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The border with Canada

What is going on? The linked article appears to show an open border. And yet this family crossed it and ended up in … PA. Border-dwellers, tell us how the border with Canada works. Are Canadians and US citizens allowed to cross and re-cross without being checked? When you do your grocery shopping on main street do you go to the butcher and baker in Canada and then to the candlestick maker in the US? (I assume the family in the report came to grief because they had a visa waiver for Canada but not for the US.)

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by Anonymousreply 137October 20, 2019 4:28 PM

[quote]And yet this family crossed it and ended up in … PA.

You can't read, can you. It says they were in Vancouver, were caught in Washington state, and then put on a plane to PA.

[quote]The family, from Maidstone, in Kent, claim they were visiting Vancouver on October 3 when Michael Connors swerved to avoid hitting an animal, accidentally resulting in them driving along a country road out of Canada into the United States.

Their story, however, sounds rather fishy to me. Why would they swerve to avoid an animal, then take a road for what was likely many miles into Washington? Where were they going in the first place that they were so close to the border if it were not their intention to cross into Washington. Why would you continue driving down a country road, rather than simply returning to your original route and destination - wherever that was?

by Anonymousreply 1October 15, 2019 3:20 PM

You are not supposed to enter either country other than at a legal border point. I gather there are roads where you can cross. Seems idiotic they wouldn't be marked and I don't buy the swerved to hit an animal. How far do you have to swerve?

All that said, typical over reaction.

by Anonymousreply 2October 15, 2019 3:20 PM

Also, they look like utter. vermin. That resentful type that fuels Labour yet loves Brexit, drunken brawls at the footie, and fillers and tattoos. Anyway, Maidstone is not a nice town. Even so, one wishes even our scum would be treated properly when their level of intellect betrays them.

by Anonymousreply 3October 15, 2019 3:23 PM

Build that wall!

by Anonymousreply 4October 15, 2019 3:39 PM

What happens if you swerve on a country lane to avoid hitting a moose and end up in Canada? Do you get banged up by the Mounties?

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by Anonymousreply 5October 15, 2019 3:44 PM

Here's another one.

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by Anonymousreply 6October 15, 2019 4:04 PM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 7October 15, 2019 4:26 PM

We discussed this last night at Thanksgiving. Two questions came to mind:

1. Did they have passports on them?

2. Are there no signs along 0 Avenue, or whatever road they were taking, informing drivers the US border?

It's true ICE wasted US taxpayers' dollars flying the family to a Pennsylvania detainment facility (was the Tacoma one full? Is there some new policy that travellers entering from Canada don't know?). We don't hear about Canadians getting detained like the French jogger and the English family, but it could be that British Columbians know enough about the malevolence to not get caught without ID, or have a clue that 0 Avenue is the southernmost east-west road.

These stories sound like CBP was just waiting behind the trees or a utility pole like state patrol officers at speed traps ready to snatch passport carrying tourists and send them to detention facilities nationwide but that doesn't seem likely to me. One scary thing about CBP is that the officers aren't uniformly informed and trained about treatment of violators. A CBP officer last week said to me "the field officers are those you ask for clemency or exceptions, the central office you ask for permission."

by Anonymousreply 8October 15, 2019 4:45 PM

Adding onto r8, I chatted with a Vancouver resident, he told me of an incident 17 years ago where an acquaintance drove with his acquaintance his just purchased Porsche into the US, the two were sent to a detention facility because the passenger's name matched one on a list. The next day the acquaintance was released and returned to Canada, the driver remained in detention for three weeks. The driver lost his car because he couldn't get to his bank, couldn't call a friend to explain his situation, and didn't pay for the car in full, so it was repossessed.

by Anonymousreply 9October 15, 2019 4:49 PM

[quote]We don't hear about Canadians getting detained like the French jogger and the English family

According to this CBC article, we've been hearing more about it recently. It's a disturbing trend, especially as it seems so random.

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by Anonymousreply 10October 15, 2019 5:02 PM

Following R8, there don't appear to be any country lanes south off O Ave. It's puzzling.

by Anonymousreply 11October 15, 2019 5:03 PM

r11 I didn't know Canadians could say "I changed my mind, just direct me to the road that returns me to my homeland" at the border and they'd be released, and I've made scores of border crossings.

by Anonymousreply 12October 15, 2019 5:12 PM

I have a bit of sympathy for them, accidentally driving into another country (that isn't part of the UK) isn't possible from England.

by Anonymousreply 13October 15, 2019 5:16 PM

Perhaps they were trying to go to the opera or borrow a book.

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by Anonymousreply 14October 15, 2019 5:18 PM

Comment from the article at R10 about the Canadian being detained...

"I heard about this one on the other local news that does ya know good reporting....the reason why they refused entry is she lives in her van and " works" remote and they were worried she had no reason to return to canada "

US is really strict about not working without permission. For all we know those trashy Brits could have been caught lying about one thing or another. CPB can be absolute pricks but they usually aren't going to go through a detention process without cause. There has to be more to the story with the Brits (and there were SEVEN of them: and ALL were detained). Lost? They seem to live on their fucking phones. They have GPS. They aren't in rural Guatemala. Worst thing you can do to CPB/DHS is lie.

