Where Did Whitney Go Wrong?

More like, Where did Cissy and John Houston go wrong?

She was always rough. Clive Davis polished her image. Getting with Bobby just exacerbated her issues.

Fucked up religiosity kills as well. Whitney's prayer partner was Kim Burrell...

Damn, is that really her, omg, what a mess.

LOL, How much crack was she smoking to let herself get like that???

She could have had anyone in the world. It's hard to understand why she would choose Bobby. It seems like an act of extraordinary rebellion that she was never able to recover from.

Whitney was sublime. Clive pretty much crafted her public persona. She was a gorgeous canvas - super model looks and a voice from the heavens. At some point, the real Whitney just broke out of that over-manicured farce. She just said fuck it. I agree with her love of cocaine - I have not smoked it but lines are fantastic. I just assume that most of us realize that it should be utilized a few times a month if not a few times a year. Addiction is a strange thing. The addict has no sense of disrupting/ruining their life for something that in the course of a few days is not even euphoric any more - after weeks they are miserable all the time and have less enjoyment for life than your normal, take nothing/drug free neighbor. The key to alcohol and drugs is that when used sparingly it is still fun. When used all the time - the same drug that you love makes you feel miserable all the time. An addict can not sense this - the rest of us can. I think that it relates to body chemistry and innate need for being medicated at all times. Ask the Donald about his crack addiction...oops - he only snorts. Like an 8 a day...

She's looked worse. There's a shot of her with Dionne at some industry thing. Whitney looked embalmed. Dionne looked dewey in comparison.

I get the feeling that Whitney pretty much smoked crack all day, all night - every day. That has to take a toll. If nothing else - no sleep and rotted teeth will get you down.

I've seen a picture of her that some fan took at a gas station in Atlanta at 4 in the morning. A homeless person looked better. She was frequenting Atlanta crack houses at the time. How she was allowed to keep Bobbi Kris through all of that I will never understand. The Enquirer had the picture.

It is all hard to fathom. To have all that beauty, money, fame and talent. Crack must be THAT good...

I tried smoking meth twice. I never did get the excitement. I kept waiting for the huge excitement but it never came - very lame. What a confusing drug. Never have tried crack but I have no interest.

Don't forget the purple vibrator.

There's no way that's Whitney in that picture. It doesn't even look anything like her.

That is her in the picure and R8 is right -- she's looked worse.

Whitney's talent was extraordinary, and her decline was heartbreaking.

The closet does kill. I believe that was a major part of it. The public started to hear about her relationship with Robin, and Clive n Sissy weren't having it. The (true) rumours were so persistent that they didnt want her to have just any guy as a boyfriend/husband because he would've been seen as an obvious beard. They wanted Bobby Brown for Whitney because of his extreme bad boy image.

Celebrities like Whitney have me scared straight to never even look at drugs, let alone try them.

I think that is true R15 - and this pairing could not have been worse from a drug addiction standpoint. Two wealthy and entitled addicts leads to that using all day, every day lifestyle - where you loose all sense of normality and what Hell you are reeking on your body.

The Atlanta gas station

She was the mid-to-late 80's and early 90's of popular music.

I can't believe her family let her get this way, this pictures are heartbreaking.

Stars do what stars want to do. But, yeah I think that her family as a whole was shitty. Religious hypocrites at best. I am sure that her mother wanted to save her at the end but just couldn't. Addiction can not be easy to cure.

Makes you wonder if she never became famous if she would've died early

Cissy Houston was a homophobic bitch, and if Dionne outlives her I'll feel nothing but schadenfreude.

All of Cissy's kids had drug problems.

Sad.

I still can't believe Whitney and her only child are both gone. If she would've died in the early 2000s during her really wild years, it would've shocked the world more and she would've been more revered today. By the time she died, her heyday was long behind her. Michael Jackson's death, which gripped the news for weeks and weeks, was just a couple of years before Whitney's, and made her passing seem minor.

Didn't one of her brothers get her addicted to the hard stuff? Mainly so she could pay for HIS drug habit. It's difficult to have any sympathy for her family of vultures, and any at all for Cissy. Even in that unauthorized bio of Whitney, Cissy came across as a bullying cunt. I almost don't blame her two husbands for leaving her controlling ass.

Whitney's death wasn't minor, it was all over the news for weeks. Where the hell were you at, the North Pole?

She looks like somebody who could work in politics or something!

It's amazing she lived to see 48.

Meanwhile, what's Julie Andrews excuse for losing her voice? She didn't do crack, just arthritis pills.

Eating out Carol Burnett, R31...acidic puss juice. At least that's what Vicki Lawrence used to say.

I read Cissy Houston's book that was published after the death of her famous daughter, Whitney, and she gave some insights on what happened to her. Whitney was always known as a 'good girl' and after awhile there seemed to be some sort of inner rebellion to go the 'bad girl' route (which she accomplished). From being so nice, going to church, singing hymns, having a squeaky clean look and image to marrying Bobby Brown, getting careless with her image and appearance, eventually using huge amounts of drugs, losing most of her once beautiful voice as well as her money. No matter how many interventions were done, she could never bounce back. The drug addiction signaled the beginning of the end and eventually killed her. She just didn't seem to care anymore. So sad.

Beauty

She was never the good girl Clive crafted. She smoked cigs and cursed like a sailor from a young age, and started doing drugs in her teens.

Bad parents?

Drugs

Closet

Bobby Brown . Fame

Agreed R16. Luckily I didn't try certain things, learning from other people's mistakes.

I think it's harder to be an international pop star than it looks.

She was sort of my generations' Judy "Pills" Garland....only lived a year longer than Judy too :(

When a celebrity suddenly drops dead we now immediately assume it's from drugs, because it almost always is. Very sad. But they like their drugs, and have all the time and money in the world to sit back and allow addiction to take over their lives. The rest of the world wakes up at 5am to go to work, and there's no money to fuel a drug addiction.

They should put Whitney's picture up on posters in schools. She made drugs looks so unattractive that no sane person would ever touch them.

She didn't believe she could be happy.

Crack is Whack Bitchzes

So lovely! That combination of voice and beauty is unmatched.

To have such a voice and to smoke crack. That still boggles my mind.

I'm 43 and Whitney Houston was basically the Streisand of my generation in terms of talent. And, she was gorgeous.

Her self destruction stemmed from something really deep. Again, she smoked her voice out with crack. What happened? Was it the closet? Religion? Was she molested? All three? My God, it was like she was a modern day Billie Holiday.

I miss her because she somehow had an inherent sense of goodness to her. She wasn't a bad person

Mad TV almost looks like a documentary.

I wonder if Cissy ever saw any of these Madtv skits, God how embarrassing to have your daughter turn into a crack head with people laughing at her antics.

Imagine having all that and pissing it away...for drugs. Drugs are evil.

[quote]Whitney's death wasn't minor, it was all over the news for weeks. Where the hell were you at, the North Pole?

It was in the news for a couple of weeks, but NOTHING can be compared to Michael Jackson's death completely dominating the news for a better part of the summer in 2009. When Michael Jackson died, it was ALL that was reported on TV for at least a week, like nothing else was going on in the world. CNN actually had a freaking panel of anchors at his memorial service in Los Angeles. Not saying Whitney's wasn't a big deal, but it wasn't an earth-shattering, over the top scandal/ spectacle like that.

The most scandalous part might have been the leak of the photo at the funeral home, and perhaps the family drama with Bobby at her service. But nothing that warranted a huge malpractice investigation, child custody drama, a huge estate war, multiple autopsies, burial of her body MONTHS later etc. For all of Whitney's personal struggles while she was living, her death and following affairs were very well handled and out of the spotlight of public scrutiny. Im glad for that.

she was so well-spoken...

and then Wendy interviewed her

She sounds out of her head talking to Wendy, what a fucking embarrassment.

love this duet with cuz Dionne

Her voice is so horrible sounding, like she smoked a trillion cigarettes.

Posting one of my favorite videos of her singing. Very talented lady and also very beautiful before her decline.

I know someone who worked with her for several years in the 80s - I won't give the name but they have a lot of credits on Whitney's work so it's legit. She was actually a very nice, caring woman and very generous. But she was already troubled and under a lot of pressure before Bobby came along, and underneath the glamorous image she had some deep seated insecurities.

Her close female friend is now very happy in her own life and very private. She has no interest in talking to media.

If you look at Whitney's early career she was worked very hard and it must have been exhausting at times. Whitney must have seen some of the fame lifestyle when she was younger because her cousin was Dionne Warwick. That should have helped her prepare for the industry she was going into but Whitney's fame was on another scale. I don't know if anything can really prepare you for that kind of celebrity and how to stay sane.

The crazy thing is that she was really interested mainly in singing, though she would do the other work that she had to along the way.

There were some very controlling people around her and I think she was so busy trying to care for others and make them happy, she forgot to take care of herself also. When she married Bobby Brown she probably thought she could get away from some of these controlling elements in her life, but she probably just jumped out of the frying pan into the frier. Despite how bad they can be those kinds of toxic relationships can have a hold on people and she stayed too long

Wendy- The only question I ever have for Whitney is Is she high? is she High? is she High?

Wendy very emotional talking about death of Whitney. No further comment...

Wendy was one of the few to call out Whitney's BS after her Oprah interview.

It's a shame that she was surrounded by such bad people, starting with Clive Davis, who could've been a caring person and not treated her like a "product" to exploit. I will never forget hearing him call her a "product" on one of her DVDs. I believe she really was that person she portrayed in the beginning, for the most part. It was the business and those around her that ruined her.

Whitneys brother introduced her to crack.

Isn't that Pearl from 227 in OP's pic?

To add to R55 post - the level of denial around her was very frustrating. It took them years to acknowledge it - they just couldn't explain it away anymore and everyone was afraid for her life - and by then she'd already had serious issues for a very long time.

Her camp knew about it and kept trying to cover it up. The Houston family could be ruthless and anyone who dared rock the boat in any way would be cut out, including family. They were very image conscious but it all backfired on them. If she had got help sooner it may not have got as bad as it did later on, with the tabloids having a field day over it.

Whitney should have just smoked weed like cousin Dionne.

r55, I know you're the D Warren insider who disses Mariah at every chance talking about Trey doing lead vocals while Mariah was lounging around. I can spot you a mile away, goat.

Whitney's aunt, Dee Dee Warwick, was a dry run for Whitney. Her commercial success was modest in comparison to Whitney's, but Dee Dee was gay and abused substances (progressing to heroin) and had Cissy as a mentor...

If they let Dee Dee go down that road, why not Whitney? Better a drug addict than...

I don't think Bobby was selected for Whitney. I think she picked him for black credibility - she was criticised for being whitewashed from the outset - and because they were drug buddies.

R64 sorry haven't been on this site for very long, I honestly don't know what you are talking about? Not familiar with it.

Besides Whitney's music, she also contributed endless one liners to the gay vernacular, as we know it today. Between the Diane Sawyer and Wendy Williams interviews, and Being Bobby Brown, I can't even count how many of her spicy one liners have worked their way into everyday conversations.

She looked so terrible in being bobby brown, it's impossible for me to watch it., ugh, constant chain smoking cigarettes.

R65 yes heard that about Dee Dee. People respect Cissy as 'matriarch' of the family and don't like saying anything bad about her, but she could be a real piece of work. Whitney's brother Gary was often quite nasty to people. The other brother Michael is supposed to be not so bad even though he's the one who introduced Whitney to hard drugs and now he's a mess, probably because he may feel bad.

Cissy would rather have Whitney be a dead drug addict than a live gay.

Probably bad taste to post it but the Mad TV parodies of Whitney and Bobby were something else. (I still liked whitney.)

