Where Are Gay Millennials Moving?

Columbus, Ohio! I just moved here and I love it. It is incredibly affordable and there are many options for jobs in many industries. I have yet to partake, but it had a gayborhood and is very friendly!

R1: thanks for the tip. "Had" a gayborhood or still does?

**HAS. My bad!

Columbus actually has one of the biggest pride celebrations in the country. 4th if I remember correctly after SF, NY, and another one. I live in Cleveland and a lot of people go to Columbus that weekend.

Don't move to Denver, it is terrible.

I mean it's tempting to try and turn Ohio blue but it's FULL OF GUN LOVERS so that's a major turnoff and unlike Florida it doesn't have nice beaches or lots of sexy people to make up for the deplorables

I hear a lot about Nashville, OP, but I'm guessing you already knew that.

And while I don't personally know anyone who had moved to Albuquerque, I do hear people talk about it a lot as a good place to live that's not ridiculously expensive.

R6, the bigger cities in Ohio are generally blue, so you don't have to make up for much. Although more amenities and hot guys would always be welcome :) The rural areas are what gives Ohio its reputation.

Fort Lauderdale is great! Plenty of hot men and clubs, plus year round sunshine and beaches.

I also live in Cleveland. It is very livable and if you love the outdoors, we have terrific parks and neighborhoods for meeting new people.

For the west coast, cities like LA, SF, Seattle, and Portland have reached peak saturation point and overpriced-ness. I would not be surprised to see oddball, far-off places like Bend, Or., Cayucos, CA. or Eureka, CA get an influx of people moving there. Maybe Olympia and Tacoma.

I moved to Albuquerque from Brooklyn 5 years ago and love it. It's a blue city in a blue state, very affordable, it has great weather, delicious food, amazing cultural and outdoors activities, manageable traffic, cool unpretentious people and the most amazing sunsets I've ever seen.

It's the Southwest's best kept secret and I hope it never gets "discovered" and thus ruined.

I thought that crime was pretty high in Albuquerque.

Don't move to Atlanta. A LOT of people moving up from Florida, which says it all right there.

how about San Antonio?

[QUOTE]I thought that crime was pretty high in Albuquerque

Car theft is the main concern but I live in Downtown, park my car in the street and haven't had a problem so far (knock on wood).

Perhaps not surprising with Bay Area housing costs but lots of gay millennials are moving to Sacramento.

R11, I can't imagine Bend or Eureka ever becoming actual cities. They both have a population below 100K. And they are both far from an actual city.

I have a good friend who just moved to Phoenix and loves it. Says that outside of the hot temperatures, it's got a lot of great new restaurants and a surprisingly vibrant downtown. He says the weirdest part of it though is that the city is all old people and young people -- it's like there's no one between the ages of 40 and 60.

R9 [quote] Fort Lauderdale is great! Plenty of hot men and clubs, plus year round sunshine and beaches.

I actually lived in South Florida during grad school. I liked Miami (not as gay as I would like), but Fort Lauderdale/Miami always was just what you said -- hot men and clubs. There didn't seem to be a tight-knit, young LGBTQ community in FLL, it felt very superficial and focused on muscle-types and party lifestyles, and felt a lot like Palm Springs.

[quote] Fort Lauderdale is great! Plenty of hot men and clubs, plus year round sunshine and beaches.

I actually lived in South Florida during grad school. I liked Miami (not as gay as I would like), but Fort Lauderdale/Miami always was just what you said -- hot men and clubs. There didn't seem to be a tight-knit, young LGBTQ community in FLL, it felt very superficial and focused on muscle-types and party lifestyles, and felt a lot like Palm Springs.

[quote] Fort Lauderdale is great! Plenty of hot men and clubs, plus year round sunshine and beaches.

I actually lived in South Florida during grad school. I liked Miami (not as gay as I would like), but Fort Lauderdale/Miami always was just what you said -- hot men and clubs. There didn't seem to be a tight-knit, young LGBTQ community in FLL, it felt very superficial and focused on muscle-types and party lifestyles, and felt a lot like Palm Springs.

Come on over to South Bend! Let's gay it up!

R15: I have never been to San Antonio, and I don't know much about it. Do you recommend it? If so, why?

[QUOTE]I have a good friend who just moved to Phoenix and loves it

I tried Phoenix but couldn't stand the constant 115 degree heat. Every time I went outside it was like stepping in a wood fired oven.

Un-fucking-bearable.

Raleigh/Durham, Nashville, Richmond

Why did the hipster (millennial) burn his mouth on with the soup?

He ate it before it was cool.

Don’t try so hard to find uncharted territory. There’s a reason the other cities you’ve mentioned are popular.

Is no one moving to NYC anymore?

I grew up on Staten Island, and have heard anecdotally that a lot of young people are starting to move in from Brooklyn/Manhattan. Any truth to this?

San Antonio is the most boring top 10 population city in the U.S. In Texas, it plays fourth fiddle to Houston, Dallas and Austin.

Chapel Hill/Raleigh/Durham NC

Omaha, NE has a boring downtown, but some quirky neighborhoods, a great food scene, and affordable homes.

OP is asking about up and coming cities, not places that have already happened r28.

We are getting many new arrivals in Raleigh, Durham and Chapel Hill. Many are in Technology related fields

Birmingham - very cheap. Lots of artists and millennials moving in. Great restaurants. Bigger gay community than you might expect. Hip young new city administration. Unfortunately, it's in Alabama.

one really needs to throw Kansas City in the mix as it is quite cultured, very reasonable and great housing stock.

I'm not sure Staten Island will ever "happen," R29, though they've been trying for years.

But I meet a lot of younger people in the arts living in/moving to Queens, and across a number of neighborhoods there.

Memphis is affordable and has some neat things going for it. Great airport courtesy of FedEx — flights everywhere.

My partner and I moved from San Francisco to Madison, WI several years ago and totally love it. Great economy, active gay community, gorgeous location and very cultured and sophisticated, with many CA and NYC transplants, as well as the University.

Philly is a great, cheaper alternative to NY or DC and the millennial population is growing. Has everything you need in a city - but much cheaper. But the big job markets are NY and DC - so requires some mobility. If you’re in medicine or education, you’ll be fine. Some tech - Comcast and a bunch of smaller ones mainly in burbs - but not as big as DC/NY. There’s a reason the cheaper cities are cheaper - less high paying jobs.

What about San Diego, OP? It’s beautiful, great weather, great downtown, vibrant arts scene and vibrant gay scene. Lots of different neighborhoods to choose from.

I was hanging out with a friend last night having dinner and Queer Eye was on in the background. After dinner we moved to the couch and watched a few episodes while talking. It looked like it's set mostly in Kansas City and yes r36 it looks like a nice place to live.

