Gays, we need a new place.

Branson is the obvious choice here.

St Augustine, Florida

I don't think that we'd be able to survive in the Ozarks, R1.

We need to be near an ocean.

That undiscovered paradise, Flint Michigan.

Segregationist!

Yes, R4. The Midwest.

Nice weather and beautiful Great Lakes.

Best of all, there are some places in the region that are still very affordable.

But where?

The prices go up the moment the gays arrive. As soon as Brad and Jared buy that tacky abandoned motel 6 they change the sheets turn it into a gay resort and start charging the gay tax raising the cost per room from 39.00 to 199.00.

OP, the answer is South Carolina. Gays and Charleston get along well together. There are just over 5 million people in the entire state (roughly the population of Brooklyn and Queens) and just over 3 million registered voters. In 2016, only 2 million of them voted and Trump won with only 54 percent of the votes. Just over 1 million people gave him South Carolina.

We would not have to move many gay people to South Carolina to take over the place. One million gays (NO Log Cabin trash!) plus the Democrats already there and we would rule the school. We would get Charleston, Myrtle Beach, miles of beaches, mild winters, plus two US Senators and seven Representatives.

Just a million gays. That's all it would take. And we could take down all the Confederate monuments and remake the state flag in our own rainbow image.

R8 I've heard good things about Charleston, but I've also heard that it's really expensive.

You're right, though.

Perhaps the Southern Atlantic coast of the US could become a nice hangout for gay people.

Good weather, nice beaches, and hot guys.

Why haven't we invaded the South yet?

If they follow it is because they wanna be "cool" and "edgy" like gay men. So, in the words of the Great Gay Oscar Wilde, let's remember that:

"Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery".

Look at the leather bars and how suddenly middle class, suburban woman are buying leather sandals and boots with stud from Steve Madden in an effort to be edgy and cool. Bitches want to be like us and want us to accept them. We don't want them, which, of course makes us more appealing.

The gays are the Marines of real estate. We hit the beaches in the first wave, secure the beachhead, clean up the destruction, rebuild the area and ultimately redecorate. The regulars follow us after we've done the heavy lifting. Some people benefit from this kind of renewal (early adapters) while others don't (original residents, most often poor.)

A million of us in South Carolina would strain the state's resources unless you plan to displace the South Carolinians already there. Is this gonna be like Palestine in 1948 when a lot of people who lived there suddenly didn't have their homes any longer? Are we building new homes for the extra million people? Roads? Electric plants, gas pipelines, coastal protections, waste treatment plants? Or are we forcing them into Georgia where they'll live in camps?

I used to work with a guy who said we had to do this: get all the liberals to move to red states to seed them so they'll soon turn purple and then eventually blue. Him? He retired and bought a condo in the West Village.

R2 agree, love the place!

Personally, I hate seeing the watering down of gay neighborhoods and fewer and fewer gay bars and establishments.

There are more out gays than ever, but fewer places for us to go than ever before.

There's a myth that somehow we've overcome all prejudice and now we can blend into the straight world and be accepted. Well, I don't feel that - not at all. Particularly with straight people over the age of 40.

It's one thing to not be abused when you go out and another to actually feel comfortable and safe. Maybe because I'm 50 and grew up with the discrimination it will never be easy for me to feel completely at home in het environments.

I lived in Charleston for 10 years - I was fortuante to live in the French Quarter on Church Street. It is a very beautiful city - just walking around the French Quarter and South of Broad was always stunning - the houses and gardens are truly unbelievable. The city used to be very old boy - if you weren't from there you had a hard time being accepted. Now folks are moving in from all over and buying up all the big, old "family" homes, opening innovative new businesses and basically displacing the Old Guard. The restaurants are incredible - from very expensive to food trucks, the food is just fantastic. There's only one (sad) gay bar downtown though so we'd need to work on that. The retail is great as well - King Street is where all the shops are and its a great mix of national retailers and unique one-off shops. Its a pleasure to walk up and down King Street shopping, eating and drinking. The gay community is pretty small and pretty much insular but that could easily be changed with new blood. There's also some excellent barrier island beaches very closeby - Sullivan's Island is my favorite but there's also Folly Beach, Isle of Palms, Seabrook and Kiaweh (a little further away). There's a great Farmer's Market at the main city park every Saturday that is very social and fun. People get "put together" to do things/go out - even to the grocery store, but that's very nice - the manners and friendliness are so refreshing. Plenty of culture and a bonus of The College of Charleston which has some of the best-looking students you've ever seen. I think Charleston is a prime spot for a new gay locale. Go for a visit - you will love it.

[quote]A million of us in South Carolina would strain the state's resources unless you plan to displace the South Carolinians already there.

No, no, no. All those Republicans have pledged their loyalty to free market capitalism. If gay people arrive there, the rents will rise and the landlords will do the displacing quick enough. Republicans won't mind being evicted from their homes because they love them some free market capitalism. Let the market decide.

In any event, I don't think the gays will all be moving in during the same week. It takes time.

We need to plant the flag and defend PTown ...

South Bend, IN.

Assimilation is a double-edged sword.

Gays are becoming a very small group anyways; indirect sterilization et al.

Detroit.

North Albuquerque. Seriously. The city is in dire need of development, it's dirt cheap still, has pretty good weather year round. Santa Fe and Taos are nearby.

It's on the cusp of being great - it just needs a sizeable injection of money, talent, and creative juices. AND, it's not on anyone's list - unlike other booming middle-cities like Portland, Austin, Nashville, etc.

I can't think of any other area (NOT the humid and redneck South) that's not developed or an area I would actually want to live in. It's a bit isolated, but so is Denver, Phoenix and any major western cities outside of CA.

Just saw a documentary on St Augustine - seems like it should have historic sections. Anything is better architecturally than Wilting Manors.

R20, my thoughts exactly - Motown to Brotown

The old town was lovely back in 80s and there's a cool old fort

Detroit's weather sucks ass and it is too spread out. Getting anywhere in that town is an unbelievably long drive on really shitty highways. Fuck that.

A section of Detroit, dumbass.

OP is an ancient elderbottom who simultaneously worships and yet loathes straight men because he can’t have a conversation around anything that doesn’t involve interior design, fashion, or show tunes.

Straight people are not uniform and I personally would be lost without my straight friends. Two of my good friends are straight guys and they are amazing. Maybe it’s because I and they are Millennials and things have changed since most DLers were young, but many straight guys today DO NOT CARE if a guy is gay. If you’re cool and share common interests it isn’t hard to befriend them.

Variety is the spice of life and I find myself seeking out “straight spaces”, or at least not specifically gay ones when it comes to being social because straight people tend to be much more easy going, accepting and nicer to hang out with than gay men

Personally, I avoid most gay men because they are tiresome. I can’t imagine being quarantined on an island or at a “destination” with a bunch of judgmental, effeminate, miserable DLers.

R25 - like Ferndale? It still sucks. And unless you put a dome over it, the weather sucks 10 months out of the year. Plus you can't drive a non-American car there without fear of it being vandalized.

That was one of the most striking items for me when I was there a couple of years ago - the visual absence of Japanese, German and other cars that make up over half the vehicles in any other area. I understand why - but it's this imposed rule that sucks - particularly when you have to drive everywhere there.

Did I mention it sucks?

I’m actually on board for the South Carolina idea.

The Research Triangle. Durham for the lesbians, Raleigh for the gays, and Chapel Hill for the hunky undergraduates who will do anything for a beer.

Savannah, GA of course, which is the forgotten step-sister of Charleston. That whole area on the coast is prime for the taking: beachy, isolated, affordable. But Savannah has been on its way to becoming a gay mecca for decades and is wrought with gay history. Just read Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil: there was the rich eldergay antiques dealer, his 19-year-old bisexual murdered whore, the gay piano playing squatter, the black trans drag queen Lady Chablis, and the writer herself, Miss John Berendt. That's 5 LGBTs as the main characters in one extremely popular book, 6 if you count the city itself as a character, which many people do.

R31, I was that bisexual whore.

A lot of you must like oppressive heat and humidity, racism, and deplorable Republicans as your neighbors. Savannah and Charleston?

The houses have already been preserved / taken over. And then there's the rest of the state's population and politicians. Fuck that.

Portland, Maine.

Perhaps find a town or small city rather than an established large city. If South Carolina is the state, why not consider Georgetown?

R22 it’s the oldest town of Florida. Lovely old architecture, great atmosphere. Worth at least one visit.

R33 Not to mention that the tourists have destroyed Savannah's appeal.

I blame John Berendt. He ruined Savannah.

Girls! Girls! Girls! You cannot pick a city to make this work. If you pick a city, what do you get? Two city council persons? If you pick a state, you get two U.S. Senators and the entire state government. Think!

Rhode Island has a beautiful sea coast and only 1.5 million people. AND TWO SENATORS. We could sew that one up quickly. But I didn't want to read a bunch of comments about bitching about winter, so I cut to the chase and went with South Carolina. Alabama is slightly smaller. We could do the same to Alabama. Take it over!

St. Augustine is nice but can be very crowded in the touristy, Old Town area. And expensive to buy there. It has grown tremendously with lots of nice upscale developments farther out filled with, ta dah, well off straight retirees who have already figured it as a cool place to live. That said, it is still pretty nice. But it is also basically a suburb of Jacksonville, which is not that nice.

