What is all this bullshit about this being a rape culture in the wake of the Steubenville trial? I realize the networks' reaction to the athletes ("Their promising careers are now ruined!") was pretty obnoxious and hugely insensitive to the victim's suffering, but still, the phrase "rape culture" implies every woman gets raped in this culture--that is FAR from true. I think this is more hysterical p.c. bullshit.
|by Anonymous||reply 175||03/23/2013|
Media manipulation for ratings.
|by Anonymous||reply 1||03/18/2013|
That's not what it implies at all you fucking moron. Jesus, are you really that dense?
It's about the culture of protecting the rapists... the general "automatic" belief that the victim "asked for it" or "deserved it", or the automatic assumption that she's lying.
It's an artifact of Patriarchy.
|by Anonymous||reply 2||03/18/2013|
You are right R1.
|by Anonymous||reply 3||03/18/2013|
No, R1 isn't right. It's a legitimate thing. Your ignorance doesn't change reality.
|by Anonymous||reply 4||03/18/2013|
OP it's like if you (if you are a male) were raped and you went to report it to the police and they laughed at you and said it was not possible.
|by Anonymous||reply 5||03/18/2013|
Except OP would probably deserve it, R5, because he's such an idiot.
|by Anonymous||reply 6||03/18/2013|
R1 is correct and the reason I'd never watch network news.
|by Anonymous||reply 7||03/18/2013|
Why is it called rape culture and not rape cover up culture or shaming the rape victim culture?
|by Anonymous||reply 8||03/18/2013|
It means a culture in which the people are so desensitized to rape that it is no longer shocking and considered a somewhat normal act if not a permissible one.
I think we're in danger of heading down this road. We're becoming a culture in which extreme violence is considered unfortunate but inevitable.
|by Anonymous||reply 9||03/18/2013|
Damn, there are some serious fuckwits on this thread.
We have a "rape culture" because the mainstream media and general public still sides with the man and not the woman in most cases.
Two men raped this girl in Steubenville - two CONSCIOUS men who were aware of their decisions - and CNN spent all fucking weekend talking about what a "loss" it was that these men would lose their futures.
AND NOT A FUCKING THING ABOUT THE VICTIM.
That's broken, toxic shit.
|by Anonymous||reply 10||03/18/2013|
The fact that witnesses filmed it and laughed about it...
|by Anonymous||reply 11||03/18/2013|
[quote]It's about the culture of protecting the rapists... the general "automatic" belief that the victim "asked for it" or "deserved it", or the automatic assumption that she's lying.
How about the assumption that rape is something that happens only to women.
[quote]OP it's like if you (if you are a male) were raped and you went to report it to the police and they laughed at you and said it was not possible.
It was rape crisis that told me that it was not possible for a man to be raped when I called them. Try not to be ignorant when you're trying to post righteous.
|by Anonymous||reply 12||03/18/2013|
R10 But they were promising ATHLETES@!11!1!!
|by Anonymous||reply 13||03/18/2013|
r2 Is correct. Rape culture doesn't mean all women are raped. It means we live in a culture that protects rapist and trivializes rape. There is a rape culture in the catholic church for example. And there is a rape culture on college and high school sports. There is so much reverence and deference for sports and athletes in this country it is disgusting.
|by Anonymous||reply 14||03/18/2013|
"I think this is more hysterical p.c. bullshit."
Are you Sarah Palin? She likes to complain about "political correctness" a lot.
"It was rape crisis that told me that it was not possible for a man to be raped when I called them"
Oh, please, I used to work at a rape crisis center and no one there would ever say anything like that. Did you use this same line on all the men's rights activist boards where you post?
|by Anonymous||reply 15||03/18/2013|
Don't forget the US military, R14. Rape/sexual assault is a serious problem in our military outposts.
|by Anonymous||reply 17||03/18/2013|
Like similar postings on the other Steubenville thread, with the way our culture has become so sexualized proven by the younger ages at which most teens are screwing around, I have a difficult time understanding how some brief digital penetration could be considered as traumatizing as actual rape rape.
|by Anonymous||reply 18||03/18/2013|
R16, you need help.
|by Anonymous||reply 19||03/18/2013|
R15? Don't be full of shit. You're certainly right about the place you worked. But you haven't worked everywhere. You're committing the fallacy of assuming based on personal experience, extrapolating that to "everyone's experience".
I think you'd be shocked at the number of people, EVEN TODAY, that would insist that men can't be raped. Let alone something like 20 or 30 years ago.
|by Anonymous||reply 20||03/18/2013|
r12 You are brining in straw men into the conversation. No one implied that men get a fair shake when it comes to being raped. The term rape culture is not gender specific. As we see with the catholic church, most of the victims are boys, and they too are victims of the "rape culture."
With the Penn State/Sandusky horror story, all of the victims were young men or boys and they too are victims of the rape culture.
There is too much deference to sports and athletes when they engage in rape and sex abuse.
Why is it that we can't discuss women issues without someone jumping in and saying "well men have issues too."
|by Anonymous||reply 21||03/18/2013|
A quick google check of the term was too much work for you, OP?
|by Anonymous||reply 22||03/18/2013|
Had the two boys knocked the woman unconscious with a bottle and brutally raped her in the bushes, there would be no talk about the boys' promising futures. The fact is, this girl drank herself into oblivion at a party and passed out. That doesn't imply consent, but neither does it make the girl a victim who inspires empathy from the public.
The reason people seem to pity the boys is that the judgment was too harsh for 15-16 yr olds. To be branded a sex offender for life is absurd. Many teenagers get involved in dangerous things without realizing the consequences of their actions. Just as bad as the boys are all the kids who spread the videos and photos. They are guilty as well and ought to be punished.
|by Anonymous||reply 23||03/18/2013|
R16 sounds like a rich white Christian male bitching about being oppressed, more so than any minority, women, gay person, or non-Christian...
(rolling eyes at this clueless idiot's obliviously ignorant sense of privilege)
|by Anonymous||reply 24||03/18/2013|
r15 You are right. He sounds like an MRA.
|by Anonymous||reply 25||03/18/2013|
"How about the assumption that rape is something that happens only to women."
