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MAD MEN, Season Finale, 6/23/13:"In Care Of"

Don has a problem.

by Anonymousreply 36808/06/2013

Why does Joan dress so anachronistically?

by Anonymousreply 106/23/2013

Poor Peggy..

by Anonymousreply 206/23/2013

So glad Don punched that bible beater in the face.

by Anonymousreply 306/23/2013

It was Manolo! That bastard!

by Anonymousreply 406/23/2013

"Detroit with palm trees" That's an Elmore Leonard quote.

by Anonymousreply 506/23/2013

I get the feeling that Weiner is determined to get rid of Bob in this episode.

More time for his beloved flashbacks...

by Anonymousreply 606/23/2013

Did Manolo throw Mrs. Campbell off the boat? OMG, do not fuck with Bob Benson!

They tease with balconies and then this.

by Anonymousreply 706/23/2013

Don has a drinking problem.

by Anonymousreply 806/23/2013

Who is the annoying person in the American Express ad?

by Anonymousreply 906/23/2013

I missed the first five minutes (right before Roger and Bob talk), what did I miss?

by Anonymousreply 1006/23/2013

I am laughing hysterically at the whole thing over Pete and his mother and Manolo!

by Anonymousreply 1106/23/2013

I love Bob's overcoat.

by Anonymousreply 1206/23/2013

Roger saw Bob and Joan talking in the office by the staircase, got peeved and walked over in time to see Bob give Joan a toy car for Kevin. So now he's double pissed.

by Anonymousreply 1306/23/2013

Pete can't drive.

by Anonymousreply 1406/23/2013

Pete's a virgin who can't drive.

by Anonymousreply 1506/23/2013

Damn, Bob is good! I think he's leaving the show because Pete will kill him before the episode's over.

Next season, I hope Pete is forced to share a house with his new father-in-law, Manolo.

by Anonymousreply 1606/23/2013

R6, James Wolk wouldn't have signed a contract to CBS for the Robin Williams sitcom unless he was certain Bob wouldn't be back for the next and final season.

And enough of these lame Heather Locklear/Allison Brie analogies, there's no way he can do both.

by Anonymousreply 1706/23/2013

Thanks, R13.

by Anonymousreply 1806/23/2013

Ted has the beady dark eyes of a hamster.

by Anonymousreply 1906/23/2013

Whoa! Peggy has a nice rack! Who knew?

by Anonymousreply 2006/23/2013

"I'd invite him, but Ralph stopped drinking and you know Little Ralphie's spastic."


by Anonymousreply 2106/23/2013

Ted and Peggy make no sense at all.

by Anonymousreply 2206/23/2013

Of course Pete, having lived his entire life in Manhattan, would not know how to drive.

by Anonymousreply 2306/23/2013

I wanr to see Peggy in Barbra's sailor dress that she wore for her Oscar acceptance speech.

by Anonymousreply 2406/23/2013

This is really a beautiful episode. The tone is not like the rest of the season, but they are building on a structure that was meticulously laid out over the last few months. No idea where this is going, but Bob's smackdown of Pete, Betty's moment of humanity, and Don's floundering's great television

by Anonymousreply 2506/23/2013

"I should've known you'd know where to find the boys AND the booze!"

by Anonymousreply 2606/23/2013

So did that little scene between Pete and Clara mean they've found Dot Campbell's body?

by Anonymousreply 2706/23/2013

Bob Benson says he has no idea what Manolo was up to -- i.e., marrying Pete's mother and perhaps murdering her. I don't buy it.

by Anonymousreply 2806/23/2013

Don Draper is coming apart.

by Anonymousreply 2906/23/2013

Don, the balcony is calling you to jump.

by Anonymousreply 3006/23/2013

This is like when Michael Steadmen stayed in Philadelphia and Eliot went to LA.

by Anonymousreply 3106/23/2013

Wow. That was beautiful.

Jon Hamm might have finally won an Emmy with that monologue.

by Anonymousreply 3206/23/2013

Someone on reddit correctly spoiled this episode last week.

by Anonymousreply 3306/23/2013

But as you noticed none of those guys actually appreciated the story.

What the fuck is Don going to do? What the hell is Peggy going to do!?

by Anonymousreply 3406/23/2013

"She did love the sea."

by Anonymousreply 3506/23/2013

I thought the same thing, R32.

by Anonymousreply 3606/23/2013

Is Megan Draper leaving?! FINALLY!

by Anonymousreply 3706/23/2013

Why, what did they say? I wish they would spoil next season.

by Anonymousreply 3806/23/2013

Weird episode...Joan looks good, Don is on a leave? I hate the way they make Detroit a joke.

by Anonymousreply 3906/23/2013

Holy shit! Don's "on leave!"

by Anonymousreply 4006/23/2013

r38 - they spoiled this episode, not next season.

by Anonymousreply 4106/23/2013

Duck really enjoyed that.

Peggy's exactly like Don, whether she realizes it or not.

by Anonymousreply 4206/23/2013

Matt Weiner recently said that no one would die in the remaining episodes of Mad Men this season. He lied -- unless Dot Campbell miraculously turns up.

by Anonymousreply 4306/23/2013

I think Don Draper finally died. A perfect episode.

by Anonymousreply 4406/23/2013

Loved Sally looking at Don with a new understanding at the end.

Peggy's glorious plaid pantsuit!

If Pete is going to California, does that mean Ted doesn't get to go?

by Anonymousreply 4506/23/2013

Why is Pete going to California?

I thought Peggy looked and was great tonight.

Was Duck bringing a new guy in to replace Don?

by Anonymousreply 4606/23/2013

OK, I'm confused. I guess I need to watch the episode again, but why is Pete going to California?

by Anonymousreply 4706/23/2013

Really great episode. Good ending. Won't spoil it for West coasters but really pay attention. Can't wait to re-watch when ep is available on On Demand.

by Anonymousreply 4806/23/2013

Who was the guy with Duck and how did Don know him?

That whole thing with Pete's mother and Manolo is just insanely weird.

And everyone is effectively scattered to the four corners: Bob in Detroit. Ted, Pete and possibly Megan in CA. Don God knows where. And Peggy in the big office, echoing the logo. Crazy.

by Anonymousreply 4906/23/2013

They probably put Don on 'leave' for him to check himself into a detox hospital. Back then, before managed care, a patient could be away for months.

by Anonymousreply 5006/23/2013

The truth has set Don free. LITERALLY.

by Anonymousreply 5106/23/2013

I got a little misty at the end. I love how Sally can convey so much in a look.

by Anonymousreply 5206/23/2013

But Pete does know how to drive -- he got a license last season.

by Anonymousreply 5306/23/2013

Duck's been circling those waters all season. I just knew he wasn't popping up just for the Bob story line.

They could have ended the series on that episode, it was that solid.

by Anonymousreply 5406/23/2013

The episode did a great job of nailing the feeling of 1968. It was a time when things were falling apart. Lots of people were leaving New York and going to California so everyone wanting to leave made perfect sense.

I don't understand why Pete was going though. That was very confusing.

by Anonymousreply 5506/23/2013

Yes -- I love love love Kiernan Shipka. She's done stellar work this season. She deserves an Emmy nomination.

by Anonymousreply 5606/23/2013

I don't understand the story arc involving Pete's dead mom at all. Seems too campy. Also: Why is PETE moving to LA? How did that come about -- maybe I missed something.

by Anonymousreply 5706/23/2013

How could Pete have lived in CT with Trudi and now have a license?

by Anonymousreply 5806/23/2013

Pete didn't know how to drive stick. So Bob made him look like a fool.

Yes. That episode was so solid it could have ended the entire series.

by Anonymousreply 5906/23/2013

They really don't know clouds, at all.

by Anonymousreply 6006/23/2013

I sense that Betty and Don might get back together once he joins AA.

by Anonymousreply 6106/23/2013

[quote]Who was the guy with Duck and how did Don know him?

He's Don's replacement.

by Anonymousreply 6206/23/2013

Now wait just a cotton-pickin' minute. Did we or did we not see a scene with Don and Megan on the terrace in last's week's next week on Mad Men montage?

by Anonymousreply 6306/23/2013

Fantastic episode & agree Hamm should finally get his Emmy.

Did Betty change her hair-do? It looked different.

Bob carving the turkey at the end, lol. I hope he comes back in some capacity next season.

by Anonymousreply 6406/23/2013

It was from a previous episode.

by Anonymousreply 6506/23/2013

Great season finale. I also don't know what led to Pete making his way to California along with Ted.

Is Bob Benson going to end up with Joan? He must be at least 10 years her junior. Was that taboo back then?

by Anonymousreply 6606/23/2013

Guess that explains the Season 5 poster - Both Sides Now.

by Anonymousreply 6706/23/2013

When was it decided that Pete is going to California?

by Anonymousreply 6806/23/2013

They're ALL moving to L.A. It's like the final season of "Laverne and Shirley."

It was a decent episode, but I found this season a bit of a bust. I guess I'm just sick of Don and his existential identity crisis.

So who won't we see next (the final!) season? I think Megan is history, which is kind of too bad. Bob is "in Detroit." I don't understand why Pete says he's going to L.A., but the character will be back. Ted and his family are history.

And I PRAY that we are done with the Rosens. Enough.

by Anonymousreply 6906/23/2013

I swear I saw someone floating face down in a swimming pool on last week's "Next time on Mad Men." This was the most disappointing season finale EVER! No cliff hangers (aside from Megan walking out), nothing to make us wonder what is going to happen, nothing that would compel me to tune in next season (although I will)

by Anonymousreply 7006/23/2013

Benson's gay, R66, so the answer is no.

by Anonymousreply 7106/23/2013

Poor Peggy. She finally gets Ted to fuck her and then five minutes later he's all "well, I'm off to California with the wife and kids. See ya!"

by Anonymousreply 7206/23/2013

In California, Ted will run creative and Pete will run the account for Sunkist.

by Anonymousreply 7306/23/2013

I cannot stand the Ted character.

by Anonymousreply 7406/23/2013

They have planted the seed for Big Gay Bob to marry a woman to further his career and standing with the Chevy client. Joan and her kid represent a built in opportunity. OTOH, he's younger (and gay), and she's a partner at the agency. And he's really, really gay.

And I don't think that actor's coming back next season.

by Anonymousreply 7506/23/2013

Ted is the nice, milktoast version of Don. He couldn't leave his wife and kids. Don could and now feels guilty.

by Anonymousreply 7606/23/2013

How did Bob Benson know Pete can't drive a stick shift?

