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Prayer is a fuckin' waste of breath.

Discuss.

by Anonymousreply 10205/15/2013

True. Religion is for 'tards.

by Anonymousreply 105/02/2013

Not necessarily, it's a form of meditation. The fools that believe somebody is actually listening, put too much emphasis on it though.

by Anonymousreply 205/02/2013

How do prayerful people console themselves when their prayers are not seemingly answered?

by Anonymousreply 305/02/2013

Scary shit, r4, but benevolent none the less.

by Anonymousreply 505/02/2013

I pray all the time. It's very helpful.

by Anonymousreply 605/02/2013

Helpful in what way?

by Anonymousreply 705/02/2013

OP, those were my exact words when I was recording Like A Prayer.

by Anonymousreply 805/02/2013

so don't pray.

You are so daring and so bold!

by Anonymousreply 905/02/2013

I don't understand the purpose of meditation, at least the kind where you 'empty your mind of everything'. The only sensible meditation is a substantive rumination on some aspect of the universe.

by Anonymousreply 1005/02/2013

Say it soft and it's almost like praying

Maria,

I'll never stop saying

Maria

Maria, Maria,

Maria, Maria, Maria, Maria, Maria, Maria, Maria

by Anonymousreply 1105/02/2013

As best I can tell, "prayer" is little more than the grown up version of making a list for Santa Claus. Prayer seems to consist almost entirely of people asking their powerful friend in the sky for specific outcomes, even though they also believe: God already has our best interests at heart; that he knows everything; and that he knows (indeed, controls) all future outcomes. It makes absolutely no sense to ask him for anything. It makes zero sense since there is zero probability of changing any outcome.

It's not even a question of whether a heathen like me "believes" or not... it's so internally inconsistent as to be dismissed as patently absurd.

P.S. At least in the Santa Claus, some portion of lucky children in this world actually see a direct outcome from their requests.

by Anonymousreply 1205/02/2013

As a framework within which to pause for a moment and reflect on something or take a quiet breath - "prayer" is fine. It may even be useful.

As an effective method of communicating with whatever God someone believes in, umm... no.

by Anonymousreply 1305/02/2013

A teaching hospital was given a large grant to study the effectiveness of prayer in healing outcomes of surgery patients. There were 3 groups:

Group 1 received prayers and knew about it

Group 2 received prayers and did not know about it.

Group 3 received no prayers and did not know about it.

Group 1 suffered the most complications and reported the worst outcomes of all 3 groups. The hypothesis for this was the immense pressure to "get well" because of all the people praying for them and to prove the efficacy if prayer actually caused more stress.

The group with the best outcomes was group 1, the control group whom received no prayers and no knowledge of the experiment.

And yes, the researchers were laughed out of town for this one.

by Anonymousreply 1405/02/2013

[quote] Discuss

No

by Anonymousreply 1505/02/2013

So when prayerful persons pray that their side wins in a war, what happens to their faith when their prayers are unanswered, and instead devastation and ruin ensue, loss of hearth and home, along with disease, pestilence, and death?

Do they think they didn't pray hard enough?

Or that the other side prayed harder and longer?

Or perhaps that their god's plan is for them to die?

What do they think?

by Anonymousreply 1605/02/2013

R18, "identifie" is pretty good from the same post.

by Anonymousreply 1905/02/2013

How do I do the thing to make the QUOTE section correct? I forgot how to do it.

by Anonymousreply 2005/02/2013

type [quote]then type what you want to quote.

Then skip a space.

Don't type the end-quote thing, or you'll screw it up.

by Anonymousreply 2105/02/2013

I like chanting mantras. Makes me feel good. Its not for everyone but as long as I feel good doing it, I'll continue. No harm, no foul.

by Anonymousreply 2205/02/2013

Re: R21, it didn't show you the thing you need to type, which is this, but remove the space:

[ quote]

by Anonymousreply 2305/02/2013

Those who spend time in prayer are focusing on a very positive outcome but are used to being satisfied with less, as "It's God's Will." Prayer does help those that are facing a crises, or are just taking a test, and feel helpless. Supposedly it calms the mind. Don't forget that many feel better physically and mentally after taking a placebo.

by Anonymousreply 2405/02/2013

[ quote] Then skip a space.

by Anonymousreply 2505/02/2013

Also, don't type what you want to quote. Do a copy/paste (I highlight what I want to quote and then I do cntrl C and cntrl V).

by Anonymousreply 2605/02/2013

Amen!!

by Anonymousreply 2705/02/2013

[ quote] didn't show you the thing you need to type

by Anonymousreply 2805/02/2013

The quote instructions are not right and will only confuse you.

