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Yikes. Skyrocketing Covid Cases, Lockdowns and Riots in Europe

VIENNA (AP) — Tens of thousands of protesters, many from far-right groups, marched through Vienna on Saturday after the Austrian government announced a nationwide lockdown beginning Monday to contain skyrocketing coronavirus infections.

Demonstrations against virus restrictions also took place in Switzerland, Croatia, Italy, Northern Ireland and the Netherlands on Saturday, a day after Dutch police opened fire on protesters and seven people were injured in rioting that erupted in Rotterdam. Protesters rallied against coronavirus restrictions and mandatory COVID-19 passes needed in many European countries to enter restaurants, Christmas markets or sports events, as well as mandatory vaccinations.

The Austrian lockdown will start Monday and comes as average daily deaths have tripled in recent weeks and hospitals in heavily hit states have warned that intensive care units are reaching capacity. The lockdown will last at least 10 days but could go up to 20, officials said. People will be able to leave their homes only for specific reasons, including buying groceries, going to the doctor or exercising.

The government also will make vaccinations mandatory starting Feb. 1. Not quite 66% of Austria’s 8.9 million people are fully vaccinated, one of the lowest rates in Western Europe.

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by Anonymousreply 310December 3, 2021 8:09 AM

The far right wing pretty much doesn't care about protectong vulnerable people, medical science, the rule of law and good governance. Fuck them, really.

by Anonymousreply 1November 21, 2021 2:01 AM

If people don't start figuring out how to get along we are going to end up in WW3. It's starting to feel like there are a lot of parallels to the time leading up to WW2.

by Anonymousreply 2November 21, 2021 2:02 AM

Trump nearly singled handedly brought back fascism and racism out from under a rock. That was five years ago. Now it has metastasized to consume all Republicans and has even emboldened despots all over the world who have seen it work here. Our democracy is hanging by a thread. Not to be an alarmist, but we could be entering a very dark age.

by Anonymousreply 3November 21, 2021 2:19 AM

When fascists are burning shit down in *Austria* you know things are bad.

by Anonymousreply 4November 21, 2021 2:24 AM

Actually r3 Brexit happened before Trump. Eurpoe was ahead of the US with fascism.

And as Obama said I don't think Trump is a fascist. His thinking isn't ordered enough to follow any particular ideology. He goes with whatever pops into his head.

Even his racism he got from reading an Ann Coulter book and adopted it as his own.

by Anonymousreply 5November 21, 2021 2:25 AM

R3 sounds like one of those Trump-is-doomsday trolls that has been infesting this website for quite some time.

by Anonymousreply 6November 21, 2021 2:32 AM

wait I want to edit r5. He probably didn't read Ann Coulter's book. He read about it let's say.

by Anonymousreply 7November 21, 2021 2:35 AM

Trump is a breath of fresh air. So intelligent, loyal, kind, even handed and even handsome! A class act. I want to suck his dick!

by Anonymousreply 8November 21, 2021 2:41 AM

Trump got his racism from his KKK dad

by Anonymousreply 9November 21, 2021 2:45 AM

Can we keep this thread focused on Covid restrictions in Europe today?

by Anonymousreply 10November 21, 2021 2:49 AM

R10 How about the *skyrocketing Covid cases* that are a precursor to what we’ll be seeing here in a few weeks?

by Anonymousreply 11November 21, 2021 3:38 AM

This is why I am vaccinated and I continue to use a mask whenever I leave my home. I refuse to believe any report saying it's OK to relax restrictions. When the CDC announces the pandemic is over, I'll consider changing my stance.

by Anonymousreply 12November 21, 2021 7:17 AM

The head of state they just recently kicked out for corruption was a far right Putin stooge.

by Anonymousreply 13November 21, 2021 7:38 AM

They didn't kick out the head of state, r13 -- that would be the president; he's a former Green party leader and a very low-key moderate ex-professor.

They kicked out Sebastian Kurz, the relatively youthful now two-time ex-chancellor. He was a stooge all right, but not for Putin, but rather for big-business interests -- he lengthened the workday and cut social services to appease his sponsors. The hard line he trumpeted on migration was a poll-driven political tactic to distract from his actual agenda.

by Anonymousreply 14November 21, 2021 12:43 PM

I can't believe they used real bullets to shoot into the crowd in Rotterdam.

by Anonymousreply 15November 21, 2021 12:54 PM

Kurz almost sold Austria out to Putin.

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by Anonymousreply 16November 21, 2021 12:54 PM

[quote]How about the *skyrocketing Covid cases* that are a precursor to what we’ll be seeing here in a few weeks?

It's already happening here, in some places at least:

Coronavirus data for Thursday, Nov. 18: Daily cases spike 104% as Michigan’s surge hits No. 1 in the U.S.

Michigan was averaging 3,613 newly reported cases of COVID-19 a week ago. That seven-day average spiked to 7,353 cases per day as of Wednesday, Nov. 17 -- an increase of 103.5% in one week’s time. Michigan now leads all states in total new cases, as well as new cases per 100,000 residents and percentage increase over the last two weeks.

by Anonymousreply 17November 21, 2021 12:59 PM

Why do they have to protest in Switzerland? Can't they just hold a referendum over no lockdowns or whatever?

by Anonymousreply 18November 21, 2021 1:01 PM

[Quote] I can't believe they used real bullets to shoot into the crowd in Rotterdam.

I can't believe no one was killed. Those cops need to work on their marksmanship!

by Anonymousreply 19November 21, 2021 1:22 PM

What'd we do on LHOTP? Strip 'em, stick 'em in a tub of ice for 3 days, and pray like you've never prayed before. God will provide, unless He doesn't.

by Anonymousreply 20November 21, 2021 1:36 PM

Gee, that couldn't be because the Republican legislature took away all emergency powers from the Democratic governor and convinced the brain dead Trumpists not to get vaccinated in Michigan, could it?

Michigan! Where the vaccination rate is 54.3%! Come enoy our beaches! AND DIE!

by Anonymousreply 21November 21, 2021 1:37 PM

In a stunning (but not surprising) display of hypocrisy, the GOP criticized Michigan governor Gretchen Whitmer this week for not doing enough to prevent the current surge.

However, I do feel that she has completely abdicated any leadership role on COVID. She has said barely a peep about it since June. Two of her Health Dept. heads have quit because they wanted to implement stricter containment measures (which they still have the legal right to do) and she wouldn't allow it. She read the tea leaves and decided to focus on her reelection above all else.

by Anonymousreply 22November 21, 2021 1:57 PM

White people just want to die apparently.

by Anonymousreply 23November 21, 2021 2:01 PM

[quote] She has said barely a peep about it since June.

A simple google search reveals that to be a blatant lie.

[quote] Two of her Health Dept. heads have quit because they wanted to implement stricter containment measures (which they still have the legal right to do) and she wouldn't allow it.

There is no evidence that that was why the first resigned and the second asked to resign.

[quote] She read the tea leaves and decided to focus on her reelection above all else.

Boy, you didn't reveal your bias at all.

by Anonymousreply 24November 21, 2021 2:09 PM

I lived in the netherlands for a decade, I'm back in the US now. An american friend who still lives there was visiting recently and we discussed the partial lockdown in his residence country and he was fairly nonchalant about it. the protesters are likely rightwing agitators it seems

by Anonymousreply 25November 21, 2021 2:18 PM

[quote]Boy, you didn't reveal your bias at all.

My "bias" is that of progressive writer Susan Demas and the progressive Michigan Advance:

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by Anonymousreply 26November 21, 2021 3:12 PM

Yeah, I got it in the other thread. You are a Berniebot who would rather see Michigan become Ohio than support Whitmer. Got it.

by Anonymousreply 27November 21, 2021 3:15 PM

Having lived in Europe (and traveled to every European country except Norway, Russia, Kosovo, and Belarus), I find it hilarious how people assume Europeans are any more enlightened than Americans. Americans suffer from spoiled brat syndrome in that they feel they can say and do whatever they want, and they have the tendency to be contrarions. But many states in the US have fared better in the age of COVID than European countries that get kudos.

by Anonymousreply 28November 21, 2021 3:21 PM

r28.

by Anonymousreply 29November 21, 2021 4:17 PM

LMAO, get a fucking life!!! You block practically everyone for everything, and then can't resist seeing what they have to say. It's fucking pathetic and everyone else can see it...why can't you?

by Anonymousreply 30November 21, 2021 5:26 PM

r30

by Anonymousreply 31November 21, 2021 5:31 PM

More anti-lockdown protests, this time in Brussels.

BRUSSELS (AP) — Ten of thousands of people demonstrated through central Brussels on Sunday to protest reinforced COVID-19 restrictions imposed by the Belgian government to counter the latest spike in coronavirus cases.

Many among the police estimate of 35,000 at the rally had already left for home when the demonstration descended into violence as several hundred people started pelting police, smashing cars and setting garbage bins ablaze. Police replied with tear gas and water cannons and sought to restore order when dusk settled on the Belgian capital.

“We have injuries but we cannot yet say how many,” said police spokesperson Ilse Vande Keere. It was also unclear how many people were detained.

Earlier, marchers came to protest the government’s strong advice to get vaccinated and any possible moves to impose mandatory shots.

Shouting “Freedom! Freedom! Freedom!” and singing the anti-fascist song “Bella Ciao,” protesters lined up behind a huge banner saying “Together for Freedom” and marched to the European Union headquarters. Amid the crowd, the signs varied from far-right insignia to the rainbow flags of the LGBT community.

The World Health Organization said last week that Europe was the hot spot of the pandemic right now, the only region in which COVID-19 deaths were rising. The autumn surge of infections is overwhelming hospitals in many Central and Eastern European nations, including Ukraine, Russia, Romania, the Czech Republic and Slovakia.

Over the past several days, there have been many anti-vaccination marches in European nations as one government after another tightened measures. Dutch police arrested more than 30 people during unrest in The Hague and other towns in the Netherlands on Saturday, following much worse violence the previous night.

Austria is going into a 10-day national lockdown on Monday for all of its people, after first imposing a lockdown on the unvaccinated. Christmas markets in Vienna were packed Sunday with locals and tourists alike taking in the holiday sights before shops and food stalls had to close.

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by Anonymousreply 32November 21, 2021 5:36 PM

Weird - and scary - to see the anti-vax loons are as prevalent over there in many places. Most still have higher vax rates than US overall - but clearly lots of right wing loons who would rather die than psychologically “give in” to orders from government. Amazing they completely ignore what will happen if they get sick - when they expect medical care in the hospital.

The issue driving this is the hospital overwhelm. The correct answer is to deny the anti-vax people medical care. But somehow that is unacceptable. If they feel so strongly about not “giving in”, they should be denied medical care in hospitals when they get Covid.. Their stubbornness is causing lots of innocent people to die because hospitals can’t handle the volume.

by Anonymousreply 33November 21, 2021 6:00 PM

R33

Considering the fact that most of the hospitalizations are among people that have already been vaccinated your "logic" is retarded.

by Anonymousreply 34November 21, 2021 6:02 PM

Every single person protesting lockdowns, vaccinations and mask wearing should be forced to work in a god damned hospital.

by Anonymousreply 35November 21, 2021 6:03 PM

R17 shut the airports down in Michigan. No passenger flights, none. No Christmas or thanksgiving air travel in or out of Michigan except for cargo, until the state hits herd immunity. Close highways too

by Anonymousreply 36November 21, 2021 6:06 PM

[quote]Considering the fact that most of the hospitalizations are among people that have already been vaccinated your "logic" is retarded.

I'm sure you have a link to back that up.

by Anonymousreply 37November 21, 2021 6:13 PM

Are EU countries generally requiring vaccinations to go back into office?

by Anonymousreply 38November 21, 2021 6:47 PM

R37 - no he doesn't. The stats show that 90% of hospitalizations are unvaccinated.

However, with the immunity wearing off from the vaccinations, that may not be the case in the last 30 days. I got my booster 2 weeks ago and am grateful for it.