You would think that Whitney Houston was the only person in the entertainment industry who used cocaine in the 1980's and became addicted. It reminds me of Lauren Tewes mentioning that people act like she was the only person on television who did cocaine in the 1980's. Why did any entertainer become addicted to cocaine in the 1980's? Why does any singer smoke any substance?

Stevie Nix

Andy Gibb

The Pointer Sisters

Robin Williams

Steven Tyler

Corey Haim

John Belushi

Charlie Sheen

Dennis Quaid

Ryan O'Neal

Its the parents, all bad, and they turned their closeted children into addicts.

R73 - why does any president snort multiple 8 balls a day and then psycho tweet at 3 am every morning?

She was just doomed. It's not her fault.

I agree with r28. Her death was huge news, especially because of the time, place, and circumstances. There were pictures and videos of her, literally the day of. They talked about it for weeks and months even. Then it continued on because of the money drama with Bobbi Kris.

r55 thank you for that post. I always wondered how Robyn made out; I'm glad she found peace.

Mary! I know, but reading about her finally having to get out for her own self was so sad.

The closet kills.

[quote]When Michael Jackson died, it was ALL that was reported on TV for at least a week, like nothing else was going on in the world.

Her death was world wide news but do you really compare her tragic life to the circus of Micheal Jackson? C'mon.

I live down the street from where Whitney is buried and the news trucks were out there every day for almost two weeks reporting just from the cemetery.

... Oh, and our flags were ordered at half staff

[quote]Stevie Nix

Who?

She went wrong by never leaving the ghetto and it's people behind her.

Whitney was the only person you saw destroy themselves with cocaine, crack, in real time for years. She was the longest running celebrity train wreck ever until she finally died.

Yet oddly enough Whitney made her most genuinely soulful music when she cracked out. Everything before had the charm of Lionel Ritchey.

Actions should have been taken regarding Whitney's drug problem in 1989, when Robyn went to Cissy and told her Whitney liked drugs a bit too much, and was using more than the rest of us were.

R85, actions were taken... through prayer.

Whitney will always be the poster girl for crack.

Truly one of the most angelic voices ever. Didn't she have like 20 octaves or sumthin'?

Two of the biggest crack queens in heaven. I wonder if they will get their voices back there?

Her death still makes me sad.Those pictures are heart breaking, a true testament to having it all then throwing it away with both hands.

She basically boiled like a lobster in the tub when she passed out right?

I always loved how little she had to open her mouth for that gorgeous, booming voice to come belting out. I also respected that she never stooped to doing all those annoying vocal runs that became so popular (Hi, Mariah!). She didn't need any gimmicks, she had the goods.

I saw a show recently where a medical examiner went over Whitney's autopsy report. He said she had fake teeth, breast implants, and that her vocal cords were actually fine.

She spent the first half of her career building it up and becoming a beloved superstar, then the last half throwing excrement all over what she had built up.

Five days before her death, Whitney was spotted at an LA bar singing and grooving to Madonna's Super Bowl Halftime performance, and reminiscing about the good ol' days when the two would battle it out on the pop music charts. Sadly, she was at a point where the Super Bowl franchise wouldn't want to be associated with her.

At the 30 someodd second mark of this YouTube video, Whitney Houston spontaneously sings opera properly as a mezzo soprano for a wee bit. She could sing anything.

Overrated and her natural voice was always digitally enhanced. We agree that she could hold a candle to the real Voice -Ms Barbra Streisand!

R83 please see Courtney Love

Courtney was not as big a star as Whitney, my great aunt knew who Whitney was, she would not have ever heard of Courtney.

Whitney was pretty dykey-looking before Clive Davis made her get a makeover.

Whitney used drugs for years before she met Bobby Brown, but she was able to keep it a a recreational-only level, and it didn't affect her career. After she hooked up with Bobby is when she became a full-blown addict and everything went to shit.

r31, Julie Andrews lost her voice because of botched vocal surgery.

She should have followed Robyn's example, she has a wife and kids, lives a private life, I saw a picture of her at Bobbi Kris funeral in Atlanta. I loved when Whitney hung out with Robyn.

Whitney was so eerily perfect when she first became famous. That beauty combined with that voice and musical pedigree seemed too good to be true. She came off as effortlessly glamorous and soft spoken and sharp in interviews. Her only flaw was a penchant for cheesy pop songs that were not worthy of her voice. We know now a lot of that was facade--she was heavy into cocaine early on. But for many years she was able to keep her shit together. It seems like after the birth of Bobbi Kristina was when she started to go off the rails. She was in the midst of The Bodyguard movie and soundtrack hype and went on a huge world tour right after the baby's birth. I wonder if her drug use intensified because of that plus struggling to lose the weight to be ready for the tour. And then Bobby Brown's legal troubles started ramping up hard. Just a perfect storm of pressure and expectations and mess.

She wanted to stay home with her baby, but Clive and company wanted her to tour which is understandable as a business decision. She also made her money touring, since she didn't write the big hits.

Ariana sings it better than Whitney.

When is someone going to write a REALLY good book about her? All the current biographies out there are ass-kissing.

How is this enhanced, hater above ?

She's loosing her top notes at a very young age R105

I miss Whitney Houston in a way. Never met her but miss her all the same. I'm of her era and she was blessed but couldn't see that for herself.

Listening to her mother.

The Closet kills.

She really looks like a crack ho in OP's pic.

The answer to the OP's question is drug addiction.

She needed to be in residential treatment for 6 months to a year, the one month stays weren't working.

Bobby Brown is still the King Of Stage y'all! When was his last hit again?

I shouldn't be mean but damnit. He did bring a lot on himself and whenever anyone would try to advise him better he always just gave the bird and kept right on partyin'. It all catches up sooner or later. He's in sad shape now but was broke a few years ago, so he had to keep performing or doing tell alls where he repeatedly changes his story.

She honestly is the poster child for sad declines. She literally had it all - a voice from the heavens (and still not really matched), the looks of a stunning supermodel, an X factor that is hard to quantify but easy to qualify, and just a ton of luck that landed her right into the sweet spot of fame from her fans and the public. She is hard not to love - so gorgeous and so talented and so sweet in her early years. It would have been best for her to just hide from public life once she succumbed to addiction, but she thrived on that public adoration and ultimately = all of her millions she smoked through a pipe. What do you say? Let's try to remember her gorgeous, talented years and leave it at that. It is what she would have wanted.

I think if she was allowed to be herself more when she was young, she wouldn't have been so self destructive for so long. I mean plenty of rock stars conquered drugs through rehab, no biggie. It was more than just the gay thing too. Like someone said up the thread, she was perfect when she hit it big. It looked like it pained her to be so perfect all the time, following all of Clive's instructions, being a prize show pony 24/7. That must be more difficult than any drug addiction. Britney Spears is a great example. Beyonce was the same way when she was younger, but for her dad. But Beyonce actually got to be creative and make music she wanted to make. By the time Whitney got to do that, she was already too far off the deep end.

R115 She really is the poster child for sad declines and her marriage is like the anti-marriage cautionary tale of all time. What a horrific, soul crushing waste of time and energy. And she gave it her all or at least played the part. I pray to never end up in a relationship like that. It left her broken while Bobby turned around and remarried and had more kids.

She was very good in The Bodyguard and Waiting to Exhale. It's sad to watch those movies now knowing that at the exact time she was ascending into movie roles, she was also falling deeper into drugs and Bobby and poor choices. All of a sudden the movies abruptly stopped and that was it. Watching her in Waiting to Exhale playing a successful career woman in her 30s, you see a glimpse of what could have been. That's the movie where I really look at her and wonder what the hell happened, how did she veer off so quickly.

r117, Whitney's marriage wasn't anything you'd want to emulate, but I don't think Bobby or her relationship with him is really what did her in. If you watched Being Bobby Brown, she was pretty much just along for the ride, high, just not really all there mentally. I think she would've been a mess if she was single or with someone else. She was divorced from Bobby for five years when she died, and she was still battling her own personal demons.

True, she definitely"hid" in that marriage instead of facing her issues.

[quote]but she obviously was in love with Bobby.

See, I never really got that. I saw it as r120 says - she was hiding in that marriage from a myriad of things, and there was a desperation in her clinging to him that I think a lot of people took for some ferocious love. It reminds me of something I read about Patti Smith's relationship with Robert Mapplethorpe - that he begged her not to leave him: 'If you do, I'll become gay.' Well, of course he was gay and damn well knew it, but with Patti he could deceive himself. IMO Whitney knew that if she no longer had Bobby as her drug buddy/shield against the world, all the stuff being held in was going to burst forth.

Untreated PTSD.

I wasn't a big fan of her at the time based on what I heard on the radio. I was probably one of those people who thought she was 'overrated' but I'll never forget turning on TV just on time one day to see her perform the national anthem. I got a chill - you knew it was a defining moment.

I also love the video with her and Pavarotti I just wish there was more of it! She hits such a clean strong note and even Pavarotti is like :O

I often prefer her live performances to her studio versions. When she first recorded 'Saving All My Love' she was supposed to have sounded like a young Aretha and very soulful. But Clive apparently complained that he didn't like it - it was 'too black' sounding and she had to record it again. Whitney's mother Cissy had of course tried her own solo career but never got a mainstream breakthrough. So I think they were prepared to follow Clive's advice to get a successful debut record.

Between 92-94 she seemed at her peak vocally, also really maturing as a performer, and it's a shame that couldn't continue. She recorded a concert with classic standards in 97 and it should have been great. But she was obviously having issues by that time. If not for her decline on drugs it could have been so very different.

And yes - all those pictures of her looking so terrible were real and they were horrifying.

I can understand that she wanted to shed some of the sanitized early image but was sad when she started behaving in such a stereotyped ghetto trash manner. Part of it was probably influence of drugs because when she was doing better in recovery she seemed quite different. She could be quite classy and elegant when she wanted to be - like her cousin Dionne.

I liked her but am still shocked how "great" a singer people found her. I didn't Yes, a big, huge power ballad voice, but I find her really disconnected to the music, just power-belting through them. I always found her singing quite empty, which is not to imply she couldn't sing big loud money notes.

Agree @ R124. She seemed emotionless and stoic to me.

She had bi polar just like Bobby, but like being gay that was unacceptable to Cissy.

You can't tease out bi-polar from drug addiction so easily, R126. Both bring the crazy.

You're crazy if you thought it was Bobby Brown who corrupted Whitney with drugs. It was the complete reverse.

Brown was a cocaine addict before he ever met Whitney.

And Whitney wasn't?

[quote]She could be quite classy and elegant

[quote]- like her cousin Dionne.

Both were addicts, they got worse thanks to Whitney's money, buying kilo's of coke.

I think the Diana Sawyer interview was the biggest public relations failure in entertainment history.

Bless Whitney . She is in a better place.

I hope the rest of the Houston women stay away from bathtubs.

I absolutely believe Whitney and Robin could have been lovers, but I do not believe Bobby was her beard. If she wanted a fake romance/marriage for cover, she had plenty of better options. Anyone who saw 5 minutes of that "Being Bobby Brown" mess knows that was a legit and completely dysfunctional marriage. This clip is hilarious, with her nonstop bitching about how Bobby's nieces and nephews are ruining her Mother's Day, although there is a really sad moment when she talks to Bobbi Kristina about her getting married someday.

Why did she sweat like a fat kid at recess?

Crack/cocaine gives you the sweats.

Whitney was so fucking gross on that show, she must have been so out of it to allow herself to be seen like that. What other A list celeb destroyed themselves so thoroughly as Houston?

Judy. Whitney really was the colored Judy.

[quote]What other A list celeb destroyed themselves so thoroughly as Houston?

Yeah—hic!—I wonder—(cough)—who—(haaaRAAAALPHH!).

Poor Krissi, she had no chance with those two fools as parents. I was shocked at the time that the State didn't remove her from their home.