Canada won't let US Citizens/LPR in if they have DUI. Ever. Super strict about it, too. Plenty of Americans are turned away from Canada.

by Anonymousreply 15October 15, 2019 5:29 PM

The Daily Mail did the story too and loves to stitch up chavs, so if they were up to something more or less than they claim, the Maul will get to the b bottom of it. The Maul is the mean girls of newspapers.

by Anonymousreply 16October 15, 2019 7:43 PM

Well, they do look like typical chavs.

by Anonymousreply 17October 15, 2019 8:43 PM

Sure enough... Border Services said they were denied entry visas... claims they crossed anyway.

Sounds like Maidstone.

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by Anonymousreply 18October 15, 2019 9:10 PM

Can somebody copy and paste here the text on R18's link ? Damn paywall

by Anonymousreply 19October 15, 2019 9:51 PM

for r19 and paywalled lurkers:

A British family currently held in U.S. immigration custody was arrested for making what U.S. agents believe was a deliberate attempt to enter the United States illegally from Canada, U.S. Customs and Border Protection said Tuesday in a statement.

The arrest and detention of the Connors family received extensive coverage in the United States and Britain after their attorney described them as tourists who accidentally drove across the border and ended up jailed with their small children in what they described as squalid conditions.

The family’s attorney, Bridget Cambria, said her clients were driving near the U.S. border south of Vancouver on Oct. 2 when they swerved to avoid an animal and veered into the United States inadvertently. The family members said they were stopped by a U.S. agent, were denied a request to return to Canada, and instead were sent to a family detention center in Pennsylvania, where they are being held pending deportation.

CBP officials disputed the family’s version of events and said the Connors were spotted via video surveillance “slowly and deliberately driving through a ditch onto Boundary Road in Blaine, Washington” between parallel roadways on the U.S. and Canadian sides. The roads are not connected by cross streets, and the only legal way to traverse between the countries is at staffed border stations throughout the region.

Cambria could not immediately be reached Tuesday for comment.

The CBP statement said U.S. agents also determined that two of the family members had applied for travel authorization to visit the United States and were denied. A senior CBP official said the Connors applied for visa waivers last year, and it was not immediately clear why they were rejected.

Such waivers are available to British passport holders and other foreign nationals from countries for whom the United States has less-restrictive visa requirements.

The official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe the case, said the family — four adults and three small children — were in possession of $16,000 in cash at the time of their arrest.

“Attempts were made to return the individuals to Canada, however, Canada refused to allow their return and two attempts to contact the United Kingdom consulate were unsuccessful,” the CBP statement read.

The CBP official said it was not clear why Canada refused to let the family back into the country.

At that point, the official said, “by law and procedure we have to turn them over to ICE,” referring to U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

Eileen Connors, 24, filed a complaint with the Department of Homeland Security Inspector General on Friday alleging that her entire family, including her 3-month-old son, have spent more than a week living in “frigid” and “filthy” conditions at the Berks Family Residential Center in Leesport, Pa.

“We will never forget, we will be traumatized for the rest of our lives by what the United States government has done to us,” Connors wrote in a sworn statement. “We have been treated like criminals here, stripped of our rights, and lied to,” she wrote, calling the ordeal “undoubtedly the worst experience we have ever lived through.”

302 wa.po comments at the time of this pasting and posting.

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Attempting to enter without declaring over $10,000 in possession is wrong.

Canada could reject the Brits if they didn't have passports OR if they had over $10,000 in possession and did not declare it on return to Canada, or any reason we don't know about because it hasn't been reported in news media.

My dinner party attendees have some familiarity with the area (Blaine, not Sumas or Back40) and disbelieve the Connors' story of accidentally crossing to avoid hitting a small animal.

by Anonymousreply 20October 15, 2019 10:06 PM

I wonder why they were denied ESTAS. Criminal record perhaps?

by Anonymousreply 21October 15, 2019 10:29 PM

[quote] Border-dwellers, tell us how the border with Canada works. Are Canadians and US citizens allowed to cross and re-cross without being checked?

No, we're checked 99.9% of the time. The 0.1% I wasn't I was already accounted for by my spouse in the vehicle ahead of me as we crossed into Point Roberts.

[quote] When you do your grocery shopping on main street do you go to the butcher and baker in Canada and then to the candlestick maker in the US?

Butcher, yes. Dairy in Lynden is excellent, and some nightshade plants like eggplant and tomatoes we can shop for at Trader Joe's. Gas we try to buy in Point Roberts. I have a US post box for when good deals on candlesticks appear at Amazon.

by Anonymousreply 22October 16, 2019 5:15 AM

"In a sworn statement Eileen Connors, 24, said they accidentally crossed the border while trying to swerve out the way of an animal on the road."

If CBP produce the alleged video, I assume Eileen will be prosecuted for swearing a false statement. That sounds like it could be perjury: Alger Hiss got five years.

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by Anonymousreply 23October 16, 2019 1:43 PM

Any of you bitches live in Derby Line, Vermont/Stanstead, Quebec?

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by Anonymousreply 24October 16, 2019 1:50 PM

Eurotrash!

by Anonymousreply 25October 16, 2019 2:08 PM

$16K in cash, Canada won't take them back, the UK consulate fails to respond ... what is going on with these people? They sound like international pariahs.

by Anonymousreply 26October 16, 2019 2:09 PM

Are they gypsies?

by Anonymousreply 27October 16, 2019 2:10 PM

Finally, somebody brexits.

by Anonymousreply 28October 16, 2019 2:12 PM

R25 = Gunilla Garson Goldberg

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by Anonymousreply 29October 16, 2019 2:14 PM

We understand completely what it's like to have the worst kind of Brits come in and you can't get rid of them, like bedbugs.

by Anonymousreply 30October 16, 2019 2:19 PM

R27 They're from Maidstone.

by Anonymousreply 31October 16, 2019 2:22 PM

They were denied visas to the US, Canada refused to take them back and they had $16k in cash on them?!

