Guardian: Prince Harry's "pent-up rage" could backfire on him, say commentators

(cont.) “It is as though he has got months of pent-up rage in him. I really, really question the wisdom of taking on the media in this way.”

The BBC’s royal editor, Nicholas Witchell, said the timing was “curious” given the visit has been a “considerable success” and had lifted the couple’s reputation “after a series of mis-steps involving private jets and expensive property renovations”. The media commentator Roy Greenslade told Radio 4’s Today programme: “Is [Harry] taking a sledgehammer to crack a nut here? I think he may well find that this is counter-productive.”

Palace sources indicate the timing of the announcement was based on specific legal advice. It is understood the claim was filed on Sunday 29 September, and processed by the court on Monday. The particulars of the claim would need to be served within 14 days, and within another 14 days, the claims documents would be accessible to the public.

While this may explain the timing on the announcement of legal action, it does not, however, fully explain the timing or content of Harry’s statement.

Law firm Schillings, acting for the Duchess, has filed a high court claim against the paper and its parent company – Associated Newspapers – over the alleged misuse of private information, infringement of copyright and breach of the Data Protection Act 2018.

Harry has also accused the paper of misleading readers by strategically omitting paragraphs, sentences and specific words – “to mask the lies they had perpetrated for over a year”. The newspaper denies this.

“The paparazzi in Diana’s day wanted to elicit a negative reaction, wanted her to burst into tears or lash out,” said Stephen Bates, author of Royalty Inc . “I think the coverage has been pretty snippy about Meghan, sometimes with reasonable cause, private jets and all that. But she is in no way comparable to Diana, because she has been much better shielded, and she’s in a much less vulnerable position, and a much less vulnerable person.”

PR consultant Mark Borkowski said the statement risked the pair being “a little too open about what they think about the media”.

“The royals normally keep the media at arm’s length but this is not an arm’s length move. Harry is determined not to play the media game. There is no charm left, this is an open declaration of war,” he told PA. “He has drawn a line in the sand and that line has been crossed. There will be a lot of people who support him, but he will also be losing a lot of friends.”

It is not the first time Harry has moved to defend Meghan’s over her treatment by the media. In November 2016, he confirmed he was dating the US actor and lashed out at the “wave of abuse and harassment” she had faced from publications.

His communications secretary Jason Knauf outlined the difficulties Meghan had experienced since news of their relationship broke in a statement which said she had been “subject to a wave of abuse and harassment”.

A frivolous lawsuit which will be tossed out. The MOS did nothing improper. They are suing on a theory of copyright infringement. Sounds absurd to me. The invasion of privacy is ludicrous. Meghan’s “friends” opened the door to this by bringing up the letter in People mag in order to boost Meg and slander the father. The letter belonged to the father, and he was free to do what he wanted with it. The allegation is that they altered the letter, which MOS denies, and U believe them. This lawsuit was brought to intimidate the press and to give the senior royals the middle finger. If she goes down, she’ll bring down the whole edifice.

Mark my words, they'll win. They deserve to.

[quote] Mark my words, they'll win.

We DO mark them, O mighty prophetess Cassandra!

R2, I believe under UK law, the copyright remains with MM. However, were I defending the DM, I would call Thomas Markle as a witness, as to why he released the letter, and their previous relationship. I would really go nuclear on what’s admitted in court, which is all public.

This could backfire on them spectacularly.

It’s quite funny that anyone thinks Harry wrote that statement. That cretin can barely spell his own name.

Markle wrote it. Every last word.

She does own the words, but her father owns the letter. He’s entitled to sell it on, and it’s not unlawful (on the face of it) to publish excerpts. Letters from the royal family are published all the time.

The issue will be whether she had a reasonable expectation of privacy. If she was writing to some member of the public, not really. To her father - generally speaking, yes.

BUT....she had five friends share the contents of that letter with People Magazine. The MoS didn’t even know it existed until then. Her father has the right to defend himself against any public accusation and it seems perfectly fair that he would use the very letter that Markle herself was trying to use against him.

I don’t think they stand a hope of winning - but worse, I think they are setting themselves up to have some rather embarrassing and unpleasant facts about them made public. In particular, Markle’s treatment of her father and her collusion with the press.

Nice, a trial during the Cambridge Tour.

r3 They won't win. He's doing this to assuage Meghan's rage at not being perceived as the Next Diana.

She's not the Next Diana.

She's not even the first mixed race member of the British Royals.

Her blood, so celebrated by the racists on this thread, means nothing.

It won’t be for at least 6 months, R7. The High Court is busy.

I'm very much enjoying how the racist Megstans have suddenly shut up with mention of England's two mixed-race Queens.

Doesn't quite fit their world-view, does it?

Just go down in flames with your imbecile husband alone, Meg. You've done too much damage to the BRF already. Enough is enough.

Or "they" may not care, R10.

You are so enthralled with Meghan's ascent you have to ascribe dislike of her to racism. You cannot imagine, now she's had a year to show what she's about, that shallowness, vanity, hypocrisy, disrespect, self-interest, pomposity or any other number of demonstrated and unlikeable characteristics are at the root of it.

For me, they all are. I couldn't care less about her background. It's her character that repels me.

Meghan has brought out the worst in Harry. Remember how he supported her in bullying the staff who had to quit their jobs because their bosses have absolutely no idea of proportion when punching down?

You have misunderstood my comment, r12. My point is that the fact there have already been two mixed-race Queens of England demotes the significance of the fact that the sixth in line married a mixed-race woman into irrelevancy.

Her entire "fanbase" is comprised of outright racists who would not give her the time of day were she not mixed-race. Would Celebitchy worship her if she were white? No. What do they make of the fact that the BRF has not one, but TWO mixed race forebears, both of who managed to do their jobs without a smidgen of drama?

Their example throws into high relief the fact that Meghan a tawdry, and very fake, also-ran.

Queen Charlotte's African heritage--if it ever existed--was pretty negligible. The claims have been made about her African heritage based on her descent from one of the mistresses of the King of Portugal in the thirteenth century (a full fifteen generations back), and by the time she ruled many members of the royal families of Europe were descended from the same woman--and there was never any strict proof that woman was black.

The claims mostly stemmed from Charlotte's appearance; contemporaries described her as having "a mulatto face." But if there's one thing we know pretty well about European kings and queens in the eighteenth century it's who their ancestors were straight down the line, and there's nothing to suggest Charlotte had any significant African heritage.

As for Queen Phillippa: again, her supposed African heritage is based on pretty slim evidence. Either she or her sister (historians are not clear which) was described as having "brown skin"; but nothing is said about this young woman being African, and in the thirteenth century "brown" was used to describe women who were not fair/pale, but who had a more sallow coloring.

"Slim evidence"? Are you aware that much of Spain was ruled by Moors from Africa for five hundred years, r15/r16?

Not five years, five HUNDRED.

I know you want your Meg to be the first. But she isn't. Deal with it.

Also, the portrait of Queen Charlotte at r15 portrays Charlotte with more facial features indicating black heritage than Meghan's face indicates on her best day. But that could be all the surgery Meghan has had to remove any trace of blackness. After all, Meghan is only "black" when it suits her.

I love how the racists who love Meg only for her skin colour have suddenly STFU on this thread now that it's been mentioned that Britain has had two mixed-race Queens already.

In fairness, those two queens were much loved for the quality of their character, so you can't really compare them to Meagantoinette.

An alpha male defends his family.

Harry is an ultra Beta male, r21

No self-respecting straight man would allow the media or people to attack his family. It's something that DL doesn't understand.

R22-I don't even know that he makes it that far. He's too whiny, too entitled. If he never brought up Diana, maybe, but he trots her out every other day.

No alpha male lets his wife carry his balls around in her purse.

[quote]Are you aware that much of Spain was ruled by Moors from Africa for five hundred years, [R15]/[R16]?

Are you aware that the Moors had been cast out of Spain hundreds of years before Queen Charlotte was even born? You have to go back nine generations before there's anyone Spanish (much less alleged to be Moorish) in her ancestry at all.

[quote] I know you want your Meg to be the first.

She's certainly not "my Meg"--I think you are projecting all that onto me. And I do not care at all if she's first or if she's twentieth; I have no dog in this fight other than factual accuracy.

Look at the portrait of Charlotte. She looks far more mixed race than Meghan does. Charlotte's own Doctor wrote that she had classic mixed-race facial features (he used the word "mulatto"). Meghan is an also-ran, and unlike Charlotte or Phillippa, will never, ever be Queen.

Attacking his family? The press just states the obvious: jet travels, extravagant lifestyle, hypocritical bitchery, sappy fakeness, etc.

Harry is a pathetic joke. Sad.

[quote] Look at the portrait of Charlotte. She looks far more mixed race than Meghan does.

Appearances don't mean very much. Sorry.

Harry is such a pussy.

It sounds bizarre that Harry doesn’t realize poor decision making by his mother led to her death. I wonder if she was still alive and presenting hole for rich Arabs if he’s still suffer under the delusion that she was this delicate waif, instead of the passive aggressive ho she was.

As I told my granny's courtiers, "WHAT MEGHAN WANTS, MEGHAN GETS !!!"

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

She actually looks like Wallace Simpson in that pic

Completely intentional, I am sure R35. They have been dilligent in setting up their own golden parachute.

R25 for the win.

R36 - That's the increasing expectation - that they're getting a few blows in before they exit England's green and pleasant land, with as much Victim Baggage as they can carry so they can justify also taking with them the status, wealth, and titles that the BRF gave them, on the private jet that will most certainly spirit them away to LaCa, the land of Woke and Honey.

I'd give anything to be a fly on the wall as Charles and the Queen and their solicitors and financial advisors draw up plans for settlements, annuities, NDAs, handling the public announcement so that xpressions of regret also contain best wishes for the couple on the path the couple themselves have chosen, and taking care to make Harry's and his descendants' constitutional position clear.

As the Wicked Witch of the West so sapiently observed, "These things must be done delicately."

I really, really hope the BRF is sitting on Meg's salad tossing tape so they can hold that over her. They play the long game hard for the win.

Actually I think you can see a resemblance to Queen Elizabeth in some of Queen Charlotte's portraits, esp around the eyes and mouth. See R8 link above.

R39 - I'm still not sure I believe there is such a tape, or it would have been used before the engagement to try to stop Harry from marrying her. If BILD didn't buy the tape when it was offered, but only built a story on its possible existence, then there isn't one. BILD has plenty deep pockets and cares no more about Meghan's privacy than CLOSER Magazine did about Kate's privacy at that chateau in France.

But if there is such a tape, I doubt that 1) the BRF have it, or2) they would use it as a bargaining chip. Publication of the tape would backfire on the BRF and put them in the same camp as the tabloids - Meghan, quite rightly, would say, Publish and be damned! and call their bluff. The only way it could be used is by a third party at the BRF's behest but without the slightest possibility of it being traced back to them, and I'm also doubtful that kind of absolute security exists in today's world.

No, the chips are already being stacked up on the table on the BRF's side, and the main ones are the cachet of the Sussex title, and a formidable amount of money they can give or withhold. The Sussex's chips are agreeing to sign stringent NDAs, and a willingness to surrender their titles in exchange for money, and the issue of access to his grandchildren for Charles. Due to a still standing 300 year old law, the Queen has automatic custody of all minor grandchildren

But Archie is her great-grandchild, not her grandchild, so I'm not certain the rule still applies. If not, the Sussexes can play hardball about access for Charles to Harry's children.

I just do not see how the Sussexes can continue to pretend they are members of a close royal family, or the Queen, or the Camridges. The photo ops won't work any longer, the public knows too much now.

Going to be quite fascinating.

Songs will be sung, R41. I'll be curious to see if a divorce happens if Meghan retains her title. It would look very bad if she didn't given that Fergie kept hers. That Fergie at least played by some semblance of the rules wouldn't detract from the fact that a woman of color would have her title yanked.

Fergie is British. Meghan isn’t, at least not yet, and one could argue she never will be, certainly not in the rarefied world the BRF inhabits.

Correction: Prince Harry's power could put commentators out of work, so they're going to make shit up.

R42 Fergie had no title to keep. She was “HRH The Duchess of York” as a courtesy while married to the pedo prince.

After the divorce she was styled in the same way as any woman divorced from a peer, i.e.: “First name, former title”, thus “Sarah, Duchess of York“. In the same way that Diana was known as “Diana, Princess of Wales” after her divorce.

Think of “,Duchess of York” as her surname. The only place where she has a title is in her head. If Andrew were to remarry, that woman would be “HRH The Duchess of York” with poor old Fergie still just the ex wife.

But hanging on for dear life with him paying the bills!

No wonder he never remarried - who would entertain getting involved in that mess?

Thanks, R45-that's one of the best explanations of how the titles work I've seen. So if Andrew were to remarry a woman named Edna, for example, would she be Edna, HRH the Duchess of York, while Fergie would still be referred to as Sarah, Duchess of York? It's a bit confusing but no more so than all of David Fosters exes running around still using his surnames.

[quote] I'll be curious to see if a divorce happens if Meghan retains her title.

