Top Dem Pollster Says Elizabeth Warren Gives Joe Biden the Best Chance to Win

I agree. She has the national awareness and progressive ideas that he needs. Excuse me, that WE need.

I said this on another thread. I like Elizabeth Warren best but I can't help but wonder if the optics of a Biden-Harris ticket might be better. In other words, I don't think we just need a VP with estrogen. I think we need some color in there too.

Joe and Liz look good together, too.

I think Biden is going to select a VP who is not well known nationally, but has a lot of respect in her region.

That Dem pollster is wrong.

LOLOLOLOL. Hello, 4 more years of Trump in the White House!

They. Just. Don't. Get. It. Outside. Of. The. College. Campuses. And. Coastal. Metropolises.

Kamala does!

Explain yourself, R6.

R6 needs to get out more:

"Poll: Warren tops VP appeal for Dem voters in Michigan and Wisconsin"

Hey R6, phony concern troll. Go suck Trump’s mushroom, why don’t ya!

I'm in northern Wisconsin. Took a drive up and into Duluth a week ago. Trump signs everywhere. Didn't see a single one for Biden. Come see for yourself.

She's great and she deserves it, but unfortunately she's probably not the best choice. It's not as if Massachusetts is in play while the Midwest is squarely for Biden.

She’s old and a fabulist. Next.

I sincerely doubt that. Warren is a slippery ex-Reagan supporter (during the AIDS crisis, but she lies about it now), and staunch Republican, and her ridiculous "Fauxcahontas" problem actually resonates with those outside the liberal bubble. She let Harvard call her a "woman of color" hire for a decade, back when she was a Republican. I'm thrilled to vote for Joe, but Warren is going to be a net negative.

Looks like Amy Klobuchar is off the VP list.

Liz Warren stops my from voting....I just can't lol.

All the trouble in Minnesota is not going to help Klobuchar

So you would abstain from voting due to the VP on a ticket, R16? What has she done that’s so horrible?

R15 lesson in politics. Don’t serve locally or in any position where you’re over police.

I LOVE Kamala and want to see her as AG because there is no way a white man & black woman will look good to Midwest and Southern hicks.

Biden & Warren are the perfect Mommy & Daddy.

For R4 (from the article):

[QUOTE] Former President Barack Obama, who has been advising Biden on the choice, also thought it was very important to pick someone who had already gone through the rigors of the presidential campaign trail. “There’s not going to be a lot of time to adjust,” Obama said at the time, according to former adviser David Axelrod’s book, "Believer." “I’m afraid that if someone is experiencing this whole, crazy circus for the first time, it would be too much to ask.”

If Barack and the VP team want someone who has already run for President, and Amy is now effectively eliminated, then it’s pretty much down to Elizabeth Warren or Kamala Harris at this point.

I’m available!

Warren is tooooo liberal for me. I don't want more taxes to pay for free things for everybody else. She has no other way to pay for her BIG liberal ideas which is why her campaign sunk so quickly.

[quote]Explain yourself, [R6].

Please. Don't. Ask. That.

[QUOTE] Warren is tooooo liberal for me. I don't want more taxes to pay for free things for everybody else. She has no other way to pay for her BIG liberal ideas which is why her campaign sunk so quickly.

Then don’t vote for her in the 2024 primary. She’s going to be the Vice President, for christ sake. Joe Biden will decide which of her ideas actually become apart of the agenda that he will try to pass with Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer.

Oooh sounds like we got a multi millionaire here. Her math checks out.

[quote]Warren is tooooo liberal for me. I don't want more taxes to pay for free things for everybody else.

You're free to feel however you want to feel on the first part of this statement but ....

[quote]She has no other way to pay for her BIG liberal ideas which is why her campaign sunk so quickly.

You're wrong here. The one thing that woman did was plan the hell out of everything.

Sanders was the one who had a lot of big ideas and no way to pay for them. His presence also prevented her from getting all of the progressive vote.

She hung in there long enough to single-handedly take Bloomberg out (even if she should have been attacking Bernie) so you should be thanking her for that since Biden and Sanders were incapable.

She's old, R13? He's older.

[QUOTE] You're wrong here. The one thing that woman did was plan the hell out of everything.

She did not have a plan to pay for Medicare For All, R27.

That will be an old ticket. From today's electoral-vote column:

"You should have seen the joke that (V) struck yesterday, which (Z) knew full well was just a little too sarcastic. Here's a hint: It involved an observation about one presidential ticket having a combined 150 years on the planet and the other one having a combined 150 points of IQ."

I think she's too liberal for some folks (independents) to vote for, and I agree Klobuchar will be struck off the list of contenders. I think Val Demings would be the best, Kamala 2nd best choice.

[quote]If Barack and the VP team want someone who has already run for President, and Amy is now effectively eliminated, then it’s pretty much down to Elizabeth Warren or Kamala Harris at this point.

I agree it’s down to these three, R21. And they each have baggage.

But given the optics of the current race-riots taking place, I think he’ll have to pick a black woman, and that’s Kamala Harris.

He should choose the mayor of Atlanta. She's appealing to a broad number of people.

[quote]She did not have a plan to pay for Medicare For All

Actually she said her plan was to hire experts to do more research to find out what would work best for everyone, R29.

I am impressed with the mayor of Atlanta but there is something to be said for the idea that the veep should be familiar with the rigours of a presidential campaign. I hope however she has a long career in US politics

[quote] I think he’ll have to pick a black woman, and that’s Kamala Harris.

Former District Attorney Kamala Harris whose record was questionable? Current events put her out too.

Or as one article said:

[quote] She lost, in part, because she couldn’t forthrightly defend her record as a prosecutor. She couldn’t forthrightly defend that record because party activists deemed it insufficiently progressive. They portrayed her as complicit in the unjust incarceration and killing of black and Latino men.

The last thing people will want is someone previously affiliated with law enforcement who put black people in jail and openly called herself a "Top Cop." It's also part of the reason why even Warren pulled better numbers than her with black supporters when Kamala was running.

[quote]I am impressed with the mayor of Atlanta

She was said to be on Biden's shortlist before all this.

I wonder if the data still holds, given how much has changed in the last week. The Politico story surprises me but the numbers are the numbers. I think there's a lot of good things about Warren, though I didn't want her as the nominee. She may be wasted in the sentence. If the black vote would get behind her, I could see the pick. My only concern is she tends to gild the lily.... reminds me of the story about Labour grandee Harriet Harman, who addressed a black crowd as "brothers and sisters" and was laughed at. It wouldn't be fatal or doom the campaign, but these days I think white people can be allies but they can't claim to be as one. It's disrespectful of the AA experience.

I like Warren but after this week I don't think nominating a white leftist woman would fly. Social media is full of black protesters showing video and photos of white leftists jumping in, trying to make it all about income inequality and trying to sideline the concerns about police brutality. White people are shown causing trouble and even getting arrested for arsons that the media and many rightwingers were trying to blame black protesters for.

Also, remember that she said the DNC rigged the primary in 2016. She put out a cookbook called "Pow Wow Chow" based on her own belief she was Native. Those are things that will not go away, unfortunately.

[QUOTE] Also, remember that she said the DNC rigged the primary in 2016. She put out a cookbook called "Pow Wow Chow" based on her own belief she was Native. Those are things that will not go away, unfortunately.

Nobody will care about any of that, R38.

I'll vote Biden if it's Harris or maybe anyone but Warren. I will not vote for, as someone said above, that fabulist.

I'll just pull the Libertarian lever again.

[QUOTE] I'll vote Biden if it's Harris or maybe anyone but Warren. I will not vote for, as someone said above, that fabulist.

Why do you like Kamala so much more, R40? Like she’s some sort of moderate?