They don't sound very innocent to me.

by Anonymousreply 32October 16, 2019 2:26 PM

[quote]The official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to describe the case, said the family — four adults and three small children — were in possession of $16,000 in cash at the time of their arrest.

Who goes out for a leisurely jaunt with $16K?

Where were they staying in Canada during their "vacation" prior to "accidentally" illegally entering the US? If they were not intending to come to the the US, I'm sure they are still registered at their Vancouver hotel, right?

by Anonymousreply 33October 16, 2019 2:34 PM

It's a bit scary: just suppose you're walking the dog and it dashes across the border on some urgent and imperative errand (eg some irresistible scent); you can see it sniffing something in the grass but it won't return when you call it; you can't just go and get it and re-attach the leash or the powers will grab you (and your little dog too).

by Anonymousreply 34October 16, 2019 2:54 PM

You wait for someone on the other side to eventually assist with your dog, R34. Do people really think no mans land is just a lawn for pets to dump on? It’s an international border. Border officials are there to follow and enforce non-arbitrary decisions, to protect its citizens from known criminals and Brexiters.

by Anonymousreply 35October 16, 2019 3:03 PM

They were probably headed to California to try their luck at porn.

by Anonymousreply 36October 16, 2019 3:06 PM

These people are being disingenuous. Their story makes no sense and I guarantee they were up to no good. Can’t prove it, though.

And it’s interesting to note that the heavy-handed border approach applies to white people in the north as well.

by Anonymousreply 37October 16, 2019 3:09 PM

O come on y'all. Haven't we all at one point strayed into a foreign country we'd previously been denied entry to with $16k in cash on us? I do it all the time!

by Anonymousreply 38October 16, 2019 3:10 PM

R27, my first thought. They look like Russians, but I think they’re Travellers, or whatever they’re called. Grifter scum.

by Anonymousreply 39October 16, 2019 3:10 PM

They’re allowed to give interviews? Huh.

by Anonymousreply 40October 16, 2019 3:13 PM

They're travellers/gypsies. No 24 year old non-traveller is called Eileen.

by Anonymousreply 41October 16, 2019 3:21 PM

They are liars. I know the area. In order to cross from 0 Avenue to Washington., you need to cross a deep and very noticeable ditch. Their excuse of swerving to avoid an animal is bullshit. Also, CBC is reporting two of the three adults in the vehicle had previously been denied entry into the US. This lying British bitch whining about jail conditions should be charged for endangering her child.

by Anonymousreply 42October 16, 2019 3:22 PM

R35 There is no such thing as no-man's land there. The border is a line. Some parts are remote with few passers-by to help with R34's dog: you have to make an incursion into the other country, retrieve your pet and cross back across the border fast - the other country's police will not follow you back across the border; but beware of snipers.

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by Anonymousreply 43October 16, 2019 3:27 PM

R37 - they are white-adjacent.

by Anonymousreply 44October 16, 2019 3:29 PM

These things happen.

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by Anonymousreply 45October 16, 2019 3:31 PM

This is weird. I wouldn't expect chavs like that to even have $16k in cash. That's probably everything they have. I haven't read all the info about this but my guess is that they were convinced they could start a new life in America as "undocumented immigrants."

by Anonymousreply 46October 16, 2019 3:45 PM

[quote] That's probably everything they have.

What about their car, or was it a rental? If it was a rental, where is it now: did Hertz or Dollar or Thrifty have to do some cross-border repatriation and is the rental company now suing the renters?

by Anonymousreply 47October 16, 2019 3:57 PM

r47 The rental company was probably contacted, the owner info comes up in a license plate search, and employees come to retrieve it after the CBP have examined and searched the vehicle.

by Anonymousreply 48October 16, 2019 4:29 PM

Agree with above - I immediately thought they were travelers when I saw the pic and their names. They were going to grift US residents.

And yes - they were denied entry to US because of their prior arrests - most likely for theft and disorderly conduct. Many people aren't aware that you can be denied entry into another country if you have a misdemeanor charge of assault or battery. A bar fight can exclude you from international travel.

Grifters and liars.

by Anonymousreply 49October 16, 2019 4:44 PM

[quote] they were denied entry to US because of their prior arrests

What prior arrests?

by Anonymousreply 50October 16, 2019 4:47 PM

$16,000 … in cash … You use cash when you do not want a credit card or ATM trail.

by Anonymousreply 51October 16, 2019 5:18 PM

The border ditch (link)

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by Anonymousreply 52October 16, 2019 5:22 PM

Were they selling their driveway-repaving services? Or carpet from their trunk?

by Anonymousreply 53October 16, 2019 5:47 PM

R52 If you rotate the view left once the ditch looks quite deep with steep sides. If a car swerved into it to avoid hitting an animal, the car and passengers would have been badly damaged. You could only get across it slowly and deliberately and even then with difficulty. Having said that I want to see the video recording before I believe the authorities.

by Anonymousreply 54October 16, 2019 5:51 PM

[quote] $16,000 … in cash … You use cash when you do not want a credit card or ATM trail.

