Pronouns on a resume?

Complaining about it on Twitter has now placed her in a "freelance" category. It's fine to have convictions so I won't fault her for that. But be a bitch after you get the job.

I used to include my preferred time to take a dump in the mornings (7:30-8:00am), but it wasn't until I started leaving that information out that I got any interviews.

They didn’t take you seriously is all.

R1 LITERAL VIOLENCE.

They appreciated that you were informing them in advance that you were tiresome. Unfortunately, tiresome isn't what they are looking for at this time.

Clit/gone

hire/me

I’m so confused by this. I notice my co workers have included pronouns on their zoom chats. Can’t you tell by name?

K. Rambo must not have read about Mattress Girl. And Mattress Girl wearing the mattress walking across the stage to get her diploma. And Mattress Girl ultimately having to open up a nude interpretive dance art exhibit wearing only a mattress. Employers might be hesitant to hire someone who lives their life with a mattress tied to their back. Especially once Mattress Girl's story was determined not to be true.

According to the Indeed commercial currently airing, you don’t mention it until the person interviewing you brings up preferred pronouns.

R8, what about unisex names like Alex, Sam, Lee, Kyle, Jody, and then unfamiliar ethnic or foreign names as well as made up names?

The poor dear didn’t realize that the companies were already at max woke capacity.

It’s okay to say dear, right?

R11 that actually could make sense in some scenarios.

And there you have it.

What are the odds K. Rambo will take note.

[quote] Freelance Journalist/Annoyance

Pronouns are not his only problem. I just noted his descriptor includes Annoyance. That makes two red flags. Not smiling and looking annoyed for his Twitter profile pic is the third red flag.

If you are cis gendered and easily identified as such, pronouns in business are very tiresome. If there is some question or you think it's unclear, or if you are triggered by wrong pronouns because no one gets them right for you, I could see the need. But I don't think everyone should be having to state their pronouns or boundaries before hiring, or after. Your employers don't really want to know THAT much about you.

My midwestern born and raised, white bread, gosh darn speaking, married mother of two manager includes she/her on her email signature.

As if anyone had any question or cares for that matter.

Twitter has had sufficient.

Many women are very resistant to this because God knows they already get enough sexism and harassment from the het men they work with. Must 51% percent of the workforce be compelled to emphasize something they would much rather downplay while just trying to do their jobs? For the validation of a tiny minority of trans-identified males?

Bingo, R5. Bullet dodged. Big time.

[quote] I guess @twitter doesn’t support quality journalism and bad posts smh

He really doesn't know when to stop. He's getting dangerously close to selling ad space in the Autotrader.

I avoid this ridiculous pronoun nonsense whenever I can. Occasionally, it becomes impossible. It is rather bizarre that people are forced to participate in this insanity.

People can put Mr., Miss or Ms. on their resumes, R11.

They can, but they shouldn’t.

Yes they should as it clears up the question.

Diversity involves hiring people of different ethnicities, different sexes, different sexual orientations, different experiences, *not* a white man who's so precious he uses "they/them" pronouns.

I bet this guy thought he would be so cute going by non-standard pronouns as if anyone gives a shit and as if employers aren't rightfully worried about the conduct of such employees in the workplace.

They definitely should, R24

Our HR system at work as well as the platform we use for instant messaging have all added "Preferred Pronouns". That in itself was fine but we were then being "encouraged" to add our pronouns to the system and to our email signature. When some people ignored the "encouragement" HR contacted their line managers to "provide guidance".

I've told this story here before, I think. A colleague who is a gay man of color then complained to HR that they were trampling on his religious beliefs by imposing their rules about something he didn't believe in. He added that his employment contract did not require him to state his pronouns in his email correspondence. As soon as he played the religious beliefs card, HR backed off and stopped harassing him. Now it's gone back to being optional and they are no longer "encouraging" (with a gun held against our heads) to state our pronouns.

Fucking HR. Their pronouns are undoubtedly Dickhead/Cunt.

What "question", r25? If you mean the questions, "is this person a fucking idiot who I should steer away from and not employ in a million years?" then, yes, it probably answers that question.

Our HR systems works in this way; when we interview, we like to see the people best qualified for the job.

Their age, race, sexuality, pronouns etc are surprisingly not a factor compared to their experience and ability to be articulate.

