Isn't a grown man visiting his mom three to four times a week excessive?

3/10

[quote]Italian

What part of Italy did he grow up in? How good is his English?

Yes. That's cute up until college. Afterwards, not so much.

OP theres nothjng wrong with this. Besides you guys get free, quality food. Is everything else going well in the relationship?

Now you all know why I never see him.

He's Italian-American, R2. It's not a dealbreaker, R4. In fact, I thought it was charming at first, but after two years I sometimes feel like I'm second fiddle.

#346,670 in the "I'm dating an Italian guy. Let's make fun of them" category.

You should be so lucky to have affectionate parents, OP. But doubtless your cold Anglo mom makes Mary Tyler Moore's character in "Ordinary People" seem lovable by comparison.

Does she live close by? I don't see anything wrong with calling in to see his mom regularly? She'll still be his mom, long after you've broken up.

Yeah, it comes with the territory for Italian guys. Be more wary of the ones who aren't close to their mothers.

Couldn't be my man.Go have a talk with his insecure mom.

Have you ever met his mom, OP?

An hour away, R8. Yes, maybe I am a little subconsciously jealous, R7. She is a very nice woman, accepts that he's gay, and has met me, but I think she is overly needy and guilt trips him.

You better get used to it.

OP it aounds like you have issues not his mom. Why the hell would you be jealous. I can already tell your the bottom, not that that matters. But your probably needy as fuck.

If she's very close by I can see it.

Its very common in Italy for sons to live with their mothers.

R14 You're redic

Their grandmothers too. 3 generations under one roof.

Italians are too close tot their mammas.The downfall of most marriages in Italy is because the daughter-in-law doesn't get along with their mother-in-law. It is too much after some time. I prefer Greek,Spanish and French guys because they are less mother centric when compared to Italians.

I think it's great!

He doesn't live with his mother, R16, but he might as well since he sees her so often. Not just her, but brothers and cousins and extended family too. Yes R14, maybe that says more about me since I find the situation so foreign.

R6 You are 2nd fiddle. Accept it and relax

Why don't you accompany him?

As long as your needs are met, not a deal breaker for me.

You should be more concerned about his relationship with his father.

Is she a good cook?

Listen to R19. They know what they are talking about.

R23, OP can't go with him and then bitch about it on DL.

I have accompanied him, R23, to some of his family gatherings. They are all very nice, but I feel exhausted afterwards from all of the chatter. Yes, she is an excellent cook, moreso than me, and I think I'm a pretty good cock too, but I wouldn't have the patience for some of her hours long recipes.

*COOK.

R22 What are you even talking about?

R6 You're

I'm with you, OP. Living in NYC I've seen this in several boys who've broken away from Little Italy but remain calling by mom several times a week. And Sunday is hers. Now if this relationship of yours has any merit ,his loyalty to mom will transfer to you in time. Or not.

Men who have poor relationships with their moms are more concerning.

R34 Bullshit. A friend of mine is dating an Italian American guy who has no relationship with his mother. It is heaven because they are Italian too and don't miss the pushy and smothering mamma act.

He is close enough with his father, R25 although their relationship is a bit strained because I'm not so sure his dad 100% likes his only son being gay. I feel kind of awkward around him honestly. His dad is nice with me but short.

Men who treat their mothers well make better partners.

R37 I hear ya but that's not always true

I'd go for the victuals. No, I'm not fat.

Yes it's excessive.

Creepy as fuck. Cut the umbilical cord, you pussies.

At least get her lasagna recipe from her before he breaks up with you, OP.

[quote] I feel kind of awkward around him honestly. His dad is nice with me but short.

r36, do you mean that he's a Little Person? His father is a Little Person? I feel awkward around Little People because I have so many questions I want to ask them and always have to keep myself from patting them on the head.

any opinion on a 51 year guy that works full time makes a decent living and lives with his Mom ( in her apartment) but he does NOT pay any rent and she makes his food and does his laundry too...

r44 would you be referring to yourself?

well that's a bit much R44

Ha no R43, I mean that his dad doesn't make too much conversation with me, at least not compared to his daughter's husbands who he jokes around with all the time. He's nice enough, but we don't have too much to talk about I guess.

Anyone over the age of 25 who is not living in his own apartment/house is a big red flag.

Do Not Fuck.

He knows you're having sweaty anal sex with his son, R47. What do you expect him to talk about? The weather?

Start watching football, that will help.

I think it's sweet.

You want to get between a son and mother. I can write the ending. Hint: you’re not in it.

You want to get between an son and Italian mother. I can write the ending. Hint: you'll end up dead.

Well, you haven't known him as long as the sister's husband, right? Maybe he doesn't know if you have a sense of humor. Probably, though, he's trying to figure out which one of you is the top and this unanswered question blocks his ability to ask other questions.

Learn to make Sunday Gravy OP. That might steal him away from momma.

OP's cooking will never stack up. Don't even think of making Italian food, OP.