$16k in cash does sound shady (in this particular case, because of the other circumstances). But, generally, it's not that crazy. AFAIK, this was a collective sum from FOUR adults with 3 dependants/kids (so 7 people in total). So that's just over $2k per person.

As an example, I usually carry at least $2k on me when I travel internationally (as an "emergency" backup if something happens to my cards). Because bank cards are not fool-proof. They can stop working (get damaged); or your bank might temporarily freeze the foreign transaction if they think it needs extra security verification (so you'll need to waste time & money calling your bank's customer support). It's sometimes just easier to carry a bit of emergency cash, in case your cards get declined. $2k per person or dependant sounds reasonable (depending on the overall duration of travel) - it's enough to cover any emergency lodgings, food, hospital bills (before insurance compensation) and transportation.

by Anonymousreply 55October 16, 2019 6:24 PM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 56October 16, 2019 6:28 PM

So let me get this straight an American woman kills a British teenager claims diplomatic immunity and flies home in a private laid on by an American jet after agreeing to meet British police to avoid arrest then a British couple drive across Canadian border kill no one and end up in jail.

by Anonymousreply 57October 16, 2019 6:32 PM

[quote] This is getting worse

Speeding, driving on the wrong side of the road.... You mean it's getting [italic]better[/italic], R56. I'm waiting for the sex tape & the meth stash to be discovered. This trainwreck story is getting more engrossing.

by Anonymousreply 58October 16, 2019 8:37 PM

I Live in BC near the Blaine border and you need a passport or a nexus card to cross. If you being things in from either country you have to declare them. I find crossing into the USA is easy but I always get hassled coming back into Canada.

by Anonymousreply 59October 16, 2019 8:42 PM

Fishing?

"C'mon everyone, we've room in our auto for fishing."

Surrey relatives: "the baby's three months old. Don't you think its crying will scare away the fish? Should it be outside with you while you fish? We can take care of it if Eileen really wants to go with you."

Eileen: "Nah, 's fine. All the mums I know take infants fishing with them."

by Anonymousreply 60October 16, 2019 8:49 PM

Also - isn't the max amount of currency you can bring into the US set at $10,000? That's another foul on their part.

by Anonymousreply 61October 16, 2019 8:57 PM

The kids definitely needed to carry $2k cash for their vacation. Oh yup. Nothing shady there.

by Anonymousreply 62October 16, 2019 9:25 PM

R59 The nexus card or the passport are required for border crossings at border entry points only, correct? Even if you have a passport on you (or a nexus card), you still can't legally cross the ditch from 0 Ave to E Boundary Road, eg on foot or in a car, right? In practice, do people cross the ditch from time to time (walking the dog, herding the sheep) illegally or does everyone on both sides of the ditch show complete self-restraint? (I am assuming the ditch, which I can see on Google Maps, is not difficult to cross on foot; in a car, it looks like it could be challenging even though our heros managed it with three babies on board, crazy.)

by Anonymousreply 63October 16, 2019 9:35 PM

Looking at the satellite image (link), there appear to be farmsteads to the north and the south of the border: what happens if you need help in an emergency, you're not going to get your passport out and drive to the nearest border entry point, cross the border then drive back to your neighbours on the other side, surely? Is this border really a zero-tolerance situation?

As a European, I can say that no border in Europe is observed unless it is fortified, walled, guarded, electrified. Otherwise you go hunting, shooting and fishing all over with impunity. A minor ditch would not make any difference in Europe. (I do not accept that these bozos were going fishing, BTW!)

The contrast seems rather startling, between Europe and N America, in this respect.

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by Anonymousreply 64October 16, 2019 9:44 PM

R61, 10 grand - per person, not per family or group, I think. AFAIK, there are 4 adults in this case (so $40k would probably be their allowed customs limit).

by Anonymousreply 65October 16, 2019 9:46 PM

R61 If the $16K belonged to one person, then that person needs to declare any cash of theirs over $10K.

by Anonymousreply 66October 16, 2019 9:51 PM

Obviously, R60. You're supposed to present at a Point of Entry and be inspected and admitted. Otherwise, if caught, you are unlawfully present (aka "undocumented").

So no, you cannot just walk across the border and back. Sure, you can probably do it and not get caught (tons of people do it in Mexico), but as technology catches up CPB can definitely see you. I'm sure they have cameras along that stretch border; it's not like it's the mountainous hinterlands. Even if you crossed on foot, CPB might be like "uh.... why are you out here with no car?"

This is of course in today's world. Before then it wasn't as complicated.

by Anonymousreply 67October 16, 2019 9:52 PM

Sorry, that was for R63 re: NEXUS/Passport/Passport Card

by Anonymousreply 68October 16, 2019 9:56 PM

R66, when it's a family unit, they can just split it up between themselves however they wish. It's not about e.g. employment income, etc (that's irrelevant), it's just about cash in possession. That's how it's done at customs virtually all across the world. Because how exactly do you plan to prove the extra $6k "belongs" to one family member and not the other? They're a family - they split the money however they wish. E.g. a husband can simply say he gifted half the money to his wife - and that 2nd half "belongs" to her. You can't prove he didn't gift it to her. So it's usually a moot point.

by Anonymousreply 69October 16, 2019 10:03 PM

Wow, they really rolled out the old "welcome wagon" for them. This country gets stranger by the day.

by Anonymousreply 70October 16, 2019 10:06 PM

[quote] This is of course in today's world. Before then it wasn't as complicated.

