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How is it fucking possible that the Academy didn't nominate Lillian Gish for The Night of the Hunter or The Whales of August?

I mean.... really?

REALLY?

AMPAS has fucked up many, many times. But its snubbing one of the great ladies of American film (who's only nomination was for - WHAT THE FUCK? - Duel in the Sun) for two such profoundly beautiful and perfect performances defies belief.

by Anonymousreply 6503/20/2013

I mean "whose" only nomination..... sorry

by Anonymousreply 103/03/2013

Because she never portrayed a whore,that's why.

The Academy loves to throw Oscars at hooker roles.

by Anonymousreply 203/03/2013

The Night of the Hunter was just to weird. It was an independent film in an era in which independent films did not exist. The film was not a success and Laughton never directed another film.

by Anonymousreply 303/03/2013

^And its survived the test of time to be recognized as the masterpiece that it is.

by Anonymousreply 403/03/2013

Someone's got their caftan in a knot this morning!!

by Anonymousreply 503/03/2013

Well, yes. I have to do something!

And I'm tired of planning brunches.

On my own behalf.

by Anonymousreply 603/03/2013

The Academy is a dry blind bitch sometimes, that's why.

by Anonymousreply 703/03/2013

Bystander: Miss Gish did such a wonderful job on that close-up!

Bette Davis: She should, she was around when they were invented!

by Anonymousreply 803/03/2013

How is it fucking possible than anyone but the most demented queen could remotely CARE?

by Anonymousreply 903/03/2013

She was so convincingly authentic playing an old lady in The Whales of August.

by Anonymousreply 1003/03/2013

You certainly care R9 seeing as you took the time to post.

by Anonymousreply 1103/03/2013

I'm glad to know I'm not the only who has spent many sleepless nights, tossing and turning, just wondering why.

by Anonymousreply 1203/03/2013

Oh, God! Oh, God! Have they not eyes to see? Have they not ears to hear?

by Anonymousreply 1303/03/2013

Miss Gish was incredible in both those films. Norma Desmond was right: they had faces then.

Here she is in one of Night of the Hunter's most haunting scenes. Rachel Cooper sits in a rocking chair and cradles a shotgun. The insane "Reverend" appears in the front yard and begins singing Leaning on the Everlasting Arm.

Rachel joins in and harmonizes until he vanishes. Chills.

by Anonymousreply 1403/03/2013

Would you GET OUT OF THE PAST?

That movie was made over 30 years ago.

Christ, girl, the year is 2013!

by Anonymousreply 1503/03/2013

r15, some of us actually sometimes think about even older things. Like Buddha, Jesus, the Kuran, Shakespeare, Galileo, and Chaucer.

by Anonymousreply 1603/03/2013

Did Bette Davis get nominatd for "Whales"? Because I remember she was the one who got all the publicity out of that film, she was the brave stroke survivor staging a dramatic comeback, leaving the old pro Gish in the shadows.

And Mitchum gave the best performance in "NOTH", he was also robbed of a nom. But in those days, the AMPAS didn't want to encourage wierd littl independent films, however good.

by Anonymousreply 1803/03/2013

Bette Davis should have actually received an Oscar nomination for Whales of August. Her performance was brittle and heartbreaking and technically stunning portraying blindness as she magnificently did in Dark Victory 50 years prior. Lillian's? Not so much. Just her usual sweet old lady with a twinkle in her eye act and the Academy already rewarded that performance with Helen Hayes in Aiport.

by Anonymousreply 1903/03/2013

Ann Sothern was the only one nominated--sadly, her only nomination ever.

by Anonymousreply 2003/03/2013

Ann Sothern didn't deserve the Oscar for The Whales of August. Her attempt at a Down East Maine accent was a failure.

by Anonymousreply 2103/03/2013

NIGHT OF THE HUNTER was a flop and no one would consider rewarding it at the time. An expressionistic treatment of American culture in a fairy tale model was not something they or audiences could see as worthy or interesting. Yes, we don't see it that way now.