If you look at the case rate the past few days in Europe - it's scary. Some countries are having the highest daily case loads EVER. If the US heads the same way - and undoubtedly it will with the holidays - then we're looking at overrun hospitals yet again.

This shit never ends - and unfortunately, it's predictable that Jan and Feb will be a lot of deaths yet again. And many will be from vaxxed people without the booster. I don't give 2 shits about the unvaxxed - let them die.

by Anonymousreply 39November 21, 2021 6:57 PM

EU needs to step up booster shots yesterday.

Are they in some kind of bureaucratic delay over boosters?

by Anonymousreply 40November 21, 2021 6:59 PM

As long as you're issuing ultimatums, R40, maybe look at the weeds in your own garden?. Look at this list, sorted by fully or partially vaccinated and the U.S. comes in at 57th place (for fully vaccinated); Western Europe countries lead the U.S., quite significantly in most cases, and the lower (than U.S.) rates fall along parts of Eastern Europe.

Or find any other list looking at the same question.

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by Anonymousreply 41November 21, 2021 7:15 PM

Oh piss all the way the fuck off, R41.

Did I say overall vaccination rates, R41?

No, I did not.

I said boosters.

Next time read actually read the statement before popping off.

by Anonymousreply 42November 21, 2021 7:34 PM

It is true that far right is engaged in these protests because they see the opportunity to cause some trouble to EU leaders, but there is also a lot of skepticism about experimental vaccination made by powerful multi-national pharmaceutical companies predominantly controlled by American capital. Then, the vaccine has proved to be not so efficient. Some people had serious side effects and few even died. Then, EU health institutions have made political decision to ban perfectly efficient Russian Sputnik that would have been choice of many people here in Croatia. Some Croatians go to Serbia and Bosnia to get Sputnik vaccine. Balkans is a place where people rightfully don't believe in institutions.

Many people in Europe, me included, are waiting for safer protein vaccine Sanofi from France. Don't get me wrong, but Rna vaccines are experimental, and Astra Zeneca and Johnson have had some side effects that made them banned in certain states.

by Anonymousreply 43November 21, 2021 7:51 PM

R43 - oh fuck off. Hundreds of millions have received the COVID vaccines without any problems. You go ahead and dismiss them and wait for your 'perfect' vaccine.

God - the bullshit some of you try to sell on this board.

by Anonymousreply 44November 21, 2021 7:58 PM

Douglas Murray

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by Anonymousreply 45November 21, 2021 8:03 PM

I'll add another fuck off to r43.

by Anonymousreply 46November 21, 2021 8:04 PM

R43 can suck my dick too

by Anonymousreply 47November 21, 2021 8:08 PM

[quote]EU health institutions have made political decision to ban perfectly efficient Russian Sputnik that would have been choice of many people here in Croatia.

The Russian people don't even want to take Sputnik.

by Anonymousreply 48November 21, 2021 8:09 PM

Look, you can get enraged all you want, but I only tried to explain you how things are functioning here. People are not the same everywhere as they are in America.

by Anonymousreply 49November 21, 2021 8:10 PM

Riots you say, OP?

Hmmmmm.

Anyone know what airline flies there?

by Anonymousreply 50November 21, 2021 8:15 PM

[quote]...experimental vaccination made by powerful multi-national pharmaceutical companies predominantly controlled by American capital. Then, the vaccine has proved to be not so efficient.

Funny how "experimental" vaccines — developed in a time of crisis — have not been 100% effective in preventing the spread of the virus when nearly half of the people (in America specifically, but true worldwide generally) have refused to take the vaccine at all, let alone three doses. This is the right's bugaboo; they need the certainty of authoritarian leadership and are willing to dismiss the fact that authoritarians are particularly bad at leading in times of crisis. I know R10 would like us to focus on Covid restrictions in Europe, but unfortunately rightwing ideology and covid are inexorably intertwined thanks to authoritarian leaders throughout the world using a virus to further their political agenda (and again, to understand what the right is doing all you have to do is look at what they accuse of the left).

The lockdowns aren't political, but the right certainly wants them to be.

Cosign r44, r46 and r47. Should we just do nothing until a magically 100% effective vaccine with absolutely no side effects comes along, R43 (setting aside, for the moment, the fact that no vaccine for any disease in the history of the world meets that stipulation)? How will we know, given that there is an alarmingly high percentage of the population that despite all evidence, insists that they will never take any vaccine? Please, r43, hold your breath... and wait.

by Anonymousreply 51November 21, 2021 8:16 PM

[quote] This is why I am vaccinated and I continue to use a mask whenever I leave my home. I refuse to believe any report saying it's OK to relax restrictions. When the CDC announces the pandemic is over, I'll consider changing my stance.

The CDC were the ones that said masks weren’t necessary if you were vaccinated. Why would you not believe them on that but believe them if/when they say the pandemic is over?

by Anonymousreply 52November 21, 2021 8:17 PM

Since this is the topic of this thread and Croatia is mentioned in it I wanted to give you brief information about the public sentiment, but if you only want to curse the damn anti waxers, well...

by Anonymousreply 53November 21, 2021 8:18 PM

Europe's biggest problem going into winter is NOT Covid.

Europe's biggest problem going into winter are insufficient supplies of NATURAL GAS AND COAL which may cause people to endure blackouts and freezing homes.

by Anonymousreply 54November 21, 2021 8:18 PM

[quote] [R43] can suck my dick too

Did you really use this as an insult on a gay board?

Unless you’re a great big fat person, then I understand it.

by Anonymousreply 55November 21, 2021 8:18 PM

[quote] but if you only want to curse the damn anti waxers,

Wax on, wax off.

by Anonymousreply 56November 21, 2021 8:19 PM

[quote]Europe's biggest problem going into winter is NOT Covid. Europe's biggest problem going into winter are insufficient supplies of NATURAL GAS AND COAL which may cause people to endure blackouts and freezing homes.

Unless those insufficient supplies result in half a million deaths, I'd say Covid is still a bigger problem.

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by Anonymousreply 57November 21, 2021 8:21 PM

The right fighting for liberty and civil rights against a left that has turned authoritarian was not on my bingo card.

by Anonymousreply 58November 21, 2021 8:22 PM

It’s interesting how this far right shit emerged in the west after the fall of the Soviet Union.

It’s tempting to look at the USA and say it was a factor of Clinton’s election and the GOP response to that — they thought the Republican Party would rule the country forever and Clinton was such a shock they decided to set up a propaganda network, Fox News, which worked extremely well and has resulted in a powerful extremist, unmoored-from-reality rightwing faction in the USA.

But that doesn’t explain what’s happening in Europe. Perhaps part of it is that conflict has turned inward after the Red Menace fell?

by Anonymousreply 59November 21, 2021 8:22 PM

The "right fighting for civil rights", r58? Bwah-ha-ha...ha!!! I'll say this for you, you fly your troll flag proudly.

by Anonymousreply 60November 21, 2021 8:25 PM

The CDC has been to Hell and back, R52. They've had their credibility destroyed (by Trump) and when given the opportunity to assert leadership under Biden, they went too far too quickly. Recall how about a month ago Biden announced that everybody was going to need a booster, and the CDC balked? Yeah, no one noticed when they finally announced this week that everyone is going to need a booster, and no one said "Biden was right!". These human beings are fallible and susceptible to political pressure. I thought it was a mistake when they jumped the gun and announced that we could unmask, but then again, I learned early on in the pandemic that the CDC was made up of people trying to do their best, flummoxed by leaders whose interests were and are political in nature.

by Anonymousreply 61November 21, 2021 8:26 PM

LOL R56.

by Anonymousreply 62November 21, 2021 8:26 PM

So can the US really expect to have our biggest hospitalization and death rates EVER this winter?

by Anonymousreply 63November 21, 2021 8:27 PM

When the infection and death rates are down and when the ER is clear of covid patients, then it's over. This is not over because you're tired of it all.

by Anonymousreply 64November 21, 2021 8:27 PM

r58 in the **COVID-19: stigmatising the unvaccinated is not justified** thread:

[quote]It is therefore wrong and dangerous to speak of a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Historically, both the USA and Germany have engendered negative experiences by stigmatising parts of the population for their skin colour or religion. I call on high-level officials and scientists to stop the inappropriate stigmatisation of unvaccinated people, who include our patients, colleagues, and other fellow citizens, and to put extra effort into bringing society together.

by Anonymousreply 65November 21, 2021 8:28 PM

Anti-waxer

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by Anonymousreply 66November 21, 2021 8:28 PM

Nah, it's over when a majority of people lose their fear and tell governments that they have had enough of this BS.

by Anonymousreply 67November 21, 2021 8:29 PM

R61, that was kind of my point. Yet that person said they’d believe the CDC when they say the pandemic is over. I thought it a little ironic is all.

by Anonymousreply 68November 21, 2021 8:30 PM

Enough of what bs?

by Anonymousreply 69November 21, 2021 8:35 PM

FYI - there was an anti-vaccine mandate march in NYC on Saturday, Nov. 20. It went past Columbus Circle. It was pretty big.

by Anonymousreply 70November 21, 2021 8:57 PM

Paste eating prostitutes are irrelevant.

by Anonymousreply 71November 21, 2021 9:10 PM

This will officially kill Vienna’s Christmas markets. I was there 4 years ago, Vienna knows how to DO Christmas.

by Anonymousreply 72November 21, 2021 9:14 PM

It's routine for people to get flu shots annually. As things stand now - "now" being the operative word - it may become routine - and recommended - to get your covid shot semi-annually. Fortunately, the RNA vaccines can be reformulated against new variants very quickly.

by Anonymousreply 73November 21, 2021 9:17 PM

If the anti vaxxers don't believe in what medical experts tell them, they should not get medical care when they get sick from covid. And before somebody counter arguments, the same can be said by people who smoke, eat unhealthy food, drink too much alcohol - none of these things affect the person next to you on the train, in a restaurant, in a movie theater.

by Anonymousreply 74November 21, 2021 9:24 PM

Let's make this dickhead at R74, World Health Czar, doling out medicine according to whim and righteousness.

by Anonymousreply 75November 21, 2021 9:53 PM

I stand with r74.

by Anonymousreply 76November 21, 2021 9:55 PM

What a surprise, Austria is full of deplorables.

by Anonymousreply 77November 21, 2021 9:59 PM

At least those fucking children will be locked up in the Villa von Trapp!

by Anonymousreply 78November 21, 2021 10:44 PM

[quote] If the anti vaxxers don't believe in what medical experts tell them, they should not get medical care when they get sick from covid. And before somebody counter arguments, the same can be said by people who smoke, eat unhealthy food, drink too much alcohol - none of these things affect the person next to you on the train, in a restaurant, in a movie theater.

Agreed 1000% R74.

Furthermore if they get sick with ANYTHING they should not go to the hospital. If they cannot trust medical professionals who tell them that getting vaccinated is the best possible way of preventing serious illness or death from Covid, why should they trust these same professionals when they treat them with chemotherapy for cancer, bypass surgery for heart disease or insulin for diabetes? By the way those treatments have VASTLY higher incidences of serious and fatal side effects than ANY vaccine, so please fucking spare us the “bUt ThE eXperiMEntaL VaCCineS!” Crap

by Anonymousreply 79November 21, 2021 11:04 PM

[quote]EU health institutions have made political decision to ban perfectly efficient Russian Sputnik that would have been choice of many people here in Croatia.

Even Russians reject Sputnik R43, because nobody trusts a heavily underfunded Russian heath ministerium. Trustworthy vaccines are widely available now if governments are willing to pay for them. I'm sure Croatia has enough funds to pay for 8 million Pfizer or Moderna shots.

by Anonymousreply 80November 21, 2021 11:22 PM

Of course we have Pfizer and Moderna, our PM is is a dutiful little Brussel's valet.

by Anonymousreply 81November 21, 2021 11:27 PM

Die in a grease fire R75!

