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Trump vs. Clinton Will Come Down to the Debates

Conventional wisdom says Donald Trump is going to lose, and lose big.

You see it everywhere in corporate media. Republican Party insiders are bereft and in denial, simultaneously refusing to accept the reality that their party is facing the possibility of catastrophic defeats in races all over the country this fall; indeed, some pundits say Trump marks the beginning of the end of the GOP. The New York Times is running a 24-7 odds placement that puts Hillary Clinton’s chances of victory at 86% against his 14%.

Indeed, if the election were held today, Hillary Clinton would beat Trump by a sizable margin. But the election is in two months. Two months is a long time. Old scandals percolate; new ones emerge. Another terrorist attack could prompt voters to turn to the right.

By far the biggest potential game changer, however, is the presidential debates. Conventional wisdom says Hillary Clinton will use her superior command of the facts and her ability to namedrop world leaders to run circles around Trump. But conventional wisdom is often wrong – just ask unstoppable 2016 Republican presidential nominee Jeb Bush.

I think Donald will trounce Hillary in the debates.

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by Anonymousreply 283February 20, 2020 2:54 AM

[quote]I think Donald will trounce Hillary in the debates.

Considering many people don't even think he'll have the guts to show up and will come up with an excuse involving "rigging" or "bias," you're incredibly delusional.

He barely leaves the FOX bubble. He runs to his girlfriend Hannity any chance he can get because he can't handle a real challenge.

by Anonymousreply 1August 27, 2016 3:42 AM

"Trump vs. Clinton Will Come Down to the Debates"

Yep. Should be interesting.

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by Anonymousreply 2August 27, 2016 3:48 AM

She is a crooked Cunt.

by Anonymousreply 3August 27, 2016 3:49 AM

R2, at least that'll make it more fair for him, but still at a disadvantage. If she were in a coma, it would be even.

by Anonymousreply 4August 27, 2016 3:51 AM

Trump won't debate...he will just call names and say stupid things...that really is all he knows to do.

by Anonymousreply 5August 27, 2016 4:01 AM

But they'll be the best names and the best stupid things, believe me, R5.

by Anonymousreply 6August 27, 2016 4:02 AM

Hahahahahaha! I just read that someone said Trump would trounce Hillary in the debates? I guess we will see, won't we?

by Anonymousreply 7August 27, 2016 4:03 AM

In the article, Rall points out that people don't remember facts -- they remember slick sound bites.

Whoever wins, it will be a battle of sound bites and potential slogans.

by Anonymousreply 8August 27, 2016 4:03 AM

@abc7elex 4 minutes ago

.@DollyParton on whether she'll support @HillaryClinton or @realDonaldTrump?

"I think they're both nuts!"

by Anonymousreply 9August 27, 2016 4:04 AM

The greatest show on Earth! Trump the clown versus Hillary the scold.

by Anonymousreply 10August 27, 2016 4:07 AM

Are we surprised that Dolly Parton is an idiot?

by Anonymousreply 11August 27, 2016 4:09 AM

At least the debates will force both of them to tell America what they actually plan to do. So far, Hillary talks about how awful Trump is, and Trump talks about how awful Hillary is. They will have to answer questions about themselves at the debates. Both candidates still have very high unfavorable ratings, so there are probably still a lot of undecideds. They better get the very best moderators as these debates are extremely important.

by Anonymousreply 12August 27, 2016 4:15 AM

My biggest advice for them would be this: Hillary needs to make sure she is not just "anti Trump" she needs (for political but also governing purposes in the future) present a clear mandate of what she is for and what she will do. She needs to get people excited for her vision of America. She also needs to be prepared to adequately answer what her biggest policy criticism is of President Obama and how she would be different from him. She can be similar to him in policy in many ways, but people are always hungry for change and 2/3 think the country is moving in the wrong direction. Now that she is out of the primary, she moves to a swath of the electorate that is not as in love with Obama. They may like him, but they want to know how she will be different. She needs to be able to say a couple of ways she would be different in policy. Her answer last time about "being a woman" in the primary debate will not cut it.

For Trump, I think there is one tool he has that he has never used but should. The one sign that he has any "moral code" is his abstinence. He doesn't drink, smoke, or do drugs at all because his brother died from alcoholism. In the midst of him flip flopping on all other positions politically and changing marriages, this is the one area of his life he has never changed or compromised. Ironically, he never speaks about it on the trail. If he could speak openly about that, connect his experience to the experience of many other families who have lost loved ones, he could relate to people.There's a human moment there. He could make substance abuse a signature of his campaign, say he wants to help those with drug addiction and come up with a proposal. Actually, if he re framed it carefully, he could use it to adjust his rhetoric on immigration. If he made the focus of immigration about potential drugs coming in, rather than the character of people, he would have a better shot there. Say "Listen, I know what it's like to lose someone to substance abuse. I never want another family to experience that heartbreak. That's why we need to secure our borders, not because Hispanics are bad people, but because I am afraid of what substances are being brought into our country."

by Anonymousreply 13August 27, 2016 4:23 AM

There are a whole bunch of lefties who I used to respect until this election.

by Anonymousreply 14August 27, 2016 4:24 AM

Shit R13, don't help him like that. The Moar mons (spelling like that so it won't show up in search) will fall in love with him. What do we have to do to get this thread deleted?

by Anonymousreply 15August 27, 2016 4:26 AM

of course he's gonna LOSE! HELLO!?

by Anonymousreply 16August 27, 2016 4:27 AM

No it won't. She got it already. Its just a matter of how badly she wants to hurt him and in turn, hurt/damage/kill the GOP.

by Anonymousreply 17August 27, 2016 4:31 AM

Nixon in a pantsuit or Mussolini with a comb over. Punt.

by Anonymousreply 18August 27, 2016 4:35 AM

You may hate your selection r18, but we sure is happy about ours!

by Anonymousreply 19August 27, 2016 4:44 AM

OP, exactly why should I give a shit what some arch conservative cartoonist with a blog says about this election?

From Wiki:

[quote]Rall has called for Barack Obama to resign as President of the United States, because "the gap between the soaring expectations that accompanied Barack Obama’s inauguration and his wretched performance is the broadest such chasm in recent historical memory. This guy makes Bill Clinton look like a paragon of integrity and follow-through.

What a genius.

by Anonymousreply 20August 27, 2016 4:45 AM

I didn't post it for you, r20 -- no matter what your mother says.

by Anonymousreply 21August 27, 2016 4:47 AM

I have a hard time believing that 80's Donald Trump who partied at clubs and decorated his trashy gold villa's as he did was (or is) NOT a prolific user of cocaine. Also, he seems like someone who would abuse prescription pills because they are legal and doctor approved. I don't buy that he's NEVER tasted alcohol either.

by Anonymousreply 22August 27, 2016 4:54 AM

[quote]I didn't post it for you, [R20] -- no matter what your mother says.

So you posted it for the neo-Nazi (i.e. alt-right) trolls?

Pray tell, how old do you think I am, anyway?

by Anonymousreply 23August 27, 2016 4:57 AM

For those of you who are comparing Donald and Bill, I can tell you first hand that Trump makes Bill Clinton look like a boy scout. It will come out how he raped an underage teen while with that Epstein pos. He can suppress the press for only so long. I can't believe that any of you, on this thread or others, can endorse Trump, regardless of his opposition. Disgusting.

by Anonymousreply 24August 27, 2016 4:58 AM

But didn't Bill run with Epstein, too?

by Anonymousreply 25August 27, 2016 5:00 AM

Yes, he was on Epstein's private plane but no one has accused Bill of rape. It's a clusterfuck, for sure, but, from what I know and have heard, Bill isn't into anything rough. Trump, on the other hand, married an 'escort' who will do and accept anything and everything.

by Anonymousreply 26August 27, 2016 5:06 AM

The Clintons have been knee deep in crooked shit since Arkansas. The trouble is their crooked shit results in dead bodies. Now we find that crazy cunt sold the State Department. I was robed.

by Anonymousreply 27August 27, 2016 12:10 PM

Ted Rall is a horse's ass. He's also as lefty as they get.

His call to impeach Obama stems from his disappointment that BHO did not give us The Revolution.

by Anonymousreply 28August 27, 2016 12:49 PM

[post redacted because linking to dailymail.co.uk clearly indicates that the poster is either a troll or an idiot (probably both, honestly.) Our advice is that you just ignore this poster but whatever you do, don't click on any link to this putrid rag.]

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by Anonymousreply 29August 27, 2016 1:30 PM

This election is already over. All the recent negative stories about Clinton are to make people think it's still a horse race. It's quite clear Trump doesn't want to win and never did. His supporters might as well deal with that reality right now.

by Anonymousreply 30August 27, 2016 1:38 PM

It's even possible Clinton and Trump planned this all out. A more reputable candidate could have beat Clinton.

by Anonymousreply 31August 27, 2016 1:44 PM

The debates will only serve to strengthen Clinton's position. I don't know that Donald will even show up, which of course will serve Clinton well. I've read people saying that a terrorist event or other huge act of violence could serve the Trump campaign well. But to my thinking, it would only make voters think about how ill prepared he is, how he rushes to Twitter to shoot off his mouth rather than strategizing solutions and ways to help -- and how calm and experienced Clinton is in a crisis.

by Anonymousreply 32August 27, 2016 1:56 PM

[quote]how calm and experienced Clinton is in a crisis...

...where she implements her agenda no matter what the circumstances.

by Anonymousreply 33August 27, 2016 2:01 PM

Ted Rall is a Bernie Bro. He hates HRC from the left of the spectrum. He's right, though: it's all about memorable "zingers" (and, of course, non-verbals that can become GIFs).

by Anonymousreply 34August 27, 2016 2:11 PM

R9 I think that just about says it all about this election...."so tell me Dolly, I need to hear your learned political wisdom..."

by Anonymousreply 35August 27, 2016 2:12 PM

Totally disagree with OP. On polls where the question "Would you never consider voting for Trump/Clinton?" Trump typically scores 50% where Clinton typically scores 44%.

THAT needle is very, very difficult to move.

Trump is also far behind where Romney was at this point in 2012 in the polls. Trump is also more consistently behind than Romney was at this point in 2012.

Any kind of major terrorist attack where a high numbers of Americans are killed (which Trump supporters seem to be hoping for) would likely make people vote with the more familiar, stable candidate.

Typically, Presidential debates only serve to solidify the base, unless there is a major gaffe, which is much more likely on Trump's part.