R38 - You didn't read the directions for the assignment or misunderstood. We're not taking over an entire state - that's too much work and who wants to live in rural areas anyway? And there's no way to turn S. Carolina or Alabama into some liberal haven without forcing out all of the white racist religious assholes who make up 80% of the population.

We need to go somewhere to live fun, freely and cheap and that hasn't been overdeveloped.

Blue state New Mexico and Albuquerque. Why not there?

Aim higher, R40.

I veto South Carolina -The state has no LGBT rights protections and no hate-crime laws. Our pioneers should not become sacrificial lambs, and states full of hatred should not be rewarded with our money, taste, and trendsetting.

I'd rather see us take over a smaller city in California or other gay-friendly state.

R42 - Central coast? Like San Luis Obispo area? I like that idea. Beaches, good weather, a lot of wine made close by. Not too far to SF or LA.

Here's my solution: When we finally get a government that will scale back the military, they can sell off Camp Pendleton and we can turn it into a gay paradise. It's got miles of prime oceanfront, it's in between LA and San Diego, and has perfect weather. And maybe some of the marines will linger around to "service" us.

^^^Works for me! I live in Oceanside!

LOL - I was just in Oceanside yesterday and drove through Camp Pendleton in the afternoon. It is a waste of so much space.

Hell, we'll take half of it. But you know Republicans would sell that shit out to their crony friends instead.

I've never been, but Central coast looks very undeveloped.

Question - where do you go for any gay life around Oceanside or Carlsbad (in normal times, not COVID)? It just seems so straight but I know it can't be 100%.

Local Scruff and Grindr are quite crowded. And the farther south you go, the more choices you have. San Diego still has gay bars and clubs, of course. Oceanside at one point had two -now none. But the number of guys online hooking up is astounding!

We could take over Delaware. And it has beaches.

AND TWO SENATORS!

"One of those odd little states, Dolly darling?"

St. Augustine is a darling little place ,but very expensive and getting more crowded by the day. Of course I grew up going there in the 60s-70s-80s so i remember when it was vastly different. Theres zero appeal now on trying to walk through the historic area on a 95 degree day with 20,000 other tourists. And its always ridiculously crowded now. Ive long thought Pensacola would be a great spot for the gays to take over . Its very historic with a great beach and interesting architecture. But I havent been there in 20 years so Im not sure how it is now.

My vote goes to San Bernardino!

I want to live in r27’s house and walk around in my caftan with a martini while hurling arch insults at her cool young millennial bros.

[quote] straight people tend to be much more easy going, accepting and nicer to hang out with than gay men

R27, what alternate universe do you live in because I don't find this remotely true at all, and before you say I'm old, I'm probably around your age.

If we take over Pensacola, we get deeply closeted Matt Gaetz with his live in houseboy (er.....his Cuban son, Nestor) as our representative..... No thanks.

The entire deep South is so heavily imbued with fundamentalist Protestant values, it would be a 30 or 40 year slog to make it livable.....livable as in not having to endure people (complete strangers) constantly asking you daily if you have accepted Jesus Christ as your personal savior. I'd be dead long before that got accomplished. I would vote for an easier environment, where we don't have to surmount religious, political, and historical baggage. The northeast and midwest have weather problems. Caftans don't work in places with 6 months or more of shitty weather. That leaves the west coast.

There are a few slummy beach towns in California that could be "colonized". Places like Santa Maria, the slightly impoverished neighbor of Santa Barbara. Same great weather though.

R53, I would watch that show.

R27 doesnt fool anybody . Shes just trying to get that straight dick by stealth . Probably waits till she gets them good and drunk on a "bro" night then molests them when they pass out . We see you Gurl !

The clothing-optional resort hotels of Palm Springs.

Sure, you have to put up with some fat, old guys - but at least they are the last bastion of gay-men-only bliss.

St Augustine is the gayest straight city I've ever been to. I have no idea why it's not gay already.

ABQ and Spokane

The beaches in Galveston are nice. We could have hurricane parties four months out of the year. And it's cheap!

St Augustine seems to be in first place

Geocities?

Oh, wait, you meant—never mind.

Another vote for the West Coast.

[quote]Personally, I avoid most gay men because they are tiresome.

r48 is right.

Midway between NYC and DC,--a suburb, really, of Philly--Wilmington, Delaware, is cheap, architecturally rich, imbued with arts, and 90 minutes from several charming beach towns, including Rehoboth, which is already a gay stronghold.

Delaware has no sales tax, is Democratic, and doesn't have a shitty winter.

R66, good choice. I love Wilmington.

We have DL and Muriel. We should be grateful for small mercies.

R66 - Wilmington, DE isn't a bad choice, but wtf are you talking about with the winter? It's colder than Philly on average every month and has a similar amount of snow.

That's not good weather - not at all.

And I think we can cross the whole buggy, humid, hurricane prone, redneck deplorable state of Florida off the list.

Florida here, we're not all the same you know.

Wilmington is shitty. People confuse “Democrat voting” with “gay friendly”. Wilmington is reliably Democrat, but I wouldn’t sit at the Amtrak station holding hands with my partner.

The DE beaches are gay friendly though.

R70 - yes, yes you are. Just because you have strips of wealthy people, it doesn't remove all of the rednecks, deplorables, and criminals populated throughout the state. Humidity, bugs, alligators, hurricanes, oppressive heat 6 months out of the year.

And Palm Beach - that goes for you too - you only have to travel a few miles.

[quote] Just because you have strips of wealthy people, it doesn't remove all of the rednecks, deplorables, and criminals populated throughout the state.

Sounds like anywhere.

r55 No one has ever referred to Santa Maria as a "beach town."

I like hanging with friends and going to a few gay events. Nothing sounds worse to me than living in the gayborhood or only socializing with other gay men.

R73 - not really. And Florida has some of the worst people in the nation - it makes headlines weekly. Florida is in a class all its own.

Savannah, Georgia. Tybee Island. Too small though and housing very expensive.

Gary, Indiana!

R77 Maybe Savannah but not Tybee. The island is ok for an afternoon but would suck to live

A mass of Republican politicians in South Carolina are gay. They deny it, claim they are straight,,display to the public they are closeted, and suck dick galore.

Fraus haven’t invaded steamworks, have they?

I like this idea, it’s like guerrilla gay bar of a whole city. Let me know where to start looking!

I enjoy finding gay culture and communities in the least likely places like the city I am in now in Eastern Europe. Essentially, when we are more tightly knit, we are less catty and more united. I find big gay communities kind of lose their unity where there are many of us.

But we are also human and humans will segregate based on income, education, interests, etc. We aren't just all defined by just being gay. WeHo still has many residential buildings where about 80 percent of the inhabitants are gay men.

Problem is - there needs to be jobs available. We can't make all of our own jobs.

Another vote for Delaware

I propose a Tri-Cities concept. Asheville NC for the mountains and Biltmore Estate--they employ a lot of gats and most of them think they're the lady of the manor. Raleigh for people working in tech, education and pharma. Wilmington NC for the beach lovers. It's one of the last affordable areas on the east coast near/on the ocean. Aside from Asheville, snow is rare, but there's a change of seasons. Charleston in the Summer is hellish with the heat and humidity! It's also a Southern Baptist version of New Orleans without the fun and mobbed with tourists. The state is purple and enough gays moving here would tip it into the blue column with more electoral votes than our provincial neighbor to the south!

[quote]WeHo still has many residential buildings where about 80 percent of the inhabitants are gay men.

Imagine those coop board meetings!

Lake Okoboji. Marilyn Maye performs yearly which would be like PTown.

Puerto Vallarta.

I think the only way this will work, where we can all agree on one location, is to take over an unincorporated U.S. territory. I'm thinking one of the U.S. Virgin Islands. It would start as a seasonal destination, like Fire Island, but would gradually become THE gay island. Can you imagine? Visiting would be like a rite of passage, not unlike the Amish Rumspringa.

Actually, I just came across a bit of history indicating St. Thomas in particular used to be a "gay mecca" in the 60s-80s before a couple hurricanes and AIDS forced everyone out. It also seems St. Croix has a gay scene, particularly the neighborhood of "Judith's Fancy" near Christiansted, where Alexander Hamilton was born. Time to reclaim what's ours.

The Caribbean islands are almost all homophobic.

Wherever it is, I want to live on Dick Drive.

The last time this question came up, there was no consensus, but an awful lot of people agreed with the suggestion of Ojai, Ca., or Astoria, Or. Both small towns in lovely natural settings, both within 2 hours of a proper city.

Although Portland, Or. is hardly a "proper" city these days, is it.

How about Sacramento? We can cosy up to the governor...

Ojai? I don't understand the attraction. Nothing to do besides some mojo 'spirituality' nonsense. There are 2 main streets and lots of lemon trees.

Ojai? Oh hell no.

R93 and R95, I hasten to point out that Jaime Sommers, “The Bionic Woman,” is not real and doesn’t live in Ojai.

Why not somewhere more sparsely populated where we could easily become the majority, like the Falkland Islands or St. Helena?

The biggest issue would be ensuring relatively equal numbers of tops and bottoms. I could see war erupting if there were a top shortage.

How about somewhere that’s not California.

SC? bwaaaahaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I like to party in the Neighborhood of Make Believe. King Friday has the best anonymous sex and cocaine parties.

r94 Hot in the summer.