Get used to it OP. I'm in a similar situation with my partner of 12 years. Although he's not over there as often as yours, Sunday is a definite. And an occasional during the week visit. Large family. I usually go with him but occasionally I don't, I think it's nice for them to have their "them" time. His mother is a terrific woman. And a great cook, we get the Tupperware's too. Most of his family is warm and loving, there are a few who are problems for everyone as well. I'm always included in everything. I'm happy that I'm with a person who's family minded. The chatter can even still be overwhelming and tiring, I'm just not from a family like that, mine is quite and reserved. But overall I'm glad I'm part of his family, especially his mom.

OP - know your place in the world.

OP the situation is overbearing. Southern Italians are too close, especially to their mamma. Once again Southern French, Spanish and Greeks are very family oriented but the mother has nowhere near the influence they have in Southern Italian and Sicilian families. A date of Italian descent is more likely to call their mother during a date!

I'm being so clever. Get ready for my sequels: I'm worried about my Irish boyfriend's temper and I'm sick of my Asian boyfriend knowing more about math than me. The possibilities are endless!

I've known him about the same length as one of the sister's husbands, R54. He's a very jovial man otherwise. I don't really mind a father being distant, since my own father is the same way. My BF's been out to his mother a lot longer than his dad, and he has never really explained to me how he came out to him, but it's something he prefers not to discuss.

R44 He's the typical Italian who is a spoiled mama's boy. Drop him. There are more Americanized Italian Americans that would be better. Otherwise a mama's boy in that culture always fights with their son's lovers. They really know how to stir shit up.

I meant a mamma fights with her sons lovers.

If she's elderly and lives alone, I can understand it. Otherwise, he needs to grow up.

An elderly Italian woman never lives alone, R64.

OP, just be grateful you found a top willing to take you on.

I agree with R66.

[quote] Probably, though, he's trying to figure out which one of you is the top and this unanswered question blocks his ability to ask other questions.

This. Every time you speak to him, he's picturing his son mounting you on all fours.

Just accept it. What kinds of foods is she putting into those Tupperwares?

My mother tells the story that “a man who is good to his mother will be good to his wife.” I think my father was known as something of a mama’s boy.

im jealous of the bf, i cant stand my mom.

my mom is a good cook though..

This is an Italian thing, and it’s not going to change until the mother is dead.

So either accept it, OP... or move on.

An hour away and he visits her 4 times a week? Is she an invalid and needs assistance? If not , then 1-2 times a week is more than enough.

R70 complete horseshit. In the Italian culture whatever a wife does comes second to what his mother does. It leads to tons of tension. No one male or female wants to be second fiddle to someone's mom. Even in the Italian culture where it is considered normal!

An unfortunate reality of Italian life. Sucks but it’s part of the package. I’m sure a lot of it is guilt. Italian mothers and culture make it insidious. But the upside is loyalty is a good trait - and caring for someone is a good thing, My BF never dealt with or took care of his family - and I’ve learned over time, that same behavior applies to me in old age. It’s intrinsic in your upbringing and fighting it is pointless - it is who he is. He probably needs help managing his guilt - not more guilt for you for trying to avoid guilt from his mother.

[quote]He's Italian-American

Yes, I figured. I just find it weird that people try to say they are "Irish" or "Italian" when they are have never even stepped foot in that country, much less are actually from there.

They are American.

This is normal for Italian families. If he doesn't his mom, his mom will barge in on your private time together.

Great point R77. The fact that he doesn’t make you go and is preventing you from having to deal with them intruding on you is very good of him.

[quote] but I think she is overly needy and guilt trips him.

This is an old lady Italian mother trick. They are overbearing and guilt trippy so that their kids never end up putting them in senior homes. You never see those old bags in senior homes!

And the mothers treat their sons like little mini princes all the way through life too. So unless you are equally as accommodating, you'll be treated as an unfit partner!

Too many visits. Talk to him about cutting back.

I always find it incredibly weird when grown adults spend that much time with their families unless one of the family members is sick or an invalid. Cut the cord already.

Also, little old Italian ladies all live until they are 103 years old. So if you're thinking she'll kick the bucket anytime soon, think again!

Italian, you say? Well, he has to go to visit her often...how else can she get her mustache and nose hair trimmed.

I wish I had this type of relationship with my mom.

Maybe if you cooked better he wouldn't be over there so much.

Hold old is his mother. I change my ideas about Momma's boys when the mother is elderly. IF she is over 70 good on him. In her 60s and alone without others in the house, that is okay. In her 50s, it's too much. He should just go over on Sundays.

I live across the country from my m other who is in her late 70s, I wish I could see her a couple of times a year, rather than ever 2 years, I call about 4x a week.

She is not at all invalid, R73. She's very able bodied and spry and gets around all over by herself.

She's 73, R85. My boyfriend was her last kid after three consecutive daughters, so yes, there is some of that spoiled son syndrome going on.

R53 respect

I try to see my mom twice a week, plus we talk on the phone usually every other day, but I don’t know if it’s comparable to your boyfriend’s situation, OP.