Gish was considered a fossil when it was made, as well.

For WHALES, it was considered a failure - so much less than it could have been, and a bad comparison to ON GOLDEN POND. The bad blood during filming, with Bette Davis being an insufferable bitch, added to the ill feelings. And Gish simply got lost in the shuffle.

I loved her in both movies. And in her earlier work.

by Anonymousreply 2203/03/2013

AND they denied her the lead in Pretty in Pink!

by Anonymousreply 2303/03/2013

But didn't she get nom'd for her supporting role in Mystic Pizza?

by Anonymousreply 2403/03/2013

In the early days of television, Ann Sothern did cut-down versions of hit musicals...all available at The Paley Center in New York and Beverly Hills. She is especially good in "Lady in the Dark." Sothern finally had a chance to show that she might have been a huge Broadway star under different circumstance.

by Anonymousreply 2503/03/2013

Both of those movies were commercial failures. While The Night of The Hunter was/is an artistic success and a fascinating Laughton curio, The Whales of August just wasn't/isn't that good.

What is interesting is that the only competitive nomination for acting that Vincent Price got was for supporting actor by The Independent Spirit Awards for The Whales of August.

by Anonymousreply 2603/03/2013

I love Ann Sothern! She really deserves her own thread.

After a long film career in mostly MGM B films, she finaly became a bigger star in early television as Susie McNamara on Private Secretary, a sitcom which was almost as popular as I LOve Lucy.

Susie was private secretary to Mr. Devery, who IIRC, ran a theatrical agency in Manhattan. Susie was unmarried and a real career girl and this was long before That Girl and MTM.

by Anonymousreply 2703/04/2013

I also adore Ann Sothern (I'm the person who first posted about her on this thread). I don't think The Whales of August was her finest hour--I agree the accent seemed hard for her--but she was also the only real sign of life and vitality in that film. I know she had been one of the actresses considered for "Driving Miss Daisy"--I'm afraid by then her name would not have been sufficient to bankroll the film (yes, Tandy was also not a film star, but she had done Cocoon more recently and had such stage cred). I remember seeing her on the Oscars when they were rattling off the names for her category, and when hers was announced she had a slightly bemused look, as if she were thinking, "Oh come on, we all know it's going to Olympia Dukakis, but it's nice to be at this party anyway." Vincent Price was also charming and, despite his own accent problems, less hammy than he had been (also gently and lovingly used in the prologue of "Edward Scissorhands" a few years later).

It was hard to believe in Davis and Gish as sisters--though I love both actresses and thought they were each moving in the film in their own way. Davis' health simply made it a bit painful to watch her, though you could see her still attending to her art; Gish glowed at moments and had a sweet, not treacly monologue celebrating her anniversary with her long-dead husband.

Some people must have thought Gish was going to be nominated. I remember watching one of the morning shows (GMA?) and when they flashed stills of the actresses nominated, her was there--hastily replaced by the next shot with Holly Hunter's (or one of the others). In a sense, it was a relief she wasn't nominated--Sothern losing to Dukakis was fine--two strong character actresses. But for Lillian Gish to lose to Cher (and that would have been the outcome) would have been as absurd and wince-producing as....well, Emmanuelle Riva losing to Jennifer Lawrence (although I thought Lawrence was fine, and probably would have been my second choice--I just think she was stronger in "Winter's Bone," just as Melissa Leo was stronger in "Frozen River."

Also, for quite awhile, after sound came in, Gish turned to theatre and did memorable performances in Chekhov and other classics. Apparently her sister Dorothy, whose work I've only seen in one film, was a superb comedienne--died much younger.

BTW, to the poster who said Gish didn't win because she never played a whore--untrue! In the pre-Oscar silent days, she was Mimi in a version of "La Boheme" and a fallen woman in "Way Down East."