Lindsay was not the talent or superstar that Whitney was.

Mariah is getting there, just a different kind of gross.

That "reality" TV show she did was just fucking embarrassing and very likely fed into her destructive behavior if not actively encouraged it.

LiLo was merely a cute child star who predictably got entrenched in drugs. SHe was never in the Pantheon of great actors. Whitney was a genuine musical legend. It would be as if Meryl Streep got hooked on heroin. I agree Whitney is the modern black Judy Garland.

[quote]That "reality" TV show she did was just fucking embarrassing and very likely fed into her destructive behavior if not actively encouraged it.

It was also the funniest reality show to date.

Excuse me!

Nice try Anna, but at your peak everyone still knew you were gilded trailer park trash.

Whitney's vocal flaws got the better of her. Look at the way she shakes her microphone back and forth, then see how she lets the saxophonist take over.

Compare that to Aretha who could still keep it going twice as long at Luther Vandross's funeral:

She never took care of her voice, chain smoking cigs, never did vocal exercises.

Luther Vandros is dead?

Damn Ree Ree looks bad. Another funeral Whitney missed due to being pissed at her mother for getting a court order to get her into rehab.

R150 yeah she lost a lot of her basic singing skills from drugs and maybe laziness. But early on you could see she was exceptionally trained. Here she starts off rushed and clearly nervous, but once she settles into the song you can see she could control her voice impressively.

Did she bleach herself?

I agree that Whitney didn't take care of her voice - no singer can be a chain smoker and maintain their rang and vocal stamina. She did have a gorgeous voice though - while she perhaps was not professionally trained, she did develop her voice as a child and teen through the years of singing at her church. Having a mother who was a singer and a cousin who was an actual star didn't hurt. The training was there one way or the other. Even her speaking voice used to be heavenly. She was a decent actress and could have been great - her voice was sultry and really pulled you in. I don't know the effects of smoking crack 24/7 - but it can't be good; the cigs alone could kill her voice over decades of abuse, however. That is pretty much a known fact. I remember during the 80's with all the hair metal - the lead singers who were smart might have snorted coke and shot heroin, but avoided smoking anything (cigarettes or drugs).

rang = range, sorry.

I read a story in a magazine in which Whitney's drug dealer who called himself "Uncle Rob" (not her real uncle) was interviewed. He sold a lot of drugs to Whitney and said that after awhile she would come over to his place, look in his windows, and start to sing and talk through the windows in a crazy manner. After awhile he had enough, phoned Bobby Brown and demanded that he come over, get his wife and take her home. It's pretty bad when even your own drug dealer doesn't want you around.

In the early 2000s Whitney's drug addiction had spiraled so out of control that she was visiting crack houses in the ghetto in Atlanta. True story.

Someone in Bobby's family sold pictures of Whitney's bathroom to the tabloids. It was a disgusting mess, including a scorched crack pipe out in the open.

The only episode of Being Bobby Brown that was hard for me to watch was the Christmas special. Whitney looked and sounded way worse than she did when they taped the original show. I think this was her lowest point, she looked completely out of her mind and like she hadn't slept for weeks.

I know Miss Phaedra Parks, who can be seen hanging around with Pat in Whitney's kitchen, was thinking to herself what a mess she was.

Whitney's Drug Den!

Would it be in bad taste to ask if she snorted crack out of silver spoons?

r163, I didn't want to believe the infamous drug den story at the time, because Tina Brown just wanted money and it was a silly Enquirer story. But Cissy and Whitney herself confirmed it years later, that last Oprah interview. That show @ r162 was taped in 2005, when Cissy said Whitney was at her lowest. I wonder if that's the house the 'drug den' was in.

The above poster who said that Whitney needed to be in an inpatient facility for 6 months to a year was correct. That's what happened to Natalie Cole, and the only way she was finally able to get clean.

Pat Houston is one evil person. Stood around watching Whitney kill herself, now with Krissi gone too, Pat is rich beyond what she ever could have imagined.

I haven't heard anyone mention Whitney since her death except for when Bobbi Kristina was going through her own medical emergency. It seems like her legacy doesn't have staying power.

She sang mostly schlock. I shit better songs than the Greatest Love of All. It seemed brilliant at the time but she's really just a slightly more tragic Laura Branigan.

Since she was so wrecked the last 12 years of her life, couldn't sing, seemed high in public, it's no wonder her legacy is largely ruined. The reason for her fame, her voice, was gone.

Elizabeth Taylor's estate makes more money than Whitney's.

That's part of the tragedy--that she was down and out for so long her legacy is ruined. She should have aged out of the cheesy pop schlock and made some great R&B and gospel albums, but by the time she stated making inroads there, it was too late.

Whitney didn't write her own songs - this was part of the issue with her not making the money that she could have. Actually, almost everyone considers her voice to be one of the all time greatest. I have heard little dispute to this - except for those who are just ragging on her later decline and drug addiction. She was easily the talent that Micheal was from a voice perspective - most would say far better. He had the creative that she never possessed however. She really was not a business woman at all either. She had little drive in her career - it was driven for her until she fell to pieces. Her looks and voice were a 10/10 at her peak, but she did not have any real interest in the music business IMHO. When addiction took over, she made it her only priority.

Whitney was extraordinarily smart, you could see this in her early interviews. As a teen she was poised and could always carry a conversation with virtually anyone - that is a gift. By her own admission she listened to the experience around her - compared to other young women Whitney knew the game before it started - not to mention that it was EFFORTLESS for her. That is a rare amongst female vocalists.

She knew music, but it has been said that she was far too sheltered by her family and it hurt her badly when confronted with serious problems. Sexuality and Drug addiction could not be prayed away. Robyn Crawford said Whitney was in the "Drivers seat," so we believe that. She seemed very happy in the 80's with Crawford, friends that knew their home life said they appeared to be very much in love, Robyn was kind, approachable, protective in a lovingly healthy way. For nearly 22 years Crawford was understanding, utterly loyal and ultimately could no longer standby as Brown dragged Whitney to hell.

Her involvement with Brown was a shock. Reports have surfaced from witnesses that Brown (for a million reasons) began "running Whitney down" and denigrating her as a "Pop Star." So the guy that she married for Street Creds in private life all but called her Whitey! That little Bitch Brown - one hit wonder - was so insecure is it any wonder she turned to drugs in the mid '90's? From a domneering Mother, to running her own show with a trusted beloved partner & very competant biz associates that totally supported her, to a Bad Boy Man Child she loved but was so insecure she had to Elevate him to "Man of Everything."

All the gossip, the emergence of ACTUP, outing of powerful people that neglected the suffering of the LGBT community - Whitney was no way dumping this guy after 2 years of marriage. (She told Oprah she was ready to call it off within a year of the marriage). Bisexual that she surely was, she still had that thing women do that want to "fix those Bad Boys."

She told us why she ramped up the drug escapism:1) hounding Fame 2)Contractual & financial obligations to the Brand and Family 3) Endless tension from her childish, self medicating Bi-Polar husband vs Crawford who prob did her best to keep the peace 4)SUPREME LOVE OF HER DAUGHTER WHICH WAS PROB ALL SHE REALLY CARED ABOUT. Brown routinely embarrassed her in the media - she couldnt catch a BREAK from this guys behavior. Still she loved him. Even today he still blames their marriage for his mediocre career and surely would have dragged her to hell as would his mentally ill lunatic sisters if she left him.

Whitney did a tremendous amount of good in this world - she deserves to be remembered for more than the health problems she suffered in her later years. Whitney remains the Gold Standard for female vocalists, surely this will be the same in decades to come. Whitney smashed the Music industry's racism and stereotyping of African American singers. Whitney made the Bey's, Mariah's happen.

Whitney deserves more compassion for the beauty she contributed to the music, television and film world than this thread delivers.

R174 I never got the impression Whitney was smart.

It seems to me that Whitney got addicted to drugs early in her life, and it became a controlling demon she never could shake. I believe she was a teen when she began.

And she didn't/couldn't stop when she was: with her girlfriend, when she was with Bobby Brown, (somehow she successfully had a daughter but she also had miscarriages), she didn't stop after she divorced Bobby Brown, when she was in ghastly health.....the drugs controlled Whitney almost her entire life.

Whitney was using and boozing and hitting the lez bars in Manhattan when when she was just a teen. She wanted mostly to be an actress. She modeled to pay the bills while trying to make the acting thing work out. The singing came easier so she followed that route. She had great vocals, a little bit of good material, and a whole lot of success as a pop star. Then her demons just came out of the bottle and she had no one around her who really gave a shit. It's not a complicated story and she really wasn't a saint. There's no need to turn her into something she wasn't.

Robyn was probably the only one she ever had in her life who gave without taking anything. When that was over so was Whitney. Pretty sad.

I'm glad to see that people actually know the truth about Whitney. I so often hear the "good church-going girl led astray by evil rapper Bobby" story and nothing could be further from the truth. The DL knows the truth of it, as usual.

She was so beautiful, so poised. When she wore that white dress and sang "One Moment in Time" at the Grammys, backed by a full orchestra ... perfection.

Link to performance:

If it were told honestly it would make a great movie or TV series. They would probably just, well, whitewash it.

Sweaty and high, two days before her death...

Aside from her skeletal frame at the 2001 Wacko Jacko Tribute, Whitney's voice is cracking and flat.

And she lived for eleven more years...

On a different note, Usher is gay.

Here is a video of Whitney from 2009. She looks great and her singing is fine. It is hard to believe in three short years her voice would be shot and she looks 20 years older.

Oops. Sorry, here is the video.

Insane stan at R184 / R185 - Whitney can't even breathe or sing!

Her backing vocalist is singing all of the louder and higher notes.

Whitney is sweating like it's 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004... STILL.

No, you are the Weakest Link when it comes to providing compelling evidence that Whitney "looks great and her singing is fine."

She's stumbling around drunk!

I wonder how the leeches she was supporting or getting by now.

R186 In that video I posted she looks great. I didn't say she looked sober. It is quite a big difference between what she looked like in 2009 and what she looked like in 2012. Also, yes she was a little bit out of breath, but that is to be expected considering she was a smoker and she is moving around. You are the weakest link to reality buster.

Buster?

Frau.

Whitney didn't go wrong, rather Hollyweird chewed her up and spit her out. OP, do some research on Clive Davis and his cabal before you drag some poor soul who had no idea what she was getting into and had no way of getting out. Ever wonder why with all her money and fancy houses the the only place Whitney felt safest was hiding in a tiny closet? And no, it wasn't because of the drugs. You people are woefully unaware about how sick this world truly is and it's a shame.

OMG, please tell us R190 what a terrible world it is.

^drag some poor soul through the mud

The leeches she was supporting like Pat, Gary, Michael, Cissy are now rolling in the dough thanks to Krissi dying. It's all so sad.

[quote]I wonder how the leeches she was supporting or getting by now.

Miss Dionne is doing just fine. Her fine emcee skills at Nippy's funeral kick started a second career for the old bat

Are you going to tell us that big gay Clive Davis fucked Whitney into crazyland when she was young, R190?

Sweetheart, Whitney was a street rat druggie/drinker when she was a young teen all on her own. She didn't need Clive Davis or Bobby Brown or anyone else to turn her into a drug addict. If you want to find a problem in her life, look to her parents.

Here's the thing. The pressure on a pop star is unthinkably intense and unrelenting. The performance levels to maintain, the hits to produce, the people around you trying to get your money, the hangers on, the legal stuff, the suits, the paparazzi, the obliteration of family personal and private space, the need to look good always, the nasty gossip and lies. You get the picture.

That's why, drugs.

Helen Lawson, at R190, using Starbucks free WiFi to post from the streets. Remember when you tried to get Whitney to duet with you on a reissue of that fucking tree song you sing? She beat the crap out of you didn't she?