Meghan still holds American citizenship and she's still going through the waiting period to be given British citizenship as she wasn't fast tracked as she and Harry wanted. If a divorce occurs after she becomes a British citizen, she would likely be known as Meghan, Duchess of Sussex. If there is a divorce before she becomes British, then she has only American citizenship and Americans are not given titles, let alone foreign ones. Presently in America and because the only current citizenship she holds is American, she is permitted by diplomatic courtesy to use her title and Royal Highness which she attained through marriage. In the event of divorce, in the USA she'd legally be known as Meghan and whatever last name she chose.

R46 lucky Edna would be “HRH The Duchess of York”. In the inevitable divorce she would become “Edna, Duchess of York”.

The British aristocracy get divorced quite a lot, especially once an heir has been produced. “FirstName, PreviousTitle” niftily accommodates the multiple divorcees within the higher orders.

But it's the HRH that really matters to these women. Diana was an aristocrat with, as she liked to remind people, a title of her own. But for Meghan, that "Duchess of Sussex without the HRH is essentially meaningless. It's only the HRH that gets her the curtsies, bows, patronages, global stardom, the funds from the Sovereign Grant for her "work", and tours set up by Britain's Foreign Office, who will only turn to the Sussexes again if forced to by considerations for the relationship between the monarchy and the government.

But all that said, I do not see a divorce coming - I see HMS Outbound sailing from Southampton, one way only.

The BRF would naturally like that to happen before Meghan gets her UK citizenship. I think much will depend on how the upcoming year goes.

R44 - That is nonsense. Harry has no such power. He's sixth in line and the only threat is financial to the companies who own the papers, not to individual paid staff, through damages. The Leveson changes to press in Britain deliberately made it financially dangerous to criticise the royals and risk these kinds of legal proceedings, which could bankrupt smaller media companies even if they win the case. But the Mail isn't a small outlet - it's a huge one with very deep pockets, and it's obviously willing to pay to make its point. In point of fact, Harry and Meghan stand to be paying through the nose, as well, and they've publicly stated that any damages will be donated to an anti-bullying organisation.

Harry's real cash income is far below that of Associated Paupers, which own the Mail on Sunday and the DM. Were it not for his father's annual household supplement, Harry wouldn't have the money to support these actions. He wouldn't even have the money, after taxes, to live as anything other than an upper middle-class solicitor or private physician - not a Prince of the Blood of the House of Windsor.

So I believe you're seriously overestimating Harry's influence, which will not get anyone sacked. If Charles couldn't get anyone sacked during his own fiasco, Harry certainly can't.

^*Associated Papers (not Paupers, LOL, far from it!)

Harry will not follow Megs into exile, not because he doesn't want to give up his privilege and perks but because Megs has no further use for him. She's had the wedding ring and the baby, has plenty of photos that establish her beyond her wildest dreams cred. Now all she's waiting for is that sizeable stipend to piss orf.

You have to be stupid to think this family has any power over journalists.

I saw some news story with Harry and Ed Sheeren and it looks like Harry is dying his hair. He looks okay straight on but when he turns his head he looked terrible with puffy hair and a bald spot.

He was so much happier and sexier before MM. she is draining him of all his Prince Hot Ginge. He’s in over his head and I don’t think he realized what he signed up for.

I never liked red hair, but Harry is clever to stand next Ed SHeeran who is probably one of the ugliest man on earth.

R55 - I'll agree he's in over his head, but I think he knew what he was signing up for, he just wasn't honest with himself about it and he miscalculated his own ability to deal with the fallout from what he signed up for.

He wanted a wife he could weaponise against the family toward whom his depth of anger even he probably didn't acknowledge. He wanted a wife whose unsuitability for royal life (which in Meghan he likely recognised quickly) would in turn help propel him out of the family he resents and the work he doesn't like (but not on his own and all alone). He wanted a wife who would make him feel that He Is Just As Good As William. He wanted a wife who reminded him of his Mum.

And he wanted a wife who would, at a minimum, make his life more interesting.

Excellent points, R57.

I've recently been remembering what lip readers interpreted were the first comments from Sparkle and Dim as they settled into the carriage immediately after their wedding.

Sparkle looked around at the crowd and said "Fuck".

Harry said "I need a drink."

How romantic.

I think he believed that as Diana's son paired with a pretty confident actress, they would become the most beloved couple to ever live and he is mad as hell that they are not.

R59 - Really?! Is that confirmed or just another Internet fable?!

Was Sparkle disappointed at the size of the crowd?

R60-I think he believed he was marrying a far superior woman to his brother, and on paper it seemed that way. An actress with her own career, humanitarian, entrepreneur, intelligent, stylish. Then on further inspection, she's a mediocre actress at best, one no one had ever heard of; all her charity work was overinflated Sunshine Sachs PR crafted to raise her profile; she ran a cringe-worthy blog; she prattles word salads with no substance; she's a disheveled disaster who only looked good because of the Suits stylists. Everything Meghan does just makes Kate look superior by comparison.

R62 - Nailed it.

We need a DL pool for when the divorce will be. I give it 3 years.

3, R64, and Meghan and Harry will both cite just how mean the press was as the camel that broke the camel's back. In subsequent Oprah interviews, Meghan will also lament that the British people just couldn't move past their racism to accept her.

Divorce, or separation announcement? I am thinking they will announce they are separating sometime after their 2nd anniversary IF they don't have another kid. They keep trying to generate interest but each effort leads to diminishing returns. Archie didn't trend. None of their stupid media tricks work. Even their lawsuits only trended a day or so. It's doubtful they'll ever be assigned another tour nor given another patronage, so it will be harder to come up with ways to garner publicity. Meghan, narcissistic as she is, will begin to think (if she doesn't already) that she knows best and that Harry is the reason for her PR problems. Maybe they'll have one more kid in the hopes of generating interest. If not, she will take off because that is what she has always done.

I think they may both leave the BRF and live as an discreet open couple in Canada or New York.

I don't see Meghan living in Africa.

Megs has gone as far as she can with Ginger, so when she bolts, he'll be left behind. I'm betting separation by next summer. It's the only thing left that will put her in the mega-spotlight that she craves.

But what can Meghan accede to once she's left Harry? She's gone as far as she can go. Sure, she'll remain famous, but her star will never be as high as it is right now as a member of the BRF. A divorcee with a sordid book may get her notoriety, but that's all. She'll be chasing after fame the rest of her life.

Don't forget Meghan thinks very highly of herself.

She doesn't think she would lose anything leaving Harry, on a contrary she must think the BRF would be the one suffering from her departure.

Only a true narcissist would think that way, R71-which is of course what Markle is. She's in for a rude awakening. I pity the poor people who have to experience her frustration and diva temper tantrums first hand.

Agree, R71.

I do feel for that child with those 2 as parents, and with the isolation. Childhood is gonna be brutal for that kid.

Archie is going to have it rough, no doubt about it.

I don't think a divorce is in the cards unless it's quite far down the road. Of course, they're going to have a second child, the size of any settlement depends on more children, but that settlement I believe will come as they're pushed out of the BRF entirely, not through a divorce. She will hang on fiercely so that second child is born a member of the BRF and will also try to stall so that her UK citiznship comes in.

Harry's rant on his IG account the day the news broke of Meghan's lawsuit says he is much too far gone. He's doubling down.

He'll never admit William and his father were right. He will never admit he was wrong.

Of course, Meghan would have no compunction about leaving Harry when she's had enough, but Harry won't leave Meghan.

The only real question on the table is, does the BRF have the balls to get rid of them quickly, or not?

r74. i agree Harry is sticking like glue to her. but does she really want UK citizenship? She has no interest in the UK anymore. I know she thought it looked cool on her instagram to be in London back before the relationship. I just don't see any advantage to her to gain dual citizenship and I really cannot picture her giving up her USA citizenship as that would make it problematic if she chose to go home.

R75 - UK citizenship is an advantage re her title, and re legal issues around her son, who has dual citizenship.

r76. thanks, I never thought about it in terms of title , that makes sense. The baby she will have had to register at the USA embassy but I guess they did that.

I think she'll hold out hope for a 2nd baby that's a girl, finally giving her the Instagrammable, oh-so-marketable mini-Diana she desperately wants.

r78. poor gozzy eyed ginger girl with a dumpy figure always compared to Di, that would be tragic.

Scary Harry and Meager No Sparkle will not last as a couple. Celebrity is essentially dead and Meagre thought of a new way to make herself the center of attention (kind of, anyway) and I swear that she got Canadian citizenship with the thought of tracking and bagging Scary Harry someday.

I truly hope ole Meager is still a U.S. citizen when this all falls a part (fellow yank posting here). My, won't she be not yesterday's news but last month's news when her Prince is gone and she has no chance at a title or at creating even a fraction that the media drama that Prince Charles and Princess Diana had going on. (C'mon divorce papers!!)

Michelle Obama: "Meghan Markle is an inspiration to so many!"

What, in every hell there is, is so inspiring about No Sparkle?? She was a rich, spoiled Hollywood actress who dated - and married and unceremoniously dumped - white men exclusively, found herself another rich, white man to marry and reproduce with and then suddenly and conveniently remembered how black she is just before her televised wedding which was followed by her coming to South African women as their "sister". (Dear Lord!)

She is only an inspiration to her fellow narcissists.

I never thought these words would leave my keyboard; I feel sorry for Kate Middleton. She has a real b*tch on her hands. (This confirms why Ms. Kate wore that just-about-white dress to the wedding. Way to go Kate!!)

R81 That's old news.

R81 - Don't feel sorry for Kate, Meghan has made Kate look like the Golden Princess. Kate will be just fine.

R80 - So far as I know, Meghan never applied for or received Canadian citizenship.

I am not sure that they do have the balls to get rid of them quickly.

I suspect that they thought that they might fall into line back when the Africa tour was leaked to the press. Instead they acted out and escalated.

They leaked footage of the baby the day Wills and Kate started a high profile foreign tour. They will never be team players and any slights or coded messages seem to have whipped up their victim complexes.

The family can buy them off but NDAs would never reign in these 2, even with a settlement in installments, they have built their brand of having a go at the monarchy.

I do sometimes wonder, if this was a movie she would be a plant to bring it down.

Wish we had an edit button

rein in these too

Freudian slip - wonder IF the BRF will reign if this is not nipped in the bud

R83-Kate is on her jegging-clad knees every day thanking patron Saint Diana for Markle.

Kate is certainly glad the press is off her ass.

So, it's the last Royal thread open.

I see Muriel is much active on week-end. Unless it's the Harkles lawyers....

Last I heard, they had suspended all royal duties until after the New Year. Does she need time to prepare for her role as plaintiff?

I also heard they were moving to Africa. Are they going to take over one of those white farms that was seized by the black government?

Now they are going to America. Well that was fast. These two are waaaay off the reservation. The BRF can only hope to keep minimizing the damage to their brand. Maybe take them out of the line of succession completely. Then in 10 years, they will be bitching that they aren’t being well treated by the BRF - a la Great Great Uncle Eddie and Wallis. Except Megs isn’t going to be the dutiful wife and stick around like Wallis.

How can they move to SA and the US and still receive support from the Civil List? Are they finally being given the heave ho?

[quote]How can they move to SA and the US and still receive support from the Civil List?

Harry's too dim to realize he will lose that money. But Chuckles will probably give him a personal allowance. Poor Camilla will have to wear last year's couture because the money going to Harry will be cut out of her budget.

Whether it's America or Africa, they can't stay away too long because of Markle's British citizenship status. Well, maybe she doesn't even want it now.

I think they gonna argue they still work for the Commonwealth to stay on the civil list.

They gonna do few trips to see few charities every year, the rest of the time they gonna stay in LA to schmooze with Oprah & Co.

The Sun and the Mirror are reporting that Harry and Meghan want to build a "bolthole" (hate that term) in Botswana so that they can have their much desired privacy. So they're going away for six weeks to America and they're prepping the public for them to live at least part time in Africa.

The BRF likely cut them off work-wise several months ago. No more tours, no more patronages. There was a time during Meghan's maternity leave when Harry was doing a bunch of engagements, showing up for Easter service, etc. I think he was trying desperately to get back in the BRF's good graces because he has to know on some level that he is nothing without them. It didn't work.

The Africa visit had to occur because it was already scheduled some time ago and the BRF had to honor their agreement with the Foreign Office. Of course, Harry and Meghan blew that (and the Pakistan tour) out of the water with their lawsuits and statements and "documentary". Apparently, they plan to use this documentary to blame not only the press but the BRF for not supporting them. They are going scorched earth because the BRF has rightly told them to fuck off.

They're gonna be spending Thanksgiving in LA!

They are exploring moving overseas somewhere!

Jeez, just think about all the money that went to ToadHole. Now, a new house in Botswana?

Please - anyone who thinks these two spoiled brats who LOVE the attention and being surrounded by fabulous famous people will live in Africa are delusional. LA is where they will end up - warm, sunny, lots of fabulous people to hang out with, plenty of places to spend gobs of money, relatively strict paparazzi restrictions. Harry will eventually get homesick - but Megs will stay put in LA.