Trump is toast.

by Anonymousreply 36August 27, 2016 2:20 PM

I'm certain the Trump campaign is most fearful of Hillary irritating Donald to the point where he lets out "bitch" or "cunt" on live television.

by Anonymousreply 37August 27, 2016 2:23 PM

R26, Several women have accused Bill Clinton of rape.

by Anonymousreply 38August 27, 2016 2:25 PM

In those space-capsule-looking pantsuits Hillary has been wearing, she's looking more and more like Humpty Dumpty.

by Anonymousreply 39August 27, 2016 2:27 PM

R37 We should have a pool on when that happens...if it's said often in private, it's only a matter of time before he lets that fly...

by Anonymousreply 40August 27, 2016 2:43 PM

It will be a close election. Those calling for a landslide either way are insane. The Devilish orangutan and the Depends wearing Succubus will give each other a run for their money.

by Anonymousreply 41August 27, 2016 2:46 PM

Isn't that what Presidents are elected to do, r33? Implement their agenda?

by Anonymousreply 42August 27, 2016 2:50 PM

R41 is a moron. There were people up to election day in 2012 saying Romney would win or it would be close. Obama won by 126 electoral votes, and Clinton will win by an even bigger margin.

It will be as close to a landslide as you can get in 2016.

Again, Trump is toast and his been since June.

by Anonymousreply 43August 27, 2016 2:53 PM

[quote]Ted Rall is a Bernie Bro. He hates HRC from the left of the spectrum.

Yup. That was pretty evident from what he wrote in that column. Any who can write, "But her vulnerabilities are more serious," and "that she has gotten a relatively free ride from journalists and pundits" (when the opposite is true) or that "Secretary Clinton was reluctant to agree to any debates" is full of shit. It's completely biased and completely fact-free.

Look, you absolutely can make the point that this isn't going to be a "debate," in the sense of an adjudicated college debate team, where impartial judges will be watching. In such a debate, where command of facts and figures is critical, where keeping your cool and staying focused matters, Clinton would mop the floor with Trump. But modern Presidential debates are about staying on message, about avoiding the gaffe that will be on the front page of the next day's news ("There is no Soviet domination of Eastern Europe" - Gerald Ford), and so on. In that arena, it is correct to note that Trump has just as much of a shot as Clinton.

What Trump is going to do is likely to be a "Gish Gallop" (see link for more), spewing bullshit as rapidly as he can so that Clinton is overwhelmed and doesn't know what to push back on first. It's commonly perceived that Romney did that in his first debate with Obama and it worked, throwing Obama off his game. However, Obama handled it in the subsequent debates, and Biden handled Ryan who tried to do the same thing. And Clinton has their experience to draw on, as well as the experience of watching Trump in the Republican debates.

And Clinton, unlike Trump, is going to prepare because that's what she does (and what he doesn't do). Trump doesn't have the patience to prepare, to practice, to think ahead about what he will do. He has an overweening confidence that he's invincible and that he can handle her. He is also, however, notoriously thin-skinned and she's managed to get under his skin in the past. If she can do that again, get him flustered, she wins. And she's got the advantage that "picking on a girl" is still seen as distasteful; Trump could very easily go overboard and thereby win sympathy for Clinton, just as happened in Clinton's first Senate run.

As for Rall's specific points:

- Clinton can't get into the gutter: She doesn't need to. She can use Trump's own words and flip-flopping against him without getting into the gutter. She can go after his alt-right connections without getting into the gutter. She doesn't need to get personal; he's already given her far more ammunition than she's given him.

- Secrecy of tax returns vs. Clinton's speeches: Easy, say that she'll release the latter when he releases the former. Done.

- "Her hypocrisies and inconsistencies comparatively unexamined, she emerges from her primary campaign untested and untempered": In a word, bullshit. She had far more negative press than any other candidate.

- Ethics: Rall is simply wrong on the facts here, both with respect to emails and the Clinton Foundation. It is true that Trump will likely go after both but this is the simplest thing for Clinton to handle since he's already shown her what he's going to bring with his frequent tweets.

- Bill on a convicted pedophile's plane: a) contrary to Rall's assertion, it was reported, and b) Trump was on that plane, as well, and has been accused of rape of an underage girl. Trump isn't going to go there.

Basically, there's nothing there.

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by Anonymousreply 44August 27, 2016 2:53 PM

R43 is a Hillarybottom/idiot/Hillaryrimmer, You have no fucking idea how the lopsided election will be idiot. On what fucking planet did anyone say that Romney was winning? If they lived on the Faux News planet! Stop comparing that election to this one, Hillary and Trump have more unfavorables than almost any other candidates. The election will be close with the evil Hillary as the victor. Her wicked lackey Trump has been throwing the election since the start BUT there are more than enough people that he has fooled out there.

by Anonymousreply 45August 27, 2016 3:07 PM

Ted Rall is a nut with ZERO credibility.

He's a disgruntled, insane Bernie supporter. I was a Bernie supporter too, but I dont allow that to cloud my view of what's going on in the race.

Trump is toast.

by Anonymousreply 46August 27, 2016 3:39 PM

Will the cunt be able to stand that long?

by Anonymousreply 47August 27, 2016 3:52 PM

[quote]Will the cunt be able to stand that long?

Says the four hundred pounder who hasn't gotten out of bed in two months.

by Anonymousreply 48August 27, 2016 3:59 PM

Maybe they will have a strobe light on the debate stage and we can all watch Hillary stroke out. Good times

by Anonymousreply 49August 27, 2016 4:00 PM

Look at cunt Clinton's circle of friends and associates. Has there ever been a politician associated with so many convicted felons?

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by Anonymousreply 50August 27, 2016 4:00 PM

There's no race, and hasn't been for a while.

Clinton will walk into this and leave like a pro. Drumpf will mess up his Ailes provided answers, and will resort to his usual stockpile of insults.

I just hope for Hillary's sake he wears deodorant. Orangey's been sweating like a stuffed pig lately. I'm surprised that two dollar toupee hasn't slid off his head.

by Anonymousreply 51August 27, 2016 4:04 PM

Trump would win in a landslide if the first time she opened her cunt mouth he walked over and said "shut your fucking lying cunt mouth and go away and stop inflicting your damage on the American people" Then punched he right in her cunt mouth and walked off the stage.

by Anonymousreply 52August 27, 2016 4:05 PM

[quote]Then punched he right in her cunt mouth and walked off the stage.

He's too fucking fat to be that mobile.

by Anonymousreply 53August 27, 2016 4:07 PM

Yeah. Must have been a stand in when he was down in LA visiting the flood victims. It's your cunt Clinton that can't move.

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by Anonymousreply 54August 27, 2016 4:10 PM

R45 on this planet, you fucking moron.

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by Anonymousreply 55August 27, 2016 4:43 PM

[quote]It's even possible Clinton and Trump planned this all out. A more reputable candidate could have beat Clinton.

For the love of God, would you stop with this shit? Trump became the nominee specifically because millions of REPUBLICANS voted for him. The fools who keep repeating this, never let us in on the "mind-control" Clinton performed on millions of people to get them to actually support and vote for that orange clown. The GOP can't accept that they created this. Period. They created an environment where the very first president of color was "other" and it's been downhill ever since. A leading birther (did he ever send his goons to HI btw or should we put that atop the pile of bullshit this orange thing has said over decades?) became their nominee.

[quote]Another terrorist attack could prompt voters to turn to the right.

And guess which disgusting group of so-called America-loving assholes want to see it happen? Soulless, orange clown-supporting scum jerking themselves off to the very thought of dead Americans because they're just so America-loving that seeing a bigoted and racist reality star win is the ultimate goal...and only hate and death brings them that goal. Sick fucks.

by Anonymousreply 56August 27, 2016 4:56 PM

I don't think it will come down to the debates. No one is changing their minds.

I heard on a conservative radio show, someone call in and state that they are okay with Trumps waffling on Immigration although it was what appealed to them in the first place, and if he says the wrong thing from time to time, and we actually don't know what he would do, but the alternative is Clinton and we know what she would do, she would destroy the country. He stated that nothing Trump would do would be as bad and they feel that he would make better supreme court decisions and couldn't cause much harm.

I feel exactly the same way but would replace Trump with Clinton, she may have done questionable thinkings with the Clinton Foundation but in the end she is better than Trump regardless of what comes out because I believe Trump will destroy the country and she would make better supreme court decisions.

The host to his credit did agree with most of his callers points but did make it clear that he wasn't so sure that Trump wouldn't make things worse.

No one is changing their minds.

by Anonymousreply 57August 27, 2016 4:57 PM

r52, what the hell is wrong with you?

by Anonymousreply 58August 27, 2016 5:00 PM

I think the media has trained us to believe these "debates" (they are nothing of the kind), are a big factor. I don't believe that. I think by then most voters have their choice set in stone. What changes is who comes out to vote and who stays home.

by Anonymousreply 59August 27, 2016 5:03 PM

Trust me, there are still millions of fools who haven't decided.

by Anonymousreply 60August 27, 2016 5:05 PM

It's funny to me that berniebros are so self-centered. They'd rather see Trump get elected than Hill because she beat Saint Bernie in the primary.

So much for their convictions!

And so they're cranking out ammo for the Trumpkins to use in the GE.

STILL.

by Anonymousreply 61August 27, 2016 5:10 PM

r60, I think their decision is more like if they stay at home or vote. No one is jumping camps. Voters leaning Trump may decide to come out and vote if he does well or stay home if he doesn't but they are not going to vote for Hillary. Voters leaning Hillary, may do the same.

Those who have no clue, FUCK THEM THEY ARE IDIOTS, stay home, my God, if I run into someone who doesn't know yet I will smack them in the face.

by Anonymousreply 62August 27, 2016 5:11 PM

Remember the Republican debates?

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by Anonymousreply 63August 27, 2016 5:25 PM

Has it been announced yet who will be moderating the first debate?

by Anonymousreply 64August 27, 2016 6:28 PM

I hope it's Gwen Ifill. And I'm sure when Trump falls flat on his face, his fans won't come after Gwen because she's...on PBS.

by Anonymousreply 65August 27, 2016 6:35 PM

Kellyanne Cunway will be feeding him lines through an earpiece, IF he even shows up.

by Anonymousreply 66August 27, 2016 7:27 PM

There's some real Dorys on here eh ?!

by Anonymousreply 67August 27, 2016 8:35 PM

R30, for the win.

by Anonymousreply 68August 27, 2016 8:42 PM

R31? Your theory makes no sense.

There were EIGHTEEN republicans running for President! This ridiculous meme that if Hillary were running against ANYONE ELSE she would lose is fucking ridiculous. If the GOP had wanted someone else they should've chosen someone else! THEY CHOSE TRUMP!!!

The republicans CHOSE Trump for their nominee.

The people who hate Hillary cannot accept the fact that we CHOSE Hillary. She is not and has never been a compromise candidate. Not to me. And not to the millions of democrats who are going to elect her.

by Anonymousreply 69August 27, 2016 8:53 PM

[quote][T]he media has trained us to believe these "debates"... are a big factor ... by then most voters have their choice set in stone.

Tell that to Mittens after the first debate in '12. Or, try repeating that after the second debate, when Obama took the lead back.

by Anonymousreply 70August 27, 2016 8:56 PM

One more thing.

In the debate, Trump is going to throw out the fictional meme about The Clinton Foundation being a "pay for play" with The State Department, or an ATM for The Clintons.