My mom is 89 and not in the best of health, so the truth is I worry about her a lot. Plus, I’m her only family anywhere in the vicinity. Beyond that, given her health problems and - though I hope she’ll be around for a good long while - I anxious to get her out of the house and take her places she can enjoy herself and possibly even forget about her physical discomfort, before it’s too late for me to do that for her. I really can’t put myself in her shoes, but I know her gradual decline over the past couple of years has done a number on her sense of self.

That said, I recognize that between the time I spend with Mom and my often-crazy work schedule, I’m probably not great boyfriend material at the moment.

Oh boy, the only son and youngest child, OP?

You're doomed.

^^^ I AM anxious...

[quote] R81: I always find it incredibly weird when grown adults spend that much time with their families unless one of the family members is sick or an invalid. Cut the cord already

If you’re lucky, family are friends with whom you travel over a lifetime.

It's from Americans who have never left the country so they have no real frame of reference r76.

If you like her, then you should be thankful to have her in your life. As you get older, family and friends are your most precious assets.

Is she a good Italian cook? How many of us would kill to have an authentic Italian Nonna to cook for us.

So their only son is gay? No wonder poppa doesn’t want to talk to you OP. You are helping end generations of continuing the family name.

R81: Probably not too often.

How is your bf in the sack? If he throws a good fuck (and he’s cute), you’re lucky and you need to just accept that he loves his momma.

Yo at least he is not at a strip club or bathhouse or his he?

R57 - you seem like a good egg. Wishing you and yours all the best!

She'll be living with you eventually so get with the program, bimbo.

It's unhealthy, OP, but get used to it. She will be moving in with you at some point too. Your kitchen is hers.

[quote]He thinks I'm the flawed one. What do you think, DL?

You HAD to know that this wouldn't go very well.

When you date an Italian guy, you're not just dating him, you're dating his entire family. The other posters on here warning you know what they're talking about.

Op types like a bottom.

Italian mama's boy here. Here are my 2 cents if anyone cares.

I have 2 siblings, my sister lives close by, less than 10 minutes to my mom. but she has a demanding, stressful job and just doesn't want to deal with our 84 year old mom daily or on the weekends. My older brother is a dick he lives about an hour away but sees her maybe 4x a year and never on holidays because he hates my sister and refuses to be in the same room with her, big brother is very immature.

Now me, the mama's boy (boy at 55? Ha ha!) Like my brother, I'm also about an hour away, but my husband and I pack our bags every weekend and head to my mom's. She's an 84 widow who lives alone and can't drive any longer. She lives in the suburbs and so there's no walking to the market or walking to anything. Like most suburbs it is car-oriented. So we leave Saturday mornings (giving us Friday to go out to dinner and/or drinks) and spend the weekend with her, take her shopping, get her nails/hair done, go to the movies and just hang out.

A nice surprise is that my partner loves hanging out with my mom. His own mom is a distant, cold religious woman, and in general, most of his family is homophobic so he does not get any love from his own family - that coincidentally lives about 2 miles from my mom's house. But in a rather short time, my mom has become his defacto "mama." When we first met, my partner couldn't boil water, now every weekend he and my mom are in the kitchen cooking. he's learning to cook while making up some wonderful meals for the three of us, and there's always leftovers for us to bring home.

I'm lucky that my husband unlike OP is not jealous of the time I/we spend with my mom. My mom is fun. She likes her wine when it's fall/winter and in the spring/summer she likes her beer. She loves showing off her fruit orchards, her vegetable and herb gardens, which are her pride and joy. Luckily, her home is large enough that when husband and I want to spend some alone time, her place has the space, which she respects and she doesn't bug us.

TL:DR, OP if your BF's mom is elderly, your boyfriend is being kind and generous with his time. As the great Bette Davis famously said, “Getting old ain't for sissies.” You need to grow up and stop being so insecure. Go with him, get to know her better, and let her get to know you better. Hope it works out. Ciao!

If the relationship with a mother is good an loving, why would it be weird to hang out in adulthood? My mom taught me how to love, and since she stopped trying to steer my life and interfere with my choices and just accepted me for who I am (it was mutual, I also accepted her for who she was, in my mid twenties), I actually really enjoy hanging out with her, she is fun. I care about her and want he to be well.

I'm lucky because my long term boyfriend also loves her and enjoys her presence, even when she comes around unannounced or is needy for attention, he can handle her even better than i can. If he has plans he'll make her a tea and have chit chat and then he'll excuse himself. She'll just chill or cook something, which is always nice.

What about people who are in family businesses together? Is that a no go too. Because they see each other every day.

Guess who’s moving in?

You sure he’s not cheating on you ? I mean 3 to 4 times a week a 2 hour drive ! Is that car running on water maybe ? 2 times a week is more than enough

It's not nearly as excessive as if he hung framed pictures of his momma all over your bedroom like Ronan Farrow does, OP:

This is an Irish thing too but tbh I like it. I moved to the US in 89 and I still haven’t been able to accept the very common idea that you’re a weirdo if you voluntarily spend time with your parents and siblings after 18. I go to Ireland twice every year and my parents come to me twice. My sisters also come visit. I like them as people (I know that’s not the case for everyone and some parents are abusive), they put a lot of effort into raising us and forming relationships with us, my sisters are the only people I can call and say “remember when grandma......” , “today would have been grandad’s birthday” and they will be my only link to the past when my parents are gone. I also call my 2 aunts in Ireland weekly and send them money or little gifts. I’m rambling now but basically if you like your parents and had a good childhood why create such distance between you? What does it prove.