She's non-ideological at base. A politician. And her instincts are not to lie and not to suck up to the trendy miniscule voting base of trans activists.

[quote] I said this on another thread

Same here. Warren is the only safe bet if he MUST choose a female running mate.

The others simply will not fly in a swing state. Not in the Midwest, not in the South. They'll just end up voting for Trump.

The naysayers have no clue, and they're just speaking on their own agendas. Nobody really cares what the Libertarian troll here thinks. You don't want to vote for Warren? Then don't vote for her. But millions of undecideds and independents WILL vote for her. And THEY are the ones who will decide the election. Not some Libertarian on the outskirts of American politics.s

As for how all the black social activists who are "all over social media" will react? Well, they will just have to live with it.

Politics is about winning. That's the whole point.

Biden needs to go with Warren NOW, so that he can address the social concerns LATER. Biden and Warren are THE two people who actually care about, and will address the social problems in this country. They have both been doing it for decades, in government.

Do you think that Harris will be worried about social problems for African Americans? Fuck no. She only cares about her career. And moving up the political ladder. She is an opportunist.

Don't mistake the color of a person's skin, for how much they actually care about you.

Vote Biden/Warren. You'll be glad you did.

I don't think it will be Warren, too much Bernie Bro baggage. I just don't think it will be Warren. Joe Biden will pick Kamala Harris, a safe, centrist, black alternative to all that actual leftism. And honestly, as I posted before, I think Warren would hate the actual job. She has real skills, but being vice president in charge of bullshit and backslapping isn't one of them.

I doubt it.

This election will be decided on how many moderate republicans Joe can get to vote for him and they're not that much into liz Warren.

also, despite all the mooing and moaning, very, very few people vote for the vice president. They will vote for Biden or not, but they will not vote for his running mate. That just doesn't happen despite all the build up and the publicity.

That "top pollster", OP, is clueless.

If you want Biden to lose, guaranteed, you pair him with Warren.

WHY THE FUCK DOES ANYONE THINK WARREN IS A GOOD IDEA?!? She's absolutely terrible.

Well who’s your pick, R48?

[quote] despite all the mooing and moaning, very, very few people vote for the vice president

Put a black woman on the ticket, and see what happens.

All people will SEE is the Vice-Presidential nominee.

I mean, seriously. How naive are you people, to think that race won't matter? It does matter. It WILL matter.

It's all Trump will talk about. It's all the media will talk about.

Choosing a black female will suck all the oxygen out of Biden's campaign. It will be the focus of both Trump AND the media, 24/7. His message will get lost in the frenzy, and Trump will gain the upper hand.

That won't happen with Elizabeth Warren. Trump has been attacking her for years. What more could he possibly say about her, that he hasn't said already.

Warren will be a good surrogate for Joe Biden. She will take a back seat, and she will help him get his message out.

This is so simple, yet people are making it SO complicated.

no, sorry, it's Biden versus Trump. That is the matchup. Do you like the shit that has been happening for the past 4 years, or do you not? That is the contest.

They do NOT look good together. This is what the world would see.

Harris or Rice or Duckworth would be fine.

Kamala is the obvious choice of those.

Warren? Two over-70 white people? How do you think that will go over? The base of the party is and has been black women... they do so much work, knocking on doors, working phone banks, raising money, providing support. They deserve a seat at the table. Warren would be a slap in the face to them, a grave insult... this over-privileged meemaw that appropriated a minority race when she felt it was to her benefit, but never once did ANYTHING to help racial minorities (or LGBT people for that matter) during most of her political life. She was a fucking Reagan Republican until the mid-90s for chrissakes. She spent the entire campaign appropriating other people's ideas without credit (including stealing several of Harris's ideas and plans). She would back stab Biden the entire time because she's proven she is NOT loyal. She spent way too much time dissing Hillary and Obama. She would NOT make a good team with Biden.

Well, R51 has spoken.

Without any facts or decent argument, mind you. But R51 has spoken.

Let it be! Hallelujah!

Warren couldn’t even place second in the Mass primary. Her primary run did her no favors with the national audience and her ludicrous pandering to fringe groups turned off a lot of centrist Dem voters.

now you're getting it r54.

Warren is certainly the most qualified and the smartest, but as we saw in 2016, America has issues with uppity women.

In fact, they didn't like the uppity black man we had for eight years, either. I don't say that as my words, but the fact that Americans are so virulently anti-intelligence.

she doesn't even want the job. Honestly, I think Warren would say no. Kamala will leap at it, however, which is half the battle.

She’s too old to be Biden’s running mate.

[quote]Warren is certainly the most qualified and the smartest

She is neither. But she's the whitest. I guess that's your criteria.

[quote] In fact, they didn't like the uppity black man we had for eight years, either.

Ah yes, that uppity black man twice elected in resounding victories by the American voters.

[quote] Two over-70 white people? How do you think that will go over?

A million times better than Biden and a black woman will go over.

You people are truly not getting it. This is about MIDDLE AMERICA. This is about SWING STATES.

It doesn't matter how this plays in NY or CA or MASS. Why? Because they will go blue no matter what.

This is about Ohio. And Wisconsin. And Michigan. And Pennsylavania. And Florida.

And this year, Texas and Georgia and Arizona will be in play.

With Warren on the ticket, white people in these swing/purple/leaning red states will consider Biden, because they are comfortable with this older white man and older white woman. They are a "safe" pick.

The MOMENT that Biden puts a black woman on the ticket, then all bets are off. He will lose these voters in the swing states.

BLM, the protests, the pandemic, have all unsettled white America. They are looking for STABILITY.

Trump has not brought stability. He has brought chaos.

This is Biden's chance to take the temperature down, and go with the safe choice. Elizabeth Warren.

If he goes with a black woman, he will take the temperature up. He will add fuel to the fire.

You all can go on and on and on about how this will play with Democrats, Liberals, and Progressives, but none of that matters.

What matters is Biden appealing to the white people in states that Hillary lost in 2016.

Some Democrats really don't get it. They're just too blinded by their agenda.

believe it or not r62, middle America does not hate all black people, even all black women. I know that there is this thing, this coastal thing that everyone is trapped in the 1950s west of the Mississippi, at least until you get to San Francisco, but it isn't actually a fact. Biden himself will appeal to a lot of suburban white people. His very put together black female running mate, you know, who used to put people in jail, won't be some catastrophe. I know you live in this world, but peek out of it occasionally.

[quote]A million times better than Biden and a black woman will go over.

Nah, because you think Black people will turn out for this after getting lied to and cast aside and taken for granted?

They've lived with worse than Trump for generations. They'll sit back and let you suffer. And rightly so for being racist fuckwads who keep promising but NEVER GIVE THEM A SEAT AT THE TABLE.

You really don't get it. You really don't. You disrespect black people this time, and this country is over.

Warren is no "bridge to the future". She's the past. She's "Millie" from "The Color Purple". She's fucking Karren.

The level of tone-deafness it takes to suggest Warren would be a good VP pick is off the fucking charts. It proves you're willfully blind to everything she's done over the last several years.

[QUOTE] Warren couldn’t even place second in the Mass primary. Her primary run did her no favors with the national audience and her ludicrous pandering to fringe groups turned off a lot of centrist Dem voters.

And how did Kamala Harris do, R55? Oh that’s right, she had to drop out before one vote was cast.

The bitch lied about being a Native. White liberals, minorities like me don't forget! Warren needs to crawl back under the bushes from where she came from.

To be honest, all the typical female choices (Kamala, Adams, Warren, etc.) are all weak ass choices. They are all unlikable and won't help Biden one bit.

The Democratic party is run by morons. They needed someone new and fresh to reinvigorate the election.

and Hillary's problem, at least here in Wisconsin, was that black people didn't turn out to vote for her in Milwaukee, like they'd turned out to vote for Obama.

and which novice who never ran in an election would that be, r66? Or do you just have some mythical person, grown in your own personal lab, in mind?