And did Ken lose his eye in the buckshot blast, or is it just damaged?

by Anonymousreply 7706/23/2013

Poor Stan! First Don, then Ted, rip off his CA dreamin'!

by Anonymousreply 7806/23/2013


Oh dear

by Anonymousreply 7906/23/2013

I found Stan's opening scene with Don unconvincing. It felt like he was there to set up the events that follow. I didn't really believe stoner horndog Stan dreamed of setting up his own agency for a minute.

by Anonymousreply 8006/23/2013

But at least this sets up Stan and Peggy to both be in NY...hopefully to get together.

by Anonymousreply 8106/23/2013

sally is drew barrymore

by Anonymousreply 8206/23/2013

And there was no follow up for Ginsberg, who kept threatening to have a psychotic break this season.

The backstory with Roger's daughter and son in law was tedious. I didn't understand and I don't care.

I know a lot of you loved this episode, but I have more questions than answers. OTOH, Mr. Draper called me "sweetheart" on the way out, and I didn't entirely mind it.

by Anonymousreply 8306/23/2013

For me, the strangest post was the person who assumed Robin Williams new TV series was going to be a hit, which menas the exit of Bob Benson. Does anyone care about Robin Williams anymore?

by Anonymousreply 8406/23/2013

I did not love this last episode at all. It was the cap on Mad Men's worst season.

by Anonymousreply 8506/23/2013

As a thirtysomething, one of the funniest things to me about Mad Men is that a recurring theme throughout the entire series is Los Angeles being seen as this magical place of relaxation, freedom and the laid-back lifestyle. LOL! Ask a modern person what they think of LA and you'll get a very different reaction.

by Anonymousreply 8606/23/2013

Was Don fired, or just put on a leave of absence? Why do they need the Dancer Fitzgerald guy, if he's just on temporary hiatus?

Does Ted's wife know about his tryst with Ugly Peggy?

Why does Joan like Bob Benson so much? For someone as jaded and world-weary as she -- wouldn't she know he's a con artist of the highest order?

The backstory with Roger's daughter was pointless.

Why all the brouhaha over Pete's dead mother? What point did this plot twist serve?

Loved the scene with Pete in the car, but how did Bob know that he couldn't drive?

Why is Pete going to California?

How was Don able to drive to remote PA in Jig Time? Where did ge grow up?

Megan is insufferable. But I hope she makes it in LA.

by Anonymousreply 8706/23/2013

He just wanted to set up the office, I didn't think he wanted his own agency but I think with his personality he might work well in California.

by Anonymousreply 8806/23/2013

I've been Sally. I know my father had a very hard life as a child. I have tried to reach out to be sympathetic in small ways and he's very definitively shut me down with a "you don't know what you're talking about." While it's true denial works for some people, my fathers ENORMOUS fuckups as a father can only be forgiven in light of his sad childhood... So his eagerness to dismiss my understanding is just one more of his fuckups. At least Don isn't making that mistake.

by Anonymousreply 8906/23/2013

[quote]They're ALL moving to L.A. It's like the final season of "Laverne and Shirley."

That's fucking hilarious!

by Anonymousreply 9006/23/2013

r86, the whole point would be to ask someone in the Sixties what they think of California. I'm not sure how being "a thirtysomething" has any relevance, since the entire series is set a decade before you were born. Are you really that dim?

by Anonymousreply 9106/23/2013

{r1} we've all ready discussed this. Joan is older and like many woman they get stuck in their teens/twenties fashion for the rest of your life. Haven't you seen that before? Makes perfect sense to me.

by Anonymousreply 9206/23/2013

God bless you, R86...I totally agree.

by Anonymousreply 9306/23/2013

Alan Sepinwall interviewed Weiner about what this episode means for next season; he won't post it until about 2:00 a.m. Monday morning, however.

by Anonymousreply 9406/23/2013

No cliff hangers? What is Don going to do with his life?

by Anonymousreply 9506/23/2013

When I lived in the North workers said "everyone in the south is lazy and slow."

When I moved south, I was expected to work twice as hard, for less pay.

You can't generalize about anything, r86.

by Anonymousreply 9606/23/2013

Oh, I'm already in suspense. Matt Weiner is likely to tell us so much about happens next season given his big mouth.

by Anonymousreply 9706/23/2013

Ironically, somebody DID go over a balcony tonight. So they gays were right.

It was Dorothy Campbell, during the "20s Party" onboard the ship.

I am besides myself with grief.

by Anonymousreply 9806/23/2013

I was really confused about Pete and his move to LA.

I wonder if Don will go back to the agency? Maybe he could move out to California and let Megan support him?

by Anonymousreply 9906/23/2013

r91 I was merely commenting on how different then vs. now is, like many people do on the Mad Men threads.

by Anonymousreply 10006/23/2013

"I swear I saw someone floating face down in a swimming pool on last week's "Next time on Mad Men."

R70 - have you been watching the show at all this season?

The pool clip you reference was there, but it was clearly the Jon Hamm dream sequence clip when he falls into the pool, all of the clips were from previous episodes. Weiner made it clear he would not show preview clips of the season finale in the second to last episode. do not recall them saying it was scenes from next week's episode - they definitely did not include their statement about an "extended scene from next week's episode" online.

by Anonymousreply 10106/23/2013

I am a GHOST on this show, gay bitches.

I'm not Sharon Tate, I'm not dead, and I'm divorcing Don. If everyone is super-nice to me, I'll turn up in a guest spot next season dressed like Dyan Cannon. But that is it.

by Anonymousreply 10206/23/2013

"When I moved south, I was expected to work twice as hard, for less pay."

R96 - slightly off topic but are you serious? You REALLY did not know that was the case?

by Anonymousreply 10306/23/2013

[quote]I swear I saw someone floating face down in a swimming pool on last week's "Next time on Mad Men."

It was a clip from the episode several weeks ago where Don almost drowned in a pool when he, Roger and Harry went to L.A. As with him hitting the preacher and landing in jail, he had a full-on blackout.

by Anonymousreply 10406/23/2013

All my life I've heard of New Yorker's complaining about how they hate California and want to move back to New York.

I think it's because of the traffic and because they can't walk anywhere.

by Anonymousreply 10506/23/2013

Jesus, you bitches are dense. Here's what's happening next season:

1. Megan and her teef are outta there. Doesn't matter if she stays in NYC or moves to L.A.; she and Don are clearly done, and with good reason.

2. Don will return to SC&P a "free" man: free of his demons, free of his alcoholism. Him confessing his sins, as it were, to the Hershey's executives -- which would have been UNTHINKABLE for the old Don -- was effectively his rock-bottom. Him subsequently taking his children to see where the real *Dick*, as opposed to Don, grew up was the first step in his self-redemption -- and also possibly the only way to save Sally from destroying her own life, by providing insight into why Don acts the way he does (e.g. fucking the neighbor's wife).

3. Pete is going to L.A. -- not permanently -- because Ted's the creative guy and they need an account guy out there. He'll be going back and forth, much like he did between NYC and Detroit this season.

4. Bob is coming back, regardless of all the hysteria from R17 about the "impossibility" of him being on two shows at once. At most he's in 2-3 scenes a week, and he'll be a supporting player on the Robin Williams sitcom. It's not like either job is all that demanding.

5. Bob is NOT getting together with Joan; if anything, Roger is. Joan is the most perceptive woman on the show and undoubtedly knows that Bob doesn't "swing her way," if only because she can read a man's attraction to her like Shakespeare could read sonnets. She likes him as a person and as a father figure for Kevin, hence her inclusion of him in her life.

6. Ted is, obviously, gone. Don let him have the California job because he sees himself at the beginning of the series in him, when he first started cheating on Betty. It's all been downhill since then, and he wants Ted to save himself before it's too late.

7. I have no fucking idea what actually happened with Manolo (real name "Marcus," in case you missed it) and Mrs. Campbell, either, or if Bob is somehow involved. In any event, it's a mystery that will be resolved next season, and yet another reason to fully expect Bob to return.

Expect Alan Sepinwall to confirm most or all of the above in a few hours.

by Anonymousreply 10606/23/2013

And the third world invasion, r105. LA is a shithole now, but in the 60s it was pretty.

by Anonymousreply 10706/23/2013

Btw as for Pete's driving abilities: Bob surely could have heard via office gossip that Pete only got his driver's license the previous year, and it could have easily come up in conversation (keeping in mind that the two traveled together quite a bit even before Bob started coming on to him) that Pete never learned to drive stick.

by Anonymousreply 10806/23/2013

Yes. What r106 said. That's what I took away from it as well.

by Anonymousreply 10906/23/2013

Actually,Sepinwalls review is already up.

by Anonymousreply 11006/23/2013

I really am better with less screen time, aren't I? That was actually a real scene I did there tonight. And on the phone, which is kinda hard.

by Anonymousreply 11106/23/2013

Weiner, Hamm et al. talk about tonight's season finale and what the whole season is about at link:

by Anonymousreply 11206/23/2013

[quote]4. Bob is coming back, regardless of all the hysteria from [R17] about the "impossibility" of him being on two shows at once. At most he's in 2-3 scenes a week, and he'll be a supporting player on the Robin Williams sitcom. It's not like either job is all that demanding.

Plus the shows film at different times of the year.

And look at Gillian Anderson who will be doing THREE series (The Fall, Crisis and Hannibal), and she's a lead on two of those.

by Anonymousreply 11306/23/2013

Doesn't Harry spend all his time in LA and wouldn't that mean they already have an LA office?--certainly a desk with a window.

R106--The question is not what would Pete be doing in LA. The question is when was it decided he was going? Don had no intention of taking an account guy.

by Anonymousreply 11406/23/2013

Good point about Harry, R114.

by Anonymousreply 11506/23/2013

Your Klan hood is showing, R107.

by Anonymousreply 11606/23/2013

People like R107 never realize that many people think the same about gays and AIDS. Gays and "their diseases" have ruined society.

by Anonymousreply 11706/23/2013

R114: It's safe to assume that that happened offscreen - probably after Pete's disaster in Detroit. Don apparently didn't know what was going on at the office.

by Anonymousreply 11806/23/2013

R113, the two shows will not film the sane time of year. The Crazy Ones will go from mid August to late April and Mad Men will probably shoot November to March. James Wolk might be able to make a few appearances next season but he can't be a regular on both. And he's the other male lead on The Crazy Ones, by the way, not a "supporting" character.

Wow, 6 pages and no mention of what a great moment "Not GREAT, Bob!" was? It's already been Vined.

by Anonymousreply 11906/23/2013

If "Manolo" was really Marcus Valentine wouldn't Bob know this? And why would he be speaking Spanish to him if he did?

by Anonymousreply 12006/23/2013

If Bob is indeed telling the truth when he says to Pete in the elevator that he had no idea what "Manolo" was up to, then clearly Bob too was taken in by Manolo/Marcus and may not know who he really is/was...

by Anonymousreply 12106/23/2013

I was born in LA, and my family goes back since the turn of the century, and it's true what r107 says. It's not politically correct, but it is totally fucking true, and it's really sad.