No one said that. But male victims usually aren't accused of being "sluts" or dressing too sexy.
The Jerry Sandusky victims were treated like innocent widdle babies but an 11-year-old girl who was gang-raped in Texas was accused of being a slut who dressed too sexy. People call Jerry Sandusky a monster but constantly defend men who rape women and girls like Roman Polanski and these dirt bags. Just heterosexual men defending "their own"
|by Anonymous||reply 26||03/18/2013|
"That doesn't imply consent, but neither does it make the girl a victim who inspires empathy from the public."
The fact that she was drinking does not mean she wasn't a victim of rape.
"The reason people seem to pity the boys is that the judgment was too harsh for 15-16 yr olds."
15 is old enough to be a rapist.
"Had the two boys knocked the woman unconscious with a bottle and brutally raped her in the bushes, there would be no talk about the boys' promising futures"
So the only rape victims who deserve sympathy are the ones who are knocked unconscious? Okay, let's not feel any sympathy for Jerry Sandusky's victims since he didn't knock them out and they willingly returned to his basement over and over again. Oh, wait, I forgot, they are male so they get a free pass.
|by Anonymous||reply 27||03/18/2013|
[quote]Are you Sarah Palin? She likes to complain about "political correctness" a lot.
Only Sarah Palin complains about tit? And if you complain about it, you are necessarily Sarah Palin?
|by Anonymous||reply 28||03/18/2013|
[quote] The fact is, this girl drank herself into oblivion at a party and passed out.
That, and the date-rape drugs they fed her.
|by Anonymous||reply 29||03/18/2013|
[quote]Had the two boys knocked the woman unconscious with a bottle and brutally raped her in the bushes, there would be no talk about the boys' promising futures. The fact is, this girl drank herself into oblivion at a party and passed out. That doesn't imply consent, but neither does it make the girl a victim who inspires empathy from the public.
Ah, of course. If a girl passes out at a party it's perfectly fine for boys to start sticking their fingers in her vagina. That is rape and YES THAT MAKES HER A VICTIM. Stupid, vile piece of shit, R23.
And the boys were treated as minors. They will probably spend a 1 or 2 in juvie. If they were tried as adults they would have faced 20 years in prison. They got off easy.
|by Anonymous||reply 30||03/18/2013|
"Just heterosexual men defending "their own"
That doesn't really shock me but when gay men jump on that bandwagon .... ugh, fucked up.
|by Anonymous||reply 31||03/18/2013|
Men receive abuse? Hahahahahahahaha.
Apparently, this entire analogy is over your heads, boys. I know my comments here are just an invitation for you to vehemently argue your treasured most-oppressed-minority status, but HEAR THIS!!
Women have been literally fucked over by men for thousands of years. A woman in this country gets 78 cents for every dollar a man makes, doing the same job. Only 18% of the Congress is female. And on and on.
OTOH, I could list a myriad of ways that women continue to be oppressed by men, and you'll still be whining and pouting and crying about how oppressed you poor babies are (I call that vagina envy)... Personally, I have never seen a white man, gay OR straight, who was oppressed as much as any woman in this culture.
|by Anonymous||reply 32||03/18/2013|
R24, Trying to insult me won't change facts. Always dissing the gay man. Stop the hypocritical shit you cunt. And don't dish out what you can't take.
|by Anonymous||reply 33||03/18/2013|
R31, they're the same gay men who pretend all male homophobes are closeted gays, because of course, all straight men love gay men and heterosexual male homophobia is a myth.
|by Anonymous||reply 34||03/18/2013|
r29, there was no date rape drug. The girl drank until she passed out.
r30, nobody says she wasn't a victim. But don't let that stop you from hurling vile insults to make yourself feel superior.
|by Anonymous||reply 35||03/18/2013|
R33, I *am* a gay man. I'm not "dissin' the gay man". I'm calling YOU out for your egregious cluelessness.
|by Anonymous||reply 36||03/18/2013|
R23/R35 YOU specifically state the girl is not a victim who deserves empathy.
So because she drank too much, passed out, what - she deserved to be raped?
You are a toxic waste. And I don't say that to make myself feel superior. Your views are disgusting and repugnant.
|by Anonymous||reply 37||03/18/2013|
r26 Perfect response.
|by Anonymous||reply 38||03/18/2013|
"Women are ridiculously hypocritical. So you cunts can shove it."
Men like you are ridiculously hypocritical. You dicks can shove it. Stupid redneck conservative men like you like to bash feminists for playing the victim but you redneck morons act like straight white men are always the victims in society. You sound like a Rush Limbaugh fan.
What are you even doing on a gay board, you conservative dirtbag? Go back to your men's rights board with all the other conservative, angry white men who blame all their problems on gays and feminists.
"But don't let that stop you from hurling vile insults to make yourself feel superior."
You're the one hurling insults now, dear. Accusing others of acting superior!
|by Anonymous||reply 39||03/18/2013|
r37, you need to go back to grammar school because you cannot read. And furthermore, you are an idiot. Period.
|by Anonymous||reply 40||03/18/2013|
Sure R33. Sure
|by Anonymous||reply 41||03/18/2013|
[quote][bold]"That doesn't imply consent, but neither does it make the girl a victim who inspires empathy from the public.[/bold]
[quote][bold]"The reason people seem to pity the boys is that the judgment was too harsh for 15-16 yr olds."[/bold]
Just repeating what you posted, you fucking asshole.
|by Anonymous||reply 42||03/18/2013|
R15, I have never even looked at a men's rights board. You seem to have made your own assumptions and generalisations, so it's probably for the best that you don't work at a rape crisis center any more. It took me a long time, a very long time, but I worked through the damage myself. I have never felt as alone as when the one place I hoped I would get support acted like it was some delusion and an impossibility. I hoped that they would suggest somewhere I could get help as a man that had been raped. At the time there was nothing I could find. I left my partner. It didn't matter as he turned our friends against me after I challenged him. I don't think he even remembered as he was drunk on whisky at the time. I slept on the streets for a while. Anything was better than being anywhere near him. This was many years ago, and although I don't care to go back to what he did, I am a long way from the damage it caused me for many years after. really R15, you don't sound that dissimilar from some guy saying that the woman made it up. You worked in one rape crisis center and implicitly trust all your colleagues not so have said such a thing? It was in the 90's in London when I called. I range and asked if there was anywhere I could go for support as a gay man that had been raped by his partner. What I posted was what was said to me.
|by Anonymous||reply 43||03/18/2013|
Someone slipped something into her drink. Please ban R23 vile pathetic peice of shit!
|by Anonymous||reply 44||03/18/2013|
It's a culture of seeing women not as living, breathing human beings with hopes & dreams, heart & soul, angst and joy...