Also my parents cared for my grandparents in their final years. My father took a career break and nursed his mother through 6 months of hospice care in her own home. For that he has my respect and I think it’s an incredibly masculine thing to stand up and care for and protect your loved ones. I hope I’ll have the privilege of caring for my parents someday and giving them an easy passing.

To OP: Try to work on your jealousy and make sure you and your bf are spending quality time with each other. If your time together is suffering I think it would be reasonable to ask him to drop one visit. I don’t see life as a hierarch where I give each person in my life a number. I see it more as a circle and what my parents give me is completely different from what a partner has to offer. I never compare the two and I’d see my mother as a substitute for a romantic partner but a romantic partner couldn’t be a substitute for parental love either. I hope you both find a balance. Good luck.

Funny how significant others are jealous of their partners family members.Its also kinda weird...OP how would you feel if your partner had a hissy fit everytime you went to see your family.Not good right.Stop your bishing,eat and learn controlling who your love interacts with won't keep them in the long run.An for gods sake,thank her for the delicious food.....before you really get kicked to curb.

Every Sunday? Um, no. Dealbreaker. I’m not even counting the four other times (!) during the week. This is a child who is incapable of being in a committed adult relationship. Punch and delete.

How far away does mom live? If it's a 15-minute trip, it's not really that weird. Now, if she lives an hour away, then that's an issue.

Are you a gay man R37, because you’re INCREDIBLY naive. A lot of gay men have horrible unaccepting parents, and that includes awful mothers. You sound like a frau wasp. Knock it off.

Tupperwares?

Does your Eyetalian boyfriend have a clean hole?

It's not really excessive if they're in love.

OP - while your bf is busy with his mom, maybe you can service some of that other hot wop cock hanging around the house or neighborhood. Win win!

R113

Leave aside people who have issues with their family. So, after spending 18+ years living with people, bonding, having shared experiences, giving and receiving emotional support you should cut them almost out of your life and limit your contact to prove you’re not a child, even if they live close by. And this in a country with a 50% divorce rate and a corporate culture that gives meagre vacation time and expects long hours. Is it any wonder that so many people are self medicating with pills, drugs, religion, serial monogamy, tribal affiliation to political parties... There’s a lot of lonely hurting people out there who would have been a lot better off if they stayed close to their parents/siblings.

You should consider yourself very fortunate, OP.

I have a Mediterranean mother-in-law who has given us (gay couple) 25 years of unrelenting hostility. Even our having children did not, amazingly, reduce her anger. My husband, unfortunately, adores her. She has caused an immense amount of damage and -- for him -- suffering along the way. I gave up on her years ago and look forward to her death.

R111 The Irish thing is da bit dfferent. The other Mediterranean cultures like The Southern French, The Greeks and The Spanish are very close to the family situation of The Italian s. They all love their mothers but not like Italians! Unwed Italian guys live with their mother until they get married. Then the mother will eventually move in. In the world no daughter in law will have more tension with their husbands mother. The mother's sauce is always the best and you can't do anything like mamma does. Italian men are the most spoiled men in the world. The umbilical cord is never fully cut with them!

Agree R111 . Irish parents and family here - and this has always been the expectation. Bothered me in my 20s-30s. Now in late 40s and mom 83, I’m less bitter about it. But there is no denying the maternal guilt component.

I bought a weekend house near my mom/family so at least I don’t have to be with her 24/7 on weekends. My partner is not close to his family and thinks my family is excessive. I don’t force him to participate - though honestly wish he would. We’ve had numerous conflicts over him not making any effort with my family (ex, not going to major family functions with me). After 20 years, I realize it’s indicative of a deeper issue between us that he doesn’t go out of his way to help or show loyalty and is less responsive in times of need. (BTW, he’s an actor - enough said).

Being giving to family is a sign of someone who is giving to people they love. They are the salt of the earth and some of the best husbands a man could have in the long term.

Actually the Irish (not Irish Americans) can be worse because it’s such a small country. You are always no more than a 2 hour drive from home. Kids usually stay living at home until well into their 20s and with house prices out of control in Dublin it’s not just single men living with mam but young married couples too. I believe 35% of 25-35 year olds live at home. My supervisor has all 3 adult children, sons wife and their toddler all in her home. College kids go home every weekend to mammy. Even the immigrants in Canada and Australia get home more often than many Americans who are driving distance of their parents. My brother comes back from Sydney every Christmas and every June. But he married an Irish girl so she would think he was very weird if he didn’t do that. In fact she probably wouldn’t have married him. Nursing homes are seen here as a place for people with no family. Elderly people move in with their kids and our work culture is very friendly to children who need to take off to care for elderly parents. Even a part time supermarket clerk will get a government payment if he/she has to stop working to care for a parent. There are also grants to build in a granny flat or to alter your home to allow your elderly parent to stay in your care. All 4 of my grandparents died in my parents home and were waked there and carried out of there to the graveyard by the men of the family. I’m sure the Irish Americans are very assimilated by now but it’s very traditional here still and family is everything. Religion is gone but blood will always be thicker than water. Nobody really cares that I’m gay in my town but god help me if I said dont visit your mother every week or put your dad into a home or stop calling your son in Canada everyday

[quote] It's from Americans who have never left the country so they have no real frame of reference [R76].