Also, her one nomination for the risible but enjoyable "Duel in the Sun" shows that Oscar was still favoring the young gals even in 1946. The competition was Gish, Ethel Barrymore in "The Spiral Staircase," Gale Sondergaard in "Anna and the King of Siam" (Lady Thiang or her equivalent--Sondergaard was the first winner of Supporting Actress a decade earlier and soon to be blacklisted in the McCarthy era), Flora Robson in Creole-face in the truly bizarre "Saratoga Trunk"--and the winner, young Anne Baxter for her drunk Sophie in "The Razor's Edge." I love those four great actresses, but, on recent viewing of all the films, I think the Academy made the best choice that time.

All that said, I agree that Gish and Mitchum deserved nominations for Night of the Hunter--as did Shelley Winters as the desperate widow-woman--her fervor at the revival meeting was something to see, and the shot of her dead body still in the car in the lake was haunting. At her best, WiInters was a truly great actress. Even in "The Poseidon Adventure," where she has cliched role in a stupid script, she brings some warmth and pathos. Too bad she became a kind of joke in later years--mainly because of her weight and her ditziness on talk shows. Still, I bet she could have (and did) teach young actors a thing or two--didn't she teach at the Actor's Studio? In any other year, her performance in "A Place in the Sun" would have been a worthy choice, but how could you argue against Leigh's Blanche?

by Anonymousreply 2803/04/2013

Love your smart posts r28 but Mimi in La Boheme is not a whore, she's a poor sickly milliner's assistant. Musetta is the whore of La Boheme.

by Anonymousreply 2903/04/2013

Ann Sothern was a bitch to Barbara Eden, who was a guest on her show.

by Anonymousreply 3003/04/2013

Gish won the National Board of Review award for Whales, tying with Holly Hunter for Broadcast News.

She was also nominated for the Independent Spirit Award; Davis was not.

by Anonymousreply 3103/19/2013

I loved her, too.

by Anonymousreply 3203/19/2013

Are Gish and Sothern still alive?

by Anonymousreply 3303/19/2013

R33. No.

by Anonymousreply 3403/19/2013

[quote]Rachel joins in and harmonizes

She doesn't harmonize. She sings the melody with him and goes into the ocassional brief counterpoint.

by Anonymousreply 3503/20/2013

I've never heard of or seen either movie but the Academy are heifers. They overlook a lot of great stuff, probably because they don't agree with the particular message of the film or whatever else.

Academy Awards would be great to have but they're 90% politics and only sometimes reflect reality.

by Anonymousreply 3603/20/2013

So what if they were flops, people get nominated for flops.

by Anonymousreply 3703/20/2013

Th same way it's possible that Alfred Hitchcock never won an Oscar, OP, but shit like Crash and Argo easily wins.

by Anonymousreply 3803/20/2013

You do realize that back in Lillian's day the Academy Awards wasn't serious, right? Everyone looked at them like a joke and an excuse to throw a party. It was basically like the stupid awards you have your Senior Year in High School.

by Anonymousreply 3903/20/2013

her heyday was the late 1910s and early 1920s. There were no Academy awards until the late 20s.

by Anonymousreply 4003/20/2013

Caviar to the general, OP.

Awarding an Oscar to Lillian Gish as "Best Actress" would be like giving a "Verizon Prize for Contributions to Telecommunications" to Alexander Graham Bell...

by Anonymousreply 4103/20/2013

"You do realize that back in Lillian's day the Academy Awards wasn't serious, right? Everyone looked at them like a joke and an excuse to throw a party. It was basically like the stupid awards you have your Senior Year in High School."

As opposed to when, now?