The SEEDS for the destruction of paradise, aka LA were always there, San Fernando, Boyle Heights, East LA, but the illegal population has exploded and LA can't really handle it.

It was a much more open and less class obsessed place in the past, now, not at all.

by Anonymousreply 12206/23/2013

The 70s is when a lot of agencies opened in San Francisco. Isn't Don looking too far south?

by Anonymousreply 12306/23/2013

[quote] They're ALL moving to L.A. It's like the final season of "Laverne and Shirley."

If that's true, I want the new theme song to include Don Draper watching a gaggle of kids doing "Schlemiel...." and then see him tap dance behind the title.

by Anonymousreply 12406/23/2013

That's Marcus Constantine, Panamanian, to you bitches.

by Anonymousreply 12506/23/2013

"Sounds like a plan" was not a catchphrase in 1968. That's just sloppy.

by Anonymousreply 12606/23/2013

The backstory with Roger's daughter is not pointless, R87. It makes him want to connect with his son, and perhaps makes a buyout of Don's partnership impossible for Roger because he's giving so much of his money to his daughter.

What happened to Ginsberg?

by Anonymousreply 12706/23/2013

I think I'm done.

by Anonymousreply 12806/23/2013

This episode made me SPASTIC!

by Anonymousreply 12906/23/2013

"I'm not that girl." The anachronisms are piling up.

by Anonymousreply 13006/23/2013

Don's use of the word "bi-coastal" to Megan.

That word wasn't in the lingo until the Swingin' 70s!

by Anonymousreply 13106/23/2013

Megan needs to get to California in time for a certain gathering on Cielo Drive.

by Anonymousreply 13206/23/2013

I kept thinking that, too, R132. She has about nine months until August 9th, right?

by Anonymousreply 13306/23/2013

I was cringing at the thought of watching Don come apart but it was clearly a positive development akin to shedding a skin. He's on the verge of integrating his two identities, which will take a toll on his career but will finally stop those ghoulish nightmares. He has a chance at a relationship with his kids. The question for next season will be whether he wants to continue being Don Draper and working in advertising. The point of having Sylvia on this season was to show that Don married a hot babe but he can't talk to her. I get the sense that he and Megan are done but I hope they don't prolong it for the entire season. I don't see him going back to Betty although she did appear to grow this season. I don't think that SC and partners is long for this world. They've basically exploded their creative department and if this show were accurate, the new guy would bring in his new team. I think we can finally look forward to Roger getting together with Joan and dying immediately afterward, which will underscore how Don's going sober has saved his life. It's clear now that all the scenes of Don being off his game were the prelude to his coming apart. I don't think he gives a shit about advertising. And Betty does not want an unsuccessful husband. Maybe the best resolution is for Don to move to upstate New York and make furniture. Next season: Woodstock and Watergate. Then we're out of iconic events for a while.

by Anonymousreply 13406/23/2013

When are they actually filming the last season? BTW, I'm glad it's ending, too much longer and it really gets too stale, too soap-operaish.

by Anonymousreply 13506/23/2013

In real life, the real Don Draper's never went back to wife #1. Think Hal Riney. And to me, that is who Don is really based on.

by Anonymousreply 13606/23/2013

R135 they write from August to October and film Oct/Nov til Mar or April.

by Anonymousreply 13706/23/2013

When Ted and Peggy got together I thought, "And now they can have beautiful bug-eyed children together." Oh, well.

And I'm guessing when Pete rejected Bob's advances, Bob found out Pete doesn't drive stick.

by Anonymousreply 13806/24/2013

I thought it was pointless to have Megan use the word "fuck" while argung with Don, then to bleep it out. Why bother.

by Anonymousreply 13906/24/2013

[quote]It's clear now that all the scenes of Don being off his game were the prelude to his coming apart. I don't think he gives a shit about advertising.

But creatively, Don hasn't been off his game. His work - when he's actually done some work - has been ahead of its time. He's been off his game in terms of only erratically giving a shit about pleasing clients.

And Peggy is now acting creative director of a major ad agency at age 28? Quite a career trajectory for a mousy secretary.

by Anonymousreply 14006/24/2013

As of today, none of my favorite shows - Mad Men, Breaking Bad, Project Runway, RuPaul's Drag Race, Modern Family, The Big Bang Theory, or The Middle - will have new episodes airing until July 18, when Project Runway Season 12 starts.

This must be how sports fans feel about that ONE day in the whole year (the day after the Baseball All-Star Game?) when NO major league sports play at all.

I haven't read this thread yet. Maybe I should space it out throughout course of a month...

by Anonymousreply 14106/24/2013

Wow, sure have shitty taste in TV.

by Anonymousreply 14206/24/2013

I agree the whole Manolo story made little sense. Bob seemed to know him pretty well. What the hell?

Pete can't drive stick, ha.

Was that little kid on the steps eating a popsicle in November? Where do you think that was? New York? Connecticut?

by Anonymousreply 14306/24/2013

[quote]The backstory with Roger's daughter was pointless

No it wasn't. It clearly shows that Roger's familial priorities are being re-shuffled to include his son with baby mama Joan.

[quote]"Sounds like a plan" was not a catchphrase in 1968. ... "I'm not that girl" The anachronisms are piling up

I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt uncomfortable with these (you can add Roger's "REALLY?!" reaction to Benson already being at his door). Though it is not inconceivable that any of those phrases could have been uttered by a given person in some isolated instance in 1968, their post-millennium popularity makes them suspect and bad writing choices. As a staunch defender of Mad Men's amazing loyalty to the times so far, I was taken a bit aback.

I, too don't get what's so difficult to comprehend about a Creative Director (Don, then Ted) wanting to take an account man (Pete, who happened to have become available after the Detroit fiasco) to California, as part of the small team setting shop there. And no, having Harry in LA prior did not constitute having a branch of their firm there. To be an agency branch, you need more than an TV ad space buyer in place.

by Anonymousreply 14406/24/2013

Don't try to fool us, R8, you're psychic, right?

by Anonymousreply 14506/24/2013

Re: Pete going to California. Sure, it's understandable, R144, but I think it should have been made a bit clearer. I hope this doesn't mean less Pete next season. I always enjoying watching Pete.

As I think somebody upthread noted, "bicoastal" seems like an anachronism as well.

by Anonymousreply 14606/24/2013

Good observation, R126. I think "ballpark" was also anachronistic. I'm surprised these glitches get by Weiner and his co-writers.

by Anonymousreply 14706/24/2013

Interesting how all protagonists - Don, Peggy, Joan, Pete, and Roger - have been left to fend for themselves by this season's end. Thanksgiving is a good way to drive that point home. Just hope Pete is not the one doing the driving:). I know, lame.

Also interesting how patriarchal some things still remain in 1968 New York, where men make decisions, change their mind on a whim, affect many in the process, yet expect them to adjust (Don, Ted, Roger). Only that for the first time, they're encountering some resistance from the affected ones, also a product of the countercultural 60's.

by Anonymousreply 14806/24/2013

The poster who was hankering for some Mary Richards fashions some weeks ago must have been very pleased with Megan's brown skirt/boots/side-tied career scarf ensemble as well as Peggy's gingham pant suit.

And on another shallow note, loved Bob's style when complaining about his weight gain in Detroit. And some people still think he's not gay?

by Anonymousreply 14906/24/2013

R127 Ginsy? He's a secondary character to begin with. The last episode dealt with much bigger guns.

I don't know if Don is finished with Teefy. All I know Weiner might throw a curveball and have Megan back and preggers. Then again it wasn't fair for Dung Draper to jerk her around. Sure he did Ted a favor but he too needed a fresh start. It will be interesting to see the LA shop with Ted, Crane and that insufferable cunt Pete all interacting with each other.

R135 It's already a soap opera! As much as it tries not to be it is. Mad Men is sometimes a bizarre mash-up of a soap opera and a Douglas Sirk film. The same thing goes for Weiner's previous work on Sopranos. It had more in common with General Hospital than Good Fellas!;)

by Anonymousreply 15006/24/2013

Bob knew about Pete's driving issues from Manolo. Manolo mentioned that Pete's mother told him Pete could not drive. Pete replied "not good enough for her". I believe Pete was Bob's mark. Yes, Bob knew what Manolo was up to with Dot. Bob is just hanging out with Joan, because it makes sense in his world.

by Anonymousreply 15106/24/2013

Will we ever find out if Joan got Avon?

Not a cliffhanger, but still.

by Anonymousreply 15206/24/2013

where was the whorehouse--I thought Don grew up in Kansas or something--he stopped by on his way back from picking up Sally at Miss Porters?

by Anonymousreply 15306/24/2013

He said he grew up in Pennsylvania

by Anonymousreply 15406/24/2013

The scene in front of the elevator forecasts Don's quick return to the agency. If the partners are planning to replace Don with the jerk we saw on the plane to Detroit (who's been brought in by feckless Duck no less), it's clear they'll soon be regretting their decision. In this universe it's a fundamental law that Don is indispensable to the firm's success; even beloved Peggy is occasionally humiliated (or, at least, humbled) to make that point.

by Anonymousreply 15506/24/2013

According to an interview with Weiner, Joan landed Avon.

by Anonymousreply 15606/24/2013

I do not understand what is going on with Roger and his daughter. She said for once she wants to be the girl he gives money too and that he's bleeding them dry; yet, someone posted he is giving her family money?

by Anonymousreply 15706/24/2013

Margaret Sterling is a brat is what she is.

by Anonymousreply 15806/24/2013

Surprised that MW thought it was clear that Joan landed the Avon account.

Good for her, but there needed to be a few more hints of this for the audience.

by Anonymousreply 15906/24/2013

Her father's no prize either r158

by Anonymousreply 16006/24/2013

Anybody catch Harry Hamlin's huge turtleneck when they met with Don at the end. Perfect.

by Anonymousreply 16106/24/2013

Where is our Bellhop for Mad Men??! Or Not Marc? Can we get a Not Matthew please? That season was a big fat bore and I wasted $25 on iTunes. It was like the ending of Smash where they just threw all the resolutions in the last episode. Nothing was a shock, nothing was even a surprise.

Note to M Weiner: This isn't free form prose, it's fucking TELEVISION. Create some tension and suspense. And give me my $25 back because this was just self-indulgent bullshit.

by Anonymousreply 16206/24/2013

No shit. Nothing fucking happened. All season long and nothing happened. It's embarrassing to listen to people who are still enamored by it. Waxing on about how it's all a character study and that people who notice that emperor is naked must need explosions and car chases to be satisfied. Nope, just a little plot.

by Anonymousreply 16306/24/2013

R163 tells the truth. No one else listens.

by Anonymousreply 16406/24/2013

A stunning episode. Left me speechless. Anyone who thinks otherwise knows nothing about good writing.

by Anonymousreply 16506/24/2013

Here's an idea: you don't like the show? Stop watching it!