- R74

by Anonymousreply 82November 21, 2021 11:27 PM

More riots/protests in France, Netherlands

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by Anonymousreply 83November 22, 2021 12:11 AM

If you’re advocating for the deliberate separation of a segment of humanity, you are not a liberal.

by Anonymousreply 84November 22, 2021 12:54 AM

Who are you addressing, r84?

by Anonymousreply 85November 22, 2021 12:58 AM

R84 in an example of the “deliberate separation of a segment of humanity”, wouldn’t you agree that putting the mentally ill in an institution in eminently better than letting them wander the streets homeless? Being pro-pandemic is a form of mental illness.

by Anonymousreply 86November 22, 2021 1:35 AM

That is exactly what they are. There are not anti vaxx, they are procovid. They don't mask, observe quarantine or social distancing recommendations.

by Anonymousreply 87November 22, 2021 1:40 AM

[quote]If you’re advocating for the deliberate separation of a segment of humanity, you are not a liberal.

Get this R84!

Criminals have been separated from main societies for centuries. Mentally deranged and dangerous people are put on medication so they don't harm themselves and others. Smoker are separated from non smokers. Paedophiles are being kept away from children. Convicted rapists need to register with police. Vaccinated people ban anti vaxxers from safe places they want to hang out.

Your idea of idiotic libertarianism does not work in stable societies that abide by the rule of law.

by Anonymousreply 88November 22, 2021 1:57 AM

R61 At the outset of the pandemic the CDC destroyed their credibility all on their own with no assist from Donald Trump when they first insisted that only they could develop a test for the virus then sent out a test that didn't work because they had contaminated it. Crucial weeks were lost.

by Anonymousreply 89November 22, 2021 2:29 AM

It's amazing how high the bar is set for some and how low for others, r89.

by Anonymousreply 90November 22, 2021 2:31 AM

LAKES R21, Michigan has LAKES. Not beaches.

by Anonymousreply 91November 22, 2021 2:52 AM

It is bizarre to me that anti-vaxxers talk about people getting sick “and even dying” from the vaccine. Millions of doses with a few cases of side effects. But the hundreds of thousands who died from having Covid because they weren’t vaccinated are not mentioned.

The blind stubbornness of those people is a case study in human flaws - that people are able to deny facts due to their allegiance to a belief system. It is the religious faith mindset being applied to politics - arguing with logic is useless.

by Anonymousreply 92November 22, 2021 3:11 AM

well put

by Anonymousreply 93November 22, 2021 3:39 AM

Anti vaxxers cannot claim freedom for something that harms others.

by Anonymousreply 94November 22, 2021 4:05 AM

to add to r92, not only do "people... deny facts due to their allegiance to a belief system" but when I ask them why people would post memes for 18 months on Facebook denying covid-19 exists, spouting their liberties and freedoms, decrying restrictions, mocking Anthony Fauci, Joe Biden, and then suddenly post they have covid-19 and mention their 02 levels from their hospital bed, the best they can do is "show proof that hospital beds are filling up," and they disregard each of eight widely selected news articles chorusing the same fact: case numbers rise, hospitals can't keep up -- one prominent anti-vaxxer was hospitalized for six weeks, moved to another province because his local hospital had no space for him.

Imagine having a brick for a brain and denying any and all of this without any countering facts.

I'm not interested in learning of covid-19 skyrocketing cases unless I know that the majority of the cases are people like me who are vaccinated, and regularly practice at least 80% of recommended prevention methods. Unvaccinated people who don't socially distance, don't accept reality, don't do any amount of recommended covid-19 prevention methods don't have my sympathy, unless their lazy and irresponsible relatives have them shut up in a care facility.

by Anonymousreply 95November 22, 2021 4:16 AM

It's absolutely bizzare to me that anti vaxxers are often Trump supporters and Trump was vaccinated. The level of logical disconnect with these people is astounding. Some sort of 'emperor has no clothes' phenomenon.

by Anonymousreply 96November 22, 2021 4:23 AM

I somewhat agree with the protestors. I'm posting from Switzerland. The ones in Austria go too far. Let the unvaccinated get COVID at this point. They will develop the antibodies we vaccinated now have, or they will die. Why make everyone suffer to protect these assholes? I have my FFP2 masks and my vax so I'm want my freedom.

by Anonymousreply 97November 22, 2021 4:27 AM

by the ones in Austria - I mean the lockdown and the mandates that are coming. Who gives a fuck at this point. Let the unvax deal with it or not. We can't change their behaviors.

by Anonymousreply 98November 22, 2021 4:28 AM

I am going to need proof that all these are "far right" groups...seems very editorial-y especially when nothing was writen in the article to back it up.

by Anonymousreply 99November 22, 2021 4:33 AM

R96...the anti vaxxers from where I live (NYC) are FAR from Trump voters. (psst check the race status of the vaxxed vs unvaxxed)

by Anonymousreply 100November 22, 2021 4:34 AM

Anti vaxxers in Germany, Austria and Switzerland include a lot of liberals and more importantly libertarian types. Anti-establishment, anti-government. Also super OCD "natural" hippy folks. "ianti-mondialists". the remains of squatters. Anarchists. grungy hipster freaks. and so on.

by Anonymousreply 101November 22, 2021 4:37 AM

Honestly don't care if they are right or not. I am not anti vax or even anti (some) mandates, but explain to me like I'm 3. We have vaccines. Yes, thy are not 100% full proof, but they help, quite alot, and, according to what I am told by the vaccine pushers, it is very rare to die if you are vaxxed, especially if you are not in any risk group.

Then why exactly are there still being lockdowns for countries in Europe who have about a 80/85/90% vaccine rate? Honestly...something isn't making sense. Someone make it make sense for me.

by Anonymousreply 102November 22, 2021 4:45 AM

Liberalism is not the same as libertarianism.

Completely different things.

by Anonymousreply 103November 22, 2021 4:45 AM

R103..libertarianism isn't necessarily right wing either.

by Anonymousreply 104November 22, 2021 4:47 AM

Which is what I specified, dogbreath smartypants R103.

R102 - German, Austria and Switzerland do NOT have 80/85/90% rates. Reading skills? Germany's was under 70% up to last week and may still be. Austria's is SHITE, too.

by Anonymousreply 105November 22, 2021 4:49 AM

80% vaccinated means 80% of all people over 12 years old. Even if it's 80% of all population it's still every 5th person who potentially can get sick from covid and may require hospitalization. For some countries with less than top quality health care system that may mean hospitals can't cope anymore and the government shutdown down regions with high covid numbers and they need to go into lockdown.

by Anonymousreply 106November 22, 2021 4:53 AM

Political Libertarianism is definitely right wing. Reagan started it all and he surely wasn't a democrat.

by Anonymousreply 107November 22, 2021 4:55 AM

France is at 76.6% of at least one timers (which one would assume will get their second soon enough) Germany is at 70% UK is at 75% Italy and Spain are at 80%

Maybe I exagerrated but the numbers ar pretty high. If the vaccines are as effective as is said, does it really need to be much more?

by Anonymousreply 108November 22, 2021 4:58 AM

Well Read the headline, bub. In Europe not all libertarians are far right. It's a politics that includes anarchists and anti-mondialists.

by Anonymousreply 109November 22, 2021 4:59 AM

R106 but is this not why we have the vaccine....is that every 5th person also a part of a very high risk group?

by Anonymousreply 110November 22, 2021 5:00 AM

Germany was a shitty 60 something% standstill for months - INTO NOVERMBER That's what this is about.

by Anonymousreply 111November 22, 2021 5:00 AM

Anarchists can very much be right wingers. There's also the argument to be made that there are a lot of similarities between far left and far right wing groups.

Yes R110, this is also why we have the vaccine. To make sure that people are protected against covid and that the hospital system still can cope. If this is what you were trying to say. Maybe you shouldn't type when you're drunk.

by Anonymousreply 112November 22, 2021 5:41 AM

R112 but then why do we need lockdowns? and why are you insult9ing me?

by Anonymousreply 113November 22, 2021 5:53 AM

Here ya go R99

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by Anonymousreply 114November 22, 2021 5:56 AM

More for R99

You can also track vaxx % on MSN.com and cross reference the voter base. It will yield a similar result except in Florida.

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by Anonymousreply 115November 22, 2021 6:01 AM

I just realized some thug that makes these protests even less surprising:

Thousands of people across Europe used to work various festivals and Christmas markets, which was a significant amount of income for the year (I’ve known a few of them over the years). At this point, it will have been nearly 2 years since these events have taken place…

These protests aren’t just about people wanting to go to nightclubs or the gym.

by Anonymousreply 116November 22, 2021 6:08 AM

The reason why they have to shut things down again is, I presume, due to the stresses it would put on the healthcare system and all of the deaths that will occur because of the shortage.

There were stories of people dying in the US because they couldn't get into a hospital due to COVID overload.

Everyone is affected - not just the unvaxxed. But we can't just lockdown unvaxxed because - they're assholes. So the rest of us have to be the parents - yet again.

Immature selfish assholes.

by Anonymousreply 117November 22, 2021 6:27 AM

But isn't the vaccine preventing that...at least the vast majority of it? R117,

by Anonymousreply 118November 22, 2021 6:30 AM

Like, what I'm asking is, shouldn't the vaccine be protecting people (even if its the people that chose not to be vaxxed?) so there isn't an overload? If it's not good enough to prevent that, then why is it being mandated? I understand either vaccine mandates, or lock downs....not both.

by Anonymousreply 119November 22, 2021 6:33 AM

R118 - no, because it's the unvaccinated that need hospitalization much more often. And there will be more serious cases with people who don't get their boosters. Many vaxxed people's immunity is decreasing.

It's always been an epidemic of the unvaccinated - before the vaccine and after the vaccine.

The only reason why it didn't spread a lot more was due to masks and lockdowns. And now there's the more virulent strain.

How many hospital beds do you think there are? There are usually 5-8 hospital beds per 1000 people in the better countries. Netherlands has 3.2 beds per 1000, Italy has 3.1 beds. US has 2.9 - nationally, but there are many underserved areas. Beds are usually 60+% filled in nonpandemic times - they're not empty.

So if 99.9% of Americans are healthy and not hospitalized, our system is still maxed out. Certain underserved areas will be overcapacity very quickly.

Just start to do the math - the amount of unvaccinated is still really high. If we get 2-3% of the unvaxxed people sick at once, that's a crush and can be disastrous. No beds for anybody else to be sick.

Plus - it's going into holidays where a lot of gatherings are going to happen. It sucks.

by Anonymousreply 120November 22, 2021 6:51 AM

Because too many people choose to not get vaccinated R119. A very virulent strain like delta easily finds every 5th, even 10th person that isn't vaccinated. 5% of those infected cases land in hospital and/or requiring intensive care.

by Anonymousreply 121November 22, 2021 7:01 AM

How did we get rid of Polio? Measles? Mumps? Everyone got vaccinated - well, almost everyone. But then people started to not have their kids vaccinated and what - measles outbreaks? Yep. It's still around.

US considered Measles to be eliminated in 2000. Recent years we had over 1200 cases.

by Anonymousreply 122November 22, 2021 7:10 AM

The states are usually about 6 weeks behind Europe on COVID infections.

Scary Christmas & Crapy Newt Year!

by Anonymousreply 123November 22, 2021 7:11 AM

R100 I have read that too. Seems that Black people don't trust the institutions, just as Balkanic nations, and for good reasons. They have rarely experienced that the institutions are on their side, so when somebody claims that he cares about their lives and health and want to protect them, they are not so prone to believe it.

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by Anonymousreply 124November 22, 2021 8:35 AM

R102 R108 Finally someone who has a brain and uses it too. All I can see here are militant pro vax crusaders who don't want to allow any discussion.

