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Francis Poulenc. Gay French composer 1899-1963

Does anyone, besides me, still appreciate him?

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by Anonymousreply 58February 7, 2023 1:31 PM

Lots of love interest and lovers

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by Anonymousreply 1November 13, 2020 5:47 PM

Dialogues des Carmélites has been one of my favorite operas for 40 years.

by Anonymousreply 2November 13, 2020 5:51 PM

Les Biches is probably one of the best ballet suites ever written. I listen to it all the time. Never gets tired.

A lot of French composers don't get the recognition they deserve. Saint Saens is, in my mind, one of the greatest composers ever, but few people know much about his music and outside of Carnival of the Animals and (sometimes) the Organ Symphony, it is seldom in the repertoire. Likewise, Faure created some of the most beautiful pieces ever, and again, they're rarely played. Likewise, many other of their contemporaries.... Only DeBussy gets the full Great Composer treatment, and, to a slightly lesser extent, Ravel (who is about my favorite composer of all).

I think most people just stick to the basics, the Bs, and then the other ones constantly played in the concert halls. I like Dvorak and Schumann and, especially, Schubert, but they are overplayed now.

by Anonymousreply 3November 13, 2020 6:00 PM

Poulenc's music is melodic and delightful! Any of the concertos make for wonderful listening.

by Anonymousreply 4November 13, 2020 6:15 PM

most is a bit to airy for me, his organ concerto though and particularly his "voix humaine" written during WWII are exceptional works

by Anonymousreply 5November 13, 2020 6:21 PM

r3, with a name like "les bi(t)ches" it should be the most popular piece of music ever on the DL

by Anonymousreply 6November 13, 2020 6:21 PM

Love Poulenc. Concerto for two pianos is fab. So is his Gloria.

by Anonymousreply 7November 13, 2020 6:36 PM

I love his chamber and, especially, piano music. I also love that (as you might know) one critic referred to Poulenc - who was both deeply spiritual and very sexual - as a "hooligan monk."

by Anonymousreply 8November 14, 2020 4:12 AM

I like his organ music and have song some of his choral music. All of it is good.

by Anonymousreply 9November 14, 2020 7:20 AM

As an oboist (in high school in college, only an amateur in adult life), his Oboe Sonata is a staple of the rep and was the last piece he wrote before he died. The last movement, Déploration, is very, very dark.

Didn't realize he was gay.

by Anonymousreply 10November 14, 2020 8:26 AM

One of my favorite piano pieces. Melodic, with beautiful counterpoint and perfect touches of minor chords and mild dissonances.

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by Anonymousreply 11November 14, 2020 8:52 AM

I played his Trois Mouvements Perpetuels for my first piano jury as a college freshman (got all As and an A+!). I didn’t realize it at the time, but I was the same age he was when he composed them.

Still as fresh and new as the day he wrote them! The third is still my favorite.

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by Anonymousreply 12November 14, 2020 9:04 AM

Still a fan, and also had no idea he was gay.

by Anonymousreply 13November 14, 2020 9:14 AM

Francis Poulenc was openly gay as a young man, something that could have had him deported when Nazis took over Paris during WWII. They kept an eye on him, and voiced displeasure at some of his works, but otherwise M. Poulenc was left alone. This even though he often couldn't resist stirring the pot.

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by Anonymousreply 14November 14, 2020 9:57 AM

By many accounts Pierre Bernac, was Francis Poulenc's partner in both life and profession; but you'd never know it as nearly nothing is written about their relationship outside of music related.

Francis Poulenc is buried at Père Lachaise cemetery with his niece; she inherited his entire estate along with rights to recordings, etc.., but died several months later.

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by Anonymousreply 15November 14, 2020 10:09 AM

Never mind the above, checked my French sources and Poulenc and Bernac were just partners in music, period. They even used "vous" to each other their entire lives.

Sorry for misinformation....

by Anonymousreply 16November 14, 2020 10:12 AM

Another vote for Dialogues des Carmelites, in particular Dervaux’ version with Régine Crespin in Mme Lidoine.

by Anonymousreply 17November 14, 2020 10:19 AM

R17

Have that version of Dialogues of Carmelites as CD set, and have played it to death over years.

While alive and IIRC in his will Poulenc stated he wished DdC always to be performed in language native to country were it took place. French in France, English in UK or USA.... But think it sounds best in French.

Have seen he Metropolitan opera version with late Jessye Norman, and it was done in English.

Poulenc wrote the part of second prioress for the young Mlle Régine Crespin , so hearing her perform any of the roles is wonderful because she was "there" so to speak when opera premiered in 1957.

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by Anonymousreply 18November 14, 2020 10:34 AM

For those who did not know, Le dialogue des Carmélites is based on actual account of a group of Carmelite nuns executed by French revolution.

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by Anonymousreply 19November 14, 2020 10:41 AM

Besides several books there is also a French film on subject.

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by Anonymousreply 20November 14, 2020 10:42 AM

J'écoute maintenant sa sonate pour clarinette.