But instead seeing them as fck dolls...cumm dumpsters...
And want to reenact porn scenes with/on them.
It's a culture of miss USA pageants and a billion dollar porn industry.
A friend has two daughters. When they were young, they were into American Girl dolls. They googled American Girl once when their folks weren't home. They got tons of porn sites. I'm sure the seth McFarland types find that hilarious. But I find it sad. Google anything female and you'll get tons of porn results.
Kids grow up with hard core anything goes sex in ther homes. For all they know, not only is it realistic, it's how sex should be.
|by Anonymous||reply 45||03/18/2013|
R23 What was she wearing?
|by Anonymous||reply 46||03/18/2013|
To portray these guys as the victims in any way shape or form is no better than the piece of trash lawyer who PAID an "expert" witness to testify that she was fully aware of what was happening even though she was so drunk she blacked out.
At the same time, Im very familiar with rural small town life...its very common for the community to stick togeyher because they all know each other...and its not uncommon for the drinking, parties and sex at very young ages to be overlooked and in alot of cases applauded. Where i grew up ( a small town in central Ohio), everybody slept with everyones bf/gf, gf would sleep with their bf fathers, etc...This was nothing more than a typical game to these people and I for one am glad the state intervened to prosecute these self important punks otherwise it would have been swept under the rug and forgotten...seriously.
|by Anonymous||reply 47||03/18/2013|
Thank you, Anonymous, for making the situation public so justice could be served.
|by Anonymous||reply 48||03/18/2013|
Urban Dictionary has a pretty good definition of "rape culture":
Shaming victims of rape, making women feel bad for having consensual sex, making fun and trivializing rape and not embracing sex positivity so the unfortunate victims of rape who want to put their rapist behind bars will have fear that they will be blamed.
1. Blaming a female for dressing like a "slut" instead of the rapists is an example of rape culture.
2. Teaching women how not to get raped instead of teaching, mostly men, don't rape is an example of rape culture.
3. Blaming the victim and not the rapist is an example of rape culture.
4. Telling rape jokes such as "This is my rape face" is an example of rape culture.
5. Denying rape culture exists.
|by Anonymous||reply 49||03/18/2013|
|by Anonymous||reply 50||03/18/2013|
I'm curious about this: would the punishment have been just as harsh if they had done that awful thing where someone draws all over someone's body and face when they're passed out? When I was in school this happened to someone and I thought it was horrible. He was covered in permanent marker, all over his face, chest and arms. But no one was sent to jail. At what point does it turn into an incarcerating crime? Is it because this involved her vagina? I'm curious if anyone knows when this crosses over into something more serious.
|by Anonymous||reply 51||03/18/2013|
R51 why don't you get raped and find out?
|by Anonymous||reply 52||03/18/2013|
Shit I knew someone was going to be an asshole and take my post the wrong way. I think what they did to her was horrible. Unacceptable. R52 calm down and quit being an hysterical reactionary.
I'm curious if there is going to be a rash of criminal cases at universities now involving the stuff people do to people when they pass out. When I was at school a girl drew on a guy's penis (again with a marker) when he was passed out and I remember she was reprimanded and it was in the school paper police blog, but she wasn't sent to jail.
|by Anonymous||reply 53||03/18/2013|
53....there a HUGE difference between someone drawing on you and being VIOLATED. Im sure if he woke up to find pictures on the internet of her shoving a baseball bat up his ass it would have been a different story
|by Anonymous||reply 54||03/18/2013|
R51?: You're an utter tool.
|by Anonymous||reply 55||03/18/2013|
True, I see the distinction of that, r54. I'm just curious, legally, when one thing becomes the other
|by Anonymous||reply 56||03/18/2013|
why am I a fool? I'm asking questions with nothing but support for this girl. Damn some of you just flame at anyone with a question. I'm on your side, I'm on this girl's side. I'm just trying to understand the technicalities of this without becoming hysterical like some of you.
|by Anonymous||reply 57||03/18/2013|
Despite all the concern, rape is never going to go away. Frat boys and athletes will continue to date rape, teachers (male and female) will continue to fuck their students, bad guys will still continue to break into houses and rape, steal, and rob. Mothers and fathers will continue to beat, abuse, and kill their own children. There will always be deviants who cross the line and take whatever they want. We can discuss "rape culture" until we're blue in the face and it won't go away.
And it's not a "mens' problem" it's a people problem. Women are just as responsible for raising the kids who grow up to do this kind of shit as men. The myth of nuturing, cooperative women is just that. Almost all the women I know spend the vast majority of their time verbally attacking and deriding other women. The best we can do is continue to tackle it case by case and educate our kids about staying safe and avoiding situations that may get them into trouble of both sides.
Just my humble opinion.
|by Anonymous||reply 58||03/18/2013|
I think there is plenty of outrage about this incident to dispel the assumption that we live in a rape culture.
|by Anonymous||reply 59||03/18/2013|
Post by r23 is vomit-inducing on many points.