"The nasty gossip and lies"?

Like she was a Lesbian and a drug addict?

ALL TRUE!

Multi-year winner of the Neely O'Hara Award for gratuitous celebrity flame-out.

Re R124 'I liked her but am still shocked how "great" a singer people found her. I didn't Yes, a big, huge power ballad voice, but I find her really disconnected to the music, just power-belting through them. I always found her singing quite empty, which is not to imply she couldn't sing big loud money notes.'

I used to feel the same way - that she lacked 'soul'. But her live performances could be very powerful. In the early studio days she was discouraged from singing that way which was a shame.

If it hadn't been for drugs I think she would have continued developing naturally as a singer and had a lot more to give.

I also thought that she was just a power-belting singer but she did have a softer more mellow tone that was reminiscent of her cousin Dionne.

She was just a great marketing package. I great product. People don't want to believe it but singers like Whitney are a dime a dozen. Are they the total package? No. Whitney was.

Whitney was the total package - and very rare that someone has her spectacular looks and talent - sure couldn't say that about Babs, Mimi, or anyone. Yes her live performances are outstanding, and what have built her legacy.

As someone posted earlier, Whitney was nothing more than a recreational user through ALL the 80's. When she had a tour, she knew everyone's livelihood depended on her and she was gravely serious about her role. Yeah a partier when home. Whitney was in and out of rehab. Posters that think of these events as relapse miss the science of Medicine - Whitney would have needed 5 or 6 stints and or 6mos. She was slowly beginning to understand that every relapse was ultimately building to success. She was reportedly headed to rehab in 2012. She would have made it. And I agree, she had so much more to give the world, mentoring, producing, etc.

Was Robyn still in contact with Whitney?

Maybe someone knows, pure speculation but bandmembers of such seismic experiences as touring with her probably are inclined to stay in touch. Band members showed up for her funeral - why wouldnt she stay in touch with Robyn? Little Bitch Brown did say in his book that Whitney would have lived a better life if she had been able to keep Robyn IN her life, and that she Really needed a trusted friendship like that.

r194: I got your number, hussy.

I always thought Bobby was a homosexualist.

Ghetto Whitney will cut a bitch!

Whitney was surrounded by homophobic cunts like Cissy and Kim.

A co-worker of my brother's who went to her high school claims Whitney was into drugs then. Which in and of itself is not the end of the world, but she was no angel when she came on the scene, she just looked like one. Sad. She was so gorgeous and so talented. Something went very wrong.

She really was fucking gorgeous.

And there is asshole Pat enabling Whitney into the cemetery

Did they ever find out who sold these? It was probably Cissy.

Then there was her cunt of a mother always calling her Nippy. It wasn't some loving nickname it was to demean her. I remember the few times I saw Whitney cringe at the name during interviews.

I doubt if one more rehab would have worked. How many times was she in rehab, they never worked because she could never admit she was an addict.

Many think that she and Bobby both were bisexual and that they served as a beard for each other. Both were massive drug addicts before they met - so at best - they enabled each other. I agree with the above poster who said that her money made their addiction unstoppable. I agree. As is often the case, if you are a user who cannot display any self-control - you spiral into an all day, all night, all morning, every day sort of habit. It happens to millions, we just find it shocking when it happens to a celebrity. Whitney was stunningly beautiful and tremendously talented in her early years. More importantly, she was hugely successful. This makes her story more shocking but not uncommon.

Pat and Raffles sold the coffin picture.

It's sad that Whitney worked all her life to support leeches like Gary, Bobby (for a time), that bitch Patricia (who has to have her name on every single Whitney release since her death) and Whitney's own mother.

And then Whitney's only daughter dying following her death. That family was toxic for both of them.

Her mother called her "Nippy?" Why was that? How did she come up with that horrid nickname? No wonder Whitney started taking drugs!

Whitney didn't want to stop using drugs, she loved being high, no amount of rehabs would have changed that.

Chaka Khan loved drugs too r219.

She must have, but then she had lost so much of her voice - I think she would have done anything to recover what she could of the old magic. Including sobriety. Right, Chaka and Natalie both could have been supportive. That idiot Kim Burrell just kept telling her to pray it away. Just as stupid as she is about LGBT bigotry.

Nippy? Like nipples? What an awful name. I would hate that.

Nippy was from some comic character that kept getting into trouble, according to cissy's book.

She was face down in six inches of water and didn't turn around.

What is your point R220? Chaka didn't lose her voice or looks to drugs

Had she fallen slightly to the side not in the water, she would have survived. Her injuries were minor but for that.

And Chaka is still alive and now sober.

Chaka's interview with Piers Morgan after Whitney's death was so insightful. She talked about a time she, Bobby and Whitney were smoking up. She talked about the occasion like it was a happy memory. She also gave insight into how Whitney was used and how the people around her could have let her stay at the hotel a week leading up to the party. She also shaded Clive.

r226 unless, of course, someone made sure that's how she landed.

She needed a real SOB to say no and kick all the hangers-on out of her life, family included. Not that I condone Peter Grant's behaviour, but someone like that would've kept her alive.

r228 I thought she shaded Clive for going ahead with the party, not necessarily his treatment of her during her career. IIRC, Chaka also said in another interview that Whitney would always say she's a grown ass woman and no one could tell her anything.

In that Piers Morgan interview, Chaka Khan also said that if you bring a known substance abuser out to do an event, you bring them out the day of the event or the night before. Chaka said this is an unwritten rule in the Industry and she couldn't believe they brought Whitney out several days before. Sitting in a hotel for days on end with nothing to do is the worst environment for a druggie to be in. They get bored and restless and start using.

R228 Thankfully I never became a coke addict, but I could still recall the times I used coke. I can give a glowing review of my times snorting coke in the bathroom of a gay bar.

R203 They might not have been in contact for awhile. That's the feeling I get from reading the tribute that Robyn wrote for Whitney. Towards the end Whitney began shutting herself away from many people - because she felt so humiliated about her own situation.

I know a friend of Robyn's but I don't ask them much because I don't want to be intrusive. All I can say is that Robyn is doing fine nowadays. She is happy in her own life.

Idk who sold the picture of Whitney in the casket. Some of you may have seen that when her daughter was in hospice someone took a picture of her and sold it to the National Enquirer. The person who was accused of that was Kelsey, Leolah Brown's son. Leolah is Bobby's crazy older sister.

Whitney's father gave her the nickname 'Nippy'. In most circumstances only the people who were very close to her called her that even though a lot of fans seem to like using the name.

Everyone probably remembers the pictures of the bathroom that Bobby's sister Tina sold to the National Enquirer with a lurid story to boot.

Tina did that in 2006 when Whitney was actually trying to get back on track and was just about done with Bobby.

Cissy suspected that the picture was an old one, not new. Whitney was very hurt by that betrayal and Tina only did it because she was hard up for cash. She was arrested for prostitution in 2007, also theft - it was probably to pay for her own continuing drug habit.

Whitney couldn't have minded her nickname too much, she had a production company called Nippy Inc.

Bobby's sisters all sound like real pieces of work.

I don't believe Whitney and Robyn had been in contact for quite some time before Whitney's death, maybe as long as a decade.

She was an angry, insecure girl who couldn't get away from her mother's domination.

Robyn told Narada that she hadn't seen Whitney in years.

Many drugs such as coke or meth are taken by a star in order to stay lean and attractive on film or in print. When you way over-indulge such as Whitney had done by the time of the Michael Jackson's 30th anniversary thing - you no longer look trim and healthy, you look like the crypt keeper. When she tried to get off them, she ballooned up and seemed fat and puffy. It is a slippery slope. THAT is only pertaining to the body aesthetics aspects of drug use. The behavioral issues are far more destructive to one's image.

I think her weight gain was due to steroids she was taking to help her voice. They reduce throat inflammation.

She was also found to have had fibroids. That may be why she got a tummy.

Bobby gained weight too and ain't sounding great these days.

Here he is decimating one of his best songs. My God this is bad.

Bobby Brown was always bad and always looked homosexual.

On the stupid reality show, Whitney may not have seemed like the smartest person. But in her better interviews she was poised and very well spoken.

When you look at it, Whitney Houston had a second to none music pedigree and background. She would be in the studio with greats like Aretha Franklin when she was a very young girl and was singing real gospel in church. She was learning from the best.

When she was in good form her singing seemed so effortless, where other vocalists would be straining or using falsetto.

She was also such a natural beauty compared to many of the songstresses around today, or people like Kim K who has made plastic surgery procedures from a young age seem almost 'routine'. Beyonce has had work done and now it is starting to show up. It's difficult to think of anyone who hasn't had significant work done by the time they are 30.

Yes, Whitney was glamorized but she always had basically good bone structure, from the beginning. She also had a fantastic complexion before drugs started taking a toll.

Lady Gaga has worked hard on her vocals and was acclaimed for her version of 'Star Spangled Banner'. But I think what set Whitney's version apart was her traditional gospel background.

Yes I know however that Whitney's vocal technique was criticized and may have caused some damage. Any singer who really wants longevity is probably well advised to have a good vocal coach.

Bobby is beyond ugly, inside and out. I never understood anyone that desired him and I definitely don't understand the young woman who is currently replicating Bobbi Kristina at an a alarming rate. What are they on, kid number 3? Who pays for that?

She was "eerily perfect" is right -- I idolized her from the minute she came on the scene. I lost interest in her gradually after her second album...and was fully done w her when she hooked up w Bobby. It's too bad she was so upset about the 'whitewashing' remarks. She had a universal appeal that most of the naysayers were probably envious of.

At least no one can claim that Whitney was "about to FINALLY get sober" right before her death like the lying parents of Amy Winehouse and the insane stans of that dead Glee queen.

Whitney was still enjoying her drugs right up to the end.

I can't get the same enjoyment out of the MadTV skits as I once did. I loved them at the time but knowing that such broad satire was so close to reality isn't as amusing, only sad. I was not a huge fan growing up. As mentioned upthread Whitney was seen by some in the African-American community as a "white-washed" version of R&B. I was one of those people. I always thought Phyllis Hyman deserved the career that Whitney got. It's strange how close their stories parallel. The other issue I had with Whitney was the closet. I was a young, out, gay woman when she came on the scene. I understood then and do now that people are in the closet for a number of reasons but I could not abide the way she denied the fact (I'm from Philadelphia so Whitney's true proclivities were well known in my circle) that she was gay. Kind of like another Clive Davis creation, Alicia Keys, did years later.

Isn't Keys "hetero-flexible" or some BS like that?

My best friend lived in Huntington Beach in 1987-1988 and worked in the film prop industry. He said that the Whitney/Kelly/Jodie story was absolutely true. He called to tell me all about it in 1987!

Like Clive, DL has its own "pink-washers" who want to hide away the gay from Whitney's history.

Whitney never, ever got over Robyn. She spent the rest of her life mourning over her, and I think she actually gave up caring about anything.

I have always loved her version of "Do You Hear What I Hear". It's the one song of hers where I really feel the emotion coming through her. I don't know much about gospel music, but if this song is an indication of what people mean when they say gospel was her true calling, I have to agree.

I think the very first song on her first album showed what kind of singer she cold have been. It's a master class in how a killer vocal can elevate a standard song. If she had continued with solid R&B like this with occasional forays into gospel, her legacy would have been untarnished.

Beyonce's career is bigger now than Whitney's ever was. Whitney was the better singer, but Beyonce dwarfs her as a performer and businesswoman.

Phyllis Hyman just had an unfortunate name. It was never going to happen.

Why does everyone forget The Bishop's Wife? That's her best movie.

Beyonce married well, R252. It's amazing how those kinds of choices can make all the difference. Not so much looks or talent.