I think it would be more fair to introduce mandatory vaccine like China than to create the lynch atmosphere and moral crusade against unvaccinated. Be a man and force people into vaccination, but than also take the responsibility for the consequences. This is one of the major reproach of anti-vaxers.

by Anonymousreply 125November 22, 2021 9:23 AM

I am vaxxed and had the booster. What I don't understand is the closing of the Christmas markets in Vienna and Germany...call me crazy. Here in Romania, cases have started dropping since only those of us with a green pass can go to restaurants, cafes, malls, events, and all non-essential activities. It will be the same at the Christmas markets that have just set up and at all mountain resorts and spas and for anyone who still has to go to the office or a co-working space and in classrooms. I get scanned all day. So, why can't Germany and Austria, who certainly have more resources than a developing country like this one, do the same thing? Keep the markets and tourism open on the condition that entry is allowed ONLY with proof of vaccination. Am I missing something? My roommate says the health care system will collapse but I say that if the vast majority in ICU are not vaccinated, allowing access exclusively to vaccinated persons is unlikely to affect that.

by Anonymousreply 126November 22, 2021 9:24 AM

It's not just an anti-vaxxer faction that affects the numbers. Countries differ a lot in terms of how easy it is to get vaccinated: how convenient the locations and timings are and what reservation or documentary hassles are imposed.

Few if any countries offer the Walmart, CVS, Walgreens etc walk-in convenience of the U.S.

by Anonymousreply 127November 22, 2021 9:34 AM

R126 Maybe because vaccinated spread the disease, too. German virologists warned that letting the vaccinated roam around free with their covid pass is dangerous. Particularly, since they get the covid pass for 12 months and recent Oxford studies as previous Israeli studies showed that vaccine is efficient for 3-4 months, and after that period rapidly loses its efficiency. Last year you had to have a negative test to be admitted to hospital. Now, vaccinated people are spreading the virus on the vulnerable people in hospitals, and hence the escalation in hospitals. You can't put the blame on unvaccinated because they have to show the negative test result to even enter the hospital building.

by Anonymousreply 128November 22, 2021 9:38 AM

R127 - as a matter of fact, most Eastern European countries have vaccination centers in airports, shopping centers, central squares, most public and private clinics, pharmacies and any family doctor can administer the vaccine. They even come to people's homes in case someone is disabled and home-bound. Tbh I saw vaccination centers only on the airport in Holland and Italy. I didn't exactly look but did see some vaccination signs in France at pharmacies. Anyone can hop on a train or bus and get jabbed.

by Anonymousreply 129November 22, 2021 9:40 AM

R128 - while that may be true (and I am 100% on board with the virologists), NOT letting the vaccinated roam around free (even after a booster) will have nothing but a deleterious effect on people. The vaccinated will feel cheated and protest, the economy will suffer and, worse, the unvaccinated and anti-vaxxer nuts will have fuel to use against the vaccines. I don't agree with 100% shut-downs of economically important events for the vaccinated. They don't end up in the ICU and aren't a danger. Also, they aren't hanging out at these venues with unvaccinated people.

by Anonymousreply 130November 22, 2021 9:44 AM

"German virologists warned that letting the vaccinated roam around free with their covid pass is dangerous."

So you want to let the "experts" cage everyone up again? Imagine, humans roaming around free when they should be staying at home. With the door locked.

by Anonymousreply 131November 22, 2021 9:45 AM

If it's so easy to get the vax, why did my 85 y/o parents get the run around from two different pharmacies? Telling them they had to go on-line to make their appointments, bring health insurance cards and an application/questionnaire printed from their website. Fucking ridiculous. I had to jump in and assist them. Not a big deal for us. But I can easily imagine an elder without any family support just saying, "fuck it".

by Anonymousreply 132November 22, 2021 9:57 AM

Per NYTimes Covid tracker: Austria is 66% fully vaccinated and Germany is 68%. Spain and Portugal are at 80% and 87% respectively, and are not seeing the numbers that Germany and Austria are seeing. By comparison, the US is 59% vaccinated. So, get ready, get vaxed, get boosted.

Here are the countries, in addition to Spain and Portugal, that are at or over 80% fully vaccinated: UAE (90%), Singapore (88%) Chile (84%).Malta (86%), and Cambodia and Cuba (80%). You can see on the Covid tracker how that level of vaccination has impacted cases and hospitalization. Israel's rate of vaccination isn't much higher than the US at 64% fully vaccinated and 69% one vax. But they turned their Delta surge around this summer by acting quickly and giving the 3rd shot to 45%. By comparison, the US is at 10%. The only countries close to Israel in terms of boosters are UAE at 30% and Chile at 42%.

Re your question R102 the Delta variant, now THE variant, requires a much higher level of vaccination/ immunity ( 80-90%) than estimated with the earlier strains. It's that powerful. I suggest reading the Twitter threads of Dr Bob Wachter (UCSF), Dr Eric Topol (Scripps), Dr Jha ( Brown University) and an in-depth interview with Dr Fauci last week on the NYTimes The Daily podcast. The Daily, especially, goes into vaccine protection and how that can change during a surge when the rest of your community isn't vaccinated. I agree, it's confusing. These doctors have given me the most clarity.

by Anonymousreply 133November 22, 2021 9:58 AM

R131 - I am the biggest pro-vax guy on the planet and had all 3 and live in a place where at one point 500 were dying a day. But your post rings true. Letting people "roam around free"....like WTF? There is sub-zero logic in lockdowns for the jabbed.

by Anonymousreply 134November 22, 2021 10:00 AM

[quote]Countries differ a lot in terms of how easy it is to get vaccinated: how convenient the locations and timings are and what reservation or documentary hassles are imposed.

[quote]Few if any countries offer the Walmart, CVS, Walgreens etc walk-in convenience of the U.S.

Fantastic. But so what?

In Portugal and Spain, you are assigned an appointment and have to go to a local health clinic or a public stadium or similarly large space, and yet 88% of people over 12 in Portugal are fully vaccinated and 80% of the same in Spain are fully vaccinated. In both places the difference between the numbers of people partially and fully vaccinated is very small (1%).

The walk-in convenience you cite is a great thing. But the percentage of Americans fully vaccinated is less than 58%, meanin there is almost one CVS, Walgreens, Walmart, etc for every unvaccinated person and still...Portugal has 30% MORE people vaccinated than the U.S., Spain has 22% more, and without a Walgreen's on every street corner.

You look down on European countries for their documentation hassles, their invconvenience of scheduling and locations, etc., yet those poor primitive countries that don't have Walmarts and CVS, Western Europe, the principle countries of SOuthern Europe, and every European country mentioned in OP's link other than Croatia have managed higher vaccination rates than the U.S.

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by Anonymousreply 135November 22, 2021 10:08 AM

R135 Spain had a very severe situation in the beginning of Covid crises. Just like Italy virus have gone through the population and normally they have so called herd immunity. Same when people mention Italy as a good example of high vaccination rates. But almost everyone who was vulnerable died there in 2020. These countries have higher vaccination rates because they had a very bad experience with covid, so they are very cautious.

There are states that have equally high rates of vaccination and difficult covid crises, because they were not affected severely in the firs wave. Iceland, Ireland, UK. Isreal was the first country that realized vaccine aren't as efficient as expected. Singapore and South Korea too.

On the other hand you have Bosnia with low percentage of vaccinated and without an alarming outburst.

It all makes people confused.

I agree that is better to have some protection than none, but lies and manipulations aren't going t stop the crisis.

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by Anonymousreply 136November 22, 2021 10:27 AM

R125, no. The typical European anti-vaxxer reproach is something along the lines of "I DON'T WANT TO DO IT!!!" because they're nothing but selfish cunts. We've been too tolerant and indulgent with these idiots here.

Here's what does happen in Austria: Some of these anti vax cunts waiting for doctors and nurses outside hospitals, telling them they're murderers, etc Anti vax cunts telling docs they're traitors because they've been warning about the health system (particularly ICUs) to collapse at some point in the near future. Anti vax cunts sending death threats to ICU docs who went on national TV literally crying for help due to start being forced to do triageing in some severely affected regions here.

But let's face it: When these lunatics fall sick, they expect the very same docs and nurses to help them -- only to insult them over and over again while they get help.

Seriously, fuck these anti vax morons.

And fuck you, you dumb Croatian cunt blabbing on about the alleged dangers of the new vaccine. You don't speak for Europe, you're just part of the lunatic minority that's making sure this nightmare won't end for yet another year.

by Anonymousreply 137November 22, 2021 12:15 PM

I've only skim-read the thread, so apologies if this has already been mentioned, but one of the reasons the U.K. isn't affected by this latest wave is because the government opened up the country - to much controversy and sneering, it has to be said - over the Summer. This was when the hospitals had the most breathing space and the weather was warmer. The Delta variant spread, but it was more manageable than what Europe is seeing now. It looks like a very wise decision from the British medical advisors.

by Anonymousreply 138November 22, 2021 12:20 PM

R138, Austria was open the entire summer, too. The UK has got a better vaccination rate than some European countries, that is all.

Look at, say, Spain and Portugal -- hardly any Covid cases due to a good vaccination rate.

And then take a look at my shithole country, Austria -- lots of anti vax cunts. Party time for the virus, that is.

by Anonymousreply 139November 22, 2021 12:29 PM

The vaccinated feel cheated and deceived when required to mask up indoors. There is no inconvenience in wearing masks but "they've done everything right and are sick of covering up". Being a contrarian is the default of most people which is why the hospitals are full again.The vaccine prevents serious illness recurring vaccination and death. The vaccine doesn't prevent infection.

by Anonymousreply 140November 22, 2021 12:32 PM

The vaccine prevents serious illness requiring hospitalization and death.

by Anonymousreply 141November 22, 2021 12:35 PM

[quote] If it's so easy to get the vax, why did my 85 y/o parents get the run around from two different pharmacies? Telling them they had to go on-line to make their appointments, bring health insurance cards and an application/questionnaire printed from their website. Fucking ridiculous.

This is exactly what I had to do to get my booster last week. It seems very reasonable. Oh, and I was able to fill out the questionnaire once I got there, I didn't HAVE to print out the one on the website. It was only optional.

by Anonymousreply 142November 22, 2021 12:39 PM

R137 So, I am minority and as such should be muzzled.

I also see you have problem with Croatians, I can't help you with this condition which is even more serious than Covid.

And this blabbing about death threats. Come on, where did you hear that, in a beisl?

by Anonymousreply 143November 22, 2021 12:41 PM

Cray cray

by Anonymousreply 144November 22, 2021 12:56 PM

I haven't read the entire thread but does anyone wonder if any of this would be going on if Trump hadn't been our President? Trump managed to unleash a lot of crap all over the world.

by Anonymousreply 145November 22, 2021 1:11 PM

R145 - lots of Eastern and Western European anti-vaxxers copy what he and his goons said word for word.

by Anonymousreply 146November 22, 2021 1:20 PM

R137 Do you hate Jews too or only Slavs?

by Anonymousreply 147November 22, 2021 1:30 PM

Maybe R137 locks anti waxxers, particularly those from Balkans in his basement like Fritzl.

by Anonymousreply 148November 22, 2021 1:37 PM

Bin Laden

Geo. Bush

Trump

what one man can do. what damage and carnage one man can cause.

by Anonymousreply 149November 22, 2021 1:39 PM

[quote]The vaccine prevents serious illness requiring hospitalization and death.

So does eating healthy and taking vitamin-d.

by Anonymousreply 150November 22, 2021 1:45 PM

Mask wearing when needed to protect your health is no big deal. I’m always amazed how well children adjust to wearing masks. I’ve yet to see a kid tantrum about wearing one. I think with adults it’s a control issue. I won’t do it because they say I have to. Ditto with vaccines.

I wish there were very high additional health and life insurance premiums placed on non vaxxed. Please no more lockdowns though.

by Anonymousreply 151November 22, 2021 1:47 PM

[quote]I haven't read the entire thread but does anyone wonder if any of this would be going on if Trump hadn't been our President? Trump managed to unleash a lot of crap all over the world.

