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Breaking news: Plane crash in China

133 people on board. Praying they all survived.

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by Anonymousreply 379May 25, 2022 6:03 PM

Horrifying.

by Anonymousreply 1March 21, 2022 9:33 AM

None of them survived

by Anonymousreply 2March 21, 2022 9:48 AM

I was just thinking yesterday that there will be more plane crashes as pilots are forced to fly longer nonstop flight paths around Russian air space. I wonder if this flight is a casualty of war.

by Anonymousreply 3March 21, 2022 9:57 AM

Hardly R3 - it was a short haul China Eastern domestic flight.

by Anonymousreply 4March 21, 2022 9:59 AM

HOLY FUCK!

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by Anonymousreply 5March 21, 2022 10:00 AM

r3 Xi is an ally of Putin

by Anonymousreply 6March 21, 2022 10:01 AM

I already doubt the "official" explanation that will come out of Chinese state media

Maybe a suicidal pilot, a la Andreas Lubitz?

by Anonymousreply 7March 21, 2022 10:03 AM

Swords and prawns.

by Anonymousreply 8March 21, 2022 10:08 AM

Covid?

by Anonymousreply 9March 21, 2022 10:09 AM

đŸ»đŸ‘‘

by Anonymousreply 10March 21, 2022 10:11 AM

R5 you mean Ho Lee Fuk

by Anonymousreply 11March 21, 2022 10:47 AM

Die, r10

by Anonymousreply 12March 21, 2022 10:47 AM

R5 if that is a true video it looks like intentional homicide by a pilot

by Anonymousreply 13March 21, 2022 10:49 AM

I wouldn’t expect anything less from a product made in China.

by Anonymousreply 14March 21, 2022 10:52 AM

Why does bearking SO trigger certain DLers??

by Anonymousreply 15March 21, 2022 10:53 AM

nobody survived that

by Anonymousreply 16March 21, 2022 10:54 AM

[quote] Chinese state broadcaster CCTV.

ten to one

this is just the pretense to blame it on another country and will start the taiwan invasion almost immediately

by Anonymousreply 17March 21, 2022 10:55 AM

R15 because it's stupid and you should hate yourself. Stuff like that happens organically or not at all, you can't force it. That you think you can, despite the chorus telling you that's not how it works, speaks ill of you.

by Anonymousreply 18March 21, 2022 11:02 AM

R17 I'll take those odds, because that's a wholly ridiculous statement. I'll send you my CashApp.

by Anonymousreply 19March 21, 2022 11:03 AM

[quote]Why does bearking SO trigger certain DLers??

[quote] because it's stupid and you should hate yourself.

I love when posters like r18 pull up immediately to prove posters like r15

by Anonymousreply 20March 21, 2022 11:04 AM

any new news?

by Anonymousreply 21March 21, 2022 11:10 AM

R20 we realize you are also R15.

I think you started out wanting to make it a thing but now you're just trolling because your peabrain is too stubborn and hardheaded to give it up.

You're going to get red tagged again eventually.

by Anonymousreply 22March 21, 2022 11:13 AM

Utterly terrifying

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by Anonymousreply 23March 21, 2022 11:22 AM

I've been frequenting the DL for many years -- and I am indeed both r15 and r20.

Posters like r22 remind me that trolls are likely to present traits of the dark tetrad -- psychopathy, narcissism, sadism, and Machiavellianism. In other words, r22 is likely an asshole in real life, too.

by Anonymousreply 24March 21, 2022 11:22 AM

R24 yes, yes. Please show us on the doll where the bad man touched you.

by Anonymousreply 25March 21, 2022 11:24 AM

this (airplane crash) is my worst nightmare.

by Anonymousreply 26March 21, 2022 11:25 AM

This has just happened so let's all jump to conclusions before any facts are known, wheel out well worn racist comments and snipe and insult each other.

The DL at its best.

by Anonymousreply 27March 21, 2022 11:25 AM

R27 me so sowwy

by Anonymousreply 28March 21, 2022 11:26 AM

Sum Ting Wong

by Anonymousreply 29March 21, 2022 11:34 AM

r27 it's been confirmed there was a crash; crews have been out to put out the fire; there are 2 videos of a plane with a completely downward trajectory. This has happened, and I guarantee there are no survivors.

by Anonymousreply 30March 21, 2022 11:35 AM

r19 Can't I just slip it directly in the slot?

by Anonymousreply 31March 21, 2022 11:58 AM

Telling somebody that you will pray for them is as useless as sitting there and saying, I’ll think about you.

Way to show that you intend to do absolutely nothing to help them, OP.

by Anonymousreply 32March 21, 2022 12:01 PM

According to a recent update in the NYT:

[quote] The plane was cruising at an altitude of 29,100 feet when, in just over a minute, it lost more than 21,000 feet. It appeared to briefly regain altitude around 8,000 feet before continuing its plunge, according to Flightradar24’s data.

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by Anonymousreply 33March 21, 2022 12:12 PM

It's a mystery!

by Anonymousreply 34March 21, 2022 12:15 PM

Aren't those 737 planes fucked up? This isn't the 1st or even 2nd time this has happened.

by Anonymousreply 35March 21, 2022 12:18 PM

When a plane is at cruising altitude, it represents the safest part of a flight (with the first several minutes and the past few minutes being the most dangerous). It’s quite telling the plane plummeted 21,000 ft in a minute, only to momentarily level off before crashing.

If this was a US or European flight, it would appear to be a crash due to an intentional act. However, since this is a Chinese aircraft it was likely some cheaply made piece of shit held together by superglue.

by Anonymousreply 36March 21, 2022 12:19 PM

Wi To Lo

by Anonymousreply 37March 21, 2022 12:26 PM

This is a 737-800, not a 737-MAX which were the ones that Boeing didn't tell/train pilots about after a software update which was erroneously reporting altitude issues and automatically trying to correct in a way that was confusing to pilots who hadn't been briefed about the changes nor given training. I watched a docu about it and it was really preventable. Boeing is having to pay millions in restitution for attempting to defraud the FAA during the investigation.

One wonders if they didn't make changes to other 737s as well. Although, from those 2 vids, that plane was on a perpendicular trajectory straight into the earth. Could have been intentional.

by Anonymousreply 38March 21, 2022 12:29 PM

R36 hate to break it to you darling and other uneducated DLers but this was a 737. 737s are manufactured by BOEING. This wasn’t a Chinese made aircraft.

by Anonymousreply 39March 21, 2022 12:29 PM

What r39 said; this was a Boeing aircraft. Nothing to do with a "Chinese" aircraft.

by Anonymousreply 40March 21, 2022 12:30 PM

Another 737 crash.

Hopefully this ends Elaine Chao.

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by Anonymousreply 41March 21, 2022 12:32 PM

*puts

by Anonymousreply 42March 21, 2022 12:33 PM

r41 - to be clear, this wasn't a 737-Max crash. China held off on any Max flights.

That said, the quality of Boeing's work has greatly declined since they were taken over by another company and HQ was moved. I can't recall the name of the doc I watched on Netflix, but it gives a really good run through of how the whole Max situation played out, and the decline in quality of Being in general.

by Anonymousreply 43March 21, 2022 12:41 PM

Just looked it up, it's called "Downfall: the case against Boeing."

by Anonymousreply 44March 21, 2022 12:42 PM

r27, welcome to the internet! Based on your comment, I don't think you're going to like it here.

by Anonymousreply 45March 21, 2022 12:43 PM

Fuck the Chinese cunts. Fuck them!

by Anonymousreply 46March 21, 2022 12:43 PM

As an aside, criticizing Xi and the CCP is not inherently racist. However, Xi and the CCP play RIGHT into that attitude, because it benefits them immensely on the global scale.

by Anonymousreply 47March 21, 2022 12:44 PM

yes, it was boeing but the fucking airline probably trying to be cheap and hardly ever maintained the plane etc. probably faked all the maintenance records. Chinese cunts are cheats

by Anonymousreply 48March 21, 2022 12:44 PM

I understand wanting to be cautious. But it is physically impossible for anyone to have survived a crash in which a plan rapidly plummets tens of thousands of feet in under a minute.

by Anonymousreply 49March 21, 2022 12:44 PM

Just horrible.

by Anonymousreply 50March 21, 2022 12:46 PM

They all survived according to the official Chinese new agency. Save by superior Chinese manufacturing which does not exploit the common worker.

by Anonymousreply 51March 21, 2022 12:47 PM

Agreed r49; as I said upthread, nobody survived that crash. The trajectory was insane. And if someone did, that person has about a million angels looking out for them.

And honestly, I kind of resent anyone who is posting about "Chinese cunts" - I would reserve judgment given that Boeing made some major software changes that they didn't train pilots on and are now paying millions of dollars for lying about. There's no proof that these models were effected but hey, I wouldn't put it past them.

by Anonymousreply 52March 21, 2022 12:48 PM

After reading the update on altitude losses and gains and seeing the plummet footage, it becomes more evident to me that this was an intentional act.

At first I entertained the possibility of a broken plane as the wings were not discernible at all in the footage, but seeing as there was an altitude recovery, that theory was nixed.

by Anonymousreply 53March 21, 2022 12:49 PM

r51, shut up and go to sleep.

r53 I can't imagine that trajectory not being intentional. Usually crashes are more gradual in alt loss.

by Anonymousreply 54March 21, 2022 12:50 PM

R52, the Chinese are not your friends and they are fucking cunts, just google the human rights issues they have, among other problems. There is no free speech of any kind to start off with. The list is endless.

They have an annual dog meat festival where tens of thousands of dogs are slaughtered and consumed. They are CUNTS!

by Anonymousreply 55March 21, 2022 12:55 PM

[quote] Usually crashes are more gradual in alt loss.

There are exceptions (Valujet 592 in Florida, USAir 427 in PA) but these don’t involve altitude fluctuations. So, yes, intentional crash.

by Anonymousreply 56March 21, 2022 1:01 PM

So sad.

by Anonymousreply 57March 21, 2022 1:06 PM

Looking at the angle and speed of the crash the first thing that come to mind is an intentional act, there are other possibilities like stab issues, maintenance and incapacitation of the crew that will be be reviewed. I hope the Chinese cooperate and are transparent with the investigation, which is a big ask of them.

RIP to the passengers.

by Anonymousreply 58March 21, 2022 1:14 PM

Boeing was never taken over by another company, but they did move their HQ from Seattle to Chicago because executives were tired of long flights from Seattle to New York and Washington.

by Anonymousreply 59March 21, 2022 1:18 PM

Horrifying and tragic. RIP all those passengers.

But to those blowing things out of proportion lets keep the big picture in mind. Anyone who's watched Mayday can tell you these things happen from time to time.