R175 Unless you were familiar with her business projects, producing and the choice of her work colleagues you could never know the level of her acumen. Unless you actually watched a number of her interviews in the 80's/mid 90's, realized that she had no more than a high school education - you would have no idea. Just watch Mariah or Bey in interviews - ick.

Whitney personally chose the "BodyGuard" after years of offers - that was HER decision alone - BAM straight to the TOP. When she settled on "Waiting to Exhale" as her second vehicle, the thought was well of course she will do that album - but no. Houston said this was an opportunity to SHARE new female Vocal talent and spotlight the Mother Aretha - she refused to make that all about her. SHe knew she would have the chart topper - but wanted to give others opportunity. SMART and GENEROUS. That is great character. BAM straight to the top of the charts again.

She wanted a fairer representation of diversity in her young daughters television viewing habits so she produced and starred in the highest rated Live programming of the day "Cinderella." Her production relied on Broadway talent which was quite brilliant casting - she wanted people that could hold the stage on their own - Bernadette Peters and Jason Alexander. Brandy was young and fairly inexperienced - she surrounded her with talent that could support her. That show of Whitney's remains again, the gold standard for live programming.

"Princess Dairies" - yup, that series too - record shattering. She only partnered with the best, Deborah Chase Martin, and that is how you know what SMART IS.

I hate brown with the heat of a thousand suns - she had a REMARKABLE VITA, a remarkable team - Houston, Chase, Crawford. He was jealous of every breath she took. Inspite of his endless arrests, drama and ENOURMOUS DOMESTIC VIOLENCE she did these things. And still got high to get away from the pressure. And Still made Music that will live for eternity without equal.

Besides a disease, it appears that her reputation oddly enough was the most important though sadly she had no idea how to deal with it besides denial and "Standing by her man." That was where she went wrong. She needed to dump him, screw what the world thought about her issues and get help. She would have remained unstoppable and would have been alive today.

R255 don't forget she started Groupon so she could get good deals on her crack. I think that was her smartest move.

So, we now have a Whitney Stan on the Level with the Janet Jackson wacko.

R252 you cant view them as the same for you have no context in your remark. Without Whitney there was no Bey. Whitney was the FIRST most remarkable Global talent and Bey merely follows in her footsteps. To be the first is always the hardest and where the GENIUS LIES - to follow is ... only to follow the genius.

That is all. And she could sing circles around Bey.

R 257 No Alt Facts here, only documented, verifiable Entertainment history. Facts only need apply.

Agree @ R258.

There's nothing likeable about Bouncy. At least with Whitney, even at her bottom, you could like her and root for her. Rooting for Bouncy is like Rooting for a box of Wheaties. She's ALL product. I don't thinks she breathes without wondering where it will land on the charts. She takes zero chances. Parts of Whitney may have been a product but it seemed a product others were selling. Not Whitney herself. Bouncy you just wish would go away.

I've never been a fan of Beyonce, like r261 said she's all product. She's like a robot or something, and I've never cared much for her material, which I think is rather mediocre. Whitey had a warmth to her and of course was a much better singer with much better material. Off the top of my head, I can name 10 Whitney Houston songs. I think I can name maybe 3 Beyonce songs.

BTW, I'm Beyonce's generation and not Whitney's.

Another note about Whitney's intelligence - she was deeply political, very very keen on her ability to influence racial inequality in America.

Not for nothing was that HBO "Classic Whitney Concert" filmed at Constitution Hall and dedicated to Marian Anderson - one of the most celebrated singers of the 20th Century, an African American Woman that was denied permission to sing at that theater by the DAR. Whitney wanted that concert filmed there and she told the story, paid tribute to the woman that came before and inspired her own journey.

When she was finished she donated ALL the proceeds to an organization also founded by an African American Mother - Marian Edelman Wright, founder of the Children's Defense Fund. The organization that advocated for Children living in poverty, living with disabilities and fought for equal access to education for all children.

Around the same time Houston was the first and the most prominent American artist to refuse to perform in apartheid South Africa. So while Paul Simon was recording in Johannesburg - Whitney was leading by example.

Call me a Stan - but at least I know WHO to admire.

R255, You realize that she died pretty much broke, don't you? So your list of her business accomplishments is meaningless. Beyonce, Madonna and Streisand are all worth north of $500 million, while your gal died a broke crack addict.

I've seen her interviews R263. She does not come off as intelligent. You claim all these things about her, so show me the proof.

Lots of great artists die in poverty, R264, due to circumstances both in and out of their control.. Heartbreaking and tragic. You really are a cold bastard.

In fact she didnt die broke. There was ample money to split 3 ways within her family. It is rumored/reliably that she had protected her assists against Brown with both a Prenup and other means. Stop reading the Enquirer #FakeNews.

She didn't die broke, Krissi was getting 2 million a year from her estate and that was only about 10 percent of it, at 30 she would have gotten the rest. That's hardly broke.

[quote]She honestly is the poster child for sad declines. She literally had it all

She didn't have it all. She didn't think she could be with the love of her life.

Whitney was so smart she had a will instead of a living trust. I don't know how accurate, but it was wildly reported Whitney was worth $20 million when she died. Some say Clive Davis what supporting Whitney. Who knows, but after she died her estate grew by millions.

I think she was worth more than that - MORE. The only thing Clive did (he wasn't supporting her) was pay her expenses for her appearance at his events. It was reported in the media that Clive settled taxes on her physical property - but it has also been inferred that this was again part of the divorce strategy to keep the leeching Browns at bay. Listen is any of this our business? All I am saying is she certainly didnt "die broke." That is just vile BS.

R258 is spot on. I don't find Beyonce to be particularly talented but that is beside the point. Whitney paved that road so that Beyonce could travel it. I don't believe that anyone except for the fiercest Bey fans would ever compare her singing voice to Houston's; there is zero comparison. In the auto-tuned world that we now live in and in the current music world climate of a lot of flash and little musical ability - Beyonce has made a huge success for herself. She owes Whitney a HELL of a lot.

That picture is so tragic. She was such a beauty and would've aged amazingly with her bone structure.

I wanna see the receipts, Vile Stan at R263.

"Business acumen"? LOL!!!!! Even her coke dealer could not stand her!

How did that African trip go, huh?

The Diane Sawyer interview???

That 2009 "comeback"??????

Don't forget the 2010 tour where she was booed and people wanted refunds cause she couldn't sing.

Yes, she was well on her way to bankruptcy just like Aunt Dionne when she died. What money she had left was running out fast, especially since she had no way of making more. Her voice was completely shot, so she couldn't record albums or do concerts.

Those are the FACTS.

Why are you in here R 275 274 276 ?? You just want to slay her all over again. Well No anonymous internet blog is going to obliterate her trailblazing genius thats for sure. So you need to get a life.

I would remind you that she helped finance & produce "Sparkle" and was under constant pressure from big studios for the WTE sequel. She wasnt going anywhere. But seriously - you need to get a grip on that ugly.

Whitney was never good in interviews, she always came across insecure and defensive, which she covered up with arrogance. She was conditioned and brain washed in the black church and that is all she knew and all she was. Her mother never prepared her for real life or taught her to think reasonably.

Defensive AND high...

"I make too much money to even see crack!"

Holy Shit!!!! Whitney is DARING Diane to accuse her of drug abuse!!!!!!!! WOW!!!!!!!

"That it's because of drugs?"

(Pause) "No."

"I wanna see the receipts!"

Whitney's smoke-destroyed voice in her forced laughter... scary!

Even in the eighties Whitney had a chip on her shoulder in interviews, like she was pissed that she had to be bothered to do them.

Whitney comes across so bad in the interview with Sawyer. But let's be fair--celebrities don't even do these kind of interviews anymore. Questions are all pre-approved and no one is "confronted" about anything without ample time to prepare their pat answer.

Whitney couldn't have disliked 'Nippy' too much because it's prominently written on a license plate on the cover of I'm Your Baby Tonight.

I loved her singing voice, and she was fine in The Bodyguard and Waiting to Exhale. But I wouldn't call her a total package because she couldn't dance for shit.

I remember when she used to cancel concerts in the 1990's she always had laryngitis, or her voice couldn't' take the air conditioned arenas, it was always some lame ass excuse.

I wonder what would've happened to Whitney if she had never hooked up with Bobby Brown. Would her drug addiction have become as bad as it did? Would she still be alive today?

Looks like they fed into each others addiction R285.

Use to see her limo with plates "Nippy 1" idling on my street.

On Crack Alley???

Whitney did drugs before Brown, her own brother introduced her to them.

I liked her, she was a good girl, I think, but boy was she dumb.

Not many singers have had the success of something like The Bodyguard.

Not even Beyoncé.

[italic]Cinderella[/italic] was not a live TV production but a made-for-TV movie musical shot on film. Only the 1957 version was actually done live and the 1965 version on color videotape.

R291 Thanks - misspoke. Principle point was she picked the best of Broadway talent to make the production.

R290 - VERY TRUE.

Oh, I'm falling on the floor....

R290 You act as if people went to see the movie because of Whitney. It was a Kevin Costner film and he picked Whitney because he thought she was cute. Kevin was a big star then and had two Oscars.

The song propelled the movie R295, only Elton John's Candle in the Wind did better.

What a bunch of BS. It was the movie that propelled the soundtrack.

Debra Wilson was a fucking genius. She had Whitney down pat.

r295 Please. Whitney + Kevin + Whitney's voice + Whitney singing a classic Dolly song made the Bodyguard a smash.

The Bodyguard movie and soundtrack were both huge.

It was the movie that made the soundtrack successful R299. I never said the soundtrack wasn't a hit. It was a hit because of the movie.

She told us herself why: CRACK is WACK.

The movie wouldn't have been that big a hit without the song.

It was synergy.

BS R302. Costner was a big star than.

Nobody remembers the movie in ten years, the song is a universally known evergreen.

Wrong R305.

R295/R297/R300 "I Will Always Love You" was released first and was already at #1 when the film was released. That song blew up the charts and it broke all kinds of records. That song was everywhere immediately. It ABSOLUTELY propelled the success of the film. The film, by the way, didn't even make it to #1 at the box office. It made great money, but didn't have a huge debut. It did well over time, in large part because the song lasted so long on the charts and on constant rotation on radio.

"My Heart Will Go On" is a better example of a song that was made successful by the film. It likely would have been a big hit for Celine Dion anyway, but it was the association with Titanic that made it colossal.

I was around back then and "I Will Always Love You" absolutely influenced the box office of the movie. The movie never would've been such a hit without that song. "I Will Always Love You" wasn't just a hit song, it was a big pop culture moment, one of the biggest of the last 25 years.

BTW, after Whitney died I watched The Bodyguard for the first time in 20 years and it really hasn't aged well. If you watch it now, it looks like a Lifetime movie.

you are delusional R306

The Bodyguard was never a good movie, but the songs are fierce.

False argument R307. BTW, the soundtrack was only released 8 days before the movie.

Doesn't make any difference R310. It made $411 million.

The Bodyguard was awful. And "I Will Always Love You" is precisely the kind of bombastic schlock that was a waste of Whitney's voice. Dolly's quiet version suits the song much better. The "I'm Every Woman" remake was fantastic though.

I love The Bodyguard. Whitney was not an amazing actress but she is lovely in the film and she and Kevin have great chemistry.

They obviously tailored the film to not give her hefty dramatic moments (ie. the death of her sister - she doesn't even get a crying scene or a reaction scene).

It's too bad Whitney could never sing the bridge to I'm every woman live, she had to use backing tracks.

R311, the song was released 3 weeks before the movie. The song was already breaking records before the film was out.

Debra has Whitney's weird smile down perfectly. "I don't do crack. I do freebase, though."

[quote]The Bodyguard was awful. And "I Will Always Love You" is precisely the kind of bombastic schlock that was a waste of Whitney's voice.