Hillary is then going to have three uninterrupted minutes to explain to the Americans who still don't know EXACTLY what the charity does all over the world.

If for nothing else she deserves the time she'll have to shame the people who need shaming.

by Anonymousreply 71August 27, 2016 9:01 PM

Wouldn't it be the best if cunt Clinton stroked out right in the middle of the debate?

by Anonymousreply 72August 27, 2016 9:03 PM

[quote]Trump vs. Clinton Will Come Down to the Debates

If that is true, I can now rest easy. No amount of prep in a few months could prepare Trump to debate her. He will get in some cheap shots and try to unsettle her, but remember how she got through those eight hours of congressional hearings. Hopefully she will not spend too much time defending herself, but keep hammering at him on substance, of which he has little.

by Anonymousreply 73August 27, 2016 9:13 PM

"For Trump, I think there is one tool he has that he has never used but should. The one sign that he has any "moral code" is his abstinence. He doesn't drink, smoke, or do drugs at all because his brother died from alcoholism. In the midst of him flip flopping on all other positions politically and changing marriages, this is the one area of his life he has never changed or compromised. Ironically, he never speaks about it on the trail. If he could speak openly about that, connect his experience to the experience of many other families who have lost loved ones, he could relate to people.There's a human moment there. He could make substance abuse a signature of his campaign, say he wants to help those with drug addiction and come up with a proposal. Actually, if he re framed it carefully, he could use it to adjust his rhetoric on immigration. If he made the focus of immigration about potential drugs coming in, rather than the character of people, he would have a better shot there. Say "Listen, I know what it's like to lose someone to substance abuse. I never want another family to experience that heartbreak. That's why we need to secure our borders, not because Hispanics are bad people, but because I am afraid of what substances are being brought into our country."

That's a good point, but he wouldn't be smart enough to frame the conversation that way. He also is tries too hard to be macho to open up in a vulnerable way

by Anonymousreply 74August 27, 2016 9:16 PM

You're berating Trump for flip flopping? LOL

by Anonymousreply 75August 27, 2016 9:26 PM

[quote]Trump would win in a landslide if the first time she opened her cunt mouth he walked over and said "shut your fucking lying cunt mouth and go away and stop inflicting your damage on the American people" Then punched her right in her cunt mouth and walked off the stage.

Well, there you go--if Trump did that, every Democratic voter in the country, as well as every Republican too disgusted/ashamed/horrified at what he's doing to the party will switch over and vote for him in a "landslide"

by Anonymousreply 76August 27, 2016 9:51 PM

[quote]You're berating Trump for flip flopping? LOL

Politicians flip-flop, Trump somersaults. If you hear him give his view on something when you're pouring a cup of coffee, you'll be lucky if it stays the same by the time you're done stirring in the half-half.

by Anonymousreply 77August 27, 2016 10:07 PM

Tell me one important issue Hillary has come out on the right side of. She has changed her position on just about every single issue imaginable. Some not just once.

by Anonymousreply 78August 27, 2016 10:17 PM

The right is fantasizing that HRC at the first (and, presumably, last) debate will be a trembling, spastic, drooling, aphasic, pants-wetting, incoherent mess.

by Anonymousreply 79August 27, 2016 10:19 PM

[quote]Tell me one important issue Hillary has come out on the right side of.

She didn't come out of her mother being Donald Fucking Trump, so that's enough for me.

Don't even try to pull this shit where you attempt to rationalize a Trump presidency - even as a hypothetical, it's horrific. I happen to dislike Hillary based on facts, not delusions, but I still want her as president over Trump. No rational human being would ever try and proactively cheer on the very idea of Trump as president of the United States. I mean my God, I see the type of absolute trash who support him. It's embarrassing.

[quote]The right is fantasizing that HRC at the first (and, presumably, last) debate will be a trembling, spastic, drooling, aphasic, pants-wetting, incoherent mess.

And she'd still be more qualified than that orange baby-man.

by Anonymousreply 80August 27, 2016 10:23 PM

r69.....Dems arent the only ones voting for Clinton.....quite a few Repubs are too, from prominent politicians on down. I dont know any Dems who are voting for Trump....but I know quite a few hard core Repubs that are voting for Clinton.

by Anonymousreply 81August 27, 2016 10:33 PM

I cannot stand her and I was accused of being a Freeper every time I called out the PUMAS who blindly worshiped her - and I'm voting for her because that's how much I fear the idea of Trump winning.

Many of us voting for her are doing so more in a "Scared Straight" way than because we actually like her, so when you Trumpkins try and claim we're all Hilbots, you're wasting your time. The fact that you'd look saner voting third party, should give you pause.

by Anonymousreply 82August 27, 2016 10:50 PM

I don't think he would trounce Hillary, at least if it's a knowledge-based debate, but if he goes berserk on her like he did against Jeb Bush and Ted Cruz, I don't think she would know what to do; she's likely not used to being called a piece of trash, at least not to her face.

by Anonymousreply 83August 27, 2016 10:53 PM

Eleven hours R73.

Cool as a cucumber for ELEVEN hours with those idiots.

Donald Trump is not capable of staying alert & focused for the one and a half hours he'll have to stand there next to Hillary.

She will be a fine POTUS.

by Anonymousreply 84August 27, 2016 11:05 PM

He'll do a shitty job (if he shows up) at the debate, then run to twitter the next day like a little girl to either claim victory or just attack her over something said during the debate...because he isn't smart enough to do it in the moment. He needs hours to go by before he can actually respond.

by Anonymousreply 85August 27, 2016 11:13 PM

Again the things you imagine Donald Trump would do cunt Clinton has done. She's the one that ran from debates.

by Anonymousreply 86August 27, 2016 11:26 PM

What debate did she run from?

by Anonymousreply 87August 27, 2016 11:29 PM

With Bernie.

by Anonymousreply 88August 27, 2016 11:32 PM

She never debated Bernie?

by Anonymousreply 89August 27, 2016 11:37 PM

WHO, R38? You're full of shit.

by Anonymousreply 90August 27, 2016 11:39 PM

No he wanted more debates and she ran. You know that. Or wait. Maybe you don't. I find cunt Clinton supporters don't really seem to know her at all.

by Anonymousreply 91August 27, 2016 11:39 PM

Oh this is for R90. This is who feminist cunt Clinton stayed married to. She must have been upset that Gary Ridgway was already taken.

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by Anonymousreply 92August 27, 2016 11:41 PM

r13, "moving in the wrong direction"? Total FOX propaganda. Do Americans recall the price of gasoline a decade ago? When a "pre-existing condition" could disallow a person from buying health insurance? When our young soldiers were dying and getting maimed in an illegal war in Iraq? Mortgage-lending/foreclosures fraud?

by Anonymousreply 93August 27, 2016 11:42 PM

That's right, r92. Desperate and craven Republicans do what they always do when they reveal themselves to be liars and phonies with zero plans or even plans for plans to do one damned thing to help Americans who aren't multi-millionaires or more---distract with bringing up sex, abortion, and gay rights.

Oh, and guns. Can't forget about guns.

by Anonymousreply 94August 27, 2016 11:46 PM

R92, darling, don't post links to right wing sites. We will only laugh at you.

by Anonymousreply 95August 27, 2016 11:46 PM

She debated Bernie about a million times but the old blowhard was losing so he called for a million MORE debates in the hopes she'd epically screw up and he'd get a deus ex machina moment.

That's what the bernbots are referring to.

by Anonymousreply 96August 27, 2016 11:46 PM

HRC didn't "run from" Bernie; she swatted him away like the annoying insect he was.

by Anonymousreply 97August 27, 2016 11:49 PM

If he does "soften" on immigration, then there isn't much difference between Trump and Hillary -- both are pro-Israel so both will keep us involved militarily in the ME. Hillary supports only hetereonormalized behavior in gays, so if you aren't married and parents, in the military, and related to someone in power to help, there won't be much to expect from her. Trump has fundies on his side, but they will attack only those not well situated via family name and nepotism.

by Anonymousreply 98August 27, 2016 11:52 PM

No, I'm pretty sure she ran away - first, in the NY primary campaign, screaming that she's a Female Victim of Harassment, and then, in California, when polls showed a tight race, by not appearing at all. She didn't treat him like an insect, she treated him like a lion who could slice her in pieces and devour the nomination.

by Anonymousreply 99August 27, 2016 11:53 PM

Obama is a popular and successful President. Why would Hillary run away from that?

by Anonymousreply 100August 28, 2016 12:26 AM

The idea she's running away from Donald is indeed laughable; unlike Trump, she has the actual ability of saying sentences that make sense, that have a beginning and an end.

This is actually from one of Trump's speeches:

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by Anonymousreply 101August 28, 2016 12:31 AM

As one post above noted, when D gets stressed, shit just pops out of his mouth.

The debates will be very entertaining.

by Anonymousreply 102August 28, 2016 12:39 AM

The first debate will be do or die for Trump. Everyone still talks about the first 1960 Kennedy-Nixon debate as an historical benchmark in televised debates, but many forget that there were two or three additional Kennedy-Nixon debates that year and I'm sure the ratings for those didn't even come near the first debate.

by Anonymousreply 103August 28, 2016 12:54 AM

[quote]She didn't treat him like an insect, she treated him like a lion who could slice her in pieces and devour the nomination.

Well, see, that might make sense if she had actually lose any of the debates against Bernie or if he had found a way to pierce her reserve. Sadly for your revisionist history, neither of these is true. As for the California thing, have you really forgotten that Bernie invited Trump? Please. She ignored this as the supremely foolish notion that it was.

by Anonymousreply 104August 28, 2016 12:55 AM

His job in the debate is to tell lies so outrageous she has no way to present a positive message, and to get her to loser her cool.

My guess is, that's a harder job than it looks, and it will take him a couple tries to get it, but then it will be too late.

by Anonymousreply 105August 28, 2016 12:56 AM

He will succeed in making it about her instead of him, though, as she just loves talking about herself.

by Anonymousreply 106August 28, 2016 12:57 AM

I'm sure the Trump campaign has shown him tapes of the debate with Rick Lazio, who made the mistake of crossing the stage and asking Hillary to sign a petition during the debate.

by Anonymousreply 107August 28, 2016 12:58 AM

Trump should wear a lapel button depicting him posing with Hillary at his wedding to Melania, just to break the ice.

by Anonymousreply 108August 28, 2016 12:59 AM

Hill's only chance in the debate would to be Bill's ventriloquist dummy with his hand and arm way up her ass. I just hope she doesn't get Hep C or HIV from it

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by Anonymousreply 109August 28, 2016 1:01 AM

Dream on, r99. (He lost, you know.)

by Anonymousreply 110August 28, 2016 1:03 AM

I just don't want to hear about her "small-business owner father" for the umpteenth time!

by Anonymousreply 111August 28, 2016 1:07 AM

I don't think being a teetotaler about drinking and drugs and smoking makes one morally superior. In fact, I think never ever having consumed one single drink in one's life shows that one is fearful of succumbing. Which is a valid fear, especially if one has witnessed destructive abuse in a close friend or family member, but don't say that it makes you better than someone who has consumed alcohol moderately, or taken a few social drugs, or smoked when one was a teenager.

by Anonymousreply 112August 28, 2016 1:24 AM

Will cunt Clinton fart in this debate too?