I don't know if I could stand living outside one of the major cities, been in LA 30+ years, but KC looks like a really nice town.

How about Las Vegas? No one really gives a shit about gay people there. Tons of gays.

Lots of gay dancers in Vegas

Palm Springs is where it's at for the gay millennial in the know.

Living in Las Vegas would feel very strange and surreal, I think.

R45, Palm Springs? I love it but what jobs are out there for gays in their 20s, 30s?

Actually Vegas is a good mention. Lots of jobs and night life.

Zero culture though. And it is also hot as hell like Phoenix. Still all in all, a decent choice for anyone younger.

OP is listing these very tech hotspot, intellectual, hipster type cities. Las Vegas is not of that mold.

Vegas is better than paying 4k for a 500 sq ft apt in the overcrowded San Francisco Bay area.

I don't know why tech companies don't move to Vegas. So many other Californians have.

Not even a good apartment either. An apartment with popcorn ceilings!

Cayucos is tiny and couldn't handle an influx of people.

I lived in San Diego for 36 years. It's a great place with great weather. Unfortunately it has become a crowded, expensive big city. There is no place to park. Any house that would pass the "tasteful friends" on this site is over $1 million.

I travel to Las Vegas every couple of weeks for work. There is NOTHING to do in Las Vegas that doesn't require spending money. That's all Vegas is about. Spending money. It's very hot for half the year. Drivers are crazy and unpredictable. Service is good everywhere because it's a service economy. Every street in Las Vegas is always under construction. It's the city of a billion orange traffic cones.

R35 is right, Birmingham is the new hip mecca. Lots of gays moving there.

Heh, the Nytimes recently ran a piece about how Birmingham is falling behind while Nashville has become a rising city.

10 years ago Birmingham was an ultra racist shithole. Can't imagine it changing so drastically

Nashville is becoming expensive very fast. In many ways you’ve missed the boat if you’re not already there.

R36 Agree.

Kansas City has good restaurants, is very affordable, and has different neighborhoods with different vibes (Waldo, Hyde Park, Crossroads, Brookside, etc.). Four or five years ago it suddenly started making a lot of “top 10” lists to move to for 20-30s and “up and coming” although there was no rush of people to move there and is still a decently-kept secret.

I left years ago for sunny California but I miss it sometimes.

[quote] There didn't seem to be a tight-knit, young LGBTQ community in FLL,

There IS a tight-knit community in Miami and Fort Lauderdale, but it's very difficult to break into if you're not upper-middle class.

Detroit seems like a pretty cool town.

I’m from Ohio, but have lived in LA for 15 yrs. I’m considering moving back to the Cleveland area. I want a backyard. And a garden.

If you are in SF, I'd stick to the Pacific Northwest. Even Southern California will be culture shock to you.

People in the rest of the country are that much more materialistic and superficial, for the sake of appearances and to impress/be accepted/fit in.

I used to hate that about SF (having come of age in LA). Now I can't be bothered to care. Meanwhile my friends in LA and SD and colleagues in NYC and DC are so focused on keeping up with what everyone else is wearing/driving (and now that we are home buying age) moving into. You'll feel it too.

^^(used to hate how no one in SF gives in a fuck about what you wear or drive)

It's a shame the city is a shit hole.

DLers in other threads have very recently badmouthed Phoenix, Vegas and New Mexico.

They say Phoenix is a redneck, anti-gay town with no jobs.

They say Vegas has no gay scene and the culture and atmosphere is sleazy/tacky/ all tourists.

They say New Mexico’s businesses all close at 5 p.m. and there are hardly any whites and no good-looking men there.

This is just what I’ve read.

There are no gays moving to Birmingham. No sane gay wants to live in Alabama.

I've been to Birmingham, and it's kind of frightening.

Dear god, who wants to live in Nevada?

Large coastal cities are expensive--precisely because people want to live there.

My boss is from Birmingham. He’d rather die than go back there.

He also said New Mexico is awful if you are white. He got the sense people treated him and his wife like crap for it.

whites complaining about discrimination in New Mexico? lmao

I thought Santa Fe was full of white hipster/crunchy granola types and wealthy white retirees.

Somehow, I don't think of Miami and Fort Lauderdale as upper-middle-class havens?

My former neighbors have moved to Boise and convinced another friend to buy a house there.It seems they have new bars and restaurants there and the access to nature is pretty great. There are tech jobs there to some level.

Raleigh is too far gone as well.

Try Mayberry.

Kansas City is wonderful.

[quote]besides houseboy and masseuse, that is

Are you well-educated, OP? If so, why do you not know that a masseuse is only a woman? If it's a male, he's a masseur.

I could tell you but we hate millennials here and you should probably stay where you are.

Why don’t you ask yourmillennialenemy?

Millenials??? Oh, dear, OP.

Try this...

There is no such thing as 'gay community'. Just venues where queens congregate to indulge in hedonism. Wake up call!

Boise is too cold

[quote]Nashville is becoming expensive very fast. In many ways you’ve missed the boat if you’re not already there.

It's all relative, if you are leaving a place like SF, NY,DC, LA, then these b-list cities that locals consider are getting expensive are not expensive.

Vienna, Leipzig, Seville, Izmir, Beirut, Amman

That sort of thing happens in Hawaii too R68.

[quote]Where Are Gay Millennials Moving?

All over California

[quote]People in the rest of the country are that much more materialistic and superficial, for the sake of appearances and to impress/be accepted/fit in.

Which is why with the flood of flyovers moving into my small "East Hollywood" neighborhood, I've noticed a huge uptick in shitty attitudes and pretentiousness. LA was never an inviting place but the Silverlake/Los Feliz part of town used to be a really great neighborhoody place to live. Nice little community that no one really cared about, and the gay scene was a refreshing change of pace from boys town. Not anymore.

A lot to be said for the absence of materialism and pretension. LA is the most extreme in this attitude, followed by Dallas, San Diego, Miami, Atlanta, DC, NY. Midwestern cities do tend to be better in this regard. I’ve spent time in Cleveland and liked it for that reason - and some great housing stock for cheap.

I’m in nyc but my lease is up and I will prob move to The Bronx. Once I finish school I have no idea where I will move to

Good point R88. Everyone hates on how crazy expensive NYC is - but there are a lot of people paying less than $2,000 month to live in NYC - in the Bronx. And it’s a vibrant city neighborhood a subway ride away from the gay Mecca of Manhattan. With lots of hot men. And it’s relatively safe now. Safer than lots of Chicago. Maybe not “pretty” but if you want to live in NYC cheaply, you can.

Medellin, Colombia -- so far, I'm lovin' it!

Medellin, Colombia -- so far, I'm lovin' it!