I know little about this but could it not be human error R56? I seem to remember an incident where a pilot became so disoriented he basically flew the plane straight into the ground.

by Anonymousreply 60March 21, 2022 1:22 PM

Symantics, r59. McDonnell Douglas merged with them in 1997. And their HQ was moved.

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by Anonymousreply 61March 21, 2022 1:22 PM

Thoughts and players.

by Anonymousreply 62March 21, 2022 1:23 PM

r60 there is that chance, and it is a question because Boeing made software changes to the 737-Max line which caused 2 crashes because pilots weren't trained on the new altitude correction system.

But this such a steep descent, it seems unlikely it was an error.

by Anonymousreply 63March 21, 2022 1:25 PM

Praying for them and their families🙏.

by Anonymousreply 64March 21, 2022 1:27 PM

Interesting R63 and very disturbing if it turns out to be intentional. I remember an episode of Mayday where the pilot had a murder-suicide thing going with his co-pilot (or boss or something - I can't quite remember).

by Anonymousreply 65March 21, 2022 1:28 PM

Omg, terrible.

by Anonymousreply 66March 21, 2022 1:29 PM

Wow. They died.

by Anonymousreply 67March 21, 2022 1:44 PM

"No sign of survivors" is being reported. Also, they are grounding all 737-800s for now. They admit it's extremely rare for such a quick descent when at cruising altitude...reported to be 31,000 feet per minute.

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by Anonymousreply 68March 21, 2022 1:51 PM

[quote] There's no proof that these models were effected

Oh, dear!

by Anonymousreply 69March 21, 2022 2:03 PM

This plane was not the problematic 737 air max or whatever the fuck it's called.

by Anonymousreply 70March 21, 2022 2:04 PM

I want to see the crash site.

by Anonymousreply 71March 21, 2022 2:06 PM

A graph of the altitude was posted on Flyertalk. It looks like there was an attempt to recover the aircraft below 10,000 feet.

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by Anonymousreply 72March 21, 2022 2:06 PM

Yes, there was a brief leveling off at approx 8000 feet. That was such a quick descent though; it will be interesting to see what the black box readings show and if there's any audio. Of course we won't learn this for months.

by Anonymousreply 73March 21, 2022 2:10 PM

For anyone interested in the views/analysis of professional pilots about this event

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by Anonymousreply 74March 21, 2022 2:12 PM

I heard that before passing the beverage cart through the aisles, the stewardesses would go pee pee in your coke.

by Anonymousreply 75March 21, 2022 2:13 PM

Sinophobia bait thread.

by Anonymousreply 76March 21, 2022 2:19 PM

Chinese airlines have sketchy maintenance records...they cut corners.

by Anonymousreply 77March 21, 2022 2:19 PM

In regards to flying, how do we the public even know what kind of plane we are going to be flying on ahead of time?

I myself have only flown 4 times in my life... l.a. to chicago and back and chicago to phoenix and back...

by Anonymousreply 78March 21, 2022 2:21 PM

Some good news.

by Anonymousreply 79March 21, 2022 2:22 PM

If this were a 737 MAX, Boeing would be done for.

by Anonymousreply 80March 21, 2022 2:23 PM

And no you can't have sex with the corpses.

by Anonymousreply 81March 21, 2022 2:23 PM

They're going to ground the 737-800 planes and claim it was a technical fault to make America look bad and promote Chinese aircraft, when it was clearly an intentional act. I wonder if the pilot left behind a manifesto. It will, of course, never be released.

by Anonymousreply 82March 21, 2022 2:32 PM

yes, everything will be covered up and the blame will be put on the American company.

by Anonymousreply 83March 21, 2022 2:34 PM

Who cares about China or its slave population

by Anonymousreply 84March 21, 2022 2:35 PM

What a petty, joyless thing you are R18. In a site where have to tolerate every warp man can invent, you go ballistic over that.

Never enjoyed a block more. And though I don't care what happens to you, for the benefit of the people exposed to you, you might consider not sweating the small stuff.

by Anonymousreply 85March 21, 2022 2:38 PM

R10, that was funny.

by Anonymousreply 86March 21, 2022 2:39 PM

Thank you r74, that was very enlightening.

by Anonymousreply 87March 21, 2022 2:39 PM

the other freaks who are posting stupid shit should jump off a fucking bridge. 133 LIVES WERE LOST YESTERDAY. HUMAN LIVES. Just go take a flying leap, you misogynists.

I really hope they can eliminate the suspicion around their aircraft/Boeing/software updates. Although, according to the pilot thread that r74 linked, several were leaning toward the suicide way.

by Anonymousreply 88March 21, 2022 2:45 PM

R85 yes, we know you're also r20, R15 and r10, but nice try. Must have really hit a nerve!

by Anonymousreply 89March 21, 2022 2:45 PM

Fortune say: ALL DEAD

by Anonymousreply 90March 21, 2022 2:57 PM

This is why I dont fly. RIP to those poor souls

by Anonymousreply 91March 21, 2022 2:59 PM

I'm not seeing anything on those videos.

by Anonymousreply 92March 21, 2022 3:02 PM

I"ll be fucked if I can find it, but I read in the PPruNe link that one guy missed the China Eastern MU5375 flight by a few minutes. It wasn't his time.

by Anonymousreply 93March 21, 2022 3:02 PM

Erratum R93 MU5735

by Anonymousreply 94March 21, 2022 3:03 PM

[Wuote]Although, according to the pilot thread that [R74] linked, several were leaning toward the suicide way.

The majority are leaning toward malfunction... tail issues ..the rudder again.

by Anonymousreply 95March 21, 2022 3:07 PM

That sucker went straight down!

by Anonymousreply 96March 21, 2022 3:09 PM

i've never seen an almost straight down crash. Perhaps it could be a hijack which is why there was a very brief recovery at 8k feet. but to me, it seems unlikely with that trajectory.

by Anonymousreply 97March 21, 2022 3:11 PM

Boeing and McDonnell Douglas merged in the late 90s. The former MD management team was put in charge of the combined company following the merger. There was a sea change in corporate culture, lots of cost-cutting, and moving HQ to Chicago isolated engineers physically in Seattle and minimized their input in the direction of the company. Boeing is a shadow of its former self.

by Anonymousreply 98March 21, 2022 3:21 PM

R60 I literally watched that episode yesterday. And now you mention it today. Creepy af. Yes, that pilot flew from Dubai to a Russian city and it was the night and tough conditions with wind. He got disoriented and it resulted in the crash.

by Anonymousreply 99March 21, 2022 3:22 PM

R65 There's also that Germanwings pilot who wanted to suicide and crashed it on purpose.

by Anonymousreply 100March 21, 2022 3:26 PM

r98, just what i was saying upthread about the merger and deterioration of quality. The employees (experts) were cut back with cost cutting measures and their quality assurance was cut back quite a bit. They were hurried in their production of aircraft and were given deadlines that didn't allow them to actually check the aircraft out in full. Their product suffered.

by Anonymousreply 101March 21, 2022 3:27 PM

I don’t trust those Chinese to have properly maintained any of their planes. In fact, Boeing shouldn’t even be selling planes to countries like China with corrupt governments. Let them all fly on their own shit planes, or on Russian-built death traps.

by Anonymousreply 102March 21, 2022 3:46 PM

R77 Aren't Russian airlines banned in the EU? Or they used to be, because of maintanance issues. Didn't know that was the case for Chinese airlines too.

by Anonymousreply 103March 21, 2022 3:48 PM

R91 Same. I've been claustrophobic since I was a kid. Flying doesn't appeal to me. Being stuck in a death trap, no thanks.

by Anonymousreply 104March 21, 2022 3:51 PM

Uh, oh--Another Boeing 373!

by Anonymousreply 105March 21, 2022 3:51 PM

^ Boeing 737

by Anonymousreply 106March 21, 2022 3:51 PM

Netflix’s Damning Boeing 737 Documentary

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by Anonymousreply 107March 21, 2022 3:52 PM

[quote] This plane was not the problematic 737 air max or whatever the fuck it's called.

How do you know?

It WAS a Boeing 737. If not the MAX, it would be pretty old

by Anonymousreply 108March 21, 2022 3:54 PM

The Netflix documentary was brilliant.

And if you are so inclined, research that Ethiopian Airlines Crash. (The 2nd MAX crash)

I have never seen such a flight filled with truly good people trying to help the less fortunate- Many Americans.

That plane crashed at one of the highest speeds ever- Along the lines of that 1987 PSA crash which broke the sound barrier.

I wish that crash got more press as those people deserve to be remembered.

by Anonymousreply 109March 21, 2022 3:55 PM

Just as the documentary about the 737Max says, we first blame everyone else--pilot training, poor maintenance in other countries, etc.

...and then we find out it's the plane's crappy software

by Anonymousreply 110March 21, 2022 3:56 PM

What was the name of the Netflix documentary?

I'll watch it tonight.

by Anonymousreply 111March 21, 2022 3:57 PM

i already talked about the NF doc upthread, duh. Jeez, do any of you read the messages in the thread?

by Anonymousreply 112March 21, 2022 3:57 PM

And those Boeing motherfuckers who killed those people deserve life in prison.

I do not know how they did not serve prison time.

The documentary really showed you what scumbags they are.

by Anonymousreply 113March 21, 2022 3:58 PM

Downfall: The Case Against Boeing.

by Anonymousreply 114March 21, 2022 3:59 PM

Just looked it up, it's called "Downfall: the case against Boeing." —Anonymous 1 reply 44 3 hours ago

by Anonymousreply 115March 21, 2022 4:02 PM

[quote]And those Boeing motherfuckers who killed those people deserve life in prison. I do not know how they did not serve prison time.

Prison is for the little people.

by Anonymousreply 116March 21, 2022 4:03 PM

Let me chime in too and thank r74.

by Anonymousreply 117March 21, 2022 4:44 PM

[quote] Just go take a flying leap, you misogynists.

And there it is. Found the Frau!

The go-to accusation when all else fails. Fuck off, cunt!

by Anonymousreply 118March 21, 2022 4:45 PM

[quote] How do you know? It WAS a Boeing 737

Because it was a 737-800, not a 737-MAX.

Did you even read the link at OP?

by Anonymousreply 119March 21, 2022 4:50 PM

I cannot bring myself to watch the Netflix documentary. I know - Mary! - but it took me years to feel comfortable on a 737 after those nosedives into the ground that a couple of 737s took in the 90s - apparently due to some design flaw.

by Anonymousreply 120March 21, 2022 4:54 PM

[quote] In fact, Boeing shouldn’t even be selling planes to countries like China with corrupt governments.