Americans like to think they would have solved this whole problem had it not be for Trump. Execrable as Trump was/is, American ingenuity and pluck wasn't going to turn a pandemic away at its borders. You would have had a better (lower) rate of deaths per million and fewer infections had you not had an evil clown fueling distrust of government and science, but you would have been on the chart with the rest of the world.

by Anonymousreply 152November 22, 2021 2:00 PM

Your info about Portugal, one of the world’s most vaccinated nations, needs update. Situation is aggravating there.

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by Anonymousreply 153November 22, 2021 2:00 PM

Americans, you can’t put the blame on orange guy for everything. He might be an asshole, but he is not to blame for the middle east oil wars that destructed that whole region and brought hundred of thousands of refuges roaming around Europe.

by Anonymousreply 154November 22, 2021 2:07 PM

Is this their 4th wave? I’m hoping so, because I kind of feel like the 4th should be the last one before covid becomes more endemic.

by Anonymousreply 155November 22, 2021 2:12 PM

The higher a country's vaccination rate the better, of course, but once that is quite good you shouldn't go by the number of cases. In a highly vaccinated country or state there should be a noticeable disconnect between cases and hospitalizations/deaths, indicating that most of the latter are coming from the smaller unvaccinated community. If there isn't a disconnect, THEN you can worry about it. Otherwise, if you're vaccinated and boosted, a surge of cases is no problem unless it's a new strain of the virus.

Graph showing clearly the case/death disconnect in Britain since June 2021 when double-dose vaccination rates started getting higher. (You have to click and scroll.)

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by Anonymousreply 156November 22, 2021 2:31 PM

Does any of this mean increased deaths? Because that doesnt seem to be the case. Transmissions happen all the ttime /between vaxxed too so I don't think we can only blame the anti vaxxers. Yes the surge may be in less vaccinated countries buth the exact opposite has been too in other places like Israel and Maine in the US were transmsissions are high but the vax rates are as well.

by Anonymousreply 157November 22, 2021 2:42 PM

OMFG

Stop, Trump is fucking irrelevant here, wackoos. Typical americans thinking a US president would have that much influence in the world, or that the world revolves around you.

by Anonymousreply 158November 22, 2021 2:46 PM

[quote]So does eating healthy and taking vitamin-d.

you're a troll

by Anonymousreply 159November 22, 2021 2:48 PM

No, no, he’s right. None of the 3+ million people killed by this thing worldwide had any idea that’s all it would’ve taken to save them. If only someone had told them that, including any—ANY—competent medical authority anywhere in the entire world.

/s

by Anonymousreply 160November 22, 2021 3:00 PM

All the people who denied the existence of Covid in 2020 are now denying that the vaccines are safe.

by Anonymousreply 161November 22, 2021 3:05 PM

So, vaccines are perfectly safe.

Every honest expert will tell they are not, they were developed fast and didn’t pass the regular experimental procedure. Risk-benefit analysis is on the side of vaccination, particularly for vulnerable groups and because of economy.

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by Anonymousreply 162November 22, 2021 3:16 PM

Very true, R153. Portugal illustrates to me at least that there is no absolute resolution, no getting to zero in the near term. 100% vaccination (of eligible people) in the U.S. is a pipe dream, but in places where it is much more a reality it still doesn't mean that the problem dries up and blows away.

Germany which has a certain scoldiness and superiority about it was horrified at what they saw as the miserable early failures of Italy and Spain and later Portugal. Had this happened in Germany...well, it would never have happened in Germany they said. Now look at their rates both of vaccination and infection, slow to the finish they have landed a place, and a rising one, in the Top Ten. Three weeks ago a German viroligist thught Spain was going to be a model, the place where herd immunity would finally take hold. His opinion might be more guarded this week becuase Spain's new infections low and stable for some significant time are now on the rise again. For that matter, look how Sweden fared: after the world reacted in horror to their approach, now there are 21 European countries with worse death rates per million and their new infections rate has been low and stable for much of this year.

Vaccination, masks, lockdowns, controls on free movement, and other factors each can have very real results, but no one approach has been perfect, and for each seeming success there seems to be a bump in the road that follows.

It's a little nervy of an American to offer that Europe should hurry the fuck up with its booster shots, as if it were not doing, and as if the U.S. had its house in perfect order. There's really no country that can be that fucking uppity about their own perfect record. Nobody has a perfect record.

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by Anonymousreply 163November 22, 2021 3:20 PM

I'm getting a COVID booster shot today. Do it folks.

by Anonymousreply 164November 22, 2021 3:29 PM

I didn't know that Herbert Kickl @ R150 leader of Austria's far-right FPÖ party, is also on The DataLounge.

Because this bloke publicly came up with the idea of taking lots of vit d instead of vaccinating in order to prevent Covid-19.

Guess what - he has got Covid19 now.

Karma is a bitch - and I totally love her.

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by Anonymousreply 165November 22, 2021 3:35 PM

He’s cute!

by Anonymousreply 166November 22, 2021 3:36 PM

Oops, I thought I had the pic 'hidden'.

Sorry for creating nightmares.

by Anonymousreply 167November 22, 2021 3:36 PM

Triage will start in parts around Salzburg (AT) and Dresden (DE) this week — I expect more regions to follow soon.

The unvaccinated will have to make room for those who did get vaccinated, and it’s only just.

by Anonymousreply 168November 22, 2021 3:37 PM

And here is the pic of R137. He is a stunner

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by Anonymousreply 169November 22, 2021 3:41 PM

R166, the funny thing is he has got a rather weird infatuation with horses. He used to be Austria's Interior Secretary (Innenminister) in fucking Sebastian Kurz's first administration and wanted to create some cavalry brigade for Vienna. There are pics of him where he's genuinely smiling, probably for pretty much the first time in his entire saddo existence, but I can't find them atm. Anyway, here's another rather horrifying pic. Enjoy, ha ha.

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by Anonymousreply 170November 22, 2021 3:42 PM

Hasn't anyone told them the US election was last November? Why is all this happening?

by Anonymousreply 171November 22, 2021 3:43 PM

I see the cunt from Croatia aka my favourite šupak in here is back.

by Anonymousreply 172November 22, 2021 3:44 PM

There are pics of him riding a horse where he's genuinely smiling [...]

Having to look at this weirdo makes me forget half of what I wanted to say.

That cavalry brigade thing was a great bust, btw. The entire thing cost a fucking fortune, only to get disestablished about half a year later.

by Anonymousreply 173November 22, 2021 3:49 PM

R172 Cunt is in your panties. Maybe some of DL bisexuals would be interested in you.

by Anonymousreply 174November 22, 2021 3:54 PM

Hey pizda iz Hrvatske, volim te!

:-*

by Anonymousreply 175November 22, 2021 4:00 PM

Can’t you smell his teeth from here?

by Anonymousreply 176November 22, 2021 4:03 PM

Is that what that is?

Pew.

by Anonymousreply 177November 22, 2021 4:21 PM

[quote]The vaccine prevents serious illness requiring hospitalization and death.

It cuts way down on hospitalization and death, but it doesn't prevent all of them. WSJ reported yesterday:

"State reporting is inconsistent but collectively shows here have been more than 1.89 million cases and at least 72,000 hospitalizations and 20,000 deaths among fully vaccinated people in the U.S. this year ... Breakthrough cases of Covid-19 are hitting older people and those with underlying health conditions particularly hard."

When people throw off their masks and cease social distancing, a certain percentage of fully vaccinated people will get bad cases of the disease. That's why some European countries are experimenting with total lockdowns.

by Anonymousreply 178November 22, 2021 4:56 PM

When I asked if people thought that Trump was the cause of a lot of this I didn't mean the deaths or pandemic. I meant the resistance to it. The rest of the world was not ignoring us when every nutcase in this country came out. Someone above posted that the Europeans are using the same language as Trump and his minions verbatim. (thank you for that answer)

and for those that think Trump can't be blamed for everything: wrong. Trump had his filthy little hands in every pot in the world. One day we may know the extent of the damage the he caused around the world.

by Anonymousreply 179November 22, 2021 4:57 PM

perhaps...i don't follow these threads...most got it and natural immunity has waned after a year and a half.

I got it at the beginning and got it last week.

by Anonymousreply 180November 22, 2021 5:04 PM

China is the cause of this! Fuck China!!!

by Anonymousreply 181November 22, 2021 5:09 PM

"Federal medical teams have been dispatched to Minnesota to help at overwhelmed hospitals. Michigan is enduring its worst case surge yet, with daily caseloads doubling since the start of November. Even New England, where vaccination rates are high, is struggling, with Vermont, Maine and New Hampshire trying to contain major outbreaks.

More than 90,000 cases are being reported each day, comparable to early August, and more than 30 states are seeing sustained upticks in infections. In the hardest-hit places, hospitalizations are already climbing."

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by Anonymousreply 182November 22, 2021 5:11 PM

German Health Minister:

“By the end of this winter pretty much everyone in Germany (…) will have been vaccinated, recovered or died."

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by Anonymousreply 183November 22, 2021 5:12 PM

I wonder why the USans blaming Trump for the world right-wing protests, yellow vests, et cetera can't imagine Putin having a malefic influence globally.

by Anonymousreply 184November 22, 2021 5:18 PM

[quote] "State reporting is inconsistent but collectively shows here have been more than 1.89 million cases and at least 72,000 hospitalizations and 20,000 deaths among fully vaccinated people in the U.S. this year ... Breakthrough cases of Covid-19 are hitting older people and those with underlying health conditions particularly hard."

That is indeed tragic, but 20,000 deaths represents .01% of vaccinated people in the U.S. Serious, yes, and I don’t mean to minimize the tragedies of those individuals, but it’s important to keep everything in perspective so we can see that the vaccines work brilliantly for millions and millions of people. And 1.89 million breakthrough cases is still just slightly less than one case out of every hundred fully vaccinated people in the U.S.

by Anonymousreply 185November 22, 2021 5:33 PM

R175 Ma vidi ti njega. Ti zbilja ideš iz hladnog u toplo. A vidim da je šupčić bio u dodiru s balkanskim antivakserima, naučilo se malo prostota na hr.

by Anonymousreply 186November 22, 2021 5:45 PM

[quote]I wonder why the USans blaming Trump for the world right-wing protests, yellow vests, et cetera can't imagine Putin having a malefic influence globally.

Those of us paying attention know damn well that Trump is an American branch of Putin and the creeping fascism spreading like kudzu across the globe.

by Anonymousreply 187November 22, 2021 5:51 PM

R100 and R124 are race baiting trolls.

1. African-American vaxx rate in New York does not apply to African-Americans in all states .

2. If 100% of all African-Americans were unvaxxed they would still not make the impact of the 48-33% (depending on state) of white Americans wherein political ideation is still the strongest predictor of vaccine hesitancy.

3. You cannot use flawed logic to bolster a point. What is true for white people (or any other ethnic group) in South Dakota is not true for white people in Connecticut . Hell you have some ethnic groups less than 40 miles apart in some states that are night and day for vaxx rates. You are merely highlighting a regional attitude nothing more.

It's very telling you default to black america as a problem not the 120 million+ white ethnic group wherein 30% are generally unvaccinated. Please stop with ethnicity as a relevant factor. The unvaccinated in a pandemic of this nature are a problem regardless of ethnicity or nationality.

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by Anonymousreply 188November 22, 2021 6:15 PM

[quote]That is indeed tragic, but 20,000 deaths represents .01% of vaccinated people in the U.S.

Absolutely. But 72,000 hospitalizations amongst vaccinated people did/does add to the strain on healthcare systems. They're just a drop in the bucket compared to the unvaccinated who spend time in the hospital but it's still a lot of room nights.

We can decrease these numbers even further by getting boosters in a timely fashion and, if you're vaccinated and elderly or immunocompromised, wearing masks and social distancing if you're in crowds or with people whose vaccination status you don't know.

by Anonymousreply 189November 22, 2021 6:55 PM

It's hilarious that Dragan, the Balkan troll is posting on a gay gossip forum. And the US posters even believe his bullshit.

by Anonymousreply 190November 22, 2021 8:08 PM

[quote] Dragan, the Balkan troll

OMFG hahahahahahahaha

by Anonymousreply 191November 22, 2021 8:11 PM

Israel nipped a new covid wave in the butt with booster shots.