There is no way Megan's gonna want to live in shit hole Botswana. No cameras there. Or maybe she can control the press there to kiss her ass all day long...

Oh I think the BRF/Charles may buy a house in Botswana, but like ToadHole they won't live there for long.

to them, a house in Botswana to them is chump change...

I think what Markle really wants is to become The Queen Bee of the Celebs, holding court in an LA mansion surrounded by ass-kissing celebs, while doing an occasional charity event to keep up appearances. She wants the full fantasy romcom experience and she wants it now.

The Duchess of Sussex is unlikable. That's a positive thing in my soap opera perspective observation of the BRF. Every drama needs a Lucy Ewing.

Markle, however, lacks the stuff to transcend the C-List villainess role. Her vanity and shallowness precluded her from doing what she should have done to avoid that fate. That is, her first year of marriage: lay low, not put one foot wrong and LEARN.

That she didn't do that compels me to conclude, finally, that she actually believed that the BRF would adjust to her, rather she adjusting to it.

Symbolically, before the world at her wedding she promised to do that, adjust to the BRF, when she, an American, curtsied to QE II after stating marriage vows to the Queen's grandson.

The BRF, internally and externally, encompasses a paradoxical, contradictory thing: it's both inherently ridiculous, yet, dead serious in it's role as a symbol of state. Apparently, the DoS didn't grasp that fundamental reality after Prince Harry proposed to her.

It's distasteful that Markle publicly, would say nobody has asked about me and then inferring she's not OK.

Let me be clear. I think she IS genuinely homesick. I think she has taken too much unfair criticism, some of it undeniably based upon bigotry. I think it's, probably, 10th Circle of hell to adjust to having a public role within the BRF. I have no doubt that is a real thing to her and it's difficult.

Still, if you're actually "woke", when you're being filmed for public dissemination, and asked about how you're doing, you don't milk the moment for personal drama.

Instead, you're prepared to say and MEAN something like the following: "There are people in the world who have real problems, poverty, mental health issues, addictions. I live a very fortunate life. I hope to do what I can to help with those issues."

That she doesn't know to say that means she doesn't get it and isn't capable of doing so.

And I'm not letting the Duke of Sussex off the hook. He's more to blame than her. They're both toast.

[quote] It's distasteful that Markle publicly, would say nobody has asked about me and then inferring she's not OK.

Aren't the British supposed to be "stiff upper lip" and "we'll muddle through, ducky"? This display of emotion must horrifying to the BRF.

At the risk of indulging in stereotypes, r104, I've read and heard it observed, but I won't generalize.

It's distasteful for ANY person to, whether they're famous or obscure, who has wealth, fame and privilege, and, especially if they, ostensibly, want to help through charitable work, complain the way the DoS does in this "nobody has asked me" clip.

Eat another stack of pancakes Della. You fat white miserable COW.

The problem is who should ask her how she is? Harry? The public? Journalists? The Queen? Her "friends"? Her ghosted family? Amal Clooney and Oprah? The Daily Mail? Jessica?

She doesn't have the support system Kate or Camilla have because she ghosted everybody in her life and her relationships are mainly business ones.

That's too bad Meghan.

[quote] Eat another stack of pancakes Della. You fat white miserable COW.

lol, r106

I Love pancakes. I'm not fat. I'm not white. I'm not miserable. I'm not a COW.

I've stuck-up for Markle. I've called out her bigoted haters. I've given her time to right the ship.

Ain't gonna happen.

On a lighter note...the late Earl Spencer (Diana's father) vs. actor James Norton.

F&F for R106.

[quote] That she doesn't know to say that means she doesn't get it and isn't capable of doing so.

I think she does know better, she just doesn’t care. The way to get clout and attention these days is to be the most persecuted. Meghan is courting the Instagram generation.

You're sweet, r110 and Smoooches, but, not to worry.

I've dealt with worse.

I'm sorry but when it comes to royalty, I prefer the Queen Elizabeth style. Never complain, never explain.

According to the newspapers, they're going to continue doing royal engagements until mid-Nov, then 6 weeks of "family time" (holiday) til Christmas with the RF. So it's not that they're fleeing immediately.

I reckon it's Harry's dream to relocate to Africa and Meghan does the wifey thing of appearing to think it's a good idea .... but it never quite happens. "Humanitarian" visits yes, but otherwise it's New York/LA for her.

R114-that would be like a surreal version of Green Acres.

Harry is evidence - along with Earl Spencer - that the Spencer family are really fucked up borderline personalities. As much as Diana has been sainted and it was traumatic to be so famous at 18, she chose to engage in the drama and enjoyed the attention while screeching that she hated it. Harry is as unhinged as his mother - but without the looks or charm.

Just like Diana seriously dated an absolutely horrible choice of a guy - Dodi - Harry seems to have no practical awareness of what would have been a good partner for him long term rather than an exciting affair. They both just wanted to be “rebels” while living in their gilded castle and getting all the positives and crying about the negatives.

So what happens to her patronage at the National Theatre? And her other patronages? Will she continue working with them from the opposite end of the earth? What about their subjects in Dumbarton?

I can only imagine the things that she’s telling him now that she has no opposition... “We’ll leave the haters behind, Harry. They don’t want you to be great. They don’t want our son to be one of them. Fuck them, Harry. We can go to LA where people will love us and treat us like real royalty!”

When all is said and done is being separated from family and friends worth the abuse from Me-Again and the zing of re-creating old patterns? Has he ever evidenced a relationship with the children?

Duke of Sussex acknowledges a 'rift' with Prince William: 'We're certainly on different paths at the moment'

Celebrity Duke of Sussex acknowledges a 'rift' with Prince William: 'We're certainly on different paths at the moment' The Telegraph Hannah Furness,The Telegraph 42 minutes ago Reactions Reblog on Tumblr Share Tweet Email The admission follows stories in the press about the increasing separation of the two Dukes - Getty Images Europe The Duke of Sussex has acknowledged a “rift” with his brother the Duke of Cambridge for the first time, saying they are “certainly on different” paths under the pressures of Royal life and admitting: “Inevitably stuff happens”.

Prince Harry said the brothers, who have grown up together in the public eye, have “good days and bad days”, and do not see each other as much as they used to because they are “so busy”.

The admission, which follows stories in the press about the increasing separation of the two Dukes, is likely to surprise and sadden admirers of the Royal Family, who have long viewed Prince William and Harry as bonded for life after the death of their mother.

They have already separated their working lives, with the Sussexes leaving the Royal Foundation they once shared with the Cambridges, after the Duke and Duchess of Sussex moved to a new home in Windsor from Kensington Palace.

Asked about a “rift” in the ITV documentary, and “how much of that is true”, the Duke of Sussex laughed before conceding reports were not without foundation.

“Part of this role and part of this job, this family, being under the pressure that it's under, inevitably stuff happens,” he said.

“But look: we're brothers, we'll always be brothers.

He'll count on William being his brother when his life inevitably shatters. As usual,. William will have to pick up Harry's pieces, like he's always done.

He’s gonna be in trouble at home because he didn’t condemn his family hard enough.

I’ve seen this shit play out close-up in real life. She’s probably berating him now for treating them with kid gloves and not sticking up for her and THEIR SON THEIR OWN FLESH AND BLOOD

Anything anyone does can backfire. You just gotta do what you need to do.

Why do I feel like Harry/Meghan are the new Duke and Duchess of Windsor?

R122-Prince Phillip allegedly refers to Meghan as DOW2-Duchess of Windsor 2.

R123 Where did you read that?

R124-that's been floating for awhile online now. I've seen it several places. It's no coincidence that Meghan wanted to live at Windsor Castle but instead grace and favored the Harkles with Frogmore where the Duchess of Windsor is interred. The Queen is a master of shade.

*instead the Queen grace and favored," meant to say.

And now for a lesson in how it should be done. This is a lovely video posted by the Cambs on Instagram. God, Harry and Meghan, it isn't that fucking hard.

Was there a thread about their TV show that disappeared?

That video is genius PR. William really chose so well. I wanted to see inside the Tuk Tuk (sp?) so I am glad they showed that bit.

That Meghan did the no one asked if I was ok routine whilst IN South Africa is so indicative of a lack of respect for the people being visited and the causes being highlighted, to her it is all HER. For them to try to step all over the reporting of the Pakistan tour is quite shocking.

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'I keep telling H, it's not enough to survive... you've got to thrive': Meghan Markle rejects the 'British stiff upper lip' and says she's warned Prince Harry about the 'damage' of burying emotions

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7594453/Meghan-Markle-talks-rejecting-British-stiff-upper-lip.html

As the cameras started rolling, it was clear this could have been one of the most inspiring and amazing royal tours of all time, especially at the beginning when Meghan met young women in Nyanga township, the so-called 'murder capital' of the country.

'I am here with you as a mother, as a wife, as a woman, as a woman of colour and as your sister,' she informed the small crowd that had gathered.

Her words might seem glib to first-world ears, but there is no telling how stirring they might seem to young women who could see and hear, through the Meghan prism, of a more hopeful future for themselves.

For one wonders at them visiting Angola, one of the most unfortunate countries in the world, and then using it as a backdrop to complain about their own problems.

All those wonderful people the Sussexes met across the continent, all those desperate problems they encountered, were condensed into a thin, doomed chorus that no one was listening to, while attention focused on the grandiose oratorio of their unfeigned pain, and the jolt of their first-world grievances.

Think of their plight compared to the teenage girls taking boxing lessons to fight off sexual predators who rape them with impunity. The tiny children in Angola who are still having their limbs blown off by land mines and the adults who have coped with mass killings and endless wars, not to mention a life without limbs themselves.

If you can bear witness to all of that misery and still stand in front of a camera, biting your lip or with a tear in your eye, as you complain that behind the ramparts your life is tough, then you are tone deaf to the concerns of real people and blind as to how you are perceived.

Harry and Meghan think that people are mean to them.

Catherine has a good eye for composition. It is noteable that their tour and the follow on PR has highlighted the country of Pakistan and its people.

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Post on Instagram @ SOS Village. When their plane had to turn back due to weather, Catherine had asked to return there for another visit.

Look how Meghan turned her back on her father, she probably thinks Harry can do the same to his family.

Although I did hear a rumor that Meghan is going to do a photo op with her father and Archie at Thanksgiving.

Thought her plans for Thanksgiving were to hang with Oprah, R135. Maybe they can all write on bananas and have them delivered to a soup kitchen?

I am sure they will deliver their own bananas, R136.

They'll drop them from their matching helicopters.

From the Telegraph... I highlighted some observations I found telling...

What will the Queen make of Harry and Meghan's Panorama-like outpouring?

2019 is starting to feel like another annus horribilis for the monarchy. First we had the allegations surrounding Prince Andrew’s friendship with the convicted paedophile Jeffrey Epstein. Then the Queen was dragged into a constitutional crisis over Brexit.

And now the Duke and Duchess of Sussex have given a television interview that feels on a par with Princess Diana’s explosive sit-down with Panorama.

[bold]By seeming to suggest that she can no longer continue in the Royal Family as it stands, Meghan appears to be not only casting aspersions on the British tabloids but also the Firm she married into.[/bold]

Her revelation to interviewer Tom Bradby that: “Not many people have asked if I’m okay,” appears to hint at a lack of support among her royal relatives - echoing the criticisms Diana made to Martin Bashir in 1995 of being isolated and misunderstood.

Sources close to the Sussexes have told me they feel like they are “completely on their own” which is perhaps why they have felt able to justify breaking with the 93-year-old monarch’s mantra: “Never explain, never complain,” for this extraordinarily emotional outpouring.

The monarchy can be brutally dynastic - when times get tough for one part of the hierarchy, it can be a case of every household for itself.

As when Diana and Prince Charles were having marriage problems, the suggestion seems to be that no one has taken Harry and Meghan aside to help them deal with the press criticism, let alone the mental anguish they claim it has caused.

[bold]Which begs the question: have the couple been receiving poor advice, or simply ignoring the good advice they’ve received? Since they did not appear to consult their advisers or closest family members before releasing a statement attacking the press on the final day of their tour of Africa last month, perhaps we can deduce that it is a bit of both.[/bold]

Harry’s admission that “stuff” has happened between him and his brother, who he reveals he no longer sees as much of, also bears witness to the notion that the Sussexes are increasingly operating in a silo. Harry used to rely on brotherly advice. Now married, like most husbands he largely listens to his wife.

[bold]Yet unlike William, Harry clearly has not fully come to terms with his mother’s death, admitting his mental health needs ‘constant management’.[/bold]

2 /2

Declaring that he “will not be bullied into playing the game that killed my Mum”, he confirms that he does still blame the media for what happened on August 31, 1997. Many will sympathise with this view. Others will conclude, as the inquest did, that a combination of drunk driver Henri Paul and marauding paparazzi were to blame.

He also appears to have forgotten that at times both of his parents were willing participants in the “game” he describes, actively tipping off journalists in a bid to win favourable headlines during the so-called War of the Waleses.

But this was not an interview that sought to give both sides of the story - hence why it was allowed in the first place.