Weirdly I was under the impression that the US/Canada border, prior to 9/11, was open except in major towns eg Detroit–Windsor and that if there was a fire (say) on Campobello the fire department in Lubec would come to the rescue, if necessary, without the need to show passports etc. I bet the President did not have to carry his Nexus card (or 1930s equivalent, if any) when he escaped to Campobello for a drink in the middle of the Prohibition!

by Anonymousreply 71October 16, 2019 10:17 PM

[quote] Wow, they really rolled out the old "welcome wagon" for them. This country gets stranger by the day.

I reckon they were watching the Connors even before they crossed to border. I reckon the Canadians and the US were all watching the Connors, for some reason. The Canadians tipped the US off, and CBP got the old "welcome wagon" out (after having filmed them crossing the ditch). Canada then washed its hands of them, no doubt relieved to be rid of the problem.

by Anonymousreply 72October 16, 2019 10:25 PM

[quote] The kids definitely needed to carry $2k cash for their vacation. Oh yup. Nothing shady there.

Depends on the duration of the vacation. Some Brits stay in the US for months (6 months is the max limit, I think).

by Anonymousreply 73October 16, 2019 10:27 PM

R73 It depends on the Brit's situation. Under the visa waiver program it's up to 90 days. Under the B1/B2 visa it is up to six months. These guys were neither under the visa waiver program nor under the B1/B2 visa, it seems. Why they were carrying $16,000 on a fishing expedition is not explained.

by Anonymousreply 74October 16, 2019 10:30 PM

Is illegal to carry 16K in cash over the border?

by Anonymousreply 75October 16, 2019 10:51 PM

I don't think it is illegal. it definitely needs to be declared.

by Anonymousreply 76October 16, 2019 10:53 PM

Why "definitely"? If it's under $10k per person, I don't think it needs to be declared. I doubt that out of those 2-4 adults, only 1 person said he owned all the cash.

by Anonymousreply 77October 16, 2019 10:58 PM

They look like chavs

by Anonymousreply 78October 16, 2019 11:01 PM

Could they be Roma Gypsies?

by Anonymousreply 79October 16, 2019 11:03 PM

[quote] Hounded in Europe, Roma in the U.S. Keep a Low Profile

They should have claimed asylum if they wanted to be in the US.

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by Anonymousreply 80October 16, 2019 11:08 PM

Whether they're grifter Gypsies or not, they were still treated quite shabbily for British subjects. I think America has gone a bit too far seperating children, and tossing so many in detention centres. If they were willing to turn around, they should have been allowed to do so. If the Canadian authorities did know something they're not sharing, they should have barred their entry, or arrested them on Canadian soil.

Many seem "suspicious" especially in the age of Trump and rampant xenophobia, yet they shouldn't be treated in this manner. if America is truly taxed by all these people, and her courts are clogged, the pragmatic thing to do would be to send them straight home if Canada didn't want them, or had tipped them off. I'm not keen on the smell of this as a Brit living here in America.

by Anonymousreply 81October 16, 2019 11:08 PM

R79, they might be gypsies / 'travellers', but very unlikely that they're Roma. This is how Roma-ethnic people generally look (they're thought to be descended from the Indian sub-continent group). They usually look a bit Indian.

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by Anonymousreply 82October 16, 2019 11:11 PM

R82 That phenotype may be popular in certain European camps or enclaves, yet the Romanichals in the UK are not so recognisable as being of Indian descent. These lines are the same Gypsies here in America too. They have been mixing for almost a millennia. Most have admixture of Eastern European genes, some Persian, and other Middle-Eastern heritage.

Scintis look different to Roma also. I have a friend who is a quarter Scinti, and she is blonde haired, and blue-eyed. Many Greek Gypsies are blue-eyed as well. If one looks at the Gypsie community in the south here in the US, they blend in. Most are from Britain/Ireland before coming to America. Here they mix freely with Travellers.

by Anonymousreply 83October 16, 2019 11:34 PM

[quote] Whether they're grifter Gypsies or not, they were still treated quite shabbily for British subjects. I'm not keen on the smell of this as a Brit living here in America.

R81 Are you a British "subject"? If so, what are you doing here? The Connorses (to use the WaPo's rather labored expression) seem to be British citizens.

by Anonymousreply 84October 16, 2019 11:38 PM

Faces of Meth. Canada didn't even allow them to return there.

by Anonymousreply 85October 16, 2019 11:44 PM

R84 Yes, and I have lived here going on twenty-one years. I'm neither a troll, nor a Gypsie, but a Jew who believes in fair treatment under the law for everyone, especially minorities. Human rights and dignified treatment of immigrants seems to be in peril here, considering the borders and hostility toward all immigrants.

by Anonymousreply 86October 16, 2019 11:45 PM

You're nuts, r43. This is what most of the border looks like.