Crazy isn't it?

R31, our HR team will argue that "their experience and ability to be articulate" are often code for "college-educated cis white males". We had a "training" session where our Diversity Coordinator informed us that "ability" is a term that carries inherent bias because it is from the perspective of a cis, white, male culture and does not take into account the life experiences of minorities, institutional racism, and their "lived truth". She advised us that we should look beyond ability and recognize their potential and their lived truth before hiring. I couldn't believe she gets paid to spout this drivel at work.

r32. Exactly. Same words verbatim are parroted in many places (not just things of unhinged twitter incels, just like forced pronouns in the workplaces) and spreading further. "Merit" and "ability" and such are "biased", "inequal", "racist", etc.

I'm so glad I don't work wherever you work R32!

Do they also have a policy that says mangers should not expect people to turn up on time, dress appropriately and actually do the job they're getting paid for, as these can be construed as a series of micro-aggressions and should not be tolerated as oppressive?

If answers were required as to why so many US companies outsource offshore, why US businesses are falling behind, one only need read the posts on this thread.

(Hint: Businesses in most of the world are not required to indulge/pander to employee personal whims)

My sister's email signature includes pronouns and she's actually one of the enforcers of it at her company. The worst thing is that she uses me (a gay man who disagrees with all this stuff) as justification for her lgbT-friendly activities in the company because she says that having a gay brother has made her an "ally".

I identify as a tall, slim, muscular blond Norwegian man. Should I put this information on my Resume too?

Incidentally, I only answer to indirect object pronouns. If you use any other pronouns, I will sue.

I think the people that use pronouns on their email signatures do so with the best of intentions on the whole, they're just trying to be inclusive. I can see the benefit of including Mr or Mrs/Miss/Ms that can help making a social faux-pas with non-Anglicised names.

Strangely I've found that if you do accidently call a woman he or him, they don't tend to have an attack of the vapors and try to sue you, make you lose your job, they can laugh it off or say "Oh that happens all the time".

To be honest I don't think I've ever seen any pronouns in email signatures in use at my work other than he/him and she/her, which makes it a bit pointless.

I had a manager that put his pronouns in his e-mail signature. It lasted about 2 weeks and then it disappeared. I think he was told to remove it.

[quote] People can put Mr., Miss or Ms. on their resumes, [R11].

I’ve seen Japanese, Chinese and Singaporeans have Mr/Ms on their business cards and it’s very helpful for westerners. It’s even more helpful when they put their surname in all caps.

I work for a pretty progressive organization and am very openly gay. My boss knows I am very supportive and open minded with the community. She recently asked me if we should include pronouns and I acknowledged it seems to becoming more prevalent, but that I have a reaction when I see others doing it. It'll probably happen one day and I'll just do it and get over it.

I'll include my pronouns in spaces where I'm asked to because I don't care and it costs me nothing. I don't carry the practice around with me because I don't care and it would cost me having to explain to people why my pronouns are there. Although I'm fully aware of how precious the Kids Today can be about their gender identities, I think people who consider stating pronouns to be a huge red flag should spend some time unpacking that. You don't want to work with people who have a clear sense of self and an expectation that they be treated with respect? I understand why the bosses would prefer we all go into cog mode, but I don't consider that healthy or wise.

If the organization shows staff using pronoun preferences on its web site (I'm seeing more of this now.) then feel free to establish your selfhood in a resume.

Otherwise, wait until an interview and just sho' yo' bad ol' self.

I appreciate people including pronouns in their resumes.

There is no more reliable indication that they are going to be a pain in the ass to work with.

I work for big tech in the Bay area. HR and management have encouraged us to list our pronouns on our internal profile page.

I have ignored it for now. I'm a male, my first name is unambiguously a male name, so I don't need it. But thanks to a poster above, I know what to say if they insist: I'll say that they are trampling on my religious freedom. That's genius! Thanks R29.

If pushed, I think I will go with:

Bob Happily Penised-Person

I recently applied to a job at a company headquartered in Canada. The application included the usual voluntary diversity questions, but with a whole lot of extras throw in, including sections on pronouns, gender identity, and sexual orientation. And then the options were almost comical in their attempts to be inclusive.