In insisting he will protect his family at all costs, backed up by Meghan saying she will not adopt the “British stiff upper lip” - the Sussexes appear to be saying something deeper about their ongoing role in the Royal Family. They are no longer willing to put up and shut up - which could prove problematic for a family that has traditionally kept calm and carried on.

Both the Duchess of Cornwall and the Duchess of Cambridge faced a relentless media backlash when they first entered the royal scene. Camilla was famously dubbed “Britain’s most hated woman” and “the laziest woman to have been born in England in the 20th century”. Kate was also described as “lazy”, a “doormat”, nicknamed “Waity Katie” and a “Wisteria Sister” (highly decorative, terribly fragrant and with a ferocious ability to climb). Both royal women rose above.

Of course there is a big difference between unfair headlines, and untrue ones. But as with their generalised statement about the press, this documentary did not make any clearer just which stories the Sussexes were objecting to, and why.

[bold]Some members of the public will be scratching their heads at Meghan’s suggestion that she and Harry don’t want to be seen as a ‘mixed race couple’ but a love story. If that is the case, why does the Duchess keep bringing race into it, like when she spoke of being a “woman of colour” in South Africa? Hardly anyone else mentions it. [/bold]

No one expects either Harry or Meghan to “just exist”. The British public and indeed the world wants both to “thrive and be happy”.

But the reaction to this documentary will inevitably be divided between those who think people in positions of great power and privilege should follow the Queen’s example - or Diana’s.

---

I predict that ultimately, and sooner rather than later, these two will go the way of the Duke and Duchess of Windsor. They are too much trouble and will have to be cut adrift. The solution to that is exile because then they will have nothing to complain about relating to the royal family... as they will have gotten the space and freedom to thrive.

In the end, they will divorce, because Harry will have even less success coping outside the world he actually knows and and understands.

Yeah r5 and then it would all hinge on what mentally challenged humans wanted to believe someone like Thomas Markle.

So after the divorce will Meghan run back to daddy for a tearful reunion? I can just hear it now, "You tried to warn me about Harry!"

[quote]She also admitted to feeling 'vulnerable' during her pregnancy with baby Archie.

Is that why she wouldn't stop cradling her bump?

I was walking dogs this morning with a woman - and mother - who had previously been sympathetic to her... but that vulnerable during pregnancy line really turned... she was like ' find a woman who didn't feel that way?'

Is it unfair to see in what she says publicly MM seems to have no clue about other people... it's all about her, how she feels, how things impact her, what's she's got, what she wants, what she'll do...

This is an interesting podcast. A BBC royal correspondent who covered Harry and Meghan's Australian tour talks about Harry's relationship with the press, starting around 10 minutes in.

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^ Sorry for the double post.

If wonder what Prince Philip and Princess Anne think of these two.

^^ I wonder what Prince Philip and Princess Anne think of these two.

Kate on the cover of Hello.

R152 - I can hear Philip and Anne now.

Philip: "I told you WE just date actresses, WE don't not marry them. Grow some balls, man".

Anne: "Stop your bloody whinging. If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen".

These are the sanitized versions. Some swear words would probably be in order from these two as well. Both are well known for it. Patience is not known to be one of their virtues. LOL.

I tried to warn Liz that no good would come from marrying someone from the colonies.

He could have just taken the same route as Anne, Andrew, and Edward. Live in a huge house with a bunch of perks that most people only dream of in exchange for some public appearances. Let the family handle your PR, and settle into the background? You know what you get when you follow that path? PRIVACY. But privacy is not what Harry really wants. He wants to be a superstar. Without having to earn it. It's not cute anymore.

Interesting to hear in the podcast linked at R144 from the currect BBC royal reporter (the BBC, mind you, not some tabloid hack) how much Harry despises the press.

As to Meghan's advice to him to not just survive, but thrive: that's a commonplace in the yoga/medition/woo woo world. I'm also a devotee of all kinds of woo, and Harry needs to take a lot more of it to heart (stop blaming, look within, detach, etc.)

[quote]He wants to be a superstar. Without having to earn it. It's not cute anymore.

Actually, he was on the road to getting that before he met Markle. He was well liked because he went to Africa and did humanitarian work. If he had continued on that path, doing like Jimmy Carter and helping to build homes for poor people or people in devastated areas, he would have risen to be more popular than the Queen herself. (He didn't even need to do the work. If he had become a patron of something like Habitat for Humanity or Doctors Without Borders, he could have reaped the rewards without the work).

I don't understand why someone who hates the press so much married a woman who's sought the spotlight her entire adult life.

Maybe I'm a nasty old misogynist, but I think the Occam's razor on this is that MM is pussy-whipping him. I mean, who does a "poor me" interview (with a reporter you've been friends with for 20 years) in the middle of a tour where you're supposed to be paying attention to poor them? It's pure self-promotion.

[quote]If wonder what Prince Philip and Princess Anne think of these two.

[quote]He wants to be a superstar. Without having to earn it. It's not cute anymore.

He, nothing. Rubbish. It's all her. Before The Great Mistake of 2018 slithered in he was dimly content with Invictus and Africa. Everybody liked him. Everybody rooted for him. Well, everybody except The Guardian. Then Anna Anderson saw and easy mark and moved in. Just like Wallis, she overplayed her hand. It's quite sad, really.

Well r140, MM released at least parts of the letter to her friends, so they could leak it to People. Thomas Markle released parts of the letter to refute People.

If it comes to the truth, I would hardly be relying on MM.

Robert Jobson and other reportes with a line to BP and Charles's office are reporting that QEII and other senior royals are 'deeply concerned' about this documentary and where H&M are headed. William said to be worried about the 'fragile state' of his brother.

Am seeing a path being laid to remove them from active royal duties, if they don't raise the nose cone and pull up out of this dive soon.

This is a magnificent cluster fuck. My guess is they pulled a Panorama style interview to force the BRF's hand for more exalted treatment. Perhaps they forgot that's what resulted in the divorce and Diana losing her HRH.

Oh, Granny, if Harry is removed from Royal Duties, can we jump in and do some?

thought this was quite telling;

"Royal commentator Penny Junor described the couple's television appearance as a 'huge mistake', and urged the duke to change his approach. She said: 'My advice would be to keep his head down, and I'm afraid to say, stop whingeing. 'It's beginning to sound like a bit of a whinge. [bold]That's not the Harry that we know and love.[/bold]

Pretty sure Penny Junor is one of Prince Charles' go-tos. I wonder if she was a surrogate? You know everybody's team was all over this. The emergence of Megantoinette as a player has revived the game/imperatives of the 80s and 90s.

R143 I’m from LA, and to me she just sounds like the worst kind of self-absorbed Angeleno, complete with the woke buzzwords and uptalk, right? I’m sure that was very alluring and exotic to Harry. But this is a damn mess. I’m disgusted by it. I’ve been a fan of the royal family since I was a wee lad with a Scottish mother, and it just pisses me off that these two idiots are ruining the mystique by being such asshole drama queens. She really is Wallis all over again, taking advantage of a weak man and wreaking havoc. Grrr!

Jan Moir's genteel pseudo-concern about Harry is gold-standard 'Daily Mail' nastiness. 'Of course one sympathises with Harry…', and, 'There are many stages of grief…' - one can smell the fake 'decency' from many miles away.

Harry lost his mother, the most famous woman in the world, to a sordid road accident, when he was a boy. His father, who will be King, eventually married the woman he was fucking all the time he was married to Harry's mother.

If that isn't a Shakespearean clusterfuck enough to mess with anyone's mind, I don't know what is. All the money and privilege in the world can't smooth out that legacy. Moir's crassness is a symptom of the corrupt press; but The Firm's MO is also deeply part of the problem. Every year, their standing looks steadily less assured - so entirely otherworldly, and out of touch. Harry's troubled realism is highlighting this.

R161 "Dimly content," lol

r168, Jan Moir is a bitch and Harry and William did go through hell. The thing is he is a grown adult, he should talk about his feelings with counsellors/psychiatric workers and not to the media while he is on public duty. The media he loathes with a passion.

R170 Also one of them turned into functioning adult , the other into a whining mess.

Swipe for the life of the late Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mum.

[quote]Harry lost his mother, the most famous woman in the world, to a sordid road accident, when he was a boy. His father, who will be King, eventually married the woman he was fucking all the time he was married to Harry's mother.

How was her accident "sordid"? She died at the hands of stupid drunk driver, in a speeding car wearing no seat belt. Yes the paps were involved but the drunken impairment, speed and lack of car restraints were the occupants fault. Lots of people lose a parent when young like Harry, to all sorts of accidents and illnesses. He is no different from the lot of them and alot more privileged.

His dad going on to marry in mistress is de riguer behavior in his social circles. Again something they all do, and would be expected to do. Despite the stress of it all, I can't understand how he can claim to still be in meltdown mode over it in his mid-thirties.

[quote] His father, who will be King, eventually married the woman he was fucking all the time he was married to Harry's mother.

From all accounts, Harry loves Camilla (she's the only mother he had after the age of twelve), and does not think of her in those terms.

Stop being such a drama queen.

Why don’t they simply ignore the writings of the gossip papers? If you stick to reading quality newspapers, even British ones, you are barely aware of the fact that royal families still exist. It’s like these people are googling themselves all day long.

^ Well, I've no doubt she does. Her profession dictates she do nothing else.

A Torygraph columnist wonders if it's time for them to move on... my bolds again... this went as expected (at least as expected by any one other than Dim and The Great Mistake of 2018.)

For their own sake, the Duke and Duchess of Sussex need to decide whether they are cut out for Royalty

Sometimes, when things aren’t working, you just need to go in a different direction

[bold]Whatever way you look at it, ITV’s documentary following the Duke and Duchess of Sussex around Africa, perhaps intended as a puff piece — damage limitation after months of negative press — has had the opposite effect to what was intended.[/bold]

Instead of discussions about the human side of the couple in any positive light, or their causes and the movements they champion, two things have come away from the hour long documentary — that Meghan feels coverage of her is unfair, and Harry wants to leave the UK and head to Africa full time.

[bold]The image that came across was less of a well-meaning couple misunderstood and wanting to set the record straight, and more of a couple fed-up at not being appreciated, taking it out on a convenient enemy, and going off in a huff.[/bold]

It’s a shame, but the question must now be being raised — is it time for them to step away from the limelight, at least in the sense of representing the royal family?

[bold]This is not just a wanton attack on the pair — there must be genuine concern that, actually, neither is cut out for this, nor is it fair to put them through it. Both saw fit to bring up their mental health during the documentary, after all.[/bold]

2 of 2

[bold]Harry is now very much a spare, with little to no constitutional relevance. [/bold] That must be difficult, especially having been groomed his whole life for the spotlight, and wanting to make a positive difference in the world. Meghan, meanwhile, is a self-made woman, with a life and career built independently of royal privilege. [bold]Becoming a cog in a machine where you are expected to smile and perform duties without complaint or query is as far away from being empowered as one could wish for. It must be equally tough to swallow.[/bold]

[bold]But for as long as they remain royals — funded by the taxpayer, representing the nation — that is the deal. Stiff upper-lips may not be fashionable amongst the young of today, but the family at the head of the country is symbolic for all generations, now, at a time of national disunity, more than ever. They represent the whole, not the individual, and individual tempers, views and wants are not indulged in public.[/bold]

The duke and duchess, though, are not like the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge. The latter are to be king and queen one day, whilst the former will not. They are not essential. [bold]Why, then, should they not be allowed to take their public lives in a very different direction?[/bold]

[bold]They cannot do this whilst the taxpayer continues to fund their lifestyles. Meghan and Harry espouse many ideals, some of which are universal; others, though, are not. They do not represent official policy, nor are they overwhelmingly popular with the public. That is a problem when it is the public helping fund them to do so.[/bold]

Moreover, the hypocrisy that the couple is accused of, with Prince Harry reportedly taking a private jet to lecture the world at a climate change summit, and both indulging in diva-like behaviour out of touch with ordinary people, has not won them many friends. Even the idea of inviting an ITV documentary team to follow them around Africa, lovingly capturing every positive, whilst launching legal action against other members of the British press at the same time, raises questions about their level of self-awareness.

I don’t think the duke and duchess are being cynical when Harry talks of his love for Africa. I think he genuinely means it, and wants to do much to improve the world. I suspect Meghan does too, and the pair should be commended for wanting to do good. But using your platform to launch the Invictus Games, say, or start a clothes line for jobless women, doesn’t sit well when some members of the press are happily utilised to promote the ‘right’ sort of stories, but when stories about tempestuous tiara-based bust-ups or familial disputes surface, others are sued for being ‘unfair’. You can’t have it both ways.

Equally, one cannot complain that scrutiny is applied to the couple when the taxpayer lays on multimillion pound renovations to their home, and they then reportedly fly by private jet to lecture the same taxpayer on the dangers our lifestyles pose to the climate.

If they were not royals, then, actually, this wouldn’t matter to nearly the same extent. Perhaps Leonardo Di Caprio, for example, does the same thing, but he doesn’t get anywhere near the same backlash, because he does so on his own time, at his own expense.