It must be by the sea, with a river near by and mountains in the rear. Heh I said rear. Best if we reach by a ferry or a causeway we can close off. Naturally the climate must be temperate year round so we can see bare flesh throughout the year.

R97, we ensure a fresh supply of vigorous tops by creating a world-class men's college with subsidized tuition for gifted young men. Each spring, we push out the old spent students. Every August, phalanxes of new college boy meat will come pouring into Gayland. Always horny. Always horny.

We will have to give of ourselves to make them feel welcome, but I expect everyone here is up to the challenge.

Wherever. Don't wanna live too close to other gays. I am ugly and will just get depressed when everyone rejects me...

Toledo, Ohio.

You will do better in Toledo.

Let's just take over someplace in the Nevada Dessert. Create a gay Las Vegas..okay a gayer Las Vegas. Legal gambling, legal prostitution, legal pot, all we need are need is to create a large body fo water and we are set.

r105 WT o ledo? No thanks - they can keep their poison algae blooms and lake waters filled with shit (and by shit I mean actual feces).

I personally think we need to leave the country, as it's only going down the shitter and won't come back for a long time, if ever. The Caribbean is by and large homophobic, but there are some bright spots. Particularly Curacao, a gay friendly island that is up and coming. Prices are low and the weather is beautiful all year round. I was there in February right before the pandemic really hit and it was amazing. Not overly crowded with tourists and the people were just lovely. There's lots of culture, great food and everything is accessible by an hour, two hour car ride tops. Worth considering planting our roots there and then trying to get citizenship. A Curacao passport will soon be more valuable than an American one.

If Nevada, then Virginia City is perfect! It s already kitschy with a Disney-Bonanza theme, has a population less than 1,000, close by Reno and only 3 and half hour drive to San Francisco.

R108 You were there and you think they have their own passports? They don't: Curacao is part of the Netherlands. The Netherlands don't make it easy to gain residency let alone citizenship by naturalization.

Being Dutch, it can cost you. Here's a partial list of the fees associated with living in and/or becoming a citizen of the Netherlands. It's a long list:

Curacao has like 150,000 people. That's less than a medium-sized city.

Virgina City it is then. we can rename it Cocktopia

Alexander Hamilton was born on Nevis, not St. Croix.

Maybe something further down the Cape away from Provincetown. Some times are still moderately affordable...Brewster, Dennis, Orleans, Yarmouth, north coast of Barnstable...all have a gay presence, wouldn't take much.

r91 You are missing the point of this thread. So what if the Caribbean is homophobic? Some island communities are small enough that it would take only a couple thousand gays to completely redefine the culture. This is why it's important to move in numbers. Attract the gays with some sort of festival, like Dinah Shore, and force the locals to accommodate. I'll go there and stake a rainbow flag in the sand myself if I must.

Puerto Rico and bring loudmouthed activism for your 51st state.

Just think; guaranteed weather drama, boats, beautiful people who won’t give you the time of day, and perhaps monkeys or seals. I’ll look that up.

‘Your uncle Phil died in the founding of the State of Puerto Rico. He choked on a dick, but that dick was attached to a legal voter.”

What we need is gay bars. We have Guerneville - if we can keep it alive. Beautiful,natural setting, near ocean and 2 hours to SF. Not obscenely expensive.

Thunder Bay!

R115 - umm...Puerto Rico has enough problems. It still hasn't recovered from those 2 hurricanes - and they had an earthquake a couple of weeks ago.

No to the Caribbean - those places are only good to visit for a week or so.

Intercourse, MO. It’s up to us to make the red turn blue.

R108 yes because it’s a Dutch passport.

R108 yes because it’s a Dutch passport.

There are six cities in the USA already named Gay. They are in Idaho, Michigan, North Carolina, Georgia, West Virginia and Oklahoma. Aren't they calling us?

R113, if we are to all move to Cape Cod, then shouldn't the landing place really be Gay Head?

There are Fruitlands in Maryland, New Mexico, Iowa and Florida

or there is Knob Lick, Missouri

De Queen, AR

Fancy Gap, VA

Guysville, OH

Manly, IA

Gayville, SD

Not the US - but this location may be suitable for many of you.

In the earlier days of Hudson, NY there were drug dealers on corners and most locally owned businesses shutting down because people feared Hudson. This was when the main street and shops were being revived by outsiders -- read LBGT.

Some crone wrote a letter published in the local newspaper about "that element" moving into Hudson. The next week someone else's letter excoriated her letter telling her she was "that element" who would abandon a beautiful small city and her neighbors' businesses because she's rather go out to the new Walmart to buy her granny panties for 99 cents.

Staunton, VA is the new Hudson at least for the Mid Atlantic region

Oh, R128, I hope it is better than Hudson. It's a dreadful little town. They tried to fix it. But so far, no cigar.

R129 I agree. The problem is there are a couple of streets south of Warren where houses sell for high prices. Union Street is called Queen's Boulevard. On the north side it's all public housing.

For a small city of 2 square miles, don't go out at night in the summer or you might be shot.

No straight women! Only butch ass dykes and their lipstick lesbian hoochies allowed.

Choose a place. Name it.

I am going along with Puerto Rico. New Pingaland.

R110 First off, there's a push for independence on the island, so the ties to the Netherlands may not last for much longer. If that doesn't happen, then if the US goes so far down the toilet that it becomes intolerable for our community to live here any longer, we can collectively make an asylum case to the Netherlands to gain citizenship in Curacao. Bringing money and the prospect of job creation to an island like that in big numbers could spur them to allow us to settle there. It's just an idea worth pursuing.

R133 there’s a plan. In time we might be able to take over Aruba and Bonaire too. EU citizenship might come in handy though in case there’s another pandemic.

Curacao, Aruba and Bonaire? It seems so greedy. Leave them for anyone lucky enough to escape from Venezuela.

I still think Detroit would be great for us to revitalize. Beautiful abandoned buildings that are cheap.

You go freeze your ass off in Detroit, R136.

Detroit is a great idea. A great city that needs to rise again.

Leave the Caribbean islands to their inhabitants. They don't want us.

R137 you do know theyve invented this thing called indoor heating ?

R134 as R111 pointed out, Curacao only has a population of 150,000. Aruba has a population of 100,000 and Bonaire has one of 20,000. If quarter of a million to half a million gay Americans were to resettle to these three islands, we'd be the majority of the population. Having those kind of numbers, it'd be harder for the Netherlands to say no to us settling there. Plus, considering much of the population who lives there is poor, they would appreciate the influx of wealth being brought onto the island. It's definitely an avenue a real estate minded gay should consider pursuing, because we might need it and it's the most accepting region of the Caribbean for our community. No anti-sodomy laws and gay marriage is strongly being considered on each island.

No way, R139. I was raised in the midwest. When the cold air comes down from Canada, everything is pure misery. Detroit is not a prime target for lake effect snowfall, but it is not immune from it, either.

So that's a 'no' on Detroit.

Another plus for Curacao: It's been a safe haven for Jews for 400 years.

All those places were always majorly straight. Gay people don't even make 20% of the population of San Francisco. And that's the gayest city in the world.

R23 Oh yes, a midwestern mecca Brotown with all the BBC one can take in any available hole or orifice.

R140 You are not native American are you? Or know American history or you would not make dumbass statements lhat espouse -

[Quote] If quarter of a million to half a million gay Americans were to resettle to these three islands, we'd be the majority of the population

Actually let's make that world history, not just American for here's another stupefying notion -

[Quote] the population who lives there is poor, they would appreciate the influx of wealth

SMH.

How about somewhere in Ecuador? They just passed gay marriage and right now they're one of the only place willing to take American refugees...

Ecuador doesn't want another colonialisation.

R145 And what's the alternative, exactly? Accept persecution here in the States as fascism reigns supreme? Please. We're not looking to slaughter off the native population (though hardly any of them are are actually native). We just want to establish a political majority so we can ensure that we have protection politically and economically. No one wants to be a minority that is persecuted. Plus, we'd bring jobs that pay a lot better than the ones that are currently on the islands. We're not the fucking Puritans. We can co-exist.

Highland Park, IL

R148 the alternative, nay the only solution, is to stay and improve some part of your own country. Don't go bothering other people in other countries simply because they are poor and you are rich and like their climate. Capisce?

R150 Yes, that's a great idea. That worked out so well for the Jews that tried that in Europe? *roll eyes*

That's also going to work out really well for the people who live in regions that will be inhospitable in 50-100 years time.

Or for those feeling war torn countries. The people of Syria should have stayed behind and tried to "reform" Assad. Do you realize how naive you sound?

I equate "cheap" with "poor" and "affordable," and I have no interest in living in any area or town that is proud of those attributes.

R142 Yes, predominantly black island for racist DataLoungers

Gah you Mary's are so dramatic. You just want another fire island pines where you can play naked and be oh so gay. Don't trivialize the Holocaust or the refugee crisis.

R156 This you?

[Quote] Don't go bothering other people in other countries simply because they are poor and you are rich and like their climate.

Also you.

[Quote] Choose a place. Name it. I am going along with [bold] Puerto Rico. [/bold]

Can I come too? I can be gay I think but I need to eat first.

R156 Please.You type like Billy Porter. At a certain point, people are just not going to listen to you.

[Quote] Can I come too? I can be gay I think

Then stop posting in a thread about gay people discussing where to move to if Trump's America becomes too inhospitable for our community to live in. You are not party to this discussion. Thank you.