And I have no qualms about them being branded as sex offenders. They humiliated, raped and urinated on her for kicks and were so proud of it they even shared it via social media. This is not an oopsie, but intentional sociopathic behavior. A normal boy doesn't do that. If these two lived anywhere near me and made friends with anyone young I know, or got a job that's related to girls/women (ie girl's gym coach) I would want them to know who they are dealing with.
|by Anonymous||reply 60||03/18/2013|
I was raped by my doctor. As A Jewish girl it was a bittersweet experience.
|by Anonymous||reply 61||03/18/2013|
She probably consented. You know, sometimes no means yes.
|by Anonymous||reply 62||03/18/2013|
R57 You really don't see the difference? When I suggested you get raped you immediately thought I took your example the wrong way.
Perhaps you can explain to me what the right way would have been? Or why you see your example as the same thing or no different from one another?
|by Anonymous||reply 63||03/18/2013|
Goddamn r63 I bet people just avoid you in life don't they? You suggest I get raped over a question? You're an asshole. Fuck you.
|by Anonymous||reply 64||03/18/2013|
I think the term "rape culture" stems more from those Republican idiots' incredible statements last fall moreso than to this small town tragedy which, hopefully, will educate law and sports authorities, teens and their parents on their responsibilities not only to their communities, charges, families and friends, but to society and civilization at large.
|by Anonymous||reply 65||03/18/2013|
That sounds nice, r58 but women's actions have very little to do with how these men turn out. It's their fathers and their views on women and the way they treat them that are responsible for that. They learn how to become men through emulating the father figures in their lives. Whether they are absent or abusive. I just wish for once men could take the responsibility for their own mistakes instead of trying to lay it on women. And as for women verbally attacking other women, those are just people who are internalizing what they picked up from a society shaped by masculine values.
|by Anonymous||reply 66||03/18/2013|
CNN: "But surely there must be some exceptions for rape when the perpetrators are football players with bright futures, right?"
|by Anonymous||reply 67||03/18/2013|
After I typed my post, I read it and thought "shit some asshole is going to take my question as some sort of backhanded opinion" which I see happening ALL the time on here because in text messages, snarkiness can be correctly or incorrectly assumed. And lo and behold, right on cue, there you are deciding to take my question as some sort of stance on this. I am fully in support of this girl. Fuck you for saying "why don't you get raped" you lonely miserable asshole.
|by Anonymous||reply 68||03/18/2013|
"Rape Culture" = GOP Congressmen trying to parse types of rape to sort them into "acceptable" rape and "unacceptable" rape.
As if there were such a thing as "Acceptable" rape?
|by Anonymous||reply 69||03/18/2013|
R64 You did not answer my question. Could you please clarify your statement.
|by Anonymous||reply 70||03/18/2013|
[quote]5. Denying rape culture exists.
That's a recursive loop. The defining feature of rape culture is to deny rape culture exists--ergo, by its very nature, a rape culture is a non-falsifiable proposition: to deny it is only to confirm it
Works exactly the same as "denial" from the Freudians.
This is why so many people hate p.c. bullshit. It's not actual ideas--it's ideological cant.
|by Anonymous||reply 71||03/18/2013|
[quote]Almost all the women I know spend the vast majority of their time verbally attacking and deriding other women.
You're a fucking retard.
|by Anonymous||reply 72||03/18/2013|
R68 then just answer my question. Why do you think your example is the same as rape. I have asked you 2 times and keep calling me names.
|by Anonymous||reply 73||03/18/2013|
The "right way" would have been to not jump to your hysterical, fucked up conclusion that I'm somehow a jerk who supports a misogynistic worldview. And to say I should be raped? Seriously FUCK YOU. You're a miserable asshole.
|by Anonymous||reply 74||03/18/2013|
CNN in 1945: "Hitler's promising career in art tragically cut short..."
|by Anonymous||reply 75||03/18/2013|
When women complain about sex abuse or rape, they always portray it in this binary of gender. It can happen to anyone regardless of class, race, or even GENDER.
Sexual abuse or rape should be considered a terrible act regardless of the genders involved. And it doesn't have to do with "rape culture," where it is only about women's minority status and a culture that is against them. Sheesh.
|by Anonymous||reply 76||03/18/2013|
[quote]...but women's actions have very little to do with how these men turn out.
Absolute bullshit. Women are just as responsible for how children of both sexes turn out as men. Otherwise you're just buying into the patriarchal myth that children need both daddies and mommies.
|by Anonymous||reply 77||03/18/2013|
I know that rape happens and is awful, but at the same time just that word alone can give someone an 'out' or an automatic reset for a bad choice. Allowing the Phi Delt pledge class to run a train on you, can all be washed away with one word.
|by Anonymous||reply 78||03/18/2013|
Ah, r75: Godwin's Law in action!
|by Anonymous||reply 79||03/18/2013|
A retard, R72? And why is that? Because I told the truth. You don't think that mommy's attitudes about other women(as well as daddy's) don't affect how kids grow up to see themselves and other people? I've had lesbian friends tell me that they don't want their son to grow up to be a "pussy". Or get "mixed up with some slut" and throw his life away.
|by Anonymous||reply 80||03/18/2013|
R74 That's some good trolling kid. I hope you had fun.
|by Anonymous||reply 81||03/18/2013|
I don't know if it's the majority of women or not, but I do agree that internalized misogyny and women treating other women badly is a big problem.
|by Anonymous||reply 82||03/18/2013|
Women do bitch about woman all the time. I get fucking sick of hearing it. Yes women wil go to men and bitch about other women all the time. I can understand hating your gender but stop bitching about it to men. Were sick of all of ya.
|by Anonymous||reply 83||03/18/2013|
Yes R80 - you're a fucking retard. Anyone who writes (and believes) this:
[quote]Almost all the women I know spend the vast majority of their time verbally attacking and deriding other women.
is a fucking retard and an OBVIOUS fucking retard at that. t
|by Anonymous||reply 84||03/18/2013|
LOL at all you thinking we hate other women. We talk even more shit about men, in case this thread hasn't shown you that. Don't forget that.
|by Anonymous||reply 85||03/18/2013|
[quote]Almost all the women I know spend the vast majority of their time verbally attacking and deriding other women.
|by Anonymous||reply 86||03/18/2013|
r64, YOU are probably someone sane people avoid in real life. No one is being hysterical. If DL were a party and you shared your thoughts out loud, we would have gazed at you with pity, shook our heads and one by one left the table, leaving you to your deep thoughts.