I find it hilarious when people say Kamala is "unlikable".

More racist sexist tropes. ANY woman who strives to achieve better is "unlikable". Women are only "likable" when they "know their place", right?

Hillary Clinton was hugely liked as Secretary of State (a position given to her by a man), with approvals in the 60s (routinely higher than Obama's), but the moment she ran for higher office, her "likability" was questioned and her approval ratings nosedived.

The misogyny is stiffling.

[quote]and Hillary's problem, at least here in Wisconsin, was that black people didn't turn out to vote for her in Milwaukee, like they'd turned out to vote for Obama.

R67 CONVENIENTLY forgets about the unprecidented GOP voter suppression in the wake of the gutting of the Voting Rights Act and the take-over of Wisconsin by the GOP. Or their onerous & racist voter ID law.

But sure, blame Hillary.

[quote] Warren is no "bridge to the future". She's the past. She's "Millie" from "The Color Purple".

That's absolute utter bullshit and nonsense. You have the intelligence of a flea if you seriously find this argument compelling. Sounds like woke a nonsense.

Warren would be something desperately needed - a reformer - but unless things are dire, voters rarely embrace a reformer. As long as the system is still benefiting them, it's hard to get them to agree to dive into change. And while I think we are at a point of severe dysfunction, much of "Middle America" still thinks the huge cultural changes we've had are somehow temporary, and will vote for inertia.

it's not about blaming Hillary, it's a fact of political life, r70. Black people that jumped through a ton of hoops to vote for Obama didn't jump through more hoops to vote for Hillary. There was a huge falloff. The black vote is actually key for Democrats, here in "ever racist" middle America.

Elizabeth Warren for VP. This means progressive will work their asses off to get her in the WH, w/joe biden. An united ticket is the most powerful. We went with joe biden because AA wanted him as president.

After they announce the VP pick, all the dems united behind the ticket and will campaign for him.

Listen to what the progressives are saying and pick Elizabeth Warren. Elizabeth Warren already has BLM Activists. They supported her for President.

It's not Warren, and again, I don't think she even wants the job. And I think she would hate it.

Actually R73 I don’t really hear any progressive noise for Warren. They’ve forgotten about her and now they’re pushing Karen Bass.

[quote] believe it or not R62, middle America does not hate all black people, even all black women

Don't put words into my mouth R63, because that's not what I said.

I said that white people are going to vote for the person they're comfortable with.

In this year, especially. They need someone SAFE.

In another year, if things were more normal, if there wasn't a global pandemic, if millions of people were not losing their jobs, if protestors and tear gas were not lighting American streets on fire, then a black woman would be a fantastic choice for a VP pick. Or maybe even a Presidential nominee.

But NOT. THIS. YEAR.

This year - and this is my personal opinion - white people are looking to vote for someone they are comfortable with, and yes I will come right out and say it: another white person.

Now I've stated on another thread that Joe Biden would have had a slam dunk with Tim Ryan from Ohio, or Conor Lamb from Pennsylvania. But he boxed himself in with his big mouth, saying that he WILL choose a female running mate. Now he's stuck with that, or he's a liar.

So given the female running mate choices, it has to be Warren. For all the reasons I have already discussed.

NOT because Americans hate black women, but because that's just not what they want or need in this particular election cycle.

That Dem Polster is tone deaf.

And that is why they will vote for Joe Biden, r76. They will see safety. Honestly, if Kamala or Liz Warren or for that matter Mayor Pete had won the nomination, this would be the conversation, but they didn't. And I think the Midwest in general will vote for ole uncle Joe, and having a black running mate will not terrify them into voting for the shittiest president in American history.

I love the Bernie/Liz wing of the party trying to get their chosen ones in one way or another. I mean, if I supported them I'd do the same, I guess. Bernie and Warren were soundly rejected by the Democratic electorate, and they will have no greater success with the general public (which is to the right, not the left, of Dem voters). Warren couldn't even win Massachusetts, and that's after Pete and Amy dropped out. Bernie's fame equals that of Biden and yet he barely won a few states and his support was about 1/2 the support he had in 2016. No Bernie wing VP on the ticket.

He backed up his assertions with polling data, R77.

[QUOTE] Greenberg also argues that there isn't evidence that someone like Harris would obviously increase African American turnout more than Warren would.

[QUOTE]"If you look at the African American vote in the primaries, they weren't supporting Harris," he said. "She never developed the base in the African American community against Biden." The POLITICO/Morning Consult/ survey also showed Warren polling better among black and Hispanic voters than any other contender on the question of whether her selection would make them more likely to vote for Biden.

I've always hoped he would pick her. She's got balls of steel and isn't afraid of any of the republican scumbags one iota.

[quote] The misogyny is stiffling.

Then take it up with the American people.

White American women, in particular.

Because they voted for Donald Trump in big numbers. FORTY SEVEN PERCENT of white women voted for Trump in 2016. 47%.

So stop blaming men, and African Americans, and minorities for Hillary losing.

Because white women bear a huge responsibility for that.

From the linked NYT November 9, 2016 article:

[quote] The data indicate how deeply divided Americans are by race and gender: 94 percent of black women who voted and 68 percent of Hispanic or Latino female voters chose Hillary Clinton, but 53 percent of all white female voters picked Mr. Trump.

People who state they are well connected are saying it's going to be Kamala Harris. Californians will elect another Democratic Senator. So no loss in the Senate.

Obama Advisor (a white boy) implied it may be Elizabeth Warren. Because Joe Biden (cough Obama) wants someone who can deal with the economy and pandemic on day one. Obama really respects Elizabeth Warren.

Susan Rice will obviously be a prominent cabinet member. Her expertise is National Security. If she is the Sec of defense she could overseas the massive DOD budget and realign to pandemic response. Which definitely has to happen.

[quote] "If you look at the African American vote in the primaries, they weren't supporting Harris," he said. "She never developed the base in the African American community against Biden."

Thank you, R80! And they wouldn't vote for Cory Booker, either.

In fact, Cory was complaining about this during the election, particularly when Harris dropped out.

Bottom line: African Americans did not support the black candidates for President.

Ask yourselves, why not? That's why Harris shouldn't be made out to be this dream running mate.

She has REAL problems, and black voters saw right through her.

everyone should respect Elizabeth Warren r83, and that should be her job. Vice President is a different job, it's basically President in Waiting. I want to see Warren running some big agency or some big Department, or just put in charge of solving some big problem, using all her amazing skills. As a job, Vice President still kind of sucks, actually.

[QUOTE] People who state they are well connected are saying it's going to be Kamala Harris. Californians will elect another Democratic Senator. So no loss in the Senate.

No loss in the senate with Warren, either. The Massachusetts legislature can easily change the law to prevent Baker from appointing a Republican representative.

People who keep saying a black female VP won't be a good choice, keep forgetting that a black male democrat won the biggest public vote count in US history - not only once but TWICE!

Elizabeth Warren has the progressives. People who will work their asses off to get her elected. The energy behind Warren would be powerful. Plus, she is qualified to be in the white house. We have very serious problems.

Also, Elizabeth Warren will be endorsed by BLM. They already supported her in the primary.

yup, r87. I think there is still this weird fear, oh white people outside of New York and California just can't deal with black people. I think that's a myth, and we need to shatter it.

Dear R87.

Kamala Harris, Susan Rice, and Karen Bass are not Barack Obama.

Not even close.

r88, why would BLM NOT work hard for a black vice president? Why?

are you a bot? are you proud resister, or proud socialist, or proud whatever these days?

But Obama worked his ass off to get elected twice. He is an remarkable public speaker and campaigner. He has depth political instincts. Thank God, he is calling the shots on the campaign. We need him.