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by Anonymousreply 21November 14, 2020 12:49 PM

R16

Thank you for the precision.

Last Love interest of Poulenc was Louis Gautier, a young soldier.

by Anonymousreply 22November 15, 2020 8:17 AM

Did you know Francis Poulenc came from a very affluent family, his father was Émile Poulenc who along with his brother (uncle to FP) was Poulenc Frères a pharmacutucal company founded by Francis Poulenc's grandfather. The company merged to become Rhône-Poulenc in 1928 with subsequent later mergers having various divisions now part of Sanofi S.A., Solvay group and Bayer Crop Science.

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by Anonymousreply 23November 15, 2020 2:33 PM

Carmelites is extraordinary.

by Anonymousreply 24November 15, 2020 2:47 PM

The last ten minutes of Carmelites is extraordinary.

What comes before isn't so extraordinary.

by Anonymousreply 25November 15, 2020 5:24 PM

Young Jessye Norman singing Poulenc.

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by Anonymousreply 26November 16, 2020 9:18 AM

There are so many great moments in Dialoughes des Carmelites not just the ending....

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by Anonymousreply 27November 16, 2020 9:54 AM

I think of Francis Poulenc as very 20th century, very 1920s. So many of his pieces are like a flippant dancing bird.

He uses an orchestra as if it were a solo instrument. He seems too impatient —or perhaps uninterested in exploring the emotions and colours in the orchestra —as Ravel did so effortlessly— or Martinu.

His ‘Gloria’ is frequently played. It sounds very much like ‘The Carmelites’ in that he uses the same orchestral instruments in the same percussive way.

It seems he was friends with Bebè Bérard and Boris Kochno (Diaghilev’s last boy). What a pity he didn’t do film music like Georges Auric (whose film music was heard by many more millions than ever heard Francis Poulenc).

by Anonymousreply 28November 16, 2020 9:58 AM

Scene where Blanche's brother comes to fetch her out of the convent as the revolution takes on steam and their father feels it is no longer a safe place.

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by Anonymousreply 29November 16, 2020 10:02 AM

Completely disagree R25. One of my favorite operas in French, although the English translation is actually quite good.

I’ve performed Poulenc for decades, including Carmelites with major opera companies, but probably my favorite piece to perform is a chamber piece called Le bal masqué, a Dada composition with absurdist lyrics. So much fun.

by Anonymousreply 30November 16, 2020 12:10 PM

It doesn't make sense to blame Poulenc for not composing like Ravel. I don't think he's really a profound composer (except for Carmelites and a few other compositions) but I've gotten much pleasure from his music, which is sort of the point.

by Anonymousreply 31November 16, 2020 4:50 PM

One of the simplest, purest, and evocative songs ever written, using the words of Poulenc’s favorite poet Guillame Apollinaire. The words themselves seem like they could have been written by a DataLounger:

Hôtel

Ma chambre a la forme d’une cage Le soleil passe son bras par la fenêtre Mais moi qui veux fumer pour faire des mirages J’allume au feu du jour ma cigarette Je ne veux pas travailler je veux fumer

Hotel

My room is shaped like a cage The sun slips its arm through the window But I who want to smoke to make mirages I light my cigarette on daylight's fire I do not want to work I want to smoke

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by Anonymousreply 32November 18, 2020 9:11 AM

There's a trashy write-up on him here.

It doesn't mention if he was an atheist or not.

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by Anonymousreply 33November 19, 2020 12:23 AM

Poulenc was many things, but an Atheist wasn’t one of them. He was a devout Catholic who experienced many levels of spiritual awakening throughout his life.

by Anonymousreply 34November 19, 2020 1:02 AM

Very Catholic.

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by Anonymousreply 35November 19, 2020 9:23 AM

[quote] …blame…

No, that's not the word. The word is ignorance. I’m ignorant of why Poulenc wrote in the way he did. I don’t know what was going on in his life.

For instance I know that my one of my favourite composers was appallingly lazy and preferred the sun in Portofino to the piano. Another of my favourites was an atheist but wrote some wonderful, resonant religious pieces. Another favourite (well, not so favourite nowdays) lived with a man of his own age but supposedly was obsessed with teenagers.

Another, a definite favourite!, well I had assumed he was homosexual, but now we’re told he was merely fastidious and celibate like Proust.

by Anonymousreply 36November 20, 2020 9:40 PM

That portrait has to be a Picasso.

by Anonymousreply 37November 20, 2020 9:44 PM

Francis Poulenc is buried at Père Lachaise cemetery with his niece; she inherited his entire estate along with rights to recordings, etc.., but died several months later.

Shortly after the war, Poulenc had a brief affair with a woman, Fréderique ("Freddy") Lebedeff, with whom he had a daughter, Marie-Ange, in 1946. The child was brought up without knowing who her father was (Poulenc was supposedly her "godfather") but he made generous provision for her, and she was the principal beneficiary of his will.[72]

she's my niece she's my daughter I said, I want the truth [slap] she's my niece and my daughter

by Anonymousreply 38November 20, 2020 10:32 PM

R38

As long as she's not his sister and his daughter.