I am Q in the LGBTQIA 😞

R148 I agree. There is a strong lobby for gay marriage on the islands and the islands are dependant on money from the Dutch State. Also they are indeed generally gay friendly in my experience. There is some real potential.

R160 could you blame anyone for not wanting to live in the ruins of Trump?

R163 Of course not, but our community will end up being one of the most persecuted. This isn't just about some gays fleeing to make a new Fire Island overseas. This is about saving our lives and our community. Ms. Billy Porter R158 can't seem to take her head out of a liberal arts college textbook on race to see that.

R164 alright maybe I’m an idealist. I do have hope though. The past few years have been good over here, that gave me hope. I’ll fight if I have to, don’t get me wrong.

[quote]Highland Park, IL

I think our impact would be stronger in Highwood, and it has better liquor laws.

How about we pick a place in cold weather without a beach.

Somewhere opium is legal

Nunavut

Let's follow King Juan Carlos into exile.

To the Dominican Republic?

[quote]Gay people don't even make 20% of the population of San Francisco. And that's the gayest city in the world.

Oh, honey -- not even close.

I think we need a place with a beach for this to work. Florida has all those little beach towns? It doesn’t matter what the people who live there now are like if we overwhelm the culture with gayness.

R173, Florida isn’t just filled with tacky people, it’s also filled with alligators and humidity.

True, so where do you think R174?

R175, Asheville, NC. It’s already liberal, it just needs even more gays.

Frostproof FL sheriff Grady Judd could protect the gays!

R75 ok go ahead and enjoy Mrytle Beach or something then. Bye.

Ogunquit, ME. Pretty gay town, but we need more.

Let Asbury Park and New Hope be your guide . . . and your warning.

OP, are you pretending to Make Gay Great Again in your little new ghetto? will non-white gays be allowed through the gates?

Siler City

The only good thing about Detroit is that it’s a major airline hub, making it easy to get the fuck out of there.

[quote] I think we need a place with a beach for this to work. Florida has all those little beach towns?

How about Flagler Beach, FL? It's a cute little beach town with boutique shops. And the name is, well...

Savannah, Georgia

It's absurd to push a city, any city, in a backward Southern state. The state laws will still control you and they won't be written to benefit you in any way. Pick a small state, align with the straight Democrats and take over the fucking place.

It's absurd to push a city, any city, in a backward Southern state. The state laws will still control you and they won't be written to benefit you in any way. Pick a small state, align with the straight Democrats and take over the fucking place.

Staunton VA is an interesting little town. Real potential. Great architecture, a lively main street with good restaurants, lots of gay flags everywhere and surrounded by beautiful mountains - yet only 2 hours to DC. Charlottesville is way too big and expensive now. Staunton seems like it’s ready for its moment - appears gentrification has already started but still relatively cheap.

Hah while we are sitting around wondering how to get the "bros" we don't even realize we beat their ass with their ultimate prize: women. They LOVE us and we don't even try or want them while they go crazy and spend time and money and we could have them with zero effort. I guess the joke is on them because, at the end of the day, people want that they can't have and we are just cooler.

R189 Except, the only reason women hang out with gay men, it's cause they know gay men don't want them. And you couldn't have them, cause then you would no longer be a gay man and they would no longer want to hang out with you

Um, how is this utopia supposed to be a going concern? All the new baby gays that straight America pumps out will come and join us? Or will we discriminate against the heterosexuals, despite wanting to have sex with "straight" guys?

Because unless you want to go the Andy/Anderson route (and then who knows what you'll get when the kid grows up?) you'll need someone to sell your fabulous place to when the Assisted Living Center beckons.

[quote] All the new baby gays that straight America pumps out will come and join us?

I think that's the idea.

I'm sitting here trying to imagine the social tensions that would arise, if hundreds of thousands of white gays descended on some Caribbean island and took over the economy and government. Given that there's already a native population there that is largely not white and is largely poor, and which is economically dependent on white tourists from other countries and resentful about that, and some of whom are taught homophobia by their religions...

Well, my brain is unequal to the task of imagining the racial and social tensions that would be in place after ten years.

I'll just say that if you think you can create a safe place to live by invading it and taking it over without the goodwill and cooperation of the people who already live there... look at Israel.

R190 - sure we could have them (assuming we would make an exception or be very drunk) and STILL prefer male partners. The fac that we don't is what makes us desirable and that "want what you can't have" isn't going away as long as we exist.

I really don't care if women think of me as an accessory. Think about it, they need us to look and feel better because their husbands are lackluster and as edgy as an old door knob.

In 1980, when I was 19, I would leave CT at 4 pm to drive 4 hours to get to Ptown. Then I’d depart for home about 6 pm on Sunday.

We need a new place that is as difficult to get to as that. It’s got to be cheap. The Pilgrims House had rooms for $9 then. They didn’t seem to clean them, but the entire room was painted yearly, including the lightbulbs. Most rentals did not have TVs; microwaves; air conditioners; private baths; or phones. They did have beds,

That’s what I’d recommend for a new place. Hard to get to, and cheap. Probably Puerto Rico. And in 40 years, PR will have the highest real estate in the country, mostly hardened against hurricanes.

R194 Yeah, that's not it.

R195 would have us all in Alaska.

Does New Hope even qualify as a gay destination anymore? There is just the Cub Room. The Cartwheel is long gone, the Raven is gone. Gotta be rich, rich, rich to live in Central Bucks county.

How about Santa Fe?

R199 - I suggested Northern Albuquerque. It's still a city with amenities. It's just a bid down on its heels - which is what gays are known for renovating.

Every other 'warmer' place has been taken or is in a Southern Republican religious stronghold.

Plus Sante Fe and Taos are nearby - but alas, no beach, which is a must have for some.

We had a recent thread on Santa Fe, and it sounded like it had already been thoroughly gentrified by the straights.

Taos not so much, but there are some people who like Taos just the way it is, so maybe we should keep our hands off.

We had a recent thread on Santa Fe, and it sounded like it had already been thoroughly gentrified by the straights.

Taos not so much, but there are some people who like Taos just the way it is, so maybe we should keep our hands off.

[quote]OP, are you pretending to Make Gay Great Again in your little new ghetto? will non-white gays be allowed through the gates?

R181 needs exactly what she's destined to get She's the serial homophobe racist here. .

The straights and yuppie breeders have completely destroyed Montrose here in Houston.

[quote] Portland, Maine.

[quote] Ogunquit, ME

Darling, the gays want places where you can take off your clothes. Not put on more.

I don’t want to be around those gays. R205. I’m too old.

Pish-posh, R206. You're never too old to enjoy beauty. Even if you have to enjoy it from more distance than you used to.

So, a place in America. But also not America-Trump. And it should not be in the South, but it must have weather warmer than in the North and be quickly accessible to people in the North.

But mainly, CHEAP!!!

[quote] And it should not be in the South, but it must have weather warmer than in the North

So the west coast?

We’d all have cool boats in Puerto Rico - and linen, but not pastels. It will be a state. And you will organize and put in the muscle needed to push through disaster preparedness and infrastructure funding. It’s part of good citizenship.

We’ll have lesbians and they get shit done. Plus, they’ll follow native Puerto Rican directives so we’re not stepping on toes.

R209 - Yes, I submit for consideration: California Central coast. Really not developed to any standard. Great weather, cheap housing relatively. A few hours to SF or LA.

Wineries, beaches, mountains, Big Sur to the North, Santa Barbara to the South, Sequoia National Forest to the East.

Great weather year round. The middle of CA needs another major CA city along the coast.

R211, that sounds lovely. Perfect climate and proximity to beaches and wineries.

R212 - thanks. Everybody else on this thread wants to end up in some homophobic Caribbean country or some hot and humid Southern state filled with Republican deplorables, bugs and hurricanes.

Or they want some Northern spot that's only good weather-wise 3 months out of the year. I don't get it.

Oh, I didn’t know we wanted a supportive living enclave. Jello at 8

And for the hard of hearing:

JELLO AT 8!

Pismo Beach - Central CA coast for your consideration. It needs some paint and some zhuzhing to be sure.

How about A Summer Place?

Make America Gay Again!

Pismo Beach sounds interesting but the name is pretty horrendous - I keep hearing abysmal beach.

[quote]So where can we move next, to live fun, freely, and cheap?

The old gay gentrification model has gone the way of gay bars. Articles in recent years about gentrification paint gays as its victims rather than its perpetrators; when it's in the news it's a case of gays being dispersed by financial pressures from a neighborhood in which they were an earlier generation of gentrifiers.

Gay cities? That's evolved into gay-friendly cities—meaning for tourists, or residents, or both. Look up "top gay cities" or permutations of and you find places like NYC, San Francisco, Tel Aviv, Paris, Amsterdam, Toronto, London, Milan, Rome, Lisbon, Auckland, Buenos Aires, Tokyo, Sydney, Bangkok, Guadalajara, Barcelona, Brighton, Berlin, Madrid...world cities with gay rights protections and/or ease of living, some measure of tourist draw, traction in travel media and marketing, and maybe significant gay history.

