The internet brands Lana Del Rey a racist

In what universe is her comment racist? She merely pointed out the most popular female entertainers of the moments, many of which are black. This is crazy.

The comments on the original post she made are insane

I'm black. I don't find the comments racist at all. But they are stupid and don't answer the criticisms against her. In her songs and music videos she likes playing characters that are abused or in dangerous relationships or don't love themselves. She likes playing victims that are inexplicably drawn to the source of their misery.

It's good art imho. I like her music, and what she does works for her. There's definitely a space for it. But THAT is what she's criticized for. And it is a far cry from " being sexy, wearing no clothes, fucking, cheating, etc".

If she was half as smart as she thinks she is, she would just own what she does and talk about its value as music. Not say it's actually the same as what other famous artists do (it's not) and pretend she's being unfairly targeted.

She’s not! It’s not like she’s a Republican!

She’s not a feminist and she’s advocating for her right as a woman to be a slutty submissive woman while criticizing other women for not being that and...OK. It’s not even worth reading. She’s an attention-starved space cadet.

My thoughts: She is racist, entitled, uncouth and her nose is jacked.

I have no idea if she is racist or not but I really do get the impression she is not very bright. That doesn’t mean her music sucks. But she’s still basically a bimbo.

Every now and then I remember that she described herself as "Lolita who got lost in the hood" and "'gangster Nancy Sinatra". Lol.

Nicki Minaj or Ariana songs don't make any sense tho.

R7 I kind of agree with this. She's had an air of mystery around her for years which I think lent itself to the illusion that she was more intelligent than she actually is. I don't think she's an idiot by any means, and I do think she is a very talented songwriter--but in the past year or so, as she's been more interactive with the public via social media, she has made herself look increasingly clueless and pedestrian.

I've noticed she's been tending to air her laundry online quite a bit in the past few months, including a recent lengthy Mother's Day post where she basically implied that she had disowned her mother and instead shared a number of photos of herself with her sister and their rich female friends. It was very bizarre, especially because she has tended to be more impersonal on her social media.

Her mistake was mentioning the names of other women at all, most of whom have rabid fanbases and will attack at any sign of negativity toward them. Her point about how there should be a space in feminism for “delicate” women as she labels herself is fair, I guess. Though to phrase it that way sounds corny and reductive. Also the people she mentioned aren’t universally adored because they sing about fucking. They get accused of setting feminism back too. She does come across as an airhead trying to be intellectual.

Sometimes creative people demonstrate their philosophies profoundly through their art works but fall flat on their faces when they try to explain their thought processes.

People always get annoyed when artists refuse to explain their work and say they want their audiences to extrapolate their own meanings...but it’s usually better to let the work speak for itself.

I like the song Yayo, but I really don’t think I would like anything at all about an explanation of it as a philosophy.

Fake outrage is getting to be tired as fuck!

RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!!

EVERYTHING IS RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!! RACIST!!!

They’re all a bunch of stupid sluts in the end.

Just the 12% pissed when they don’t get 95% of the attention.

[quote] In what universe is her comment racist?

Are you joking? Planet Callout can always find a reason to lecture a successful white person on their racial insensitivity — things they’ve said that are “problematic.”

Literally the only people talking about racism on this thread are the petulant reactionary right wingers above. Can you leave so the adults can keep speaking?

Racism is not as simple as I hate them or I hate those. It has s lot to do with entitlement and ignorance. For someone like Del Rey the world is her oyster as far as expressing her art but if a black woman expresses herself in any other way than what YOU thinks she's supposed to be then it's a problem. Then it's a real big problem when she's successful at it. Also, there's a long history of black women being punished for their sexuality. Google Venus Hottentot.........

There is a long history of everyone being punished for their sexuality r18! Except straight white men!

Oh you poor thing^

Emo, r8, she’s emo to the core. She just won’t admit it to herself.

R19 is correct. Fuck off R20

When Beyoncé addresses gay rights and her husband apologizes for spewing “faggot” innumerable times then I’ll run to the frontlines to support this cause.

Beyoncé has “addressed it,” She has spoken many times about her gay uncle. JayZ was raised by a lesbian mom.

R18 that is not "racism," though—that's ignorance. While you can't be a racist and not be ignorant, you can in fact be ignorant and not be a racist.

R24 what does that have to do with what Lana said??

R22: you must be kidding are you that sheltered and entitled?

R26, I was responding to what R23 wrote.

R28 my bad, I can't see what R22 and R23 wrote.