At some companies, NOT listing your pronouns is seen as transphobic and grounds for firing.

R45, I have a feeling that my colleague was able to use the religious belief excuse because he's a person of color. I doubt that he would have been able to get away with it had he been a white guy.

R34, not quite that, but we did have training on diverse workplaces and bias where the trainer tried to tell us that even an expectation of professional behavior and attitude in the workplace is inherently biased and discriminatory because apparently the definition of what is deemed professional is all based on a cis white male frame of reference.

I was astounded by this nonsense.

[quote] I think people who consider stating pronouns to be a huge red flag should spend some time unpacking that. You don't want to work with people who have a clear sense of self and an expectation that they be treated with respect?

What a ridiculous statement. The people so invested in their personal sense of identity that they post their personal pronouns (and demand it from others) are the farthest thing from having a “clear sense of self”. It’s a very adolescent mentality.

Welcome to the offline world, K. Rambo.

I might have even interviewed you just to cover my ass with various concerned parties, but no way I'd hire your tiresome/EXHAUSTED ass. Pronouns are efficient.

R47, which company was it?

If an employer ever requires my preferred pronouns I would say ME/ME. Makes as much sense as They/Them IMO.

Rather than continue to destroy rules of grammar and make people uncomfortable, can’t we just come up with some new words?

Lots of big companies that many on here think of as "evil" and super conservative (Wall st, etc.) have launched Pronoun campaigns. It makes me vomit.

Evil = trannies r55

Do people not yet realize that interviews are not only about determining whether or not you’d be someone they’d like to work with, but also whether or not you would be difficult to fire if someday they determine that your someone they no longer want to work with?

Nobody wants to have to rehire your position, go through the interview process AGAIN, train the position AGAIN.

Being fireable doesn’t mean that you ever WILL be fired, it just means that you won’t sue them til kingdom come if you suck at your job or create trouble in the workplace.

Being fireable and good at your job means you’ll get hired and, most likely, never fired.

I think that requiring pronouns achieves the opposite of what is intended. Your name is sufficient for almost all types of communication without getting into personal details.

If my employer asked me to add pronouns I would use my sex plus reproductive organs to describe.

Woman XX with a uterus.

Male XY with a prostate.

[quote] have launched Pronoun campaigns

An easy, quick sham of an activity to appear “woke” and inclusive. 🙄

R55 is right.

The Canadian company was Scotiabank. Lol.

I work in an industry that provides housing, which like it or not, can be rife with discrimination. I was told that pronouns in an email signature can alert people you interact with that you’re an ally/safe space/etc.

I recently added pronouns to my email signature and so far have not had any negative feedback, but I live in a progressive city where it’s become fairly widespread.

I would bet $$$ that the % of people using any pronouns other than he/his. she/her etc. is 1% or less.

[quote] Lots of big companies that many on here think of as "evil" and super conservative (Wall st, etc.) have launched Pronoun campaigns. It makes me vomit.

Let’s see corporate America put its money where its mouth is and give their non-exempt employees a paid day off for our new Juneteenth holiday.

Lol r54, that's a good one. I might used Me/Me too if forced to give "my" pronouns.

R54 This thread reminds me, the other day I was thinking about how weird it is that people list their pronouns with the object pronoun (e.g. "she")/possessive pronoun (e.g. "her"). It made me wonder, what if someone used "she" as the object pronoun but wanted to use "him" as the possessive pronoun. Can someone use she/him? I kind of love the idea of that, in a trollish way.

He/Him/ThroatwobblerMangrove

R65, isn't that kind of what the NBs claim to be?

R67 Oh yeah, you're right... I guess. I just meant different pronouns used as the object and possessive. Not like a she/her/they/it situation. But yes, I recall a twitter nut being mad that people weren't "switching" up their pronouns.

Could I use French pronouns? Though I was born into an English speaking society, in my mind I’ve always felt that I am francophone.

[quote] I’ve always felt that I am francophone.

Live your truth, R69.

Agree with you, r19. This pronoun business annoys my sister to no end. She says she’s spent her entire working life trying to just be seen as a person and a professional when she walks into a room, and after all these years there’s no way she’s putting her gender front and center.