That health minister in Germany is a gay and nasty right winger and totally incompetent. Hopefully the mismanagement of the covid pandemic killed his political career ambitions for good.

Austria would have become a Russian vassal state if they hadn't kicked out Kurz.

Just my observations as an ex EU resident. It's sad to see something that was a great idea going down the toilet by incompetent and corrupt politicians. I mostly blame Merkel for this, with her idiotic migrant policies and by her kowtowing to China and Russia.

by Anonymousreply 192November 22, 2021 8:32 PM

[quote]Israel nipped a new covid wave in the butt

I’ll need to take your witness statement, ma’am.

by Anonymousreply 193November 22, 2021 8:51 PM

Fascism has always been a death cult. It amazes me that it still persists.

by Anonymousreply 194November 22, 2021 9:36 PM

R155 - this 4th wave isn't the latest. Here in Romania we are in it and the president, an ethnic German, has told people to brace for the 5th wave right after the holidays. Meanwhile, Germany's leaders have said that there are only 3 options Germans have by March of 2022: get the vaccine, die, or go through a nasty illness.

by Anonymousreply 195November 22, 2021 11:14 PM

R175 - that "pizda" was cold even for an Austrian. Also, not much of an insult on a gay site, is it? Well...guess you are picking on the Croat, but tbh the other major protesters in Vienna were Romanians but I guess since most are married to and have kids with Austrians AND support the far right they get some kind of weird pass. In any case, I hope they all get the vaccine and see the light. Shame the Christmas markets are closed.

by Anonymousreply 196November 22, 2021 11:19 PM

Oh yes, it was me who was calling out the cunt from Croatia who was trying to spread fake news regarding the vaccine here. Do you mind? If so, you might as well fuck off, too.

Frankly, I don't give a fuck where someone is from. If someone is a cunt, they're a cunt, end of. What I do find interesting is the fact that some anti vax bloke from Croatia is posting crap on an American gay forum. But given the fact that the DL is pretty well known here, too, I'm actually not that surprised as those far-right assholes are pretty much everywhere trying to stir shit. See the rally in Vienna - it was led by far right assholes waffling over the Great Reset (that's what quite a few banners of these morons said), trying to use people for their own far right agenda by hijacking any sort of protests against Covid19 measures. And even in case those attending the moronic rally in Vienna aren't really fond of that particular far right agenda, they, however, didn't mind attending that rally despite well-known Nazi fuckerfaces being there, too. So fuck all these idiots and everyone supporting them, including our dear cuntish anti vax friend from Croatia.

by Anonymousreply 197November 23, 2021 12:05 AM

Given that half the protestors arrested in Rotterdam on Saturday were under 18, I'd say bored kids are driving a lot of this chaos ... and right-wing agitators paying bored kids to cause trouble.

by Anonymousreply 198November 23, 2021 12:25 AM

America doesn't have a monopoly on stupid. From Italy:

"At the parties, the infected mingle, kiss, and hug the unvaccinated in order to spread the virus. Some of the parties are being held in outdoor areas of bars, which are accessible without a Green Pass. There, an infected person will drink out of a glass or bottle of beer and pass it around to try to spread the virus. Other events are held in private homes. In one case, the infected person was bedridden and the guests are said to have gathered around the sickbed to try to breathe in the virus.

The area has also seen a number of no-vax, no-mask parents giving do-it-yourself vaccines to children."

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by Anonymousreply 199November 23, 2021 12:43 AM

Why hasn't Europe bought the miraculous antiviral pills and the monoclonal antibody treatments.

by Anonymousreply 200November 23, 2021 12:47 AM

There was an epidemiologist on Australian radio this morning. She said the main reasons for the new surge are:

- unvaccinated people, obvs. BUT she said we have to remember that's not just anti-vaxxers. It includes all 1-12 year-olds and often 12-16s as well. The vaccination stats countries are giving out are greatly inflated because they mostly only count people over 16. If the advertised rate is 90%, it could be as low as 75% in reality. She said the virus doesn't play politics: it's systematically picking through the population trying to find anyone, any age, without a vaccination.

- people not having had their third shot, either from negligence or because it hasn't been available. She said this surge has proved what doctors have been thinking for the last few months: that it was a 3-dose vaccine all along and you are vulnerable if you don't get the third one.

- governments opening up too soon with too few residual restrictions, in response to pressure from a public which is "over" the virus and wanting life to return to normal NOW. She said magical thinking does not work against a virus. (I would add that governments are itching to remove restrictions because they think it will help the economy, and people being ovah it is just helping them out.)

They put R183's quote to her and she said the German Health Minister was probably right.

I thought her description of the virus's "attitude" vs ours was interesting. It's like a psychopath in the middle of a school shooting, walking through the rooms one by one with an automatic weapon looking for victims, while we're going "Tired of hiding in this closet now. I reckon I'll take a stroll."

by Anonymousreply 201November 23, 2021 12:48 AM

oof, hard to read but true

by Anonymousreply 202November 23, 2021 3:21 AM

[quote] Do you mind? If so, you might as well fuck off, too.

Shut up bitch. I told you I was pro-vax but I said that I am surprised that you are singling out the Croatian guy versus the other anti-vax trolls on DL. Why not pick on the Austrians or Romanians (well, maybe them you will pick on) who were actually at the protest? Or argue with the Americans on here who spread bullshit lies about the vaccine not being any good. Hell...pick on the German authorities who let a bunch of Bavarians set up their stalls at the Christmas market in Munich and then, told them to go home. Could have thought of maybe alerting them before they spent the time, money and effort to set up since the ICU's were pretty damned full.

by Anonymousreply 203November 23, 2021 10:02 AM

I don’t understand why the Christmas markets get cancelled — the whole concept of “it’s safe to meet in the open air” goes out of the window with that decision.

by Anonymousreply 204November 23, 2021 11:29 AM

I've been to a German Christmas market, and it was JAM PACKED. I'd feel safer in a moderately busy supermarket than at the Christmas market I went to - I was particularly pissed that a drunk German spilled glühwein on my coat. Being red wine based, it stains like a bitch.

by Anonymousreply 205November 23, 2021 11:33 AM

R204 - it's because of crowds. Lots of people close together breathing all over each other. German markets are big and with lots of people. Can you imagine the lines to check green passes? The possibility of transmission among such a packed crowd?

by Anonymousreply 206November 23, 2021 11:35 AM

True, they do get packed — but with entrance checks and limited no. of visitors I’d wager they could still take place. It’s just a big blow to the country’s morale. Christmas is such a big thing here.. 😞

by Anonymousreply 207November 23, 2021 11:35 AM

R207, that's what they're doing for London's Winter Wonderland - tickets are restricted but currently still available if you fancy it!

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by Anonymousreply 208November 23, 2021 11:39 AM

Anti vaxxers = Local terrorist cells

Angry and frustrated people are more eager to join a "burn it all down" cause (like the ones run by Steve Bannon worldwide). This could be prevented with better anger management programs available to those who want it, and mandatory for those who got into trouble with the law before.

Sure, the pandemic sucks. Give people ways to express their frustration and anger in a less destructive way. Guide them to relief before they can be recruited by the likes of Steve Bannon.

by Anonymousreply 209November 23, 2021 11:56 AM

I certainly hope cases swing up dramatically in the US. I want to keep working from home!

by Anonymousreply 210November 23, 2021 12:02 PM

For an introvert like me, it's not that bad. I had my vaccine shots (both of them, moderna, itched a bit and had a sore arm for over a weak, but I got over it, since I'm a big boy). I keep my distance, wear a mask in shops and supermarkets (as it's required). I buy whatever I need and get the hell back home, wash my hands right when I arrive, and to be brutally honest: I've never been happier on my own. I keep up with my friends on Zoom and emails.

I'm sure for extroverts, the pandemic and lockdowns must be pure torture. Sometimes I feel bad for them.

by Anonymousreply 211November 23, 2021 12:16 PM

The Christmas markets are no doubt prized locations this year for terrorist attacks.

by Anonymousreply 212November 23, 2021 12:18 PM

Not much to terrorise if they’re half-empty or even cancelled, Grinch @ R212

by Anonymousreply 213November 23, 2021 12:30 PM

R203 I guess you missed me mentioning that Austria is a shithole country full of fucking anti vax cunts.

by Anonymousreply 214November 23, 2021 12:31 PM

Looks like Northern Ireland will pull the trigger on some sort of lockdown next. From the NI Executive:

"The clear advice from public health experts is that an intervention is now required.

Our people - individuals, families, communities and businesses - have been through so much during this pandemic. Our collective aim is to reduce pressure on our hospitals while allowing our society and the economy to remain open as fully and safely as possible.

That means we all need to take action to prevent a worsening of the situation that would potentially require more severe measures."

by Anonymousreply 215November 23, 2021 12:35 PM

[quote] The right fighting for liberty and civil rights

Demanding the “right” to go unvaccinated in a pandemic is not a civil right.

It’s like saying you can drive through a red light at an intersection because you’re exercising your personal freedom and if you get arrested it’s nazi authoritarianism.

by Anonymousreply 216November 23, 2021 2:06 PM

R203 Thank you, pal.

But, even if I don’t mind to be called anti-vaxxer, I am not one. I am not against vaccines, and as I said I want to take protein vaccine Sanofi (or American Novavax), which should be out by the end of the year. In the meantime, I am the safest animal there is, since I am not allowed to enter most public places without negative test result.

by Anonymousreply 217November 23, 2021 4:43 PM
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by Anonymousreply 218November 23, 2021 5:39 PM

Last week: Emmanuel Macron said France does not need to follow European countries imposing COVID-19 lockdowns on unvaccinated people, because of the success of its health pass in curbing the virus' spread.

This week: France announces more than 30,000 Covid infections in the past 24 hours, up from 5,266 the day before.

by Anonymousreply 219November 23, 2021 7:24 PM

R214 - well I am not sure why an Austrian would say Austria is a shithole country given its infrastructure and quality of life. Maybe as a gay guy it is hard in a place where the extreme right wing is super dominant. My roommate has a Romanian last name and, despite having a German grandfather and great-grandmother, says she got nasty comments from the women in the family of an Austrian guy she dated back in LA. She countered with a few statistics about the level of corruption in the Austrian government as well as who the founder of their current party was (she probably shouldn't have mentioned that). Honestly, I believe all countries with heavy right wing and nationalist tendencies are pretty shitty in terms of racism, gay rights, xenophobia, and have a significant number of anti-vaxxer nutjobs.

by Anonymousreply 220November 23, 2021 8:32 PM

More unrest in Europe of Covid lockdowns.

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by Anonymousreply 221November 23, 2021 8:34 PM

Wow, Austrians are xenophobic wing nuts? Shocking.

by Anonymousreply 222November 23, 2021 9:29 PM

R222 - well, let's just hope the lockdown doesn't prevent potential art students from reaching for their dreams.

by Anonymousreply 223November 23, 2021 11:07 PM

Vegetarian art students in Austria should be rounded up and put on trains to work camps in Poland...as a preventive measure.

by Anonymousreply 224November 24, 2021 1:07 AM

it is winter.

by Anonymousreply 225November 24, 2021 1:09 AM

R224 - especially those that don't smoke.

by Anonymousreply 226November 24, 2021 1:17 AM

Germany might spend another Christmas under lockdown.

by Anonymousreply 227November 24, 2021 4:23 PM

If it's happening elsewhere, it will come to the US within a month

by Anonymousreply 228November 24, 2021 4:24 PM

European winter holiday ruined for the third straight year.

by Anonymousreply 229November 24, 2021 5:02 PM

R228 - I doubt it. The US is spread out and there aren't such strict laws. Assholes in Republican states have guys like that Texas governor to do their bidding so...totally different.

by Anonymousreply 230November 24, 2021 7:14 PM

Slovakia is the latest European country to impose a lockdown. Ukraine is also experiencing a Covid surge that is taxing its healthcare system, reportedly.