Meghan and Harry would have no trouble living if they decided to give up royal crest and responsibilities. They could probably earn significantly more money if free to pursue their own agendas unshackled by the palace. They could probably raise a lot more money for charity, and would be a lot more effective at pushing their missions to a global audience. It would give them the spotlight they crave, allow them to be the change they want to be, and would enable them to do things at their own pace, and much more so on their own terms.

The nation doesn’t dislike Meghan and Harry. But sometimes, when things aren’t working, you just need to go in a different direction. This couple, more than anything, look like they need a change of scenery.

Bravo!

Yep, the drumbeats that are going to march them to the door have definitely started. The columnist at R178 makes a lot of sense, actually. If Harry and Meghan want to live the celebrity lifestyle, let them go give it a try at their own expense--or funded by Charles until they get on their feet. Then they can network and merch to their heart's content and say/do/wear whatever they want.

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Ouch. That's pretty damning.

R175, one reporter (was it CNN?) said that she claims to not read the tabloids, but she apparently does.

No fucking kidding.

Not only does SHE read what people on the internet say, her PR flunkies do, too. And they call every critic “racist”.

I was struck that she does not call him by his name, but just by a letter, likely unlike anyone else in his life. She is creepy in her echoing of poses, outfits and even words of his mother. She has isolated him from family and friends in a very short span of time and he seems to be emotionally fragile suddenly. It is concerning.

If this was a film she would be a plant set to bring down the BRF. IRL she may still do the institution great harm.

[quote] If you stick to reading quality newspapers, even British ones, you are barely aware of the fact that royal families still exist.

I'm afraid your pants are on fire.

There's at least one story almost every day on the royal family even on the front page of The Guardian's website. Right now there's a photo of Princess Diana for a story about the blackmailing of Prince Harry and Paul Burrell.

In an abusive relationship, it frequently happens that the abuser isolates the abused partner from their family and close friends, leaving the abused one totally dependent on the abuser.

Aside from her mother, who shows up infrequently, Sparkle does not appear to be close to family members from either side, including those who helped her like the uncle who helped her get the embassy job.

If she does not value her own family, why should she see any value in Harry's family relationships?

Is she is the one and only person he is listening to?

Adam Bidwell still seems to be around.

[quote] The royal couple is aware that one dissenting perception of them is that they live gilded lives, in royal properties with staff at their every beck and call, and that all they do is travel the world to champion causes the family believes in. When pressed on this impression in the documentary, Meghan emphasized that "the grass is always greener."

[quote]"I never thought this would be easy. But I thought it would be fair and that's the part that's really hard to reconcile."

When Harry wants to release his pent-up rage, he can come to my bedroom. Hubba-hubba.

Really, R187? Where?

Apart from in your tiny little head, I mean.

Much basic advice for The Sussexes to re-adopt 'The Stiff Upper Lip.' That's the attitude which long prevailed under the aegis of QEII and Philip. And arguably led to three of their offspring divorcing.

Diana was constantly praised for bringing new life into The Windsors with her emotional openness and challenging of rigid protocols. Certainly she overplayed her hand; but the public responded strongly, hence the unprecedented grief in '97.

So now suddenly 'The Stiff Upper Lip' is again evoked - despite the sane world recognising that more emotional openness is constructive, that repressing painful feelings is destructive, and both Diana's sons being praised for associating themselves with mental health issues.

To understate, the world has changed unimaginably since the Coronation in '53, and Harry's troubled state is expressive of that huge shift. The archaic panoply of The Royal Family seems every year more anachronistic.

R99, I take issue with your characterization of Botswana as a shit hole.

It is a peaceful, stable, harmonious democracy, and one of the most economically successful countries in Africa.

It is, however small, homogenous, and parochial, with a total population of around 2 million, and I've no doubt Sparkles will be bored off her trolley and spitting with frustration at the lack of attention and ass kissers to be found.

Poor Harkles and their wobbly upper lips. And Diana too. No really, boo flippin hoo. Get the mental health help you need with all your vast resources, and make creative use of your opportunities. Or not, and stomp away. Bye!

[quote]Diana was constantly praised for bringing new life into The Windsors with her emotional openness and challenging of rigid protocols.

Accepting her private life was an increasingly angry and revenge focused hot mess, the difference with Diana is she did effected change by making her work about people, not herself.

R192 - Well said, and that's where Harry and Meghan may find their marital Waterloo - they have some issues in common, but they also have some issues that do not overlap: he really does want out and wants a privileged, paid for privacy, and probably does "love Africa", but Meghan craves attention and drama and deference and luxury and her face on magazine covers and paps covering her every move, but worshipfully. A poster on an earlier thread who claimed to have run into her years ago in L.A. described Meghan as "exhausting".

Meghan married Harry for a life of endless attention and celebrityhood - a quiet life in Botswana is not what she married him for. She also married him to luxuriate in white privilege, something she has also been chasing all her life, evidence by a crowd of white besties and two white husbands. Her WoC act is just that, an act. Her nearly pyschotic obsession with having long straight hair that she doesn't even seem to want trimmed and shaped is evidence of skewed self-image.

I don't know where this is going, but it should be obvious by now, and I don't think it's quite what the Harkles intended to make obvious, that the two of them suffer from serious psychological and emotional problems of considerable depth.

The only thing the BRF can do at this point is cut them off as quickly and cleanly as possible - that is, if it is interested in saving itself.

Psycho-pop analysis of the mental deficiencies or problems of others is indicative of your own, R195. Calling them names is another tell.

No intelligent discourse here, but it's the BRF so no one really expects that from them or their admirers. I do thank you for outing yourselves.

R191, Harry made it clear that spewing his problems and concerns publically has NOT been beneficial to him in fact his mental health is much worse by his own description. Whinging endlessly at work is not the same as being treated by professionals. The rumor is that he had been on SSRIs, which WERE helpful and dear loving Me-Again got H to ditch them. Hmmm, wonder if that is a factor? Or being isolated from friends and family?

When your JOB is to highlight the suffering of landmine victims and you instead, in the midst of HORRENDOUS human suffering instead choose to narcissistically bitch about the in laws, you need to be replaced in that role. Whilst most humans understand the concept of time and place, for some, when they spot a camera, it is just MeMeMe.

Actually I find R195 - who interestingly I have blocked for some reasons - to be sensible. Take away a lot of the pompous hyperbole and unjustified pseudo-psychiatric analysis and it describes Hapless and the Great Mistake of 2018 pretty accurately, in terms of what we can tell of them. Dolt wrongly imagining the grass is greener and Lisa Douglas (Google it) without the warmth and charm.

If Harry gets what he wants - that view over the savannah with quiet and privacy - he'll probably find out what his mother did, what most of us do: it's boring as hell and the imagining is far, far better than the having it.

Agree, R198, but he imagines living a privileged ex-pat life as many from the UK do there. His vision of the future has some basis in the reality he has seen of life there for the rich. She wants something completely different. People in Africa are not idiots, they will not fail to notice her treating them as props. When will he clue in that they have very different end goals?

That she does not call him by his name is so odd. I jokingly posted about Neuro Linguistic Programing on a prior thread but now I wonder. She has quickly established so much control over him and seems to reduce him to the edge of a breakdown frequently, even in front of others whilst at work. Cannot rule out the possiblity of cueing.

If she dresses like and quotes Diana in public who knows how much study she has done? Many have reported on their fights, how far will H go to prevent another loss of Mummy? Gobsmaked at how William managed to land a woman who is stable, kind and genuinely nurturing towards him and his children. Not to manipulate but out of love. Harry is in way over his dim head with this one.

I agree she's got him by the balls but I don't think she's a master manipulator in an informed way... she seems to me a creature with her own damage and somehow their cells mutate together. They feed off the other's damage and need.

If she was going on intelligence, rather than hunger, she wouldn't have made such a hash of her reputation. She's been lucky enough to find an easy mark: stupid [italic]and[/italic] needy. Never underestimate the role of luck in the biggest grifts.

from an article in the Maul today:

"But royal sources scotched talk of William being 'furious' about the timing of the programme, which ITV began trailing toward the end of his own successful tour of Pakistan with his wife Kate. One said: 'Actually I just think there is a really deep sadness there. Things will never be the same again, clearly.'

William labelling the pair "fragile" has hit a deep nerve. Now Harry Mountbatten-Whinger and his narc wife are saying people are just "hysterical." Oh, and they've single-handedly modernized the BRF. You cannot make this stuff up.

[quote] Psycho-pop analysis of the mental deficiencies or problems of others is indicative of your own, [R195].

Pot, meet kettle.

[quote]To understate, the world has changed unimaginably since the Coronation in '53, and Harry's troubled state is expressive of that huge shift.

Mary! Harry's dim and trouble state has dunk-all to do with the changes in modern society since the 50s. It has to do with his dim IQ combined with his hyper-privileged upbringing, with a caring but clueless father and a mother who was openly borderline. He's now coupled with a woman of similar bend, and the results are evident and predictable.

The BRF is going about its business in its typical way, it was here thousands of years before the Harkles, and will be here many more after them. They are not anywhere even near the center of the monarchy or highly in line for it, their prominence actually declines each year as the Cambridges reproduce and their children age up. If they are so "troubled", they have private life awaiting them with open arms (and wallets), they will do just fine there. Its the best solution to their current issues, there are plenty of other royals to step up in their place.

[quote]William labelling the pair "fragile" has hit a deep nerve. Now Harry Mountbatten-Whinger and his narc wife are saying people are just "hysterical." Oh, and they've single-handedly modernized the BRF. You cannot make this stuff up.

It was perhaps ill-advised and foolhardy of William to leak statements like that, give the mind-set of his brother and SIL currently (like firing a gun near a fragile skittish colt) - but the insane narcissism evident here belies belief. Who believes that H&M "single handedly" modernized the BRF?? what.

Time to plan an orderly calm removal of the Sussex brood from public duties. They have plenty of examples to live fulfilling private lives, yet stay close to the BRF (Peter and Zara, the Armstrong-Jones kids, Kents, Glocuesters, etc). On with it.

watch Harry become a drunk ! He's gonna crack under the pressure.

How pathetic to be in your mid-thirties and to be worrying your septagenarian father and nonagenarian grandmother that you're too fragile to handle your incredibly pampered and privileged life.

If the Queen were to suddenly die in the midst of all this, Harry is absolute toast. He would never be forgiven for the hysterical posturing during his grandmother's last amount of time on the throne.

Or if Philip died (which is more likely, given that his health is worse).

Yeah, R209, but I think people would take it more personally if it were the Queen. She is a beloved national treasure, the only monarch the majority of her subjects has ever known. They would probably blame Harkle Hysteria for triggering a stroke or heart attack.

Yes, I too have thought of the elderly family members, and the stress on them, which Harry and Meghan would be blamed for. Can't they see that? They're a very reckless pair. Probably even worse than we know.

I don’t for a minute believe Meghan would actually live in Botswana for any length of time. Sooner Thomas Markle Sr will be seen seated next to TQ on her weekly church visit.

Philip is in great health, he sends his love.

Did you see how normal Philip was walking a mere few weeks after his hip replacement? I wonder what the fuck they are feeding him...

Maybe he's getting blood transfusions (of young people) like some billionaires.

So it looks like the palace is setting up the "Poor Harry" narrative. My money is on a divorce and painting Harry as a victim to rehabilitate his image within the family. Predicted by many astute observers on the DL.

R214-I swear to god, I half wonder if that's true. Their health is just all preternatural.

Did they sign a prenup?

According to those in the know here, neither William nor Harry did, R217. Some have theorized that their monies are so tied up in trusts that much wouldn't be gotten out of a divorce, but Charles certainly paid Diana.

This is very much the Palace line, I think---lots of sympathy, but clearly formulating the narrative that Harry and Meghan are damaged, all's fine with the rest of the RF, our paparazzi are less intrusive than the US' and by the way, that interview was all planned out with a reporter who's one of their best friends.

Prenups can be ignored completely by UK courts. R218 is also correct, in that trusts can shelter capital though not necessarily income streams.

Is that why Fergie got nothing ? Andrew didn’t actually have his own wealth. Most super rich families ensure the spouse can’t get much. Joe Kennedy was the master at that.

"The couple, who married in May 2018 in a trailblazing ceremony at St. George's Chapel in Windsor, have one child Archie Harrison."

What exactly was trailblazing about their wedding? The boringness of her gown?

And god I still hate that dumb name. Harry's son? We already knew that.

From the Telegraph.,. part of a column... this disaster isn't going away.

DO take Archie to visit his great-grandmother at Balmoral when you’re invited. Claiming he’s too young to travel to Scotland, then managing to get him onto a rock star’s private plane to the south of France was not a good look. There is only one Queen of England, and it’s not Elton John.

DO hunker down and enjoy your lovely baby, instead of flying across the Atlantic to see a tennis match. Watch it on the telly like everyone else. Stay at home quietly and take advantage of the help you can afford. Hormonal and sleep-deprived, we all go a bit nuts after having a baby, and trying to do too much will put a strain on you and your marriage. There’s plenty of time to save the world; save yourselves first.