Journalism 101, you dumb cunt/dickhead. The story is NOT ABOUT YOU. Your job is to report the facts, not to expound ad naseum about how those facts triggered your PTSD or affected your journey or whatever other mental gymnastics you perform to take the focus off the story and put it on yourself to win gold in the Oppression Olympics. Any and all employers saw you coming a mile away and rightly ran in the other direction. In other words, fuck off.

When I get a resume with pronouns it goes straight into the trash. I’m the final interview, and I can’t tell my employees to filter them by pronouns, but I sure as hell can stop it so I don’t have an organization of loons

I work in academia and a number of staff have put pronouns in their sigs voluntarily. I'm putting it off until an official word comes down the foodchain.

Then I plan to use (Mr) after my name if I can get away with it. Fuck the pronoun police!

r74, are you tenured?

Please r75….r74 is a janitor at a community college

I have two thoughts. Those saying that the people of questionable gender should list their pronouns if they feel like it and leave everyone else alone, that makes logical sense, but it's also discriminatory. It further singles out that population. I everbody *has* to do it, then they are the oddballs for being the only ones doing it. It makes sense in theory, but I don't care enough to add the pronouns myself.

My other thought is this - doesn't insisting on pronouns on a resume open your organization to liability assumption? Would this not make it easier for someone to make a gender discrimination claim on your hiring practices? Just like you're not supposed to ask for age in an interview to prevent any accusations of age bias and asking about a disability has to be voluntarily provided in order to prevent an accusation of ability bias. How long will it be until someone cries, "They didn't hire me because I'm non-binary and they made me list they/them on my application so they could tell," and then the company has to prove it hires an equitable number of non-binary people for their jobs?

Unless I'm hiring for something where gender is relevant (like a porn shoot), then I couldn't care less what gender you want to be. I care that you'll be a good fit for the role.

[quote]Unless I'm hiring for something where gender is relevant (like a porn shoot), then I couldn't care less what gender you want to be. I care that you'll be a good fit for the role.

At the porn shoot, I'd care that you'll be a good fit for the hole.

R54 is onto something. The phrase usually used is "your pronouns." Yes, *my* pronouns are me, my, and mine. Any other pronouns that might be used in relation to me are the concern of *others*. I don't care how they refer to me in the third person. Most likely I won't be there to hear it anyway.

I'm reminded by a perfect response I read here on DL. "That's personal. What does my gender have to do with my work?"

reminded *of*, that is.

[QUOTE]Our Diversity Coordinator informed us that "ability" is a term that carries inherent bias because it is from the perspective of a cis, white, male culture and does not take into account the life experiences of minorities, institutional racism, and their "lived truth". She advised us

She? I'm shocked and stunned that your diversity co-ordinator was a woman. (Said no one ever).

There aren't any paid jobs that a man can do that a woman can't. But sometimes it is better to employ one sex over the other; women's crisis centres being an obvious one where men would not be welcome.

Surely there are no jobs where being Asian or being white or being black would affect your ability to do the work? So what does a "lived truth" have to do with anything? You can either do a job or you can't. Same applies to being gay or straight. What fucking difference do "preferred pronouns" make to the ability to do a job? No one had even heard of them a decade ago.

I know a book agent who turns down unread any submission that addresses the agent as Miss/Ms/Mrs since said agent has declared herself non-binary.

R69 You can! French gender neutral pronoun spelling is "iel". It is the main gender neutral pronoun used in French and is a contraction of the two binary pronouns "il" and "elle".

Yes, lots of French "iel"s with ugly dyed hair & otaku makeup/outfits, tattoos and/or obese. And Swedish "hen" (they/them)...

I prefer adverbs on a resume

It took a long time for Ms to become acceptable.

We need an English version of iel.

The English equivalent for iel is “insane aggressive straight man in a ratty wig and a whore’s dress” r87

[quote] We need an English version of iel.

English has gender neutral pronouns: it/it/its

Ms actually means something though r86, and it was necessary because of the unfortunate fact that in English - unlike probably every other language - the Miss and Mrs titles for women denote their marital status. In other languages, the distinction in titles for women is based on age not marital status.

He’s been taught an important lesson. The question is: did he learn it? (I’m guessing, not!)

Your resume should be genderless. Let your achievements be the only thing that stand out.