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by Anonymousreply 87October 16, 2019 11:46 PM

I grew up near Derby Line and live outside Burlington VT now. The border was there, but largely ignored. My aunt and uncle had the border going through part of their backyard. Both countries, Vermont , and Quebec ignored that. If you went to the library, you had to cross the border to use some shelves. You could come in from one country and leave through the door to another No one really cared. Now, my aunt says there are blocked streets and sidewalks and official border crossings.

by Anonymousreply 88October 16, 2019 11:53 PM

Why is he nuts R87? That's not no-man's land: that's a clearing between countries; the border is less than a millimeter thick, presumably somewhere within the Slash, assuming the Slash has been accurately executed. "Unfortunately, there was no GPS system at the time, so the border markers were inadvertently placed in a zig-zag fashion, straying north or south of the official 49th parallel border by an average of 295 feet." Have the border markers been put in the right place by now? Is the Slash now accurate? What if I am hunting: I might stray into another country and be arrested, with a weapon!? Just scary, given the authorities' behavior (R59 "I find crossing into the USA is easy but I always get hassled coming back into Canada"; getting into Canada is always a siege, getting into the US less so and easy in some places.) "Despite its errors, witnessing the Slash is still on the bucket list of hundreds of geography nerds worldwide." I wouldn't dare walk within 300' of the Slash, even unloaded for bear!

And the slash is straight, so as to facilitate surveillance.

by Anonymousreply 89October 17, 2019 12:13 AM

[quote] Now, my aunt says there are blocked streets and sidewalks and official border crossings.

When did that all start R88?

by Anonymousreply 90October 17, 2019 12:19 AM

R88 Were there other US/Canada places like that, where "No one really cared?"

by Anonymousreply 91October 17, 2019 12:26 AM

Are you familiar with this part of the VT/PQ border R88? The border runs down the middle of street - the houses on the north side are in Canada, the south side is the US.

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by Anonymousreply 92October 17, 2019 12:28 AM

The border certainly was more porous up in Maine during the early 80s R91

by Anonymousreply 93October 17, 2019 12:30 AM

And, what kind of cash was it? If it was US currency, it especially shows intent.

by Anonymousreply 94October 17, 2019 12:42 AM

R92: this is amazing; you drive one way along your street (rue Canusa) you're in one country; when you drive the otherway, you're in the other country. And when you turn off the street into you own driveway you may be crossing an international border. How do CBP and their fascist Canadian counterparts cope with that? Both seem to have a border control at the west end of the street: it must be murder living there! There is a cafe to the north and a USPS post office to the south. Can you drink your expresso on la rue Principale then saunter down to the post office on Beebe Road across the border to send a letter? And if you do send a letter from the USPS to one of your Canadian neighbours, does it count as international mail and take as long?

by Anonymousreply 95October 17, 2019 12:50 AM

The north side of Rue Canusa looks better.

by Anonymousreply 96October 17, 2019 12:54 AM

Is the woman in the white apron the maid or the matriarch?

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by Anonymousreply 97October 17, 2019 12:58 AM

R83 I live near one of the largest Irish Traveller communities in the US, in SC. They don't really mix, with anyone. They are very particular about maintaining their bloodlines. I have actually known a couple of people who have married into them, and before the family/community would allow them in they had to prove they were completely white, among other things. Based on pictures of these people they look like Irish Travellers.

by Anonymousreply 98October 17, 2019 1:21 AM

R98 No argument here, as I agree they look like travellers. If you ever watch the Gypsies on TLC, they intermarry. In places like VA, WV, GA, and TN, they aren't as "exclusive" as they must be in SC!

by Anonymousreply 99October 17, 2019 1:30 AM

R99 It is because those communities tend to be much smaller, so they need to intermarry with other groups. Murphy Village in South Carolina is made up of around 2,500 people and is the wealthiest community of Travellers, in the US. One of the TLC shows showed a local girl marrying into them, she is one of the ones I know about, and the show really didn't show all she had to go through to get "approved." Just like they didn't show how the parents of people who are accepted to marry into the Travellers are paid between $5,000 and $10,000 in cash.

by Anonymousreply 100October 17, 2019 1:52 AM

I love the comment about running into a moose somewhere above...there hasn't been a wild moose within 500 km of Vancouver during the past century. As for fishing - who the Hell would go inland along the border to some no-name lake when you can head further north to the world's biggest sturgeon in the Fraser river, or some of the best ocean fishing along the coast?

by Anonymousreply 101October 17, 2019 2:44 AM

British subjects or not, let us review again what we have read so far. They crossed over a ditch. They claim it was to avoid an animal. So why didn't they cross back over? And just look at that ditch. It would not be easy to just swerve over it. They were driving at a very high speed. They were carrying a very large sum of money. Even if that sum of money was spread out over several people, some of the people were children. Do you think children would be carrying thousands as spending cash? And wasn't it said they or some of the group tried to enter the USA before, but were refused? It appears that something very, very fishy is going on. Oh, and speaking of fishy, weren't they suddenly going on a fishing trip? It's like the more they talk, the more suspicious this all seems.

They were behaving in what seems, on the surface at least, a very suspicious manner. They did something that got them into some hot water. So, what did they expect? To be treated to 5 star accommodations?

I wonder if they were maybe headed to California as illegals, hoping to get whatever benefits offered?

by Anonymousreply 102October 17, 2019 6:19 AM

[quote] They have been mixing for almost a millennia.