[quote] why would BLM NOT work hard for a black vice president? Why?

Why Why Why don't you go and ask THEM?

THEY are the ones who didn't vote for Harris or Booker during the Democratic Primaries.

They are FEMALES, yes. I think that is the thing that seems to be the biggest obstacle.

Summer White House= The Vill-a-gez!

I cannot wrap my head around why anyone would vote for trump again. Just shoot me.

um, shit happens r94, times change and people make new calculations. you know that, right?

R80 His assertions are in his ass. Elizabeth Warren couldn’t even be president of Massachusetts.

I hope Obama prevents Biden from doing anything stupid.

got it, you have some weird bitterness r100. Well that is okay. Biden needs to win though, you get that, right? You are living in a complete bullshit world, are you?

[QUOTE] But Obama worked his ass off to get elected twice. He is an remarkable public speaker and campaigner. He has depth political instincts. Thank God, he is calling the shots on the campaign. We need him.

If Barack Obama was calling the shots, Joe Biden never would’ve run in the first place. Barack urged him to sit out 2016 which led to Trump getting elected, and he tried to keep him out in 2020 which would’ve given the nomination to Bernie Sanders and led to Trump getting elected AGAIN. Obama has no business calling anything. This is Joe Biden’s decision, one he rightfully earned, and he will make it on his own.

[quote]Stan Greenberg urged Hillary Clinton to pick Elizabeth Warren as her Vice President. He thinks Clinton would be in the White House had she listened.

This shows why this pollster is clueless. The problem was Hillary. People stayed home because they couldn't stand her.

I think Obama is leading the ship. He is very evidence- based, and also has great political instincts. The American people and kids everywhere cannot survive Trump/Facist Republicans in office.

Vote ALL Republicans OUT of office for this.

Are you register to Vote? Register Now

How are you going to deal with Voter Suppression in your state and district? You are going to need a Plan now. Republicans are going to make everything a hell-scape to prevent you from voting.

I know, everyone stop imagining the perfect vice presidential nominee. there isn't one. it just doesn't work like that.

But Bloomberg (the billionaires) are trying to stop Warren. And they are manipulating the American people into it.

Yes, it does matter the experience of the people in the White House. IT DOES MATTER.

Trump/Republicans are going to hit this ticket HARD. So in that case, it does not matter. Trump is calling Biden a Socialist.

Harris is an actual reformer, who has reformed things. Warren is all talk.

Harris is more progressive than Warren. Harris is ranked #2, warren #4... Bernie is #10 in the Senate.

So yeah. The fact that Progressives are not stanning for Harris is pure racism. And Berners were ripping Warren up one side and down the other when they perceived she was a "threat" to their precious Bernie (calling her a "Snake" among other things).

Harris is better than Warren on any given issue or topic. Period. To deny that obvious, and provable truth, is to be blinded by racism. Sorry.

I would so prefer her to Kamala Harris.

Biden needs a true progressive to balance out Biden's conservatism.

Harris isn't a reformer enough.

She locks up innocent people, then pretends her shit don't stank.

Has the Duckworth Troll chimed-in yet?

Waiting is driving Trump batshit mental. I say keep it up.

[QUOTE] Harris is an actual reformer, who has reformed things. Warren is all talk.

What has she reformed, R107?

Go Liz!

She’s always been a lone voice against the banks that prey on minorities.

I think she would be an excellent choice.

R112, try taking a class in history. You would learn that she reformed the banks and was the head of the CPFB which helped to block banks from preying on minorities. She got back BILLIONS from the banks.

What have you done?

Thank you, R113 and R114!

The anti-Warren idiots are full of shit.

[quote] Has the Duckworth Troll chimed-in yet?

Probably fast asleep.

It's like 3 a.m. in china.

Malarkey!

It will never ever be Warren. Keep fantasizing for a few more days.

Just to clarify, Elizabeth Warren is the one responsible for creating the CFPB and promoting bank reform, not Kamala Harris. R114 muddied the waters a little.

Also, polls have consistently shown that Elizabeth Warren is the top VP choice among African-Americans. Harris, by contrast, has generated distrust among AAs for her work as a prosecutor. So R107 telling us we're all racists for not supporting Harris is bullshit.

But I don't think it'll be Warren either. With any luck, she'll be put in charge of Treasury.

Wrong skin color.

(How ironic is that?)

Please link to all the polls that show Warren as top VP choice among African-Americans, R119.

Well, R121, there's one example at R80.

Warren is too old. Next.

I think Warren is highly intelligent and spry. But I think black voters would be extremely disappointed and angry, and might refuse to vote.

Are the Warrenistas really making the argument for Warren because she supposedly has African-American support? There was person with significant AA support in the primaries. His name is Joe Biden and he's already on the ticket. Desperation on the part of the Liz fans.

I sincerely doubt that, OP!

She's such a fraud and operator and men HATE her!!

R27, Elizabeth lost in her own state. Nobody voted for her.

[quote]Are the Warrenistas really making the argument for Warren because she supposedly has African-American support? There was person with significant AA support in the primaries. His name is Joe Biden and he's already on the ticket. Desperation on the part of the Liz fans.

This just reinforces the idea that the VP doesn't need to be a Black woman. Biden already has Black voters. He should pick the best person for the job, and it's probably Warren.

And it dispels the notion that black voters are clamoring for a black candidate in the White House when they don’t really seem to give a shit about race. They never did. They didn’t vote for Barack Obama because he was black; they voted for him because they saw him as the best candidate to win in November 2008. That’s the exact same reason they voted for Joe Biden. Obama being black was just icing on the cake for them.

Exactly, R128 and R129. Both right on the money.

For some reason, pundits seem to think that black voters are stupid, and only vote based on race.

Wrong. White voters do that. Especially in the South and the Midwest.

Black voters vote based on who can help them. That's why they vote primarily for Democratic candidates, particularly for ones like JFK, Bill Clinton, Joe Biden, and yes - Barack Obama.

she's the one I like best

[quote] I cannot wrap my head around why anyone would vote for trump again. Just shoot me.

Better yet, shoot them.

IF there are going to be debates Liz could kick ass. She’s good on the comebacks in most cases and knows how to use zingers.

We need to get the message out to Biden, before it's too late:

Pick Elizabeth Warren for the win!

Pick anyone else, and it's four more years for DUMP.

Biden should not be bullied into picking a running mate, just to be politically correct. He needs to choose the BEST person for the job, and that's Elizabeth Warren.

Take a look at these polls...

Biden/Rice 47% (+7) Trump/Pence 40%

Biden/Abrams 47% (+7) Trump/Pence 40%

Biden/Warren 47% (+6) Trump/Pence 41%

Biden/Harris 47% (+6) Trump/Pence 41%

Biden/Baldwin 46% (+6) Trump/Pence 40%

Biden/Demings 46% (+6) Trump/Pence 40%

Biden/Grisham 46% (+6) Trump/Pence 40%

Biden/Duckworth 46% (+6) Trump/Pence 40%

Biden/Whitmer 46% (+5) Trump/Pence 41%

Biden/Bass 46% (+5) Trump/Pence 41%

Biden/Bottoms 46% (+5) Trump/Pence 41%

Biden/Hassan 45% (+4) Trump/Pence 41%

R135, those same polls said that Hillary would win in 2016.

I tend not to believe the polls.

James Clyburn came out and said it’s more important to have a Black woman in the Supreme Court rather than VP. He probably knows it’s going to be Warren.

Joe hasn't decided yet.

Liz is still in the running!

Hurry Warren if you want this you must find a bottle of "Gee your hair smells terrific" this decision will be made with a sniff.

They just held a fundraiser together and they speak frequently. They sound like they’re already in that President/VP love the way Barack and Joe were.