My thought is she makes the same song over and over again.

The black radicals are crazy. It's clear that no black women can incur any criticism, regardless if it has nothing to do with race, without it becoming an issue of race. And if you claim otherwise you are "not listening". It's ridiculous. And frankly, quite n*ggerish.

Here's a classic.

Shakespeare.

The Beyonce fans are actually trying to tout her as a comparable lyricist to Lana. That they would even consider her a writer is ludicrous.

[quote] The Beyonce fans are actually trying to tout her as a comparable lyricist to Lana

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[quote] Racism is not as simple as I hate them or I hate those. It has s lot to do with entitlement and ignorance. For someone like Del Rey the world is her oyster as far as expressing her art

So if you’re white and successful and express your art you’re an entitled racist. Check.

[quote] The black radicals are crazy. It's clear that no black women can incur any criticism, regardless if it has nothing to do with race, without it becoming an issue of race

She didn’t even criticize them. She just cited their lyrics as examples of the fact that not all female pop stars are just spewing feminist talking points as lyrics. And for THAT she has been labeled a racist.

Black Twitter is tiresome. And has ruined Twitter. That's why more people like Del Rey have migrated to Instagram. Only faux woke, virtue-signaling, victim-porn black people will eventually ruin that too.

Now I’ve got Su-summertime sadness.

R38 they are ripping her to shreds on Instagram too.

This is dumb. She could have named another white artist or two (Ariana Grande is white BTW) like maybe Gaga but really she's just listing some of the most popular singers and currently they are mostly black or Latina women. It's really cynical to jump to "racism" here when there's no reason to think that's the case.

Lana does seem like a drama llama though and I usually avoid singers' social media stuff, except when it makes the headlines and pops up on DL... There's no real reason for this to be a news story.

Racism is a real thing that impacts people's lives all the time...but that doesn't mean everything is racist.

R12 I love "Yayo" too—the piano version on her Paradise EP is beautiful, but the older guitar-based one from before she got famous is equally gorgeous. A lot of her music is truly haunting and unique

Who really cares? This is all getting really annoying.

How does this woman not have a decent PR team lol.

This is why artists who shut up keep their allure and rarely get into scandals. She should stay off social media like Frank Ocean etc, it would benefit her ‘brand’ so much.

Is she still dating that racist cop? Does she still consider herself to be ‘a bit republican’?

She’s not racist, but she is a dumbass. Her latest post on the topic has her doubling down, somehow accusing the offended parties of being republican Trump lovers (okay?), and stating that third wave feminism is approaching. That happened in the 90s, girlie! We’re now in 4th wave. Crack open a book on the topic that isn’t a cute vintage artifact from the 70s, or at least get thee to Wikipedia before opening your mouth. Her publicist must hate her.

R46

Ha, well wiki is a bad example. But some simple googling and an article or two would suffice.

She told a long-standing fan account who asked her about her mental health to "Fuck. Off." and that they "aren't really fans". 🤷‍♂️

Yeah, she could have at least googled third wave feminism before scanning that typewriter composed response. It shows how inane these people really are.

She has no reason to be talking politics. The second she did her music went to shit. She is way out of her depth.

Kepp it coming, more people are exposing themselves as the racists they are deep down. You just haven't the nerve to shoot a black jogger yet. It's coming........

Her crimes were:

1. Forgetting that people have a real problem with women pitting themselves against other women. (Not just on Twitter either.)

2. Not running things past a damn publicist when she wants to do more than write a sentence or two. They probably would have told her she could make her point but NOT name names.

3. Saying the women mentioned, "have had number ones with songs about being sexy, wearing no clothes, fucking, cheating, etc" because it sounds condescending as if they didn't have the right to have had number ones with those topics and that her music is DIFFERENT! The woman literally wrote a song that started out with "My pussy tastes like Pepsi Cola." You're not better than anyone else because you wear gowns and sing about sex instead of booty shorts.

She is so fucking insufferable, everything she says is spoiled white girl. She is unable to express herself in any other way.

I agree with others that it's hard to tell if she's racist or a dumbass or both.

Oh we must NEVER EVER question anything by "WOMEN OF COLOR"

If Lana were black and calling out white artists in the same way she would be fucking lauded. We all know this.

She sure has invoked the wrath of the identity warriors--the LA Times is even slamming her

Poor Lizzy.

That's not a slam, R55. It's canvassing the many sides of a toxic debate and lamenting the way women's outrage gets turned against each other instead of outwards against a system that is unfairly rigged against women.