And can someone who speaks "lame" please translate r162's post?

by Anonymousreply 16606/24/2013

Bob is not gay. He is fucking with Pete to drive him crazy and out. He is a totally evil, slimy, ambitious slug. But dreamy, no?

by Anonymousreply 16706/24/2013

Seems like Don should be more worried about his real Hershey bar... ME!

by Anonymousreply 16806/24/2013

Did everyone claiming that nothing happened or there were a bunch of reolutions miss the parts where Betty said she can't handle Sally anymore, Megan walked out and Don basically got fired from the firm?

by Anonymousreply 16906/24/2013

Love the ending song of Both Sides Now...Perfect.

Peggy in that groovy, sort of sexy (again!) polyester pant suit hanging in Don's office. Peggy is definitely going to be in an even more lead role! But I like that they show her getting over her mousy side. I like the sexy Peggy...

by Anonymousreply 17006/24/2013

R169, that's pretty much all that happened all season long. Unless you count all of the stuff that didn't happen on screen but you're supposed to seek out through Matthew Weiner's online interviews. That's not good writing, that's just lazy.

by Anonymousreply 17106/24/2013

Two competing firms merged, half the employees were let go, Pete and Roger's mothers died, Pete got caught cheating and kicked out, Don cheated in the lowest way and got caught by his daughter (destroying their relationship), Cosgrove hot shot, and a total fake rose to power. Dull season - not a thing happened.

by Anonymousreply 17206/24/2013

Pete's family must have had a summer house somewhere--I'm really surprised he just recently learned to drive.

by Anonymousreply 17306/24/2013

Pete can drive, he just can't drive a five speed. Boy, are you people dense...

by Anonymousreply 17406/24/2013

It'll be interesting to see where they pick up the story in the final season. I bet Meghan will be in the show, but not as often. If Don's "on leave," he can go to California with her. What did they have before Betty Ford?

Roger won't be able to stand Duck's candidate very long. Don will be back at Sterling Cooper even though Matt Weiner said that he was, in effect, fired last night. Peggy can't do what Don does. She's good, but she's not at his level.

Maybe the way they'll work it out is that Don will come back to SC, because he'll bring in some big account. But they'll make him stay in L.A. As a plot device that works, because he can then continue to make Pete & Ted miserable.

If you look at the way things are currently constituted at SC NYC, you have Peggy, Ginsberg, Stan, Ken Cosgrove, Joan, Roger, & Bob. In L.A. you'll have Pete, Harry, and Ted. Putting Don in that mix will drive Ted nuts.

I almost wonder if they end it by having the NY partners put the agency in play for a buy out. As someone pointed out, who in that agency is in a position to buy out Don's partnership? That's why I think they'd rather take him back via the LA office.

Maybe we'll learn that Ted left SC after moving to LA. He really isn't that important except as the nice guy, straight arrow type. SC is pretty toxic for a dedicated family guy.

Think about it. Joan was diddling Roger for years thru two of his wives. Peggy had Pete's baby. Pete cheated on Trudy, and needed her more as a mother/advisor than a wife. No need to talk about Don. So Ted really didn't fit in with that crew.

OK. So in 1969 you have the Tate murders, then in 72, McGovern, then '73-74 Watergate & Nixon's resignation. Huge anti war demonstrations going on still and the Non-Violent Civil Rights movement sort of falls apart, as there is a more violent, more assertive Black consciousness movement is ascendant.

As for the Women's movement, this is their time. Late 60's early 70's. They were beginning to "roar." In numbers too big to ignore... I will be interested in the way Joan & Peggy's characters develop. Not to much for Roger to do besides be Roger. That's enough for me. Roger & Pete are always interesting.

by Anonymousreply 17506/24/2013

Roger needs to die of a heart attack before this series ends.

by Anonymousreply 17606/24/2013

I can totally understand not liking the episode (or even the whole season), but how anyone could watch last night's finale and say that "nothing happened" is bewildering to me. Don effectively killed his persona off and allowed Dick Whitman out into the light. Isn't that, like, the biggest thing that's happened on this show ever?

What do some of you people want? A vampire war? A gangland attack? Moldavia?

by Anonymousreply 17706/24/2013

[quote]Bob is not gay

ROGER: "You're back in one piece."

BOB: "Ugh (exclaimedd in the most eye-rolling manner possible), one bigger piece, I'm putting on weight."

MARY! If that's not the gayest of quips...

by Anonymousreply 17806/24/2013

"Unless you count all of the stuff that didn't happen on screen but you're supposed to seek out through Matthew Weiner's online interviews"

What are you talking about? For god's sake - this show has never spelled things out and been for the simple-minded. If a viewer wants want "action" or nothing but ham-handed plots they should watch something else and be much happier.

by Anonymousreply 17906/24/2013

I think it will be Bert who dies and Don comes to the funeral or something. But Roger dying during the course of the season definitely makes sense. He's at a happy place. Less interesting storyline for him.

by Anonymousreply 18006/24/2013

Ken has been injured twice in the line of duty (with the Chevvy folks).

Interesting that he hasn't sued Chevvy or leveraged more out of SC&P other than being granted the right to work just out of New York.

by Anonymousreply 18106/24/2013

[quote]You know what? Why don't YOU just tell them what I saw.

Best line this episode.

by Anonymousreply 18206/24/2013

Last night's episode was astonishing. It makes me think that the next season, the show's last season, will be fascinating.

It won't go into the seventies though, didn't Weiner say that the show wouldn't go past the 60's?

by Anonymousreply 18306/24/2013

r17 first you predict that Don will be back because Peggy (in NYC) won't measure up and then you state it would be better plot-wise for him to be sent to LA. He can't be in both offices at the same time. Make up your mind.

by Anonymousreply 18406/24/2013

Sterling Cooper's office address is Avenue of the Americas.

So why do they overlook the Pan Am building?

by Anonymousreply 18506/24/2013

Matt Weiner has made it clear that the show will end in 1969.

by Anonymousreply 18606/24/2013

I thought it was the best episode of the season, but some of the dialogue was really bad.

Megan: "I can't do this."

I half expected her to break into a Grey's Anatomy "You don't get to say that!"

by Anonymousreply 18706/24/2013

Why does Megan always, always hold her arms and act cold? ALl the damn time.

by Anonymousreply 18806/24/2013

[quote][R17] first you predict that Don will be back because Peggy (in NYC) won't measure up and then you state it would be better plot-wise for him to be sent to LA. He can't be in both offices at the same time. Make up your mind.

R175 isn't actually writing the show, weirdo, just speculating like everyone else; he can suggest more than one possible future for Don if he pleases.

by Anonymousreply 18906/24/2013

Because she's not a very good actress, r188.

I hope Megan gets banished to LA next season, I'm so tired of her and her whining. The Megan scenes have been taking time away from the office, where the real fun is.

by Anonymousreply 19006/24/2013

My predictions for next season. Sally lives with Don. Megan is gone for good, but we'll see Don be financially generous with her. The firm will want Don back, but he realizes he doesn't want to work in advertising anymore. The swanky NYC apartment will be gone and he'll be in much more humble digs. Peggy is going to be one angry, jaded but successful bitch. Roger dies.

by Anonymousreply 19106/24/2013

As expected, I was RIGHT about nearly everything:

[quote]1. Megan and her teef are outta there. Doesn't matter if she stays in NYC or moves to L.A.; she and Don are clearly done, and with good reason.

Per Alan Sepinwall: "With all due respect to Jessica Paré, I don't know that we ever need to see Megan again. Weiner gave us a lot of Megan over the last few seasons, but was never able to develop her into a character who functioned interestingly outside of her relationship with Don. Lord knows I'm not the biggest Betty fan, but there have been some strong Betty-centric stories from time to time over the years, where Megan was mainly there to reflect what Don's been going through in the latter half of the decade." (Btw you're crazy if you don't think he's the single most influential media critic of the show, or that Weiner et al don't listen to him.)

[quote]2. Don will return to SC&P a "free" man: free of his demons, free of his alcoholism. Him confessing his sins, as it were, to the Hershey's executives -- which would have been UNTHINKABLE for the old Don -- was effectively his rock-bottom. Him subsequently taking his children to see where the real *Dick*, as opposed to Don, grew up was the first step in his self-redemption -- and also possibly the only way to save Sally from destroying her own life, by providing insight into why Don acts the way he does (e.g. fucking the neighbor's wife).

Again, per Alan: "...his job at SC&P possibly over, he can focus on repairing things with his kids, which he starts to do by taking them to the whorehouse in Pennsylvania (whose exterior now reflects how Dick felt growing up there), just to give Sally an idea of where he came from and why he is the way he is."

Matt Weiner on the reason why Don will return to SC&P (without actually giving away a spoiler that it will happen): "It's the spirit of change that has been ignited by him hitting rock bottom. Being in the drunk tank and telling Megan, "It got out of control. I got out of control," he's in a different head space. He's quit drinking. I think a lot of it's about his daughter, as we find out ... It's hard for me to explain this, but Don's ads this year are spectacular. That omission is actually kind of an expression of creative genius. It is where things are going. It is the way advertising will be in 1975. You just have to talk the clients into it ... Don's advertising, I think, is still great advertising, and probably better than a lot of the advertising that is getting sold. His understanding of television is the reason they got Sunkist, you know?"

[quote]3. Pete is going to L.A. -- not permanently -- because Ted's the creative guy and they need an account guy out there. He'll be going back and forth, much like he did between NYC and Detroit this season.

This is the only one I was apparently wrong on: Pete's move seems to be a permanent one.

[quote]4. Bob is coming back, regardless of all the hysteria from [R17] about the "impossibility" of him being on two shows at once. At most he's in 2-3 scenes a week, and he'll be a supporting player on the Robin Williams sitcom. It's not like either job is all that demanding.

Per the Weiner interview:

[italic]Speaking of James, he's doing "The Crazy Ones" in the fall. You've always been able to work things out with Alison Brie so that she can do your show while she's doing "Community." Do you have a similar arrangement in place with James Wolk, or will Bob just be in Detroit all year? [/italic]

Matthew Weiner: I can't tell you. You have to watch. We loved having him on the show. I would say that the little thought I've given it, I don't think his story is over.

by Anonymousreply 19206/24/2013

[quote]The scene in front of the elevator forecasts Don's quick return to the agency. If the partners are planning to replace Don with the jerk we saw on the plane to Detroit (who's been brought in by feckless Duck no less), it's clear they'll soon be regretting their decision.