Sorry but an oscar for Anna Magnani was serious; an oscar to Gwyneth Paltrow..... not so much.

by Anonymousreply 4203/20/2013

R42

As opposed to... people, including the actors winning the things, not giving a damn about them.

by Anonymousreply 4303/20/2013

"Whales" was a cable movie wasn't it?

by Anonymousreply 4403/20/2013

I told you I was skinny in the water.

by Anonymousreply 4503/20/2013

But she did get the Kennedy Center, far better than the Oscar anyway.

by Anonymousreply 4603/20/2013

R29 You are right--my lack of knowledge of La Boheme is apparent. At the same time, didn't "Hello, Dolly!" teach us that milliners were always believed to be wicked women? :)

by Anonymousreply 4703/20/2013

Lilian Gish was also excellent in 'The Cobweb'.

by Anonymousreply 4803/20/2013

A dedication to Lilian Gish

The First Lady of the Silent Screen

A very moving tribute. The person who made it really caught the essence of the actress. Lilian Gish would be proud if she could see that.

by Anonymousreply 4903/20/2013

A happy life is one spent in learning, earning, and yearning. -Lillian Gish

by Anonymousreply 5003/20/2013

The older I get, the more I believe in what I can't explain or understand, even more than the things that are explainable and understandable.-Lillian Gish

by Anonymousreply 5103/20/2013

You can get through life with bad manners, but it's easier with good manners. -Lillian Gish

by Anonymousreply 5203/20/2013

Lillian Gish (1893-1993) and younger sister Dorothy (1898-1968) (photo by Diane Arbus, 1964).

by Anonymousreply 5303/20/2013

John Gilbert was so infatuated with her he would mess up their love scenes on purpose (during the filming of “La Bohème”, 1926) so he could keep kissing her.

by Anonymousreply 5403/20/2013

With John Gilbert in 'La Boheme'(1926)

by Anonymousreply 5503/20/2013

Dorothy Gish and Lillian Gish, 1934

by Anonymousreply 5603/20/2013

Very funny, R41, and true.

Before this thread degenerates into a list of still photos, has anyone here ever met Miss Gish? (Why is it always "Miss Gish"?)

An old friend of mine went to a screening of one of her tributes in Chicago and wandered out for a smoke when he found her sitting quietly by herself in the lobby.

He exchanged pleasantries with her but could only remember the large necklace she wore made of very small ivory and jade elephants in a breastplate formation.

by Anonymousreply 5703/20/2013

R57, i'm sorry that you took those photos as degeneration of this thread. What more is left to say when someone is so disapproving of small charming things?

by Anonymousreply 5803/20/2013

Because Hollywood does not and never has liked Lesbians. Especially incestuous ones.

by Anonymousreply 5903/20/2013

R59, you can't know if Lillian Gish was a lesbian for sure and you are so gross if you firmly believe that her close relationship with her sister was of an incestuous kind. A very dirty mind some people have!

by Anonymousreply 6003/20/2013

Lillian in Whales is one of my favourite performances ever. On the archives of Siskel(?) & Ebert you can see their review, they liked the film but singled out the award worthy performances, so she had her supporters. But it got barely any precursor love, only the National Board of Review gave anything.

The Golden Globes totally ignored her, Sally Kirkland seemed to be the favourite that year aside from Cherilyn, they went for other stuff like Babs in Nuts and Faye Dunaway. Unusually, Meryl had no other nominations for Ironweed, yet still made the Oscars. I suppose if you're gonna make one it might as well be that lol.

I don't get why Ann Sothern made it though, wtf. That seemed to be the filler nod and a way of honouring Whales as a whole/the cast and her career.

by Anonymousreply 6103/20/2013

R60

You are so ridiculous.

by Anonymousreply 6203/20/2013

Bette Davis told the director about Lillian Gish close-ups on the film.

Fitting she gets a lot of close-ups on this film, the bitch invented them!

by Anonymousreply 6303/20/2013

Some y'all are so mean. Why not learn something, or just move on.

by Anonymousreply 6403/20/2013

R63 that quote is classic and exactly what I was told in the intro to the film - it was part of a Bette season.

by Anonymousreply 6503/20/2013
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