What??! Italian-Americans call themselves Italian the same reason Jews call themselves Jewish. It’s a culture that has passed down traditions. They are very clannish and both were stuck in ghettos.

If OP moved closer to this guy’s family, the commutes to and from those visits wouldn’t cut into the couple’s “we” time so much.

[quote]Then the mother will eventually move in.

What 1950s drama is this from? This doesn’t exist, hon.

Reminds me of this.

Italian men typically have squeaky clean anuses

Oh yes OP I forget to ask is he,working or at home ?

In many cultures, you don't leave your parents' house until you're married and even afterwards, it's normal to maintain consistent contact with them (dinners, get togethers, etc.) and even live together under the same roof (kids and all). It's not normal, once you've settled down, to treat parents and family members like acquaintances. Americans are probably the only nationality on earth that thinks it's normal to kick their kids out of the nest at 18 and minimize as little contact as possible other than phone calls, social media and the occasional family reunion.

So, if he's spending so much time at his mother's house that he seems totally dependent on her or it's having a negative impact on your relationship, then it's excessive. But if he's perfectly functional, stable and independent, I don't see what the problem is.

Y’know I just discussed this with my partner and as he said immigrant families and the culture in many countries (probably most) is just different. We have similar backgrounds and neither of us did any extra curricular activities, the term didn’t even exist. We didn’t go to camp or sleep over parties, also concepts that didn’t exist. We spent a lot of time with our parents and a lot of time playing with our siblings. We both are sort of stunned at the amount of stuff American kids do and how independent they are from a young age. But we didn’t need it. We both got into the best college in our country because the only requirement is academics in the form of a multi-day state run exam. Not an aptitude test but an examination of the state curriculum. My boyfriend even reminded me that when we both studied French at university level the oral examination asked all about our families, not our hobbies or romantic lives. At college there are no sports scholarships or any reason to be there but academics and rooms were rented to students for 5 nights assuming we would all go home on the weekends which we did. So for us it was natural to stay close to family because our homes were the center of everything for 21 years and not just a b&b. My partners best friend is his brother and they speak on the phone every night. I never thought this strange and I’ve never felt jealous. His brother knows him much longer than I have and most people I know from my childhood are very close to their siblings. And yep mom moving in happens, usually with a daughter though not a son. But I would be fine if my mother in law moves in with us or moves closer to us. We haven’t checked the immigration rules yet but if she cannot get here then I would go and move to her before I would let him put her away to be tended to by strangers. That said, we both understand how strange this is to upper middle class white culture in the US.

R131 The mammoni culture(theadukt boys spoiled rotten by their mothers) is so bad in Italy that the government tried to have incentives to have them move out! There is no other culture that matches the overbearing nature of the Italian mother with her sons. I've known Italian men to say " Guarda La Bella Mamma ( look at my beautiful mama)" in front of everyone and not even say that about their girlfriend,wife or side piece!

R127 Have you been to Italy? I don't think so from your answer. In Italy guys live very close to their mom even after they get married! Mamma does their wash and cooks for him.Meanwhile the wife can't stand the competition!

I don’t know how I missed this thread, lol. I’m Italian-American, gay, and live 30 minutes away from my parents. I visit twice a week with Sunday being a must if I am not working. My mom is not at all overbearing though or the screaming, gesticulating mama type. Maybe that is more of an east coast culture thing.

She would just love it if I moved back home though, but come on, I am not bringing dudes home to mom and dad’s, lol. I like my own privacy and space.

We have more important things to worry about than adults being close to, and caring for, their parents.

OP, post a pic of you in your house dress with some used Kleenex in the pockets.

Extra points if you're making lasagne

[quote] Guess who’s moving in? —Mama

Somebody needs to make this a sitcom. A pushy elderly Italian lady moves in with her son and his WASPy BF. Hilarity ensues.

I’m Italian American - both sides - 55. Grew up in NYC with grandparents in different boros. Growing up in the 70s my dad’s parents came over our house every Sunday - not for dinner - usually just a few hours in the afternoon - their other son lived near us so they also spent some time there each Sunday.

My mother HATED it (I found out years later). She said we could never go anywhere on a Sunday - not even for a drive. Her parents lived about the same distance away, but they would only visit once a month or so.

I was close to all my grandparents, but understood my mom’s frustrations. She has always been very good about giving me my space - my parents are there for me when I need them, but never overbearing. I go home for Sunday dinner about once a month - by public transit it takes over an hour to get from my apt to my parent’s house - they know it is a schlep for me to visit.