If that were the main criterion, Boeing wouldn't sell in the US

by Anonymousreply 121March 21, 2022 4:58 PM

The trolls can cry Sinophobia all they want. Their xenophobia against Americans is just as shameful, until they put that behavior behind them, people will feel free to fight fire with fire.

by Anonymousreply 122March 21, 2022 4:59 PM

I’ve never forgiven the Chinese since I saw that housekeeper bitch slap little Christian Bale in Empire of the Sun.

by Anonymousreply 123March 21, 2022 5:10 PM

Yeah, but he liked it r123.

by Anonymousreply 124March 21, 2022 5:13 PM

Funny how our anger at China rose as China became a bigger and bigger economic rival.

The US always needs an enemy, but it's tough when it's our biggest trade partner.

by Anonymousreply 125March 21, 2022 5:51 PM

Who gives a fuck? They’ve killed nearly 1,000,000 people in the US alone.

by Anonymousreply 126March 21, 2022 7:23 PM

R126, sure, it’s all China’s fault and has nothing to do with people pretending there’s no pandemic.

by Anonymousreply 127March 21, 2022 8:00 PM

I'm not up on emoji jokes.

What does R10's post mean?

by Anonymousreply 128March 21, 2022 9:31 PM

Bear King = bearking r128

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by Anonymousreply 129March 21, 2022 9:33 PM

DL forbidden words, R128...

by Anonymousreply 130March 21, 2022 9:35 PM

Ah, got it.

Rofl.

Thanks, R129.

by Anonymousreply 131March 21, 2022 9:35 PM

Falun Gong strikes again!

by Anonymousreply 132March 21, 2022 9:36 PM

Wei tu lo.

by Anonymousreply 133March 21, 2022 9:38 PM

r132 = CCP party official

by Anonymousreply 134March 21, 2022 9:42 PM

Those “funny Chinese name” jokes were tired years ago.

All that you are doing is sharing your lack of sophistication with the rest of us.

by Anonymousreply 135March 21, 2022 9:51 PM

Smell you.

by Anonymousreply 136March 21, 2022 9:54 PM

Aw, wat soh bat R135?

Sum ting wong?

by Anonymousreply 137March 21, 2022 9:55 PM

Especially when that one has already been done.

by Anonymousreply 138March 21, 2022 9:55 PM

Was it one of the Max planes that was previously grounded?

by Anonymousreply 139March 21, 2022 9:57 PM

Rosie O'Donnell has issued a statement about the incident.

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by Anonymousreply 140March 21, 2022 9:57 PM

熊王

by Anonymousreply 141March 21, 2022 9:58 PM

R141 translated: đŸ»đŸ‘‘

So you don't have to waste your time.

by Anonymousreply 142March 21, 2022 10:01 PM

R139 As detailed in the original post, it was not a Max, but a 737-800. Only six years old, delivered new to China Eastern and manufactured in the USA.

by Anonymousreply 143March 21, 2022 10:08 PM

Thank you both for so perfectly proving my point, R136 and R137.

by Anonymousreply 144March 21, 2022 10:09 PM

The 737-800 is a very common aircraft. It’s flown by American, Delta, United, Southwest, and Alaska in the US.

by Anonymousreply 145March 21, 2022 10:25 PM

[quote]If this were a 737 MAX, Boeing would be done for.

r80 if this crash is due to anything other than pilot error or hijacking, Boeing is in DEEP SHIT, MAX or no MAX. Way too many incidents in recent years. COVID reduced the number of planes in the sky, it does not look good that one of theirs has gone down again as soon as flight activity starts getting back to pre-COVID levels.

by Anonymousreply 146March 21, 2022 10:46 PM

I still don't understand the bear and crown emoji and / or what "bearking" is meant to convey.

by Anonymousreply 147March 21, 2022 10:47 PM

Bearking is a cute way of saying Breaking. Rather than write out the word, and to get visual attention, we see the emoji of a bear + one of a king. Am I right?

by Anonymousreply 148March 21, 2022 10:55 PM

Southwest is the world’s largest operator of the Boeing 737. Currently with a fleet of 735 aircraft, including the -700, -800, and MAX8 variants. And you know Southwest has had ONE passenger fatality throughout its entire existence since 1971.

Almost all of these recent incidents happen overseas. The problem is not Boeing’s planes. It’s the poor maintenance, poor training, and lax safety practices that cause these crashes to be more frequent in places like Asia, the Middle East, and Russia.

by Anonymousreply 149March 21, 2022 11:08 PM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 150March 21, 2022 11:08 PM

[quote] Was it one of the Max planes that was previously grounded?

JFC, read the goddamn link or the fucking thread.

by Anonymousreply 151March 21, 2022 11:18 PM

r149 = Dave Calhoun

by Anonymousreply 152March 21, 2022 11:37 PM

Right, R149, because air crashes hardly ever happen in the good ol’ USA.

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by Anonymousreply 153March 21, 2022 11:46 PM

Boy that’s hard to believe about Southwest. They’re such a cheapie airline and the customer service is like a bunch of teenagers behind a fast food counter.

by Anonymousreply 154March 21, 2022 11:46 PM

DM is reporting that Boeing's 737-800 have been involved in 22 accidents with over 600+ fatalities since 1998. Not a good track record.

That pilot gossip thread, as well as other media sources, are showing pieces of "trim" that have been found by villagers not at the impact crater. Given that everything at the crash site was "instantly incinerated" (indeed, the pics show pretty much no whole pieces of the plane), there are indicators that parts of the plane began ripping off. We'll see how this pans out.

by Anonymousreply 155March 22, 2022 1:16 AM

It was most likely a bomb.

by Anonymousreply 156March 22, 2022 2:38 AM

My fear of flying is not irrational is it now

by Anonymousreply 157March 22, 2022 2:43 AM

R157. Statistically speaking, you're still more likely to die from a variety of other things. Like a car crash (depending on where you live).

But I will be taking a very close look at what flights I book from now on.

by Anonymousreply 158March 22, 2022 2:45 AM

Your chances of ever being in a plane crash are close to zero.

by Anonymousreply 159March 22, 2022 2:49 AM

"They" often say in these kinds of situations that passengers would have passed out just to keep the freak out factor to a minimum. Lies. In a long travel with an unpressurized/depressurized cabin, totally possible just from lack of oxygen. However, these poor bastards were in terror, plummeting that fast in a near perfect nose dive, as you can see, is fucking fast, not nearly enough time for G force to make you unconscious. Horrific way to go. That thing dropped like a stone. I wonder if the "brief regain" at 8k feet was just a fluke of air draft.

by Anonymousreply 160March 22, 2022 3:48 AM

Eat shit, R151.

by Anonymousreply 161March 22, 2022 5:12 AM

Behind the scenes, China must have balked at helping Putin.

by Anonymousreply 162March 22, 2022 5:34 AM

[quote]It’s the poor maintenance, poor training, and lax safety practices that cause these crashes to be more frequent in places like Asia, the Middle East, and Russia.

And Africa . Notoriously bad as well.

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by Anonymousreply 163March 22, 2022 5:44 AM

Is there anyone else reading this thread that has experienced even a SIMULATED crash? I have. I’m an airline pilot and have been in a simulator during trading when my partner fucked the pooch
 in the sim the screen turns bright red but we are all also subjected to a bit of a g-force “fuck you” shock courtesy of the hydraulics.

I introduce my bona fides that way because I am experiencing a visceral reaction to some of the comments here mostly because I have no clue the experience, personal or professional, of the person posting.

It’s pretty basic understanding of air crashes that if it was a bomb, we wouldn’t have seen such a solid object descending/falling as that video showed. The “incinerated” pieces of wreckage would seem consistent with a high-energy impact scenario. And that scenario would suggest either a deliberate action to “nose-dive” the plane, or an uncontrolled scenario
 but that would be contradicted by the clear nose-down attitude shown in that video.

Boeing probably has little exposure here, given the safety history of the 737 (non-MAX). Chinese pilots are basically high-flying serfs
 chosen because they show some talent (usually just speaking enough English), paid somewhat decent wages for basically signing their life away to do just one job that they may never wanted to do. IMO, there is a clear and widely open door through which mentally ill prospects may walk.

Finally, and specifically for R155, you are measuring the -800’s safety statistics through a prism that is somehow still smaller than your dick. 600+ fatalities across 22 incidents? That’s less than 30 dead per incident flight. And 22 incidents against the MILLIONS of flights during the 24 years since 1998? Yeah, you’re a micro-peen for sure.

by Anonymousreply 164March 22, 2022 5:48 AM

[quote]Is there anyone else reading this thread that has experienced even a SIMULATED crash?

R164 Not a crash (wouldn't be here oherwise), but a belly landing due to stuck landing gear. Don't want to say how many decades ago, but luckily it was winter and plenty of snow on the runway. Lots of passengers with minor injuries. The airline bussed us all into a hangar where those who wanted it were checked by medical crew. The airline wouldn't release passengers until we signed a Release Form releasing the airline of all responsibility.

by Anonymousreply 165March 22, 2022 5:59 AM

r164 - you seem particularly upset for some reason. I am r155 and I was just reporting the facts I've seen here and there that have been reported. I am not the person who suggested a bomb; in fact, as you said...the incineration of the debris indicates it was a high energy impact event and there was no smoke on the video or explosion sounds before impact reported. I've been reading the thread linked below at Professional Pilots Rumour Network and am just taking it all in.

And I'm not a man, so I don't have a "micro-peen." I'm a bisexual women. There is no reason to throw feces around.

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by Anonymousreply 166March 22, 2022 6:00 AM

Addendum R165 And I never flew that airline again. Didn't want to push my luck.

by Anonymousreply 167March 22, 2022 6:01 AM

^^*woman

by Anonymousreply 168March 22, 2022 6:24 AM

Well, a clitoris can be considered a micro-peen

by Anonymousreply 169March 22, 2022 6:50 AM

[quote] I have. I’m an airline pilot and have been in a simulator during trading when my partner fucked the pooch


Are you a gay pilot? Have you ever had sex in the cockpit? (The jokes write themselves).

by Anonymousreply 170March 22, 2022 6:53 AM

LOL r169. Anyways, I've been finding the speculations on the PPRN site interesting. As I'm not in the business, I of course haven't commented over there, just have been reading the thoughts and opinions expressed on the thread. I initially thought it to be pilot suicide (and expressed that upthread) but now, in reading at the other site, see there might be other explanations.

by Anonymousreply 171March 22, 2022 6:54 AM

R153: There hasn’t been a commercial airline crash in the US since 2009. There have been fatal incidents in which a few people have died, but Americans have room to gloat all day and all night when it comes to our flight safety record.

As others have noted, rigorous maintenance and well-trained pilots are crucial to flight safety.

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by Anonymousreply 172March 22, 2022 7:36 AM

Video linked was live streamed from a doomed passenger on the plane.