It happens.

by Anonymousreply 39November 21, 2020 11:36 PM

R36 are you talking about Ben?

That list does not include Mussorgsky or Gershwin.

by Anonymousreply 40November 22, 2020 12:18 AM

Yes, R40, I was referring to Benjamin Britten.

Did Mussorgsky or Gershwin have issues as well?

by Anonymousreply 41November 22, 2020 1:27 AM

Modest was gay and Gershwin had no romantic life whatsoever and remained unmarried until his death at the age of 38. Adele Astaire herself claimed he was not heterosexual but that he was asexual. What does that tell you?

by Anonymousreply 42November 24, 2020 3:51 AM

R42

About George Gershwin.

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by Anonymousreply 43January 5, 2021 4:23 PM

[quote] Adele Astaire herself claimed he was not heterosexual but that he was asexual. What does that tell you?

It tells me that Gershwin (like Ravel and TE Lawrence) was asexual.

And that's perfectly fine. We don't have to follow this Freudian-inspired 20th century fad that everything in society is about orgasms.

by Anonymousreply 44January 6, 2021 10:33 PM

So you genuinely believe there are people who have no interest in sex whatsoever either man or woman?

You know life existed before the 20th Century don't you?

by Anonymousreply 45January 7, 2021 12:49 AM

[quote] So you genuinely believe there are people who have no interest in sex whatsoever either man or woman?

Yes, I do.

[quote] You know life existed before the 20th Century don't you?

Yes. Freud was publishing in the 1890s but his ideas saturated 20th century culture.

by Anonymousreply 46January 7, 2021 10:25 PM

Have you ever met one? I haven't. Though a friend from high school claims a guy we both knew is asexual.

by Anonymousreply 47January 8, 2021 10:02 PM

[quote] Have you ever met one?

Of course I have.

But, you know, they don't announce themselves to one as such. You have to talk with them and, more importantly, listen to them.

(I stress 'listening' because it's a little-used skill)

by Anonymousreply 48January 8, 2021 10:08 PM

Merveilleux

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by Anonymousreply 49October 26, 2021 9:52 PM

... "was very open with his sexuality.

He often sent letters to his male friends with flirty, inappropriately homosexual banter.

At the beginning of Moore’s article, he even states that the American Composer Ned Rorem was surprised and uncomfortable with Poulenc’s talk of his sexual exploits.

It makes more sense to me that Poulenc would incorporate his homosexual readings of society into the works he created.

It’s an important argument to acknowledge that this is prevalent specifically in his ballet Les Biches.

Now, I just wrote an essay on the notions of sexuality in Les Biches, so I could go on for ages.

Moore points out that there are specific scenes in which androgyny, cross-dressing and same-sex desire are present.

Nijinska’s choreography often shows two same-sex characters feeling each other up during a dance, or in some other way fueling the notion of homosexual lust."

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by Anonymousreply 50October 17, 2022 5:26 AM

Yes, R40, my second paragraph refers to William Walton, Ralph Vaughan Williams and Benjamin Britten.

My third paragraph refers to Maurice Ravel.

by Anonymousreply 51October 17, 2022 6:30 AM

"Dialogues of the Carmelites" is the greatest of post-war operas, gorgeously melodic and with a terrific libretto. The Met has never retired its 1977 premiere production because it still plays so well. There are also half-a-dozen videos of various international productions available, including two from the Met.

Leontyne Price performed it several times in San Francisco and appeared in the US premiere live on NBC Opera Theatre. Joan Sutherland performed it in England and Australia.

by Anonymousreply 52October 17, 2022 7:56 AM

[quote]For instance I know that my one of my favourite composers was appallingly lazy and preferred the sun in Portofino to the piano. Another of my favourites was an atheist but wrote some wonderful, resonant religious pieces. Another favourite (well, not so favourite nowdays) lived with a man of his own age but supposedly was obsessed with teenagers.

This is the first time I've read a blind item about symphonic composers.

by Anonymousreply 53October 17, 2022 11:18 AM

OP Yes. And not because we're both gay men. I love his music.

by Anonymousreply 54October 17, 2022 11:30 AM

[quote]His Flute Sonata of 1956

Pics please.

by Anonymousreply 55October 17, 2022 11:35 AM

[quote] the first time I've read a blind item about symphonic composers.

People are suspicious that 3 out of my 7 favourite composers of the 20th century are English. They foolishly compartmentalise tham into boxes whereas William Walton, for instance, has strong non-English links.

by Anonymousreply 56October 17, 2022 9:22 PM

L’œuvre pour piano par Gabriel Tacchino.

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by Anonymousreply 57February 7, 2023 12:52 PM

Chamber Music, a CD I like from Poulenc.

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by Anonymousreply 58February 7, 2023 1:31 PM
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