Amsterdam, NYC, San Francisco have gay rights protections, plenty of gays, and gay history, but gay things to do (outside of pride events)? They're really rather small town when it comes to gay things to do, illustrious gay histories notwithstanding. Chicago, for example, has a more interesting gay life in bars and clubs and a variety of things to do by day than any of these three, importantly both to tourists and residents. Gay life in London in there in numbers certainly, but in neighborhoods or parts of the city not much. Its old alternative core of watering holes and artsy or alternative places has dwindled to a few holdout corporate pubs and a weekly changing string of try-too-hard events in far-flung corners. There's no heart or center or even recognizable organs to the gay body of the city. Rome? Gorgeous place with a loads to do and comfortable to live there as a gay man but not an especially gay city at all. I would say only Brighton (on the small end of the scale), Berlin, and Madrid have some vibrancy in the sense of places where you see gays are a strong visual and political and social presence, where you can see that gays are a part of the city instead of just a percentage number of citizens, where their influence is felt and seen - more or less what I think the OP means..

Berlin and Madrid have gay neighborhoods and it's possible to live entirely within them I suppose, but that's not what you see. Instead it's gay people and straight people mixing much of the time and not some smaller part of the time. You can live on a gay street and work in a shop with a gay design sensibility and go for drinks and dinner with a mixed group of friends or with gay friends, but there's always a lot of intersection; it's not like the bizarre too gay for words little kitschy shops that used to be in the Castro or on Christopher Street with everything gay for a clientele that was only gay or gay-slumming. The gay near future for all but a tiny group of exceptions isn't about gay cities but about how gays live in cities (with straight people.)

It's not so much that we don't want to mingle with straight people, R219.

It's that we sometimes need a place of our own, like a retreat. Some place where we can feel completely safe to be ourselves. Where we can hold hands with our partner/spouse and not be stared at or worry about being bashed. A place where we can feel like it's our community.

Of course we can always blend in with straight people and live amongst them in this day and age.

But it's also nice to have a place where we can call our own, like The Castro in San Francisco, or the Village in New York, or Provincetown.

These places used to be traditionally gay communities, and they've all been invaded by straight people, because they liked what we built there. So now, they've become de-gayed.

That's why we have to find someplace else, basically to run away from them. Another place we can call our own.

However, it's becoming much more difficult to do nowdays, because there really is nowhere else to go, that isn't ridiculously expensive.

[quote]how gays live in cities (with straight people.)

Well, thus it has ever been.

Not the point of this thread, one thinks.

[quote] it's becoming much more difficult to do nowdays, because there really is nowhere else to go, that isn't ridiculously expensive.

That's another thing.

The reason many gay people moved to The Castro, NY's Village, and Provincetown, was because they were cheap and run down. In the past, many gay people didn't have a lot of money, and had to live in what came to be known as "gay ghettos."

However, we made it nice. As Dorinda Medley would say. We took these shabby and run down areas, and turned them into vibrant and exciting communities.

We could easily do the same today.

I read threads on places like Syracuse or Detroit, and think that we could easily take those places and revitalize them. However, it has to be a concerted effort, where we get the word out and move there en masse. Otherwise, it won't work.

Gays are indigenous to every place on earth, so we have the right to take over every place on earth by every means necessary, even the use of force.

Israel is justified in doing whatever it has to do to protect the national sovereignty of the Jewish people, and a gay nation would be no less justified for the same reasons. I have no moral qualms about displacing anti-gay bigots. In the immortal words of Joan Rivers, “they deserve it.”

Funny how you are talking about straights like they are another minority group. They make more than 90% of the population. No city will ever be majorly gay. Even in San Francisco, gays were/are a minority.

Gays are the only people not responsible for San Francisco turning to shit.

[quote] Even in San Francisco, gays were/are a minority

And yet just listen to the way that homophobes and right wingers used to trash San Francisco for being SO GAY.

The way they talk, you'd think that the entire city was full of homosexuals.

But that's the point to them, isn't it? Even a few gays is TOO MANY gays.

This is why we need our own place. To get the fuck away from those assholes.

I wish San Francisco was nothing but homosexuals and you would, too, after you see what everyone else has done to it.

Okay, so the Winter weather sucks in the upper Rust Belt. But come on, Detroit and Toledo are just sitting there, waiting for you. Some rust belt places are sitting there, waiting for you, full of old architecture and run down areas just perfect for revitalization.

R228, the Great Lakes region is one big Superfund of waste dumps and your garden soil always tests positive for lead (it’s still blowing around from the gas). We misplace WWII era nuclear experiment material and we are shitty as fuck to the weak, people of color, and Robert.

I swear the pollution makes people fat, red, and prone to temper tantrums. And, if you’re a white straight guy, you now own a pair of nylon cullotte shorts, but you have half-butt and love handles. So many fat fat fat folk.

[quote]So many fat fat fat folk.

Then Gaytopia or whatever it ends up being called can have federally funded fat farms.

Detroit and Toledo are dumps. Dumps with awful weather. And they are isolated, miles away from civilization.

Even the winters in Troy and Albany are not as bad as Detroit and Toledo. And the architecture is better. Plus, it's 150 miles from NYC, 150 miles from Boston, and 250 from Montreal. Plus, the surrounding countryside for miles and miles in every direction is gorgeous.

Do not kid yourself about the glories of northern Ohio and Michigan. There are damned few. Flat, boring, and unattractive.

What about Africa?

Agreed, R231. Troy and Albany (and vicinity) have some amazing architecture and opportunity for a renaissance for the reasons you note and more.

Western New York once had great architecture but in many places its substantially lost and the cities lost to drug rehabilitation facilities, correctional and detention centers, unemployment centers, and the gamut of social services facilities for busted and blown out cities. Buffalo has amazing architecture and the city survives relatively intact and ripe with opportunity, but climate makes it one of the most miserable places in the country. But a 3-bedroom renovated house in a nice central neighborhood will cost the better part of a half-million without getting too fancy about things, cheap for some not for others (example at link.)

Detroit is hugely overhyped. It's unique historical development as a series of factory towns within a sprawling city means there's no good part of town really, with a few nice exceptions in places like Indian Village. Factor owners lived in mansions surrounded by concentric circles of upper middle class management, middle class managers, and factory workers so that you're always driving through shitty neighborhoods to get to some place nicer on the other side. The least of those neighborhoods that once had the most houses have been abandoned and/or bulldozed leaving scars that will be there forever as the population and economy fell. The visions that everyone has of finding a grand, five-, six, seven-bedroom 19th or early 20th C house can come true, but starting at 600k, 700k, 800k, more expensive than a comparable house in cities you might actually want to live in...and all ringed by miles of shitty little tumbledown, burned out houses for which there will never be a renaissance big enough to buy a tiny $5000 with a $40,000 tax bill due and space enough to stand in the front door and piss out the back. The old train station and some of the skyscrapers are spectacular, but they're in Detroit, and there's no real reason to be there. There are better places that cost less, are more comfortable places to love, and have more to offer.

[quote]Camp Pendleton and we can turn it into a gay paradise

Isn't it already?

R231 How is Detroit miles away from civilization, when Michigan it's 10th state in the US by population, and Detroit is 24th city? And it's right between Toronto and Chicago, two of the biggest cities in North America. You don't know what civilization means.

[quote]How is Detroit miles away from civilization, when Michigan it's 10th state in the US by population, and Detroit is 24th city? And it's right between Toronto and Chicago, two of the biggest cities in North America. You don't know what civilization means.

You are an American if you jump in a car and drive 4 to 5 hours to Toronto or Chicago when you get an itch, the equivalent of driving from Amsterdam to Paris, or Zurich to Milan. And don't forget that Akron is a mere three hours drive, and the cultural hubs of Ann Arbor, Toledo, and Lansing all just under two hours drive away. Is there a more ideal situation?

some gay people really hate cold weather

Hypothermia just isn't my thing.

R226 An itch for what? Straight people? I thought the whole idea was to move away from straight people and be isolated and now your are complaining how it is too far from civilization, like Michigan is Sahara and not one of the most densely populated places in America

R215 Pismo Beach is wonderful. My parents took us there every summer on our way up to Big Sur from LA.

However, alas, most of us could not nor will ever be able to afford PB.

Average home price is $850,000.

EVERY beach town along the coast is expensive. Except for Pelican Bay, which is full of corrections officers and the criminally-minded families of inmates serving multiple life sentences at the Supermax there.

Stop trying to make Detroit happen. Or Buffalo. It needs a fucking lot more than 'paint'. Detroit is a slum with horrible infrastructure and shitty weather. Buffalo is isolated, cold AF, and has some of the highest snowfall amounts in all of the US.

R240 - we could take over Grover Beach (just South of Pismo beach) instead, much cheaper.

And yes, some of us want to live 12 months out of the year - not spend a third or half of it indoors waiting for good weather to happen.

I worked for 3 months (on a contract) in Buffalo in winter. It was so awful, between the snow blizzards and the "lake effect" winds.

I would never put myself through another Buffalo winter no matter what I was paid.

I’m not shoveling snow.

You guys are such queens. You will never have your own place with this kind of attitude

r240 If you're going as far as Pelican Bay, might as well go a few miles farther to Oregon. No sales tax there.

Isn't northern California cold as well?

And damp.

R244 - I don't see where you've added any places or ideas. Stop criticizing if you're not adding to the discussion.

And sorry that people are not enamored with places that have very cold and very snowy winters. We've had central air for close to 50 years now - no reason why we can't be someplace warm.

I think North Carolina is the way to go. Warm but not outrageously hot. Mild winters. And it's turning blue.

Another vote for Asheville. But both Carolinas are in the South. And it has the largest slave port in history in Charleston. That legacy lingers.