[QUOTE]”We’ve known each other a long time. Her fearless work for a just America has transformed lives and inspired millions, including me,” Biden said of Warren. “She is something else.”

[QUOTE]Warren returned the compliment. “I wake up every single day with a heart full of hope and here is why: Vice President Biden is meeting the moment.”

Joe approached Liz about being his VP in 2016. Anyone claiming they hate each other doesn’t know what they’re talking about.

[QUOTE] Former President Barack Obama, who has been advising Biden on the choice, also thought it was very important to pick someone who had already gone through the rigors of the presidential campaign trail. “There’s not going to be a lot of time to adjust,” Obama said at the time, according to former adviser David Axelrod’s book, "Believer." “I’m afraid that if someone is experiencing this whole, crazy circus for the first time, it would be too much to ask.”

I'd be fine with Elizabeth Warren as VP, or Prez.

R140 Sounds very good to me.

A lot of people are ignoring the fact that if Biden wins he will be the oldest president ever elected, which means there’s a damn good chance that the VP will become president Based on Warren’s detailed economic policy platformed during her presidential run, she seems to be the only VP candidate fully prepared for assuming the office of PRESIDENT, love her or hate her.

She’s such a sleeper. There’s virtually no discussion about her, which means none of these warring VP camps are out there attacking her. It’s Dick Cheney in 2000 all over again.

I really think it could be her. I wasn’t a big fan before, but there’s no question she’s the most qualified of any of these people to take over on Day One if needed.

Also, I don’t think her age is as big of a deal as some here think. Nobody seems to have a problem with McConnell running the Senate at age 78, or Nancy Pelosi in charge of the House at 80.

I do wonder if the reason why Joe has said 4 black women are in the running for VP is to soften the blow if he chooses a non-black woman. It could also be the reason why he said he'd appoint a black woman to the Supreme Court.

[quote]It could also be the reason why he said he'd appoint a black woman to the Supreme Court.

And don’t forget, Ruth Bader Ginsburg is going to announce her retirement about two minutes after Joe Biden is sworn in as President, so one of his first priorities in office will be filling that Supreme Court seat.

It would be the smarter choice, but the Dems have fumbled the ball at every opportunity this election cycle, so I’m expecting it to be Harris for optics sake, which will lead to incessant in-fighting over her. It will please no one and she’ll just end up being an albatross of unelectability.

[quote]Are the Warrenistas really making the argument for Warren because she supposedly has African-American support?

Not African-American support, Warren has African-American blood! She's been telling people for years she is part black is and actually a woman of color!

Go, Liz!!!

[quote]Dems have fumbled the ball at every opportunity this election cycle, so I’m expecting it to be Harris for optics sake, which will lead to incessant in-fighting over her.

Biden knows that Harris is going to be problematic.

If he didn’t before then he certainly does now, R153.

R150, the smartest choice would actually be a straight, white man, preferably from the Midwest. That ticket would be an easier sell to swing voters and Republicans dissatisfied with Trump. We already know Trump is going to send in troops to big cities. They're likely going to try to mess with the black vote by doing this. That needs to be offset by ensuring the suburbs feel safe voting for Biden. And you do that by making the ticket 2 straight, white men.

UH-OH, Liz may not be under the radar for much longer. Brand new soaring Times piece just published calling her “one of the most racially progressive white politicians in the country.” The jig is up, DL. Kamala’s gonna be coming after her now. 😂

[QUOTE] More than half a century later, the young college coed, who now goes by Senator Elizabeth Warren, led the charge in Congress to require the Pentagon to rename bases that honor Confederate military leaders. She spent much of her time on the campaign trail during the Democratic primary campaign talking about the racial wealth gap and systemic discrimination, and proposing plans on housing, maternal mortality, child care and other issues, which had an explicit focus on racial justice.

[QUOTE]She’s also the only white woman still under serious consideration to become Joseph R. Biden Jr.’s running mate, at a time when some Democratic leaders are pushing for more racial representation on their ticket.

[QUOTE]“She did the work and continues to do the work,” said Angela Peoples, the director of Black Womxn For, who recently co-wrote an op-ed urging Mr. Biden to select Ms. Warren as his running mate over several Black women. “That’s the model that I would love to see other Democrats follow.”

R155 It SHOULD have been Cuomo, but the pandemic happened. A Biden-Cuomo ticket would have been unbeatable.

Tim Ryan of Ohio is white male Rust Belt personified.

Warren’s engaged heavily with the rust belt, has cranked up the folksy Oklahoma accent to 11, and even has an ungrammatical populist catch phrase (“I got a plan for that!”) Her optics are on point.

Warren fans, where do you live?

You’re right, R157. That’s a ticket that would inspire passion right now and actually give Biden a fighting chance. But it’s a Catch 22 because people wouldn’t have known how suited Cuomo is if it weren’t for COVID.

But Biden shot himself in the foot when he decided to pander and say he’s giving it to a woman of color.

Establishments care about quotas during an election. Voters don’t care about them in the voting booth. No one is going to say “I think let’s give this minority a chance” in private and when their livelihood is at stake. People didn’t vote for Obama because he was black during the crash of the recession in 2008. They voted because they connected with him most. McCain pulled the cynical identity politics game by picking Palin and he lost it.

The idea that Harris, with her fire and brimstone approach to law and order, is expected to serve as a representative as the Democratic Party on a national stage for any reason other than her skin color is laughable. And the fact that Dems are rooting for her someone so deeply unqualified is also a little racist.

That is bullshit. The last vice presidential candidate that helped a president win was Lyndon Johnson when they stole Texas (and Illinois) for Kennedy.

Jesus, will the lone holdout from this summer’s Cuomomania please move on? Nobody’s putting a cuckold in the White House. If the man can’t dick his wife down properly, how’s he going to protect us from all threats foreign and domestic?

I agree that Warren has the best optics of all the woman, but we can't afford to lose a Seante seat. She needs to stay where she is.

[quote] Also, I don’t think her age is as big of a deal as some here think. Nobody seems to have a problem with McConnell running the Senate at age 78, or Nancy Pelosi in charge of the House at 80.

Are— are you joking?

A Biden/Warren ticket would be a slightly more successful Mondale/Ferraro. But only slightly.

Harris will lose California because of her tainted record as a prosecutor. She might appeal to centrists who like that she is a woman of color who is tough on criminals, but her flip-flop from “progressive prosecutor” to enabler of police misconduct and oppressor of the wrongly convicted has alienated her from liberals and POC - at least in California.

She’s as toxic as Hilary was in 2016, R166. Far left people hate her, the right absolutely fucking hates her, her supporters aren’t that impassioned or numerous, and independents don’t trust her to take over when Biden dies.

That ticket is Hilary 2 chained to the ghost of Jacob Marley.

Oops I mean Harris will lose the SUPPORT of Californians - Biden will win the state no matter who his VP is. There will be pressure on him to NOT choose Harris as his running mate, though.

She couldn't win her own state. But she'll win over the other 49? Not sure about that.

Is elizabeth warren off biden's VP list now? If she is, he is beyond stupid.

She’s NOT off the list.

OP, considering Hillary list due to misogyny I don’t think TWO women on the ticket would’ve seen her win.

R172, Hilary didn’t lose because of misogyny. Don’t do that.

I know R173!

There are 99 Reasons She Lost (And "I was a shitty candidate" ain't one.)

Me and my fellow Stans can recite them for you if you'd like.

We're trying to set them to the tune of "My Favorite Things"

Get it through your THICK HEADS! Biden is OLD, Warren is OLD....you can't have a ticket with two OLDS, especially if they are also both WHITE OLDS.

Not in 2020 you can't.