Are we sure that she didn’t bone Harvey?

"If Lana were black and calling out white artists in the same way she would be fucking lauded. We all know this."

It's hilarious what racists think they know.

R58 I thought it was obvious that she did.

I love The Internet, but that is A Bridge To Far.

r59 calling out hypocrisy is racist?

This was some very effective race baiting by the OP.

Kehlani is actually a thing?

such a fucking double standard we are dealing with. Any opinion by POC, even if misguided or wrong, must be validated and supported, or you're a racist. Just like "mansplaining." If you correct a woman who is completely off-base, you are "mansplaining." Set some higher standards, for fuck sake. If Minaj came out saying Lana was degrading women, we'd have the wokeratti congratulating and praising her for her courage. But in this case, it's "racism."

R62, it is here.

I honestly think she's been spiraling for the last six months ever since she lost out again for the umpteenth time for the Grammy—that seemed to really hurt her ego and she obviously put a lot of work into her last album. That record was better than Billie Eilish's by miles, but at the same time, she is not someone who should really be comparing herself to top 40 artists. She's had one mainstream hit which mainly got exposure from its awful radio remix. She is not top 40 material, and that's what people like about her. I cannot relate to 70% of the things she writes about in her songs, but there is something about her music that has always punched me in the gut--something I cannot say about generic divas like Beyonce, Ariana Grande, etc. There is a profound sadness in Lana's voice and her melodies that hits you where it hurts. It's a perfect mixture of lushness, beauty, yearning, and pure sadness. Critics, generally speaking, have always given her music favorable reviews, and her albums have sold very well and made her wealthy. She should take pleasure in the fact that she's forged a successful career making the music she makes, because its audience is a limited albeit dedicated one.

“I honestly think she's been spiraling for the last six months ever since she lost out again for the umpteenth time for the Grammy—that seemed to really hurt her ego and she obviously put a lot of work into her last album.”

Boo hoo.

I'm not condoning it as an excuse for anything R68, I'm just saying that's what it looks like from the outside. She also broke up with her boyfriend shortly after that. I think she's too in her head about all of this.

R62: it is when there is no hypocrisy. Only in your small world.

Allegedly Weinstein is the one who told her that her pussy tastes like Pepsi. She openly admits that song was “inspired” by him. She fucked him because he wanted to put her in movies, and when that didn’t pan out he asked her to write a song for one his films.

Disgusting. Mark my words: one day she will write an article or a book and then go on a series of interviews saying that she told herself she was not disgusted and traumatized but over time, thanks in part to therapy and thanks to her artistry, she realized that she had been in denial about having been preyed upon by Weinstein. She will say she still doesn’t consider herself a feminist, exactly, because she embraces being ‘delicate’ and feminine, but that she wishes she had been able to be more honest with herself about the reality that she was abused by Weinstein and it was not a chosen ‘submissiveness’ that she depicted in her music; that was a fantasy she created to reconcile what happened.

It’ll happen. Just wait.

R34 agreed. Beyonce, like so many pop stars, is made up entirely of the team behind her. She's a great singer, sure, but she is not a great lyricist nor a competent songwriter. Almost all of her songs are written by large teams of people; if you look at her last album specifically, there are some tracks that have 15+ people credited as writers. She is basically Britney Spears, except she can sing. Alternately, Lana Del Rey writes all of her stuff with one or two people. She has a natural way with words—in a musical context, at least—that Beyonce has never had and never will have.

Hope that hot cop dick was worth it, Lana!

Doja cat show her homophia several times, Nicki MInaj lied about being bisexual to promote her career, so no effort in defending them for my part.

Lana is right, but her mistake is naming names because there are a lot of white singers who do exactly the same than the ones she mentioned

Everything is racist.

Ma says if you put a knife under tha bed it cuts da pain in two.

Any negative comments on women of color¨ by a white person in the entertainment business is career suicide.

[quote] There is a profound sadness in Lana's voice and her melodies that hits you where it hurts. It's a perfect mixture of lushness, beauty, yearning, and pure sadness.

Young and Beautiful was also a big hit I think? The music video version was fantastic. Perfect embodiment of all the qualities you listed.

I agree with every word R67. There is a haunting quality to her music that it makes it so even though I can't personality relate to it, I feel sad that anyone in world has ever felt that way. It makes me want to be more empathetic to the people around me. To me that's the highest compliment one can give any form of art.