Your question lacks thought and insight. You say you support the raped victim, yet wonder out loud and equate her abuse to someone scrawling nonsense on a drunk's face with a sharpie. When others call you out on the inanity of the question, you feel attacked? Think about it. If you had a 16yo daughter, would you rather she came home with a "Crazy Party Animal!!" scrawled on her forehead with temporary ink, or come home in tears with her vagina bruised and bleeding, and cum stains on her face? If you are still wondering if a face vandal merits the same punishment as a rapist, then you clearly have no idea why you are supporting the Steubenville victim.
|by Anonymous||reply 87||03/18/2013|
It seems like a lot of young men and women, don't see a big problem with rape. I'm beginning to think our culture is completely fucked for the future...young people seem pretty weird. They are not all weird in the same way but they are all pretty weird.
|by Anonymous||reply 88||03/18/2013|
I've had 5 close women friends over the last 25-30 years. They are all close to the same age. They're all similar in occupation and background. I've literally spent hundreds and hundreds of hours with all of them individually bitching about the other women in their lives. I've tried to bring them together for social activities thinking that they all might find some common ground and become friends. To a woman they've all declared the others "crazy bitches" and don't want anything to do with them. 4 of the 5 are raising children as single mothers. These are professional women, teachers, nurses, and CPAs. If you think they're attitudes and behavior isn't going to affect their children, you're the crazy one.
|by Anonymous||reply 89||03/18/2013|
STFU r80. Your catty little girlfriends have nothing do with anything. Men are responsible for the crimes they commit, not women. End of story.
|by Anonymous||reply 90||03/18/2013|
Blame the mothers!
|by Anonymous||reply 91||03/18/2013|
[quote]...Your catty little girlfriends
So "rape culture" doesn't include the attitudes or behaviors of the broader misogynistic culture - it's strictly about the actions of a few men?
Doesn't that sort of negate the whole idea of "rape culture"?
|by Anonymous||reply 92||03/18/2013|
[bold]This Two-Year-Old Onion Story Perfectly Predicted CNN’s Shocking Steubenville Rape Trial Coverage[/bold]
CNN earned the ire of thousands over the weekend when it aired coverage of the Steubenville Rape trial that was shockingly sympathetic toward the rapists.
"Incredibly difficult, even for an outsider like me, to watch what happened as these two young men that had such promising futures," correspondent Poppy Harlow told anchor Candy Crowley, who then turned around and asked a legal expert to weigh in on the "lasting effect" being found guilty of rape will have on the lives of "sixteen-year-olds just sobbing in court."
Given the Onion-y nature of CNN's coverage, it may not be all that surprising to learn that The Onion did a story two years ago that shares some disturbing similarities with CNN's take.
"I was a staff writer on the Onion's show 'SportsDome' which aired on Comedy Central in 2011," writes Krister Johnson in the intro to Onion Sports Network story "Athele Overcomes Rape." "This is one of the stories we did—full credit to David Iscoe for the idea and script. It could have been produced by the CNN team covering the Steubenville rape verdict."
Who needs Onion-like stories in real life when actual Onion stories are becoming real life?
|by Anonymous||reply 93||03/18/2013|
R80, you continue to hysterically respond to things I didn't write.
I did not address or criticize your ground-breaking hypothesis: Bad Mommies Are Bad Parents.
Now then, either respond to what I actually quoted or shut the fuck up about it, retard.
|by Anonymous||reply 94||03/18/2013|
"Almost all the women I know spend the vast majority of their time verbally attacking and deriding other women."
|by Anonymous||reply 95||03/18/2013|
I did respond in R80.
I can't speak about anything beyond my own personal experience. The women I know spend a lot of time putting down other women. I don't know why that is or what leads to their seeming intolerance of other women. I do know that they are all quite competitive and spend a lot of time doing their best to out "mommy" the other women in their lives.
I don't know personally know anyone who has committed a rape other than the 2 women that molested me as a child. Likewise I don't know anyone that has been raped or molested as children other than several gay male friends.
So perhaps my point of view is skewed somewhat.
|by Anonymous||reply 96||03/18/2013|
[quote]Almost all the women I know spend the vast majority of their time verbally attacking and deriding other women
we'll make a show out of it maybe call it The View!!!!
|by Anonymous||reply 97||03/18/2013|
He took me....AND I LIKED IT!!!!
|by Anonymous||reply 98||03/18/2013|
So now, some gossip girls are responsible for men raping women. Hahahahaha, I know men hate taking responsibility for their actions, but this is ridiculous. r80, resolve your issues with women in therapy and stop taking it out on this board.
|by Anonymous||reply 99||03/18/2013|
I hope r99 gets raped.
|by Anonymous||reply 100||03/18/2013|
And, I mean, not to be a big heartless cunt, but they just fingerbanged her, right? So, it's not like she is going to have to deal with an unwanted pregnancy or STDs, whether treatable or untreatable.
Ultimately, she'll get over it, I'm sure. Fingers do not equal penis. Yes, it's horrid and the boys should definitely be punished (perhaps by being tied down and having the same thing done to them), but there ARE degrees to this stuff. This isn't as bad as it could have been, and as bad as other poor women have had to endure.
Furthermore, what business exactly do 16 year old children have getting crazily drunk in the first place? Unacceptable behaviour, and unacceptable behaviour sometimes has unpleasant consequences.
|by Anonymous||reply 101||03/18/2013|
Fags and their hags...
|by Anonymous||reply 102||03/18/2013|
[quote]Furthermore, what business exactly do 16 year old children have getting crazily drunk in the first place? Unacceptable behaviour, and unacceptable behaviour sometimes has unpleasant consequences.
MORE blaming the victim and excusing the criminals...
|by Anonymous||reply 103||03/18/2013|
[quote]Ultimately, she'll get over it, I'm sure. Fingers do not equal penis.