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by Anonymousreply 113August 28, 2016 1:28 AM

*yawn* We get it, R113. You don't like Clinton. Well goody for you. Now run along and play.

by Anonymousreply 114August 28, 2016 1:41 AM

He can win the audience over with a few good jokes and lines.

by Anonymousreply 115August 28, 2016 1:43 AM

r113 is why I don't worry about Donald Trump.

That kind of nonsense may well work with his base. But women totally get the misogyny.

Keep calling her a bitch and a cunt.

It just increases her margin of victory.

Silly man.

by Anonymousreply 116August 28, 2016 1:44 AM

Really, R113?

And here we thought Trump appealed to the lcd. Thank you for proving us wrong.

by Anonymousreply 117August 28, 2016 1:46 AM

R116 You should worry about Trump. Hill (aka The Cunt ) and her "run out the clock strategy" is being perceived as an unexcusable weakness on her part. And the car is definitely out of gas with the whole "war on women" canard....

by Anonymousreply 118August 28, 2016 1:54 AM

She's a bitch and a cunt.

by Anonymousreply 119August 28, 2016 1:55 AM

R119 = Donald Trump

by Anonymousreply 120August 28, 2016 1:56 AM

[quote] At least the debates will force both of them to tell America what they actually plan to do. So far, Hillary talks about how awful Trump is, and Trump talks about how awful Hillary is. They will have to answer questions about themselves at the debates. Both candidates still have very high unfavorable ratings, so there are probably still a lot of undecideds. They better get the very best moderators as these debates are extremely important.

It's comments like this one from R12 that worry me about this election. How many people out there think Hillary is just talking about Trump? She's a policy wonk. She talks about her plans. They are published on her website. Do you have to be spoon fed this information - or can you manage to use google?

by Anonymousreply 121August 28, 2016 1:58 AM

[quote]an unexcusable weakness on her part.

"unexcusable" isn't a word, you human speed bump.

by Anonymousreply 122August 28, 2016 2:00 AM

Will the ratings for the 1st Trump-Clinton debate be the highest ever?

by Anonymousreply 123August 28, 2016 2:02 AM

Sorry, R121, but the only thing Hillary's been talking about the last few weeks is how Bush was so smart, how Reagan was so lucid, in sum how the Republicans were all so great, before Trump came along.

I know her platform is on certain points very well detailed, but she doesn't campaign on policy - she probably doesn't think the average voter can understand her anyway, and so she campaigns on platitudes and her ability to pander to just about everyone.

by Anonymousreply 124August 28, 2016 2:03 AM

Assuming Trump shows up, and I don't believe he will, aren't the expectation of his performance so low that all he needs to do is sound a little bit presidential? He can win by just not losing the debate overwhelmingly. The expectations for Hillary are much higher. She has to leave him in the dust.

by Anonymousreply 125August 28, 2016 2:03 AM

Good point, R125.

That's what some of the political analysts are saying, too.

Hillary is expected to be a good debater.

So if Trump just manages not to fall over, he will exceed expectations.

by Anonymousreply 126August 28, 2016 2:06 AM

Expectations will be adjusted to produce a pro-Hillary narrative. Even if Hillary has a bad debate, and even if a miracle happens and Trump learns to speak in full sentences, all major papers will announce a massive Hillary victory. They did that even when she was debating Sanders, who's an infinitely better speaker than Trump. The media is not against her this election cycle. You have even the Weekly Standard and assorted neocons supporting her. They will push for her no matter what.

by Anonymousreply 127August 28, 2016 2:10 AM

The media is pushing Hillary at this point. However there was one debate where Trump did badly in the Republican debates, and people still thought he won.

by Anonymousreply 128August 28, 2016 2:14 AM

Who ever yells the loudest wins!

by Anonymousreply 129August 28, 2016 2:14 AM

I wish the first debate was this week.

We have to wait until Monday, September 26.

by Anonymousreply 130August 28, 2016 2:22 AM

Will there be exciting plot twists before that episode, R130?

by Anonymousreply 131August 28, 2016 2:27 AM

R122 Sorry "inexcusable" .... Now screw that strap-on into place on your Hillary doll and go fuck yourself whilst dressed up as Huma.......

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by Anonymousreply 132August 28, 2016 2:29 AM

I think most people will be tuning in just to see if cunt Clinton can stay awake, or maybe even alive, through the whole debate.

by Anonymousreply 133August 28, 2016 2:30 AM

They will be tuning in for Trump making jokes.

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by Anonymousreply 134August 28, 2016 2:33 AM
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by Anonymousreply 135August 28, 2016 2:39 AM

Hillbottoms like R121 do us Dems no favors.

Yes, she's a policy wonk and yes she's got some poorly laid out, unfathomably dense position papers up on her website. But the people she needs to vote for her actually do need to be spoonfed and the fact that no one knows what she stands for other than "Not Trump" is a real issue.

But seriously R121, providing condescending answers to legitimate questions and denying that there are any warts just drives people to Trump and reinforces the worst stereotypes about Clinton and the sorts of people who like her.

I am really staring to believe that Trump never wanted to be president, was thrown for a loop when he won and goes back and forth on a daily basis as to whether he should actually try or just give up and spend the rest of the time giving speeches in places with nice hotels and good fast food restaurants.

The debates could be scary on the old "never argue with a crazy person, people might not be able to tell the difference" theory. So Hillary says "Russia should never have been allowed to take Crimea" and Trump responds "I like ketchup on my french fries. You don't have ketchup, you might as well forget about the fries. Am I right America?" The moderator gamely tries to ask Trump about Russia again, and just says "I'm talking about ketchup now Anderson. My position on Russia has not changed. But ketchup..."

by Anonymousreply 136August 28, 2016 2:43 AM

[quote]They will be tuning in for Trump making jokes.

Yes, and also to watch the fireworks as these two strong personalities clash!

by Anonymousreply 137August 28, 2016 2:46 AM

Audience goes, "Yeah, ketchup!"

by Anonymousreply 138August 28, 2016 2:46 AM

Yes, R137. It will be HUGE ratings!

by Anonymousreply 139August 28, 2016 2:46 AM

R124 - It is a political campaign. She has given major speeches on policy. I'm sorry you can be bothered to look past the sound bites. She has to persuade voters like you to vote for her. That seems to take a sound bite rather than a policy paper.

by Anonymousreply 140August 28, 2016 2:48 AM

[quote]It will be HUGE ratings!

Has there ever been a political debate as anticipated as the one between Trump & Hillary?

by Anonymousreply 141August 28, 2016 2:53 AM

These bloggers post their pages on DL and other sites, and then make multiple comments to increase the hits to advertise their names and blogs Feeding it is what is sought.

by Anonymousreply 142August 28, 2016 2:53 AM

Hillary's team has done a terrible job of letting people know what she stands for.

#ImWithHer just says "I'm voting for Hillary" - it's all about her and not the voter. That's why Trump was able to take it and turn it into "I'm With You"

She needs a version of Yes We Can.

We may all think "Making American Great Again" is moronic, but it's a strong clear message.

by Anonymousreply 143August 28, 2016 2:54 AM

I can't think of one, R141

by Anonymousreply 144August 28, 2016 2:56 AM

Every time Trump answers a question at the debates, the moderator will turn to Kellyanne Conway who will say...What Mr Trump means is.....

by Anonymousreply 145August 28, 2016 2:58 AM

R143 - I don't think you should be allowed to vote.

by Anonymousreply 146August 28, 2016 3:00 AM

R143 And Hillary will run to the bathroom after each question to quickly read crib notes because she is too deaf to hear the answers in her hidden ear microphone.....

by Anonymousreply 147August 28, 2016 3:02 AM

Trump was not a good debater on substance. He did not even know what the nuclear triad meant. Any other candidate would have been driven from the race for that failure of knowledge.

He got rewarded for name calling, personal insults, and antics. The media sees him as a big moneymaker for them, while declaring their disdain. They are in-on it for profits.

by Anonymousreply 148August 28, 2016 3:07 AM

And Hillary thought Nancy Reagan was a hero in the battle against AIDS.

by Anonymousreply 149August 28, 2016 3:15 AM

In rehearsals, Hillary is using Anthony Weiner as Donald Trump.

by Anonymousreply 150August 28, 2016 3:41 AM

Which one of these three cunts is the cuntiest?

1. Hillary Rodham Clinton 2. Debbie Wasserman Schultz 3. Christine Callaghan Quinn

by Anonymousreply 151August 28, 2016 3:46 AM

R151 Add Donna Brazile to the list and it'll be a 4 way tie.........

by Anonymousreply 152August 28, 2016 3:48 AM

I've read comments in other threads that say DL turns into a cesspool during election cycles, but this is starting to remind me of second-grade playground conversations.

by Anonymousreply 153August 28, 2016 4:12 AM
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by Anonymousreply 154August 28, 2016 4:14 AM

[quote]And Hillary thought Nancy Reagan was a hero in the battle against AIDS.

Yeah, that was a surprising mistake on Hillary's part.

I assume she meant to say Alzheimer's.

by Anonymousreply 155August 28, 2016 4:26 AM

Hillaryhavingaball

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by Anonymousreply 156August 28, 2016 4:36 AM

Who's that fat guy behind her?

by Anonymousreply 157August 28, 2016 4:39 AM

LOL the debates will have no impact whatsoever. Trump is an idiot - Hillary is a brilliant debater. Angry white males and white nationalists will vote for him, and rational Repubs + Obama coalition (Blacks/Latinos/Jews/Gays/Women) will vote for her. Good morning, Madam President.

by Anonymousreply 158August 28, 2016 4:40 AM

This thread's "cunt Clinton" poster = Eric Cartman.

by Anonymousreply 159August 28, 2016 5:15 AM

[quote]LOL the debates will have no impact whatsoever.

We don't know that yet.

We'll have to wait until next month to find out.

by Anonymousreply 160August 28, 2016 5:17 AM

60% of the posters on Datalounge = Eric Cartman.

by Anonymousreply 161August 28, 2016 5:43 AM

CLINTON will shine as always not so for DUMP

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by Anonymousreply 162August 28, 2016 5:47 AM

Preview of Hillary's opening statement (click on volume):

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by Anonymousreply 163August 28, 2016 8:44 AM

[quote]no one has accused Bill of rape.

Beg to differ

by Anonymousreply 164August 28, 2016 8:48 AM

R153 - were you around in the "peg" years?

by Anonymousreply 165August 28, 2016 9:46 AM

Unless I missed it, I can't believe that you folks have forgotten the 2000 debates. Al Gore was so much smarter, Bush was so much dumber, is was obvious that Gore was going to wipe the floor with GWB. Well, I t didn't exactly work out, did it...