Exactly. It was also there for ironic purposes: Duck was fired from SCDP because he was a drunk, and he subsequently ruined his career at Grey (and relationship with Peggy) because he was a drunk.

[quote]I thought it was pointless to have Megan use the word "fuck" while argung with Don, then to bleep it out. Why bother.

You must not pay very close attention. The characters on the show have repeatedly said "fuck" from time to time, usually in moments of extreme drama (like Don and Megan breaking up), and it's always bleeped out because AMC is on basic cable and "fuck" is not allowed there (though at this point it appears to be the only word *not* allowed -- shit, goddamn and pussy are now allowable). You should watch the first season of "Breaking Bad" on DVD to see how many times they said fuck (and on AMC's original airing it was bleeped every time).

by Anonymousreply 19306/24/2013

Yes, R183, the show will probably end in 1969. It won't do a flash-forward into the 1970s because they'd have to bring in someone else to play Sally and that won't happen. There can be 18 Bobbys but there's only one Sally and that's Kiernan Shipka.

Uhh, R175, what about the first moon landing in 1969? That was a far bigger event than the Manson killings. You left out Chappaquidick, too.

by Anonymousreply 19406/24/2013

The Gillian Anderson analogy? Another stupid one. She was only on a few episodes of Hannibal. She'd shot The Fall many months earlier and that was only 6 episodes, anyway. The third one was also a limited series.

The Crazy Ones might have a schedule, like many sitcoms, of three weeks on, two weeks off. If that's the case maybe they could work it out for Wolk to work a few episodes in which Bob can drop every so often from Detroit but that would be it. No way can he be a regular on both shows. His CBS contract would forbid it.

by Anonymousreply 19506/24/2013

[quote]No way can he be a regular on both shows. His CBS contract would forbid it.

He's not a regular on "Mad Men"; he's a guest star, and they're routinely allowed to show up on other shows. Besides, Wolk building a fan following on "Mad Men" only *helps* CBS, not hurts them, in terms of attracting viewers to their own show.

by Anonymousreply 19606/24/2013

From a NYT interview with Weiner:

Q: Has [Don] lost his job at the agency?

A. No. I think his job is what it is. It’s a leave of absence.

by Anonymousreply 19706/24/2013

BREAKING NEWS: Weiner says that Bob is "not gay"!

[quote]We really wanted Pete to have an underling, that there was someone nipping at his heels, but was really, really good with people. Someone who, even without any substance, had a blind affection for Pete, almost an obsession with him. I don’t even think it’s gay. I think he honestly just loves what Pete represents, because Pete has everything that he wants.

by Anonymousreply 19806/24/2013

I don't think we've seen the last of Manolo. He married Pete's mother then shoved her overboard. Doesn't that mean he gets everything in her estate? I rather doubt she had a will that clearly indicated everything was left to Pete and his brother. At the very least I'm guessing there will be a court fight over who gets Ma Campbell's bank and/or brokerage accounts.

by Anonymousreply 19906/24/2013

Uggh. If R198 is accurate, it confirms what I'd said previously....

Weiner can't write for gay characters, because he doesn't get gay people. He writes gays and lesbians the same way he writes black characters, as window dressing.

It really makes me want to credit actor Bryan Batt more with bringing Sal to life as a complex, flesh and blood character.

by Anonymousreply 20006/24/2013

At long last, we have CONFIRMATION that the series -- much to the disappointment of our resident conspiracy theorists -- will NOT end with Don jumping to his death:

"For six seasons now, Don Draper’s brilliant (if sadistic) puppet master, Matthew Weiner, has taunted viewers with a poignant opening-credit sequence that features a suited ad man falling from a Manhattan office building to his presumed death. And although many of us have assumed that the series would eventually end with Don leaping to the same fate as his animated surrogate—and some of us have bothered Matthew Weiner in real life with these hunches—Weiner reveals that this is not how the beloved AMC drama will end.

In a new interview before this weekend’s season finale, the Mad Men creator explains that when he does wrap up the series, he will not put his miserable, philandering alcoholic of a protagonist out of his misery—at least via death-by-office-leap. “That jump out the window was always meant to be symbolic and internal,” Weiner tells The Wrap. “I never meant it literally. I think it’s fascinating, though—I think people think it would be cool. But it hasn’t been an option. And now that we’ve had this conversation, I really can’t do it.”

by Anonymousreply 20106/24/2013

I hate when people speculate about Mad Men. It's strong enough on its own, can't you just enjoy it for what it is? It's not a soap opera people.

by Anonymousreply 20206/24/2013

R199, did you miss the part where they said Manolo lost interest in pursuing her estate when he found out there was no money?

by Anonymousreply 20306/24/2013

He didn't say Bob isn't gay. Read with understanding. He said it was an obsession, a blind affection for Pete that wasn't rooted in some gay attraction. I guess maybe he's Margot Channing. Bob is gay.

by Anonymousreply 20406/24/2013

r194 is correct.

The moon landing was HUGE. The biggest event in human history LIVE on TV broadcast around the world.

It was on all three channels for the better part of a week. You couldn't avoid it if you tried.

Launch, capsule/lander separation, landing, moon walk, liftoff, rendezvous with capsule, splashdown, press conference, parades.

It was the only thing anyone talked about.

by Anonymousreply 20506/24/2013

The person who wrote Weiner can't write for gay characters was right. We are just these for window dressing (as was stated above). The show is over for a year, right? So all this talk will soon die off and we'll forget about Mad Men again. Once the show finishes it will go the way of Six Feet Under, Queen as Folk, Deadwood and all the other ones...

by Anonymousreply 20606/24/2013

Well, where is it supposed to go R206? The Smithsonian? It's a tv show.

by Anonymousreply 20706/24/2013

Pete's family doesn't have any money left. The estate is broke and his mother is living on credit and the support of her sons. After Pete's father died in season 1 or 2, the family's attorney told them that the father pissed all the money away.

by Anonymousreply 20806/24/2013

I hope it ends like 6FU so we can see what happens to the characters after the 60s are done. Given the Soprano's ending I suspect that will not happen, leaving the viewer to speculate on the future.

by Anonymousreply 20906/24/2013

I was hoping for a "China Beach" final season so we see what happen to them over the next twenty years.

No, I'm kidding; that wouldn't work.

by Anonymousreply 21006/24/2013

It was a relief for Pete's mother to die but on the other seems like Bob's friend probably murdered her.

by Anonymousreply 21106/24/2013

[quote]Weiner says that Bob is "not gay"!

I think your misconstruing Wiener's always ambiguous, non-committal words. Saying he doesn't think Bob's obsession with Peter is even gay is very different from saying the character isn't gay.

Plus, everything else in your quote at r198 seems like dated information (when did this interview take place?), since by this point in the storyline, Bob is not infatuated with Pete as much as he wants him to stop threatening him.

He declared him an "hijo de puta" (harsher insult than son of a bitch BTW), saying to someone in Spanish that he doesn't care how nice his Mom is because Pete is making his life difficult, has exchanged harsh words with him in more than one occasion, and all but got him kicked out of Detroit. Hardly the actions of someone with a "blind affection" for Pete.

by Anonymousreply 21206/24/2013

I also hope at the end of Mad Men we get a flash-forward to see what finally happened to all the characters, kind of like what Six Feet Under did in their finale. This might sound weird, but I will feel kind of cheated if they don't do that.

by Anonymousreply 21306/24/2013

It was odd how much of a non-issue was made of the fact that Manolo disposed of Pete's mother. Bob wasn't concerned.

by Anonymousreply 21406/24/2013

Mrs. Campbell's death is a done deal. No fuss, no mess, just a little face saving by feeding the detective some standard expense-not-an-issue line, then conveniently saying "we have another call, we'll get back to you."

That'll be the last of THAT criminal investigation...and Peter and his brother didn't have to shell out a cent in lawyers. detectives, or burials.

The brother's statement said it all ("she's with Dad, she liked the sea). He's done. Case closed. Manolo should be expecting a Thank You note from them come Christmas '68.

by Anonymousreply 21506/24/2013

The Sopranos was another show with a supreme lack of gay characters, except for Vito near the close of the series. I always thought Jackie Aprile, Jr. was gay (or would have been with a different show runner).

Weiner's comments about Bob should have been --sure he's gay, but has no particular feelings for Pete.

by Anonymousreply 21606/24/2013

I don't think they will separate Don from the agency for an entire season. What would be interesting is how bringing Dick Whitman into the light will change him. Will he be happier and a better father and partner? Will he marry Peggy?

by Anonymousreply 21706/24/2013

r27 = Peggy.

I am not your boyfriend.

by Anonymousreply 21806/24/2013

Please. This is the 1960s. My uncle was gay throughout the 1960s. He also married a woman in 1971. He didnt come out until the early 80s and even then it was very difficult. My father (his brother) was so upset that my siblings and I were not allowed to see him for years.

by Anonymousreply 21906/24/2013

It WAS odd that the death of Pete's mother was treated with so little reverence. No flowers, no sympathy, no compassion from anyone else at the agency, and not a scintilla of grief from Pete.

Even if Pete loathed his mother - and clearly, he did - losing a parent is one of life's major adjustments and there would surely be emotional ramifications. And it's unlikely his colleagues would have just blown off such a profound event in the life of their co-worker.

by Anonymousreply 22006/24/2013

The last 3 outfits Peggy were were fabulous, hopefully now she will start dressing more sophisticated and won't waste her time on married men.

by Anonymousreply 22106/24/2013

[quote]Did Betty change her hair-do? It looked different

I think her hair was more relaxed looking because she had been sleeping on it, the call from their daughter's school came late at night. Sometimes January Jones can really look beautiful.

by Anonymousreply 22206/24/2013

[quote]Bob is gay.

Sorry, but when the series creator DIRECTLY refutes you and says Bob's interest in Pete "isn't even gay," it's pretty much a concrete affirmation that he is not, in fact, gay, but rather servile.

by Anonymousreply 22306/24/2013

[quote]Sorry, but when the series creator DIRECTLY refutes you and says Bob's interest in Pete "isn't even gay,"

He said Bob's *interest in Pete* isn't even gay, not that Bob is definitively not gay at all.

by Anonymousreply 22406/24/2013

Weiner likes Bob's character and for that reason he won't let him be gay. Anyway, all of this is a year away. Time to move on to Boardwalk and Walking Dead...

by Anonymousreply 22506/24/2013

Wow, r198, r223, et al - you need to enroll in a reading comprehension class.

by Anonymousreply 22606/24/2013

I've already turned my attention to other things: indie film offers, luxury brand endorsement deals, and a chance to create my own lifestyle/fashion/food blog.

You all need to give it a rest.

by Anonymousreply 22706/24/2013

But it is r202, it really is.

by Anonymousreply 22806/24/2013

[quote]Time to move on to Boardwalk and Walking Dead...