She shouldn't be comparing herself, favorably or unfavorably, to people who are trying to do a completely different thing (Grande, Beyonce, etc). And as R67 points out, it's not like she hasn't recived crtical acclaim and financial success for her music, she definitely has. It's just not the sort of work that will ever be widely popular and she needs to stop chasing that and focus on what shes great at.

She boils down to: “I want to be pretty and sad and I want to sound pretty and sad, and I want ugly old drug addicted criminal men to fuck my brains out, and this point of view is revolutionary and I DESERVE EVERY AWARD!!! WHY IS THE WORLD SO UNFAIR TO LANA DEL REY??!”

I’m a fake Del Ray, too.

I’m a slut, too.

Where are MY awards?

Well, nowadays she's in very good company.

Isn't Ariana Grande white?

She's a female version of Chris Isaak: pretty and pretty bland.

As deep as a puddle but that's deep enough for shallow people.

I like her music a lot. She's unique and brave and apparently a little jealous right now. She needn't be.

r23, Please name a song in which jay-Z says faggot. I'll wait.... Because he almost never used the word even when he was a young thug rapper because of his mom. So again I'll wait. I'm so sick of you lying ass marys.

Will you still love her when she's no longer young and beautiful?

R88 No. Fortunately for her, she is very dedicated to her tragic-heroine act and she will probably make sure she dies tragically before that happens.

I was so surprised when "Norman Fucking Rockwell" topped many of the year-end lists last year.

I'm black and I don't find her comments racist at all. And she might be low key shading the other artist. But if you took her words at face value, she is just asking that if you are going to praise them for what they say, don't berate her for her lyrics which are an expression of a different female, and just as real, experience.

And by the way, none of us would be talking about any of this IF she hadn't mentioned names. Only those of her fanbase who chose to click on her name that day would have gotten the message. I think she knew what she was doing when she mentioned names. I am not sure though if she was ready for the wrath. To the simple minded, it's easy to paint her as a racist because the sound of her music hearkens back to a period in America where people of color weren't welcomed to the party. It's sort of like "Make America Great Again." And as a black person or even a gay person, you're like - what period was that? But she just plays with the imagery to, as I imagine, draw a stark comparison between how far we think we've come vs. how far we've actually come - again, just purely based on the music and the imagery.

I do love how she used Carole King's most deeply regretted lyric and breathed life into it again in UltraViolence - "He hit me, and it felt like a kiss." So the sentiment that Lana is expressing has been around for a while. Yet there is an irony and distance from the pure face value acceptance of it.

and yes R58, her song Pepsi Cola is all about Harvey Weinstein years before the #metoo movement. She doesn't place blame, but just simply calls the fame game out as it is.

"Harvey's in the sky with diamonds and he's making me crazy. All he wants to do is party with his pretty baby." Harvey's people actually complained about the line, but she refused to change it. If you look up some versions it does say "Ah, he's in the sky with diamonds." So using a Beatles' line about LSD and referencing Weinstein, its more about being caught up in this tripy world of Hollywood fame and success and wanting to be a part of it. After all she does say, "Let's ride." The most telling line though is, "I know your wife, she wouldn't mind.' She did end up writing the theme song for Big Eyes.

It does have one of the best opening lines of any song, "My pussy taste like Pepsi Cola..."

Didn't Del Ray have some spat with a female critic a few months back? She sounds thin-skinned.

Once again this quarantine has showed how dumb, tone deaf and shallow these celebrities are. I am a fan of Del Rey. I love that cinematic sound of her music. But that post was a mess. First, that ridiculous font. Who has the time or eye strain to read that? And then naming fellow singers. You know she was stirring up shit.

I don't think she's racist but naming names opened her up to scrutiny and criticism.

[quote]And by the way, none of us would be talking about any of this IF she hadn't mentioned names. Only those of her fanbase who chose to click on her name that day would have gotten the message. I think she knew what she was doing when she mentioned names. I am not sure though if she was ready for the wrath.

Yeah, this isn't the kind of attention any artist needs and if she both "knew what she was doing" and wasn't "ready for the wrath" then maybe the best thing would have been for her not to have done this at all?

[quote]To the simple minded, it's easy to paint her as a racist because

So you pointed out that you are "black" and are now calling her detractors over this issue who are predominantly black "simple minded?"

[quote]the sound of her music hearkens back to a period in America where people of color weren't welcomed to the party. It's sort of like "Make America Great Again." And as a black person or even a gay person, you're like - what period was that? But she just plays with the imagery to, as I imagine, draw a stark comparison between how far we think we've come vs. how far we've actually come - again, just purely based on the music and the imagery.