Well, I'm I Phoenix right now for work and on my way back to the hotel the temp in my car read 119 degrees.

Who the fuck can live in such extreme heat?

Any Big 10 college town

Cleveland suburb here and if you do not like snow and freezing temps in the winter, do not move here. Also, there is constant construction on every highway from Cleveland to Cincinnati in the summer months due to the brutal winters taking their toll on the roadways. Nicer climates are more expensive for a reason.

what is there to do in Kansas City? I've been there twice and was bored as fuck. It seems all people do is eat and shop. There's like a restaurant on every fucking corner and they even had fast food chains I've never heard of back east.

The land is flat and most of the people are fat

R83, lol. Last I heard, millennial gays are currently enjoying skin diving off the coast near Antananarivo. ;)

R59. I'll say a bit more.

The thing about the Miami/Fort Lauderdale gay community--and by "community," I mean the little world that patronizes and attends the events of the LGBTQ non-profits--is that many of them are wealthy New Yorkers who have retired or who have a second (third, fourth) home here. There are some native Floridian wealthy gays, but for the most part it's a satellite of Manhattan.

Also, that is what I would call the community. There is an enormous number of gym bunnies who try to inhabit South Beach--but live in lower rent areas--who party a lot, but aren't really active in the community.

I would suggest blue cities in the midwest or south as being the most friendly. (A lot of my LA friends have been moving to Atlanta.)

R5, why? Denver seems cool.

Madagascar is out. Pirates!

why not try somewhere that's green?

I've been hearing good things about Darfur.

Is this a good time to get into Austin housing or even rental market before it really gets too unaffordable? Does Austin have rent control? SF is too insanely expensive for me and I make good salary. I wish student loan repayments are structured in a way that takes into account the area you’re living. I currently rent a 550 sq ft studio for $1800 in a rent controlled building in a safe neighborhood (lots of families and Asian residents). Though if I leave the owners would update the unit and probably charge around $2200 at least, they recently updated 1-BR units in our building and rented them out for $3300 and up.

$1800 for a large studio sounds incredibly cheap for SF. Lucky you. Now is not the time to get into Austin. We are in a bubble territory. Rent if you really want - then buy in 2-3 years. It will also make you appreciate all you have in SF - including decent weather that’s allows you to be outside in the summer.

Madison, WI. I'm serious.

[quote]r28 Is no one moving to NYC anymore?

If you weren't born there and have concrete in your veins, it's okay when you're in your 20s and 30s. But even though I had a $350 a month apartment on the Upper West Side, I had to eventually bail. Every time I'd go to a high school reunion, or home for the holidays, I'd be reminded there was an easier, softer way of life.

I went back to my pastoral home town and I love it so much. And friends from grade school and high school who went on to college and L.A. and NYC have come home, too, so it's like we all went off on worldy adventures, and can now cuddle up together.

It's sweet ... something you don't get in NY.

What is your hometown, R105?

Shville?

[quote] San Antonio is the most boring top 10 population city in the U.S.

R30, San Jose disagrees with you.

Yeah - non-Texan here but San Antonio is far from the most boring city. Unique and different than the sterile mid-size cities loved by millennials, I like it.

[quote] by "community," I mean the little world that patronizes and attends the events of the LGBTQ non-profits-

We call them "professional homosexuals" and often imagine they have business cards that say "Mortimer J. Shopbottom, Homosexual Extraordinaire!"

I suspect OP just meant "a place where I won't be the only out gay guy on Grindr"

I've met more than a few people who seem really into Bellingham, Washington recently.

I thought Salt Lake City was starting to become a thing. For as bad a rap as Utah has, I kind dug SLC.

I could see Portland, Maine becoming a thing.

I'm surprised Providence, RI never took off, given its location.

Tucson seems interesting. I'd look for a good university town (Eugene, Madison, Durham). I think Tucson is a little higher elevation than Phoenix, so while hot, it's high and dry desert heat.

How about we take over Detroit and make that the new gay Mecca? All those beautiful abandoned homes are cheap and great potential if they were restored.

San Francisco is over. It’s become a literal shit hole. It’s all about Texas now. If you’re more artistic and hippie-ish then move to Austin. If you’re more corporate and love a big, diverse city, then move to Houston. Avoid Dallas (full of nasty, bitchy, nelly queens) and San Antonio (full of Mexicans.)

R115 Count me out. Austin is expensive as hell and Texas is too fucking hot, as well as conservative anyway, regardless of how people try to spin the big cities there as being liberal.

R116, agreed. The tone of R115's endorsement doesn't help much. Hard pass.

Avoid Seattle.

Help turn Texas blue.

What do people living in Austin do when it's hot during the summer? You can't go outside as some of you have said so what do you guys do, go shopping or workout?

R119 Texas is a lost cause, hun.

To add on to R120 how much are your air conditioning bills???

[quote] Is no one moving to NYC anymore?

No, they’re not. And don’t come here. You can’t afford it.

Like it or not Texas is where’s its at. People can only love someplace if there are jobs - and Texas is creating them. A shame because it is one of the least pretty and least interesting naturally places in the country. But it’s cheap, growing and vibrant. We don’t get to choose everything. Just be grateful we are not like generations before who usually stayed put. Even in Texas there are very different options between the cities. Personally I like Houston - though I’m not dying to live there, it provides and escape from the insane expense of coastal cities while also providing diversity and lots of great food, bars and people. And great airports to make travel easy,

Plenty of people are still moving to NYC, they're just the worst entitled cunts you can imagine.

I love the idea of more liberals moving to Texas. If we can fucking flip that blue then we've got the election locked up

hopefully by 2024 though i'd love for 2020

For christ sake!!!! Austin fucking sucks! Enough of the ass kissing. The traffic sucks and the weather is horrible. Once u go south of Ben White its a big fucking ghetto. The so called cool Austin is a very small area . The rest of it is a big box suburbia. Jesus enough of this Austin shit. Im in Hyde Park.. cant wait to get out

Agree with R127. The city's slogan should be: "Austin...at least it's not San Antonio!"

Minneapolis is full of milennials.

R124, Houston's food scene was very impressive. I liked the vibe of the city.

Houston is very diverse and hence a lot of HOT men but the weather really fucks things up

It can be deathly humid during summer and you know that makes food smell and taste like shit

Plus being on the Gulf Coast makes it a target for awful storms like what we saw in the last year there with the devastation

I like to visit but couldn't live there unfortunately

[quote]Houston is very diverse and hence a lot of HOT men

Are these “HOT” men that you speak of straight or gay? Because if they’re straight, that doesn’t do me much good.