DON’T give lectures on the environment and then have your own Range Rovers flown to South Africa. If you do this, don’t be upset if people accuse you of hypocrisy. They’ve got a point.

DO retain a sense of humour. The British dislike people who take themselves too seriously. That means not writing “You are loved” on bananas being sent to sex workers. Chances are, if they’ve fallen into prostitution, they didn’t feel especially loved. People adored the Harry of old who enjoyed a laugh. Bring him back, we miss him.

DON’T say tearfully to Tom Bradby that “not many people have asked if I am OK”. Welcome to motherhood, sweetie! People not asking if you are OK goes on for, ooh, at least another 20 years. Archie will give you a Mother’s Day card every year; otherwise, it’s your job to check that everyone else is OK. Bummer, I know. But self-sacrifice is the job description.

DO take a six-week “sabbatical”, as you’re rumoured to be doing, but ask yourselves if someone like Harry, who says he is triggered by the sound of camera shutters, should really be carrying out the packed schedule of a member of the royal family. Maybe life as a private citizen might suit better.

BOOM R223

LOL, shade packed as helpful advice!

Worth repeating: There is only one Queen of England, and it’s not Elton John.

R203 - The kettle has obviously forgotten what the name of this site is . . . and the purpose - you know, talking about people none of us know?

That's because her brains have little holes in them where informa

^*information leaks through and out the shallow bottom (hit POST accidentally)

R221 - Andrew has a substantial trust fund of his own, and part of the settlement was a seven-figure trust fund for each of the two girls. and responsibility for their schooling until the age of 18, in addition to about $650,000 for a house, and an annual payment of about $20,000.

Fergie didn't get much compared to Diana, but given the circumstances of her departure from the family, and not having any money of her own as Diana did to hire high-grade counsel and fight a protracted and unseemly legal battle, she just took what she could get. She probably also knew that Andrew would always take care of her one way or another, and he has. Despite having no money, Fergie has for the last 25 years walked around in designer clothes, lived in nice homes, and flitted about the world jet-setting and attending charity events. She's been free-loading on the BRF all theyse years, living for free with Andrew at Royal Lodge, the York official residence.

Another hyena who threw away and opportunity other women would have killed to fulfill.

Fergie is probably just a few years, or even months, from re-marrying Andrew as soon as Philip dies, so it's hard to feel too sorry for her.

Also, life could have been much easier for her if she were not such a berserk spender.

The song playing during the entrance is “Happy.”

Sorry wrong thread, but refers to Meghan's grand entrance at the event this past evening.

R202, it DID hit a nerve. I do wonder about the rumors that H had been on psych meds and she persuaded him to stop them.

That there is a baby in the midst of all this instability and delusion is also sad.

R211, I think that they simply do not care.

The BRF have been Markled.

They serve the purpose of stock figures who have done Ging and Cringe wrong. They have no value as independent humans with their own lives and needs. They have failed to provide consistent and overwhelming narc supply and they will be made to pay.

I half expected MeAgain to go full Diana and actually quote After all I have done for this fucking family! Her quotes were more subtle. Probably saving that one.

[quote]The BRF have been Markled.

They kind of brought it upon themselves. In the way that they seem to have no rules, or clearly dictated expectations of royal life for the in-laws who marry in. Time and again we see this: prince meets girl, prince marries girl and makes her a princess (or duchess), girl can't cope with the work or scrutiny, flubs around, and bails, inevitably blaming the family itself for her failings.

A wealthy, family-owned and run major international corporation would have extremely clear and delineated rules and work descrips for those individuals who marry in and come to work in the family firm. The quid pro quo, if you will, for the money, perks, status and wealth that comes to them via the marriage. And they would ENFORCE it. The BRF just doesn't seem to understand how to do this.

[quote]The quid pro quo, if you will, for the money, perks, status and wealth that comes to them via the marriage. And they would ENFORCE it.

What? Do you think the BRF has a Human Resources Department?

Enforce it how?

Markle was given patronages that fit with her interests and coaching and support from very experienced aides. Her agenda was to build a brand literally in opposition to all of it.

Catherine has seemed to do fine, as has Sophie after a few bumps.

Diana, Fergie (now seeming a full blown alcoholic) and Meghan all appear to have significant psychiatric issues, that seems to be why it all went so sideways for them.

[quote] A wealthy, family-owned and run major international corporation would have extremely clear and delineated rules and work descrips for those individuals who marry in and come to work in the family firm. The quid pro quo, if you will, for the money, perks, status and wealth that comes to them via the marriage. And they would ENFORCE it. The BRF just doesn't seem to understand how to do this.

A wealthy, family-owned and run major corporation would have hired its employees from a pool of candidates who WANTED to work for them. The members of the BRF are all BORN into the job of being heirs to the throne. They of course cannot, and will not, be treated the same way.

Enforce by making clear up front that if they choose to head sideways and go way off-script, there will be -consequences-. Like, taking away of patronages. Being put in the back of the royal box, instead of near the front. Not getting their back garden re-modeled with BRF funds. And - for the truly wayward - the lessening and eventual full cut-off of those lifestyle-supportive funds.

For the hyper-attitudinal, reserve the 'full court press' service: use of the media to embarrass and cut down. Leakage of sound bits re 'stability', 'direction' and 'appropriateness for the job'. At max, exposure of old photos, letters, videos.

These are all things I can see a King William using with gusto. No looking back or hesitation about it.

[quote]A wealthy, family-owned and run major corporation would have hired its employees from a pool of candidates who WANTED to work for them. The members of the BRF are all BORN into the job of being heirs to the throne. They of course cannot, and will not, be treated the same way.

Well re-read, it wasn't about born BRF members, it applies to marry-ins. All of whom, in the case of the BRF, WANTED to work and marry in, wanted the perks, attention and money. The wayward ones just didn't want to toe the party line after the fact, and live up to expectation. Those are the outliers that need handling.

Any handling and MeAgain would be screaming that they are racists.

I don't understand why the Queen tolerates Harry and Meghan's going rogue with their publicity. In most companies, all teams must get the Director of Communications to approve any messaging intended for an external audience. If the Sales Team designs a new flier and starts using distributing it to potential clients without getting the Director of Communications' approval, then there will be a lot of yelling at the very least.

The Queen needs to put her foot down and say that all official communications must be approved by her team. Anyone who fails to comply will have their allowance docked.

The problem is, R242, the Sussexes won't respect the system. Since Harry's previous problems were only making a drunken, ill-costumed fool of himself, you have to imagine she's the one masterminding the rebellion. I think it will have to come to a show down and some damage. They will have to leave, maybe renounce. Meagain will tell all one way or another, even if there is a contract.

Then eventually everybody will forget because the Cambridges, knowing the job, keep sailing on with dignity and the Sussexes, left to their own instincts, look foolish and tawdry. If there's a divorce, Harry either becomes a hopeless alcoholic or he returns home and all is forgiven. She will wither on the vine because her only real draw was her marriage.

And another observation: do these two idiots, without the mantle of royalty, really expect they're going to have any sustained pull as outsiders>?

They don't have a Bill Gates sized fortune to disperse.

Have you seen the kind of charities Fergie supports? You've never heard of them. They're obscure. The Association for Homeless Carrier Pigeons. Orange Pencils for Kids.

They will be sought after only as performing seals for black tie galas in America.

[quote] And another observation: do these two idiots, without the mantle of royalty, really expect they're going to have any sustained pull as outsiders>?

This^.

Both are, even in their late 30s too immature to see themselves even 5 years from now if they persist in this mistaken belief of theirs that the BRF needs them more than they'll need it.

Upon a Sussex divorce, he'll eventually recover and be forgiven, she won't be, although he's as much to blame as her. That's not fair. That's not right that she'll be the pariah and not him, but that 's reality. And, without her marriage let's see how long the "A List" crowd continues to put up with her. She won't have Wendi Deng dough-ray-mee.

And, to be unapologetically callous about it, their are going to be 2, possibly 3 funerals coming up assuming the Sussexes survive Charles, Prince of Wales, the Duke of Edinburgh and, the big, Royal Enchilada: Queen Elizabeth II.

When their are hard feelings within a family, nothing settles or creates scores like your placement at a funeral. I myself enjoy a good tension-filled funeral over a wedding any day.

And, I've written this before, but will again: William used to be a bore. He isn't anymore because of this one reason. He's a pro in public appearances, however, I fully believe the reports that he's mean, cold and ruthless, in private with those who annoy him. Apparently, the Sussexes annoy him.

I suspect, that in private with someone he despises, William, Duke of Cambridge ain't mean in an overt way, he's mean and cold in a more effective way- distant, with an air of condescending sufferance to you if he's forced to interact with you.

I feel sorry for Markle if she's experienced the blast of that behavior.

I will never feel sorry for Markle.

Why, from her actions you might conclude her goal is hastening the death of the beloved Queen and trying to bring down the BRF as an institution. FFS!

Harry and Meghan are a couple of assholes and two peas in a pod but the BRF and the public will forgive Harry.

Harry is one of them, Meghan is not. They won't hesitate to throw Meghan under the bus to re-establish Stupid Harry Son of Saint Diana.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

Don't you love when Courtiers act like petty assholes? Pictures are a way to send messages in the Firm.

I doubt the Queen cares one way or an other at the point, but the Men in Grey have enough and make it known.

R248 - You're right, it does speak volumes, and thanks for posting it. And the idea that it's to protect their privacy is so laughable that even the DM probably blushed whilst printing it. That they phrased it as a question, however, invites exactly the laughing response of, "Not bloody likely!" Everyone will guess why the photo is gone - they are no longer members of the BRF except in name.

In my wildest assessments of how cynically Markle worked all this, and those assessments were operating from the moment her threats to the British press emerged in fall 2016, I honestly couldn't have made up the speed of this level of crash and burn.

I wonder how they're going to stage the announcement: after the six-week "holiday"? Before? What happens to Frogmore Cottage? Meghan never wanted it, anyway. Will they head to Botswana or L.A.?

Aaaaaaand the palace claps back. A palace aide is calling the Harkles "paranoid" for their claim that they "single-handedly saved the monarchy." Never in a million years would I have predicted any of this.

No way Meghan will live in Botswana, I bet on NYC.

They gonna head to LA for Thanksgiving and Meghan won't come back for Christmas. Harry will be back in UK alone to deal with the BRF's fury.

In 2020, Harry will realize he can't live outside the UK as a working Royal and they will divorce.

Meghan will find an other lapdog and Harry will stay bitter forever.

R251 We're a lot to have predicted it but we were called racist and jealous.

If you look closely at Meghan and Harry, his Mummy issues + her own issues, it was obvious it would go the hell sooner than later.

R251 - The quotes in the piece are, as usual, hilariously understated. I doubt that the Queen is remotely "worried" about Meghan Markle, although she probably is deeply saddened by her grandson's choices and the fate those choices will lead to. Meghan Markle has ghosted friends,her mother's family, her own fathere the moment she started dating Harry, and now the BRF - she's fits the description of Fitzgerald's wealthy protagonists in "The Great Gatsby", who step over the mess they've made and leave other people to clean up after them.

Meghan is no Wallis Simpson, who knew she would have to hang on forever as she'd never get a better gig, had cost a King his throne and kingdom, and wasn't likely to do better on a fourth marriage - she was already middle-aged when she snagged Edward.

Meghan will, when the time comes, ghost Harry, too. As noted elsewhere, she's like the scorpion in the fable: she can't help it, it's her nature.

I can't see harry winning back much support after this fiasco. He has aged out of the cheeky, just one of the boys act now, and tends to look a bit creepy when he hugs random kids. Andrew was the super popular heartthrob in his youth and also a war hero. Harry is off to join him in the also ran category.

R255 They will try to save Harry, it will work if he obeys otherwise they should cut him loose.

Leaning hard into that mental health angle, well, they were the ones who raised it.

Globalist darlings will never want for $ as long as they perform. Wonder how long the platform of victimhood will suffice as a career?

The 6 weeks seems like a cover for work with Oprah in LA.

As proponents of mental health treatment, I would have guessed that they should seem, erm, ah, BETTER? For that line of banging on to have any credibility? Like James Middleton seems healthier? Dim and Dame seem to be decompensating in full view of the world for all of their sharing.

The idea that constantly talking about and wallowing in negative feelings is good for you was debunked long ago. Held sway in the 70s. We can see the result in these 2. Paranoia, anger and negativity feed on themselves. They have health, financial stability and a new baby yet they cannot feel grateful for any of it due to the prisons they have created in their minds by indulgence and I will say it again, Neuro Linguistic Programing. The scripts that run through our minds all the time have a huge impact in how we experience life, but we all have the power to change it.

Harry has not developed a more nuanced understanding of his mother as an adult. Her death was greatly contributed to by dropping the RPOs, getting in a car with a drunk driver and not wearing a seat belt. Of course, going at the BRF the way she did was risky as well. At some point in life, one needs to develop acceptance of situations and people. The need to create chaos and drama is exhausting and quite destructive. Harry should have learned some of this by his age. If Diana truly indulged him and said as long as he got away with things it was fine, it was quite cruel. We all need a sense of internal structure, of responsibility to others, awareness of how our actions impact others, etc. Harry is a tantruming toddler in a middle aged body and it is not cute.