I am the knock on the door.

by Anonymousreply 22906/24/2013

Agree with r215

Poor Pete's mom!

by Anonymousreply 23006/24/2013

I don't think Bob is gay either. He's an opportunist who acted on a bunch that Pete was, and that he could use his masculine wiles on him. If Bob WERE gay he wouldn't hit on unattractive, weaselly Pete, he'd go after one of the other hunks or hot daddies.

by Anonymousreply 23106/24/2013

Look at Don Draper as a metaphor of America from 1960 to 1969. In 1960 he was a liar, a cheat, a drunk and passing himself off as this fine respectable man from a good background while in fact he was the poor abused son of a whore. America in the 1950s was similar, passing itself off as this white-bread middle class paradise of opportunity, decency and freedom.

By 1969 the jig was up and the truth was out.

I`m wondering if the agency doesn't flounder without Don, while perhaps he finds success and happiness on his own terms.

One thing all the recaps are saying that I didn't catch is that Pete quit SC&P. He wasn't at the partner's meeting (and he is a partner) and Trudy told him he was now free of her, of them (meaning SC&P).

I wonder if Don and Pete don't somehow partner up?

by Anonymousreply 23206/24/2013

Trudy's "them" referred to Pete's family, R232. Those recaps are wrong. Ted wasn't at that partners' meeting, either.

by Anonymousreply 23306/24/2013

Pete didn't quit SC&P. He and Ted are heading up a west coast branch of the office.

by Anonymousreply 23406/24/2013

I think Don will return to SC&P on his own terms.

by Anonymousreply 23506/24/2013

I also think Weiner meant that Bob doesn't want to have sex with Pete, just steal his career, - but is still gay.

by Anonymousreply 23606/24/2013


by Anonymousreply 23706/24/2013

OMG, guys?

Bob's gay.

Deal with it.

by Anonymousreply 23806/24/2013

r1 She is in her 40's and has given up keeping up with the latest fashions. Personally I think the gigantic boobs make her look silly than anything.

by Anonymousreply 23906/24/2013

He just happens to hit on a man? I think Wiener mean that sexual attraction was not what was motivating his play on Pete, not that Bob is not a homo. In the show's universe, what straight man would just want to be pals with Joan?

by Anonymousreply 24006/24/2013

Bingo, R240.

by Anonymousreply 24106/24/2013

If a character hit on Pete, they're not hitting on a man. Perhaps they like womanly men.

by Anonymousreply 24206/24/2013

Well twiggy aka R239, what is she to do with her "gigantic boobs"? I know she HAS to conform with the times...

by Anonymousreply 24306/24/2013

I didn't like the woman in blue in the elevator in front of Bob and Pete. Her facial expressions were completely wrong and hammy.

by Anonymousreply 24406/24/2013

Um, R243, no woman EVER had boobs that inflated unless her stomach and ass are the size of Kansas. Joan is not believable in the slightest - in any era.

by Anonymousreply 24506/24/2013

Interesting comment about Joan.

I asked my mom who's 86, what a woman like Joan would do back in the day to accomodate her boobage. Her response was that back in the 50's/60s women wore girdles but that no woman had tits as big as Joan as there wasn't a dependence on implants. That back then silicone shots would have been what a woman would use to add to her tits (outside of a bra to give her a bigger look) and that silicone shots would never add that much to a woman's breast. Basically my mom said that in all her decades living in NYC, she never encountered a woman who's tits were that big.

by Anonymousreply 24606/24/2013

[quote]OMG, guys? Bob's gay. Deal with it.

And yet, the person who wrote the episode and runs the whole show and created it in the first place, Matt Weiner, directly refutes you.

So... whom to believe? Matt Weiner, or Anonymous?

***weighs two options***

by Anonymousreply 24706/24/2013

[quote]Why does Joan dress so anachronistically?

She doesn't. She wears clothes that are no longer the fashion for 1968 but that isn't an anachronism any more than someone driving a 1965 car in 1968 would be an anachronism. It's normal.

If she were wearing acid wash designer jeans and had big spiky hair à la 1987, THAT would be an anachronism.

by Anonymousreply 24806/24/2013


He said Bob's infatuation with Pete wasn't a gay thing.

He told us Bob was gay with about twelve other scenes.

But thanks for playing.

by Anonymousreply 24906/24/2013

[quote]So... whom to believe? Matt Weiner, or Anonymous?

And how are we supposed to interpret close ups of Bob's knee touching Pete's, etc.? And Pete's very clear reaction?

On occasion, I find Weiner to be very disingenuous. The business about the alleged obviousness of Joan's success with Avon is the example that mystifies me the most.

by Anonymousreply 25006/24/2013

R250 gets it.

R247 gains agency by misinterpreting one comment in an interview, at the expense of everything we've seen on screen.

by Anonymousreply 25106/24/2013

R246, respectfully, your mom is off base, there were...there are, and there will always be some women with naturally large breasts.

And silicon wasn't happening in the late 60's.....

by Anonymousreply 25206/24/2013

R252, of course there have always been women with large breasts but Joan is extremely large for her frame for a woman back then. She was raised before all the unnatural crap in our foods that have impacted girls body today.

And YES there was silicone injected DIRECTLY to the breast. It wasn't a 'common' practice but there were numerous cases of women who had to get masectomies b/c the silicone injected in their breasts in the 1960s traveled.

A little history is a good thing. My friend, who's dad was at DOW, knew a number of teenage girls/young women who's parents allowed them get silicone injections to their breasts b/c they thought silicone was a magic substance and they didn't realize the side effects early on.

by Anonymousreply 25306/24/2013

R244, she was probably a relative of Weiner's or somebody on the crew.

Many shots have been ruined by lousy background acting by relatives on movies and TV shows.

by Anonymousreply 25406/24/2013

My older sister has/had boobs the size of watermelons. Humongous, humongous boobs but otherwise she was thin. Don't know if she still is, haven't spoken or seen her in 20 years. Her boobs were that big when she was in junior high. Needless to say, she was very popular with the boys in school and I heard a lot of jokes about how she needed a wheelbarrow to carry them around. Our mother also had humongous boobs, so they existed even before the advent of implants.

by Anonymousreply 25506/24/2013

"In the show's universe, what straight man would just want to be pals with Joan?"

Answer: Don Draper

by Anonymousreply 25606/24/2013

Speaking of Joan and Don: Wasn't it strange for Joan to invite Roger over for Thanksgiving after how he went along with the whoring-for-Jaguar thing?

by Anonymousreply 25706/24/2013

By the 70s, women with oversize breasts like that wore "minimizer" bras, which made their tits look more normal-sized (read smaller). Too bad the show will end before Joan has a chance to take advantage of that development in female undergarments.

Oddly, she looks great in the black dress she wears in the Johnny Walker ads.

by Anonymousreply 25806/24/2013

I think the only people who are really invested in the dreadfully boring Peggy/Stan 'story' are straight women.

by Anonymousreply 25906/24/2013

I hope Ted is gone. I hope Bob is not.

by Anonymousreply 26006/24/2013

Several people have speculated that Roger will die of a heart attack next season. I think he'll die, but it will be lung cancer. The camera lingered overlong on an ashtray brimming over with cigarette butts as he stubbed another one out. I think that was a hint as to the future.

by Anonymousreply 26106/24/2013

Peggy's checkered pantsuit at the end was too funny. It's hard to believe people actually wore outfits that hideous!

by Anonymousreply 26206/24/2013

[quote]Was that little kid on the steps eating a popsicle in November? Where do you think that was? New York? Connecticut?

I swear to god, it's like some of you are not even watching the show.

by Anonymousreply 26306/24/2013

R262, fashion became only more and more hideous through the 70s.

by Anonymousreply 26406/24/2013

[quote]where was the whorehouse--I thought Don grew up in Kansas or something--he stopped by on his way back from picking up Sally at Miss Porters?

The brothel is in Penn. Don was born in Kansas or somewhere in the midwest, then they moved to PA after his father was kicked by the horse because Abigail's sister lived there in the brothel. Yes, he drove the kids there after picking up Sally from school.

by Anonymousreply 26506/24/2013

[r261] Cigarettes are actually worse for the heart.

by Anonymousreply 26606/24/2013

[r246] Your mother never knew Black or Italian women?

by Anonymousreply 26706/24/2013

Don's conference room admissions had me groaning w/ realization he was coming clean at last. Odd how both Ted and Don flip-flopped w/ the chicks (Ted: I'm leaving my I need my family!) (Don: I'm moving to California... to Megan, we're not moving to CA). The ending was very poignant. Wonder if he'll come back next season as Dick or Don. As for Peggy, what a change. So mousey and then she was scolding Ted, "What did you tell your wife? Did you confess?!!!. Sheesh. As much as I want a woman to be shown to succeed in advertising, and it should happen, I just don't like mousey/roaring Peggy. And that last shot of Don, hot damn Hamm! Yum.

by Anonymousreply 26806/24/2013

R262, that pantsuit made me chuckle. I remember my mom and aunts wearing those, with matching headbands.

by Anonymousreply 26906/24/2013

Here's Peggy in her fabulous pantsuit. HOTT!!

by Anonymousreply 27006/24/2013

In some ways I'll be glad when both MM & BreakingBad are done.

The folks behind MadMen as well as those at AMC have been so obnoxious and arrogant toward viewers with the short seasons and obnoxious hiatuses and even the way they tease upcoming episodes... When were viewers expected to beg to follow your production?

AMC is going to have quite a fall to reality when both shows bow, and I really hope Weiner and the guys behind Breaking Bad get a little of that also.

by Anonymousreply 27106/25/2013

Preach, R264. There is only one thing to say to those who would bring 70's fashion back. It was hideous then, it's hideous now.


by Anonymousreply 27206/25/2013

[quote]"In the show's universe, what straight man would just want to be pals with Joan?" Answer: Don Draper

Yes, Rose, we've all seen the scenes of Don taking Joan to the beach, kvetching over his weight gain with her, and commenting on her mother's hairstyle while wearing a frilly apron.

by Anonymousreply 27306/25/2013

Oh, Bob!

by Anonymousreply 27406/25/2013

Thanks for such a silly response, easy to shoot down, R273

However much you want Joan to be friends only with gay men, the fact remains that Man Mad shows that Joan and Don have a close friendship, without sex. Joan was also friends with the late Lane Pryce.

by Anonymousreply 27506/25/2013

[quote][R247] gains agency by misinterpreting one comment in an interview


I love it when DLers use lit. crit. rhetoric incorrectly!

by Anonymousreply 27606/25/2013

I want Bob and Stan to spit roast me, quite deeply.

by Anonymousreply 27706/25/2013

Lane made a pass at Joan, R275. (I agree with you about Don.)

by Anonymousreply 27806/25/2013

Jesus Fucking Christ, R251, talk about mincing prisspots! "Gains agency"???

by Anonymousreply 27906/25/2013

That last scene was just perfect.

by Anonymousreply 28006/25/2013

I LOVED Peggy's pantsuit!