R230 R228 might have been referring to a big surge in Covid infections, i.e. a fourth wave like what is happening in Europe. It’s already starting.

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by Anonymousreply 231November 24, 2021 10:02 PM

Hasn’t the US already had a fourth wave?

by Anonymousreply 232November 25, 2021 1:06 AM

Yes, the US and Canada have both had a 4th wave. Canada's is just starting to wane. I assumed Europe would have gone through its 4th wave already.

by Anonymousreply 233November 25, 2021 3:39 AM

Europe pushed back their fourth wave until the winter, when the vaccine immunity is waning, the boosters haven't been properly distributed, the hospitals are fuller and the 'flu season has begun. This is in direct contrast to the U.K. who opened up in the summer to avoid this exact scenario (and got mocked in Europe for it, too!).

Not everyone in Europe is in the same boat.

by Anonymousreply 234November 25, 2021 1:32 PM

There’s a new variant with twice as many mutations as Delta or any other variant.

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by Anonymousreply 235November 26, 2021 2:19 AM

Cases rising in Ohio.

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by Anonymousreply 236November 26, 2021 2:39 AM

THE VAX IS WORKING DAMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!

Ignore the evidence!!!

by Anonymousreply 237November 26, 2021 3:04 AM

Flights from South Africa, Namibia, Lesotho, Botswana, Eswatini and Zimbabwe to the UK will be suspended Friday.

Israel banning them too.

There are13 flights a week from s. Africa to the US.

by Anonymousreply 238November 26, 2021 4:56 AM

Now the stock market is freaking out about this new variant.

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by Anonymousreply 239November 26, 2021 4:59 AM

LONDON (BLOOMBERG, REUTERS) - Britain will temporarily ban flights from South Africa and five neighbouring countries over worries about a new, dramatically different Covid-19 variant recently identified in the region.

The travel restrictions go into effect at noon on Friday (Nov 26) and are a precautionary measure to keep the spread of the new variant in check, Health Secretary Sajid Javid said.

In addition to South Africa, the countries covered by the new restrictions are Namibia, Lesotho, Eswatini, Zimbabwe and Botswana. These countries will be placed on Britain's red list as of Sunday, requiring British travellers to quarantine in hotels upon arrival.

Israel also has banned travel from the six countries, along with Mozambique, another neighbour of South Africa.

Scientists are still trying to determine whether the new variant, called B.1.1529, is more transmissible or more lethal than previous ones. What is clear is that it has the most mutations of any strain yet identified. That has raised concerns inside South Africa and internationally, with the authorities fearing a wave of cases that could increase pressure on already strained healthcare systems.

“As part of our close surveillance of variants across the world, we have become aware of the spread of a new potentially concerning variant,” Mr Javid said in a statement, adding that the new strain is now under investigation.

“What we do know is there’s a significant number of mutations, perhaps double the number of mutations that we have seen in the Delta variant,” Mr Javid said.

“And that would suggest that it may well be more transmissible and the current vaccines that we have may well be less effective.”

The British Health Security Agency said the variant had a spike protein that was dramatically different to the one in the original coronavirus that Covid-19 vaccines were based on. Officials characterised the variant as the “worst one yet”.

Britain’s move is a further blow to the airline industry, which was starting to recover from earlier travel restrictions and lockdowns but now faces fresh curbs and a resurgent virus in parts of Europe.

The measures announced on Thursday mark the biggest change in Britain’s Covid-19 travel rules since the so-called traffic light system was overhauled earlier in the autumn to ease border crossings.

In South Africa, virologists have detected almost 100 cases linked to the new variant to date, according to Associate Professor Anne von Gottberg, a clinical microbiologist and head of respiratory diseases at the National Institute for Communicable Diseases.

The variant has also been found in Botswana and Hong Kong, but the British Health Security Agency said that no cases of the variant had been detected in Britain.

World Health Organisation (WHO) officials have met to discuss the variant, which has also been detected in Botswana, where it has been found in people who were vaccinated against Covid-19.

“Armed by our experience and understanding of the Alpha and Delta variants, we know that early action is far better than late action,” Professor Ewan Birney, deputy director-general of the European Molecular Biology Laboratory, said in a Science Media Centre briefing note.

“It may turn out that this variant is not as large a threat as Alpha and Delta, but the potential consequences of not acting on the possibility it could be are serious.”

The new variant probably evolved during a chronic infection of an immunocompromised person, possibly in an untreated HIV/Aids patient, said Professor Francois Balloux, director of University College London's Genetics Institute.

Having the world’s biggest number of HIV cases has made it more difficult for South Africa to fight the Covid-19 pandemic, because the virus can linger for longer in people whose immune systems are compromised, potentially offering a bigger window for mutations.

by Anonymousreply 240November 26, 2021 5:06 AM

Yay, I hope we get locked down again so I can sit at home and Jack off all day to porn while high.

by Anonymousreply 241November 26, 2021 5:12 AM

Who cares about new infections? Almost no one is dying from Covid anymore, except for the usual suspects.

by Anonymousreply 242November 26, 2021 5:18 AM

Over 1,000 people die of Covid every day, R242.

by Anonymousreply 243November 26, 2021 5:23 AM

R243

1000 people every day out of a population of 8 billion people is statistically insignificant.

by Anonymousreply 244November 26, 2021 5:47 AM

Deaths per age in the U.S.

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by Anonymousreply 245November 26, 2021 6:01 AM

R245

50,000 people under the age of 50 have died.

The vast majority have been over 75.

We shut down the entire world and destroyed our economy for this?

by Anonymousreply 246November 26, 2021 6:10 AM

Unvaccinated r43 are you in Switzerland? Only 65% are vaccinated there.

At least promise us you'll cough on a large group of muzzies before you drop dead of Covid this winter.

by Anonymousreply 247November 26, 2021 6:39 AM

People seem to be really freaking out over this Charlie Nobody variant in S. Africa.

Who gives a fuck. Get the booster like you should have already been planning to do if you haven’t gotten it already. That’s the appropriate response at the moment, “32 mutations!” variant or not. There isn’t anything else you can do.

I got boosted 3 days ago, and nothing will change for me if this new variant makes it in New York. (But if it can make it here, it can make…anywhere; it’s up to Nu, New York, New York.)

by Anonymousreply 248November 26, 2021 6:57 AM

The only sensible thing we can do is to get our booster vaccination, steer clear from indoor parties and extremely crowded places, mask up where required — and live your life as you see fit.

by Anonymousreply 249November 26, 2021 10:05 AM

That we are safe is a lie we tell ourselves each day to get out of bed.

Cases are not illnesses, illnesses are not deaths.

Time to move on kittens.

by Anonymousreply 250November 26, 2021 10:07 AM

[quote]Now the stock market is freaking out about this new variant.

I'm going Black Friday shopping today. On Schwab and Fidelity.

by Anonymousreply 251November 26, 2021 10:16 AM

Lived in two euro countries during this pandemic. Where I am in Spain at the moment, people are still wearing masks in shops, etc, and on the street. The only people not doing that appear to be tourists. However, hand hygiene and social distancing has dropped off across the board.

It seems to go like this: lockdown then loosening restrictions because it's summer. Cases go up in autumn. Lockdown then loosening restrictions because it's Christmas. Cases go up in the New Year. Rinse and repeat.

by Anonymousreply 252November 26, 2021 10:23 AM

California and Colorado are only 62% fully vaccinated. What does fully vaccinated mean now? 2 shots or 2 shots + booster?

I was in a local Walmart last week and two guys were in line at the pharmacy for their first Covid shot. At least they're coming around.

by Anonymousreply 253November 26, 2021 10:44 AM

[Quote]Cases may cause illness, illness may result in death or long term health issues.

Fixed it for you.

by Anonymousreply 254November 26, 2021 10:49 AM

MAY....meaning

Cases are NOT illnesses

Illnesses are NOT deaths.

Fixed it for you.

by Anonymousreply 255November 26, 2021 10:56 AM

^^ can you not see your logic is flawed, Sir?

by Anonymousreply 256November 26, 2021 11:03 AM

R256 can you not see your logic is flawed?

Clearly you cannot. The reason the tout case numbers daily is to keep you living in fear, if you live in fear you make our corporate masters rich. You know who they are, the ones who own and control the media.

If they only report death numbers and compare them to last year, you might be optimistic and put your chances into perspective and life your life again.

by Anonymousreply 257November 26, 2021 11:25 AM

Any bets on how long it'll take Biden to ban flights from southern Africa?

by Anonymousreply 258November 26, 2021 11:45 AM

R217 - I am surprised you are still allowed to go to anything besides essential shops in Croatia with a negative PCR test that is 72 hours old. In Romania, that flew out the window and now, you are either vaccinated or have gotten over COVID in the last 6 months. According to the minister of health, the risk of the unvaccinated ending up in ICU is too great to allow them the 72-hour test option. Hence, only essential shops, FFP2 masks indoors and outdoors, tests every 24 hours (at work if you can't work from home) and a declaration regarding your reason for leaving your house (on penalty of perjury). I feeling like the EU press singles out Eastern Europeans because it's the last acceptable minority to insult. I saw Muslims all over France and Holland disregarding the rules and nobody said a thing. Also, it's not ok for the German press to can't call people "idiots" based on ethnicity. In fact, I have seen far greater negligence in Western Europe from local authorities than here.

When we travelled, the Dutch and Italians didn't even ask for our green pass, far less scan it. In Germany, the border police not only didn't look at our green pass...the cop asked my roommate for her WhatsApp number (WTF???). I think because the authorities there are used to democracy, they maybe more relaxed. The ones here maybe corrupt, but they are far less relaxed because they are used to dictatorship. At least those are my two cents as an American observer. 🤷‍♀️

by Anonymousreply 259November 26, 2021 11:59 AM

There is already 1 case in Belgium...that they know of...

“may be more transmissible” than the Delta strain and added “the vaccines that we currently have may be less effective”

Officials are also desperately trying to trace thousands who have arrived from South Africa in the past ten days.

Two cases have also been detected in Hong Kong after a patient had travelled back from South Africa.

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by Anonymousreply 260November 26, 2021 2:21 PM

the two cases in hong kong----

One of the two had recently been in Southern Africa. That person then passed it on to a second person, quarantining in the same hotel.

'It's very airborne,' Feigl-Ding said. 'The hotel guests were in different room across the hallway from each other. Environmental samples found the virus in 25 of 87 swabs across both rooms.'

He added: 'I think border and travel restrictions make sense. Especially since Hong Kong only caught the case because of a mandatory hotel quarantine. Which countries in the west still have that??? Almost none.'

by Anonymousreply 261November 26, 2021 2:23 PM

If it is very airborne, and starts spreading throughout the world, I can see more working from home in the future.

by Anonymousreply 262November 26, 2021 2:25 PM

R261 This isn't the first time there's been virus transmission in a Hong Kong quarantine hotel. The first time they decided the only solution was to lengthen hotel quarantine.

by Anonymousreply 263November 26, 2021 2:27 PM

Belgium:

Working from home will be compulsory four days a week until December 19 — as opposed to December 12. From December 20, teleworking will be compulsory three days a week.

The obligation to wear a mask will be expanded, including in schools, for children aged 10 and above.

An 11 p.m. curfew will be imposed on restaurants. A maximum of six people will be allowed per table, unless they are members of the same household. Christmas markets will also have to close at 11 p.m.

Public venues such as nightclubs, bars and concerts venues where social distancing can't be respected are required to close for the next four weeks, from this Saturday until December 15.

Private parties will be prohibited, except for weddings and funerals. A COVID pass will be required for events attended by at least 50 people indoors and 100 outdoors. Supporters won't be allowed in outdoor sports venues, except for parents of children under 18.

by Anonymousreply 264November 26, 2021 3:09 PM

Dow currently down almost 900 points.