R45 Using religion as an excuse to not use pronouns won’t work. It may get HR off your back but it will paint you as “reactionary”. Instead say that “putting pronouns in my signature is bad for my gender dysphoria”. That will get them off your back. You may even get a promotion for being stunning and brave.

I always send prospects a "présumé" rather than a "résumé" and I include the job I'm applying for in my experience list, pro-dating it a year out and showing all the things I accomplished.

Pronouns? I'm bending time and do not acknowledge the need to include a genital/biological/how-I-like-to-fuck tag in any of my information. I have evolved past such nonsense.

[quote] “putting pronouns in my signature is bad for my gender dysphoria”.

I think you mean it's *triggering* given my gender dysphoria.

[quote]Although I'm fully aware of how precious the Kids Today can be about their gender identities, I think people who consider stating pronouns to be a huge red flag should spend some time unpacking that. You don't want to work with people who have a clear sense of self and an expectation that they be treated with respect? I understand why the bosses would prefer we all go into cog mode, but I don't consider that healthy or wise.

You sound pretty "precious" yourself. Funny that you mention "cog mode" as something bad but then think people going along with the ultimate bullshit of groupthink that is the pronoun game are displaying some clear sense of self. I don't want to work with people who can't figure out that they are male if they have a dick and XY chromosomes or a female if they have a vagina and XX chromosomes. Also don't want to work with people who don't understand that they/them are plural pronouns. In other words, I don't want to work with exhausting morons.

This reminds me of a recent Atlantic article about the NYC mayor's race:

[quote ]Morales staffers and volunteers ultimately staged protests against their own candidate. They lit sage and incense outside her office and urged her to donate $1 million from her campaign coffers to mutual-aid groups, a decidedly unrealistic demand that would almost certainly violate city campaign-finance law. On Wednesday, Morales responded by firing more than 50 members of her team, leaving her with a skeleton crew. A campaign that was already a long shot had definitively imploded. Democratic strategists around the country watched the spectacle of young workers marching on their own office, and some saw it as a clear indicator of the dangers of trying to bring Generation Z into the fold of grueling campaign work. One veteran Democratic operative who has worked on presidential campaigns articulated these fears to me via text message. “It seems like many of these kids would be shocked and upset at just normal boring office jobs and the expectations there. And campaigns are so much harder than that,” wrote the operative, who requested anonymity because of professional concerns.

Thank you for turning me into that Atlantic article r97.

Message clear: don’t have “black femme” leadership team, because they will turn on you and take your candidacy down the shitter.

My other favorite quote from the article was

[quote] It’s a really unfortunate moment in this race,” Morales said in an interview. “As a survivor myself, who’s got a femme-led team, many of whom are also survivors, we’ve all been triggered."

This is exactly what James Carville was talking about when he chastised liberals for their "faculty lounge" politics. Seriously, who the hell talks like this in real life?

[quote]You sound pretty "precious" yourself.

I've quietly tolerated all manner of wildly illegal bullshit in the workplace because I'm a realist (pessimist?) with thick skin. But I don't expect everyone to share my tolerance level and I also know that I benefit in the long run from better working conditions because someone else decided it was worth it to them to be a pain in the ass.

[quote] I don't want to work with exhausting morons.

Tell me about this magical workplace that has no exhausting morons. The position I outlined was to give the argument no oxygen by just going along with whatever the fuck pronouns people want to use and not worrying about it. This is how to avoid exhausting morons from all directions!

[quote]This is exactly what James Carville was talking about when he chastised liberals for their "faculty lounge" politics. Seriously, who the hell talks like this in real life?

Moreover, nobody wants to elect people who will be 'triggered' instead of manning /womanning up to do the job for the benefit of all constituents.

All of this pronoun garbage is about controlling other people's behavior when you are not around. The most commonly used pronoun used when speaking to someone is "you." He/She/They, etc.. are used when talking ABOUT someone, most likely when they are not there.

If you call a they person her when she isn't there, the only way she will know is if the person you are talking to rats you out. That is why people like Themi Lovato choose they/their pronouns. That way they can police articles about them, and raise a fit if their preferred pronouns aren't used.

It is inherently narcissistic, and stems from a view that you are the most fascinating person in the world, and you have the right to control people's behavior, even if you aren't present.