R83, if those 'gypsies' / 'travellers' have been "mixing" so much in the UK for "millennia" - then they have likely already lost most of their original Roma ethnicity through dilution. I would bet they are almost fully of Anglo-Celtic ethnicity by now. For example, it's thought that Europeans originally came from sub-saharan Africa, via migration - but after "millennia" (including mixing with some Neanderthal groups), they have become a rather different haplogroup from their original ancestors. Most Europeans don't claim African ethnicity. Similarly, most British "gypsies" are by now likely almost completely English / Irish - not Roma.

[quote] "Roma, singular Rom, also called Romany, or Gypsies: an ethnic group of traditionally itinerant people who originated in northern India (the Rajasthan, Haryana, and Punjab regions) and live in modern times worldwide, principally in Europe."

by Anonymousreply 103October 17, 2019 7:17 AM

R103 I rather meant that the population was subject to European and additional admixture throughout their entire diaspora. (not simply mixing with Vikings and Celts) They were in several locales before the British Isles. They usually do engage in consanguinity, and do keep to their own, but obviously over so many centuries, they have acquired substantial admixture.

They have left India in waves too. I believe scientists studying genetics believe there were three large migrations. What often shows up through DNA is Persian, (they were mercenaries there awhile for some ancient armies) as well as Slavic, having had long found refuge in places like Bulgaria, Romania, and Hungary. Though I believe you're right about so many generations later, their DNA still tells a story, especially the males' Y-DNA Haplogroups. Often, Mitochondrial DNA shows the admixture in many different populations of Roma.

There is little debate that the phenotypes of most Gypsies in the UK look quite European. It is also believed those who have the Romanichal Gypsie identity left India in the first wave of migration, hence more time for the possibility of admixture. A geneticist once explained to me as example, if a full-blooded Chinese person, taken out of his native population, and placed amongst soley Europeans, he will cease to have offspring with any recognisable Chinese features in six generations. The Haplogroups however still tell the tales of our transmigrations over time.

by Anonymousreply 104October 17, 2019 9:35 AM

the linked article is very one-sided, CBP does not release too much information except the said person or people were detained by them and currently in a detention facility. Because if you enter the country illegally, the outcome (deported, voluntary departure, released...) will be decided by an immigration court, not by CBP. They are just following the established legal procedures here.

If you got caught by the police, you won' expect the cop will listen to you and follow your words (I made a mistake, I won't do it again, can I go now...), they will check your ID and verify the existing warrants or criminal records, bring you the station, fingerprint you, release you after bonding hearing etc...If they let you dictate how things being handled and release you, people will criticize the police didn't do their job and expose the public to the danger of potential criminals. It's the same thing here. CBP have procedures to follow, especially for foreigners enter the country illegally, the first thing they will have to determine is you are not terrorists, drug dealers, criminals...they cannot take your words, that's not how things worked in any legal proceedings. And all these things take time.

I really hate to use the word MSM, but unfortunately a lot of them really don't understand how CBP works, whenever I heard those sensational reporting from NPR or CNN, how "unfairly" or "poorly" CBP treat the people crossing the borders and detain them, they really have no clue what they are talking about, their reports are grossly misleading, they probably think it's a simple yes or no, if not dangerous, let them go, how do you know? These are foreigners from other countries, even their names could be fake.

by Anonymousreply 105October 17, 2019 10:43 AM

R102, r105, I’m with you. These people were up to no good. As per usual, people drag innocent kids along to make it looks better.

And the article was more like an opinion piece than actual reporting. Boo hoo.

by Anonymousreply 106October 17, 2019 10:48 AM

Here's an article about Derby Line VT/Stanstead QC.

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by Anonymousreply 107October 17, 2019 10:58 AM

R105 Whatever is the word "MSM" you don't wish to pronounce? I don't believe I'm the only one not following you.

by Anonymousreply 108October 17, 2019 11:08 AM

R105, r106 You guys really think a British family with 3 babies could be a group of terrorists? Illegal immigrants yes, white trash yes, but terrorists? Come on. As many here have mentioned they had $16k in cash on them. Why not put them on the next flight to London with their money?

by Anonymousreply 109October 17, 2019 11:37 AM

R109 the same reason the cops wont let you go, especially if they found you have 16k cash in your car!!!!

by Anonymousreply 110October 17, 2019 11:48 AM

and forgot to mention, for $16K cash in their car, not only did they break the US immigration law (declaration form FinCen 105 is required for carrying more $10K cash into the US), they also broke the Canada immigration law - failure to report cash more than CAN$10k when crossing Canadian border

by Anonymousreply 111October 17, 2019 12:07 PM

R110 Well, you can't really buy any weapons of mass destruction with only $16k. It is also maybe a lot for one person (not really actually), but not really much for a family of 7 with 3 little children unless they all sleep in their car and only eat canned ravioli.

R111 Many here have already pointed out that it's 10k PER PERSON. There were 7 people in the car so they only had around $2k per person. It doesn't really matter anyway since they illegally crossed the border and were detained/arrested. They're probably not allowed to return after deportation for the next 10 years or more anyway.

by Anonymousreply 112October 17, 2019 12:13 PM

R112 are you really that dumb? Do not understand how legal system works???? If you get caught by the cops during an illegal act, they must document your case, it's up to the prosecutor to decide whether to charge you or not, and/or a judge in a court to decide whether to dismiss your case, It's not up to the cops to determine you are guilty or not, they are just doing their job.