Another vote for Asheville. But both Carolinas are in the South. And it has the largest slave port in history in Charleston. That legacy lingers.

But it still has sailors so don't rule it out.

I think we really need to rule out the Deep South, even if we carve our own little enclave within it, there's still the problem of corrupt and anti-gay conservative state governments, and the fact that we'd be surrounded by a sea of people who hate and despise us. If you really like having a full-time bunker mentality, by all means, take over a small town in the Deep South!

No, the Oregon Coast came up the last time we discussed this subject, and I think it's ripe for a gay invasion. It's dotted with pretty little towns in stunning natural settings, which are poor and with no jobs aside from catering to tourists driving the coast highway and better-off retirees from elsewhere. They're shabby little places inhabited by resentful people who have opiate-fueled dreams of Getting Out, and if we ever wanted to make a secret enclave far from everything, we should pick one of those little towns. A few thousand or even a few hundred little inhabitants and we'd control the local government, we'd tart up the place and it'd become *the* place to stpp or stay when you drove the coast highway, we'd create jobs and make the town much richer than the neighbors, so maybe resentment from the locals would be kept to a low simmer. The ones at the north end of the coast are 2-4 hours from Portland if you ever need some city time, places like Astoria, Cannon Beach, or Tillamook should be under consideration.

I think we really need to rule out the Deep South, even if we carve our own little enclave within it, there's still the problem of corrupt and anti-gay conservative state governments, and the fact that we'd be surrounded by a sea of people who hate and despise us. If you really like having a full-time bunker mentality, by all means, take over a small town in the Deep South!

No, the Oregon Coast came up the last time we discussed this subject, and I think it's ripe for a gay invasion. It's dotted with pretty little towns in stunning natural settings, which are poor and with no jobs aside from catering to tourists driving the coast highway and better-off retirees from elsewhere. They're shabby little places inhabited by resentful people who have opiate-fueled dreams of Getting Out, and if we ever wanted to make a secret enclave far from everything, we should pick one of those little towns. A few thousand or even a few hundred little inhabitants and we'd control the local government, we'd tart up the place and it'd become *the* place to stpp or stay when you drove the coast highway, we'd create jobs and make the town much richer than the neighbors, so maybe resentment from the locals would be kept to a low simmer. The ones at the north end of the coast are 2-4 hours from Portland if you ever need some city time, places like Astoria, Cannon Beach, or Tillamook should be under consideration.

R254 - that pic is gorgeous, where is that?

The overdue Cascade earthquake and tsunami would be a hard no for me for any WA or OR coastline. Plus the weather isn't that great.

R255, I believe that's a picture of Tillamook, Or., or at least that's what I asked google for. Tillamook has a population of 5,000-odd, so even a few hundred gays moving into town would mean a big voice in the local politics, not to mention having an economic impact. There's also a road that leads from Tillamook to Portland, google says it's about a 90 minute drive through the Coast Range.

The towns on the Oregon coast all have lovely natural settings, on beaches or bays or rivers widening out as they reach the sea, with hills available for those who are afraid of tsinamis. And I myself love the sort of cool foggy climate with a definite winter, although others find it depressing. Here's lovely Pacific City, Or., population 1,000-odd.

R255, I believe that's a picture of Tillamook, Or., or at least that's what I asked google for. Tillamook has a population of 5,000-odd, so even a few hundred gays moving into town would mean a big voice in the local politics, not to mention having an economic impact. There's also a road that leads from Tillamook to Portland, google says it's about a 90 minute drive through the Coast Range.

The towns on the Oregon coast all have lovely natural settings, on beaches or bays or rivers widening out as they reach the sea, with hills available for those who are afraid of tsinamis. And I myself love the sort of cool foggy climate with a definite winter, although others find it depressing. Here's lovely Pacific City, Or., population 1,000-odd.

I like R231's nomination of Troy NY. Troy, Albany, and posher Saratoga Springs all have good housing stock; Troy is a bargain and has some of the houses with the most character.

Troy has an attractive downtown, opportunities for above the shop/studio living, and there are lots of architecturally interesting small towns around.

3.5 hours by bus or train to NYC, an hour less by car; and an extra half hour to Boston.

Here's one of the most expensive houses in Troy

Troy's poverty rate is about 25 %. What that means is 25 % of the population is living on less than $20,000/year.

A true rust belt hell.

Unless we go in there with millions of dollars to help the residents get out of brutal poverty, I would forget about Troy.

Oy and the winters.

I used to live in upstate New York. More racist and homophobic than the Deep South. Hard pass.

Mykonos is too expensive but there are other Greek Islands that are hardly used.

If you rule out South that only leaves you with California and the desert states and California. And since desert states are too deserty for you and North California is too cold for you, that only leaves you with South California.

I'd much rather have a place on a Greek island than in the U.S., say this one in Ermoupoli, Syros, where there are many interesting, old houses and cheap.

If you want to make it a ground-up social experiment rather than gradual infiltration, buy an abandoned town in Italy or Spain.

Or this one in Sifnos

If country music yokels can take a shithole mountain town like Branson, and turn it into a country music "Mecca," then we can find anywhere in the U.S. and turn it into something 10x more fabulous.

We just have to decide on a place.

Tillamook. Right.

[quote]If country music yokels can take a shithole mountain town like Branson, and turn it into a country music "Mecca,"

They are most gullible people alive, voting for Trump, waving the "USA We're Number 1!" flags, buying millions of "Big Mouth Billy Bass" ("'Cause, damn, you see that thing Ricky up there at the garage had on his wall, he had this goddamn big mouth bass that talked to ya, said all kinds of shit, and wagged around on its mount! Damn! I need me one of them!")

Gays are not so easily herded into a weekend with Yakov Smirnoff.

NC has NOTHING to do with SC!!!

You damn yankees get that straight!

[quote] NC has NOTHING to do with SC!!!

North Deplorableville vs. South Deplorableville.

What's the difference?

There was a really great episode of The Bad Gays podcast that discussed the Stonewall Colony - an attempt to make a separatist gay nation in rural California in the 1970s.

North Carolina has twice the population of South Carolina. That's the difference. It would be exceedingly more difficult to build an effective voting block in North Carolina.

If we have a strong representation in the state legislature, we can write our own fucking laws and the rednecks can go suck it. Going to North Carolina instead of South Carolina makes that much, much, more difficult to accomplish.

R263 - yes, exactly. There are two undeveloped areas mentioned - Central California coast and New Mexico.

I'm not setting foot into any former Confederate state. The stupid is strong there.

The TQ+ (which a lot of them is hetero) freaks are colonizing the gay spaces as well.

Ft. Myers Beach Florida. Close to an airport with a lot of non-stop flights, beautiful beaches. It's a bit rundown, some nicer condos on the beach. It's inexpensive, no state income tax, some nice spots for evening sex on the beach and state park nearby with many opportunities for nude sunbathing.

Ft Myers is a good idea!

I have to laugh at all the pussies who are rejecting any place that has 4 seasons because “it’s too cold in the winter.”🙄 Not all of us want to live in a hot and humid shithole in the south.

So it looks like this thread has proven there's no way we'll ever unanimously decide on a single location. Plenty of good ideas but the sea islands of South Carolina and Savannah win. Appreciate all the other suggestions though.

Can someone start a new thread for how we execute the mass exodus? That's the real challenge.

Ft. Myers is a shithole. FM Beach is a low-rent, trailer-park type of shithole even if they did build condos. Nearby Cape Coral is worse - it’s meth central over there.

Not only is it in redneck Red State Florida, it’s in Lee fucking county with - unless it’s been toppled - a statue of the General astride Traveller in front of the county courthouse downtown.

Also, Sanibel is on the other side of the bridge and they’d close it before they let us in. And it’d cost too much to buy them out. CIA retirees run the place.

[quote]If country music yokels can take a shithole mountain town like Branson, and turn it into a country music "Mecca," then we can find anywhere in the U.S. and turn it into something 10x more fabulous. We just have to decide on a place.

Mecca is probably the only place less gay-friendly.

I love how all you damn Yankees keep screaming about the South being Redneck and Racist - take a look around your own states - they are the same way outside of the cities. So shut your damn traps.

R277 - Who said anything about hot and humid? There were plenty of suggestions where it is warm and NOT humid.

R281 - please - you always chime in on this stuff. "Some of the most racist people I've ever met have been from the North" and other nonsense. It's nowhere near similar - and you know it.

R281... go eat a hush puppy.

R279- Wilton Manors, Provincetown and Key West are/were also shitholes. We're talking about potential to become a new gay place. Ft Myers Beach has beach, low cost, and is easily accessible. Cheap flights in and out make it desirable as a weekend getaway or full time home.

Of all the places in the world - even Florida - that we ended up in Wilting Manors is a crime. Ugliest crappiest city - even by FL standards. But I love the nightlife for eldergays - that part is perfect. Just wish we could pick it up and move somewhere prettier..

Have you ever been to Ft Myers Beach, R284?

I can think of fewer places with the potential to become a new gay place.

Beyond which, the state is a non-starter: nothing you did there couldn't be undone by the legislature or the governor.

We need more than a beach and fried dough stands.

How about Appalachia?

Ft. Myers Beach doesn't seem the wet dream of tasteful friends. For $625K you get a swimming pool, a dubious semi-freestanding arcade, and an 1169sf open plan dental surgery (vertical blinds convey!)