R87, it might be prudent to distinguish between transplants to LA and LA natives. I am a fourth generation Angelino, my partner a third. We couldn't be less material obsessed. Nor or any other of my childhood friends.

[quote]And don’t come here. You can’t afford it.

Oh, honey. Yes we can.

Timely topic, just found out a good friend of mine who I didn't imagine would leave New York is moving to Denver.

I’ve know 2 long time NYers who moved to Denver. I don’t get it. I understand wanting to leave NY after 25 years, but Denver !? I find it a little too straight drop outs/white homeless kids, Western cowboy mentality/guns, and boring. I would choose Austin before Denver - though I agree with the above Houston is much better than Austin.

Denver - legal weed. Legal psilocybin.

I could see Denver being attractive to people who like outdoors sports, hiking, access to the Rocky mountains.

Austin is hardly cheap these days. Perhaps compared to San Francisco but compared to other places it is no deal.

Gee ya know I hear Anchorage is where it's at!

Interesting that not many are moving to the east coast (not NYC) places like Connecticut, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, etc... I got recruited for a position within a large, university-affiliated health system in Connecticut but I just don't imaging myself living there after being so used to SF even though it's getting worse now. I need to live in places with vibrant food culture scene plus the thought of shoveling snow during the winter doesn't appeal to me at all. I have a cousin who's a PhD neurobiologist who got suckered into leaving California for a position with one of the SUNYs, he lives in Queens and the way he tells me about cold snowy winters is enough to put me off.

First off, Houston is not really a coastal city. To get to an awful TX beach, you have to drive for an hour through the stench of the petrochemical plants. The weather is hot and humid and if there’s more than an inch of rain in one spot, it floods.

Next, Houston is late to zoning, so most inner neighborhoods are a hodgepodge of housing (single and muti family next door to each other) with a convenience store thrown in to balance things out. If you go to the outer ring exurbs, you’re a long drive to any good clubs and restaurants. Not to mention the traffic.

Having said all of that, housing is still affordable, but property taxes and insurance will make up for any savings.

[Quote]Interesting that not many are moving to the east coast (not NYC) places like Connecticut, Massachusetts, New Hampshire,

Well no one is going to bring up Boston in a thread about up and coming cities.

I mean the east coast is old. Places like Boston NY, Philly are already very established.

[quote]Gee ya know I hear Anchorage is where it's at!

I just might end up there if we keep having hot and disgusting summers like this one. I HATE hot weather!

We've had a poster here who is settled in Toledo, Ohio.

I've checked MLS and such and it doesn't look half bad.

Thoughts?

You couldn't pay me to live in Texas.

[quote]Places like Boston NY, Philly are already very established.

But parts of each are being revitalized/gentrified. Philly is becoming quite the "foodie" town. Lots of history, arts and culture. Some Philly neighborhoods are on fire right now. It's common to see run down two story row homes torn down and replaced with three story town houses with roof top decks---all the rage with millennials. Taxes are still quite low too.

Everyone I know who moved to Texas did so because they couldn't hack it in California. Enjoy the inherent desperation for validation that permeates the transplants there and the inherent South that the natives represent.

I have only lived on the east and west coasts. I'd move to Canada before I moved to the south.

I’ve been a Texan all my life. In the summer we have pool parties, go to the lake, get cruised at Barton Springs pool, get your dick sucked at Hippie Hollow (look it up), or ride inner tubes down the river in San Marcos/New Braunfels and drool over the frat boys in swim trunks drinking Lone Star Beer. At the end of the day when they are sunburnt and buzzed, they get very horny and flirtatious with anyone. That’s when it’s my opportunity to strike!

Not a Texan, but I can tell you no one stews in misery missing CA. Unlike AZ, NM or NV, Texas is vibrant - and different - enough to be self-absorbed. It’s also not Southern like GA or TN.

JFK was shot in Texas.

Pass.

[quote]You couldn't pay me to live in Texas.

That makes two of us! A little too backwards for me!

Surely the real party people are in Boise and Billings?

Anybody spent time in Tucson?

Yes to Tucson but the place has very few good jobs.

Boise, actually, is not a bad choice - it's becoming more and more popular as an alternative to Seattle/Portland and the food/bar scene is supposed to be especially good (although I haven't been there myself lately). And as somebody said, there are tech jobs there.

Plus, if you're one of those people who wants to turn red states blue, Idaho is a good place to start. I'm sure Boise is trending blue.

Are there jobs in Phoenix?

I’m looking to relocate and can’t find a good place. I’m in Vegas now. People here are cold and unfriendly or else they’re con artists. The only decent people I’ve met here without major drug abuse, gambling addictions or mental problems, or that aren’t religious nuts, are Californians and a few New Yorkers. I’m not sure if it’s worth staying until they fill up the state. I want someplace I can retire, but need to work now.

Phoenix is a great choice if you want to help turn the state of Arizona blue. We have a senate election next year and i would love to see it go to a Democrat. All you Californians just keep on coming.

Charleston

I’ve had to visit Texas extensively, including the so- called “liberal” strongholds like Austin. It’s awful. Categorically so. Undeniably so. Inescapably so. It’s the worst that America has to offer. And that’s the nice parts. I stopped accepting work there, even though a lot was on offer. And Houston is literally a hellhole. 100 degrees with 100 percent humidity in late October. It’s a desolate miserable swamp. I feel bad for any gays that live there. You should move.

I’m not even going to get into the guns, the giant trucks everywhere, and the fat slovenly people constantly chowing down in their awful strip malls, unless you’re a Dallas striver or some such with pretentions toward being society. Then you’re just borderline chunky trying to stuff yourself into off the rack Neiman’s.

It’s sad and desperate. Avoid.

r161 I could've written your post. That was exactly my impression, as well. And I only saw the "nice" areas. I never went out into the rural parts. Total hellhole.

Hellhole is an overstatement. It’s one of the few places where a middle class family can afford to live AND where there are jobs. Given the option of Ohio, West Virginia, Alabama - I can see why Texas is attractive for the average American. Not particularly a gay destination but if you want to just get by and own a home and be able to get a job, Texas is where it’s at. Remember 90% of the people in the country can’t afford to live in the West or Northeast.

What about upstate NY? What kinds of people live there? I have a career that allows me to pretty much choose where to move/ live because it's in demand. So far thinking of Austin which is cheap because I live in SF.

The problem is people in Texas don't come there to live---they end up wanting to live BIG and live LOUD.

Despite it's trash and redneck origins (of all races - white trash, Latino trash, Black trash, and don't forget tons of Asians and Indians with tech backgrounds) all come there to own a McMansion, drive a Range Rover or Escalde or Hummer, bling out in expensive clothes, and dine out at pretentious "faux-hipster" or "faux-upscale" nouveau-riche establishments.