Bush came out swinging, slamming the Clinton Administration's lack of morality. Rather than simply telling Bush to STFU, Gore just stood there and took it. He ended up looking like a wimp - which would be confirmed by his poor judgment in running as far away from the Clintons as he could.

I'm hoping that Clinton won't be so stupid, but I'm also just a little nervous that the low expectations for Trump will backfire. He's ignorant, hateful, probably a little nuts, and nothing more than a 2-bit con artist. One thing he's not, is stupid.

by Anonymousreply 166August 28, 2016 9:51 AM

[quote] But the people she needs to vote for her actually do need to be spoonfed and the fact that no one knows what she stands for other than "Not Trump" is a real issue.

It's such an "issue" that people stopped wondering IF she'd win and are now discussing how big of a landslide she's going to win by.

by Anonymousreply 167August 28, 2016 11:00 AM

It's an "issue" silly Hillbottom @R167 because when she wins, which is a given due to Trump's self-destruction, and actually starts to try and govern, it will be difficult for her because she won't be able to claim people voted for her policies and that's why she won in a landslide. GOP, which is still likely to control Congress, will claim she won because people voted against Trump and not for her.

But when she is elected people will indeed get to call her "Madam President" and wear even fancier pants suits which is all R167 and his ilk care about.

by Anonymousreply 168August 28, 2016 11:12 AM

You're so angry, r168. The disappointment must be really getting to you by now.

If Hillary were to win 400 electoral votes and 80% of the popular vote, she would face the exact same opposition from the GOP that she'd face if she squeaked by with a close win. It will make no difference whatsoever. The fact that you think it will shows just how limited your understanding of the current political scene is.

But stamp your feet and call me a Hillbottom if it makes you feel better. It won't change a thing.

by Anonymousreply 169August 28, 2016 11:18 AM

[quote] Yeah, that was a surprising mistake on Hillary's part.

[quote] I assume she meant to say Alzheimer's.

Or, she was just doing what she's been doing non-stop the last few weeks - pandering to the Republicans at the expense of her liberal supporters. Trying to get the "moderate Republican" vote by playing the role of the Great Unifier, the Hardcore Democrat Who Nonetheless Loves You Republicans.

That she didn't predict the liberal backlash proves two things: 1) she takes liberals for granted; 2) she's an overrated politician and has bad political judgment.

by Anonymousreply 170August 28, 2016 11:19 AM

You're a Hillbottom R160 because you refuse to admit she has any faults.

And if she won 400 electoral votes and 80% of the popular vote against a candidate who argued the issues, she'd also be working with a Democratic Congress.

And wearing beautiful couture pantsuits. And hosting FABULOUS dinners. And being called "Madam President" Just like your sister's Barbie back in the day.

by Anonymousreply 171August 28, 2016 11:35 AM

r171, your anger's getting the better of you, dear. You weren't making a whole lot of sense to begin with, but you've devolved into spewing word salad with this post. Like all concern trolls on DL who are so very concerned about how badly Hillary is waging her winning campaign, you wind up making homophobic cracks about her supporters because that's really all you have left after your "concern" is revealed as the bullshit it is.

Still won't change a thing. She's winning, she'll win, and then she'll face the same enormous opposition from the GOP that Obama faced. That's how it's going to shake out, no matter how many times you post about your "concern" or how many times you sneer at her supporters for not being as manly as you'd like.

by Anonymousreply 172August 28, 2016 11:47 AM

[quote] And if she won 400 electoral votes and 80% of the popular vote against a candidate who argued the issues, she'd also be working with a Democratic Congress.

It's virtually impossible for the House to flip to the Democrats this election, no matter how big a landslide she wins by. The Senate may flip but the House almost certainly won't.

by Anonymousreply 173August 28, 2016 11:58 AM

r127, Have you ever watched these TV "debates"? They are not debates. They are tandem interviews. The candidates do not question or talk to each other, except as "Before I answer your question, Wolf, allow me a minute to respond to my esteemed opponent's claim....."

And your pre-emptive "Trump lost, but we're calling it rigged" strategy notwithstanding, the media will declare a Clinton victory because that will in fact be what it will be.

Trump isn't the only one with zingers, though his really are puerile "nicknames"; HRC will definitely try to rattle him with her "Book with Chapter 11" wisecrack.

He cannot escape his "Made in China and Elsewhere" Trump Stuff, if he dares speak of trade deals. Roll the "Letterman" clip, Mrs. Greenspan!

Trump cannot escape her mentioning his stiffing employees and tradespeople who worked on his buildings. Anderson, how many lawsuits again, please?

He cannot call HRC a "bigot" without having his past remarks' being brought up (and I was schooled on this issue on another thread after I asserted that Trump isn't racist towards Blacks! Ha! According to a published book, he thinks "laziness" is their genetic trait!).

Obviously, Trump needs to steer clear of the topic of "sexual escapades"! Adultery is as adultery does!

And is he really going to pretend he's a Man of the People, the Little Guy, the Down and Out? That he's the Buddy who's going to spare a dime? The talk sounds all good (even Democratic!), but where has the walk been heretofore? Maybe on one of his exclusive golf courses.

Finally, if faced with a last-minute desperation ploy, Trump can't even THINK of calling out Hilary on her hair, her weight, her age, her attractiveness, or her temperament, because HELLO?! Brian, get the mirror, STAT!

As long as Hillary stays seated (See: Gore, Al); doesn't look at her watch (See: Bush, GHW); has good make-up (See again: Gore, Al); stays affable (See: Reagan, Ronald); and carries a few zingers in her quiver ("...can be baited by a Tweet"), she's in like Flynn.

by Anonymousreply 174August 28, 2016 1:38 PM

Clinton is the more slick and accomplished liar so she has the edge. Dolly Parton is right.

by Anonymousreply 175August 28, 2016 1:39 PM

R170 you can't win an election with just liberals. HRC needs to appeal to Republicans who are turned off by Trump.

by Anonymousreply 176August 28, 2016 2:43 PM

[quote] Or, she was just doing what she's been doing non-stop the last few weeks - pandering to the Republicans at the expense of her liberal supporters. Trying to get the "moderate Republican" vote by playing the role of the Great Unifier, the Hardcore Democrat Who Nonetheless Loves You Republicans.

That's not what she's doing at all. You have a limited understanding of how electoral politics works. She's not "pandering," she's sticking the shiv in:

[quote] Yes, Hillary Clinton is inviting moderate Republicans to her camp (or at least convincing them to stay home on election day). Yes, she’s warning them not to trust any Trump pivot to the center. But like the hug of a gangster, her friendly message also contains a threat. To Dole, McCain, and Ryan she’s saying: You still have a chance to jump off the Trump train, but if you don’t, then you will be forever tarred with belonging to the Party of Trump. To Bush she’s saying: Don’t stay out of this; to save what’s left of your legacy, you have to embrace me. And what she says to these individual politicians she is also saying to the Republican Party as a whole: I’m giving you a chance to cut ties with Trump, but if you don’t, you will suffer the same condemnation in the eyes of history. That is the “reckoning” being threatened.

[quote] To put it another way, Clinton is trying to heighten the contradictions in the Republican Party by making it clear that there is a stark choice: Either you are with Trump (and everything he stands for) or with me. As it happens, framing the decision in this way puts McCain and Ryan in an impossible spot, since they can’t win without Trump’s base even though Trump is also an anchor pulling them down.

[quote] The praise she doled out to Republican politicians may seem magnanimous, but it was also designed to make their lives a hell, since it drives a wedge between Trump’s white nationalist base and suburban college-educated Republicans. It might look like Clinton is kissing the Republican leadership, but as she heads towards victory in the fall she’s also giving them the kiss of death.

For all the talk of her scheming ways, Hillary almost never gets credit when she pulls of a genuinely brilliant political move. This was a masterful speech.

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by Anonymousreply 177August 28, 2016 3:18 PM

The Washington Post on how the two candidates are preparing. It's pretty much what you'd expect.

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by Anonymousreply 178August 28, 2016 3:26 PM

R163, decided to put you on ignore and saw you were also R164, so I won't be clicking on your bullshit link, you Breitbart Nazi cunt.

by Anonymousreply 179August 28, 2016 5:15 PM

R99, you're not from New York or you would have said NYS instead of NY. Seems like you were born that year too (2000) based on your stupid post.

by Anonymousreply 180August 28, 2016 5:26 PM

Hillary isn't dumb. She knows just how to bait him and she will. Over and over again.

I trust her to behave like an adult and talk policy and not sink to Orange's level of insults. Most of her insults and baiting will be too subtle for him OR his idiot minions to grasp until the soundbite clips are spelled out the next day.

Then they'll all be mad because she made them all look like the fools they are and they were too stupid to even grasp it at the time.

He'll explode on social media (once he realizes he's been made a fool) and the rest of us will just laugh and laugh.

by Anonymousreply 181August 28, 2016 5:54 PM

It's unfair to label Trump "dumb", obviously he is not or he wouldn't be where he is today.

And for those who believe his "success" was handed to him by a wealthy father, there are many who were given much more and did much less or nothing at all with it.

I would much rather take a chance on a Trump presidency than live with 4 or 8 years with the recycled Clintons.

by Anonymousreply 182August 28, 2016 9:30 PM

[quote]It's unfair to label Trump "dumb", obviously he is not or he wouldn't be where he is today

It's called surrounding yourself with good advisors, Dumpette. And have you forgotten the numerous times he's declared bankruptcy? Oh, right, according to the Dumpette's, all good businessmen go into hock at least a dozen times in their professional careers.

[quote]She knows just how to bait him and she will

Dump hates strong women in the first place. Add to that being a thinskinned bully with an average education. I give it ten minutes of civility at the most.

by Anonymousreply 183August 28, 2016 9:40 PM

UGH we're still talking about cunt Clinton. She obviously didn't stroke out while I was watching TV.

by Anonymousreply 184August 28, 2016 9:42 PM

The last time debates mattered to a GE was 1976, when Ford said there's no Soviet domination of Eastern Europe. People were like, uh, ok Fordie -- should we maybe try the other guy?

In other words, back then, things people said actually mattered.

In today's braindead reality-show world, Trump can say ten idiotic/ghastly things, any one of which would have ended a campaign in the old days, and no one seems to care. In fact, Trumpkins seem to love it.

So no, the debates will not matter. At all. Unless of course the adult on the stage really screws up, and Hillary's too savvy for that.

by Anonymousreply 185August 28, 2016 9:45 PM

The debates only matter for Democratic candidates. Republican candidates can just wink and ask to call the other guy by his first name, then ignore whatever questions they're not prepared to answer. Let the stupid Dem do all the work, the debate will still be declared a tie.

by Anonymousreply 186August 28, 2016 9:56 PM

R182, sounds like you need to read up on Donald Trump and his idea of success, which includes discriminating against minority renters, repeated bankruptcies, refusing to pay his creditors the full amount owed, and being in bed with the mob.

by Anonymousreply 187August 28, 2016 9:59 PM

I think by the time we get to September 26th, most people would have already made up their minds on who they want. It's possible Trump could surprise in the debate and everyone could praise him just standing and talking at the same time. But he does seem unhinged every time he's off the teleprompter. In fact, all the crazy things he said last week were ad libs where he went off his script.