Chinese website claims pilot suicide.

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by Anonymousreply 173March 22, 2022 10:22 AM

must have been removed already r173; when I click on it, it just sits there and goes nowhere

by Anonymousreply 174March 22, 2022 10:26 AM

Nevermind, i used a different browser. that's fucking horrible...

by Anonymousreply 175March 22, 2022 10:28 AM

[quote]pieces of "trim"

Pics please.

by Anonymousreply 176March 22, 2022 10:36 AM

Sadly, no one is capable of surviving that if the video is legit. The way it plummeted nose down is so horrifying. My worst nightmare. To me it seemed deliberate, like a pilot suicide, but I saw comments saying that there are other possible explanations, and I'm definitely not knowledgeable enough to say. It looked like the plane was just cruising along when suddenly it went into freefall, but I saw someone say they thought it happened when the plane was starting its descent, so that could point to a mechanical issue instead.

[quote]I still don't understand the bear and crown emoji and / or what "bearking" is meant to convey.

I think someone wrote "bearking" instead of "breaking" as a typo once and it stuck as a DL joke, like "Lens" Dunham.

by Anonymousreply 177March 22, 2022 10:54 AM

Somebody said on a different board that the vid looked like it was the Ethiopean Airlines crash, not the China Airlines crash. ?? Don't know.

by Anonymousreply 178March 22, 2022 11:08 AM

Can someone repost the video it won’t open for me

by Anonymousreply 179March 22, 2022 11:10 AM

It’s not a video - it’s an image

by Anonymousreply 180March 22, 2022 11:12 AM

No, it's a video, not an image. There's screaming and everything.

I had to use Chrome (diff browser than i usually use), navigate to this thread (without my login) to open the link from this thread. it's a vid. But somebody on another board said it's not China Air, it's Ethiopian Air.

by Anonymousreply 181March 22, 2022 11:16 AM

Deep inside, you know that if Donald Trump had been in that plane, he would have been able to snatch the joystick away from the Commies, right the course and allow it to make a safe landing on the nearest airport.

by Anonymousreply 182March 22, 2022 11:20 AM

Sorry - you are right, R181. Thanks for the instructions.

Also, the video appears to be a flight simulation.

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by Anonymousreply 183March 22, 2022 11:20 AM

r183 I'm glad to know it's a flight simulation. i'll be able to sleep a little now.

by Anonymousreply 184March 22, 2022 11:23 AM

JINA!!!

by Anonymousreply 185March 22, 2022 11:30 AM

[quote] Chinese website claims pilot suicide.

Not surprised, as it allows both China and Boeing to save face and avoid possible legal actions.

Each country chooses an event target which will deflect blame from their national carrier, its employees, avoid political complications and, hopefully, reap some financial benefits. Such as the Ethiopian Air 302 event. The government and everyone else was quick to blame Boeing. This, long before serious investigation commenced - and how those investigations were at all serious considering the locals were filmed walking all over the crash site picking up and carting away anything that looked like it might be of value. It deflected from pilot inexperience and poor maintenance records. And Ethiopian Air is suppose to be one of "better" African airlines.

by Anonymousreply 186March 22, 2022 11:42 AM

The pilot, the airline, the manufacturer. The usual sequence of blame in aircraft crashes.

by Anonymousreply 187March 22, 2022 11:46 AM

R178, the logo on the wing is the Ethiopian Airlines logo.

R183, yeah, it does look more like a flight simulation and the screams sound pre-recorded.

by Anonymousreply 188March 22, 2022 12:07 PM

I think in the future, on my trips to Europe or Hawaii or Australia, I'll take a Ship and get there when I get there!...

by Anonymousreply 189March 22, 2022 1:16 PM

Yes r189 because catching Covid or being refused to dock is so much fun on the high seas.

by Anonymousreply 190March 22, 2022 1:27 PM

I guess the only good thing about that crash is that no one on board probably felt a thing other than the terror during the dive. That crash was catastrophic and everyone had to have died in an instant. 2 close family friends were on the ValuJet crash that went down in the Everglades and the authorities said that plane crashed in a straight vertical dive as well. There was nothing left of any of the passengers other than small hunks of flesh and bone.

by Anonymousreply 191March 22, 2022 1:35 PM

Everyone knows Asians can’t drive for shit. Not sure why people think they’d be any better at flying a plane.

by Anonymousreply 192March 22, 2022 1:38 PM

That plane must have lost all mechanical control (unless the crash was intentional). Even a big passenger jet should be able to glide if it lost engine power, as long as the rudder and the ailerons were still operational. The way that plane crashed it's as if both wings had been sheared off.

by Anonymousreply 193March 22, 2022 1:39 PM

[quote] Not a crash (wouldn't be here oherwise), but a belly landing due to stuck landing gear.

Psst. That’s a “crash,” albeit not a catastrophic one, but a crash nonetheless.

by Anonymousreply 194March 22, 2022 1:42 PM

A plane coming down in a 100% vertical dive is not a catastrophic crash? I beg to differ.

by Anonymousreply 195March 22, 2022 1:51 PM

[quote] Psst. That’s a “crash,”

R194 Ya know. That's EXACTLY what it sounded like when the plane's belly hit the runway. The mutha of all WHOMPS then a crashing sound. But according to the airline, we're alive, therefore it wasn't a crash. Ever since then, a "crash" to me is pieces of plane, humans and baggage scattered over a wide area.

by Anonymousreply 196March 22, 2022 1:51 PM

All successful airplane landings are considered controlled crashes. LOL

by Anonymousreply 197March 22, 2022 1:58 PM

R197 Old Kai Tak, Papeete and SFO are truly controlled crashes.

by Anonymousreply 198March 22, 2022 2:00 PM

How well I know R198. I landed at Kai Tak twice, and SFO at least 6 times. Of the two Kai Tak was the scariest. Can't say about Papeete, but I can certainly imagine it's a chore to get a big aircraft down there. The winds coming off the ocean must surely be brutal.

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by Anonymousreply 199March 22, 2022 2:10 PM

R195, what the fuck are you talking about?

Nobody said this crash wasn’t catastrophic.

by Anonymousreply 200March 22, 2022 2:12 PM

R189, just avoid flying with Boeings, especially 737s.

by Anonymousreply 201March 22, 2022 2:14 PM

[quote]Can't say about Papeete, but I can certainly imagine it's a chore to get a big aircraft down there.

Kai Tak was the world's best wild ride. I was indeed saddened when they opened Chep Lap Kok.

Papeete is a horror, especially at night, when the plane's descending lower and lower and there's nothing around you but Pacific Ocean. It was a real crap shoot before they lengthened the runways. You never knew if were going to stop on the runway or overshoot it and end up in someone's taro patch.

by Anonymousreply 202March 22, 2022 2:17 PM

R201 that’s ridiculous. It’s the most successful Boeing plane and taking into account the total flying hours vs crashes, it’s a safe aircraft. The MAX was a massive failure though because of the race to the bottom of the barrel to appease shareholders vs upholding safety standards.

by Anonymousreply 203March 22, 2022 2:19 PM

R191- And on Valujet, the interior was on fire so luckily those passengers probably passed out prior to crash. The pilot and co pilot did- The cabin was silent for the last minute..

by Anonymousreply 204March 22, 2022 2:22 PM

^^ sorry the cockpit was

by Anonymousreply 205March 22, 2022 2:39 PM

[quote]Even a big passenger jet should be able to glide if it lost engine power, as long as the rudder and the ailerons were still operational.

A skilled pilot can still land a plane even with both engines out.

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by Anonymousreply 206March 22, 2022 2:41 PM

Fly Airbus, r203.

by Anonymousreply 207March 22, 2022 2:44 PM

R203 It’s that mentality that churns out pilots who lack the training and skill to manually fly an aircraft when things go tits up. Technology can’t compensate for true human skill.

by Anonymousreply 208March 22, 2022 3:23 PM

R208 no new planes fly manually. Everything is fly by wire now.

by Anonymousreply 209March 22, 2022 4:26 PM

where is the video from? I mean was it a CCTV camera that caught the crash?

by Anonymousreply 210March 22, 2022 4:35 PM

[Quote]Kai Tak was the world's best wild ride.

Have you done Katmandu? Diapers required.

by Anonymousreply 211March 22, 2022 4:50 PM

R209 You should not be spreading misinformation like that, not all passenger aircraft use FBW which is most associated with Airbus. Boeing does not have the same control law/control limitation philosophy.

A well trained pilot with manual flight experience can handle either type when things go wrong and prevent upsets, the MAX for example did have some issues here in the US but no crashes because the mentality here is to not trust automation as much and pay attention to your controls instead of allowing a computer to babysit the flight for you, in the US hand flying is considered an important skill plus following cockpit procedures which is what saves the day.

by Anonymousreply 212March 22, 2022 4:54 PM

[quote] Have you done Katmandu? Diapers required.

R211 It's on my list. I want to do the Anapurna Base trek.

by Anonymousreply 213March 22, 2022 5:00 PM

I just got a Breaking News alert from the New York Times


Apparently, nobody survived the crash in which a plane plummeted 30,000 feet in less than 75 seconds!!!! I feel sorry for all the family members who showed up at the crash site, thinking they were going to drive their shaken, but otherwise unhurt, loved ones home.

by Anonymousreply 214March 22, 2022 5:10 PM

The Air Alaska flight that crashed off Calif went nose down like this aircraft. Other pilots witnessed it. The NTSB determined the problem to be a screw that came loose in the rudder. Poor maint practice was the final finding.

by Anonymousreply 215March 22, 2022 5:10 PM

It's a video/image from a flight simulation to assess an Ethiopian Airlines crash, r210. It's nothing to do with this Chinese crash.

by Anonymousreply 216March 22, 2022 5:10 PM

That's appalling, r215.

by Anonymousreply 217March 22, 2022 5:14 PM

R215, I’ve read about the Alaskan Airlines flight, and it was 1,000 times more terrifying than the recent crash in China. The Chinese plane went down fast
and it appears to have plummeted after sustaining cruising altitude. With the Alaskan Airlines flight, the pilots alternated between barely keeping the flight stable and losing control. At one point, it was even cruising while upside down before other pilots in their area watched it crash.

by Anonymousreply 218March 22, 2022 5:16 PM

Here's the Air Alaska crash story.

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by Anonymousreply 219March 22, 2022 5:21 PM

It’s “Alaska Airlines”.

by Anonymousreply 220March 22, 2022 5:35 PM

Yes, and it was the stripped screw in the stabilizer not the rudder.

by Anonymousreply 221March 22, 2022 5:49 PM

Don't worry, gays. It's Chinatown.

by Anonymousreply 222March 22, 2022 6:20 PM

And those two Alaskan Airline pilots WERE fucking heroes- A word used way too loosely.