So... you're saying the problem is not a forcible intrusion into the vagina; it only counts as rape if it involves the penis??? What if they had forcibly inserted a broomstick into it--would that still "not count"?
|by Anonymous||reply 104||03/18/2013|
Was she raped on a pinball machine?
|by Anonymous||reply 105||03/18/2013|
96...its no different with gay men...we rip each other apart every chance we get...
|by Anonymous||reply 106||03/18/2013|
R101 Could you send me your address. You sound like fun, I'd like to come over, give your some drugs that will make you pass out and pee on you. I will film you and post it on Facebook too. You'll have a blast.
|by Anonymous||reply 107||03/18/2013|
Nearly one in five women is sexually assaulted at some point in her life time.
That sounds pretty "rape cultural" to me.
|by Anonymous||reply 108||03/18/2013|
[quote]Nearly one in five women is sexually assaulted at some point in her life time.
and the other 4 are fat and ugly
|by Anonymous||reply 109||03/18/2013|
98% of all rapes go unpunished.
|by Anonymous||reply 110||03/18/2013|
Here is my take on the whole "rape culture" thing. Pubescent boys today are watching hardcore porn instead of flipping through old playboys they keep hidden under their mattresses. They are jacking off to images depicting extreme humiliation, simulated rape, gonzo group sex with triple penetration and face slapping. For the very first time in human history, entire generations will have such imagery guiding them into their sexuality. Add to it the rise of narcissistic personality disorder PLUS being improperly socialized because so many kids are no longer being allowed to simply play outside and, basically, we're fucked.
And it WILL affect us because the monsters created will be the worst sort of bullies/ gay bashes.
|by Anonymous||reply 111||03/18/2013|
What r11 said, and all the other poster condemning the rape.
|by Anonymous||reply 112||03/18/2013|
Rape in the old days
Bad guys jumps out at stranger and rapes her.
Girl says yes to having sex, regrets it, then says she was drunk.
|by Anonymous||reply 113||03/18/2013|
Bullshit, R113. That is not what happened here.
|by Anonymous||reply 114||03/18/2013|
From R108's link:
[quote]But men also reported being victimized in surprising numbers.
[quote]One in seven men have experienced severe violence at the hands of an intimate partner, the survey found, and one in 71 men — between 1 percent and 2 percent — have been raped, many when they were younger than 11.
|by Anonymous||reply 115||03/19/2013|
[quote]Two teenage girls were arrested in Ohio on Monday and accused of using social media to threaten the young victim in a high-profile rape trial that concluded this past weekend, state Attorney General Mike DeWine said.
Damn those men!
|by Anonymous||reply 116||03/19/2013|
This place has been overrun by the worst sort of know-nothing, think-about-even-less idiots I could imagine. First the asshole who raped his roommate, and now this.
You might vote Democrat, girls, but you're the worst sort of Republicunts alive, particularly because, as gay people, you should fucking know better.
|by Anonymous||reply 117||03/19/2013|
Rape apologists - fucking men!
|by Anonymous||reply 118||03/19/2013|
Rape jokes at CPAC. Part of rape culture.
|by Anonymous||reply 119||03/19/2013|
[quote]Ultimately, she'll get over it, I'm sure.
Maybe she could have gotten over it, if they hadn't also PISSED on her like a piece of garbage. Maybe she could have gotten over it if those boys hadn't made her a laughing stock by bragging and texting about what they had done. Maybe she could have gotten over it, if she hadn't been met with an army of people who blamed HER for getting raped and tried to silence her.
Those creeps deserve to have their lives ruined, because they deliberately tried to ruin hers.
|by Anonymous||reply 120||03/19/2013|
The media makes up shit for ratings, OP.
|by Anonymous||reply 121||03/19/2013|
The apologies sounded phony to me.
|by Anonymous||reply 122||03/19/2013|
Oh No They Didn't! gets linked!! Fuck yeah!
|by Anonymous||reply 123||03/19/2013|
R113 believes a fantasy & myth... as only the worst sort of misogynist could.
|by Anonymous||reply 124||03/19/2013|
r113 is a troll
|by Anonymous||reply 125||03/19/2013|
I don't know if she got drunk by herself or was drugged. It doesn't matter...the parents never told their boys that rape was wrong? Fuck those boys...let them learn a lesson and just maybe, some of their goddamn friends will learn something too?
|by Anonymous||reply 126||03/19/2013|
Henry Rollins' view of the case.
|by Anonymous||reply 127||03/19/2013|
|by Anonymous||reply 128||03/19/2013|
The tapping of Trent May's cock on the victim's hip, is one thing he picked up from watching porn. God knows what else shaped his view of women, sex and morality.
|by Anonymous||reply 129||03/19/2013|
Loving Henry Rollins.
|by Anonymous||reply 130||03/19/2013|
Exactly, R13. They were encouraged by their families and community to behave in an aggressive manner.
The same people who acted shocked when they crossed a line with their brutal behavior.
|by Anonymous||reply 131||03/19/2013|
You can blame this whole mess on CHERYL from DL.
She drives all over America in her '73 Pinto finding athletic fields to warp the young minds of our athletes with her smelly pussy.
She must be droned and destroyed.
|by Anonymous||reply 132||03/19/2013|
It's something that the Women's Studies group has tried to cram down our throats.
I refuse to acknowledge or use it because 1. it's fucking stupid and ridiculous, and 2. anything to spite those whiny cunts.
|by Anonymous||reply 133||03/19/2013|
I think the general idea behind "rape culture" is valid, but the name itself is ridiculous and oversimplifying. And the idea you can't deny its existence without thereby proving it does indeed exist is pure doublethink.
|by Anonymous||reply 134||03/19/2013|
An interesting column about womens' participation in "rape culture".
|by Anonymous||reply 135||03/21/2013|
Very valid points in that column. "The Truth is Too Painful" touches on the Just World Theory, which has been discussed before on DL.
|by Anonymous||reply 136||03/21/2013|
I immediately dismiss anyone who uses the phrase "rape culture" in earnest as moronic, a bore and not worth listening to.
|by Anonymous||reply 137||03/21/2013|
How often does that happen to you r137?
|by Anonymous||reply 138||03/21/2013|
As per usual on DL, some seem determined to miss the forest for the trees. Is “victim-shaming culture” more palatable to you? Call it whatever you want - the importance lies not in the name but in the concept, which is indeed valid. That doesn't mean that everyone or even most people participate in this culture, but enough do that it is observable, troubling and impossible to ignore.
|by Anonymous||reply 139||03/21/2013|
"I immediately dismiss anyone who uses the phrase "rape culture" in earnest as moronic, a bore and not worth listening to."