Didn't he go off on the size of his hands in one debate? That kind of stuff may fly in the all boys club he attracted in the primaries but he actually needs women and minorities to win and one thing women hate is potty humor and schoolboy jokes.

It would surprise me that in a 90 minute debate he wouldn't say something incredibly incendiary. What someone needs to do right before the debate is put out silly story about him akin to his hand size. He can't resist the low hanging fruit.

by Anonymousreply 188August 28, 2016 10:12 PM

[quote]sounds like you need to read up on Donald Trump and his idea of success, which includes discriminating against minority renters, repeated bankruptcies, refusing to pay his creditors the full amount owed, and being in bed with the mob.

And his business smarts is to stick his name on anything that might stick. Trump Air? Trump Steak? Trump University and so on and so on.... And how successful is he really? We have no idea because he refuses to release his taxes. He doesn't want the world to pull back the curtain.

I would have punched my Mother in the face if I got this for Christmas.

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by Anonymousreply 189August 28, 2016 10:15 PM

As has been pointed out, r189, most of the business ventures he got into on his own were spectacular failures. Some of his real estate development deals worked out in the end -- almost always, with a huge helping hand from daddy.

Trump hates when this is pointed out. That's why Bloomberg got under his skin more than any other speech at the convention.

by Anonymousreply 190August 28, 2016 10:26 PM

[quote]I would much rather take a chance on a Trump presidency than live with 4 or 8 years with the recycled Clintons.

Would it be unfair to label YOU "dumb"?

by Anonymousreply 191August 28, 2016 10:28 PM

[quote]he actually needs women and minorities to win and one thing women hate is potty humor and schoolboy jokes.

I think even Trump realizes that he can't talk about the size of his penis during a Presidential debate.

by Anonymousreply 192August 28, 2016 11:01 PM

If blacks keep killing each other and jihadists blow themselves up with other innocent people, it won't matter a bit. it is Trump's to lose. But I hope one of the panelists asks Trump about something specific in the Constitution to test his "knowledge".

by Anonymousreply 193August 28, 2016 11:03 PM

R183, Thank you for sharpening my point. Surrounding yourself with good advisors is exactly what a President should do.

When JFK was elected, his Cabinet was filled with some of the most brilliant minds of the day, which helped to calm the fears of some of his detractors who still questioned his young age and questionable experience.

by Anonymousreply 194August 29, 2016 12:13 AM

I'd still be more comfortable with Trump's past business indiscretions over the reckless fuck ups in Hillary's past as SOS.

A vote for Hillary is a vote for yesterday.

by Anonymousreply 195August 29, 2016 12:16 AM

R195, Trump does not have the intellectual or emotional capacity to be President.

That's the issue.

by Anonymousreply 196August 29, 2016 12:18 AM

If a vote for Hillary is a vote for yesterday, then a vote for Trump is a vote for yester-century, when racism, misogyny, and homophobia weren't just the accepted norm, they were the only norm, and being black could get you lynched, being gay could get you arrested, and being female could get you paid less than a man for doing the same job. Oh wait, the latter is still true.

by Anonymousreply 197August 29, 2016 12:48 AM

[quote]A vote for Hillary is a vote for yesterday.

A vote for Trump would mean several steps towards legitimizing the white-nationalist movement. It's that simple. Of course, if that's what you want, then go fuck yourself.

by Anonymousreply 198August 29, 2016 1:39 AM

R196 yupppppp exactly

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by Anonymousreply 199August 29, 2016 2:02 AM

[quote]If blacks keep killing each other and jihadists blow themselves up with other innocent people, it won't matter a bit. it is Trump's to lose.

And of course the man who surrounds himself with body guards and lives in a big black towers has not bothered to mention how he will solve crime and keep everyone safe. The man could'nt keep a kook from climbing his own home.

by Anonymousreply 200August 29, 2016 2:11 AM

In 1976, voters thought what the country needed, post-Watergate, was Jimmy Carter, who turned out to be the worst President in modern times, until Barack Hussein Obama was elected. Hillary Clinton is not what this country needs right now. Wake up, America!

by Anonymousreply 201August 29, 2016 2:43 AM

Right R201 (massive eye roll.) Your white sheet is showing...

by Anonymousreply 202August 29, 2016 2:54 AM

[quote]It's unfair to label Trump "dumb", obviously he is not or he wouldn't be where he is today.

Actually, it's not at all unfair to label him "dumb" since that is a legitimate conclusion based on the evidence to date. Where he is today is far worse than if he had just put his money in a stock index fund. He's been bailed out countless times, has been involved in four bankruptcies, had to get daddy's money to get going, and daddy's money again to keep him out of trouble. And, despite the fact that he's been running for President for more than a year, he is manifestly ignorant of foreign policy, domestic policy, facts, figures, and the Constitution. That is not the hallmark of an intelligent man.

[quote]I would much rather take a chance on a Trump presidency than live with 4 or 8 years with the recycled Clintons.

Then you're a moron.

[quote]Thank you for sharpening my point. Surrounding yourself with good advisors is exactly what a President should do.

That is not what Trump is doing. Look at who he has surrounded himself with. Look at who is he is listening to (and not listening to). Look at his comments about advisors and experts.

by Anonymousreply 203August 29, 2016 3:00 AM

[quote]I'd still be more comfortable with Trump's past business indiscretions over the reckless fuck ups in Hillary's past as SOS.

Well, except that she didn't really have any "reckless fuck ups" in her term as Secretary of State. Basically, you're making shit up and hoping that we're as dumb as you are. Free clue: we're not.

by Anonymousreply 204August 29, 2016 3:01 AM

[quote]until Barack Hussein Obama was elected.

Yes, how dare he create jobs, massively reduce the deficit, have 8 years of growth, and get 20 million people insured. Damn the man!

by Anonymousreply 205August 29, 2016 3:02 AM

[R6] if that is true, then why didn't ken starr prosecute Bill Clinton?? No evidence was submitted to ken starr. So no there were no legal accusation or investigations. you cannot just lie about something like that. Bill Crosby was accused and is going on trial. Saying this is really sock to really rape victim. This is not right at all.

by Anonymousreply 206August 29, 2016 3:20 AM

I put a poster on ignore and this is the only thread he is in. Does that point directly to someone with an agenda. He is not even in the men displaying their holes thread, who can this freeper be?

by Anonymousreply 207August 29, 2016 3:35 AM

A woman from Ufa?

by Anonymousreply 208August 29, 2016 3:38 AM

How stupid of Dolly to say such a horrible thing. Well, fuck Dolly.

by Anonymousreply 209August 29, 2016 3:41 AM

pero[quote]Been there, done that . . .

[quote]A vote for Hillary is a vote for yesterday.

Yes. What part of the '90s didn't you like: the peace or the prosperity? If that means that Bill gets a blowjob in the Oval, so be it. The world will be better off with Bubba entertaining interns than the horror of the tRump klan and all that they mean. We hired a Supreme Court affirmative action candidate in 2000, presented as a businessman who promised he could hire the best people to run the government and he would only have to work three days a week — remember when W said that? — and then watched as the world fell apart.

Thanks, I'll take Hillary and a return to those times over the dismal future we're guaranteed under a tRump stint in the White House.

by Anonymousreply 210August 29, 2016 3:43 AM

Jimmy Carter was a brilliant fiscal conservative. A great president who was stabbed in the back by Generals who insisted on fleecing the American tax payers.

by Anonymousreply 211August 29, 2016 3:46 AM

Doesn't the world realize that all the names and insults and lies Trump says about others actually refers to himself? Crooked, liar, stupid etc?

by Anonymousreply 212August 29, 2016 3:48 AM

[quote]Your white sheet is showing...

No, that would be Hillary's, as she calls for bringing black kids "to heel".

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by Anonymousreply 213August 29, 2016 3:52 AM

LOLR213. That's you response??? OMG. LOL. stop, you're killing me.

by Anonymousreply 214August 29, 2016 3:57 AM

Exactly r212.

You can bet anything he says about her is to draw attention away from himself.

She's a bigot? Trump just showed his ass.

by Anonymousreply 215August 29, 2016 4:04 AM

I think this election is going to come down to who is disliked the least. Both candidates will likely be neck and neck until election day when millions of people will hold their noses and finally decide while standing in the voting booth.

The unfavorables are still quite high for both candidates. That makes it difficult to accurately predict who will win.

by Anonymousreply 216August 29, 2016 4:07 AM

bump

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by Anonymousreply 217August 29, 2016 4:48 AM

R216 true but HILLARY still for the WIN no question by at least 15!

by Anonymousreply 218August 29, 2016 4:56 AM

that's right but CLINTON still would WIN even without the debates!

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by Anonymousreply 219August 29, 2016 5:52 AM

Trump will turn to Hillary and see visions of his own overbearing mother and go all Norman Bates at the debates.

by Anonymousreply 220August 29, 2016 6:30 AM

I have a feeling he is going to get annoyed by her criticism and finally retaliate by slamming her choice of pantsuit and saying it makes her look fat.

by Anonymousreply 221August 29, 2016 6:50 AM

No r216. Keep saying it and maybe it will come true.

by Anonymousreply 222August 29, 2016 6:55 AM

R211. That would be the same Jimmy Carter under whom interest rates were at an all time high, the American people were told to lower their thermostats to 68 degrees and put on a sweater and then wait in early morning lines and only on certain days of the week to purchase gasoline? That Jimmy Carter?

by Anonymousreply 223August 29, 2016 11:50 AM

How could any gay American with any amount of self-worth honestly vote for Hillary Clinton after watching her in this 2004 video? And you know damn well she STILL feels this way today.

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by Anonymousreply 224August 29, 2016 11:55 AM

[quote] [R170] you can't win an election with just liberals. HRC needs to appeal to Republicans who are turned off by Trump.

So lie at leisure about the AIDS crisis, right? Call the Reagans - the people who gave the middle finger to gay men - the TRUE HEROES OF THE AIDS CRISIS, right???

GO FUCK YOURSELF!!!!!!!

I'm so finished with you people who justify everything that dumb witch does for the votes - every little act of betrayal as a master act to Win.

What she did was not only wrong in a moral, historical sense... It was also stupid in the plain utilitarian sense.

IT WASN'T A MASTER ANYTHING.

SHE WAS FORCED TO APOLOGIZE..... TWICE.

SHE COMPLETELY MISJUDGED THE POLITICAL MOOD.

Why?

BECAUSE SHE'S A BAD POLITICIAN, or at the very best, SHE'S OVERRATED.

At the very least she has bad judgment, but considering how the poor cunt is always - I mean, ALWAYS - embroiled in some scandal or other, you've got to concede I'm right.

by Anonymousreply 225August 29, 2016 12:03 PM

[quote] I assume she meant to say Alzheimer's.