And could the poster who is STILL kvetching about a man not being picked for VP this year please move on already, like geez....we get it, you want a white dude, not any kind of female, but it's not happening.

Americans like their politicians to be OLD.

Does Biden think Warren is too old to be VP? That would be ironic.

[quote]I agree that Warren has the best optics of all the woman, but we can't afford to lose a Seante seat.

A billion people have said this already, but her Senate seat wouldn't be lost. The Massachusetts legislature, which is controlled by Democrats, has already adopted rules that basically prevent the Republican governor from appointing a Republican to the seat without its approval (which it wouldn't give).

I look forward to the announcement this week, especially coming back to this thread and watching the meltdown after Warren is NOT selected.

I don't think there will be that big of a meltdown if Warren is not selected.

If Kamala isn't, there will be a massive one.

[quote]Not in 2020 you can't.

He already has the black vote on lock. He already promised specifically to appoint a black woman to the Supreme Court for life which will be part of his legacy. The same goes for putting any woman as VP. Both will be firsts. The internet and the media are running with the idea of a black woman vp because it makes a good story.

Something tells me he will choose who he wants no matter what anyone else says in those arenas.

R180. I agree. I think odds are against Warren because of the things you mention, plus she is too progressive. Big corporations and the uber-wealthy hate her for her billionaire tax plan which would effectively redistribute a percentage of their profits to social programs They are very concerned about her being second-in-line for the presidency.

I think Warren’s opponents will successfully fund a shadow-campaign against her. Conversely, they’ll support Harris via social media because she has supported the very systems that provide housing, food and “mental health services” without billionaire tax money - institutions that up until recently actually CONTRIBUTED to corporate profit: California’s (now illegal) private prisons. Yet Harris also meets Biden’s requirement of being a woman of color, so she’s a win-win for the anti-Warrens.

Warren deserves it over Harris.

No, she doesn't, r182. She ran a piss-poor campaign and was a massive hypocrite. Remember her criticism of how others funded their campaigns when she had a super PAC funding hers? Remember her attacks on charter schools and claims that her kids went to public school when they were mainly educated in private schools? The list goes on. The schoolmarm will remain in the Senate.

I almost forgot her requirement that any potential Secretary of Education must be pre-approved by a "young trans person" before she appointed them. I can think of 20 people who deserve the VP spot more than Warren.

I cannot believe that more people don't reject Warren for the malleable, slick operator she's been. She turns me off completely as a national candidate and I'm originally from Massachusetts!

How will she deal with the fact that she allowed Harvard to tout her as a "Woman of Color" hire for the whole time she taught there...as a Republican?! How will actual women of color be expected to feel about her? Aren't their votes kind of important?

Warren's whole, "I'm getting a trans child to inform me on education", or whatever disqualifying gibberish she was pandering to that week made me gasp it was so inappropriate! She'd be a total anvil around Biden's neck! All he had to say was nothing and he could have chosen a popular male governor or former governor!

R185 Do you really think Biden won’t win because of his VP choice? I honestly think the issue is whether or not we will have a competent person to take his place should he be unable to serve due to poor mental or physical health. The optics only play a part in who BIDEN selects as VP and have little to do with his winning or losing the election

^^ BTW, my earlier comment about a Biden/Cuomo ticket being “unbeatable” refers to more centrists and undecided drawn to the polls, giving the pair a landslide win. I think Biden will win regardless, but Trump will dispute, refute and sue over it, so the bigger the margin of victory, the better.

[quote]She ran a piss-poor campaign and was a massive hypocrite.

Kamala Harris ran an even more "piss-poor" campaign. There is absolutely no contest if you're going by that.

[quote]I almost forgot her requirement that any potential Secretary of Education must be pre-approved by a "young trans person"

She pandered and it was an incredibly stupid move but they all made stupid moves. I did like her saying that young people and actual educators should have some say over who is chosen. She should have stopped at that. Then again you had Mayor Pete running around drinking a 40 out of a brown paper bag for a tv/internet show, Beto injecting Spanish into his speeches while skateboarding around at appearances, Biden flip flopping on whether or not he wanted to be associated with Obama's decisions depending on how well he knew they'd appear to the voters "I was a part of that!"/"I had nothing to do with that!" and Harris' "That little girl was me!" t-shirts she had ready to go that evening from her very rehearsed Biden attack.

I said it before and I will say it again, ultimately I don't care who he chooses as long as it's not Amy Klobuchar. Luckily her past and the current climate already got her booted out as a possible contender but stranger things have happened.

Nah. He has to choose someone much younger than he is, she's too old.

“Mayor Pete running around drinking a 40 out of a brown paper bag for a tv/internet show”

Oh please. They were making fun of pandering and parodying it.

It doesn't matter who Biden chooses. This election is not for him to win but for Trump to lose.

LThe flaccid geriatric DP has no energy or ideas of its own. That said, I like Warren and her economic policy proposals are what the world needs. Corporations need oversight and need to be reined in.

Nobody likes Warren except white upperclass people. She claims to be progressive so that makes them feel good but doesn’t actually want to make them pay taxes like Bernie.

“I almost forgot her requirement that any potential Secretary of Education must be pre-approved by a "young trans person" before she appointed them”

Does Warren realize that there are fewer than 50,000 trans people in the us. Why would she think pandering to them like that would be effective?

You're scraping the bottom of the barrel as far as political talent goes. Warren is fine. So are the rest. But nothing exciting or relevant is going to happen until AOC, Pete and company come to the fore and take charge.

Get over it with the trans thing. It was a stupid thing to say, but it was a blip, not some big pillar of her campaign. I’d wager outside of trans-obsessed DL, most people have forgotten about it or don’t consider it worth worrying about.

A picture is worth......

And that is why, in this moment of our history, a Biden/Harris ticket is a better visual than a Trump/Pence ticket.

She's too old. She's 71. He's 77.

Even if he wanted to choose her, which I don't think he does, he couldn't.

The Republicans wish he'd pick Warren but he won't do it.

[quote] She's too old. She's 71. He's 77. Even if he wanted to choose her, which I don't think he does, he couldn't.

I think you’re right, but I wish we could have her to help lead us out of the economic disaster we’re facing. Then again, she doesn’t need to be VP to do that.

[quote]Oh please. They were making fun of pandering and parodying it.

Oh, please, yourself. He was on a black television show doing bits to PANDER to black voters because they saw through his shtick. He ran out and did every appearance he possibly could to get them and he just couldn't.

Even his supporters here noticed he was pandering for several months and also knew it wasn't going to work.

[quote]Nah. He has to choose someone much younger than he is, she's too old.

Just like Obama chose someone much younger than ... oh, wait.

He's only serving for one term. People are expecting him to choose someone who could possibly succeed him. Not only does it not always work out that way but it's also likely he'll choose who he thinks is best for now which is going to be Warren for her financial background or Harris because she's younger and a fits the press'/some portion of the public's requirements that he choose a black woman.

After all, there have only been 4 times in history that a VP actually was elected President in the election after they ended their VP term.

I like Kamala Harris and Susan Rice, but now there's a lot of buzz about Karen Bass. Is she that impressive?

[quote] Just like Obama chose someone much younger than ... oh, wait.

Obama was 47 when elected, ffs. He actually needed to choose someone older and more experienced.

R200, no offense, but NO ONE is talking about Karen Bass.

I’m sure you’re trying very hard, though.

[quote] Hilary didn’t lose because of misogyny. Don’t do that.

Oh I’m doin it and doin it and doin it well - of course it was misogyny. Give me one legit reason she lost, please.

The Russians, R203 -- or did you forget about them?

There are numerous reasons HRC lost, but misogyny certainly played a role.

[quote] Give me one legit reason she lost, please.