Highlight what you want to quote, then do cntrl C.

Go to Post A Reply, then type [quote ], but without any spaces, not before or within the brackets and not after. Hit cntrlV and your quote will be entered. Be sure to hit enter after the quoted material so you have a new paragraph that's not part of the quote when you type your response.

by Anonymousreply 2905/02/2013

I don't care whether you pray.

You shouldn't care whether I pray.

Any other questions?

by Anonymousreply 3005/02/2013

I like reading about the many forms of prayer take. I talk a lot--to myself and aloud--to people who are gone, usually my best friend from my 20s and my mother and usually when I'm cooking as I'm most relaxed then. Nothing to do with god as I'm not religious, but I tell them how much important they were/are to me, how much I love them and miss them and how I've been moving on. I would sound crazy to anyone listening but it makes me feel connected to them.

by Anonymousreply 3105/02/2013

just pray silently and wear you defective brain out. No one really cares or believes either.

by Anonymousreply 3205/02/2013

[quote]just pray silently and wear you defective brain out

It's actually the opposite. Prayer improves cognitive function.

That said, lots of things improve cognitive function.

Prayer is just one of them.

Frankly, you should just stick with one and work on "you defective brain."

by Anonymousreply 3305/02/2013

Not really a problem unless you have shortness of breath.

by Anonymousreply 3405/02/2013

Obese people often do, R34. The religious/obese should think twice before rupturing their girdles.

by Anonymousreply 3505/02/2013

Praying for anything outside your own mind is a waste of breath.

Praying for inner peace is just meditation and it actually has real value.

Anyone who prays for things, prays for other people to get healthy, etc., are just wasting their time. Prayer is an internal thing.

by Anonymousreply 3605/02/2013

Why do HEATHENS like the poor, dreadful OP always start threads like these? If you don't pray, that's fine. Do YOU.

by Anonymousreply 3705/02/2013

R36 has it. Most folks want to use prayer like some kind of cosmic cash machine.

For me it's a discipline to calm down, listen to my body and align my thoughts with a higher wisdom.

by Anonymousreply 3805/02/2013

Praying to God is for the "Easily led into magical thinking" crowd. Personally, I think God-needers have different brains. I have a religious friend who has the most faulty decision making ability. He says "facts don't matter, people just believe or they don't", which frankly, I find chilling.

by Anonymousreply 4005/03/2013

If god is all powerful, all knowing and most of all a jealous god, why would a speck of sand in the beaches of the Earth feel he would change his mind once decided? If he allows you to be hit by a bus, why would he mercifully allow you to live a normal life due to requests by one or many?

Prayer is for the praying. It makes THEM feel better. Just like funerals.

by Anonymousreply 4105/03/2013

People who are religious and pray disgust me.

by Anonymousreply 4205/03/2013

If you think praying is a waste of breath, imagine what a waste discussing it is.

by Anonymousreply 4305/03/2013

Praying has little to do with religion? That's rich! They falsely claim they invented marriage, but now they want us to believe prayer is something ATHEISTS do! What a bizarro little world they live in.

by Anonymousreply 4505/03/2013

Bingo, R40. Exactly.

by Anonymousreply 4705/03/2013

Prayer and meditation are not the same thing. Prayer is communication which means an object, which implies someone is listening.

by Anonymousreply 4805/03/2013

That's your definition R48. Prayer does not mean you are necessarily speaking to someone or even something.

by Anonymousreply 4905/03/2013

[quote]Prayer is communication which means an object, which implies someone is listening.

That is the common misconception, which is why so many people think "prayer" is what it is not, and why they're doing it wrong.

by Anonymousreply 5005/03/2013

R14, so Group 1 received the worst and best outcomes? Please don't post when you're drunk.

by Anonymousreply 5105/03/2013

Drunks don't pray until they get sober, R51.

by Anonymousreply 5205/03/2013

Sorry, I meant group 3 for the best outcomes.

by Anonymousreply 5405/03/2013

The party line is that God ALWAYS answers prayers. Either yes, no or wait. The theology of it (disregarding Jesus actually saying ask and it shall be given to you) is essentially a)God knows better than you what you need or b)you don't have faith the size of a mustard seed (which is all it takes to cast mountains into the sea).

Even when I was a believer, it always sounded like someone was making excuses for God.

by Anonymousreply 5605/03/2013

Good Catholics know that you pray to God for understanding, acceptance, strength to help you understand things. It's the saints that can intercede to perhaps put in a good word for you. Saints are like the lobbyists and special interest groups of heaven.