I love "Run To You", but yes these songs can grate.

Most of Whitney's other soundtrack songs are overshadowed because of the massive success of The Bodyguard. Count On Me, Exhale, and I Believe In You And Me are good songs that aren't as over the top.

R316 I said the soundtrack was released. Try to keep. Films make soundtracks successful not the opposite. Your ignorance is not only laughable.

*up

but appalling in its simplistic ignorance.

[quote]Films make soundtracks successful not the opposite.

LOL, I will always love you is a classic, the movie was below average Hollywood drivel.

Your stupidity is noted R321. The reason I Will Always Love You is a classic has nothing to do with the film.

My favorite song on the Bodyguard soundtrack was "Someday I'm Coming Back" by Lisa Stansfield, who I LOVED back in the day. WEHT to her?

Debra Wilson's portrayal of Whitney is more than an impression. She really captured Whitney at that time. It's so brilliant. I still laugh because she captured the craziness perfectly.

I wonder what Whitney thought of Debra's skits.

R319 is having an argument in his own mind.

[quote]The reason I Will Always Love You is a classic has nothing to do with the film.

That's right, most people forgot about the movie soon after.

Personally, "I Will Always Love You" is one of my least favorite of Houston's hits; while it showed off her amazing range I didn't care for her arrangement. But who cares what I though - certainly not the millions and millions who bought her album. It was a MASSIVE hit for her and it propelled The Bodyguard Soundtrack to 17 million plus in album sales (according to most sources it is either the 12th or 13th best selling album of all time and hands down the number one selling sound track of all time). So who made who into a massive smash hit? It was likely both. Costner was a huge box office draw in those days and Whitney was a chart topping artist who had scores of awards to back up her album sales. She was also gorgeous - an obvious draw for viewers. The movie was awful IMO, but no more than other blockbusters of the period. Honestly, all the stars aligned on this one. That said, her hit has certainly aged better than the movie.

Yet the film made over $400 million in 1992. You are not long stupid, but ignorant R326.

*thought

*long should be only

I always said if i ever didn't drag, I want to be done up in the silver beaded and helmeted Metropolis look she wore in "The Queen of The Night" scene. She rocked that song.

*did drag

R328, no it didn't. The film was a slow burner and hit the $400 million mark in 1993. It took 2 months to reach $100 million in the US. The song and soundtrack were immediate hits worldwide, breaking a bunch of records upon release.

[quote]Yet the film made over $400 million in 1992

Because of the song R328!

clive spillin the tea, hunty

that old messy queen r335!

She wrote "Queen of the Night" Whitney definitely had it in her. In fact the few songs she wrote were fierce "Count on me" from WTE was a great ballad with soaring vocals, totally touched a nerve with women and female friendships.

Just never mind about R306 it is just Alt Facts from some posters in here.

What hasnt been said is that TBG album and success was MASSIVELY GLOBAL - really the first of its kind not only by an African American Female Vocalist but also by any Female Vocalist period. Whitney was STILL receiving awards for that film from EU countries years after it opened - God even in China.

IF anyone knows that Artists can perform while using and suffer marginal damage it is Clive Davis. IF he says Cigarettes did it he is supported by the Examiners report that said she had Emphyasema from cigarettes. Other substances were more impacting her Heart and arteries.

The chain smoker was covered further upthread. Cigs are 100% a kiss of death for a vocalist. It might be a slow decline - but they will kill the voice sooner than later.

Clive is still a piece of shit.

R340 Well, we all have our loyalties!

Thing is I wanna know who the insane Crack Trolls are. I doubt they are Mariah stans - she was great friends with Whitney, vice versa. I figure they are either Streisand, Ariana Grande, maybe Brown trolls. Who else?

genetics didn't help

R342 -?? What are you referencing?

[quote]But I wouldn't call her a total package because she couldn't dance for shit.

Is this how we know for sure she was a lesbian?

I don't know anyone that has ever said, I'm going to see that movie because that song is so good.

R345, no, but because of the song and the accompanying video this movie looked like a chance to see glammed up Whitney sing in the context of an amazing love story. That Costner was thought of someone who made great films certainly helped.

The way people are going on and on about Whitney R346 she alone is the reason The Bodyguard was a hit. The say because the song was a hit it made the movie a hit is ridiculous. People will buy soundtracks because of a movie, but, unless it is a musical, they don't go to a movie because of a song.

*They

Whitney and Bey stans, girls your Doboth wrong. None of this would have been possible without Miss Diana Ross!

[quote]Meanwhile, what's Julie Andrews excuse for losing her voice? She didn't do crack, just arthritis pills.

I love the way Julie Andrews' vocal problems now show up in every thread.

No R347, the point is the song/soundtrack helped boost the film. Contrary to what someone kept insisting above, the film is not what made the soundtrack successful. The song/soundtrack was a phenom all by itself and that in turn helped the film, which stayed in theaters for a long time as a result.

BS R351. It was stated upthread, people don't go to movies because of a song or soundtrack.

R349 LOVE Miss Ross - but she wasn't Global nor did she dominate the genres the way Whitney did, Pop, Rock, R&B, Gospel alas she did not dominate Film as Whitney did with smash after smash - Whitney eclipsed Streisand like a Tsunami.

R352, your determination to be dense as hell is almost admirable. The Bodyguard was about a singer/actress and the film was sold in part on seeing glamorous Whitney singing. Absolutely one of the draws to the film is if people LIKE THE SONGS SHE SINGS in it. Especially if one of those songs is one of the biggest singles of all time. Same thing happened with Purple Rain--people flocked to see it in part to see Prince perform all these killer songs.

You seriously don't think that there were kids who went to see Vision Quest because "OMG Madonna sings "Crazy for You" in it!" They changed the name of the film in some of the international markets to "Crazy for You" to capitalize on the success of the song.

The Bodyguard is number 7 in yearly box office domestic gross for 1992 and isn't even in the top 10 for 1993.

You're the one that is dense R354. Vision Quest only made a little less than $13 million. Tell me again how Madonna's popularity made it a successful movie.

I can't believe how boring this thread got with a sidebar about The Bodyguard soundtrack selling the movie or vice versa.

Can we please get back to some freebasing, closeted lesbianism, millionaires slumming in crack houses, and enabling family members? Can we talk about the time was Whitney a cracked out mess but was forced to drag herself to a Clive Davis thing on his order, and if she didn't she was over? And everyone waited in suspense if she would show, and she did. Late, but she showed. And the performance wasn't great, but better than her disastrous European tour dates, and by fulfilling Clive's demand to appear at the event she bought herself more time and his continued support?

Seriously? Vision Quest was a small budget movie that made money and got an international release schedule only because of Madonna. They changed the name of the film because of her.

Songs don't sell moves!

Sorry R357, sometimes stupidity just can't be ignored. How about Whitney and Bobby jumping a plane to avoid being arrested for drugs in HI? She left her bag behind with a boatload of pot in it.

Her drug use was so bad, Cissy held a prayer vigil with Al Sharpton in 2004. You have to be desperate to go to that fraud for anything.

[quote]nor did she dominate the genres the way Whitney did, Pop, Rock, R&B, Gospel

Dominate the genres? WTF? She was a pop singer. She was not a serious gospel singer, despite her ventures into that genre on occasion, and she was nothing at all like a rock singer.

Jesus Christ, fanbois really are the worst kind of stupid.

In the early '90s, Whitney had the same operation to remove nodes on her vocal chords that Julie Andrews had. I think they even used the same doctor.

Whitney always had poor vocal technique. She was having problems even before the drugs did their damage. She started out with a lovely and flowing voice, but then started with the heavy belting from the throat which caused nodes to develop. Consistent belting also damages your upper register. By the time she was in her thirties, she struggled to sing the upper notes of her hit songs.

By 1994, she was unable to sing the high parts of "I'm Every Woman."

The only time she could sing the bridge to that song was during the recording of it.

Even during recording she might have had a little help, with the engineers assembling bits of various takes to make that bridge. It's not uncommon at all.

Granted, Whitney came with major baggage; however, there are predators within the industry who exploited and abused her when she was younger. Without anyone looking out for her well-being, she succumbed. These are the same predators that will eventually destroy Miley Cyrus. She's got less than 10 more years.

R366, MIley Cyrus appears to be a complete dumbass, remember she's not that young, she is an adult who could refuse to do her nasty act.

She's worth about 500 million though. Believe it or not, she is one of the wealthiest entertainers in history. Rather mind boggling, isn't it?

Therefore, she has a whole string of interlopers and controllers who tell her what to do, and it will be in their best interest to keep her around.

Until she ages out, of course. Girl's not going to go to college or feed the poor on a Christian crusade.

[quote]Her drug use was so bad, Cissy held a prayer vigil with Al Sharpton in 2004. You have to be desperate to go to that fraud for anything.

I know you all hate me here, but one good thing about me is you won't have to see this grifting LOSER anywhere near the white house.

Oh, and YOU'RE WELCOME..... for getting that gross heifer Lens D. to drop some of her whale blubber. Still got a ways to go though with that one. I'm working on it. Be patient. That's a much tougher job than putting the breaks on illegal immigrations, repealing the ACA and bringing jobs back to the rust belt.

Diana Ross wasn't global? Some of the shit that gets written on this site...

Trump SHOULD post here. He's a top class and funny troll. Amazing.

I'm a cut all you bitches. I was the trailblazer when it comes to superstar African American songstresses. None of these hos like Crackney and Beyaki is fit to even lick my shoes. And Diane Ross? That talentless heifer? Bitch please.

I think Whitney recorded a cover version of "What Becomes of the Brokenhearted" and that was supposed to be the big lead off single from The Bodyguard, until Paul Young released a version in late 1991 of the song that was featured in the film Fried Green Tomatoes. It was a minor hit on the pop chart but went to #1 on the adult contemporary charts.

And it was because of Paul Young's version of that song that Fried Green Tomatoes grossed a little over $119 million. Paul Young's version of What Becomes of the Brokenhearted was released almost a year before The Bodyguard was released.

R357 but...this thread has everything: crack dens, Paul Young, Julie Andrew's throat nodules, diva fan-boi cage fights, and a rotund Jewish drag queen called Jive Mavis who screams, "BOBBBAAAAY!" whenever she takes a shit.

********************************* SPOILER ALERT FOR THE BODYGUARD *****************************

It was her sister trying to kill her.

Whitney "dominated" the Rock charts?

Let me guess: "Queen Of The Night" was a "Rock" song, right?

You guys seriously trash that Janet Jackson fan but you are treating this Whitney Nut with kid gloves???

"I can fight you but I can't FUCK YOU???"

[quote]Her drug use was so bad, Cissy held a prayer vigil with Al Sharpton in 2004. You have to be desperate to go to that fraud for anything.

Let's talk about Cece and this heifer Pebbles/Perry. They were so close to Whitney, did they ever try to intervene?

Whitney's I Will Always Love You is the most frau thing that ever walked the face of the earth.

Pebbles, the "Giving You the Benefit" and "Mercedes Boy" singer?

Yes r379.

Here's a short clip of Whitney praising her cousin Dionne Warwick and Aretha Franklin. But Whitney gives the highest praise to Diana Ross, saying Diana "set a pathway for women like me to walk through".

r381 brought receipts.

Ce ce was part of the first intervention Cissy tried in 1999, along with Robyn, that failed. Cissy wanted her daughter to go to rehab, and Whitney begged her mom to move into her new jersey mansion which cissy did. But Whitney closeted herself away in another part of the house doing drugs and soon after cissy left knowing she could not help her daughter.

[quote]But Whitney closeted herself away in another part of the house doing drugs and soon after cissy left knowing she could not help her daughter.

That is so sad.