Fort Myers Beach is in FLORIDA and that is a corrupt state with an enormous population. There are not enough homos in the entire U.S. of A. to make gay people safe from the GOP politicians that have a very strong grip on power in Florida.

Some of you girls need to grow up. Our lives are about more than a sun tan.

[quote]How about Appalachia?

Only if we start a movement to pronounce it "appa-lah-CHEE-ah."

A house like the one pictured will have at least a $1200-1500 annual flood insurance bill tacked on to your mortgage costs as 1: it's required if you have a mortgage, and 2: you'd be stupid not to buy it, despite the limits, even if you didn't have a mortgage because the city is in what's known as a Special Flood Hazard Area, aka a FEMA Flood Zone. The flood insurance premium will be in addition to those for homeowners (a guess? about $2500/yr) insurance and, again if you're not dumb, you'll need additional coverage for wind damage as well. In fact, you should have umbrella coverage in Florida, because the insurors will find a way to screw you out of the cost of repairs or replacement no matter what your policy limits are. When the bills stop coming, you'll find the insurance premiums on a house like this will cost about $5000 a year to be as close to covered for replacement costs as you can buy.

The required flood insurance coverage can only be written for amounts up to $250,000 for damage to the structure (and it costs more if you have a basement) and up to $100,000 for contents. Those are vacation home costs, as the example on Estero Boulevard (it's a year-round home) makes clear and meaning that in the event of flooding - not that unlikely given that Ft. Myers Beach has an elevation of three feet (one meter) above sea level - you couldn't insure it completely.

Just to give you an idea of the questionable approaches to the truth in Florida, the house shown is listed variously as "on the beach" or "across the street from the beach." It's not. It's on the land side of Estero Boulevard and there's another house across the street from it that IS on the beach, blocking this home's view. Not that a hurricane would care, but I would because Ft. Myers Beach has an elevation of three feet (one meter) above sea level.

Remember Mexico Beach?

That link at R287 is not at all what I expected of a page that was titled, "Queer Appalachia."

Related DL thread, R292

the Appalachia troll is trying to get people riled up; I wouldn't fall for it

The Appalachia Troll?

Oh, my stars!

I know a place !!!

How about Chico, California?

I just like the name.

In terms of climate and natural disasters, the northeast has noreasters, ice storms, snow storms, and the occasional hurricane. The Southeast has hurricanes and tropical storms, horrific long hot and humid summers, the intrusions of tropical diseases spread by mosquitoes, the midwest has horrible winters (cold, snowy, windy), horrible summers (hot, humid, stormy) and the entire length of the West Coast from Seattle to San Diego is susceptible to earthquakes as well as damaging winter rain storms, and the risk of devastating fires during the summer. Either gay people would have to agree to choose their poisons, or we'd have to look inland in the west, where the risk of earthquakes drops off. In the Southwest, you'd have to look at higher elevations to get away from the scorching summer heat, but not too high, or you run into really cold and snowy winters (Flagstaff would be an example of that). So Albuquerque is not a bad suggestion. Bisbee and Prescott in Arizona would be livable. Sedona is too expensive already. Boise and Reno have winters, but not terribly snowy ones. Utah is a lost cause because of the Mormons. I can't get very excited about the Central Valley of California. Maybe we could take over Marfa, Texas, but now we're really talking about geographic isolation.....plus......Texas.

Pittsboro NC

"A new place" for the gays should have some sort of draw to it, some sense of place that attracts people.

A consensus on a place least undesirable will never work. Throw out the spreadsheets and laundry lists of reasons not to, and pick a place that's compelling.

Other cities that became gay destinations and gay meccas didn't happen by committee or spreadsheets of distances to hub airports.

The discussion of Florida just serves to remind me that the disparity between this shithole state and the larger U.S. doesn't exist any longer. The nation has caught up to Florida.

Modern sisters have only themselves to blame for the stinkfish invasia. The strange modern 'fish-friendly' attitudes of many sisters has caused the problem.

In our day fish (aka str8 females) and sisters were mortal enemies, fish were NOT welcome in sister gathering spots or neighborhoods. So please return to the normal world of loving men and hating fish.

"How about Chico, California? "

Soul-sapping hot for 2/3 of the year, isolated, flat, boring, conservative, surrounded by Deplorable nothing. Two hours to the nearest city, and that city is Sacramento. Chico itself is comparatively cheap and isn't ugly, but it's a nothing of a town chiefly noted for its "party school" Chico state and trashy student body, and a surprisingly high crime rate considering its size and isolation. And while it may feel like a boring small town, it actually has nearly 100,000 inhabitants, so it'd be hard to build up enough of a gay population to have a political voice.

Paradise is a few miles up the hills from Chico, and is smaller and more attractive. But it burned to the ground a couple of years ago, and is still being rebuilt.

[quote] Paradise is a few miles up the hills from Chico, and is smaller and more attractive. But it burned to the ground a couple of years ago, and is still being rebuilt.

Isn't that what we want, a place to rebuild as gay heaven? And the name is perfect! I can see it spelled out in sparkly rhinestones like Family Affair.

Isn't all of this missing the point?

If you build it (that is, a nice, colorful, trendy gay-centric place) they will come. All of 'em: not just the gays. First it'll be the "allies." And because gay businesses will welcome them, soon they'll be followed by the day-trippers who will like the scene we create. They'll welcome them, too. Then it'll be the casual tourists, there to watch, like they do the animals in the zoo. Provincetown and Key West are perfect examples. "Gay" here too often is synonymous with "gay male." Are we barring or welcoming lesbians? I think to do so, you'll see some understandable disagreements. If you don't, you'll have more understandable disagreements.

If you build it in Arizona - the place that just barely did not again elect 88 year old Joe Arpaio as a sheriff. It's a state filled with elderly retirees who vote Republican. You all seem to miss the fact that cities are in states and states, when they're run by Republicans, can and will do everything they legally and illegally can to harass and undermine anything gays do, even if what they're doing means economic success for an area.

If you build it in New Mexico, you have the advantage of Democrats usually running the legislature and the state, but what have they accomplished there? You'll be living in one of the poorest, unhealthiest states in the US, one with shitty social services and lots and lots of crime and poverty. And, like a lot of rural American, shitty broadband, making it hard to live there and support yourself with remote work. There's already a gay community in New Mexico, "Birds of a Feather," (link below) one started in 1999. Any idea how many gays have found this the ideal place to live in the twenty-odd years since? Eleven people have built homes there, about a dozen more appear to have bought lots on which to build. Starting from scratch ain't easy.

The whole premise is flawed. We wanted legal equality. We've got it. Now we have to fight to make it work, not retreat to some fantasyland which, like most utopias, go bust after a couple of years when the inevitable squabbling begins. Discrimination meant segregation. Now that the bars are all closed or closing you can hardly blame discrimination, perhaps because the people who used to go to gay spaces don't feel the need to go to them any more.

Spontaneous groups of gays are not demanding and opening gay bars these days. What makes anyone think they'll give up their jobs, homes, friends and families to move to somewhere godforsaken to live they'll have to build for themselves?

r302 If you want a college town in northern California, Davis would be a better fit. Closer to a major city (although still Sacramento) but less than two hours to SF or Tahoe. Very liberal. Home to a respected university--not a party school. Smaller than Chico. It does get hot in the summer, though.

r303 is my spirit animal

Davis is a cow town surrounded by agriculture.

What about Corfu?

I'd go for Corfu, R307.

This one, for example, needs some cosmetic improvements, but it's not a bad space—and it has something rather spectacular going for it.

Are you talking about Corfu in the Mediterranean?

Is there actually a Corfu in the U.S.? I've never heard of it.

Poultney, Vermont

Your chance to but a $20M college campus for a few million.

And if this part of Vermont doesn't appeal, the Vivid crystal ball says that other campuses will be falling to the same fate.

Let's wait for Pepperdine in Malibu to come on the market.

Corfu is where Prince Philip was born and baptised, and from where he evacuated in a cot made of a fruit box, so it has impeccable credentials.

I don’t think you want this mouth speaking Carfusian.

If I had $3 million just burning a hole in my pocket...I’d buy this B&B in Taos & move into one of the casitas with kitchen.

I know nothing about running a B&B, so I’d bring in my brother (who has years of management experience in hospitality/catering) to run daily ops.

OR...I could turn it into an exclusive little LGBQ retirement community. (no Ernas allowed)

I live in Davis, Ca., and I love the place, but it's already too expensive for anyone who isn't selling a house in Sillicon Valley and retiring on the proceeds. The Sacramentans have discovered that it's a nice place to live and a short commute away, so there was a huge housing shortage and real estate prices were soaring. At least until the pandemic hit.

Paradise, Ca., is a much better idea. Before it burned to the ground a couple of years ago it was an attractive little town set in pine woods, then there was a horrific fire and it's still being rebuilt. Lots of people moved out permanently and I suppose there's a danger that the place will be taken over by the methyl element you get in the far reaches of California, an influx of gays might be what the town needs the most. Especially an influx of eldergays, those who've lived through enough bad times to appreciate the value of making the town safe. Still, it's a long, long way from anything else.

R314, that's really lovely, and a stunning setting.

Sure some of the furnishings and textiles, and definitely the kitschy accessories are not up to the quality of the setting or the architecture but that's an easy fix depending on how you use it. It would be for either of your schemes.

Wonderful place.