Half the country hated her with the heat of ten thousand suns and a good percentage of those Haters normally vote for Democrats. And there is something about Hillary, and Hillary alone, that causes people to hate her in a way that other female politicians avoid. Women like AOC and Liz Warren may be demonized by the right but they do not get the visceral hate that Hillary does. Her Stans on DL can't seem to wrap their heads around that--that there's something about Hillary that really irks a lot of people00 if Hillary was a school bus driver, she'd be the driver the kids all hated. (And their moms.)

She also ran a shitty campaign, best described at The Tortoise and the Hare

[quote] but the Dems have fumbled the ball at every opportunity this election cycle

What are all these opportunities the Dems have fumbled, R150?

As for VP, no one who wants Dump out is going to see the VP pick as a dealbreaker. Those on the fence are on the fence for reasons that have little to nothing to do with the VP.

Warren is obviously the best candidate. She deserved the presidential nomination, FFS. I prefer Susan Rice over Harris but Harris is also fine. Biden won't lose CA because of Harris. That's a ridiculous assertion.

Warren has limited appeal beyond the northeast elite. She’s not a swing state Middle America candidate. Forget winning North Carolina or Florida with her on the ballot

“ Oh, please, yourself. He was on a black television show doing bits to PANDER to black voters because they saw through his shtick. He ran out and did every appearance he possibly could to get them and he just couldn't.”

Ok Going on a comedy show and doing comedy bits is pandering now. You better talk to your homegirl Elizabeth Warren because she was on that show too. And her whole existence is one big pander.

"Desus: “We’re walking through a park with very little security. And we’re super comfortable. We know the rules and stuff. But also, he has to be careful, he’s running for president. But he was a good sport about everything. We got a little blowback online because people said he was pandering to the black vote by drinking 40s in the park. First of all, that comment is so racist, because we weren’t drinking 40s. [They were drinking a bottle of scotch covered in a paper bag.] And also the idea that black people are monolithic and we’re going to vote for someone just because he drank a 40? ‘Mayor Pete’s invited to the cookout!’ No, that’s not how black people vote

I like Warren, despite some of her admitted slickness (which only seems to be an issue for female politicians). I'd rather she remain a powerful senator. Hell, if Dems take back the Senate, it would be great to see her be Senate Majority Leader one day. I mean, I'm sure Chuck Schumer would do fine, but with Warren as SML, perhaps some genuinely progressive legislation would be accomplished.

“I like Warren, despite some of her admitted slickness (which only seems to be an issue for female politicians)”

Or gay ones.

There’s a difference between pandering and reaching out to citizens who want you to tell them exactly WHY they should vote for you. So (for democrats, at least) appearances on shows like The Breakfast Club are necessary - but also risky.

While you could say that Warren “pandered” to black voters by appearing on The Breakfast Club and promising to fund social programs that benefit African Americans, the host caught her off guard by asking about her claims of Cherokee heritage, and why she was a registered Republican up until 1995. She outright lied to the host about the Republican Question, and if anything damns her credibility, it was her disingenuous non-answer to it.

Singling out politicians for pandering is pointless, since most do it. It adds nothing to the argument. It’s simply a lazy way to criticize them without having to research their actual political histories.

There is also a nasty twitter war between Warren and Harris supporters, largely racial

The New York Times gave Warren their endorsement. She is not someone the “Uber wealthy are scared of”.

Link r208?

Go Liz! She has the most support of any other candidates having received the most votes.

Give the people what they want.

Warren is 71 years old, she will be 75 at the end of a Biden first term. If I can fault Pres Obama for anything it was not picking a younger person as VP so they have a reasonable chance of getting elected at the end of his Presidency. I supported Warren for President but I don't for VP, but it is Biden's choice and I will support the ticket, who ever he picks.

She couldn’t win her own and neighboring states this year

R204 The Russians? Please, they played to people’s stupidity, ignorance and hate with misinformation and fake news.

R206 That “something” that caused “Half the country to hate her with the heat of a thousand suns” that just can’t seem to be put into words by those millions she not only “irks” but inspires “visceral hate” in - jeez, what could it possibly be? If only someone could solve one of life’s greatest mysteries???

It must be something so powerful to make the most qualified and prepared candidate lose to a monster with zero qualifications or experience!

Or maybe they just don't like her hair R220

[quote] the most qualified and prepared candidate

As has been pointed out numerous times on DL, this bizarre claim by her Stans is patently false.

Most candidates of the post-WW2 era were far more "qualified" including her husband Bill who had served as governor of Arkansas for 11 years.

Bush The Elder though was the most "qualified" on paper but was not a great president.

[quote] Half the country hated her with the heat of ten thousand suns and a good percentage of those Haters normally vote for Democrats. And there is something about Hillary, and Hillary alone, that causes people to hate her in a way that other female politicians avoid. Women like AOC and Liz Warren may be demonized by the right but they do not get the visceral hate that Hillary does.

That's because republican assholes have had over 25 years of hammering away at Hillary.

They have HATED her ever since she took on health reform in the mid-1990's, and they haven't stopped lying about her.

Hillary might have stood a chance to be President in 2008 because that was only eight years out of Bill Clinton's presidency, and she was still popular from being a NY Senator in the early 2000's.

By 2016, it was too late. Repigs kept hammering away at her during the Obama years, and now they had Benghazi lies and "pizzagate" PLUS the thousands of internet trolls to attack her after her term as Secretary of State.

None of this was due to Hillary herself, or her actions. It was all republican lies, smears, and russian cunt propaganda.

We can never let this happen again. To ANYONE.

This is why I don’t like that the Harris supporters are trying to ‘Hilary’ her.

They need to knock it off and be called to task.

We don’t need supposed “democrats” trashing Liz.

Either support her for VP or don’t but enough of the demonizing.

R223 you are so wrong.

I hated her because of her voting record, I hated her because of her murder as Secretary of state. I did not need lies to hate her, her politics were reason enough.

Hey r206, did you vote for Hillary in the general election in 2016?

If not, that YOU helped give us Trump.

And oh yeah...kindly fuck off.

She couldn’t answer a foreign policy question in the debate. She turned it back to institutionalized racism.

I did vote for Hillary R226. Sorry to disappoint. Whatever errors Hillary made in her campaign in no way detracted from the fact that she was a far far far far superior candidate than Trump, a relatively low bar, but still..

I was answering the question posed, not espousing my personal feelings about her.

And thank you, R223 for proving my point that

[quote] there is something about Hillary, and Hillary alone, that causes people to hate her in a way that other female politicians avoid. Women like AOC and Liz Warren may be demonized by the right but they do not get the visceral hate that Hillary does. [italic]] Her Stans on DL can't seem to wrap their heads around that--that there's something about Hillary that really irks a lot of people [/italic]

^^And again that is not my personal opinion of her. But since she was first lady of Arkansas, she's been a very divisive figure and attracts hatred and negativity far in excess of her actual actions in a way that other females targeted by the Right, from Pelosi to AOC to Warren, do not. We can speculate all day on why this is and whether is is justified, but it does not make it any less true.

Americans want Elizabeth Warren for VP, indicated in poll after poll. If it's not going to be Warren for VP, they should not pull from the congress. We need every dem in there. Elizabeth Warren is just brilliant, and really we would be better off with her in the White House.

Mixed favorability.

I just wish he hadn’t committed to a woman without really having anybody in mind. It just came off as gimmicky.

I can’t stand Warren.

Elizabeth Warren is a terrible human being. I want Biden to pick her because I know he’s gonna lose and she’s a loser.

[quote] I just wish he hadn’t committed to a woman without really having anybody in mind.

I’m sure he already had candidates in mind.

[202] Beg to differ, dear. I don't know her and I'm hoping for either Kamala or Susan, but yes, people ARE talking about Karen Bass. No offense, but do your homework.

Pic looks like bingo night at the rest home.