We all have seen the way she treated her own family, none but her mother at the wedding, not even the uncle who pulled strings to get her the foreign embassy internship. The one where she almost immediately fucked off to Greece to chase some geezer. So, it is against that backdrop that her claims about any family relationships must be judged.

I think we should all start referring to her as Scorpion Megs and Harry as that gullible turtle. Really get that cautionary tale out there, perhaps it will save someone else an ill fate.

Some real truth in The Sun piece

The well-placed insider told the newspaper: "It's very much a mentality of 'us against the world', which is a real shame.

The aide also said there was a "startling lack of self-awareness" over problems Meghan and Harry have created - including the row over their private jet use this summer.

US broadcaster CNN yesterday revealed how some Palace insiders were reportedly determined to fuel "anti-Prince Harry and Meghan hysteria".

But the source told the Mail: "It's akin to saying that [Harry and Meghan] are too good for the royal family, which is extremely disrespectful to everyone who works for, and on behalf of, the Queen and other senior members of the royal family.

"The truth is that no-one is "anti" Harry and Meghan and no-one is briefing against them.

"And it is also just plain wrong to say they have 'single-handedly modernised have single-handedly modernised the monarchy. Modernisation is an ongoing process led by the Queen.

"None of this is remotely helpful to the monarchy as an institution. It is promoting discord and taking attention away from the good works senior royals do across the board."

I do not think that Dim and Dutch have any brakes on their scorched earth plan, bit sad. Hope William and Kate at least get some time with the Middletons over the holidays, although the Queen is looking quite frail. I suspect Harry may also need rehab, his behavior suggests a dual diagnosis, one which his poor choice in wife is exaccerbating. The reports of their fighting are interesting. Wonder if it is a way for her to increase control by pushing his buttons then threatening to walk with the baby.

MM has to be one of the least maternal women on the planet. Poor A Harrysson.

One Young Word event - what does that have to do with a woman pushinng 40 (or over it by some accounts?)

Harry's problem is he didn't find his Kate/Middleton family.

Will had the same issues as Harry. Resentment agaisn't the press, his role and the family but Kate and her family gave him stability, affection and support. People bitched about the Middletons/Carol beign too present in their life, but William would not be as stable today if he didn't have them.

Harry married someone who has as many family issues as him, of course it's a disaster.

I bet after six weeks in the L.A. echo chamber that she doesn't have the stones to go to Sandringham for Christmas.

R259 Wills had his life path set out for him at birth and everything he does in his daily life is to that end. Harry has no path, no structure, no sense of self and his ne'er do well, sounded like a good idea at the time behaviour/lifestyle reflects his rudderlessness.

Kate and her family provided what was needed for Kate to achieve her goal; snagging the heir to the British throne. Her and their behaviour subsequently are an acknowledgement and celebration of their achievement of their goal and their triumph.

Megs provided what was needed to sucker her mark to achieve what sounded like a good idea at the time; unlimited wealth and total and complete adulation. Except for Megs, that was never a goal in and of itself, but simply a way station along her endless path to something bigger/better that she believes she deserves. Her behaviour acknowledges and reinforces her realization that being a member of the BRF is not at all what she wanted. And she will continue wreaking havoc until she is offered or finds a suitable exit.

R261 If Harry needed stability he should have stayed in the Army.

Meghan would have stayed if the public loved her and the newspapers showed adulation.

Also, R261, I believe that Kate's close family, still obvious today, played a significant part in William's comfort in reinforcing his choice of Catherine Middleton as his wife.

Having grown up in such a chaotic family unit together with the sure oddness of the Royal Family, William's introduction to Kate's family and their affection and closeness with each other would, in my opinion, been a revelation of what family life could be like.

I was struck by the recent stories which surfaced when Kate's brother James' engagement was announced, in which James spoke of his visits to therapists and how his big sister Kate came with him. That is real family stuff.

Not some phony calligraphy laden letter which surfaces first in a People magazine story.

Also, I found it interesting that while William and Kate were on the Pakistan trip, it was the Middletons who were the ones taking care of George, Charlotte and Louis.

The Cambs trust the Middleton more when it comes to the kids.

Moreover, it's not like Chuck and Cam have the time to look after 3 young kids and offer them proper care.

[quote]Meghan would have stayed if the public loved her and the newspapers showed adulation.

Megs is not a team player. It has to be all about her, first and foremost. She would always be a second stringer, behind more senior royals and, with time, increasingly irrelevant. She only understood that around the time of her marriage, but figured her tried and true tantrum-throwing would work in her favour. It not only hasn't, she's succeeded in alienating the public, the media and the BRF. And will continue to do so until she's handed an out.

[quote]I doubt the Queen cares one way or an other at the point, but the Men in Grey have enough and make it known.

It's unlikely in the extreme that the picture would have been removed without The Queen's approval. No courtier would dare to take such an initiative only from his own volition. It's not quite to the extent of the removal of Diana's HRH status, but it's on that continuum.

[quote]In my wildest assessments of how cynically Markle worked all this, and those assessments were operating from the moment her threats to the British press emerged in fall 2016, I honestly couldn't have made up the speed of this level of crash and burn.

It's for sure another example of the volatile zeitgeist. Then again, Diana worked on that book with Andrew Morton; and did the astonishing 'Panorama' interview. ('Well, there were three of us in this marriage, so it was a bit crowded.') After which Charles's then friend Nicholas Soames called her 'paranoid' on TV.

True though that Meghan has nothing remotely close to the passionate following Diana had, and is in a much more precarious situation. Good luck to The Firm in handling this drama! Harry won't go quietly, and it can't end well. The Queen's Christmas message this year will be interesting.

We'll always have Paris. ;)

I don’t believe William is mean, cold and ruthless r245. Someone with those characteristics would not have chosen air ambulance work, something William enjoyed more than royal duties. His public interactions with his children belie coldness.

I don’t think it’s ruthless to cut people who betray you out of your life. My husband, who is far from ruthless, did the same to betrayers when he was younger and living in a totalitarian state.

R269 It has been reported that William doesn't suffer fools easily.

I think he can be ruthless if you did him wrong or did his wife and kids wrong. And I easily believe Meghan gets on his nerves and if she indeed made postpartum Kate cries....

Otherwise, he seems to be ok. Some people say he has a dickish sense of humor but he makes me laugh.

“The palace” is really trolling Harry, using words like “fragile” and “paranoia.” These psychological terms must be a sore point for him, just look at his incensed reaction.

The Palace deals with Harry's mental state since decades, they must recognize the signs.

I actually agree with r245 re William and his ruthlessness. He can be a warm and protective father and cold in his professional life, which is what the BRF is. He would want to protect the legacy that will eventually go to his eldest son, one that his wayward kid brother is currently trying to undermine. Ruthlessness should be the go-to attitude in dealing with H&M.

It's yards better than the hapless doddering of the current Queen, who by all account has simply put her head in the sand when it came to any of her children's problems over the years. And Charles hasn't been much of an improvement, he's somewhat to blame for Harry's current state imo (spoiling him during upbringing, not confronting problems head on). Good on William for tacking a different tack. I bet you won't see any of this kind of dissension among the Cambridge kids as adults, not in public anyway.

tacking = taking in r273

I think this would make a fun sitcom.

Two neighbors living side by side. The family on the left is picture perfect. The husband is the head of his firm. The wife does charity work and tends to perfect children.

The family on the right is lower middle class. You always hear them fighting. The wife is a real shrew, the husband is meek, but sexy.

Hijinks ensue.

The queen for the most part has tried to stay away from telling her adult children what to do with their marriages because she has had no other choice: in the twentieth century, she simply has no control over them other than in terms of giving them her money, and were she seen to be restricting the amount of money they received just because of spite she'd be hugely castigated in the press. (There was absolutely no telling Anne what to do anyway.) The only time the queen ever did intervene with her children's marriages was with Charles and Diana in 1992, when they embarrassed the monarchy so deeply by publishing books attacking the other one, and then with Diana going on TV to complain loudly about how Charles and Camilla were behaving. That was IT for the queen, and so she took the rare step of telling them then they had better divorce, which was actually what they wanted to do by that point anyway (and were staying away from doing it mostly because they did not think she would support such a move).

I don't think the queen or Charles can do much about Harry and Meghan's marriage, but what they can do (and what they should do) is tell Harry they will no longer fund monster trips like the one he just took to South Africa if he and Meghan are going to pull the kind of stunts they pulled (shipping over the fleet of Range Rovers, which made them seem like climate change hypocrites, and doing these personal interviews with the documentary filmmakers). All this trip did was pull attention away from William and Catherine's tour to South Asia which was much more important anyway, since William is the actual heir to the throne. What the queen and Charles should do is say to Harry and Meghan: we cannot control what you say to the press at your age, but you are no longer being helpful to the royal family with these state tours, so these large ones are over if you cannot behave better. If you want to visit Elton John's yacht for a week's cruise or fly to Sicily for a climate change conference, that's your business since other people are funding it; but you have to realize you look hypocritical if you do this and also then lecture people on climate change.

That's not really true r276, about simply limiting their larger trips. She can take away patronages, she can limit funds or even eliminate them entirely, as can Charles who is actually the one funding the Sussex spectacle. Without funding or facing serious restrictions on it, they are at their mercy. The only option would be for them to "bow out" on their own and go private. They can go about their private business like the Phillips children do, and the York girls.

TQ and the courtiers could restrict them from public appearances entirely - this would be accomplished by a simple announcement re the "re-organization" of the BRF, which wouldn't have to mention any names at all, much like the Swedish King just did weeks ago. They could announce they're limiting the actual working BRF to TQ/Philip, Charles and Camilla, and the Cambridges as direct heirs. Everyone else is still royal and titled, and can be 'pulled in' to complete royal duties as chosen and needed (Sophie, Edward, Anne etc). The Sussexes would simply not be on that chosen list anymore, case solved.

At the extreme end, TQ can issue Letters Patent changing entire titles and ranks, all at her whim. This is the last ditch, nuclear option. This was used on the Duke and Duchess of Windsor to good effect, they stripped her of her HRH and any attendant courtesies.

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Every big interview by the BRF members are planned. I don't see why anyone would be surprized.

Prince Phillip was always the family enforcer, but he's past that now. Thank God William seems to be stepping into the role: He seems to get his 'not suffering fools' temperament from his grandfather.

It is said that this doc was planned in timing and content and will tie in with the project he is doing with Oprah. Time will tell.

Someone from the rags confirming Meghan is the one leaking to the press like an old incontinent alzheimer patient.

The documentary aired on CBS yesterday.

Anyone watch it?

r283

I wonder how many watched it in the US, the number will be interesting to know if Meghan can have a career in the US.

That video is really cringy. Makes me embarrassed to be associated with this

R286 Yeah, so cringe.... What do you think people writting about celebs in rags look like? Litterature Nobel prize?

Anyway, Princess "I'm so harrassed by the press" Markle is an hypocrite and it's all that matters at this point.

ABC actually. It is up on ABC.com

It's on Youtube.

R276 - The problem with your ideas, although I support their basic thrust (Meghan and Harry need to be stopped, not indulged), is that the Queen and the BRF do not control these large tours, the British government does. The family is in fact forbidden to undertake anything of the kind except at the specific "request" of the Foreign Office. These are politically and economically motivated trips meant to secure plans for economic ties and political support. No one wants pap shots of CEOs and government officials. The FO contacts the Queen's Private Secretary and the BRF says, "We think this is perfect for the Sussexes" and the planning begins.

It is in fact the British taxpayer who is funding these trips, not the British Royal Family.

So the Sussexes stuck two fingers up first, to the British government on whose business they were about, the monarchy, whom they always represent when out on any official business, and the British taxpayers, whose payments fund the government's ability to undertake these missions on behalf of the national interest. On these trips, the BRF doesn't even pay for clothing, security, and ADCs.

The BRF could still take a hard line if it wishes, using financial and a few other lines of pressure, but those tours are not one of them. The Foreign Office, however, may feel differently and after seeing Harry and Meghan using the tour as a massive self-promotion exercise, and certainly can express its feelings to the Queen and "suggest" that from now on, the Sussexes are persona non grata on any such tour.

[quote]and certainly can express its feelings to the Queen and "suggest" that from now on, the Sussexes are persona non grata on any such tour.

Given that Ginger and Megs represent solely themselves, as illustrated during their SA debacle, I expect that the Commonwealth Trust presidency and vice-presidency passed to them by the Queen will be quietly passed to someone else.

r290 they undertake these trips at the request of the FO but with the Queen's tacit approval. If that approval goes away for whatever reason, no more foreign paid trips for H&M, or anyone else who doesn't square muster.

The FO isn't going to incur the displeasure of the Sovereign by extending invitations for major foreign excursions to family members she is on the outs with, or who have dicey issues that make them a heatscore for publicity. When was the last time Prince Andrew made a major trip at the request of the FO?