Whitney Houston, big Bush follower/supporter.

[quote] Yes, she was well on her way to bankruptcy just like Aunt Dionne when she died. What money she had left was running out fast, especially since she had no way of making more. Her voice was completely shot, so she couldn't record albums or do concerts. Those are the FACTS.

Whitney Houston and Dionne Warwick were cousins. Dionne Warwick filed bankruptcy because of the enormous tax debt (whose originally principle balance she'd paid over the years but the interest/penalties added millions of dollars to that initial principle) that she carried for decades.

[quote] In the early '90s, Whitney had the same operation to remove nodes on her vocal chords that Julie Andrews had. I think they even used the same doctor. Whitney always had poor vocal technique. She was having problems even before the drugs did their damage. She started out with a lovely and flowing voice, but then started with the heavy belting from the throat which caused nodes to develop. Consistent belting also damages your upper register. By the time she was in her thirties, she struggled to sing the upper notes of her hit songs. By 1994, she was unable to sing the high parts of "I'm Every Woman."

Chaka Khan also had surgery to remove VOCAL CHORD NODULES. According to her Whitney needed the surgery, but refused to have it. Again according to Chaka Whitney was afraid of the risks.

[quote] Vocal cord nodules are benign (noncancerous) growths on both vocal cords that are caused by vocal abuse. Over time, repeated abuse of the vocal cords results in soft, swollen spots on each vocal cord. These spots develop into harder, callous-like growths called nodules.

They only thing Datalounge hates more than black people is successful black people.

Give it rest R386.

Stevie Nicks had modules on her vocal cords too. I'm not sure if she had them removed, but her voice is definitely different now. She lost her vibrato, she's more nasal, and 'talks' her lyrics more than sings them. Certainly can't project those soaring wails anymore, despite what her ardent fans say about her current tours. "Omg she's the best evah! Nevah sounded so good!"

Does that bitch Celine have des nœuds yet?

She had the misfortune of being born to Cissy.

When did Whitney and Robyn split?

R391 Prob about the time she met Bobby. There were a couple of stories - one person swears that Whitney and Brown actually met in rehab. This has not been found in any printed sources. Whitney's family said she met him at a Music award. She and Brown dated for a couple years. Whitney said that that Crawford split in 2000. Reports of Brown being violent toward Whitney prob meant that Whitney would go to Crawford for support. I hope she did anyway.

Didn't Jackee Harry introduce Bobby and Whitney?

What do you know R393?

Gwen Verdon also had vocal nodes taken out when Liza Minnelli stepped into "Chicago." Must be nice to lose your voice when you never had one to begin with.

Here's Jackee talking about whitney

Her mother and her whole family are vultures. Cissy Houston looks like the person who opens up the door when you get to hell.

The woman is pure evil!

Crack Rock is a helluva drug.

she went wrong leaving kevin costner's fine ass on the set of the bodyguard. Should have scooped him right up. He was attracted her. She had him and didnt even know it.

When you lie down with dogs you get fleas and shit

Whitney went wrong on the corner. Coke messed with some careers but crack destroyed her life and lungs and dignity and sense. Crack came from the devil's ass and the US government and Bobby! Those who say Whitney was into coke before Brown have no real life understanding of the difference between cocaine use and crack addiction. He is not to blame for the destruction of her talent and voice and beauty, but he introduced her to the drug that brought her down and enabled every downward step. Whitney did only what she wanted, she paid people to stay or go away, but she surely went wrong long before that. Her voice in all stages of life was worth listening to. So many heartbreaking losses of resonance and power came from the pipe. Still there was no one better, ever. Her voice was triumphant, like cathedral bells and marching bands - an aspirational mix of gospel, R&B and pop perfection. She transcended all who came before AND vocally leaped past Streisand too. She was done and lost and wrong and hit her head in the tub, but no one will ever take her amazing voice and beauty and power of live communication away. She learned from the best and became greater than them all.

She once said certain industry people wanted her to model her career after Diana Ross, marrying a white guy, and she was very dismissive of the fact that she could never marry anybody but a black guy.

She was just a brainwashed dumb girl, leaving her black gospel roots and all the prejudice and conservative environment behind would have saved her.

The whole Houston clan is nothing but grifters, sycophants and shady hangers on, black low life gospel trash.

The Greatest Love of All was her favorite song, but not one of mine. She gave some amazing performances of that song though. Here she looks like Dorothy Dandridge in some yellow crescendo - the Simple Truth tour was the first time I saw Houston perform. Between 1986 and 1994 she was often superhuman vocal perfection. The rest of the time she was the best.

How often did she sing "I Am Changing"? There's a terrible performance of it from, I think, her first album era. She tries to belt notes she hasn't got. She didn't seem to inherit her mother's ease with singing in head voice.

*I'm Your Baby Tonight Tour*

She shouldn't have listened to Cissy and also should have stayed away from Bobby Brown. The biggest mistakes of her life.

I can't remember which interview, but Cissy Houston was asked whether she was sometimes jealous of Whitney's success, something she tried but never got, and she said "why would I be jealous, I made her"

That's when I knew Cissy Houston was pure evil.

Cissy was also so heartless when Oprah asked her if it would matter to her if Whitney was gay. She shot back yes it would! Which was pretty awful knowing Whitney's history.

just look at how fucking creepy cissy Houston looks now. I think that says it all.

[quote]Beyonce's career is bigger now than Whitney's ever was. Whitney was the better singer, but Beyonce dwarfs her as a performer and businesswoman.

Not sure that's true -- Whitney was huge for a while. Beyoncé is a star in the social media age so it's measured and perceived differently.

What r410 said. Whitney was HUGE at her peak, your grandmother knew her songs. Her popularity crossed generational boundaries. Beyonce is a lot of media hype, Whitney was a true superstar. Social media fame is a lot different.

R410 RIGHT. Also, whitney was a class act powerhouse VOCALIST in an era when TALENT mattered. I said TALENT. real singing. Whitney sang (in the beginning) about real human emotion. Not shaking her ass half naked screaming about a man doing her wrong all the time and how much of a bad bitch she is. That came later after you know who. Along with the implants.

[quote]Tell me again how Madonna's popularity made it a successful movie.

Indeed, since it didn't do shit for us.

R55 = Key word: CONTROLLING

"she went wrong leaving kevin costner's fine ass on the set of the bodyguard. Should have scooped him right up. He was attracted her. She had him and didnt even know it."

WHY would Whitney want Costner if she was primarily a lesbian?

What about the rumor that she didn't actually give birth to the daughter - that she was actually one of Bobby's illegitimates? (VERY old rumor)

R415 Well he's certainly a much better choice than that gremlin she picked. If you gonna fake it, at least make it worth it somehow.

Puleeeeeeze, R416.

The Bodyguard... I stopped judging beauty pageants because if I had to sit through one more screeching rendition of "don't make me close one more door, I don't want to hurt anymore" I would have immolated on the spot. Even Whitney, on the soundtrack, was shaky with those high notes.

R418 oh please, Whitney is rock solid on the soundtrack. Live, however, was another story

Yes, she was totally solid on "close onemoer door." Dont know where you get your facts from - but Whitney was nicknamed "One Take Houston" cause she could Nail a recording on the first take - maybe 2 seldom 3 for the main track. She never needed hand holding or reassurance either - she was a total joy to work with said Narada. Never another like her will pass this way/

Few people realize that Whitney also was the very first of the Mega International SuperStars vocalists. She outsold the Beatles. Yes some vocalists were popular overseas, Streisand and to a lessor degree say Diana Ross - but Whitney blew then aside in her sales and massive fame. No one was that big before her. This is what sets her apart for Beyoncé today. Nothing Bey can do is new - and her singing is good, very good but not the stuff of a legend. Not at all. Whitney is the Gold Bar, the standard. New Fresh Unique with a Global fame to boot. It was her style, her sound - everything was brand new. Frankly I just dont see something so different like coming again for decades, if ever.

One thing that sets Whitney apart from Beyonce is that she was a fairly solid actress. Beyonce and Madonna are too self aware on screen, no matter how hard they try. Lets not even talk about Mariah who couldn't act her way out of a paper bag.

R421 - you are so correct. Yes, she was gorgeous in her prime and yes she was cutting edge and novel in so many ways...BUT more than anything else - she sang like an angel from heaven and is in the company of only a handful of women in history who could match her obvious vocal talents. Comparing Bey to Whitney is like comparing a Bentley to a Buick. Sure, both have their pros, but come on now. Sadly, had Whitney passed as a young woman at her prime - the talent would have been more obvious to the younger generations. One only needsto perform a quick YouTube search to experience her genius however. The unprecedented amount of awards bestowed upon her speak for themselves.

Sorry, Bey=Buick, Whitney=Bentley. Typing too fast..

Whitney may have had a more beautiful voice but Bey definitely has a more dynamic, if not more powerful voice. Can you imagine whitey trying to sing a rock song or even the hip hop rhymthic flow of soul music today. They both have excellent vibratos. Bey's voice is under appreciated because she dances and many of her signature cuts don't necessarily require a skilled vocalist.

I am not sure that a voice can get more "dynamic" than Whitney's. And yes, her's is far more beautiful than Beyonce's - no question. Whitney's range can sing circles around Queen B as well. Bey does have those dance moves for sure. I would say that she is more along the lines of Janet than Whitney. Both beautiful, talented and put on an amazing show and stunning when they do it.

R425 - and yes, Bey's hits do not require a prodigious or particularly talented skill. If she has that, she should show it at some point soon. She certainly has the rest of the pieces for being an iconic performer.

Whitney could NEVER do this.

R428 - yeah as usual, Bey is "talking" through her breathy, weak. shallow vocals and looking sexy. Why would Whitney care? This is her BEST?

Oh, sorry - this must be witty right? A pun -I guess I missed it. Total Joke, R428.

Bey's best work:

Whitney was an amazing life singer, she really knew how to interpret a song and connect to an audience. Her mother may have had a better voice in terms of range and dexterity, but Cissy had no idea what to do with a song.

Beyonce is a good singer, but she is nowhere near as talented or as skilled a singer as Whitney was in her prime.

Whitney had the warmest "tone" and effortless vocals (we all know that there was plenty of effort there, but it sounded that way nonetheless).

*live singer

R422, replace solid with "passable." In the right role, Whitney could pass as an actress, by no means was she "a fairly solid actress."

Somehow I appreciated Whitney letting loose with less than perfect vocals. Her tribute to Aretha in 1997:

She still had it in 1998. Whitney sings Rodgers and Hammerstein on the Rosie O'Donnell show.

Whitney singing gospel at Wembley stadium, London in 1987. Her voice floats so effortlessly.

It was evident very early that her live versions would eclipse her studio recordings. She was one of the very few like this. This song is a perfect example, her fans don't bother with the record anymore.

Never liked her - her "Star Search" screechy voice, her treacly, corny songs, her bland records and her phony persona. Chaka Khan & Ree Ree were better.

R440 "phony persona?" Still waters run deep, she was a remarkably,intelligent and good woman. Whitney's philanthropy can be found in organizations that dot the landscape of NJ, fil the ledger books of the American RedCross, are amongst the legendary events created to benefit The Children's Defense Fund to simply name a few. Pediatric Units created by her are located in at least 2 area hospitals. MIddle Schools endowed by and quietly, very quietly she supported members of the LGBT communities in their time of need. There is her history as the first American Artist to refuse to perform in So Africa during apartheid & Mandela's imprisonment - meanwhile American artists like Paul Simon who was merrily recording his "Graceland" Album in SA.

Chaka Khan just would never tolerate such an insult to her beloved Whitney. They were devoted friends and I am sure she would not like knowing one of her fans/anonymous clueless bots were trash talking someone she held in enormous esteem.

