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Why are employers still offering $12.00/hr.?

After taxes, that's less than $20k a year. That's poverty wages. You can't even make a car payment with that, let alone a house payment.

This isn't 1988.

by Anonymousreply 12701/21/2013

Because employers don't care about your car payments or house notes? Just a wild guess ….

by Anonymousreply 101/13/2013

I'm a degreed accountant with multi-years experience, located in the suburbs of Philly (not exactly a low wage area). I applied as a part-time night auditor position at a new hotel. The starting wage: $10/hour.

by Anonymousreply 201/13/2013

Call a national strike, OP.

by Anonymousreply 301/13/2013

Because they can.

by Anonymousreply 401/13/2013

Op, the only jobs I seem to be able to even get an interview for are $12.00/hr. I have a degree and lots of experience. I was recently let go from a job that was again $12.00/hr with 5 days vacation per year. The situation sucks right now.

by Anonymousreply 501/13/2013

OP, if you think that's bad, last year I worked at state university for a few months and guess how much the job paid? Not even $11.00 an hour. And of course it was only 4 days a week so that way they wouldn't have to give me benefits. On top of that, the job was stressful as hell and the supervisor was a cunt. I said fuck it and quit after a few months.

Some jobs really aren't worth doing with the chump change they pay, especially after taxes and the gas it takes to get there.

by Anonymousreply 601/13/2013

As others have said it isn't complicated. Employers only care about their business being as profitable as possible.

If they can get away with qualified good workers at low wages they will. And they know they can.

It sucks, income relative to inflation has been falling for most Americans for a while now and it doesn't look like that is going to change anytime soon.

by Anonymousreply 701/13/2013


Why did you apply? It only encourages them.

by Anonymousreply 801/13/2013

OP, you must live in a fairly large city? in the sticks, you can see any number of employers offerin minimum wage jobs. Try $7.50. And I have a horrible feeling the federal minimum is even less.

by Anonymousreply 901/13/2013

I don't want to turn this into an anti-immigration rant, but honestly, this is why we need to quit allowing so many foreigners in the country. And I'm not talking about one particular group but people from all around the world. The more immigrants we keep letting in, the less jobs we have, especially considering all of the jobs that keep getting exported. It's a mess.

by Anonymousreply 1001/13/2013

Some companies advertise $8.75/hr and then ask you if you are willing to work for only $8.75/hr. You say no, they say goodbye.

by Anonymousreply 1101/13/2013

Minimum wage should be around 15. An hour.

The fact that thus country allows slave labor is sickening.

by Anonymousreply 1201/13/2013

Why do I care? If you don't want to make $12/h, develop the skills needed to acquire a job that pays more than $12/h.

by Anonymousreply 1301/13/2013

R12 I agree. How the fuck are people supposed to support themselves on $12.00 an hour when everything is so fucking expensive?

by Anonymousreply 1401/13/2013

Idiot at R13, read R2. There's lots of people that have great skills and still can't get shit.

by Anonymousreply 1501/13/2013

That is a pretty good wage where I live

by Anonymousreply 1601/13/2013

It's $3/hr more than I make.

by Anonymousreply 1701/13/2013

American Corporations donate to politicians to keep wages low.

by Anonymousreply 1801/13/2013

R15, why is it our fault that R2 lacks skills needed for a decent paying job and lacks the motivation to develop new, useful skills?

by Anonymousreply 1901/13/2013

I made $12.00 a few years ago, and did just fine on my own. In fact, was even saving a few hundred each month,.. just left a 10.50 job,..not looking back!~

by Anonymousreply 2001/13/2013

OP, we live in a country where tens of millions of unemployed people would KILL to have a job paying $12/hour. Why are you so shocked that such jobs not only exist but are highly sought after? This is Capitalism 101.

Also, single-income households these days are the exception, not the norm. It becomes much easier to make car and rent payments if you have two or three wage-earners under one roof.

by Anonymousreply 2101/13/2013

My neighbor, who has two grad degrees, worked for the State of Illinois (in Blago's office)for $10.50/hr in 2006 as an administrative assistant. The state hires through a temp agency to avoid a living wage and benefits for employees.

by Anonymousreply 2201/13/2013

"... develop the skills needed to acquire a job"

And how do I pay tuition? With all that cash that's left over after food, shelter and utilities?

by Anonymousreply 2301/13/2013

$12 an hour?!!!