Of course, you dumb little troll. Do you ever have to think about be raped when you walk alone at night? Do you have to worry that you'll be roofied and raped by a group of men? Do you have to worry that when you get hammered and drunk out of your mind that men will use your body like some rag doll, take photos and post them everywhere and later tell everyone you're a whore? Do you ever have to listen to someone who weighs twice as much as you do and is a foot taller than you "joke" about raping you? Do you, every time you say something that doesn't agree with the prevailing majority opinion, get called a "whore", "cunt", "bitch" and threatened with rape or being told "you're too ugly to rape"? Once you know what that is like, get back to me. And yes, please don't complain about "homophobia" to me, it's moronic, a bore and not worth listening to. You shouldn't take it so seriously because first of all, it doesn't exist, second of all, maybe you should develop a sense of humor about it, you humorless cunt. Why are you such a victim always whining about homophobia? And if some thug beats the crap out of you and sodomizes you with a baseball bat, I'm sure it's because you're a slut and you provoked him. First of all, you're gay, so your claims of homophobia are mostly just a lie anyway (remember all of those gay people just making "gay hate crimes up") designed to draw attention to yourself and because you're an unstable drama queen. So stop complaining, it's so boring.
|by Anonymous||reply 140||03/21/2013|
"I immediately dismiss anyone who uses the phrase "rape culture" in earnest as moronic, a bore and not worth listening to."
I agree. It's ridiculous.
|by Anonymous||reply 141||03/21/2013|
[quote]And, I mean, not to be a big heartless cunt, but they just fingerbanged her, right?
I believe somebody bragged about anally penetrating the victim, but this was not proven in court.
|by Anonymous||reply 142||03/21/2013|
Wow, R140. You're certainly not helping the cause much with your rant. I think many, many LGBTQ people have experienced a lot of the things that you've mentioned in your diatribe.
Matthew Shepard - ring a bell?
Any of the thousands of people who have suffered at the hands of others simply because they're (or appear to be) LGBTQ.
You really need to educate yourself, child.
|by Anonymous||reply 143||03/21/2013|
I told you we live in a rape culture! We need to start nipping this problem in the bud with the little 8 y/o "pre-rapists" themselves!
|by Anonymous||reply 144||03/21/2013|
R143, I think you need to go back and read R140's post to understand their point, I think you are missing it.
|by Anonymous||reply 145||03/21/2013|
R143 = moronic bore not with reading.
|by Anonymous||reply 146||03/22/2013|
This rape occurred while 50 people stood by, watching a naked girl be drug around. The rapists were football players, heroes and given a pass by their peers. YES, that is a rape culture. Only 46 out of 100 rapes are reported,12 lead to an arrest, 9 are prosecuted and just 3 serve prison time. YES, that is a rape culture.
|by Anonymous||reply 147||03/22/2013|
[quote]Do you ever have to think about be raped when you walk alone at night? Do you have to worry that you'll be roofied and raped by a group of men? Do you have to worry that when you get hammered and drunk out of your mind that men will use your body like some rag doll, take photos and post them everywhere and later tell everyone you're a whore? Do you ever have to listen to someone who weighs twice as much as you do and is a foot taller than you "joke" about raping you? Do you, every time you say something that doesn't agree with the prevailing majority opinion, get called a "whore", "cunt", "bitch" and threatened with rape or being told "you're too ugly to rape"?
[quote]Once you know what that is like, get back to me.
My post was about this section of r140's rant.
Being a victim of violence, any kind of violence, is not a competition.
I understand that R140 was responding to an somebody else's rude post, but ends up accomplishing nothing by attempting to out victim the LGBTQ community.
Bitching about being attacked by violent people to LGBTQ people is simply preaching to the choir, honey.
|by Anonymous||reply 148||03/22/2013|
[quote]Being a victim of violence, any kind of violence, is not a competition.
That's what you got from r140?
You need to get your head examined. Something is wrong with you, because you are seeing things that are not there. You're having a delusion, dear.
|by Anonymous||reply 149||03/22/2013|
I posted this on the other thread for the trial and I'll post it here because some people are pointing out the 2 women arrest for threatening the victim and the behaviour of women towards each other in general.
It's called internalized misogyny.
It's common to see it in women of all ages who say negative things about rape victims, who say misogynistic things themselves, who are desperate to let others know that they are nothing like ~those~ women. (ie. feminists, girls who they consider slutty and and any women who draw the ire of men)
They are desperate to telegraph that they aren't those women to other men, because they've internalized that misogyny.
It's the same way some gay people have internalized homophobia, and try to distance themselves from other gay people, and end up saying homophobic things.
It's sad that both groups are internalizing this shit from straight men.
|by Anonymous||reply 150||03/22/2013|
Funny thing is, this thread is full of examples of rape culture. Getting hung up on a detail like the phrase itself in order to invalidate the concept behind the phrase is a very transparent tactic.
|by Anonymous||reply 151||03/22/2013|
Okay. Let's move forward. What can gay men do to mitigate rape culture - assuming that by rape culture we mean the attitudes and behaviors of straight men towards women? What sort of steps can we take to raise consciousness and to provide some sort of aid to those who are affected by rape culture?
I'm not being facetious.
|by Anonymous||reply 152||03/22/2013|
Good point, r151
|by Anonymous||reply 153||03/22/2013|
r140 proves my point about bores and morons.
|by Anonymous||reply 154||03/22/2013|
R154 proves r137 is a self loathing troll.
|by Anonymous||reply 155||03/22/2013|
It's ok, [r137], gay men are considered to be notoriously unstable and too emotional to intellectually examine any issue.
|by Anonymous||reply 156||03/22/2013|
So there's no one who can propose some steps beyond ranting and griping about "rape culture" (see: r32,r140,r156) that gay men can take to possibly help mitigate the situation for women.