It's not that deep.

People just didn't want her coming for their favorite artists and the artists she mentioned were mostly women of color.

I don't think she's racist but I also don't think she thought any of that through and she already implied in one of her responses that two of the women (Ariana Grande and Doja Cat) contacted her directly and had "feedback." She and Ariana unfollowed each other on social media. So while the public might be pissed, so was she.

Ariana Grande is a woman of color? I thought she was Italian. Aren't Italians white?

I didn't care for her first few albums, but I was (much to my surprise) blown away by how great her "Norman Fucking Rockwell!" album was. It's the first album in a few years where I needed/wanted to listen to it a few times in a row before I could make up my mind about it. That being said, she needs to stop whining about awards. To paraphrase Chuck Sheen in "Ferris Bueller," she needs to spend a little less time worry about what everyone else is doing, and spend more time worrying about her own shit.

r95 I don't get what you are saying.

I am not familiar with the racial makeup of Lana del Rey's detractors. But I do think anyone calling her a racist is simple minded. And if most of her detractors are black, then by default, I am calling those people simple minded, yes. You know black people aren't all one unit operating with one brain. We are allowed to disagree with each other and call each other names. I guess you're not familiar with Baptist vs. Methodist, Nene vs. Porsha, or the entire Hip Hop Community.

Oh, dear R98

[quote]I am not familiar with the racial makeup of Lana del Rey's detractors.

But you commented on it?

[quote] And if most of her detractors are black, then by default, I am calling those people simple minded, yes. You know black people aren't all one unit operating with one brain. We are allowed to disagree with each other and call each other names.

Who the hell said that? And no, you just can't walk into a group of people you don't know and call them names and think you'll get out of there unscathed. Are you 12?

[quote]I guess you're not familiar with Baptist vs. Methodist, Nene vs. Porsha, or the entire Hip Hop Community.

I only came back to this post as I was clearing posts because I was disgusted that you decided to make such broad assumptions about who you're talking to. You shouldn't. It makes an ass out of you and in this case also you.

I don't think she's "racist," but she's definitely had a privileged life and is one of these "both sides" types. If she wasn't a musician, she'd be living in Greenwich with her 2.5 kids and hedgefund hubby, going to yoga, drinking green smoothies and being "liberal" without actual effort being made.

We have to believe and say that Beyoncé is the next Beethoven, otherwise we're misogynoir.

Doja Cat, Ariana [Grande], Camila [Cabello], Cardi B, Kehlani, Nicki Minaj, and Beyoncé should stop using sex as a weapon.

I like Lana. I don't think her comments were racist. Just dumb. But I don't think that's very shocking.

For pop music? Only Gaga is pulling through these days.

[quote]Ariana Grande is a woman of color? I thought she was Italian. Aren't Italians white?

Grande is a white girl.

I love the way she promotes her two books of poetry that will be coming out with Simon and Schuster at the end of that post, even name checking the publisher.

Lana's live vocals used to be pretty shit a few years ago but now they sound like they were recorded in the studio. I wonder if she's using live auto tune and pitch correction.

So what, r100?

This bitch can’t sing AT ALL. Remember her disastrous SNL performance?

here to answer all of R95 / R99s questions.

[quote]but you commented on it?

Yes, this is a forum where people comment on things that are being discussed. You say that as if it's not allowed. And the only thing I said I DIDN'T KNOW was the racial makeup of LDR's detractors. But what I DO KNOW is that they are simple minded. So the simple mindedness is what I was commenting on.

[quote]Who the hell said that?

You did R95, here - [italic]So you pointed out that you are "black" and are now calling her detractors over this issue who are predominantly black "simple minded?"

As if me being black and calling other black people simple minded is an impossibility or a betrayal- the one unit sharing one brain mentality. I'll connect the dots for you. I said the detractors who call LDR's music racist are simple minded. You said most of LDR's detractors are black. Then I said well if they are mostly black, then those people are simple minded. What's not to get?

[quote]I was disgusted that you decided to make such broad assumptions about who you're talking to.

Disgusted? Really? You're correct. I have no idea who you are. I made no assumptions about you. I simply took a guess at it, as I stated - "I guess." I'm purely going on how you have chosen to reveal yourself through your self-righteous, hyperbolic writing. Using words like "unscathed" and "disgusted" don't make your point more impactful. It just makes what you have to say sound unhinged.