If I paid that, Consuela would not have the slightest idea of how to spend all that money. That's why she's very happy to earn the $12 a day that we generously give her.

by Anonymousreply 2401/13/2013


Wow, you must be rich!

by Anonymousreply 2501/13/2013

$12.00/hr? How am I supposed to afford Hermes bags?

by Anonymousreply 2601/13/2013

Because, OP, you refuse to pay $50 for a bottle of shampoo, $100 for a steak and $250 to get your hair cut. If you weren't so damned cheap we could afford to pay our employees a lot more and give them full benefits as well.

by Anonymousreply 2701/13/2013

R13 and R19 seem to be under the illusion that skills are the only factor in landing a high paying job.

I happen to be well paid, but I am aware that the old boy network and social connections are a huge factor (and it's an area full of bigots).

These discussions often make me think of an old Lynda Barry cartoon. The teacher has told the class, "You can be anything you decide to be." Later Marlys is standing in the lunch line looking at the cafeteria ladies thinking, "Wow, they are stupid. They could have been astronauts or the president, but nooooo!"

by Anonymousreply 2801/13/2013

It's called "supply and demand." You could look it up.

by Anonymousreply 2901/13/2013

Suggestion: Don't buy materialistic stuff you actually don't need. Don't buy the apps; the high-end cell phones; etc.

by Anonymousreply 3001/13/2013

I haul stuff around all day; I make $9/hr plus tits. Not tips. Tits. Manual labor can do wonders for your pecs.

by Anonymousreply 3101/14/2013

The bare minimum wage should be $12/hour. It should really be close to $20 so people doing honest work can actually live on it.

What would happen if Obama executive ordered it? Is that something he could do in line with FDR's fixes for the great depression?

Remember back to that asshole who owns Papa John's complaining about how giving health insurance to everyone would add 11 cents to every pizza. Well, I would think upping the minimum wage (especially since employers no longer offer any fucking benefits at all) would have very little impact on businesses bottom lines but drastic effects on the workers' abilities to live a decent life.


by Anonymousreply 3201/14/2013

$20/hr lololol

by Anonymousreply 3301/14/2013

Its true, unless you want to live on the murder side of town, you need to make a minim of 15-20/hr.

America has turned into a caricature of itself.

by Anonymousreply 3401/15/2013

Sure, but if min wage was raised to $20/hr, the price of everything would inflate accordingly...and we'd end up exactly where we are today, only with higher prices & wages.

by Anonymousreply 3501/15/2013

R10 it has nothing to do with immigration. The CEO of our company just came back from India giddy because he can get people to do the same type of high tech work we do here, college educated and everything for 7,000 a year. Most of us are averaging about 50,000. Guess where the jobs are going. Plus no health insurance, taxes or labor laws. let the exploitation begin.

by Anonymousreply 3601/15/2013

In So. Calif., both skilled, degreed US born are working alongside immigrant (both legal and illegal) domestics who make the same hourly wage $10/12/14 an hour. One woman I know w/ an MBA, who was trying to enter the workforce after a few years of at-home parenting told me she had to turn down a job offer because the job (for a non-profit) paid the same low hourly amount she'd have to pay a sitter to watch her 2 kids--and the non-profit couldn't offer any benefits to make it worthwhile except for "flex time." I agree a living wage needs to be higher.

by Anonymousreply 3701/15/2013

Shit man, there was a fast food place opening up in a city I visited in the south a couple months ago advertising $9/hour as if that were a big fucking thing.

by Anonymousreply 3801/15/2013

I live in Chicago and make $12/hr and do quite well on it.

I pay $510 for my studio flat, all utilities included in Bucktown, a nice Chicago neighborhood. I get around on public transit for $100 a month and my food bill is $75/month. My Internet and phone is $55.00 a month. So it only costs $740.00 to live in Chicago.

That is $8,880/year. I take home $21,216, after taxes and health insurance is taken out. That leaves me over $12,000 in disposable income per year.

I guess you spend too much at the bar.

by Anonymousreply 3901/15/2013

$75/month for food? You are on the wrong thread, R39. Get over to the "No one can live on $5/day in food stamps" thread and post your menu.

by Anonymousreply 4001/15/2013

So, [R39] you never go to the doctor or dentist. You have no medication needs, nor do you need to buy sundry for yourself or your apartment (shampoo, soap, toilet paper, cleaning products). You never need to buy new clothing or shoes. You don't need to save for retirement.

And you claim to be able to feed yourself on $2.50 per day, or $0.83 per meal, which I simply don't buy, unless you are receiving government assistance or are being treated to food by the parents and/or friends.

by Anonymousreply 4101/15/2013

I agree, R41.

R39 needs to enlighten us all how to do this.