*would be great for either

R314, you don't need $3M, you just need 10% down and a good business plan to show to the bank that you can make the monthly mortgage payments. If you think you and your brother can make it profitable, go for it!

Paradise used to be an extreme right-wing shithole.

Yes, R318, thank you, I am aware. But did you see the part where I said “if I had 3m to burn”? II don’t want a mortgage.

There's a huge difference between NC and SC. NC has a much larger population than SC, but it's at the tipping point of going blue. In SC it's solid red and filled with religious nuts. NC has Asheville, Durham, Raleigh, Greensboro Charlotte and Chapel Hill which are reliably blue areas. There are deplorables in NC, just like in NY, NJ and other northern states outside the cities, but with the ongoing influx of Northerners it will be blue long before the rest of the Southern states. In fact NC had a blue legislature from the 1890's until 2010. So the Northerners can keep talking out of their uninformed asses. ( Christie, Pataki, Kean, Whitman, Rockefeller, etc)

Really? Cherry Grove and the Pines are overrun with hets? I haven't been to Fire Island in a while but I doubt it.

Btw, I'm not reading the 320 previous posts to see if someone has already made a similar point.

[quote]If I had $3 million just burning a hole in my pocket...I’d buy this B&B in Taos

A young man just died of bubonic plague in New Mexico. It's an unsafe state.

Canary Islands.

Seriously warm year round, plenty of places to build a resort. Would get a great mix of EU and US so both the intact and mutilated crowd would be happy.

And plenty of Spanish guys walking around naked in the beaches.

"A young man just died of bubonic plague in New Mexico. It's an unsafe state. "

So you wanna stay safe in New York, where a hundred thousand people just died of COVID?

Covid will go away. Bubonic plague is forever.

There are antibiotics for the plague, you’d be cured sooner from the plague than from Covid

Well, the young man did die. I guess he didn't recognise the symptoms quickly enough. Beware of states with plague-bearing rodents.

Covid is no big deal. Putin has a vaccine.

[post redacted because independent.co.uk thinks that links to their ridiculous rag are a bad thing. Somebody might want to tell them how the internet works. Or not. We don't really care. They do suck though. Our advice is that you should not click on the link and whatever you do, don't read their truly terrible articles.]

American gays will never move to the Canary Islands.

It MUST be an American location.

R331, you're mostly right on the first point and right on the second only in relation to Americans.

I won't invest in, move to, or likely visit any place in the U.S., so for me it MUST NOT be an American location.

R321 you do not have to move there, just vacation.

"Covid will go away. Bubonic plague is forever."

Sadly, Covid won't go away. It has an animal reservoir and is a zoonotic illness.

Polio and smallpox were eradicated with vaccines as there are no animal reservoirs.

Covid has a large animal reservoir, and with continued destruction of animal habitats, it can continue to "spillover" into humans in various mutated forms.

Sorry, wrong thread.

But we shouldn't relocate to places with a lot of bats, that is for sure.

-R334

R330 would move to Scotland in a heartbeat. It truly is the most beautiful place.

R336 Since the current population of that place is 30, it wouldn't take much for us to dominate. However, they probably wouldn't be too welcoming to "our kind."

R337 I think they would mind their own business if we wouldn’t live in their “village”. I suspect most of the current population is elderly anyway, (former) farmers

We should also make a movie of this, and all the hijinks. But without Jesse Tyler Ferguson, please.

R339 the closeted actors so they at least can feel free for a brief period of time. Who knows it might convince them to come out after the premiere

How about Mt. Shasta, Ca.? The town, not the mountain, the town is on the toes of the mountain off of I5. It's a pretty little town of 3,000-odd, it's cheap by California standards (median home price is 240,000 or so), enough tourist trade to support shops, restaurants, and B&Bs (pandemics excepted). Set in pine woods with stunning views of the mountain, if you're one of the ones that want a nice place that's far from anywhere and small enough that an influx of gays could have a strong voice in local government, well, there aren't many places in California that could qualify,

It's out there in Deplorable country, but then, all small places that are a long way from everyone are. But Mt. Shasta seems to be inhabited by a good number of New Age types and hippies, people who don't tend to have any issues with gays. That's rare for small isolated towns, homophobia is rampant out there in the sticks.

How about Mt. Shasta, Ca.? The town, not the mountain, the town is on the toes of the mountain off of I5. It's a pretty little town of 3,000-odd, it's cheap by California standards (median home price is 240,000 or so), enough tourist trade to support shops, restaurants, and B&Bs (pandemics excepted). Set in pine woods with stunning views of the mountain, if you're one of the ones that want a nice place that's far from anywhere and small enough that an influx of gays could have a strong voice in local government, well, there aren't many places in California that could qualify,

It's out there in Deplorable country, but then, all small places that are a long way from everyone are. But Mt. Shasta seems to be inhabited by a good number of New Age types and hippies, people who don't tend to have any issues with gays. That's rare for small isolated towns, homophobia is rampant out there in the sticks.

Anywhere we go, women will follow. They have some strange fascination with us. You can't imagine the amount of times I go out and women who don't know me flirt and make eyes. Maybe the man on man action produces some extra pheromones or something that draws them in....fuck knows. My friend is a yoga instructor and the women at the gym flock to his classes more than to those taught by women.

Mt. Shasta is gonna blow, like Mt. Saint Helens.

Not a good choice.

R343 it sounds like maybe straight women are attracted to men. Strange concept, I know

Indeed R345 and they don’t always have a good gaydar

Indeed R345 and they don’t always have a good gaydar

R346 - ok, my friend is openly gay and married and has adopted 2 years ago. It's probably intriguing for the frauen. That said, he did say they threw a shower for him and all so it isn't all bad but, for me, if I go in the club to looking for ass and start making out with someone I don't want a bunch of women there. Just feels weird. I don't care if they come to a gay friendly outdoor cafe here in Romania and don't bother me and hang out in their own groups trying to be edgy...normal 20 year olds...but there are places we wanna be alone.

R346 - ok, my friend is openly gay and married and has adopted 2 years ago. It's probably intriguing for the frauen. That said, he did say they threw a shower for him and all so it isn't all bad but, for me, if I go in the club to looking for ass and start making out with someone I don't want a bunch of women there. Just feels weird. I don't care if they come to a gay friendly outdoor cafe here in Romania and don't bother me and hang out in their own groups trying to be edgy...normal 20 year olds...but there are places we wanna be alone.

R349 I understand what you mean though I don’t care. I just want everyone to be tolerant. I wouldn’t want to live in a place where there are only heteros but in the modern west that is never the case. I’m ok with diversity.

R349 I understand what you mean though I don’t care. I just want everyone to be tolerant. I wouldn’t want to live in a place where there are only heteros but in the modern west that is never the case. I’m ok with diversity.

[quote] Mt. Shasta is gonna blow.....

That will be a big attraction.

Why don't we just re-claim Manhattan?

It seems like all the rich cunts, and mommy-yoga-fraus, taking little Mykenzee and Madysyn with them. Thank all fuck!

Now that we're rid of trend-sucking bland trash, we can take over their abandoned and tastefully redecorated homes, complete with the HGTV "open-concept, granite counters, and white kitchens."

I say good riddance to them! Time for us to take it all back. Hello, New York!

R353 "Mykenzee and Madysyn" type names are not common in NYC. Those names are popular amongst the flyover states and with Mormons.

In Manhattan on the UES you will find private school classes full of kids named Olivia, Charlotte, Edmond, Jacob, Leighton, Camilla, Cece, Georgina, Phillip, Graham and so on.

R353 - I am not averse to the yoga moms since they are usually libs and vote in our favor vs the flyover Karens. I don't really have an issue with them, but I do want my space as a gay man to be with other men.

"...but I do want my space as a gay man to be with other men. "

May I recommend Mount Athos in Greece? The Athos peninsula is one of the few places on Earth that has an all-male population! Of course, to be able to live there you have to become a Greek Orthodox monk and live in a cave or something, but you can't be picky if you want to life someplace without women or with few women - even The Castro in its heyday had lesbians and made them welcome.

Seriously, can we limit our search for the perfect place to feasible options? Nobody gets to pick their neighbors, or to forbid a person the right to live someplace on the basis of sex, orientation, race, politics, presentability, etc.

In the early ‘80s, the straights in Ptown weren’t necessarily friendly to the Gays.

A lot of the Gay waiters there said they worked in St. Thomas in the Winter. How Gay is St. Thomas now?

I’m still in favor of Puerto Rico, unless St. Thomas already has a head start,. I can’t say where in PR. It’s a big island. But if a Gay community developed, it would improve the infrastructure and thrive. Remember, Ptown didn’t have a public sewer system until about 10 years ago. It relied on septic tanks, all close in proximity. There was also a fire at a jewelry store that was [italic] allegedly [/italic] looted by the volunteer fire department.

Doesn't Puerto Rico have crippling debt?

Yes and hurricanes.

The island of Vieques in PR is a good choice, apart from hurricane season.

^and the depleted uranium and Agent Orange

I’ve spent time in Luquillo Beach. It’s a little east of San Juan, so it’s easy to get to. It’s near the El Yunque National Forest and had great weather. Perfectly clear and warm, then at 4 pm every day there’s a torrential downpour for 20 minutes to cool things off. By sundown everything would be dry again, but cool.

R360. That is a positive. The sickly and genetic inferiors will be culled.