"I Will Always Love You" is a wannabe great song - it's like "Like Prayer". One verse and an endless chorus. Both songs need another verse - or two.

I've always felt bad for Bobby Brown. For years it was convenient for fans and the gossip magazines to blame him for ruining Whitney. Finally I remember at least one gossip piece where someone said the whole thing about Whitney being a Clive creation, and the real her is much harder. It's not Bobby's fault. If anything, she's dragging him down. Other people from the 1990s? Will remember what I remember - the posters around NYC outing celebrities. There was a picture of Whitney id'd as gay, next to a picture of presumably straight AA diva. That was also an era when the tabloids decided it was ok to infiltrate alcoholic anonymous meetings and narcotics anonymous meetings and report what the celebrity said. I guess the celebrities have learned now, because that doesn't happen anymore. The tabloid would always be so sanctimonious, and never quite cop to the fact that it was a meeting and it was their reporter dishing the details. But anyway, there was an article based on a Bobby Brown AA meeting, and a lot of it was lamenting that his wife was hooking up with a woman. It almost had a Princess Di flavor to it. "There are three of us in this marriage!"

R442 - I wont address your AA Flyer meeting times have changed and she would be a much freer woman today. The truth is BB was diagnosed BiPolar - today we know this disease seems to emerge in late teens early 20's. Brown was diagnosed and refused to take his meds. Most importantly he never revealed this to Whitney. He self medicated with drugs to such a degree he would black out for days - well before he met her. EVERYTHING was on his plate Cocaine, H, weed lots and lots of Alcohol.

Whitney throughout the 80's (and early '92 pre marriage) was a very small time partier - from 1st hand. When she was on the road her #1 Priority was taking care of the Business, making Payroll, moving the Brand. Very very very professional. Frankly this was the case throughout her career - PROFESSIONAL get it done.

Brown was never professional - dreams but not the fire or ability to deliver. HE was a 3 hit wonder, that spent years taking his frustration out on her. She built music studios for him, settled all of his financial obligations, put up with this domestic abuse, emotional abuse and basically said nothing. WIth or without the accuracy of those reports he is not to be pitied - he brought women home to their bed when she was on the road, he hit on any female even staff, used her CCards to pay for hotel assignations.

She had a child with him, an international Superstardom unseen in Female vocalists before. He was childish, infantile and periodically violent. What kind of life did she have aside from the luxury? Eventually with the pressure to make hit 3 hit movies in 8 years, record albums and tour - and this guys career was over- she had to escape, she was honest about it. He was lightyears ahead of her on that point. Inspite of all that she let him sit on her stage drinking beer and ruining her concerts with a live mike. She really had no idea what else to do about his pain.

Meanwhile, she faints and drowns, Brown shows up and makes a scene at their funeral. Well she treated him like a "King" during their marriage it figures he felt he was the KING at her funeral service too. He lives on, reamarried late forties making new babies to go with his 4 other adult children. But he did neglect their daughter in her grief. She fell under the spell of a terrible drug user and profane domestic abuser. Brown could hardly bother to push her to reconcile.

Wish him well - but never, ever "feel so bad" for this guy. He lived his life like a thug, she cushioned his landings arrest after arrest for 15 years. Feel sorry for the Victims that felt so burned by him they tried to escape him via deepening drugs or in nightmare abusive relationships that isolated them from him. That is your truth. I think he may finally grow up now, but i doubt his addictions will ever leave.

R439 Thank you! That is simply beautiful!

Perfect interpretation R439.

Whitney really knew how to sing a song and breathe live into it. Cissy had a great voice but she had no idea what to do with a melody.

Only a sick mind would defend Bobby Brown. Whitney "dragged him down"? Well, now she's gone, he must be enjoying all the media attention and career revival. It's not like he only got mainstream press because of who he was married to.

Uhm, I'd say doing blow and smoking crack were probably lesser career moves!

See the "2017Whitney Houston Biennial Exhibit" celebrating new artists NYC DL Thread. Mar 19-29th free, open to public

Nick Broomfield has made a documentary about Whitney that is to air on Showtime. Really curious to see who they interviewed.

R449 that has been discussed elsewhere. Her former Bodyguards, drivers, maybe a bandmember or two, Tina Brown (Bobbys sister). I believe that Tina is the one that staged those monstrous FAKE NEWS, and it really was fake news photos, of Whitney's bathroom and sold them to National Enquirer. The Houston family did ask that Whitney's friends not cooperate - but I think it went out too late.

I am fully on board with R443 and appreciate the insight. I will always have a soft spot for Whitney and her still unrivaled talent. I do think that she likely went downhill after jumping from snorting cocaine (which SOOOO many people of means do and many never let it control their lives) to smoking crack. Cocaine is cocaine (even though powder and crack rock are different compounds), but the method in which you use it does play a role on the hold in which the drug take hold over your life. Much life meth - when you smoke certain "uppers" the addiction spirals. Of course shooting meth is probably that much more addictive than smoking it, but that is another story all together. Back to blow, your body processes the drug in a different way when smoked that makes it far more addictive for whatever scientific reason. I have known many, many addicts and this seemingly minute differentiation always seems to mark the beginning of the end. Heroin is a whole different story for those that like it - again a different thread.

"she was a remarkably intelligent and good woman."

You MUST be kidding. Whitney was not intelligent in the slightest - not educated, not articulate. I doubt she ever read a newspaper let alone a book cover to cover.

I will not respond to the poster above they always s troll WH threads. Clear examples of Whitney inate intelligence are in her interviews int he 80's-90's. She had a High School education and was able to converse with nearly anyone at anytime in any situation. She was never intimidated nor unable to ask questions. She sat amongst Kings and Queens, Presidents and FLOTUS', she could articulate political positions with ease, such as the Boycott of SA by American Artists. On stage she was more of a patterer, but if you watch interviewers she was a very very good listener. A good communicator is often a very good listener. "Dumb" is a racial bias in this case.

R453 = Cissy Houston

R454 Not at all, in fact the weak link in her upbringing was she was pretty sheltered in her youth as a prodigy in her very early 20's. Despite that she had great empathy for the poor and struggling thru her church community located in one of the poorest nabes of Newark. Keep reachin' you cant rewrite decades of evidence.

Cigarettes, alcohol, and drugs ALL do a number on a singer's voice. Remember Marianne Faithfull's original voice? It was a pleasant, but very dull, "mezzo-soprano." After the years of heroin addiction and God knows what else, her voice sounded like her vocal cords had been shredded. A critic said she had completely "vulgarized" her voice. Same with Judy Garland; in her final years her voice was shot, never to be the same again.

She had too many negative people and influences around her, I guess her whole life.

She needed better songs but they stopped writing classic songs for adults a long time ago.

There is a humanity to Nick Broomfield 's documentaries. I am sure he will do something good on Whitney.

I wish I could remember the exact details of this story, but when my ex moved to LA (he's a doctor) he was at a party with a few luminaries, including Whitney Houston. He told me that Whitney appeared to be stressing over Mariah Carey, and that the woman with her was loudly reassuring her that Mariah wasn't a threat, wasn't the same talent, one hit wonder or whatever. I know it's lame, and I wish I could remember what I was told the woman said, because it was pretty funny (inadvertant on her part). It was sort of desperate and loud. They were on the staircase.

r458 that is what I am looking forward to. I feel Whitney has been (deservedly) deified because of her incredible talent but I hope he will humanize her.

And I really hope he the Houstons - Cissy, especially - come off poorly. They deserve every bit of scorn. They are bottom-feeders.

Whitney was classically beautiful. Bald head & all. Theres a reason why the BodyGuard grossed over a half billion dollars and she could sell out shows with just her voice.

[quote]The Houston family did ask that Whitney's friends not cooperate -

Unless they can make money off her legacy they don't want anybody talking about her. Pat and Cissy make sure they get the last penny out of Whitney's untimely death.

hated her version of the Dolly song and the Bodyguard was a piece of crap.

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

I Will Always Love You was not Whitney's best song by any scale of scrutiny, but it did show off her phenomenal talent and vocal range. I was personally never a fan of that song, and I loved so many of her singles. Yes, The Bodyguard was not a masterpiece either. But when has an Academy=worthy movie ever taken a chance on a singer to be an acting lead? She did it well and it was a very, very successful film. Acting-wise she was really quite unknown. Her body of work from a vocal perspective is so stellar and was immensely awarded and rightfully so - that she remains in a class of her own. I wish that she did not decline as soon as she did due to drugs and personal problems. She had quite the "IT" factor when acting. Developed properly, she really could have done something with that.

Clive Davis ruined her by turning her into something from the Lawrence Welk show. Even when she tried to do dance music, the track was flat and lacked energy and soul. I never bought one of her singles or albums because they all sucked. She was so white sounding, she should be called Whitey Houston.

"But when has an Academy=worthy movie ever taken a chance on a singer to be an acting lead?"

Dreamgirls

8 Mile

Evita

Dancer in the Dark

Precious

Crash

Sling Blade

Monster's Ball

The Blind Side

R466 We get it, you dont like her. Now skidaddle on down to the Reddit where you belong.

I wonder why Dionne never stepped in to help.

R469 That's a million dollar question. Whitney was an international SuperStar for many years. Dionne had faded by the late 90's and she was doing all those distasteful commercials, IRS problems, etc. Things must have been complex in that relationship.

Dionne had her own life and family, she just couldn't be bothered by those messy Houston's.

Cissy and Dionne probably told her if she would just pray long and hard enough it would go away.

Where do broken hearts go? ❤️

The young Whitney was quite dykey-looking before Clive Davis made her get a femme makeover.

I hope Robyn Crawford will write a memoir one day, who wouldn't want to read that? Maybe she's waiting until Cissy dies.

Yes that was Whitney being Whitney for sure. The teen modeling also "glammed" her up, so she was no stranger to it. LIttle did she know that her entire life she would be bouncing between those 2 worlds - and considered one of the most beautiful women in the world! Remember how Gerry Griffin talked about Whitney and Robyn excitedly coming into his office and detailing their 100 year plan? They wanted Whitney to create music that would last 100 years. Not bad for this wonderful young woman to dream and then have it come true. I wonder if she and Robyn often reflected on that?

Dionne had already been through it with Dee Dee. I doubt she had the energy.

I love her to bits but Dionne has to be one of the most self centered women in the entertainment business. She's almost oblivious that other people exist.

Duh? She meet Bobby Brown.

That whole Houston and Warwick family is batshit crazy. Cissy is a mean, homophobic woman who destroyed Whitney's life. Whitney had to do drugs to get away from all the pain her mother caused her.

Dionne is one of the meanest women to ever walk this earth. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that she's killed people.

R479 Agreed there are so many excuses made for Cissy. Lots of people have hard childhoods and go on to become loving parents that find healthy ways to share life's lessons. Cissy just grew up without love, tried her best which wasnt great. But the people that defend her basic cruelty or constantly refer to Whitney's relationship with Crawford as salacious? Speaks volumes about how they feel about bisexual or gay people themselves.

Others have also posted that about the Houstons. Whatever the case with them - Whitney was exceptionally kind and wonderful by all accounts.

Dish about Dionne is interesting - including the comment that she had already suffered great heartbreak with the loss of her beloved sister to heroin. But killing people? Maybe she killed DL's Miss Warwick.

awwwww

I don't think Whitney and Dionne saw too much of each other in their private lives, so it's possible Dionne didn't know how bad Whitney's situation really was.

Cissy and Dionne come across as nasty, judgmental cunts, especially in their old age.

Whitney seemed like a very positive person who was accepting of others. I wonder if she would have grown into an old, crusty woman like them.

Dionne frequently took her sister back into her employ after she stormed out for the nth time. I don't think she's heartless. She probably knew that addicts can't be saved. They have to do the work themselves.

What was the story with Dionne's sister?