God isn't sitting up there as a director of a play, smiting here and there, and throwing in some miracles for drama. The universe will unfold as it is supposed to. Humans are just supposed to get through it by being kind to each other and being the best person they can be - that's our role here on earth, but not many people live that way.

by Anonymousreply 5705/03/2013

"Prayer is just a passive-aggressive way a letting the Lord know you think He's just a little bit lazy."

-- Mrs. Betty Bowers, America's Best Christian

"Prayer is letting the Lord know His Divine Plan for you is flawed -- and shockingly stingy!"

-- Mrs. Betty Bowers, America's Best Christian

by Anonymousreply 5805/03/2013

I love Mrs. Betty Bowers.

by Anonymousreply 5905/03/2013

Sure, R39. There is always higher wisdom-- always something more to learn about myself, others, relationships, career, life events...prayer is a great tool that helps me uncover imbalance, plot direction and prepare for upcoming challenges. Again, internal, not external.

by Anonymousreply 6005/03/2013

I believe the true function of prayer is a dialogue with your own subconscious - when you ask 'God' for help, you are asking yourself - the deepest part of you, to give you the wisdom to make the appropriate choice that faces you. In times of crisis, we can get very frantic and puzzled - hence prayer to get us in touch with our vital reasoning.

by Anonymousreply 6105/03/2013

There sure are a lot of inexperienced, dull, near-illiterate posters here - and from their smug, self-assured Mommy-takes-care-of-everything tone, what they say about the high school system is true. Not that the premise is a problem but you're just so stupid about it.

Got that, OP and R1? Or do the hyphens and four-syllable words confuse you?

by Anonymousreply 6205/03/2013

Link please [r14] ? I think you may have the facts of the outcome of the study a bit wrong.

by Anonymousreply 6305/03/2013

R63, there's just an obvious typo in R14... the second reference to group 1 should obviously be group 3.

by Anonymousreply 6405/03/2013

R14 here, linkie-poo

by Anonymousreply 6505/03/2013

I'm having a delicious cup of Sanka decaf right now, bitches.

by Anonymousreply 6605/03/2013

Somebody call the waaaaa-mbulance for R62.

by Anonymousreply 6705/04/2013

R62, it's time for your high colonic.

by Anonymousreply 6805/04/2013

Some people believe that God is a malicious psychopath. I think that is sur-religious!

Please, have some respect for The Deity - even if He is a weirdo created in man's own image.

And He DOES ANSWER PRAYERS! Hallelujah!!!

by Anonymousreply 6905/04/2013

The Sanka troll at R4/16/18/20/25/66/68 will be happy to know that by the prayerful intercession of hundreds of thousands of dead LDS ancestors, Postum is back in production.

by Anonymousreply 7005/04/2013

Prayer may be quick comfort for a short period, but when you pray for weeks, months, or years about something and STILL get no help, it becomes almost self-destructing and hurtful. You're pleading and begging all this time and it's like "god" is sadistically enjoying your pain.

This was exactly one of the reasons I quit believing, among other things.

by Anonymousreply 7105/04/2013

You'll all be straight in five minutes

by Anonymousreply 7205/04/2013

Well, at least we know WHO is going to Hell now.

by Anonymousreply 7305/04/2013

Not if it brings a person comfort it isn't. Prayer can be a form of therapy and meditation.

by Anonymousreply 7405/04/2013

Prayer is very personal and powerful. Not all prayer is about asking for something.

by Anonymousreply 7505/04/2013

r61 gets the prize.

by Anonymousreply 7605/04/2013

We have prayer time where I work and if one is an atheist, the time can be used as the atheist see fit or added to yearly vacation time. Figure it out for yourself, 10 minutes a day for 220 work days. Love those prayers.

by Anonymousreply 7705/06/2013

Do you work at Chik-fil-a R77?

by Anonymousreply 7805/06/2013

No r77, I work for Rosary Bead conglomerate.

by Anonymousreply 7905/06/2013

[quote]You're pleading and begging all this time and it's like "god" is sadistically enjoying your pain. This was exactly one of the reasons I quit believing, among other things.

Same here.

My dad was an abusive alcoholic who used to regularly beat the shit out of my mom, my brothers, myself, and even our small dog.

My Roman Catholic grandmother told me I should pray to make it better.

So I prayed and prayed and prayed, every day from ages 4-6, and -- big surprise -- nothing changed! The asshole still beat the shit out of all of us; in fact, he got worse as we got older.

After that, I realised that either A) "God" doesn't exist, or B) God is an evil fucking psychopath who enjoys our pain. Either way, why the hell would I worship and pray to such a being?

by Anonymousreply 8005/06/2013

And $18 is a fuckin' waste of money.