What I am bad about is calling. “Boys don’t call” is the joke my mom makes to my sisters. They both talk to her every other day or so - I only call maybe every other week. I tried to do it weekly for awhile but slacked back off. I asked my sisters “what the hell do you talk to her about?” But they both have kids so I guess there is always something.

Mom is 80 & dad is 85 - I know they won’t be around too much longer. I really do like my mom, and my dad means well but we are very different people so he and I aren’t very close. This thread has made me decide to see them a bit more than usual going forward.

This is the reason I prefer dating WASPs. Everyone else is far too attached to their relatives.

I’d watch that show, R138.

You have a problem with your partner's attachment to his/her relatives? You're just jealous. Get over it. Or better yet, get out.

I still want to know what the old italian mamma is sending you in those tupperwares, OP.

I'm going to guess a variety of Sunday gravy, pastas, meatballs and such.

There was a Europe-wide survey done about 10 years ago, when they asked thousands of people with whom they preferred to go on vacation.

Most people said their partner, many said a good friend or group of friends, or their own nuclear family (partner + kids). Only Italian men said that the person with whom they most liked to go on vacation was their mother.

OP, is your bf one of those incrediblly hot guido muscleheads. Whats he do for a living. Just curious.

What are “tupperwares”?

My boyfriend visits his mother (and other family when he can) at least 2, up to 4 days a week, depending on if his father (out of town) visits of if events are on. Its fine. Lebanese. Short drive. He has no intention to forever live with them and is not against moving to another city.

Honestly I like the break, knowing at least a few days a week are on my own and free of planning.

My parents don't live here and I call them only once a month or longer.

R148, what type of coffee table does his father have?

His mother will always be his mother. Your relationship with him can change on a dime. Choose your battles, and go with the flow on this one.

Invest heavily in your relationship with your partners parents. My mother in law has been a godsend to me. Both his parents were in many respects better to me than my own parents.

That doesn’t diminish my love for my own parents. But my partner’s parents were always there for us. Anything they could do to help. Knowing they were welcome and wanted - they visited frequently and helped us with an awful lot. When we bought our first house, they came and helped with a lot of plumbing, electrical and construction that saved us thousands. I learned to love and trust them totally. Through them, we built a close relationship with all the German relatives and visited them and they have visited us.

My partner’s brothers and sisters have been a nonstop source of joy. That seems improbably when you think how often family conflict plays out in marriage issues. But, I think my partner’s family helped us a lot in our relationship. We’ve done a lot together, planned huge surprise parties and vacations together over the years.

When we got married - our families came to Canada to be there. That’s the kind of love and dedication you get with family. At this point in my life, I don’t think I’d be with someone who didn’t have a strong relationship with his family. He’s a man of character if he does..

I want R111 to marry me. If he's not available, I'll take R151.

R145 - that is priceless.

HELp him take care of his mom.

Dump him before he dumps you. But steal his mother's spaghetti recipe first!

R155, see R42 and decide among yourselves whether it should be the lasagne or spaghetti recipe.

He's not my boyfriend, but he's a tribal Italian (1st gen eyetalian-american) friend I keep at arm's length due to the way he behaves. Today is a case in point.

We have tickets to go to a fair, and we planned to go today. He blew me off, failing to respond to my texts until a few minutes ago which is when I remembered this thread. When he finally responded, it was to announce he had to take his momma to the doctor instead of going to the fair. Then he tried to argue that we didn't really plan on going today, which isn't true (this is a typical manipulation of his).

His momma drives her own car, and when pressed, I learned that this was a routine checkup and flu shot, nothing requiring an escort. Momma drives herself to work and doctors when her son doesn't have the day off.

The problem is that these tribal types devalue the time, efforts and needs of others who aren't part of the clan. My friend has long quit whining about never having had a LT relationship. And I probably won't bother making plans with him again for a long time.

My friend had a heart attack last year. The doctor has urged him to make changes to his diet. But he hasn't. The reason is because his mother cooks ALL his meals and packs his lunches, at age 49. The food isn't appropriate for him, but he doesn't have the heart to spell it out to his momma that her cooking is killing him. They don't live together, but the food is so accessible because they both live in the same condo building. For awhile, he pretended to want me to help him plan healthy meals. Although I've known him for years, he kept it hidden for a long time that his mother does all his cooking, because he says that others usually react negatively to the news. Eventually I figured out he wasn't serious and he fessed up about his mother's cooking.

My sister is married to one of these. She works 50 hours a week. The entire eyetalian family lives within 3 miles of each other - they're up each others asses constantly. She has no time to shop or clean or relax on the weekends because every weekend is filled with obligatory nephews' soccer games and cousins' birthday parties and confirmations, and the occasional funeral for more distant relatives.

My sister has taken to arbitrarily declaring 2 weekends a month no-family-events weekends because she's exhausted. The younger members often help the older ones out with things, but my sister has noticed that although she is included in events and hosts them occasionally, she doesn't benefit from any of the concrete assistance many of the eyetalians provide each other (we are not eyetalian).