This isn’t helping:

[quote]Nov 26 (Reuters) - Merck & Co (MRK.N) said on Friday updated data from its study on its experimental COVID-19 pill showed the drug was significantly less effective in cutting hospitalizations and deaths than previously reported. The drugmaker said its pill showed a 30% reduction in hospitalizations and deaths, based on data from over 1,400 patients. In October, its data showed a roughly 50% efficacy, based on data from 775 patients.

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by Anonymousreply 265November 26, 2021 3:13 PM

Huge increase in new cases here in Norway. More people get infected than ever before. More people get hospitalized and yes, more deaths. Most people here are vaxxed. It's scary. And now this new mutation. Sigh...

by Anonymousreply 266November 26, 2021 3:28 PM

Is there some reason Norwegians haven’t gotten an mRNA booster (3rd shot), R266?

by Anonymousreply 267November 26, 2021 6:39 PM

[quote]Any bets on how long it'll take Biden to ban flights from southern Africa?

If you bet on "now," you win.

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by Anonymousreply 268November 26, 2021 7:06 PM

No, the ban doesn't start "now" it starts Monday. Europe is putting the ban into effect "now."

At least Biden seems to have overruled Dr. Let's-Wait-and-See Fauci.

by Anonymousreply 269November 26, 2021 7:17 PM

DL won’t let me post the Reuters link but more bad news: that magic anti-Covid pill is not so magic after all:

[quote] Nov 26 (Reuters) - Merck & Co (MRK.N) said on Friday updated data from its study of its experimental COVID-19 pill showed the drug was significantly less effective in cutting hospitalizations and deaths than previously reported. The drugmaker said its pill showed a 30% reduction in hospitalizations and deaths, based on data from 1,433 patients. In October, its data showed a roughly 50% efficacy, based on data from 775 patients. The drug, molnupiravir, was developed with partner Ridgeback Biotherapeutics.

by Anonymousreply 270November 26, 2021 7:21 PM

Oh well. Guess the booster is STILL the best protection.

GET IT, you hysterical idiots.

by Anonymousreply 271November 26, 2021 7:23 PM

R266 - because loads of Nordics travelled like hell well into fall...I saw Norwegians and Swedes all over in large groups and they don't wear masks or distance. However, I also know they don't all yet have access to the booster. So with the decreased efficiency of the jab (which I assume most got about 6 months ago) and travel and, now, more gathering indoors due to the weather...the perfect storm, sadly. The quicker people can get the booster, the better.

by Anonymousreply 272November 26, 2021 8:04 PM

While I'm about due for a booster, I'm going to hold off for now...until it's known whether or not existing vaccines are effective against Omicron (if it becomes an issue in the US). I'm not going to get a booster for one variant and then a booster for another variant a few months late.

by Anonymousreply 273November 26, 2021 8:24 PM

R273 - I would advise you to get your booster when you're eligible regardless of new variants. The more protection you have, the better. GET IT WHEN YOU CAN and wear a mask when you're in public.

With the new mutations coming out, I predict we'll be getting Covid vaccines EVERY year like the flu shot.

by Anonymousreply 274November 26, 2021 8:27 PM

R273 - the new variant isn't the only one around. The others are still around. Also, your initial dose is probably waning in terms of effectiveness, making you vulnerable again. Hence, your reasoning is faulty.

by Anonymousreply 275November 26, 2021 8:28 PM

R259 You can still go everywhere with negative PCR test in Croatia. They are threatening to introduce the same rules as the ones you mentioned in Romania, but it would be a carnage, because there are people who are against vaccination and who are aggressive too, and have a part of the Church on their side.

I too have noticed that poor fascists who are not allowed to be anti-Black or anti-Muslim anymore are insulting East Europeans now. They must find someone new to hate now that they became woke.

How come you are in Romania, work or did you find a guy? I don't know much about Romania, only through films, Romania has got a reallly good cinematography. As much as I can see from films they are similar to us, though they had a tougher history, our dictatorship was on the milder side then theirs.

by Anonymousreply 276November 27, 2021 7:25 PM

New restrictions for Poland:

• Restaurants, cinemas and some other places to be reduced to 50% capacity.

• Weddings limited to 100 vaccinated people, no limits on those with jabs.

• 14-day quarantine for all those travelling from outside the EU’s Schengen zone.

• Longer quarantine for those returning from some African countries.

by Anonymousreply 277November 29, 2021 2:50 PM

Greece to start fining residents who aren't vaccinated.

Reuters reports authorities said they would impose a €100 fine (113 American dollars) on every individual over the age of 60 who was not vaccinated. The measure will apply each month from January 16, 2022.

by Anonymousreply 278November 30, 2021 12:12 PM

And what now with Omikron. Seems that vaccines are not very efficient with it.

by Anonymousreply 279November 30, 2021 1:04 PM

I still don't understand why all these countries are enacting these restrictions when the US election was a year ago? Didn't they get the memo that this will all go away on Nov 4. 2020?

by Anonymousreply 280November 30, 2021 2:23 PM

Which data says that, R479?

by Anonymousreply 281November 30, 2021 4:20 PM

R281, Moderna's CEO has expressed skepticism that current vaccines are effective against the Omicron variant (see link).

Anyway, it's nice to see so many European countries paying for their arrogance. Trump fucked up, but our situation over the past year has been far better than most of Europe. Presently, among those European countries with lower rates of infection are Italy, Sweden, Romania, and Russia, which also bungled their initial response. Meanwhile, countries that supposedly handled the situation better are doing worse in per capita infections and deaths.

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by Anonymousreply 282November 30, 2021 4:38 PM

[quote]And what now with Omikron. Seems that vaccines are not very efficient with it.

What stats are you going by, r279?

by Anonymousreply 283November 30, 2021 4:44 PM

From today's NY Times:

"Andrea Ammon, the agency’s director [European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control], told an online news conference that all the confirmed cases in Europe have exhibited mild symptoms or none at all, and that authorities were analyzing six further “probable” cases."

by Anonymousreply 284November 30, 2021 6:05 PM

R282 “our situation over the past year has been far better than most of Europe.” The Qanon antivax madness that has infected the world as virulently as the coronavirus originated in the US and continues to cause chaos and genuine harm. So, don’t pat yourself on the back too much.

by Anonymousreply 285November 30, 2021 7:04 PM

R284, how dare you treat anecdotal evidence as if it’s clinical data. The truth is *we don’t know* if Omicron is mild or asymptomatic. We don’t know anything at all! It could turn out to be deadly! Mild infections can lead to “sudden Covid death syndrome” as well as Long COVID!

We just don’t know. We just don’t know.

Keep repeating that like a mantra.

Omicron could be deadly, and it might totally evade the Moderna vaccine and spread faster than a Truvada whore’s anus.

The important thing is to stay ON THE VERGE OF PANIC at all times.

by Anonymousreply 286November 30, 2021 7:56 PM

It's a matter of concern, r286, not panic.

by Anonymousreply 287November 30, 2021 8:03 PM

Don't be fucking selfish, it may be "harmless" to the healthy but it may be "deadly" to those with medical issues. Take it seriously

by Anonymousreply 288December 1, 2021 12:36 AM

The Guardian: Germany warns that it could have 6,000 people in intensive care by Christmas regardless of what measures are now decided by politicians.

That compares with a previous high of 5,745 coronavirus patients in intensive care on 3 January. Germany also has fewer beds available now due to a shortage of nursing staff.

by Anonymousreply 289December 1, 2021 12:16 PM

Seems likely that Germany will, R289. They had 56,000 new cases yesterday. This despite having 8.28 hospital beds for every 1000 people, the highest in Europe and a point of much pride (the kind that goes before a fall) for Germany in the early waves of infection.

by Anonymousreply 290December 1, 2021 12:40 PM

Cases are not deaths.

Average German hospital stay is now 4 days in Germany. Warnings are not facts, could, might, maybe.

by Anonymousreply 291December 1, 2021 12:46 PM

Yes, R291, the world is rife with examples of rising case counts leading to decreased hospitalizations.

by Anonymousreply 292December 1, 2021 12:53 PM

Considering how weak the new variant is the world will be rife with them soon.

by Anonymousreply 293December 1, 2021 12:55 PM

No Covid "expert" ever gets his name in the paper unless he throws out some fear. They learned fast.

by Anonymousreply 294December 1, 2021 2:16 PM

Although R294 comes across as a COVID denier, they’re not wrong. Leana Wen learned that lesson early and she’s been profiting ever since.

by Anonymousreply 295December 1, 2021 2:39 PM

The Swiss voted Sunday to support present and future Covid restrictions and to release monies to support ailing busnisses, social welfare, etc.as Covid cases soar and ICUs fill.

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by Anonymousreply 296December 1, 2021 2:58 PM

I'm the gift that keeps on burning.

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by Anonymousreply 297December 1, 2021 3:12 PM

"Netherlands making it much harder for American tourists to travel there this fall" thread has been paywalled.

I hope those traveling will be safe and wishing you guys all the best!

by Anonymousreply 298December 1, 2021 5:16 PM

Thanks, r298. I'm going to be traveling in the opposite direction (Europe to US) over the holidays, and I'm wondering how it's going to work if the US does start demanding a negative Covid test that's not older than 24 hours from everyone entering, when a PCR test can easily take 24 hours to get results.

by Anonymousreply 299December 1, 2021 5:37 PM

The skyrocketing is not because of Omicron but because of Delta.

GET VACCINATED, YOU IDIOTS

by Anonymousreply 300December 1, 2021 5:43 PM

R299, according to the CDC, these tests are accepted---

You must be tested with a viral test that could be either an antigen test or a nucleic acid amplification test (NAAT). Examples of available NAATs for SARS-CoV-2 include but are not restricted to reverse transcription polymerase chain reaction (RT-PCR), reverse transcription loop-mediated isothermal amplification (RT-LAMP), transcription-mediated amplification (TMA), nicking enzyme amplification reaction (NEAR), and helicase-dependent amplification (HDA). The test used must be authorized for use by the relevant national authority for the detection of SARS-CoV-2 in the country where the test is administered. A viral test conducted for U.S. Department of Defense (DOD) personnel, including DOD contractors, dependents, and other U.S. government employees, and tested by a DOD laboratory located in a foreign country also meets the requirements of the Order.

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by Anonymousreply 301December 1, 2021 5:45 PM

Coming soon to USA.

Biden.

by Anonymousreply 302December 1, 2021 6:17 PM

Germany will also impose sweeping nationwide restrictions on social contact for unvaccinated people, in what local media is describing as a “lockdown for the unvaccinated”.

Unvaccinated people will be barred from non-essential shops and events, unless they have recently recovered from Covid. “Culture and leisure nationwide will be open only to those who have been vaccinated or recovered,” Merkel said.

Discos and clubs will have to shut if case numbers reach above a certain threshold, the chancellor also announced.

Germany may also mandate vaccines for all starting in February.

by Anonymousreply 303December 2, 2021 5:11 PM

Sir, I don't see your covid star on your coat. Please have a seat while we run your barcode.

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by Anonymousreply 304December 2, 2021 5:20 PM

Can I work from home longer?

by Anonymousreply 305December 2, 2021 6:13 PM

If so, that's actually good news, R300.

As for these Austrians who are (nearly) all dropping dead - vaxxed, or not?

by Anonymousreply 306December 2, 2021 6:18 PM

R304. Why do you post that BS here? You must have searched long and hard for that garbage of an article which twists the findings of the working group. That's MAGAT misinformation.

by Anonymousreply 307December 2, 2021 8:06 PM

eat da poopoo

by Anonymousreply 308December 2, 2021 11:27 PM

Just a reminder

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by Anonymousreply 309December 3, 2021 4:10 AM

Thank you R309 for sharing this.

by Anonymousreply 310December 3, 2021 8:09 AM
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