R292 - I don't know if the Foreign Office requested him personally but Andrew has recently traveled to China, Australia and the Middle East. The Pedo Prince sure gets around.

I don't think Andy depends on the Foreign Office. His "work" is about business, not diplomacy.

I’m not sure about that. People look at relentless self-promotion and see humanitarianism, look at the C-list actress in a third-rate show and see a Hollywood star, look at bad fashion choices and put them on “best dressed” lists, hear word salad and call it deep and meaningful. The time seems to be utterly out of joint, and I won’t be surprised if the SA tour is hailed as some great achievement, and the mocumentary gets some awards for raising awareness.

A little over 3 million peopke watched the Harkles Clown Show, a .05 share.

R292 - The Queen can suggest which royals take on such a duty, but believe it or not, it is the FO who has the last word. And most of the time, the Queen's suggestion is enough because she's extremely savvy about this after nearly 70 years at it. She and the FO are rarely on different pages, and that goes for Andrew, as well. I doubt the FO and the Queen would disagree that sending the Sussexes is risky because they cannot be trusted. So it's a moot point.

The problem the BRF has is the assignment of Harry and Meghan to the whole Commonwealth Youth sector. This naturally will entail being out of the UK a great deal, for obvious reasons. So even if the Queen and the FO are agreed that the Sussexes are loose cannons, how are the Sussexes to be stopped from fulfilling that duty short of booting them out of the family?

The BRF cannnot wake up and announce that HM is rescinding Harry's and Meghan's appointment as Commonwealty Youth Trust ambassadors. They may as well just announce Harry and Meghan are leaving and have done with it.

So far as I can tell, as long as the Sussexes have the Commonwealth gig, neither the Queen nor the FO can really do much do stop them representing Britain abroad.

In other words, the only way out for the BRF long-term, is out with the Sussexes.

[quote]So far as I can tell, as long as the Sussexes have the Commonwealth gig, neither the Queen nor the FO can really do much do stop them representing Britain abroad.

I don't think the Queen or the FO have much to worry about. Meghan is headed back to LA permanently. She's not interested in representing Britain anywhere. By this time next year, she'll be out of the BRF.

[quote]how are the Sussexes to be stopped from fulfilling that duty short of booting them out of the family?

True. But the phrasing of these options makes everything seem more dire than it needs to be. The Sussexes won't be "booted out of the family", for any reason (short of murdering William on live television). They'll be removed from 'royal duties' and public royal life as members of the main Royal House, meaning they won't undertake trips or patronages on behalf of the monarch or receive public purse funding. They will continue to be part of the BRF and part of Charles's immediate family either way. He may continue to fund them with his own private funds if he so chooses. They just won't undertake 'royal duties' as we know them to do now.

Anne's kids and the York girls are in this position and do just fine. They are part of the extended "BRF" (Bea and Eug are princesses of the blood and so are direct members, if junior ones). Peter and Zara make plenty of $ as private citizens and can pretty much live as they please, yet also spend plenty of time with their royal relatives, attend personal royal functions (weddings) and even some public ones: BP balcony at Trooping the Colour, Jubilees appearances etc. Same for the York girls, who sit closer to the main succession line and do more appearances with the royals, but still have free lives.

There's no reason H&M can't successfully do the same, should it come down to brass tacks and they have to leave "official royal" life. Now if stirring up trouble is their true agenda, the end results may not be so rosy. Time will tell eventually.

R299, That is absolutely true. and why I was pretty disgusted that H went "full time royal". it wasn't needed and just an extra drain on taxpayers. Then he brought in a wife as another allegedly working royal...too much. They are all filthy rich anyway but these extra royals need free housing and security? they should piss off into oblivion on their own money.

I think they were hoping that their "documentary" would bring about a pity party and the suggestion that they might move overseas permanently would incite a "please don't go" response from the British public. It really has had the opposite effect. The only way everyone can be happy now is if the Markles step down from being working royals and pay their own way overseas.

The York girls and the Phillips, Tindalls, Snowden kids, etc., haven't been a drain on the public payroll because they aren't working royals. They may make money in any way they choose. But Harry is the next King's son, and he has set himself up as a senior working royal with a "serious" job within that context, and brought his wife in on it. Meghan Markle isn't the type to fade into, you should pardon the pun, "relative" obscurity.

And without the glare of the spotlight, she and Harry wouldn't have been in a position to make money the way the Tindalls and Snowdens did. The York girls never worked at all, just lived off their trust funds and pretended to do so whilst they waited for Mr. Right, doing a bit of charity work here and there. As blood princesses, they didn't have to care about status.

But Meghan isn't a blood princess, she's an outsider with a dodgy past, and the only way she can be in a position to make money outside the BRF is to build her brand inside it, first.

So it's all moot. She's played Harry and the BRF like the master string player she is, and they will have to dance to her tune unless they man up and boot the two out.

FWIW, I don't think there is anything remotely coincidental about the photo of Harry and Meghan disappearing from the side table of family photos in the room in which the Queen gets photographed welcoming dignitaries and prize winners.

There isn't a shred of doubt left that as far as the BRF are concerned, Harry and Meghan have already left the family and will just milk their technical membership for all it's worth till it suits them to leave with their brand, their loot, her wardrobe, and their foundation.

It's a poor showing by the BRF.

In 20 years no one will remember all this drama.

In 20 years no one will remember all this drama.

Think of the fall out if they did try to boot them out, R302. Racist! Pregnant! New mom! Struggling Harry not supported! And all of the dirt that he unwisely has shared. They are in a no win position. They were not idiots, their faces at the wedding looked like they were attending an execution.

I do think that they did try to welcome her but with a narc, they are never going to react like a normal person.

Are you referring to this happy little snap, r305?

HM Queen Elizabeth bubbling with excitement....

The reaction to Markle is similar to that of Trump. Not in scale, of course, but in the stark split in reactions to her.

Yesterday on Ari Melber's MSNBC show it was "Fallback Friday" where Ari's guests opine about what current event or person should fall back from notice or trying to be noticed. His male guest immediately talked about watching the ITV doc and expressed sympathy for Markle, her difficulty in adjusting to the BRF, and how those who criticize her should fall back.

I'll state the obvious in how it never fails to be interesting in how human beings can see the same thing and come to completely different takes on it.

With narcs, really think before blaming the victims. Dude you are talking aout, R308 likely is affiliated with SS or had a narc mother.

Harry was warned, they tried to slow it down, rein her in a bit re: treatment of staff, the tiara, etc. but short of the disaster that forbidding it would have been, here we are.

Lawsuit is going to get messy. Stock up on popcorn.

I'm not surprised, the reaction to Meghan is political and MSNBC is left wing.

If you're a leftist, chances are you're going to like her because she's this poor feminist Afro-American Princess victim of the establishment.

If you're right wing, chances are you're going to dislike her because she shows no respect to the Monarchy, the Queen and UK as a Country.

I'm left wing and I can't stand her fake ass but I'm no fan of the Monarchy either.

R309 That's why this trial is such a bad idea, now you know why the BRF was against it.

Of course Sugars will argue she has nothing to hide but I'm not so sure.

[quote]If you're right wing, chances are you're going to dislike her because she shows no respect to the Monarchy, the Queen and UK as a Country.

That's not quite fair. She shows no respect for anybody. She is a self-centered narcissist. It just happens that at the moment the Royal Family has to deal with her. We dislike her because all her concern for charity is only so she can be in the spotlight, not because she wants the world to be a better place.

Swipe for the life of King George VI.

The tiaras worn by the late Queen Mother.

"If you're right wing, chances are you're going to dislike her because she shows no respect to the Monarchy, the Queen and UK as a Country."

Probably the most patriotic group in this country are Labour supporters. That's one of Labour's problems these day.

The truth is, if you have the remotest understanding of human interaction, you'll probably dislike Meghan Markle because she wanted what Queen and Country could give her, but didn't think she owed them any respect or gratitude for giving her what she'd been unable to get on her own merits.

You wanna dance, you gotta pay the band.

Meghan wants to dance and then stiff the band on her way out.

She DOES, indeed, owe respect to the Sovereign of the country in which she is seeking citizenship, and who granted Harry permission to marry Meghan when she could have withheld it, and whose anthem is sung at most important official events.

Meghan doesn't get to choose to be called HRH but disdian respect for the next level up. You're either in or out of the game.

That's not rightwing or leftwing: that's common decency.

It's also common sense.

Funnily enough the one thing I don't get from her is a sense the HRH is important to her.... she flits in and out of her events more like a celebrity than royalty. I'm sure even with her modest acting talents she could affect regal, but she seems all about the hugs and waves - she never left her original element. I'd bet money she had virtually no knowledge of monarchy beyond People.

She puts it all over her prized Insta, R315, whilst omitting titles when referring to family members.

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Wow... I wonder how many journalists have similar stories. They've probably kept quiet in hopes that she'd come back around and give them a lead on a story.

Harry must be thrilled that he won out over Ashley Cole.

Most delicious shade ever - photos of MM and Queen Letizia wearing the same leather skirt!

Indeed, r320. Harry won the WAG-wannabe! Take THAT, Ashley!

So much gossip, what a great week. As announced last year by Lord Geidt, the twosome will be spending six months or more "abroad." I guess the long planned SA trip was their last chance to show their mettle.. whoopsie on that with the quivering lips and ghostiing of Chaz and TQ. You could not have mapped out a more Effed Up plan if you tried.

Their behavior was very goal oriented, R323. They are the anti Royals and bullied victims when it suits. They may still bring down the monarchy yet...

The monarchy has survived far more serious matters than a Cheap Actress grifter.

For a short while I wondered if they made The Yorks seem better, but no. Not even close yet.

Interesting list of qualities of Cluster B personality women...

... The Professional Victim

... She's rude to the other people

... She reacts badly to 'no'

and others...

Some of the descriptions listed at the article below sound very familiar.

It looks like the Sunshine Sachs stans shut down yet another thread. Sigh.

Which one?

r329 The Sussex, Windsor Cambridge Show Part 2

The Thomas Markle debacle before the wedding was the first sign showing the relationship between the Sussex and the BRF would go downhill.

If you think about it, this story was fucking crazy and everybody wondered what the fuck was going on with her father.

It was just showing the reality, the Sussex were already isolated in the family and top senior Courtiers wanted nothing to do with them. You could also say the Sussex wanted nothing to do with the Top Senior Courtiers. Anyway, they were isolated.

This reality didn't change since, certainly due to the Sussex attitude. If the BRF can still defend Pedo Andy, they should be able to manage the Sussex unless they don't want to be managed.

The signs that the marriage was going to be a train wreck started at the CNN engagement interview, with Megs dominating and directing both Ginger and the interviewer. And it's definitely gone from train wreck to explosion.

Harry is a major sub, he needs to be dominated.

That's why he was so happy in the army, the army told him when to wake up, how to dress, what to eat, etc.

Then it was the Senior Courtiers who told him what to do with Sentebale and Invictus, but those Courtiers retired and there was no one to replace them.

Today, it's Meghan job to tell him how to dress, what to say, who to shake hand with, etc. There's nothing surprising here.

Whatever is going on with Harry, it is amazing that in such a short span of time, he has managed to morph from happy-go-lucky, bon vivant, pals with Wills and best mates with Kate to this perpetually hard done by character who scowls, attacks, threatens, self-pities and now wants to leave his home country and family. Gee....I wonder what/who could possibly have influenced Harry? What is ME! going to personally leverage once she gets to L.A. to keep that royal "aura" flickering? What is Harry going to "leverage' separate and apart from his now unplanned and all engulfing "dysfunctional" persona he is seems addicted to projecting?

The most recent stories of James Middleton's battle with depression and his mentioning that his sister Catherine accompanied him to some of his visits to therapists lead me to think that whatever problems Harry had in the past, Catherine would have been sympathetic and would have tried to help him.

Sparkle's strong feelings against Kate, manifest among other things, with the ferocious attacks on Kate by the pro-Sparkle online presence, makes me wonder what exactly Sparkle is telling him about his relatives.

But, then, isolating a partner from family and friends is a classic move of abusive spouses.

Hardly surprising this might be so in this case since Sparkle doesn't seem to value her own family. Even less would she value Harry's.

Any extended stay in L.A. will be very hard on that marriage. He won't know what to do with himself out of his world.

Don't worry R33, Meghan will tell him what to do. That pea brained prince is trapped.

[quote]Don't worry [R33], Meghan will tell him what to do. That pea brained prince is trapped.

How is Harry going to live without all his servants?

Harry might be a shiny object for a short time in LA, but it won't last. There is not one intriguing or interesting thing about him other than being a member of the royal family. In a town full of dazzling objects, being shiny isn't enough.

He's about to get Duke of Windsored. It doesn't end well.

It comes right before being Markled, R340.

God help that poor baby.

[quote]There is not one intriguing or interesting thing about him other than being a member of the royal family.

That's the problem... it's bred in to intrigue him and him alone. He won't be able to cope with being usual.

He thought marrying an actress to squirt-out crotchfruit would get him worldwide praise.

No wonder he likes Trump.