Oh the irony!

by Anonymousreply 8105/06/2013

Joel Osteen @ R82 I love your advice and megachurch and of course, your lovely wife, victoria,

by Anonymousreply 8305/06/2013

Perhaps you are correct, R82, but if so, what is the fucking point of being God and directing your children to "pray without ceasing"? Spiritual growth? Whatever.

by Anonymousreply 8405/07/2013

Yes.

by Anonymousreply 8505/07/2013

Spiritual growth is the excuse for a beaten CHILD, R85? Then FUCK THAT.

by Anonymousreply 8605/07/2013

It's always distressing when on an ostensibly progressive forum there is so much defense of the indefensible.

There is no God. None. There is no being out there that is doing anything for us, to us, with us, or even against us. That is so plainly obvious that I can only conclude that people who 'defend' belief in God are either: a) stupid; b) ignorant; c) willfully ignorant (they don't want to admit what they know); d) internal-external discordant-- ie. the overwhelming cultural bias toward professing faith masks the person's true beliefs aknowledged only to himself; e) trolling; f) maintain a vested interest in widespread belief in God (ie church figures).

Still, if there is difficulty in educated, progressive, 'liberal' people in reaching this conclusion (or admitting they've reached it), it is clear that the masses will be fooled in perpetuity. And that is depressing.

by Anonymousreply 8705/07/2013

R87, if there is no God then why do you spend so much time thinking about...something that does not exist...?

by Anonymousreply 8805/07/2013

Alas, r88, if there was a God, he... I mean 'He' would make sure people were able to craft logical arguments.

by Anonymousreply 8905/08/2013

God is the great lie perpetuated by mankind in order to line the pockets and control the minds. It's all a great big hoax.

by Anonymousreply 9005/08/2013

God is a coping skill. Nothing more, but nothing less.

I think it's better to let those that need it have it (unless of course they infringe upon others).

by Anonymousreply 9105/08/2013

R82 - I'll tell you who atheists turn to. Friends, loved ones and even therapists or counselors when we lose our way. And doctors when we're sick.

[quote]Have an open mind. The one option that can heal you has been made unavailable to you by you. Do you have other self-destructive characteristics?

Way to prove you have that open mind. Are there more in your congregation like you?

by Anonymousreply 9205/08/2013

R89, you are obviously very clever, and your ability to put down others comes in quite handy. However, you did not answer my question: if God is not real, why do you waste so much time arguing about ...nothing?

R92, good answer. I was genuinely curious. Since you don't believe in prayer, how about meditation? What do you do to cultivate inner peace?

How did I demonstrate a closed mind? I have nothing against atheism. I just don't know how to counsel them when they come to me for advice. Apparently I do ok by them because they seek my help more than Believers.

by Anonymousreply 9305/10/2013

Pray is a form of meditation, it's not a fuckin' waste of breath.

by Anonymousreply 9405/10/2013

I guess we know who is going to Hell.

by Anonymousreply 9505/11/2013

I also participated in a prayer study which measured psychological well-being.

To be succinct, everyone in the prayer study increased their well-being somewhat (say 10%).

The only group that dramatically increased their well-being was the people who were doing the praying.

by Anonymousreply 9605/11/2013

[quote]f God is not real, why do you waste so much time arguing about ...nothing?

Dumb. We're all surrounded by people who believe this bullshit, who talk about it all the time, and who want to pass laws, if not start wars, kill others, etc based on their belief in invisible sky-friends. OF COURSE, those of us who don't believe are going to talk about it. Deal.

and people in Ancient Egypt spent a lot of time thinking about Ra. It didn't make Ra real.

by Anonymousreply 9705/11/2013

[quote]Apparently I do ok by them because they seek my help more than Believers.

LOL. Yes, we can only imagine the small army of atheists flocking to your door for 'help'. Do you have any other delusions you should seek psychiatric counseling for?

by Anonymousreply 9905/13/2013

R96 you can not objectively measure psychological well-being. There is enormous peer pressure in religious communities for people to say they are happy. It doesn't make it true. People lie. Especially religious people.

by Anonymousreply 10005/13/2013

I know, right, r99? They don't ask for spiritual advice, but one Unitarian wants me to read his emails and even edit them because he's gotten in trouble for having a hostile tone. An open atheist asked me for advice on how to deal with his mentally ill nephew. I wrote up a quick document with everything he needed to know and do. He frequently - and quite auddenly - keeps me updated. And then acts like nothing happened.

R100 = classic projection.

by Anonymousreply 10105/14/2013

R100 tells the truth.

R99 and R101 live in a fantasy world.

by Anonymousreply 10205/15/2013
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