Unbelievable grace and talent under unbeatable odds and insane conditions.

Its been made clear that those passengers went through utter hell on that flight (they were probably knocked around the entire cabin-

Those pilots- I believe one's name was Tansey-were great men.

by Anonymousreply 223March 22, 2022 9:09 PM

Is Plane Crash Death troll still among us?

by Anonymousreply 224March 22, 2022 10:21 PM

R224- I was one of the semi Plane Crash Trolls-

I find flying and crashes fascinating and compelling.

I don't know how anyone has the balls to get into a plane and learn how to fly! Its amazing to me.

by Anonymousreply 225March 22, 2022 10:30 PM

You and me are simpatico, r225.

I’m endlessly fascinated by aviation and their unfortunate tragedies, as rare as they are.

But do not make the mistake I did by watching one of those Mayday episodes or similar the night before getting on a plane. Trust.

by Anonymousreply 226March 22, 2022 10:33 PM

Does that horrible "pull up" message start playing in the cockpit when the plane gets too close to terrain?

by Anonymousreply 227March 22, 2022 10:34 PM

Only when the pilot forgets to close his fly after stepping away.

by Anonymousreply 228March 22, 2022 10:36 PM

r227 that "Pull Up" notification would give me an instant panic attack. The stuff of nightmares.

by Anonymousreply 229March 22, 2022 10:37 PM

Stall warning would be scary too.

That horrible crash in Buffalo- Colgan Air-

Taught me that if I was ever made to be Karen Allen or whatever her name is from that old film where everyone is dead and she has to fly a plane-

If you STALL- You put the nose DOWN!!!!! Not up. You want to increase lift and speed.

When I read on the pilot boards- that particular crash was one of the most DUMB crashes ever and seriously due to pilot error. And from what I read he did everything right in his situation, but pulling up.

by Anonymousreply 230March 22, 2022 11:13 PM

R230, those were VERY inexperienced pilots flying in icing conditions who were in way over their heads.

by Anonymousreply 231March 23, 2022 12:32 AM

Not for the faint of heart.

This is regarding the Ethiopian Airlines Crash, which crashed from around 9000 feet I believe.

This would be what the passengers on this China flight would have went through- while conscious...

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by Anonymousreply 232March 23, 2022 12:55 AM

One black box found.

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by Anonymousreply 233March 23, 2022 9:48 AM

I can’t believe that, according to the article, the Chinese authorities seem to be still harboring hopes of finding survivors.

by Anonymousreply 234March 23, 2022 10:37 AM

I can’t believe that, according to the article, the Chinese authorities seem to be still harboring hopes of finding survivors.

by Anonymousreply 235March 23, 2022 10:38 AM

Yes, the authorities as well as some of the family of the victims. It's been 2 days...and they have reported that calculations of their speed during descent approached speed-of-sound levels (citation: Bloomberg, but others have also proposed this as well). I'd be shocked if they found more than just chunks of flesh or bone. Making all of this more difficult is that it's now pouring rain and is expected to have the same weather conditions through the end of the week. Some sources have reported operations have been suspended for recovery because the rain is causing small landslides during search.

Black box is so badly mangled that they are unsure which one it is at this point.

by Anonymousreply 236March 23, 2022 10:52 AM

R225 & R226 Count me in as another aerial disaster aficionado.

by Anonymousreply 237March 23, 2022 12:20 PM

Has DL fave Richard Quest sobered up yet to offer commentary?

by Anonymousreply 238March 23, 2022 12:23 PM

[quote] One black box found.

That box is orange.

Oh, yeah, I’ve got my eye on you now! Mmm hmmm.

by Anonymousreply 239March 23, 2022 1:29 PM

[quote]Does that horrible "pull up" message start playing in the cockpit when the plane gets too close to terrain?

I think in this case it was "poo wup".

by Anonymousreply 240March 23, 2022 3:28 PM

R240, Yes- And then I think "TERRAIN-TERRAIN" when there is basically no time left-

by Anonymousreply 241March 23, 2022 3:32 PM

The following post came from another online site, and I asked for more info/source verification:

"Pilot was suicidal, and slipped something in the co-pilot’s drink. Steered downward and then took a break when the plane leveled off to regroup/regain strength.

Continued carrying out his intentions. God bless all those innocent people!"

by Anonymousreply 242March 23, 2022 5:02 PM

A guy I follow on Youtube says he thought it was deliberate as well...

by Anonymousreply 243March 23, 2022 5:03 PM

I'm not sure the news that it was pilot suicide makes me feel any better. It can happen anywhere, with any type of aircraft. We now have China Eastern Airlines, Germanwings, and the long-forgotten (but not by me) Egypt Air crash.

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by Anonymousreply 244March 23, 2022 5:11 PM

^^ Dan gryder. He was the funny/odd pilot dude who read Gwynn "The Hair" Sham-lin for filth!

I'll link it. I was very surprised that this was his opinion so fast

by Anonymousreply 245March 23, 2022 5:12 PM

I always turn to a guy on Youtube for important information.

by Anonymousreply 246March 23, 2022 5:19 PM

[quote] A guy I follow on Youtube says he thought it was deliberate as well...

Well then, thread closed.

by Anonymousreply 247March 23, 2022 6:12 PM

They found Black Box!!!

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by Anonymousreply 248March 23, 2022 6:13 PM

Ooooh. You should’ve all-caps-it as BREAKING!!! R248.

Especially since it broke over 10 hours ago here.

But you keep up that good investigative reporting, Cronkite. One day you’ll make it.

by Anonymousreply 249March 23, 2022 7:57 PM

WARNING: NOT FOR THE SQUEAMISH

When I saw this photo a while back it made me never want to get on another aircraft for the remainder of my life.

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by Anonymousreply 250March 23, 2022 8:40 PM

Thanks for the warning. (Seriously)

by Anonymousreply 251March 23, 2022 8:42 PM

Thats that Ukraine crash ironically. I have seen far worse.

The only reason the bodies are semi in one piece is because they had "flail" industries because the plane exploded in mid air.

Crashed like US AIR 427 and this China crash leave things that don't even look human.

by Anonymousreply 252March 23, 2022 9:04 PM

RE USAir Flight 427:

[quote]The National Transportation Safety Board investigated the crash. All 127 passengers and five crew members were killed.  For the first time in NTSB history, investigators were required to wear full-body biohazard suits while inspecting the accident site. As a result of the severity of the crash impact, the bodies of the passengers and crew were severely fragmented, leading investigators to declare the site a biohazard, requiring 2,000 body bags for the 6,000 recovered human remains.

by Anonymousreply 253March 23, 2022 9:33 PM

There was a problem with their lift and when they corrected it, one of the wings broke off resulting in the steep dive and speed.

by Anonymousreply 254March 23, 2022 9:46 PM

If a wing broke off, wouldn’t the plane have spiraled? I think it was Juan Brown who said it had 2 wings as it wasn’t spiraling.

by Anonymousreply 255March 23, 2022 9:59 PM

R255- Yes. Even USAir 427 corkscrewed, as did Alaska Airlines.(I think its called inverted?)

This plane flew straight into the ground, which I think offers a few clues..

by Anonymousreply 256March 23, 2022 10:08 PM

Has Xi invaded Taiwan yet?

by Anonymousreply 257March 23, 2022 10:10 PM

Xi’s gotta have it!

by Anonymousreply 258March 23, 2022 10:21 PM

[quote] Ooooh. You should’ve all-caps-it as BREAKING!!! [R248]. Especially since it broke over 10 hours ago here.

Right over your head. Did you even look at the link?!

by Anonymousreply 259March 23, 2022 11:02 PM

[quote] Ooooh. You should’ve all-caps-it as BREAKING!!! [R248]. Especially since it broke over 10 hours ago here.

Right over your head. Did you even look at the link?!

by Anonymousreply 260March 23, 2022 11:02 PM

Silk Air 185, a 737, left its cruising altitude of 35k and in less than a minute it was in the ground. Egypt Air 990 took a bit longer to dive from its 33k cruising altitude, 130 secs, as there were recovery attempts.

This aircraft took 112 seconds to hit the ground from 29100. About 15 seconds were spent at recovery.

Not saying this is suicide/homicide, but this fall from cruising altitude was a lot faster than non-suicide crashes such as AF447 and AA261.

by Anonymousreply 261March 24, 2022 12:07 AM

Take it easy on r249, she has special needs.

by Anonymousreply 262March 24, 2022 12:35 AM

Count me in as a crash porn aficionado - there’s no Air Crash Investigation, Flight Channel (with radio audio), National Geographic, Smithsonian, or Mayday show I haven’t seen. And to me (admittedly not an expert) this, as well as MH370, reeks of intentional deviation.

Done of my personal favorite reports:

American Airlines DC-10 cargo door rupture (all survived), because of the heroics of a Karen Black-like stewardess coping with the gaping hole while keeping her lovely white gloves intact (the fashions were very Pam Grier).

The eerie Southern Airlines crash in New Hope Georgia, where the plane crashed into some housewife’s backyard and the few burnt and injured survivors started marching like zombies out of the debris and into the housewife’s Care (9 people on the ground also died).

Air Florida crash onto the Potomac, simply because the rescue of the six smokers (at the tail of the plane) who survived was completely captured on film. The heroics of the guy who jumped to the frozen to drag a helpless woman out, the footage of the barefoot stewardess being lifted by a helicopter line, and the unsung hero who - tangled in the wiry/fueled debris - kept passing his life-line to others all brought me to tears, especially knowing that the last hero eventually succumbed to his injuries.

The Air France crash that most people survived in. Canada, mostly because of that bitchy survivor cunt who agreed to be interviewed and all she did was complain about Air France’s service and her inability to retrieve her carry-ones and laptop. She was the ultimate Karen.

by Anonymousreply 263March 24, 2022 5:23 AM

Sorry, that last Air France was Flight 358 and everybody survived.

Also, “the heroics of the guy who jumped into the frozen RIVER
”

And “
carry-ons
”

by Anonymousreply 264March 24, 2022 5:31 AM

Oh, and the Aloha “convertible top-down snafu” (1 casualty - a beloved unstrapped stewardess), again because of the amazing drama and generous amounts of real-life pictures.

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by Anonymousreply 265March 24, 2022 5:35 AM

[quote] The heroics of the guy who jumped to the frozen river to drag a helpless woman out,

Oh, yeah, I remember that one. That was the crash in DC, right?

by Anonymousreply 266March 24, 2022 10:12 AM

They found the voice recorder, which was in relatively good conditions. Hopefully that will have some clues as to what happened in the cockpit. Hope they're able to find the other black box too.

by Anonymousreply 267March 24, 2022 11:23 AM

Here is thr Reuters article about the voice recorder.