No, she didn't mean that. It was clear she meant AIDS.

[quote] “It may be hard for your viewers to [bold] remember how difficult it was for people to talk about H.I.V./AIDS back in the 1980s[/bold] ,” Mrs. Clinton, who was attending Mrs. Reagan’s funeral in Simi Valley, Calif., told MSNBC’s Andrea Mitchell. “And because of both President and Mrs. Reagan – in particular, Mrs. Reagan – we started a national conversation, when before nobody would talk about it. Nobody wanted anything to do with it.”

[quote]Yet Mrs. Clinton said Friday that she had appreciated Mrs. Reagan’s “low-key advocacy” on H.I.V./AIDS, saying “it penetrated the public conscience, and people began to say, ‘Hey, we have to do something about this.’”

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by Anonymousreply 226August 29, 2016 12:15 PM

In a way HC was right about the Reagans........they generated a conversation which resulted in activists making a stand and pushing AIDS to the forefront of the conversation......by their act of ignoring it and refusal to discuss it.....and that outraged people. NR low-key approach was to shun people....like Rock Hudson...who turned to her for help. As first lady, a parent and wife, people looked to her to be more sympathetic and to have the Presidents ear. I look at HC comments about NR as a back handed slap and not a compliment.....what was she supposed to say about a dead first lady ?.....ridicule her at her funeral ?......instead, she threw shade because people knew the Reagans had blood on their hands.

by Anonymousreply 227August 29, 2016 2:10 PM

It's sad that even though Trump will get buried in a landslide in November, his asshole followers will still be around to spread their vitriol.

The good news is that since they skew older and white, their numbers will decrease every year and their influence ebb.

by Anonymousreply 228August 29, 2016 2:23 PM

R227 That's like saying the Holocaust started a conversation about anti-Semitism, but that's not what she meant, so why don't you just kill yourself?

I actually salivated a bit on my lower lip out of anger. You Hillbots, the Hillary can do no wrong crowd, are really impossible. SHE'S ALWAYS DOING SOMETHING WRONG, ALWAYS!!

Now I KNOW how Log Cabin Republicans are possible - I just have to look at the Hillbots, at how you lot sell gay history short to protect Queen Scandal every time we debate her HORRIBLE record on gay rights.

by Anonymousreply 229August 29, 2016 2:24 PM

Yes Clinton's comment about AIDS was the defining event of the campaign. Time to crown a demented clown President and be done with it. Even if every horrible thing said about Clinton was true (which I dispute), she'd still be 1,000X better as President than he would. Make that 1 trillion.

This isn't even a real campaign. They should hold the election next Tuesday and given the country a break.

by Anonymousreply 230August 29, 2016 2:28 PM

[quote].....instead, she threw shade because people knew the Reagans had blood on their hands.

worst first couple in history

by Anonymousreply 231August 29, 2016 2:30 PM

I thought you were done and out of here R229? God you Trump shills never keep your word !

by Anonymousreply 232August 29, 2016 2:30 PM

Holding your nose to support a candidate is the Jewish way they want us to vote.

We are tired of Jewish ways

by Anonymousreply 233August 29, 2016 2:30 PM

r230 No one said that, Mr. Self-Victimizer. I'm just saying, her AIDS comments show that she doesn't care about liberals - including gay people - and that the story shows that she has poor judgment. ALMOST EVERYTHING SHE'S DONE IN LIFE PROVES SHE HAS POOR JUDGMENT.

Please yall vote for her, sweatergod I don't want the Berlusconi in a wig to win, but bear this in mind - her reign will be marred nonstop by scandals, as her candidacy has been so far, because that's who she is - she's a bad judgment-maker; that's how both Clintons are, but we've all known this since the 1990s, haven't we. And things will be worse for her than now because when she takes office, Trump won't be around to draw attention away from her with his own crap.

by Anonymousreply 234August 29, 2016 2:36 PM

To return to the topic at hand, the author of OP's article proves his complete lack of political awareness when he speaks of "unstoppable" Jeb Bush.

That may well have been the impression people wanted to have of Jeb! before the primary campaign began, but once Jeb! opened his mouth for the very first time, it was over for him. I believe he attracted about 12 voters in total.

Trump will make a lot of noise during the debates (surprise), but will do nothing to win any voters.

As a corollary, anyone who says they are undecided is a liar.

by Anonymousreply 235August 29, 2016 2:36 PM

R223, The Jimmy Carter who was betrayed, along with our nation, by the Carlyle Group; today's oil prices show the treason of long gas lines back then.

The Jimmy Carter under whose watch the INTEREST % ON CDs was at an all-time high, forming the very basis of MANY a retirement cushion today.

If you preferred the following Reagan years, you are a complete moron.

by Anonymousreply 236August 29, 2016 2:39 PM

I thought you were done R234?

by Anonymousreply 237August 29, 2016 2:46 PM

r237 I must be smashing it if that's the best you can do.

by Anonymousreply 238August 29, 2016 2:49 PM

I love you R10

by Anonymousreply 239August 29, 2016 2:49 PM

r234.....according to who ? (see...that works both ways ) If HC was so damned corrupt, why isnt she in prison ?......because THERE IS NOTHING OF SUBSTANCE THERE. You need to look no further than the multiple investigations by congress, the FBI, the Justice Dept......almost all of which were led by the GOP. Trump on the other hand has a long history of lawsuits (many he lost), bigotry and racism (the government had to get involved), shafting employees and contractors, multiple bankruptcies, and surrounds himself with the lowest of the low in Republican politics (Bannon, Sessions, Manafort, etc)....not to mention his moral compass and public scandals regarding his "traditional family values).....multiple marriages, affairs, children out of wedlock, public spectacles because he brought his mistress to a family vacation........If the best you can do is rehash Fox News rhetoric and propaganda which is baseless, and pointing to BC getting a blowjob then you deserve what you get you poor simpleton. And I might point out that although BC cheated on HC, she stayed with her husband and worked it out.....she didnt dump him for a Slovenian gigolo. That speaks more about her character and her values that the buffoon who thinks wives are disposable.

by Anonymousreply 240August 29, 2016 2:50 PM

you said you were done R238. Not me. Just reminding you of your own words.

by Anonymousreply 241August 29, 2016 2:51 PM

How do you sexually please a woman?

by Anonymousreply 242August 29, 2016 2:51 PM

Does anyone believe that Bill and Hillary have fucked since Chelsea's conception?

by Anonymousreply 243August 29, 2016 3:39 PM

I'm more interested in the post Trump twitter meltdown than the actual debate

by Anonymousreply 244August 29, 2016 5:03 PM

R243 ..........

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by Anonymousreply 245August 30, 2016 1:50 AM

[quote]How could any gay American with any amount of self-worth honestly vote for Hillary Clinton after watching her in this 2004 video? And you know damn well she STILL feels this way today.

Actually, we don't know that, mostly because it's manifestly not true. Clinton went through the same process that millions of Americans went through over the past dozen years. Are you going to condemn every single one of them into perpetuity? Or are you prepared to admit that people learn, grow, and change their mind?

So yes, I'll be voting for her, particularly when the other choice is an ignorant, narcissistic sociopath who this year has said he wants to appoint judges who will block us from getting married.

by Anonymousreply 246August 30, 2016 1:59 AM

As long as he does this the whole time she's talking, he'll do fine.

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by Anonymousreply 247August 30, 2016 2:49 AM

R247 and Hillary this while he's talking

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by Anonymousreply 248August 30, 2016 3:19 AM

[quote]I'm just saying, her AIDS comments show that she doesn't care about liberals - including gay people - and that the story shows that she has poor judgment. ALMOST EVERYTHING SHE'S DONE IN LIFE PROVES SHE HAS POOR JUDGMENT.

Yeah? The Clinton Foundation has helped thousand and thousands with AIDS all over the world to get medicine so shut you hole, she's done more for AIDS than you.

by Anonymousreply 249August 30, 2016 3:32 AM

Trump will not debate Clinton.

Not after this abortion of a morning.

by Anonymousreply 250September 16, 2016 4:07 PM

All these polls mean nothing until the debates are over. Trump going 1-on-1 with Clinton is a joke and he's already showing signs of being incredibly cocky about it - his rising poll numbers only add to his hubris. Throwing pot shots at 10 other primary candidates is very different from a presidential concern.

Of course, nobody - certainly not the media - holds Trump to any sort of acceptable standard regarding accuracy or responsibility for what he says. Imagine if he becomes POTUS - accountable for nothing.

by Anonymousreply 251September 16, 2016 4:12 PM

^^concern = debate

by Anonymousreply 252September 16, 2016 4:31 PM

R250 I agree that Trump never planned on debating Clinton. Bullies are to cowardly to face their targets.

by Anonymousreply 253September 16, 2016 4:52 PM

And he has no intention of "debating". He is just going to sling insults and bullshit and hope some of it sticks. She is going to talk policy (if the mods let her and get off their stupid email and foundation nonsense) and sound way too intelligent for 80% of the Great Unwashed.

He's a worthless, lying, traitorous POS and the media REFUSES to call him on ANY of it because they're too hung up on "ratings".

Abolish the press. Get people in there who will do the HARD WORK instead of ass kissing and puff pieces.

by Anonymousreply 254September 16, 2016 6:43 PM

[quote] Conventional wisdom says Donald Trump is going to lose, and lose big.

Donald is better at the 30 second soundbite while Clinton speaks like a stern teacher.

Trump - "Build The Wall"

Clinton - "There is a smart way to protect our borders, and there is a dumb way to protect our borders. What I learned is that the University of Texas at Brownsville would have part of its campus cut off. This is the kind of absurdity that we’re getting from this administration. I’ve been fighting with them about the northern border. Their imposition of passports and other kinds of burdens are separating people from families, interfering with business and commerce, the movement of goods and people. So what I’ve said is that I would say, wait a minute, we need to review this. There may be places where a physical barrier is appropriate. When both of us voted for this, we were voting for the possibility that where it was appropriate and made sense, it would be considered. "

So which is going to resonate with the American public?

by Anonymousreply 255September 16, 2016 7:51 PM

CNBC:

I suppose people have had better months than Donald Trump has had so far in September... maybe that guy who's won the Florida lottery seven times, or that baseball star who's engaged to Kate Upton. But Trump's surge to the lead in several national polls plus a clear softening of his image in the media seems almost impossible to fathom, even for his most ardent supporters...

When Trump's campaign pulled the trigger on its latest shake-up, replacing Campaign Manager Paul Manafort with the team of Kellyanne Conway and Steve Bannon, it looked like a "Hail Mary" move. But in the weeks since, Trump has gone more mainstream and "acceptable" with trips to visit Mexico, an appearance in flood-ravaged Louisiana, and now an economic policy speech in New York that was a great improvement on his Mitt Romney impersonation at the Detroit Economic Club earlier this summer.