The problem is deep down inside they are trash mentality (religion, lack of education, lack of culture).

Moreso because they insist on shoving their lives on you.

I have two friends in Houston and they are stuck there (too established in their lives) and escape every second they can.

My colleague in the office next door is a 20-something from Houston who couldn't wait to leave. Sure she has to walk around the homeless and druggies on her commute to work from the Civic Center station here in SF, but people are just not so insufferable.

No self-respecting gay man would willingly choose to live in that hellhole.

R165, that sounds like Atlanta.

Wow! I can’t believe all the Texas hate here. I’m a 49 year old gay man and I absolutely LOVE it here (live in Houston part-time and Austin the rest.) I make just under 6 figures and have two nice vehicles, a house, vacation every 2 months, and have no state tax. I travel frequently to both coasts and enjoy it, but am so very happy to get home to inexpensive gasoline, food, and living expenses. I wouldn’t move to California OR NYC even if I won the powerball lottery.

I'd go to Texas if they ever built that Disney's America park there like the rumors said.

Good point R167. Life is life wherever you are. At least in Texas it’s cheap. With all the bitching about SF on here, doesn’t sound like a paradise either.

R167 That's what I want, to be able to have money left over for vacations, and it seems like I can be in your current situation if I move to Austin. I'm in SF and also make close to $200k but here I'm barely getting by, I'm serious, you're middle class who can't buy a house if you make close to $200k. I'm lucky to travel once a year but it's more like once every 2 years for a big trip abroad.

[quote] What about upstate NY? What kinds of people live there?

Joyce Carol Oates.

I would move to the Berkshire’s before I would move to upstate NY. Prettier, less Deplorables. Loved it up there. But it does get very quiet and kinda boring.

OP try Chicago. The winters aren't that bad, and unless your homeless or work an outside job, you won't be in the elements for very long. Wear a jacket and keep it moving. The city has an endless supply of young people moving to the other "big city". North of the Loop is very safe. Chicago is a tale of two cities, with crime constricted to specific areas ,while many other parts of the city are as safe as a normal suburb.

It's also affordable, with a real Urban feel (depending on the area) and a vibrant LGBTQ community and neighborhood (Boystown). Chicago still has distinctive neighborhoods, that may now be more ethnically mixed, but show their immigrant roots. People don't realize how long Chicago is, so you have so many lifestyle options depending on your proximity to downtown. In the summer, the beaches are packed, especially the gay area, with all types of men.

It has some of the best public transportation in the country. You won't need a car, but the city can easily accommodate people with a cars. It's much much cleaner that NYC or San Fran, The architecture, the lake, and the rivers really set it apart from most of America's major metropolitan cities.

Lots of people are ignoring the under the radar and up and coming cities part of OPs question. He was asking what city might grow into the next Austin or Denver.

Some of these responses get at that, but many do not.

[quote]What about upstate NY?

Check out Hudson, NY. A lot of gays have been moving there over the past 10 years or so. It's about 2hrs from NYC via Amtrak.

R173 As someone who lives in Illinois and desperately wants out, I would definitely NOT suggest Chicago. It’s crime ridden, the people are rude as hell, and the state is always broke. Don’t forget the outrageously high taxes.

Duluth. Love it or loathe it, you can never leave or lose it.

Skip Vermont. Too expensive.

R165 here. R170 sounds like you have some budgeting issues. $200k is a decent salary for SF.

True, you will be unable to buy any property in the City or inner Bay without some helpful from stocks (or family as is the case for many homebuyers here) but you may find a decent condo.

From anecdotal evidence alone, once you hit $125,000 you should be able to live a decent life - and that includes several annual trips. We've taken 5 this year (3 international) and our combined income between my partner and I is $180,000. We share a condo (bought in 2012), both make payments on cars (his German, mine Japanese), both have several gym and fitness class memberships, and we're not starving or denying ourselves (we do stay in more often than not as we are coupled and in our 40s).

If I were to guess, your tastes are probably expensive and you act on them frequently. No judgment, that's just what most millennials here do. Eating out, latest gadgets, frequent Uber rides for convenience's sake, UberEats/Door Dash, Whole Foods, etc. It's what my 20-something colleague from Houston does. Every day is something new from the Westfield/Union Square which is on her walk home from the office. I lived the same life when I was in my 20s and "living in the Big City" too.

Now that you're in your 30s you may be realizing some of it was fun, but unnecessary to live a happy life.

Consider whether you'll have that same $200,000 salary in Texas. Consider whether the people you will be surrounding yourself with in that cheaper housing will be accepting/tolerant of your lifestyle or lifeviews. Consider whether you are willing to drive minimum 30 minutes anywhere, in a "big" car that is acceptable for Texas standards. Consider whether you want to be around a place where instant money was made by sheer luck of local resources (oil) versus intellectual curiosity. Consider whether you want to be in a place where religion is the norm and not individual. I'm not even going to comment on the weather, but I am partial to hot weather (one minus of SF for me).

Besides, the problem is the people - and not the location.

R179 again - I will also add that my work takes me all over the Western US.

Even 100 miles in from the coast, it's almost foreign. Worse even, as some big cities in other countries rival (if not top) those of our own.

People's mindsets are different. Very little intellect and deeper thinking (people take everything at face value that's told to them, they staunchly hold protectionist/isolationist positions, and they don't educate themselves or investigate issues in any probative sense). There are exceptions, but many people just do what family/friends tell them to and life revolves around keeping up that provincialism.

Although the folks pointing out Boise may be on to something. Even Salt Lake City is booming. I've considered buying a rental property there. One work associate mentioned home prices in his neighborhood doubled from $100,000 to $200,000 thanks to all the Californians moving there. It's stil Utah though, unfortunately.

Seattle was over 15 years ago, Portland was over 10 years, Denver was over 5 years ago. Boise and Missoula and Salt Lake City it is in the West. Skip the Southwest, that's basically an extension of the South these days.

R166 which is one reason we stopped going to Miami Beach.

Too many people from Atlanta and Houston with their flashy, boogie attitudes and pretentions. New Yorkers were a delight as at least they kept to themselves.

$117,00 annual income is official poverty level in SF

For a family of four r182. If you aren't supporting three other people the cut off looks very different.

^^^ typical lack of deep/critical thinking for many in the US ^^^

No wonder Trump was elected.

There is an entire thread on the joys of Hudson, NY, which nicely summarizes the pitfalls of the mid-Hudson Valley.

I can't believe someone is having problems living in San Francisco on 200K a year. You have to be joking. My salary is about a third of yours and I am living well.

Lifestyle creep is very real. The more money you make, the more you become accustomed to spending, and it still won't seem like you have enough. Your expectations of life change so much without you even being aware of it happening.