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by Anonymousreply 268March 24, 2022 11:23 AM

Sorry, not Reuters, AlJazera.

by Anonymousreply 269March 24, 2022 11:24 AM

R263- I am truly sorry to say that you are the hopeful side of Plane Crash Trolldom.

I am the dark side of plane crash trolldom and focus more on the horrific crashes where everyone dies?

Horrible.

by Anonymousreply 270March 24, 2022 1:14 PM

Reuters reports a 1.3 m piece found 10 km away. That and the voice recorder should provide clues shortly.

Over at PPrune there has been a lot of pissing and snarking at each other. Sometimes they sound just like DLers, only with a bunch of super-maths in their posts.

by Anonymousreply 271March 24, 2022 1:30 PM

The crash in New Hope, Ga. I remember well. A couple of weeks after the crash I drove out there one Saturday out of morbid curiosity. Everything was gone obviously, but the damage the crash caused on the ground was incredibly wide spread.

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by Anonymousreply 272March 24, 2022 3:25 PM

R271 The bitchery at pprune has me snickering about how much it reminds me of DL as well.

by Anonymousreply 273March 24, 2022 5:10 PM

R273 oh ya. Right now the snark and ego are off the charts.

Eventually the threads get cleaned up so that’s why it’s fascinating to watch Pprune threads in real time. DLer pissyness cannot not even compare to the Pprune egos.

The AF447 threads were unbelievably rude and snippy. But they lasted weeks whereas the causes of this crash will be solved shortly.

by Anonymousreply 274March 24, 2022 5:59 PM

US Air 427 crashed near Pittsburgh International Airport, which shares a runway with Air National Guard and Air Force Reserve units. I knew a reservist who, at the time of the crash, was tasked with retrieving body parts and placing them in bags. They said there were a lot of body parts hanging from trees.

by Anonymousreply 275March 24, 2022 6:52 PM

Were they in season?

by Anonymousreply 276March 24, 2022 10:12 PM

Both black boxes have been found.

by Anonymousreply 277March 25, 2022 2:45 AM

Yes, r266

by Anonymousreply 278March 25, 2022 9:51 AM

r88: [quote] ...the other freaks who are posting stupid shit should jump off a fucking bridge. 133 LIVES WERE LOST YESTERDAY. HUMAN LIVES.

DL has never shown respect for the dead. Not on 9/11, not during the Pulse massacre, not when that tween was decapitated on a water slide, and not when MH13 went missing. In fact, when there's mass death in the US (especially during a mass shooting), non-American DLers love to jump in and use it as an opportunity to be xenophobic towards Americans and say that their deaths don't matter because the US has/hasn't done XYZ. Get the fuck over your and understand that this incident isn't going to get special treatment and if that bothers you, go back to Twitter!

r88: [quote] Just go take a flying leap, you [bold]misogynists[/bold].

That word doesn't mean what you think it means.

r127, people wouldn't have had the opportunity to pretend there's no pandemic if the disease didn't spread out of China.

I'd wager that r135/r144 is likely mute on threads when non-Chinese people are the target of racism on DL.

r148: "'Bearking' is an idiotic way of saying 'Breaking.'" FIFY

by Anonymousreply 279March 25, 2022 2:46 PM

R279 seems to have too much time on her hands.

But but but....

Almost 22,000 Feet in 72 Seconds: Plunge of China Eastern Plane Puzzles Experts

Boeing 737 crash in southern China was among the fastest jetliner descents ever recorded

It was one of the fastest descents of a commercial aviation jetliner in history.

The vertical speed of the descent reached almost 31,000 feet a minute at one point, according to data from tracking provider Flightradar24, mystifying experts. With very limited information available so far, it leaves open a range of possibilities as to how the Boeing BA +0.21% 737-800 carrying 132 passengers and crew met its fate.

Previous falls from high altitudes have had a range of causes, said Jeff Guzzetti, the former director of the Federal Aviation Administration’s accident investigation division. Investigators need to winnow down possibilities: Anything from a small structural failure to a malfunctioning autoflight or autopilot system to a pilot becoming disoriented to some kind of intentional act could have played a role, he said.

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by Anonymousreply 280March 25, 2022 2:56 PM

Fact: The plane would’ve fallen slower if it had cut off its engines at cruising altitude and slowed to 0 mph.

by Anonymousreply 281March 25, 2022 5:22 PM

I think only the Silkair and USAir427 and one of the worst crashes on any level I have ever heard of (PSA in California in 1987) were at this level of speed.

SwissAir 111 and that Ethiopian Airlines were both high speed as well-

by Anonymousreply 282March 25, 2022 5:38 PM

US Air was at 6k. This aircraft was at 29100.

Right now there are conflicting reports of pieces found further out than 10 km. But if there are indeed pieces further out then that could point to a sudden rudder, elevator, tab issue.

It is weird how a 6 yo plane could suddenly experience that when doing the mundane configurations for landing - if that was the case. I’ve still yet to find concrete info if indeed it was normal at that distance to start descent into landing,

by Anonymousreply 283March 25, 2022 6:08 PM

Holy shit R283.

And USAir was on approach and at what 2000 feet? That crash lasted 28 seconds.

Most of these folks must have been passed out at the very least. And they would not have been buckled in either..

by Anonymousreply 284March 25, 2022 6:46 PM

R281 ya I saw various equations stating that as well - Reynolds numbers, V somethings, and such. Fluid mechanics and physics equations I barely remember from long ago.

What do you think happened?

by Anonymousreply 285March 25, 2022 7:23 PM

I prefer Airbus..and then the Air France crash in the Pacific came along. That crash was caused by such a minor technical problem followed by an unbelievably incompetent co-pilot response. The pilot was out of the cockpit on break at the time.

When I'm flying in the developing world which is often there's sense of relief when the pilot addresses the cabin and one can tell he's Brit, USA or Swiss. Best trained pilots on the planet.

by Anonymousreply 286March 25, 2022 7:41 PM

[quote] that could point to a sudden rudder, elevator, tab issue.

Could you elaborate just a little bit on this? What’s a “tab issue”?

by Anonymousreply 287March 25, 2022 8:38 PM

"Could you elaborate just a little bit on this? What’s a “tab issue”?"

Asked and answered.

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by Anonymousreply 288March 25, 2022 8:48 PM

R287: Elevator trim tab. See Reno Air crash.

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by Anonymousreply 289March 25, 2022 9:10 PM

China’s air safety has improved in the past 10 years, but something like this could be attributed to a mistake made 20 years ago. The crash of flight 611 in 2002 was attributed to an inadequate repair after a tail strike in 1980, with all the subsequent decades of use and stress. I don’t know what the safety protocols are but maybe it should be mandatory to revisit significant repairs every so often?

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by Anonymousreply 290March 25, 2022 9:41 PM

Except that China Airlines is the flag carrier of Taiwan, R290, not of China.

by Anonymousreply 291March 25, 2022 10:04 PM

Thank you, r289.

R288, that was fucking hilarious. Thank you, too.

by Anonymousreply 292March 25, 2022 10:12 PM

“We learn that Boeing executives knew full well about the risks inherent to the Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System, a small wind gauge that can make the plane’s auto-stabilizers go haywire if damaged.”

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by Anonymousreply 293March 25, 2022 10:46 PM

Even without MCAS, angle of attack sensor problems can cause the autopilot to aim the nose of the plane down.

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by Anonymousreply 294March 26, 2022 12:19 AM

Not an aviation expert by any means but I would think if the sensor problem causes the nose to point straight down and you have to wrestle with your full strength to get it up, and even that might not work, it would be hard even for the co-pilot to be able to turn the system off - especially if there are only seconds to react and the plane is flying down. So why not have a backup sensor? Then if the two readings did not agree, the system could disable the auto-pilot reaction while giving a warning.

by Anonymousreply 295March 26, 2022 12:56 AM

Can we have ElderLez's technical writer opinion on this please?

by Anonymousreply 296March 26, 2022 9:24 AM

R283 I was just going to post this. Everyone has been saying it looks like pilot suicide. If it is confirmed that some pieces of the wreck are found away from the main crash side, this could change everything. It could point to the plane breaking up mid-air.

by Anonymousreply 297March 26, 2022 9:31 AM

That’s even scarier to me.

At least if some lunatic committed suicide and brought everyone with him, you could chalk it up to a nut. But a plane simply falling apart midair is crazy.

Just like American 587 in 2001 where the whole damn tail fell off.

by Anonymousreply 298March 26, 2022 10:43 AM

Flight 587 came at a horrible time, right after 9/11. I remember segments on TV about spending the holidays at home, since people were scared as shit to fly anywhere. Who knew 20 years later we'd not being traveling again

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by Anonymousreply 299March 26, 2022 11:59 AM

[quote] Just like American 587 in 2001 where the whole damn tail fell off.

Yeah but that was not a mechanical or structural failure. That was an incompetent pilot who decided to slam the rudder as if he were driving a rally truck. The whole incident was attributed 100% to pilot error.

by Anonymousreply 300March 26, 2022 12:57 PM

This is interesting.

by Anonymousreply 301March 26, 2022 2:19 PM

Forgot to post the link.

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by Anonymousreply 302March 26, 2022 2:19 PM

Isn't it highly possible that due to the speed (whatever the cause) an in flight break up would have started to occur anyway? Which is why pieces may be found far from the impact site?

At that speed places start to break apart.

by Anonymousreply 303March 26, 2022 2:37 PM

Since I don’t care to plow through 300+ replies, forgive me if this has been mentioned, but on that flight were Xi or any of his cabinet members present?

by Anonymousreply 304March 26, 2022 2:49 PM

[quote]Just like American 587 in 2001 where the whole damn tail fell off.

Yes, and it was an AIRBUS.

by Anonymousreply 305March 26, 2022 3:30 PM

[quote]Yeah but that was not a mechanical or structural failure. That was an incompetent pilot who decided to slam the rudder as if he were driving a rally truck. The whole incident was attributed 100% to pilot error.

Aggressive use of the rudder shouldn't cause the whole damn tail to break off. Yes, there was pilot error, but it was also a poor design on the part of Airbus.

by Anonymousreply 306March 26, 2022 3:32 PM

Thank you, r306! I was about to post the same thing.

Mashing a pedal, no matter how hard, swinging the rudder back and forth should not cause a structurally integral part of the fucking plane to just come off.

by Anonymousreply 307March 26, 2022 6:39 PM

“The senior China Eastern executive, Mr. Sun, said in Wednesday’s briefing that the plane’s captain had four years of experience as lead pilot of the Boeing 737.