Already explained to you, for people entering the country illegally, regardless of the reason for the illegal entry, they will have to explain in an immigration court, it's not up to CBP to decide their case. They are currently in a detention facility waiting for their case to be heard by an immigration judge, do you get it now?

by Anonymousreply 113October 17, 2019 12:35 PM

R112 your 10k PER PERSON is completely wrong, the requirement is very clear, split the cash among friends/family members or even strangers (couriers) you hired to circumvent $10K all treated as one person/family.

--- US Customs 10000 dollars per family This includes you or any family members in your group bringing $10,000 or more U.S. dollars, or its foreign equivalent into the United States. The U.S. Customs office defines this as cash, stocks, bonds, money orders, personal or cashier's checks, coins and cash. ---

I am very sorry to say this but from your posts, you are not very bright and you know very little about legal matters, I hope you don't get to the wrong side of the law, that will spell trouble for you.

by Anonymousreply 114October 17, 2019 12:41 PM

[Quote]They are currently in a detention facility waiting for their case to be heard by an immigration judge, do you get it now?

I don't really give a fuck what you think r113. This may be the law but separating and detaining families and children for weeks or months is just wrong. In my country we do not separate children from their parents and we do not treat people like criminals or terrorists for simply crossing a border illegally and keep them in detention facilities for week or months. If they still have their passports, money to buy return tickets and the UK is willing to take them back, put them in front of your fancy judge within 24h and send them back to their home country. You get this now?

[Quote]I am very sorry to say this but from your posts, you are not very bright...

Oh dear, this is really the best you could come up with?

[Quote] I hope you don't get to the wrong side of the law, that will spell trouble for you.

Thanks for your fake concern, but I'm doing just fine.

by Anonymousreply 115October 17, 2019 1:16 PM

yep R115 you are doing fine, we already know that, ignorance is bliss!

by Anonymousreply 116October 17, 2019 1:21 PM

I'm tired of hearing about gypsies .... let's have more about the tramps and thieves!

by Anonymousreply 117October 17, 2019 2:36 PM

Eileen back in Blighty: "We weren't allowed to smoke for two weeks either or have fizzy drinks."

They've been banned from returning to the US for five years, which seems lenient.

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by Anonymousreply 118October 17, 2019 3:21 PM

The link here allegedly shows the crossing. There appear to be street lights which are not shown on Google Maps streetview: so I have my doubts.

"Officials said the travellers also had “more than $16,000 CAD and a small quantity of marijuana, less than three grams.”

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by Anonymousreply 119October 17, 2019 3:30 PM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 120October 17, 2019 3:56 PM

Yeah they definitely went into that ditch on purpose. Dummies don’t know there are surveillance cameras everywhere.

They are definitely Travelers.

by Anonymousreply 121October 17, 2019 5:22 PM

Boy, I’m glad I never accidentally crossed an international border!

by Anonymousreply 122October 17, 2019 6:57 PM

R117 Gypsies, Trumps, and Thieves.

by Anonymousreply 123October 17, 2019 8:09 PM

[quote] Dummies don’t know there are surveillance cameras everywhere.

They can't really be from London: if they were really from London, they would know that there are surveillance cameras everywhere. There is a lot more to this story than we are being told. The Daily Fail gives them an exceptionally easy ride, for some reason.

by Anonymousreply 124October 17, 2019 8:11 PM

Because they’re British, R124. If they were Americans they would have found out why they were denied entry to the country and would have blasted any arrests on the front page.

by Anonymousreply 125October 17, 2019 8:44 PM

These fagazy people will have to settle for Euro Disney. Anyways, it's much closer to them than Disney World.

They got off easy. Didn't an American spend a couple months in jail in Russia for having medical MJ?

by Anonymousreply 126October 17, 2019 9:03 PM

I mean the Fail hasn't even told us the staples like the value of the couple's home and what their jobs are. Pathetic.

by Anonymousreply 127October 17, 2019 9:19 PM

Connors is a Travelers surname.

by Anonymousreply 128October 17, 2019 9:27 PM

I have been to Canada, and to the USA, England, too, but I've never. been to me

by Anonymousreply 129October 17, 2019 9:31 PM

Poor thing didn't get smokes or fizzy drinks for 2 weeks. She probably wanted a creme brulee, and now!!!!!!!!!!!!!

by Anonymousreply 130October 17, 2019 9:36 PM

Look at her dress. That’s not a dress you buy in a store. Someone made that dress for a Traveler. Tight, sequins, loud colors. Probably had it made when she recently attended a Traveler wedding of a 15 year old girl.

by Anonymousreply 131October 17, 2019 9:41 PM

Yeah, yeah....cheers. Thanks a lot.

by Anonymousreply 132October 17, 2019 9:59 PM

Some of the readers' comments on the Mail Online are quite good (sorry the link doesn't work) but the Mail are going to start to lose their fickle following after this whitewash. We want the unvarnished truth please. DLers may have something to say about the grandmother's shoes.

by Anonymousreply 133October 17, 2019 10:41 PM

Couldn't she have just asked to speak to a manager?

by Anonymousreply 134October 17, 2019 11:43 PM

In the Slash gurls, looking for lurrvv

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by Anonymousreply 135October 18, 2019 1:03 AM

R125 It is because they are gypsies, a minority in the UK. They are protected as such.

by Anonymousreply 136October 20, 2019 10:45 AM

I think it was here on DL that I read that someone was kayaking and ended up in Canada. They had to go to a hut to register.

by Anonymousreply 137October 20, 2019 4:28 PM
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