And the pièce de résistance happened Thursday night on "The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon." Trump not only cracked jokes and seemed self-deprecatingly likeable, he even (gasp!) let Fallon mess with his hair! Video of that hair tussle is already going viral on Internet...

Ten-point surges don't just happen overnight. It's much more likely that Trump's relative weakness in the earlier polls was a result of voters leaning towards him, but not being ready to say so... even to anonymous pollsters. But Trump's softened messages, Clinton's "deplorables" comment, and her medical scare with frightening video of her looking totally immobilized to go with it have all provided those voters the excuse to finally "come out" for Trump. This phenomenon is well named by Dilbert cartoonist and blogger Scott Adams, who calls these events the "fake because." They're "fake" because the voters were always going to vote a certain way, but highly visible episodes make it possible to say: "well, now I'm voting for candidate X because..."

This is more bad news for the Clinton camp, because this means the Trump surge is not the result of some kind of ephemeral or fickle trend. Instead it's more like the gates of a dam opening that cannot be closed. And it makes sense from another historical/logical point of view. Hillary Clinton has essentially had 24 years in the national spotlight to close the deal with the majority of the voting American public and she's never done it. Even at the zenith of her polling fortunes earlier this summer, she never broke into truly unbeatable territory on her own. She had been simply skating on the extreme unfavorable impressions for Trump, and now that we're seeing that erode, Clinton may be trapped for good....

One day, we may look back on Trump's "Tonight Show" appearance as his "Arsenio Hall Show" moment — a turning point when he connected with voters who had been unwilling to admit he had already won many of them over.

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by Anonymousreply 256September 16, 2016 8:06 PM

The majority of Trump supporters have lept into a rabbit hole and they ain't coming back. They trust everybody and every source except Trump - regardless of the facts, even the facts of his own behaviour and actions. They ain't coming back - that's a hard core of 20%. But he's not guaranteed more than 33% - 36% come Election Day. That's always been his ceiling.

The best thing Clinton can do during the debates is make her case to the American people - let the moderators correct and contain Trump. If she gets caught up in his nonsense, she's toast. Better for her to let him dangle in the wind trying to give a coherent 3-minute reply on foreign, economic or social policy.

She has to emerge in tact, asserting her best self, whatever Trump does. She can't let it be all about him.

by Anonymousreply 257September 17, 2016 9:25 AM

^^distrust everybody...

by Anonymousreply 258September 17, 2016 9:26 AM

Front page of the NY Times this morning calls Trump a liar.

Whenever he gets humiliated (by Conway forcing him to admit Obama is an American) or overconfident he goes nuts. The hotel thing has taken him to Khizr Khan territory again. Massage the press all you want but never embarrass them.

by Anonymousreply 259September 17, 2016 1:27 PM

[quote]Front page of the NY Times this morning calls Trump a liar.

Link.

by Anonymousreply 260September 17, 2016 2:47 PM

When the Clinton Health Access Initiative (CHAI) was founded in 2002, only 200,000 people were receiving treatment for HIV/AIDS in low and middle income countries, with medicines that cost over $10,000 per person per year.

Over a decade later, more than eight million people are receiving treatment and CHAI has helped reduce the cost of medicines to around $100 to $200 per person per year in many countries. Countries have repeatedly proven that it is possible to rapidly scale up treatment services. For the first time, there is real promise that we can turn the tide against HIV/AIDS.

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by Anonymousreply 261September 17, 2016 2:52 PM

Clinton said NINE MILLION PEOPLE have lower-cost HIV/AIDS medicine thanks to the efforts of the Clinton Foundation and her husband. Bill Clinton started the foundation and its first big project was the Clinton Health Access Initiative. The program focused on using market mechanisms to reduce treatment costs. Costs have fallen dramatically and the initiative remains a key global player in maintaining a steady supply of affordable drugs.

If anything, Clinton understated the number of people who have benefited from the program. We rate this claim True.

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by Anonymousreply 262September 17, 2016 2:55 PM

Meanwhile, what has the Trump charity done for people? Received funds from donors, bought a six foot tall portrait of Trump and hung it in a golf course country club. Trump doesn't even contribute to it.

by Anonymousreply 263September 17, 2016 2:57 PM

[quote] Trump vs. Clinton Will Come Down to the Debates

And Datalounger posters said

June 2015 - Trump Will Never Be The GOP Nominee

June 2016 - Clinton Will Cream Trump on the Campaign Trail

And now you are saying that it will come down to the debates

by Anonymousreply 264September 17, 2016 2:58 PM

Here's your link, for the poster above:

THE NEW YORK TIMES By MICHAEL BARBARO SEPTEMBER 16, 2016

It was not true in 2011, when Donald J. Trump mischievously began to question President Obama’s birthplace aloud in television interviews. “I’m starting to think that he was not born here,” he said at the time.

It was not true in 2012, when he took to Twitter to declare that “an ‘extremely credible source’” had called his office to inform him that Mr. Obama’s birth certificate was “a fraud.”

It was not true in 2014, when Mr. Trump invited hackers to “please hack Obama’s college records (destroyed?) and check ‘place of birth.’”

It was never true, any of it. Mr. Obama’s citizenship was never in question. No credible evidence ever suggested otherwise.

Yet it took Mr. Trump five years of dodging, winking and joking to surrender to reality, finally, on Friday, after a remarkable campaign of relentless deception that tried to undermine the legitimacy of the nation’s first black president.

In fact, it took Mr. Trump much longer than that: Mr. Obama released his short-form birth certificate from the Hawaii Department of Health in 2008. Most of the world moved on.

But not Mr. Trump.

He nurtured the conspiracy like a poisonous flower, watering and feeding it with an ardor that still baffles and embarrasses many around him.

[...] The essential question — Why promote a lie? — may be unanswerable. Was it sport? Was it his lifelong quest to court media attention? Was it racism? Was it the cynical start of his eventual campaign for president?

[...] He was disingenuous until the very end, telling a Washington Post reporter just 72 hours before that he was unready to concede the president’s place of birth. But he treated the weighty topic, as he does so much else, like a television cliffhanger, promising a major declaration on Friday.

And then, around 11 a.m. Friday in Washington, he gave up the lie. But he conjured up a bizarre new deception, congratulating himself for putting to rest the doubts about Mr. Obama that he had fanned since 2011. “I finished it,’’ he declared, unapologetically. “President Obama was born in the United States — period.’’

Surrounded by, and in many ways shielded by, decorated veterans in his new Washington hotel, he could not resist indulging in another falsehood — that his opponent, Hillary Clinton, had started the so-called birther movement. She did not.

Much has been made of Mr. Trump’s casual elasticity with the truth; he has exhausted an army of fact-checkers with his mischaracterizations, exaggerations and fabrications. But this lie was different from the start, an insidious, calculated calumny that sought to undo the embrace of an African-American president by the 69 million voters who elected him in 2008.

In the end, it seemed, Mr. Trump’s plot to diminish Mr. Obama did not succeed. On Friday, the president of the United States seemed much bigger.

“I was pretty confident about where I was born,” Mr. Obama said from the White House, a wry smile crossing his face. “I think most people were as well.’’

And the president had this to say about the myth heedlessly spread by the man seeking to replace him: “My hope would be that the presidential election reflects more serious issues than that.”

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by Anonymousreply 265September 17, 2016 3:12 PM

Here's the think about the debates: CNN and MSNBC will tell us that Clinton won by every measure imaginable. That's because they are a bunch of political insiders who hear the debates from their own POV

But it's entirely possible that the folks at home hear a very different outcome. That happened in the primaries a lot, especially in the GOP debates where they were shocked to hear the audiences saying Trump had won despite bringing up cock size and all that.

I will guarantee you this: it will be the most entertaining political debate you've ever seen.

by Anonymousreply 266September 17, 2016 3:28 PM

^^Here's the thing about...

by Anonymousreply 267September 17, 2016 3:28 PM

R259 Hill is a lying cunt as well! They are both bullshiters. As much As I hate Trump, HIllary is the queen of dishonesty. Does she have allergies this week ,is it pneumonia or even something worse?

by Anonymousreply 268September 18, 2016 1:28 AM

I'll never understand the people who are voting for Trump. In my opinion they are ALL deplorable.

by Anonymousreply 269September 18, 2016 1:56 AM

The debates: Norman Desmond vs Don Rickles

by Anonymousreply 270September 18, 2016 5:32 PM

Betty White vs. a pile of dog shit.

by Anonymousreply 271September 18, 2016 11:39 PM

Millennials are peeling away from the Democratic party, they're voting Johnson. This year is 2000 all over again.

by Anonymousreply 272September 19, 2016 4:20 AM

Trump will push to get Johnson and Stein into the debates. The more exposure they get, the more the anti-Trump vote is split... leaving Trump the winner.

by Anonymousreply 273September 19, 2016 4:26 AM

[quote]Millennials are peeling away from the Democratic party, they're voting Johnson. This year is 2000 all over again.

Last week he had no idea what Aleppo was and this morning he said thank God nobody was hurt in the NY explosion. He's a nitwit.

by Anonymousreply 274September 19, 2016 4:36 AM

Gary Johnson is a pothead and Bill Weld is a drunk.

by Anonymousreply 275September 19, 2016 12:49 PM

As much as I am looking forward to the first debate, I'm looking forward to Hillary having to concede to Trump even more.

by Anonymousreply 276September 19, 2016 12:50 PM

Johnson and Weld were on 60 minutes last night. They seem smart, genuine and likable. I wonder if that exposure will give them a bump.

by Anonymousreply 277September 19, 2016 1:41 PM

I'm sure it will, R277, because millennials don't care about anything but likability at all. Competency doesn't matter to them. Having some high as a kite elderly hippie in the White House who knows absolutely nothing about the Middle East while it blows up all around us is fine with them. They think we can just withdraw from the world and everything will be fine. Don't care about our allies in Europe, don't care about terrorism on every street corner because we're not coping with ISIS.

They just want to sit at home smoking pot and any candidate that is pushing pot legalization and free college has the only two qualifications they need, because they do t give a damn about anyone or anything but living in a cocoon and assuming the rest of the world is just going to disappear.

by Anonymousreply 278September 19, 2016 2:10 PM

[quote] Trump vs. Clinton Will Come Down to the Debates

And you guys said Trump wouldn't get the GOP Nomination and that Clinton would CREAM Trump during the summer

Neither happened.

by Anonymousreply 279September 19, 2016 2:13 PM

Does anyone really believe that millennials watch "60 Minutes"?

by Anonymousreply 280September 19, 2016 2:19 PM

LOL @ R280. I think I read somewhere that the average age of viewers is 70.

by Anonymousreply 281September 19, 2016 2:38 PM

bump

by Anonymousreply 282October 18, 2016 6:38 PM

[quote]This election is already over. All the recent negative stories about Clinton are to make people think it's still a horse race. It's quite clear Trump doesn't want to win and never did. His supporters might as well deal with that reality right now.

Orly, R30?

by Anonymousreply 283February 20, 2020 2:54 AM
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