The plane’s captain, first officer and a second officer with 556 hours of flight time all had good relations with their families, he said.“

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by Anonymousreply 308March 27, 2022 12:29 PM

The second black box has been found.

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by Anonymousreply 309March 27, 2022 3:05 PM

For R306 and R307, you’re not wrong, with a bit of an exception. For all aircraft as long as speed is kept below “Maneuvering Speed” controls can be deflected without causing damage. Here’s the definition:

[quote] The design maneuvering speed (Va)is the speed at which the airplane will stall before exceeding its design limit-load factor in turbulent conditions or when the flight controls are suddenly and fully deflected in flight. Under these conditions the airframe experiences an increase in "G-force" or "load factor."

However when it comes to large, passenger aircraft that’s modified a bit especially in regards to the rudder, specifically as a result of AA587. There is a caveat that moving the rudder from the neutral position to full deflection in one direction then immediately to full deflection in the other direction could damage the rudder.

So yes, an idiot pilot kicking the rudder pedals could cause a crash.

by Anonymousreply 310March 27, 2022 4:55 PM

Could damage the rudder, yes. But the entire tail shouldn’t come flying off the thing. That’s a failure of engineering.

Imagine driving your car and almost have an accident. You slam on the brakes, but you pressed the brake pedal too hard so the steering wheel falls off and is useless.

by Anonymousreply 311March 27, 2022 8:48 PM

But did the whole tail come off?

by Anonymousreply 312March 27, 2022 10:53 PM

I assume that the structural integrity being compromised was from the fact that the plane plunged at the speed of sound - 737s aren’t designed for that.

by Anonymousreply 313March 27, 2022 11:07 PM

R312,

[quote] The force of the air flowing against the moving rudder stressed the aircraft's vertical stabilizer, [bold]and eventually snapped it off entirely,[/bold] causing the aircraft to lose control and crash.

Here it is being recovered from Jamaica Bay.

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by Anonymousreply 314March 27, 2022 11:31 PM

R311 your righteous grasp on Aerodynamics is made profoundly clear by your syllogism.

If you were to think of the rudder as the steering wheel then first off, the brakes are completely irrelevant. But if you’re driving down the turnpike, straight and easy and then suddenly turn the wheel in one direction, immediately followed by a sharp and complete turn in the other direction, do you think the car would stay on the road? No.

And on a plane, simulator studies as well as wind tunnel studies have shown the rudder would suffer damage up to, and including, the point of it departing the airframe.

This is counteracted by different aircraft systems, namely hydraulic limiters, as well as comprehensive pilot training to precisely NOT DO THAT!

by Anonymousreply 315March 28, 2022 1:40 AM

Yeah, that steering wheel analogy is all over the place.

by Anonymousreply 316March 28, 2022 8:28 AM

[quote] But if you’re driving down the turnpike, straight and easy and then suddenly turn the wheel in one direction, immediately followed by a sharp and complete turn in the other direction, do you think the car would stay on the road? No.

It may or may not stay on the road, but the point is I don’t think the car’s roof would just come flying off.

by Anonymousreply 317March 28, 2022 3:35 PM

^^^

But it would be likely, and understandable, if one of the wheels did.

The roof, or brakes, or even cigarette lighter, have NOTHING to do with the steering.

The rudder on a transport category plane (read: passenger jet) has everything to do with maintaining aircraft control. It is basically a wing, just mounted on a different axis.

When both Boeing and Airbus started to stretch fuselages it became necessary to increase the rudders’ size in order to ensure aircraft control during all phases of flight, but especially at slower speeds (think: landing). This increase made the rudder susceptible to over-controlling through poor pilot technique, which has been addressed in training.

But trying to link any rudder control problems to braking, or engine failures, or oxygen masks dropping is just plain weak.

by Anonymousreply 318March 28, 2022 6:29 PM

[Quote]Chinese aviation authorities said the flight crew had not sent any distress signals before the plane suddenly nosedived near the end of its flight,

This is quite odd unless the event was so sudden the crew could not contact the tower.

by Anonymousreply 319March 28, 2022 8:14 PM

R318- That sounds more like a suicidal pilot, doesn't it?

by Anonymousreply 320March 28, 2022 8:26 PM

“According to Flight radar the plane plummets from 29,000 feet to 2900 feet in 90 seconds and then there is a certain return of control from the nose dive before it falls again.

It is believed even this early from the viewing of the Flt MU 5735 flight path map, the captain is trying hard to lift and turn to avoid the aircraft from crashing into the city of Guangzhou. If that is so it was an act of high courage.“

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by Anonymousreply 321March 29, 2022 2:20 AM

Yes, R320, it does seem to be that way. I really hate the idea of jumping to conclusions in situations like these, but since China has NOT invited representatives from our FAA, NTSB or even Boeing which all have rights to investigate under ICAO treaties, I have little faith that any announced cause of this tragedy will ever be able to be fully believed.

Exhibit A has already been presented by R321.

by Anonymousreply 322March 29, 2022 5:39 AM

The Chinese are liars and not to be trusted.

by Anonymousreply 323March 29, 2022 8:38 AM

What was the point of pretending there might be survivors for several days? Nobody with a functioning brain thought that could be the case.

by Anonymousreply 324March 29, 2022 10:32 AM

That really was ridiculous, R324! I watched the video of the plane nose-diving from the sky and survivors were impossible to comprehend.

by Anonymousreply 325March 29, 2022 11:33 AM

“China will lead the investigation. It will include a representative of the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board and representatives from Boeing and CFM, the General Electric Co.-Safran joint venture that made the engines. The NTSB has said that talks were ongoing with China to address COVID-19 quarantine requirements.“

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by Anonymousreply 326March 29, 2022 12:11 PM

I can already predict the findings of the investigation: Western powers sabotaged the plain in a failed attempt to embarrass China.

by Anonymousreply 327March 29, 2022 6:29 PM

R327, it’s not beyond the realm of possibility that someone, for some reason, sabotaged the plane or the pilots. There were supposedly several executives of a mining company on the plane; maybe they were targeted and somebody put something in the food that went on the plane. I think that’s at least as likely as pilot suicide- one pilot had flown for 40 years, personally trained in the U.S. with Boeing, had a spotless safety record and was 1 year from retirement- maybe he had a medical emergency while alongside the trainee, the pilot in training who was only supposed to be watching, not flying. There are a lot of possibilities. But that one pilot suicide from the 90s, a key bit of evidence was that he insured himself with $5 million right before the crash and owed $3 million in gambling debts. Without something like that to suggest suicide, a pilot suicide doesn’t really seem more likely than any number of other theories.

by Anonymousreply 328March 29, 2022 7:06 PM

There’s been more than 1 pilot suicide.

by Anonymousreply 329March 29, 2022 8:03 PM

[quote] and owed $3 million in gambling debts.

How does that even happen?!

by Anonymousreply 330March 29, 2022 8:08 PM

Maybe the autopilot deflated?

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by Anonymousreply 331March 29, 2022 8:12 PM

US officials are traveling to China this week to participate in the investigation.

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by Anonymousreply 332March 29, 2022 9:18 PM

R332 Good.

by Anonymousreply 333March 30, 2022 1:21 PM

I agree, good, but now restricted will they be from actual information and the pieces itself? And unless one of them speaks Chinese, I doubt the CVR will matter to them.

by Anonymousreply 334March 30, 2022 1:52 PM

It's a US-made plane so US aviation officials have a right to go, including from the US manufacturers. It's not because the US is the ruler of everything in the world so only Americans can pass judgement on everything that happens in humanity.

[quote]Under a United Nations treaty, the country where a crash occurs leads the investigation, while representatives from nations in which the plane and its components were manufactured have a right to participate.

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by Anonymousreply 335March 30, 2022 2:18 PM

R334, since more than 50 percent of China’s commercial airliners are from Boeing, I would be very surprised if they can’t have someone there who speaks Chinese.

I would think the investigation would be even better if it included non-biased parties outside of both the US and China. China and the U.S. arguably both have motives to skew the results; the FAA was ready to declare it a likely pilot suicide in the absence of any evidence. Maybe it was, but someone who declares something like that before the investigation even begins isn’t likely to be an impartial arbiter. My own 401k includes Blackrock Fund, which owns 5 percent of Boeing shares- that’s the problem with companies that are too big to fail. What if there is actually a problem, like with the angle of attack sensor(not MCAS) that not just Boeing has but most jets, that has been defective dozens of times but usually just gets replaced without fatalities? Will the risk of a rare flight problem outweigh the perceived risk of poor social planning and elderly people going without food and medicine(ie, failed 401k)? Plus it seems like companies trying to get by with less staff has been a growing trend since 2008, in all fields, even ones like nursing homes where you’d think safety would be very important. Trying to make shortcuts on safety could have led to a lab leak in COVID too, and was no doubt a problem in China especially in the past - it was something Boeing actually stepped in to help China with in the past, back in the 90s. Probably part of the reason China Eastern had gone 17 years without a fatal accident prior to this is due to Boeing’s efforts there to improve safety culture a couple decades ago.

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by Anonymousreply 336March 30, 2022 8:12 PM

Possible similarities to Alaska Air flight 261, which was attributed to poor maintenance. “At 16:09 (00:09 UTC), the flight crew successfully used the primary trim system to unjam the stuck horizontal stabilizer. Upon being freed, however, it quickly moved to an extreme "nose-down" position, forcing the aircraft into an almost vertical nosedive. The plane dropped from about 31,500 ft (9,600 m) to between 23,000 and 24,000 ft (7,000 and 7,300 m) in around 80 seconds. Both pilots struggled together to regain control of the aircraft, and only by pulling with 130 to 140 lb (580 to 620 N) on the controls did the flight crew stop the 6,000 ft/min (1,800 m/min) descent of the aircraft and stabilize the MD-83 at roughly 24,400 ft (7,400 m).[6]“

“One pilot radioed, "That plane has just started to do a big huge plunge." Another reported, "Yes sir, ah, I concur. He is, uh, definitely in a nose down, uh, position, descending quite rapidly."[21] ATC then tried to contact the plane. The crew of a SkyWest airliner reported, "He's, uh, definitely out of control."[21] Although the CVR captured the co-pilot saying "mayday", no radio communications were received from the flight crew during the final event.[6]: 9 [21]“

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by Anonymousreply 337March 30, 2022 10:01 PM

AA 261’s MD83 dive is vastly different from this B737 crash. Captain Ted Thompson and crew, along with ATC and maintenance, fought for 13 minutes to bird dog and solve the nose down. I think Ted Thompson’s last words were “Here we go.” The AA 261 crew’s heroic efforts are one for the ages.

This China Eastern crash profile resembles SilkAir 185’s except for the brief “recovery” attempt around FL750. But who knows if that really happened as FR24 data can be sketchy when values rapidly change.