R187 Very insightful.

My student loan payment per month is about $1700 so that takes a big chunk out of my budget. So that combined with rent/ utilities is about $4200 out the door. I'm also taxed to the hilt being single (my BF and I have discussed marriage for this reason) both federal and state. Also setting aside money for my 403/ 457 retirement plan. So it's not that I'm spending a lot, though I do eat out and buy unnecessary things (not too expensive and not all the time), my 2010 Volvo is long paid off thank god. So while close to $200k looks like a lot on paper, it's not in reality. When I looked at Austin the salary for positions comparable there would be around $160k annual give or take a few thousands. But there's no state tax so that's a big plus. I agree that it'd be culture shock going from SF to Austin. Not decided yet but it's starting to look enticing.

R170 - you will LOVE Austin. Been there since 1994. Nobody shits on the sidewalks and it’s a liberal hotbed of the state. Don’t go to Dallas or San Antonio and try to hold hands with your partner. Houston however is very open and accepting to gays.

I'm an old Millennial in my late 30s so unlike young Millennials I'm trying to set aside money for retirement. I want to continue doing that while having money to travel.

R190 What's the summer electric bill in Austin like? My BF is there already but he's cheap so he only turns on the AC only when it becomes intolerable, the rest of the time when he's free he goes to the gym or places where's AC. So when he tells me just last month his bill came out to be I think just above $200 I think he's downplaying it a bit in order to get me to move there.

[quote] Next, Houston is late to zoning........ Having said all of that, housing is still affordable....

See the connection?

R170 - mine ranges from $125-$195 per month for 1600 square feet. I like it cool. I do have ceiling fans in most rooms.

$125-195 / month where? In Austin? That can’t be right. Electricity and AC for 1,200 square feet in San Antonio was close to $250-$350. Electricity is more expensive than in the Northeast. And you need to run it heavy and constantly for months.

I don’t get the Austin Boise or Seattle love.

I don't live in Columbus now, but I did in the late 80's and throughout the 90's. It has a large gay population and has since the early 80's. Gays are very involved in politics and are major business owners. Columbus has a major university (in addition to many other colleges) and definitely has both a liberal vibe and a conservative vibe, and both are moderate. Contrary to popular belief, it has a significant International population: it has the second-largest Somalian population in the U.S. There are many Asians, Hispanics, and Africans in Columbus. Men in Columbus are tall, there are actually many good-looking guys there. The city spends a lot of money on Festivals, an excellent public libray system (largest circulation in the U.S....at leats it was a few years ago. Much of Columbus is upscale. I had to leave because I lived most of my life in central Ohio, and i wanted to see the rest of the country.

[quote]OP try Chicago. The winters aren't that bad

Seriously? One time I had to fly from LA to Chicago in February. I left in 65 degree weather; when I arrived in Chicago, the high was a balmy 11 degrees.

Houston, Texas is where it’s at. Multitude of jobs in every industry, great cost of living, mild winters and friendly people make it the number one city in the US. Heck we even had a lesbian Mayor.

Yeah the winters in Chicago are literally among the worst you will find in an American city, no point in pretending otherwise.

I'm a native New Englander, so Chicago winters wouldn't bother me. I wouldn't live in Texas for free.

Houston sucks big, blue, donkey balls.

I couldn't wait to leave.

R201 - I’m not being snarky. I love it here. Why did you leave and where did you go?

Fugrozzo is high on my wish list. Right by the ocean, with a long strip of gay bars and clubs.

Fugrozzo?

I googled Frigozzo and still can’t find it.....sounds like Italy but I’m not seeing it

I’m a northeasterner. But I could see Houston - probably the only southern city that I would consider. Big, diverse, cosmopolitan, great transportation hub, affordable, gay, great food. If you are looking for an affordable city - and there aren’t tat many left - Houston should definitely be top 5.

[quote]Dear god, who wants to live in Nevada?

Lots of people have been moving from California to Nevada, including me, because Nevada is a lot cheaper. In fact so many that Nevada is now essentially a blue state and all the top elected officials are now Democrats. The Republicans including the ones near me are up in arms and there is a small movement to "Make Nevada Red Again." But it's unstoppable. After living in Nevada for 4 years I've decided it is a shithole. It's mainly just desert and the people can be awful. A guy killed my cat on purpose just to hurt me. I'm trying to move back to California now, but it's a lot more expensive.

R206 - I’ve been in Houston for 12 years and LOVE it. The coat of living is super cheap, the people are friendly, and there’s so much art, music, food, and culture. My only caution would be to stay “inside the loop.” This means stay in Montrose, River Oaks, the Heights. There’s nothing worth doing in the awful suburbs and it’s very conservative and small-minded. But inner city is wonderful, diverse, and vibrant. Another plus for me, is there are very few children near downtown.

Someplace that's clean.

Living in the Montrose/River Oaks/Museum District area would be nice. Some very cool and large townhomes-with parking. And a vibrant gayborhood. Not a bad life.

Houston? Too hot and humid in the summer.

Is there a city in Texas that isn't hot and humid in the summer?

R212 - houston isn’t that bad - we have cold air conditioning EVERYWHERE!! Also have great patios at all the bars and restaurants with misting systems and/or portable air coolers. We do tons of pool parties so great opportunities to get naked 😈

Don’t come to Seattle, we are a wet San Francisco now.

R213 I think I'm more sold on Houston now than Austin. My understanding is that Houston is slightly cheaper too. Is the traffic to Austin pretty bad?

The traffic in both Austin and Houston is terrible. Austin is no longer a college town but a city full of cars. between the two I actually prefer Houston now. It has much better airport connections and full of South Asians which I love.

R215 - you’ve reached the perfect person to ask that question- ME!! I lived in Austin in the glory days (1994-2007) and moved to Houston just before Austin turned into an overpriced parking lot full of hipster douche bags. I absolutely LOVE Houston and am so glad I made the transition. Jobs are great here. I’m in health care, but all other industries are thriving. I love the diversity and feel very safe being an open gay man in every aspect of my life. I recommend Montrose if you can afford it, but other neighborhoods such a small the Heights or Galleria are decent. Good luck!

Between Houston and Austin which food scene is better? I need my Asian food fix, I'm used to good Asian and other ethnic food since I'm a California native. It's why I can't just move to anywhere that doesn't have decent food scene. I had been focused on looking for work in Austin but actually have had more leads in Houston even though it's not on my radar until recently.

Oh, and I make frequent trips to Austin to visit Lake Travis (Hippie Hollow) and it’s 2.5 hours each way.

And I have lived in both cities too and Houston is a deal compared to Austin in housing.