Anyone? Ah. Today's internet activism. Rant, rave, and yell, post endless graphics on facebook but leave the real solutions to other people or to no one at all.
|by Anonymous||reply 157||03/23/2013|
R 157. Blame it all on gays and how the fight for gay rights has caused the culture of rape.
|by Anonymous||reply 158||03/23/2013|
I have a feeling there's a lot of former rapists on this thread.
|by Anonymous||reply 159||03/23/2013|
Let's put it this way, OP. In 2012, after the it was revealed that for years many people knew that Jerry Sandusky was raping children on campus, Penn State received 200 million dollars in private donations. Their highest in the University's history.
That's all you need to know about "rape culture."
|by Anonymous||reply 160||03/23/2013|
r157, even if this were the right place to discuss it, it's difficult to know where to start. How can gay men "provide aid" when it's dreadfully apparent that so many gay men suffer from the same issues so many women do: craving straight male approval/validation to the point that they are willing to not only tolerate, but participate in and perpetuate misogynistic/homophobic attitudes and behaviors? How can that be fixed, other than continually pointing it out in the hopes that it will eventually sink in?
|by Anonymous||reply 161||03/23/2013|
A country in which 1 out of every 6 women is raped or attempted to be raped qualifies as a rape culture.
|by Anonymous||reply 162||03/23/2013|
r161, you've answered your own question.
We help by not craving male approval/validation to the point of being willing to not only tolerate but participate in and perpetuate misogynistic/homophobic attitudes and behaviors.
Some of us have been proudly not doing that for a very long time.
|by Anonymous||reply 163||03/23/2013|
If I have sex without marriage I'm a slut, but if I claim I was raped, I'm a victim.
That's why all you AIDS boys think your victims, when you brought on the wrath of AIDS yourself.
|by Anonymous||reply 164||03/23/2013|
I guess it would help if some gay men stopped viewing women as "competition" because they aren't.
|by Anonymous||reply 165||03/23/2013|
r164 = Laura Ingraham
|by Anonymous||reply 166||03/23/2013|
I am an AIDS boy. I don't consider myself a victim. Nor do I consider anyone a slut because they have sex in marriage or without or don't have sex in marriage or without.
But other than that you are very persuasive.
|by Anonymous||reply 167||03/23/2013|
R167, have you ever witnessed misogyny here on DL? Did it bother you?
|by Anonymous||reply 168||03/23/2013|
Not a former (or current) rapist - check.
Never donated to Penn State - check.
Doesn't need or desire straight mens' (or womens') approval - check.
Thinks sex before marriage for everybody is A-Ok! In fact thinks traditional marriage is an archaic institution that ought to be done away with completely - check.
Doesn't think AIDS was "brought on" by anybody, it was an epedemic - check.
Believes that people who are raped were victimized by others - check.
Believes that people have AIDS/HIV were and are victimized by (non-thinking, non-judgmental) disease - check.
Doesn't think women are in any way competition (we're seeking different things) and wouldn't mind if they were - check.
Thinks misogyny (external and internalized) are rampant in the world today - check.
Believes that reducing misogyny is going to require a lot of time, a lot of public, private, and personal struggle, and education, education, education at all levels of society - check.
|by Anonymous||reply 169||03/23/2013|
And believes that reducing homophobia is going to require a lot of time, a lot of public, private, and personal struggle, and education, education, education at all levels of society - check.
|by Anonymous||reply 170||03/23/2013|
You forgot to answer whether you think this rampant misogyny is worth putting the effort to end. The problem is many men either don't care or are committed to making sure it doesn't go anywhere.
|by Anonymous||reply 171||03/23/2013|
Believes misogyny and homophobia are both symptoms of the same pathology - patriarchal society and it's male dominated, class based, archaic belief systems and institutions.
Believes that misogyny and homophobia will probably never really "end".
Believes that both misogyny and homophobia are very much widespread throughout so much more of society's cultural practices and beliefs than most of us realize.
Believes that as long as we continue to deny the effects that those archaic institutions and patterns of behavior continue there can be no complete end to misogyny and homophobia.
Believes that changing (ending) many of those cultural practices and patterns of behavior is going to be very difficult (and probably impossible) to achieve in our lifetimes.
For example try explaining to people why traditional marriage - with it's symbolic engagement ring, women taking mens' last names, with women wearing symbolic white gowns, with men promising to protect and provide for their wives is a clear demonstration of some of the same beliefs that de-value women in society - that invokes the same patriarchy that has supressed women for centuries and see how the majority of them respond.
So yeah it's worth fighting for the end of misogyny and homophobia - but ranting about it on the internet isn't going to change a thing.
|by Anonymous||reply 172||03/23/2013|
First of all, lecturing about rape culture won't change a thing. Those who agree with you will still agree and those who don't will still roll their eyes.
There is a problem of the perception of what rape is. When we think of rape, we think of a scraggly creepy rapist hanging around dark alleys waiting to jump out and force sex on his poor victim. Everyone is against this and no one defends it.
We have trouble grasping that most victims know their attacker. In many cases they have some sort of relationship with them. We increasingly accept that girls who are intoxicated are fair game. 50 years ago, it was rare for a girl or a woman to get totally blitzed at a party. Now it's common and we never address the issue that taking advantage of her (or of a guy) in that state is a criminal act.
I remember a line in the Philadelphia Story where Katherine Hepburn, hung over, asks Jimmy Stewart is anything happened between them. When he says no, she asks "Am I that unattractive" and his response is that she was a bit drunk and that "There are rules about such things"
No one bothers to explain the rules anymore.
|by Anonymous||reply 173||03/23/2013|
Homophobia is a sub-set of misogyny.
|by Anonymous||reply 174||03/23/2013|
That's a very good point and example, R173.
|by Anonymous||reply 175||03/23/2013|