In addition to the above, both these clans have lots of drama. It isn't all lovey-dovey and helping each other out. There are exaggerated responses to trivial events and overinvolvement in others' emotions and circumstances. It is draining. Curiously, my sister's MIL has been sorta booted from the clan because even for an eyetalian she is far, far too demanding and manipulative.

Such tribalism is constructive when the socioeconomic sphere is unstable - family looks after each other. But it's not useful in a more modern egalitarian society, because it's too insular, too nepotistic, and too emotionally charged with heavily enforced fealty and matriarchy.

My Italian grandmother (Mom’s mom) was over for dinner most nights for cocktails and dinner for at least 20 years. My Dad must have had the patience of a Saint. God bless them all, I miss them.

R158, was your dad not Italian?

No, R159, Dad was German.

[quote]Have you been to Italy? I don't think so from your answer. In Italy guys live very close to their mom even after they get married! Mamma does their wash and cooks for him.Meanwhile the wife can't stand the competition!

Yes, this is all true. It’s not uncommon for the entire family to even live in the same house or on the same property.

R161, that’s got to be tough for Gay guys.

R157 - that is a very insightful critique . As an Irish person entrenched in the clannish family lifestyle that is rooted in centuries of near poverty enmeshed with Catholic and maternal guilt, I see it as a dated concept but have difficulty breaking free from it without explicitly isolating or rejecting my family. My husbands American family has no such issues and it been an education to see the difference in attitudes towards family.

R151 is taken r152, but I'm willin'.

I wonder if mental illness, primarily depression, is less prevalent in these tight clans? I does sound exhausting, stifling and annoying, but also quite nice at the same time-- to have so many close relatives and all that family support and connection.

I would go bonkers If my family descend on me everyday

I think OP has gone silent

If the guy and his mother go right to her bedroom, then yes, these visits might be excessive.

R165 - I think there is as much mental illness. But there is much less loneliness and feeling abandoned - and perhaps less depression from isolation. As part of a clannish family, it drives me crazy and creates stress. But there is never a doubt that someone will be there for me and I never feel alone or dependent on my partner for my needs. When I read so many DL comments about fear of being alone and depression and isolation, it reminds me that being part of this intense clannish family at least prevents that from happening. Isolation breeds depression.

Isn't this the way most of humanity has lived throughout history? The American way is what is new, along with its lack of a sense of community. It's not how we were meant to live, and it's not healthy.

It is reassuring how many here do appreciate a close family. I think this would be excessive only if he was spending the night, or not including you OP. I've grown up amongst many Italian families in London, and they are almost identical insofar as the cooking, and Sunday dinner w/leftovers. My own family is Jewish and Irish and we have many similarities to Italian families. It is true we do in fact marry our partners' families... Try to put forth more of a concerted effort OP, and make the best of it.

Why are all Italian mothers so overbearing?

Why are all Italian men such big mama's boys?

R172, not all Italian moms are overbearing. My mom is very loving but quiet and low-key. Talia Shire in appearance and some of her roles reminds me of her actually. It’s very rare for her to ever raise her voice.

As for the mama’s boy thing, there is something to that. My brothers fit this profile. To some extent, I do, too, if you consider a man visiting his mom twice a week a mama’s boy. These days, I do more for her than vice versa, including cooking and driving her on errands. She is not someone you want driving in city traffic.

R173 what is it that makes these guys so attached to their mothers? Lots of people have great moms, but aren't up their mom's asses. What's up with that?

R174, both my (straight) bros went straight from mom doing everything around the house for them (cleaning, cooking, laundry, ironing) to girlfriends and wives who usurped that role. So in a way my mom enabled all of that. When one of my brothers went through a divorce, he moved back into our childhood home for almost two years, nevermind that he makes a very good salary and could afford his own place. My mom couldn’t have been happier having him back home.

Ironically, with me, whom she had later than my siblings, she always taught me to be a bit more independent, teaching me cooking and household skills. Maybe she always knew I was gay and knew there would be no wife doing these roles? 😂

They go back home for the pasta, Rose.

Unless she's crawling in bed with you and your BF, OP, I don't see what the problem is.

I'll be honest, I think I would really like a husband like that. My ex grew up on the other side of the state, yet he still drives home to visit his mother every other weekend. He's talked about getting a dog or a cat, but I reminded him that I would need to look after any pets every other weekend while he was away. A good son = a good man. Good men can be hard to find. Don't try to compete with his Mom. And really, if it's just an ethnic thing (I'm not sure), then respect it: none of us get to choose our origins.

My ex is AA, and I'm German Catholic. He's just very patient, as he asks me to explain certain Catholic things that are alien to him. No judgment, just honest curiosity. When I explained to him that, during Catholic Confirmation, we had to line up and kneel down in church, while the Archbishop worked his way down the line, slapping our faces, the look of horror on his face was priceless. And I was just trying to explain to him how I picked out my third name, since he knew nothing about confirmation names, and was puzzled why I had so many names.

You momma's boys make me sick. Man up!

You will always be #2 to momma, OP.

A boy's best friend is his mother.

Yes, it's excessive!

I dumped a boyfriend because he spent too much time with his parents.