R217 Thanks! Good to hear, I'm in healthcare too and am considering a teaching position along with doing clinical practice (I'm a DNP). Thanks for the recommendation of neighborhoods, it's helpful to know the gay-friendly areas from residents who know how important that is to us. I was mostly concentrating on finding position with UT Austin because I've always worked for university health system, but I guess I'll look seriously into Houston too now.

In Houston try to live within the loop.

R221 - awesome! You’re an NP and you’ll have no issues finding employment! I recommend Memorial Hermann Medical Group, Baylor Clinic, or UT Health Systems. I’m an X-ray tech and get offers all the time although I’ve been happy with my current company. You’ll be able to afford the Montrose with your income and I think it will help you integrate socially. Again, good luck! You’ll love the welcoming community here 😉

Houston is not only far, far superior to Austin in all food - especially any form of Asian - but I would argue one of the best cities in the world for international cuisine. As a NYer, I’m impressed with the diversity - and cheapness - of food in Houston. Austin is a way overhyped small town. Houston is an international city - and possibly the most affordable one in the US. Only negative is it’s very car dependent. But thanks to Uber/Lyft, it’s become less of a problem.

Houston City Hall during Pride

Avoid Chicago like the plague. Highest property, sales, and gasoline taxes in the country, just raised again, and a promised increase is coming up again. In addition to these taxes, city service taxes have skyrocketed. City sticker can be over $200 plus another $125 for state registration. I now live in the house I grew up in, and after over 60 years here, I'm moving.

Only go to Chicago if you have a death wish. People are murdered there daily, sometimes over 20 a day.

One good thing about Austin is there’s no murders, but Houston has more to offer in every sense.

The murders in Chicago are concentrated in one or two specific neighborhoods, it's not a city-wide problem.

Don't the misters make it even more humid?

[quote]Houston is not only far, far superior to Austin in all food - especially any form of Asian - but I would argue one of the best cities in the world for international cuisine.

^^^This! I've traveled all over the world, and Houston has the best selection of good and affordable food options of any major city in the US. So much good food of every nationality, and it's so affordable. Rents are cheaper, so you get a lot of food for your money. It's foodie heaven!

The Austin food scene isn't terrible, especially for Mexican and BBQ, but it's not in the same league as Houston. Dallas just plain sucks balls.

Agree R231. Some of th best food in the country. If you can get past the concept of Texas and the car based lifestyle, Houston has a lot going for it,

How warm is the sea in the Houston area for swimming? I grew up in Spain where it was 27c in the summer.

R233 - the Gulf of Mexico near Houston is very warm for swimming! I swim from April thru October.

Unless you’re poor and desperate, you don’t swim in the “sea” near Houston. There’s a beach called Galveston about an hour away that is on the Gulf of Mexico - water can get to 27-30 in August. But because Houston is a major oil/gas/chemical shipping port, the water tends to be nasty.

Houston Medical Center was fairly impressive.

Nothing in Austin impressed me. A view of the lake and a bridge? Paddleboats? Ho hum.

Houston's Lesbian Mayor. Yup!

It's way too hot in Texas. I was in Dallas over the weekend and it was 107!

Portland

Portland is so over.

Houston is my choice for reasonably priced living, mild winters, and hot men.

Another vote for Houston

I like Houston too.

I'm one of the few people who actually likes Houston, but it's weather is becoming a major problem. The have at least one big flood every year. With climate change becoming a real thing, I would be scared moving there.

R244 - you don’t have to worry about climate change in your lifetime dear.

[quote] Only negative is it’s very car dependent.

I would say the weather is another big negative. LA is car-dependent, too (although less so than it used to be) but at least we have decent weather year-round.

Another who's moved to Fugrozzo. It's such a cool place.

Are there butch gay men in Dallas?

[quote]Are there butch gay men in Dallas?

Fugrozzo has a high crime rate.

Fugrozzo needs a film festival.

How are the salaries in Houston?

Houston is in Texas. If you want to be associated with that blighted state that represents red state rage on steroids, evangelical loons running the state house, censoring textbooks that affect the rest of the US, cowboy boots, Cowboy hats, crappy barbecued beef and more beef-have at it. I've never seen any population absolutely revel in wallowing in their ignorance like Texans. If you're a white male/female you are a part of that culture whether you're playing hipster in Austin or Captain of Industry in Houston.

mexico city.so many expats here, money goes twice as far. air not that bad, lots o cheap boys

Houston is humid as fuk and filled with bugs, mosquitoes and low class scum

R253 - I thought the same thing until being forced to spend a lot of time in Houston for work. While I’d agree with your assessment for Dallas, spending time in Houston was eye-opening. Demographically the most diverse city in US - tons of different ethnicities, though predominately Hispanic, also a ton of Asian and African. Much less “Texas” than what I imagined. They are there - but most are in the far out exurbs. As a lot of media is reporting, the cities of Texas could well turn the whole state Dem because they have become bastions of Dems and are growing bigger every year.

[Quote]Demographically the most diverse city in US

Uh no. The most ethnically diverse big city in America is unsurprisingly New York, followed by Oakland.

Diversity may be subject to definition. I think Houston is the most “non-white” big city.

[quote]Diversity may be subject to definition. I think Houston is the most “non-white” big city.

Really?

Yes R259

Detroit is 80% black so are you saying Houston is 90%? So many hoes on here.

Detroit being 80% black and 14% white is not very diverse. LA is almost 50% white, NY 45% white. I know LA and NY like to think of themselves as bastions of diversity. But what they have become is more bastions of wealth.

Houston = 43% Latino, 25% white, 23% black and 6% Asian. So, yes, Houston is the MOST diverse US major city.

Except it is not r262. I've shown you it is not. This has been systemically studied, the list is at r257.

Also I just pulled up the demographics of Oakland since you don't seem to get it

Non-Hispanic White 25.9% (28.0%) African 16.8% Asian, Hispanic or Latino of any race were persons (25.4%)

You don't need a complicated study if you don't trust that list, you can see plainly that Oakland is more diverse.

No one is saying that Houston isn't a diverse city, but your insistence is has to be number 1 is bizarre.

In NY, people are heading uptown. Yesterday I walked up Broadway from 155th to 190th. In the olden days this would have been a precarious walk. Now, there's new development everywhere. A Boxer's Gay sports bar on 155 and new cute places on every block. Columbia Presbyterian has expanded in every direction. All of Broadway has been repaved, with bike lanes and safe crosswalks. The parks on both sides of the river have been revamped and cleaned up and the GWB Bus terminal has been completely refurbished. Prices have gone up steadily in the past few years, but compared to other parts of NY it's a bargain.

[quote] In NY, people are heading uptown.

You mean "white" people are heading uptown, R265?