I grew up in the 70's. My mom wore them, Mary Tyler Moore wore them, I remember the ladies wore them on The Electric Company.

by Anonymousreply 28106/25/2013

could someone explain why people find peggy attractive? she's a bug-eyed lunatic who oscillates between extreme manic workaholism and shrewish neediness. plus she looks like a mosquito.

by Anonymousreply 28206/25/2013

R281, and what about Naomi?

by Anonymousreply 28306/25/2013

There was something about that house that fucking terrified me. It just scared the bejesus out of me. Was it CGIed? Did anyone else have a visceral reaction to those frames?

by Anonymousreply 28406/25/2013

It's a real house in L.A.

by Anonymousreply 28506/25/2013

Not to mention Moss is a clam.

by Anonymousreply 28606/25/2013

[quote]However much you want Joan to be friends only with gay men, the fact remains that Man Mad shows that Joan and Don have a close friendship, without sex. Joan was also friends with the late Lane Pryce.

Once again...did she hang out like "buddies" with those two men? She never saw Lane out of the office, and has seen Don once or twice out of the office, when he was trying to help her during trying times.

Definitely not the same type of friendships. She hangs with Bob; they clearly socialize.

Damn, Rose!

by Anonymousreply 28706/25/2013

I said it before (mainly after last season’s Christmas Waltz): Joan and Don share an almost brother/sister kind of bond. They are way too similar in so many aspects of their personalities and personal and professional history, as well as having been in too much shit together. Probably, when they first met, there could have been some sexual tension between them, but Don must have known she “belonged” to his patron, Roger (if only for seeing her wearing the fur coat he sold him) and he was smart enough to leave her alone (as was she). I don’t think he was really intimidated by her as he jokingly told her in the bar, but he was aware she was off limits. And so they went on to develop this mutual respect and fondness over the years. It actually one of the very few healthy connections he ever had and he’s totally aware of it and cherishes it.

p.s. Don being aware of the Roger and Joan ongoing thing was used in a very subtle way in season 4, when it was alluded he made a phone call to her place when they were trying to locate Roger after Ken found out Lucky Strike were leaving.

by Anonymousreply 28806/25/2013

Sorry, I write for TV, including more than one show that we have posted about here over the years. And I know more than one former Mad Men writer. In the rooms where I have worked, we have talked a lot about giving characters agency over problems. When a twat like R247 tries to cling to a fringe theory and beat us over the heads with it, I read that as giving himself agency in this thread, where none actually exists, the way any conspiracy theorist who abuses the truth uses that theory to become a superior truth teller to a supposedly ignorant or stubborn audience. So, yes, I would call that someone giving himself agency. Forgive me if you disagree. I have never taken a critical theory class. As for barely inside information, Matt Weiner is very fey, and he doesn't care much for Joan; any footprint she has on the show is due to fan popularity and Christina's fabulousness.

by Anonymousreply 28906/25/2013

[quote]However much you want Joan to be friends only with gay men, the fact remains that Man Mad shows that Joan and Don have a close friendship, without sex. Joan was also friends with the late Lane Pryce.

However much you may want that to be true to support your theory, it's quite clearly not. Joan did not have close friendships with Lane or Don outside the office. She didn't have close friendships with them, period. She went out for drinks once with Don and Lane once tried to kiss her.

by Anonymousreply 29006/26/2013

[quote]Man Mad

Oh, dear.

Did you do that on purpose r275? Funny stuff. I think it should be the next adopted DL moniker hall of famer, joining cak, graxy, WHET, The Fats Of Life, and pron. t

by Anonymousreply 29106/26/2013

Another World fans may not have recognized Richard Bekins as one of the Hershey executives.

He was barely recognizable hiding behind a pair of glasses. I saw his name in the credits and went back to watch the scene again. Sure nuff, it was Richard Bekins.

Bekins played the best of the many Jamie Frames on Another World. He was on from 1980 to 1983.

by Anonymousreply 29206/26/2013

So Don's secret gay son managed to screw Pete out of the Chevy account.

Don must be so proud. Remember back in season 1 how much Don hated Pete. Don even promoted Peggy to copywriter just to fuck with Pete's head.

by Anonymousreply 29306/26/2013

{quote]Of course Pete, having lived his entire life in Manhattan, would not know how to drive.

Of course regular fans of the show, having watched each episode and paid attention, would know that Pete moved to Connecticut years ago and his lack of driving skills go beyond not knowing "how to drive", since entire plot points revolved around him taking driver's ed classes and resenting his commute after moving out of Manhattan.

Pete can drive. He can't drive well, hates doing it and, obviously, can't drive stick, but he can drive.

by Anonymousreply 29406/26/2013

[quote]I was merely commenting on how different then vs. now is, like many people do on the Mad Men threads.

We know, but [bold]that's been the theme of the entire series since episode 1. [/bold]

Which is why, week after week, when posts like yours which marvel over some blazing neon sign of cultural subtext ("times have changed!" "men/women/different races don't act/dress/get treated like that anymore!" "Everyone in 2013 knows LA is actually a shithole!"), the rest of us need to explain to you, AGAIN, that your little moment of "Aha!" is something the rest of us have been "in on" since we saw the first previews for the series premiere 6 years ago. The show has always been about how the rapid social change and upheaval of the 60s affected these character's lives and experiences.

Seriously, it's like watching "The Golden Girls" and commenting in amazement after each episode "Aren't those old ladies funny? And so vibrant and energetic for their age! They always manage to get themselves mixed up into some comical situation each week. Has anyone noticed that?"

by Anonymousreply 29506/26/2013

"Once again...did she hang out like "buddies" with those two men? She never saw Lane out of the office, and has seen Don once or twice out of the office, when he was trying to help her during trying times."

My concept of friendship is someone whom you can absolutely count on in times of trouble as well as a person you can trust completely in your day-to-day life.

Don Draper and Joan fit those descriptions, regardless of whether or not they hang out together at the beach or spend holidays together.

As an aside, I am enjoying you calling me Rose, even though it is not my name and we do not know each other, because it helps people understand your narrow point of view.

by Anonymousreply 29606/26/2013

May I call you "twat", r296?

by Anonymousreply 29706/26/2013

That's [bold]MISS [/bold] to you, R297

by Anonymousreply 29806/26/2013

has anyone noticed there are no Asians on the show?

by Anonymousreply 29906/26/2013

Well, there was going to be a Japanese with a camera in that baby aspirin commercial. Thy always have a camera!

by Anonymousreply 30006/26/2013

Interesting stuff r251/289. Anything else you can share wrt behind the scenes?

by Anonymousreply 30106/26/2013

Hey r295 - It's just a fucking tv show. Not a doctoral thesis.

by Anonymousreply 30206/26/2013

Was I the only one who felt a craving for a Hershey's bar after the season finale. That Don Draper can sell anything, even when having a nervous breakdown.

by Anonymousreply 30306/26/2013

The closing shot of Don's childhood home reminded me of the Bates house from Psycho.

by Anonymousreply 30406/26/2013

At the end with the kids and Don looking at the decrepit house w/ the young child eating the Popsicle, and Don revealing, "This is where I grew up" it would have been hilarious if Bobby had quipped again, "Are we Negroes?" as a callback to the burglar episode. Then cut to credits.

I think Megan has had it w/ the marriage. Either Don goes w/ her to California during his leave of absence or we see him alone in NYC....and Faye the psychologist he dumped for Megan comes back into his life-- and her Mob affiliated dad.

Ginsburg's storyline needs further developing. There was something there, then it fizzled out.

If the show never returns, Don's coming clean at last is enough, but I want to see Sally (but not Glenn) at Woodstock.

by Anonymousreply 30506/26/2013

r289 I don't get Weiner promoting "Peggy"/Elizabeth Moss over Joan Harris, Joan's a much more interesting character. I hate Peggy now, hated her forever. She's a non-entity, a mouse, uninteresting. Joan is a great character, much more interesting.

by Anonymousreply 30606/26/2013

There actually was a Hershey's commercial with a dad tousling his little boy's head. I remember it well.

by Anonymousreply 30706/26/2013

"A little bit of Joan goes a long way" was the way it was put to me.

by Anonymousreply 30806/26/2013

R292, I met Bekins once at a party. He's gay and very sweet. I told him he was easily the best of all the Jamies and he replied "But not the prettiest, huh?" I did admit to him that I thought Russell Todd was damn pretty but I always believed Bekins in the role much more than any of the others.

by Anonymousreply 30906/26/2013

r309 I thought Richard Bekins was gorgeous. I wanted to be the one laying in bed with him instead of Cecile or Blaine or any of the other women Jamie was involved with. This was long before I understood what that meant.

I met Russell Todd at a party about a decade ago. He's gay too.

by Anonymousreply 31006/27/2013

r289 / r208 ok he's right about that but still, he loves Peggy, he loves Elizabeth Moss, and I and millions of MM fans can't stand her. Is Weiner flirting with clams aka Scienos? I mean why did he hire her? Surely he knew about her family connections to the clams?

by Anonymousreply 31106/27/2013

Stephen Yates was the most beautiful Jamie to me, but I agree that Bekins was the best.

by Anonymousreply 31206/27/2013

No, no, no. The only soap opera that will be discussed in this thread is the one Mad Men is becoming.

by Anonymousreply 31306/27/2013

[quote] I and millions of MM fans


Oh, you delusional twat.

by Anonymousreply 31406/27/2013

What is so delusional about saying "millions of MM fans?"

by Anonymousreply 31506/27/2013

The delusional part came when r311 claimed those millions all agree with him.

by Anonymousreply 31606/27/2013

Are there any nude photos of obvious homosexual Jon Hamm?

by Anonymousreply 31706/27/2013

Well it would have been nice to get the whole quote or a post referral number, r306 (which by the way, is NOT r311, which has yet to occur).

by Anonymousreply 31806/27/2013

Oh never mind. I needed to refresh the screen, that's why I was so lost.

by Anonymousreply 31906/27/2013

R305, that's very funny about Bobby asking "Are we negroes?" again. But that would definitely have undercut the moment of possible understanding that MW was trying to convey between Don and Sally.

by Anonymousreply 32006/27/2013

When I look at Peggy and Joan I see two very different types of women in the work place with ambition, trying to get ahead in a man's world. I find both very accurate.

My mother was probably more Peggy, and she says the whole notion of sisterhood and women's lib was bullshit. Women didn't trust one another, and would sabotage one another if they had too, and the pretty ones who traded on their sexuality always seemed to get further.