R231, more likely negative favorability

Why are Dems stupid enough to seriously consider a Massachusetts politician in the modern era. They are protypical losers with the national electorate

Because she is not just any Massachusetts politician. She’s captured the hearts and minds of many people in the Democratic Party.

You are right, however, that she’s a loser.

[quote]but now there's a lot of buzz about Karen Bass. Is she that impressive?

No.

She praised a Communist. A goner

Elizabeth Warren captured so many hearts and minds in the Democratic Party that she didn’t win anything. A complete loser. We can’t win the general election with a coastal Democrat.

[quote] We can’t win the general election with a coastal Democrat.

As VP? Sure we can. Might be a different story if we were talking about the presidential nomination but Biden's not going to tank because his VP is from a coast.

"But I think black voters would be extremely disappointed and angry, and might refuse to vote."

Then maybe they should just remove the 'American' from African-American.

R244 no we can't. This is a different situation because Biden is 180 years old. There's a good chance the VP will become president in the next few years. We also can't open the door for the Republicans to run against coastal liberalism. if all the Democrats voted we wouldn't have to worry about this. But unfortunately, they don't all vote.

Blacks would rather have a black supreme Court Justice than a VP.

What R6 said. End of thread...

R108. No he doesn't. THE reason he won was because he wasn't a progressive.

Agreed, r246, that Biden’s age makes this VP pick more important than normal but there’s still no way Biden’s going to lose on the basis of his choice. There’s no one in the running who’s THAT offensive.

People who want Trump out REALLY want Trump out and they’re not going to change their minds because they’re not crazy about Kamala Harris or whomever. People who are on the fence (who are these morons?) aren’t necessarily planning to make their final decision based on VP pick. And, we may not need them anyway. There are lots of voters out there who are extremely enthusiastic about showing Trump the door, and primary season indicates that voter turnout is likely to be much higher than usual.

I’m much more worried about foreign interference and post office fuckery than who ends up getting the VP nod.

African-Americans want to kick Trump out of the White House. I think they are interested in the polls. Elizabeth Warren is extremely likeable and is brilliant. She is topping the polls.

Absolutely, R251.

I think the Warren hate is coming from the Duckface trolls.

They're so desperate to make her "happen," even she has like zero support, and her demographic represents like 4% of the US population.

I seriously think china is trying to prop her up.

i love her. fingers crossed.

AXIOS is reporting that the list is pared down to two: Kamala Harris and Susan Rice. I think Kamala would make more sense since Susan Rice is tied too closely to Hillary.

I can see that R254

On the up side, both Rice and Harris are the sort of black women that UMC white suburban yoga moms can see themselves being friends with.

[quote]AXIOS is reporting that the list is pared down to two: Kamala Harris and Susan Rice.

Looks like Bass was just noise being stirred up by the media.

Both would ensure his loss, which is what the DNC is going for.

Rice is brilliant, but has no political campaigning experience. We don’t want a Benghazi rerun

Should be Warren.

If Axios is right, then Joe Biden just lost the election.

Oh, well. So be it.

As long as its not Warren

It's Harris or Rice now. Blech.

[quote] As long as its not Warren

Elizabeth Warren was Joe Biden's only hope, given all the female candidates he has to choose from.

Midwestern and Southern independents and swing voters will NOT vote for Joe Biden if Kamala Harris and/or Susan Rice are on the ticket. Same goes for the lower-tier names being put out there, like Bass and Duckface. Any one of these four names will cost Biden the election.

Just wait and see.

Warren is a non-religious Massachusetts professor politician who annoys Middle America. She is culturally poisonous in swing states.

Massachusetts is a fatal flaw for any politician

[quote] Midwestern and Southern independents and swing voters will NOT vote for Joe Biden if Kamala Harris and/or Susan Rice are on the ticket.

I don't agree with you re Duckworth. She polls very well with such voters. I suspect you live in LA or NYC if you think Warren appeals to such people.

There’s no evidence that Warren would have appealed more to swing state voters. However, she would have been a stronger Vice President than Harris or Rice.

Warren already has a well-organized hate industry. She even has a popular derogatory nickname. When it comes to vehement hatred, she is the Hillary of New England.

The people who say Warren could help him win are utterly clueless about the nature of this country. Not saying should wouldn't be an effective VP, however.

Rice’s personality is going to go over like a lead balloon on the campaign trail.

I agree. Rice is not charismatic either. Warren is even worse

I'm looking forward to the media, having gotten what they want - any Black woman - taking a microscope to the VP candidate and uncovering absolutely everything. You think Harris has been fully vetted by the media? Hardly.

Warren was roundly rejected by New England voters

@LouRovegno @voxdotcom Remember when the will of the voters in the Massachusetts primary was that Warren was their 3rd choice?

The Republicans will start with “Rice is going to start a war in the Middle East”.

Exactly, R275.

Harris and Rice are EXACTLY what republicans have been waiting for.

Up until now, they couldn't say shit about Joe Biden. He's likable, he's competent, he's white, and he's experienced.

The minute Harris and Rice join the ticket, they will be viciously attacked, and it will become a HUGE distraction for Biden.

As I mentioned before, they can't say shit about Elizabeth Warren. She has been under attack by Republicans and Trump for years. It's fucking old news.

Rice and Harris are fresh meat, and they will be devoured by both the media and by Republicans.

Joe will have no control over what happens from this point on.

Warren is washed-up, Massachusetts elite meat. Just because she’s Already damaged, maligned goods doesn’t mean she’s a good choice for VP.

Latest Yougov Among Black Voters

Warren: 57%/20% (+37)

Abrams: 50%/15% (+35)

Harris: 48%/21% (+27)

Bottoms: 40%/14% (+26)

Rice: 39%/15% (+24)

Duckworth: 29%/12% (+17)

Bass: 26%/15% (+11)

Whitmer: 24%/16% (+8)

Baldwin: 22%/15% (+7)

MLG: 20%/15% (+5)

Demings: 20%/20% (-)

It has been flip-flopping back and forth between Warren and Harris every week with Abrams making an occasional appearance.

It’s going to be Warren. And that is a good thing.

He will have countless African American and minorities and women in his cabinet, the White House staff and the Supreme Court.

It’s going to be an amazing 4 years. I can’t wait!!!!!!!!

Trump would say: "If your own family won't vote for you, why should America?" So with this story, I think it's going to be Kamala Harris.

R218, As I've pointed out, Obama did NOT support Biden at the end of Obama's Presidency in 2016 when we were all four years younger; he pushed for HRC, even though he found her only "likeable enough."

Obama was thanking Hillary for finally supporting him in 2008

R276, Trump's "Pocahontas" ain't going away, if Warren is on the ticket. Moreover, Biden doesn't need any tangential accusations of academic falsehoods surfacing again. Joe is not without baggage.

Is the delaying due to Team Biden's huddling with Black leaders to get their cooperation with a Biden/Warren ticket? Bad idea.

We're living in BLM time right now, and The Man must meet the moment.

Democrats, from voter to candidate, need to be prepared for the lowest, most venal, most insane, and most criminal campaign ever from Team Trump.

So pick the younger woman. Pick the most photogenic woman. Pick the Black woman.

Pick Kamala Harris.

I mean, Trump's already gone to the "Biden hates religion. He will hurt God." demented accusations.

Tammy Baldwin

FYI: Rice just dumped her Netflix stock. She was on the board since 2018.

Governor Whitmer took a quick trip to Delaware.

I like Warren, and no doubt she is qualified to be president. But Warren progressives Need to understand that Americans don’t vote based on who is smartest or who has the best policies. Americans are very simple, emotional, and visceral people. We vote based on culture more than cerebral reasons. We need to start grooming politicians who appeal to their cultural values and identity, and seem to be “cool.”