Every. Weekend. He would drive 110 mi each way to the hayfields of western Oklahoma and stay at his parents, sleeping in his bedroom that remained unchanged from his high school years. If he got out of work early, he'd leave early. A day off or 3-day weekend? Mom and Dad's house. I was the first boyfriend he took to see them.

He didn't have to worry about his weekend chores. He brought his laundry (Mom washed it), and returned home loaded down with leftovers and frozen meals, made by Mom, of course. With all that, a morning bagel and an occasional restaurant meal, and he was all figured out for the week.

His parents knew he was gay, but still spoke of him, in his 30s, as perhaps about to grow out of this phase. They referred to their son as "a single." For that reason, I had to sleep in a room separate from my boyfriend when I visited. I made a joke about bundling boards that fell on deaf ears.

What did we do out there? A lot of chores. Up and outside by 7:30 am, pulling weeds, fixing shit, remodeling shit, bringing in the fucking sheaves. It wasn't terrible, but it was odd. They didn't really interact so much as they played hobby farm.

And they didn't get along totally well. Mom and Dad were sorta condescending and passive aggressive with their son, who really was a total sweetheart (and momma's boy). I thought his dad was a closet case. They argued a lot about stupid shit. Sometimes his dad would go on these aspie rants about something, getting louder and louder as he spoke. His parents didn't take much of an interest in me personally. I was more like furniture than his son's boyfriend.

We would nearly always stay late on Sunday. We would plan to leave after lunch, but it would stretch past dinner. We'd get home late, and because we hadn't gone to see my mother, I had to catch up on my own laundry, errands and cooking during the week.

I realized this wasn't going to work for me long-term. I suggested not going one or two weekends a month. "But what would I do all weekend?" "Your own cooking and washing, and maybe spending some time with your friends." "I'd rather see my parents." "I get that, but you say you want a relationship, and that's not going to happen if all your weekends are spent with parents who are still in the closet about you. And your boyfriends might not feel like mulching cabbage on an acreage in rural Oklahoma on their days off."

I ended things quickly with him after that. We are still friends. He moved out of state for work which was good for him, allowing him to have his own interests and free time. He got a boyfriend too, and they've been together over 10 years now.

If my mum lived in this country, I'd most certainly visit her at least twice a week. I've known many Americans in the past two decades who have similar complaints their partner spends too much time with cousins or siblings too.

Once a week is more than enough unless the mother is living alone or is ill or has limited mobility. You need to live your own lives.

A visit once or twice a week R184, is perfectly reasonable. Many people are saying these adult single men are spending several days a week, nearly every entire weekend, and most evening meals with their parents. It comes down to resources, and time is a resource. How much time does a mamma's boy have to pursue other adult relationships? If the answer is, "virtually no time at all," then momma's boy's relationships outside the family will be necessarily diminished. He probably won't have a LTR, such as in the case of my italian friend mentioned in R157.

LOL this is funny. Just as I am writing this, my bf came in from walking the dog. Our elderly neighbor 3 doors down, Eyetalian American, had her husband pass away 3 months ago. She told my bf that her son is moving in to her house next weekend, because "I've been so lonely since Joe died." Never mind that she has daily visitors, can stop by the Italian restaurant she owns (operated by her children) anytime she wants, and hosts weekly Sunday dinners.

[quote]They are overbearing and guilt trippy so that their kids never end up putting them in senior homes. You never see those old bags in senior homes!

[quote]Also, little old Italian ladies all live until they are 103 years old. So if you're thinking she'll kick the bucket anytime soon, think again!

Gee, I wonder if these two things are related?

I've heard more than a few stores about comparatively-healthy seniors going severely downhill soon after entering a nursing home.

I could handle visiting a partner’s parents every OTHER week.....MAYBE.

Once a month would be better.

[quote]Our elderly neighbor 3 doors down, Eyetalian American, had her husband pass away 3 months ago. She told my bf that her son is moving in to her house next weekend, because "I've been so lonely since Joe died." Never mind that she has daily visitors, can stop by the Italian restaurant she owns (operated by her children) anytime she wants, and hosts weekly Sunday dinners.

Dude, there is a HUGE difference between having visits with people vs living with someone you love 24/7. Especially for women who raised kids, and who themselves probably came from a large family living in one home.

and how many times does he speak to mommy a day?

It all sounds so borderline incest-y...

OP this is a cakewalk.

Now had this guy been straight and nailed a hot chick his ugly sister would have made your lives a living hell.

Envious italian female family members will stop at nothing to drag a woman better than them. I mean nothing.

The women in my family have tales not to be believed. I've got some whoppers for you. My SIL at one time dated an italian from brooklyn. She's a tomboyish grace kelly look a like from Iceland. She saved the life of his sister's son and the ugly bitch attempted to turn the rescue into her fault somehow. The sister was snorting lines in the garage while unattended baby was dying.

Top in one of the most unbelievable cases of envy ever. My SIL coined the term "genetic chernobyl" after this twat and i've been using it since then. Oh and the twat's name was Gina. Genetic chernobyl Gyna.