I can't believe how much Washington Heights has changed. That was practically a no-go area for many years. Now it's looking like the UWS. Crazy how things change.

I heard Harlem is the next big thing, is it still affordable ?

Agree uptown Manhattan is becoming the new gay neighborhood. Strangely affordable - and much easier access than Brooklyn as well as cheaper. Not the prettiest part of the city but nice to have a good hospital nearby - unlike the lower west side. Seems like there are real people living there and has a little bit of old NY vibe. And of course the hot Hispanic men are the ultimate selling point.

Can I get a dee-luxe apartment in the sky?

Houston is amazing. We have the BEST food, cost of living, and the entertainment options are endless. A pro football, basketball, and baseball team (if you’re into that) are all based here. Jobs are plentiful and we have the Texas Medical Center, used by patients from all over the world. It’s obviously much better if you’re white. I find that conservatives here forgive the fact I’m openly gay since I’m white. If you’re a person of color AND gay, it’s definitely a tough road. If you’re not white, I’d recommend you go to California.

Yeah agree R271 -I like Houston. But it is odd that it is such a diverse city - but there is a heavy classist/racist thing with Hispanics. Not as bad as Dallas. But Texas struggles to integrate the lily white Texans who ran the state for a century with the actual original residents and immigrants who are Hispanic and make up a huge portion of the population. It’s fine for me as a white guy - but see my partner being slighted on occasion.

R237 ... The lesbian mayor in Houston has been out of office since 2016. Term limits.

R269, Yes, hot men everywhere of every flavor. Columbia Medical and Dental school have both expanded , so there's smart, cute guys from all over the world. Yeshiva University attracts rich, Jewish boys from all over the world. The Dominicans have been here for a few generations so they are Americanized in a good way, (Let's NOT throw our garbage out the window) ,there's still leftover Irish, Polish and Greeks and of course, the well established Jewish Community. Another thing about the Dominicans, they like white people, so there's not as much tension as you find in other gentrifying neighborhoods. My husband has barely left the neighborhood in a decade, there's just so much to do here.

r271, r272, are correct. I lived in Houston 25 years ago when I was sentenced to five years of middle management. I Had a nice house, inside the loop, wonderful, fun, kind people everywhere. Houston has a lot to offer if you want to drive everywhere. But, the casual racism and ignorance of the privileged, white, xtians was intolerable and I fled back to NY as soon as I completed my sentence.

At work at a Fort 100 company: A VP speaking to twenty white male managers- "Earl, go tell Carmen (generic Mexican) to bring us more coffee and get Peedro to empty the trash. And while you're at it, go see if you can Jew him down on the bill, tell him the rolls were stale"

Different VP, drops off documents at my house, with my boy friend, leaves me a message: " I left the papers with your gardener"

As a guest at my first gay dinner Party: "Bill, since this is you're first party, would you like to say grace?" me: Spit take.

Anything that is less than 25 miles is "close", people drive 50 miles to go to a chain restaurant. At that time Pappacitos did not have ANY Hispanic servers. They could cook but not serve or touch money. The same thing with Luby's, only whites touch money. I imagine that's changed.

Me at work: "Oh, Hi Maria (with Spanish accent" Her: "My name is NOT Maria,(with exaggerated accent), it's Ma Ree uh,(the white way). And I am NOT a Mexican". Me: 'Oh, ok. Sorry.

You get the idea.

^Another, I had accounts in Mexico and the number one comment I heard from co-workers. "I love Mexico, but I hate Mexicans". Always, by people that I barely knew. It's as if you were white, you just were supposed to think like them. Frightening. I won't even change planes in Texas anymore, out of a fear that a 9/11 movement might happen and I'd be stuck. In my experience, the people who loved Houston came from shittier places like Arkansas and Louisiana and Oklahoma.

R275 - LoL you’re description is spot-on. Currently live in Houston and it STILL very similar. And I haven’t ever had a Mexican server at Pappasitos! Inside the loop is the only place I’d live; out on the suburbs the word “faggot” is frequently used by straights.

^That makes me sad. I was hoping that things had changed in the past 30 years. As a big mouth, liberal, vegetarian, atheist, homo, I never felt safe there.

Manhattan has 1.6 million people, Trump got 65k votes. I need to be surrounded by like minded people.

Good God some of you people have the most ignorant, uninformed, and just plain idiotic ideas about the rest of the US. Please, for the love of all that's Holy, stay where you are and save the rest of the country the pain of having the listen to your silliness.

^This one's for you Miss Oklahoma.

R275 /R276 - your experience rings true. While the inner ring is relatively cosmopolitan and progressive, the work environments that incorporate the exurban people are a constant reminder that you are in Texas. And it’s a valid argument against living there. The quality of people surrounding you really affects your life. Right now prefer a 1BR in Outer ring of NYC to a 4BR townhouse in Houston. There is a price to pay nowadays to live in progressive locations.

Sorry Houston, but no amount of good and diverse places to eat can make up for the horror that is to live among repugnant. bigots

I make about 50K a year and live comfortably in an elevator rent-stabilized one-bedroom in midtown Manhattan, and I LOVE it here!

Oh, and to that poster above who claims he was "highly taxed because he's single", that isn't so. The tax rates for MFJ (Married Filing Jointly) are adjusted for two incomes, so generally you'd pay the same. You'd do better if you had a newish mortgage and were itemizing your biggest deduction which would be your mortgage interest. What you probably don't have are children (dependents) which would give you their tax credits and perhaps childcare credits. The new Trump tax ripoff took away the $4000 exemption per child, but raised the tax credit (cash to you) a bit.

There are still certain deductions one loses as your income (now combined with your spouse's) rises, so in some instances, especially for two high earners there does still exist a "marriage penalty". It depends on your circumstances though.

[QUOTE] . And of course the hot Hispanic men are the ultimate selling point.

You sound like a character out of Dancer From The Dance.

I know a lot of people who moved to Denver. They love it. Usually, when people leave NY or California they bitch and complain. It is also impossible to move back.

Why would it be impossible to move back?

I hav a rent stabilized apartment in NYC. If I left it, I would have to pay more than 3x the price if I moved back.

Tell me about it, R287.

R277 What do you expect in a shithole like Texas? No matter how much people try to glamorize it, it is still a shithole.

R282 You got it wrong about bigots in control. Houston voted all Republicans out of local offices last year, in a direct rebuff of Trump and his Republican enablers. It was a Democratic sweep that left many longtime GOP officeholders stunned to be out of jobs, including the longtime head of the county commission, who was replaced by a 28-year-old female progressive. The sheriff (Latino male), DA (white female) and police chief (Latino male) are all Democrats now. The mayor's job is officially nonpartisan, but it's currently held by a Democratic black man.