But I refuse to believe this is a suicide/homicide until it’s proven.

Although the flight profile is extreme on this 7 year old “new”airplane maybe it’ll be another “engineering by blood” incident.

by Anonymousreply 338April 6, 2022 6:32 PM

The Global Times is reporting rumours have emerged that the co-pilot may have been responsible for the crash. In response the Government has said the investigation continues and no cause for the crash has been determined

This may have been another German Wings type of scenario

by Anonymousreply 339April 12, 2022 5:30 AM

[quote] the co-pilot may have been responsible for the crash.

Another victim of the Chinese real estate bubble.

Chinese media has examined claims that the pilot, Zhang Zhengping, left a suicide note accusing the leaders of China Eastern of “squeezing” employees and the Chinese Government of creating a “bubble” in the economy. The claims also suggest Zhengping invested in the property giant China Evergrande and all of his savings went to zero when the company began encountering serious debt troubles.

More stylish than a 1929 investor just stepping out of a New York skyscraper window

by Anonymousreply 340April 12, 2022 6:40 AM

Recent posts at pprune have argued about the 7500’ FR “recovery” data.

We have 9 days left until the promise of a 30-day update is met. Both recorders have been found and analyzed so there is no excuse not to do a 30-day report.

by Anonymousreply 341April 12, 2022 6:26 PM

Another article about the suicide note rumor.

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by Anonymousreply 342April 12, 2022 10:50 PM

Both of the black boxes are being analyzed in the US.

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by Anonymousreply 343April 12, 2022 10:52 PM

Gah R342. I will just be stunned if suicide/homicide is the cause. How could this be when China Eastern has at least 2 or 3 pilots in the cockpit?

So right off the bat, cranky Ron Gryder said it was pilot input.

Juan Brown noted the “recovery” FR data could be a G-force phenomenon.

Earlier pprune discussions noted a possible initial left roll.

My first thought was something mechanical went crazy while starting the descent to landing. So far I’ve yet to determine if the 29100 altitude/location was when normally flights started their descent. Does anyone here know?

by Anonymousreply 344April 13, 2022 4:13 PM

Maybe a de-pressurization/hypoxia situation?

by Anonymousreply 345April 13, 2022 4:59 PM

We have until Apr 20 to get a preliminary report. Even the pprune thread went silent. China Eastern ungrounded their 737-800 (not Max) so perhaps it’s not the fleet.

To be determined is what the debris was 10 km away and if it was a airplane surface failure while “at the top of the descent” or the result of a sudden left roll.

Whether that roll was deliberate or not we shall find out shortly.

by Anonymousreply 346April 17, 2022 3:23 PM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 347April 20, 2022 5:26 PM

Perhaps China Eastern has 3 or more pilots on international flights but is this the case for domestic flights like this one?

This may be like the German Wings event. Perhaps the pilot exited the cockpit for whatever reason and the co-pilot locked him out then took down the plane.

by Anonymousreply 348April 20, 2022 5:35 PM

Gah I was hoping for at least preliminary flight and voice recorder data! What is shockingly new is that the part found miles away was the right wing’s winglet outer surface. That’s probably a result of the sudden dive/roll. Not a cause.

The preliminary report notes all four corners, engines, rudder, and horizontal/vertical tail sections at the crash site.

I’ve still to determine if the 29100 “Top of Decent” was the normal distance from the airport destination and pilots were starting descent into the airport. If so, all pilots should’ve been in the cockpit if this was the regular spot.

Or if it was early and thus maybe two of the crew were engaged in their potty break before landing configuration.

by Anonymousreply 349April 20, 2022 9:28 PM

[Quote]Sources in China report that the plane had three pilots on its fateful last flight, two extremely experienced, and one trainee.

The pilot reportedly had around 7,000 hours of flight experience, while the co-pilot had 30,000.

Having a more experienced co-pilot than pilot already strikes Gethin as "unusual", although no suggestion has been given as to why this may have been the case.

by Anonymousreply 350April 20, 2022 9:39 PM

I was thinking this is more likely a passenger issue rather than a crew member

by Anonymousreply 351April 20, 2022 10:08 PM

[quote] I’ve still to determine if the 29100 “Top of Decent” was the normal distance from the airport destination and pilots were starting descent into the airport.

Oh DEAR, R349! The least “Top of Decent” I can remember was Colton Ford.

by Anonymousreply 352April 21, 2022 1:39 AM

Whatever happened to this?

by Anonymousreply 353April 22, 2022 3:29 PM

There's some speculation about the First Officer (a former captain with many years experience and thousands of flight hours logged) possibly suiciding the flight. He had been demoted from captain to FO after an incident, and as well allegedly lost a passel of $$ in real estate. No confirmation of this, and pretty sure China would never admit to this being the case.

by Anonymousreply 354April 22, 2022 4:47 PM

whatever happened with this story? usually plane crash stories get a lot more coverage on follow up.

by Anonymousreply 355April 23, 2022 6:16 PM

China Eastern’s maximum age for a captain is 58, and the co-pilot was 59. So the demotion of the co-pilot/First Officer would have happened because of age
I can’t find anything online about an incident causing a demotion for him - he was apparently on China Eastern’s website with full credentials and accolades before this happened.

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by Anonymousreply 356April 23, 2022 7:32 PM

We need the FDR and CVR info released. They were sent to the US. Honeywell, Boeing, and NTSB have had ample time to analyze the data.

The loss of the trailing edge of the right winglet found 12 km from the crash site wasn’t the cause of the sudden left roll and dive at 29100. It was the result.

by Anonymousreply 357April 27, 2022 12:38 AM

It was the pilot that intentionally crashed the plane according to the black box.

by Anonymousreply 358May 17, 2022 9:13 PM

^ Any word as to why he did it?

by Anonymousreply 359May 17, 2022 9:15 PM

Black box data suggest someone pushed the controls to force the plane into a nosedive, according to the report.

China Eastern added it was unlikely someone broke into the cockpit, noting Chinese authorities have said no one from the plane sent an emergency code before it crashed.

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by Anonymousreply 360May 17, 2022 9:20 PM

The pilot must have been out of the cockpit and there was little the third pilot, the trainee, could do.

by Anonymousreply 361May 17, 2022 9:39 PM

This was immediately evident from the way the plane crashed as per several posters at pprune, but it sucks to see it confirmed you kind of hope that someone didn’t just snap and kill so many innocent people like this.

by Anonymousreply 362May 17, 2022 10:34 PM

Random awful luck to get the suicidal pilot. I'm feeling down because I was hit by a car recently. Reading a story like this, I don't know whether to be grateful my accident was so minor or feel worse that life is just random and our lives can be snuffed out over the most inexplicable shit.

by Anonymousreply 363May 17, 2022 10:52 PM

More than 49,000 pieces of plane debris were found. It took two days to find the cockpit voice recorder and six days for the flight data recorder, which was buried 5 feet underground.

[quote] Any word as to why he did it?

possibly in r340

Chinese media has examined claims that the pilot, Zhang Zhengping, left a suicide note accusing the leaders of China Eastern of “squeezing” employees and the Chinese Government of creating a “bubble” in the economy. The claims also suggest Zhengping invested in the property giant China Evergrande and all of his savings went to zero when the company began encountering serious debt troubles.

by Anonymousreply 364May 17, 2022 11:23 PM

R363- If anything can make you see the positive side- go for it my friend!

by Anonymousreply 365May 18, 2022 12:41 AM

R363. Be grateful you now understand life is fragile and very short. We'll all be dead soon anyway so enjoy your short time here, hombre.

by Anonymousreply 366May 18, 2022 1:16 AM

Are they even allowed to sue the Airline in China? Is it govt owned?

by Anonymousreply 367May 18, 2022 4:50 AM

I read on another site the pilot got what he considered a demotion.

by Anonymousreply 368May 18, 2022 4:21 PM

He aged out. Not a demotion but a company policy which is quite a good one.

by Anonymousreply 369May 18, 2022 5:11 PM

If the other pilot was out of his seat, there's no way he or a relief pilot could possibly get back into the seat to take control; the G-forces pushing them towards the tail would have been too great. That's happened before, like the flight where the Russian pilot let his kid fly the plane. The kid inadvertently disconnected the autopilot and the resulting dive made it impossible for his dad to get back into the chair or for the copilot to lean forward enough to grab the stick.

by Anonymousreply 370May 18, 2022 7:09 PM

Ron Gryder was correct within a day or so. His YT video was so on point.

Juan Brown right away mentioned the “recovery” might’ve been a gravity phenomenon due to extreme G forces and flight surfaces trying to naturally recover.

I want the FDR and CVR info released now. I’m so pissed off how everyone is tiptoeing around this.

by Anonymousreply 371May 18, 2022 8:15 PM

I just can't fathom the mindset to mass murder innocent people out of spite.

by Anonymousreply 372May 18, 2022 9:18 PM

Ah R371- You mean Dan Gryder. Took me a second!

I watch both of their channels too.

by Anonymousreply 373May 18, 2022 10:04 PM

"Dan Gryder..." points to hat ... "Probable Cause"

by Anonymousreply 374May 18, 2022 10:44 PM

Some of you may consider my opinion racist, I can't control that. There is a bit of a fatalistic trait in some Asian cultures that makes it easier for an individual to rationalize their insane acts against a larger group/populace just because that individual FEELS so justly at the moment.

As I sit here writing this and searching for a parallel, I would hesitantly suggest it's almost like a white man sexually assaulting or raping a woman just because he feels entitled to do so. He has needs, she's the means to an end, and his status eclipses any acknowledgment she may think she deserves.

Sadly, I think in China it's much the same. Sadder to say that it's so prevalent it even penetrates the levels of professionalism that we would think are the highest: Pilots. A close parallel would be the missing Malaysian B-777 , MH370. The converse of this example would be the Korean airliner OZ214 that crashed into SFO for *no *good *reason!

by Anonymousreply 375May 19, 2022 3:28 AM

Yes, R375, you are racist. Also fucking stupid. And American, of course.

by Anonymousreply 376May 19, 2022 4:11 AM

Based on comments from pprune the reason for the conclusion is that the FDR parameter is for the yoke, not clear on the trim yet. I suspect the US was able to get something from the CVR that supports the deliberate yoke input from the FDR which is why they leaked this.

by Anonymousreply 377May 19, 2022 4:38 PM

[quote]not clear on the trim yet.

I figured that out way back in high school. I knew then and there it wasn’t for me.

by Anonymousreply 378May 25, 2022 5:43 PM

If the pilot were American, he would have gone to the airlines headquarter and massacred people there. Well, at least there would still be a plane left to fly.

by Anonymousreply 379May 25, 2022 6:03 PM
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