Yet we see on MM, that Joan has a lot to contend with. It's interesting. I think Awkward Peggy resents Joan's apparent ease and her effectiveness in dealing with men, while Peggy is very tense, very uptight.

Peggy is a fool if she thinks that all she has to do is be smart and tough and she'll have it all. To me, the difference is that Joan is more empathetic and seems to understand people, flaws & all, and Peggy expects more from people: to say what they mean and do what they say they'll do.

Peggy's got a rigidity to her personality that's off-putting. It will get more pronounced as she experiences more disappointments. Joan is more flexible and more adaptable.

Ted was all wrong for Peggy from the start. She was so needy for some positive feedback and when he gave her that she just melted. But Ted was inconstant and vacillating and at her core she hates that.

by Anonymousreply 32106/27/2013

[quote]Women didn't trust one another, and would sabotage one another if they had too, and the pretty ones who traded on their sexuality always seemed to get further.

This actually went on for quite a while, into the man-suit/shoulder pad/pussy-bow wearing eighties.

by Anonymousreply 32206/27/2013

R321 sums it up well.

I loved an early episode where Joan helps Harry with looking at TV episode scripts and seeing where there may be problems with ads. Joan finds that she enjoys and is good at the job, but they give the job to someone else.

by Anonymousreply 32306/27/2013

Both Peggy and Joan are complicated characters who have strengths and weaknesses, good sides and bad sides. Contrary to R321's claim, Joan is not more empathetic than Peggy. She can be mean to the secretaries she supervises, and a couple of seasons back, she behaved in a racist manner towards Paul's black girlfriend.

Also, when MLK was assassinated, Joan hugged Don's African-American secretary, Dawn, in a super-awkward way, but Peggy hugged her own African-American secretary in a warm and genuine way. In another episode, Peggy invited Dawn to spend the night her apartment after a late work day when Dawn was afraid to take the subway home. Joan's not a bad person, but Peggy has certainly shown more empathy towards the secretaries and towards African-Americans.

Both of Joan and Peggy have to deal with sexist, piggish men who constantly undermine and disparage them. Joan is more traditional and more apt to use her sex appeal to manage men, while Peggy is more modern and more apt to confront them. But again, not always -- Joan has confronted men who said nasty things about her sleeping her way to the top, and Peggy has certainly not been averse to sleeping with the men she works with (there's Pete, Duck Phillips, and Ted, to name a few, and in season one she even briefly came on to Don, but he deflected her).

by Anonymousreply 32406/27/2013

Does Pete know he has a son (?) with Peggy?

by Anonymousreply 32506/27/2013

Yes, she told him in a big fight.

by Anonymousreply 32606/27/2013

Thanks, R326. Season, ep?

by Anonymousreply 32706/27/2013

Peggy told Pete last episode of season 2.

by Anonymousreply 32806/27/2013

She did not tell him in a big fight. She told him after he told her he loved her. He'd been drinking. They were among the last in the office during the Cuban Missile Crisis. It was the season finale of season two.

by Anonymousreply 32906/27/2013

I wonder why has Don never bedded Joan. Is he not attracted to her?

by Anonymousreply 33006/27/2013

You're totally right, r329, and thanks. I not only misremembered the scene (though I remembered the office it took place in), but I forgot how beautifully written and executed it was.

by Anonymousreply 33106/27/2013

Seriously, who cares about either one of those cunts? Joan...peggy...blah blah blah.


by Anonymousreply 33206/27/2013

Give us more Teddy Chaough! That character had better come back next season, waaaaaaaaaa!

by Anonymousreply 33306/27/2013


by Anonymousreply 33406/28/2013

Don't count on it, R333/Kevin Rahm's agent.

by Anonymousreply 33506/28/2013

I don't understand the casting of Ted's character. The actor is not attractive and brings nothing to the role. I don't understand why Peggy would find him appealing. Obviously, when you have a Jon Hamm, you don't want another matinee idol, but Ted should at least be charismatic and not have the oversized eyes of a Venutian.

I liked how Roger asked Don, "Was that true?" after the Hershey confessional. Roger's known Don longer than anyone so I'd definitely be interested in Roger's take on all of that.

Pete's character is at his best when he gets knocked off of the pedestal on which he's placed himself. He'd be boring if his life was one unmitigated success, so he needs moments when he can react to adversity. It doesn't matter if Bob knew for sure Pete couldn't drive a stick or not, the point was that Pete was humiliated and Bob, who the Chevy guys all seemed to like, was the instigator. Don't fuck with Bob.

I never liked the Linda Cardellini character and never understood why her presence was supposed to have been such a big deal. Yes, I understood that having Sally catch them was a plot point, but that could have been done in lots of different ways. And Cardellini looked horrible in that short, dark wig.

by Anonymousreply 33606/28/2013

Can the writer that knows Weiner explain the Cardellini character (Sylvia) and why Don is so obsessed with her? She's unattractive.

Is she someone that Weiner is having an affair with? She drags everything down, his affair with her is dragging too.

by Anonymousreply 33706/28/2013

R338 Is Matt in the closet? He pings a bit. I don't see him fucking Sylvia but rather Bob Benson!

by Anonymousreply 33806/28/2013

Just watched the first episode of the first season again after finishing the season 6 finale. Joan's breasts were a lot smaller back then and Peggy spoke in a different way, much more like a little girl. It was great seeing Sal again!

by Anonymousreply 33906/28/2013

R339 Can they do a Sal update. The last time we saw him he was tricking in Central Park right? I bet he was at Stonewall and now has a husbear. Matt if you are reading this please make it happen!

by Anonymousreply 34006/28/2013

Sal at the Stonewall riots? Please. Those riots were 20 year-old kids. Sal would have been 50 years old by then.

by Anonymousreply 34106/28/2013

Um , the riots haven't happened yet. I think that poster was simply fantasizing about Sal hanging out at Stonewall - also very unlikely since, as much as we love him, he was a closeted, somewhat self-loathing basket case.

by Anonymousreply 34206/28/2013

R339 - Christina Hendricks was trimmer back then.

by Anonymousreply 34306/28/2013

R339, people change in 8 or 9 years. Peggy went from a bobby soxer to a businesswoman, of course her voice would have changed. Also, actors settle into their character after a while, Moss might have found she felt more comfortable with the character using a certain voice.

by Anonymousreply 34406/28/2013

R342 Good show, you hit the nail on the head with that one.Except he was closeted but by the time of Stonewall Sal could have changed. I'd like Matt to do an update on Sal next season.

by Anonymousreply 34506/28/2013

Didn't Roger mention that he had to hold Lee Jr.'s (The lucky Strike heir that also came on to Sal) balls at one point?

by Anonymousreply 34606/28/2013

Can I just say that Elisabeth Moss is one of the homeliest women I have ever seen?

by Anonymousreply 34706/28/2013

R346 - Yes.

R347 - Elisabeth can look pretty or not so pretty depending on a lot of factors.

by Anonymousreply 34806/28/2013

[quote]Wow, [R141] sure have shitty taste in TV.

Somehow I knew I'd get that reaction (this is DL after all). Would it help if I added "Downton Abbey" to the mix?

by Anonymousreply 34906/29/2013

This is how Mad Men ends.


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -








The series ends with Don Draper at the airport requesting a one-way ticket, answering the question “May I have your name, please?” and pausing, only to respond, “Dan Cooper” ...

by Anonymousreply 35006/29/2013

Finally, watched it. It was a great finale. Loved Bob duping Pete. Loved Betty admitting she basically fucked up with Sally. Loved Don realizing he's an alkie. Loved, loved, loved the awkward speech he gives in Hershey. Totally Emmy moment for Hamm. And the ending was perfect. After a very sub standard season, the finale gives me a bit of hope for the final season.

by Anonymousreply 35106/29/2013

The last season was a "mirror image" of the first season:

*Don is cheating on his young wife, who is growing restless with his behavior.

*Peggy is in love with a married man and fighting for relevance at work.

*Joan is the most powerful person in the office but has no real power.

*Pete Campbell angrily uncovers someone’s true identity (his shotgun is back too).

*Betty is thin, blonde, and beautiful again.

*Duck Phillips is suddenly around.

*Perhaps most tellingly, the agency is once again Sterling Cooper.

After Season One’s storyline of fake identity, Season Two’s started with airplanes: the crash of American Airlines Flight 1 that killed Pete’s father, the agency’s clash over Mohawk and American, the trans-continental flights to the West Coast where, in Los Angeles, the camera panned on Don’s dark sunglasses each time he put them on.

by Anonymousreply 35206/29/2013

Don't recall Peggy ever being really in love before Ted. And this

[quote]*Joan is the most powerful person in the office but has no real power

is simply not true.

Stop looking for parallelisms where there are none.

by Anonymousreply 35306/29/2013

I don't find Elisabeth Moss attractive either, but that's an incredibly unflattering photo even for her, r347. She's not that bad looking on Mad Men.

by Anonymousreply 35406/29/2013

She did look good here, though she certainly has a face made to portray headaches. (Big, sleep-depraved eyes, snarly mouth)

by Anonymousreply 35506/29/2013

[quote]Don't recall Peggy ever being really in love before Ted.

Are you watching the same show?

by Anonymousreply 35606/29/2013

[quote]Are you watching the same show?

Yes. And Duck and Abe were people she settled for. That was blatantly clear.

by Anonymousreply 35706/29/2013

I'm glad I don't know R357 in real life.

by Anonymousreply 35806/29/2013

[quote]sleep-depraved eyes

Oh dear...

by Anonymousreply 35906/29/2013

I wonder what happened to those hot grifters Don hung out with in LA a few seasons ago. Especially that silver haired fox.

by Anonymousreply 36006/29/2013

Did Peggy ever love Pete?

by Anonymousreply 36106/29/2013

[quote]She's not that bad looking on Mad Men.


by Anonymousreply 36206/29/2013

Geez, why are you bitches still obsessed with Sal? HE AIN'T COMING BACK!!!!!

by Anonymousreply 36306/29/2013

[quote]I'm glad I don't know [R357] in real life.

I agree. I just trolldar'd him, and he's a know-it-all twat.

by Anonymousreply 36406/29/2013

R357 is a dick.

by Anonymousreply 36506/29/2013

Still waiting for Carla to return with an Angela Davis fro and a blowtorch.

by Anonymousreply 36607/02/2013

Rewatched the finale for the 2nd time and for the third time found myself in tears at the end. Damn you Mary Weiner and your use of Both Sides Now!

by Anonymousreply 36707/02/2013

I think I've figured out who exactly Bob Benson is!


(wait for it...)

"J. Pierpont Finch"!

(anyone who says, "who?" - die, screaming!

by Anonymousreply 36808/06/2013
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