I personally think his is a hollow boast.

by Anonymousreply 4201/15/2013

I'm starting to wonder if R39 is 58 but gets mistaken for 19...

by Anonymousreply 4301/15/2013

[quote]Sure, but if min wage was raised to $20/hr, the price of everything would inflate accordingly...and we'd end up exactly where we are today, only with higher prices & wages.

And unemployment would skyrocket and businesses would fold. It would be a national economic disaster.

The minimum wage is a false cure. It's one of those things politicians throw at us to gain votes.

by Anonymousreply 4401/15/2013


I think immigration is at least a part of it. I happened to be in the house this week when my lawn service came to cut it, and was surprised that a team of 5 people cuts my teeny, tiny lawn--naturally not on of them speaks one word of English. (I've had the same lawn service for years, but the lady who started it, who was a friend of mine, sold the company, and I'm not usually here when they come.) And I sort of thought, "Wouldn't it be better to give the $25 to one single guy, who could cut my lawn in 20 or 30 minutes, instead of 5 guys who share the $25.)

And then I thought of two couples in my family who both have illegals--one full-time nanny, and the other has two housekeepers. There are entire neighborhoods, where I live, where every house on the street has illegal domestics. And if we didn't have the illegal population to draw on, I imagine those sorts of jobs would have gone to (realistically speaking) working-class black women.

So that's 4 jobs, just in my family, that should have gone to legals but didn't. Multiply that by thousands.

by Anonymousreply 4501/15/2013

I'm not in the top any percent, live in a southern state where wages are low, and still paid my yard guy $14 an hour for keeping up my 2 acres.

by Anonymousreply 4601/15/2013

My yard can't be more than 3,000 square feet--and actually, I think it's closer to 2,000.

by Anonymousreply 4701/15/2013

R19: you are so fucked up I don't know where to begin. My husband is degreed and has a variety of skills and has worn many hats over successful career.

He now stocks shelves and bags food for $14 an hour.

He can't even get interviews because he is too old or overqualified.

You have no idea what's really going on out there.

Oh, I think you are a miserable fuck.

by Anonymousreply 4801/15/2013

I just applied for an office job paying 8.50/hr. How fucking pathetic is that?

R48 I'm in the same boat. I'm 48 and it seems no one wants to hire anyone nearing 50 no matter that I'm more experienced and much more reliable than some twits right out of college who will go get drunk and call in hungover.

by Anonymousreply 4901/15/2013

Because of people like R13, basically.

And you've got a Republican party full of evil assholes, and a Democratic Party that's basically the 80's Republican Party at this point. There's no one fighting for the people anymore.

by Anonymousreply 5001/15/2013

THe price of wages have been falling for years. You can bet it has to do with the Global Economy. You know, the race to the bottom.

What was that Tom Friedman book from a few years ago? Can't remember the title. When a company like IBM can pay Krishna $9.00 an hour to do IT work from India- you can bet they will. No matter it barely works or the culture is world's apart. The CEO needs to makes his/her multi-million package. Executives in these 'global companies' do very well also. They have contracts. The rest of the grunt works get laid off, downsized, etc.

Someday the pendulum will turn. Maybe not in my lifetime though.

by Anonymousreply 5101/15/2013

[quote] minimum wage...should really be close to $20 so people doing honest work can actually live on it. What would happen if Obama executive ordered it?

Do you think money grows on trees?

by Anonymousreply 5201/15/2013

If the minimum wage were raised it would not lead to business closure, it would lead to fewer profits for ceos and shareholders.

Because more people would have more money to buy more goods and services the economy would boom.

The rich would have less, but everyone else would have so much more.

by Anonymousreply 5301/15/2013

The biggest economic problem today is not taxes, or the deficit, it is that wages haven't stayed level with the inflation rate. If employers paid more, the tax base would grow. All problems solved. Employers who complain should work for $12/hour. Problem solved.

by Anonymousreply 5401/15/2013


That's just not true.

Also R54, you have a similarly mistaken theory.

It's difficult to debate economics with people who are not informed.

by Anonymousreply 5501/15/2013

I'm informed

by Anonymousreply 5601/15/2013

Over the weekend I was in Old Navy (whatever) and while all the employees were quite young there was one older man (maybe late to middle 50's) running around and folding clothes and organizing. He was well-groomed, nicely dressed and smelled good (I noticed) but I got a very sad feeling realizing this was proably the only job he could get and I felt sad for him. He was not a manager and probably had kids at home the same age as his co-workers. Sad.

by Anonymousreply 5701/15/2013

I think "the biggest problem" with the U.S. economy as it is, is that it is non backed fiat money. With fiat money, there is debt slavery and a large controllable, demoralized workforce.

When you look into backed currencies throughout the world at any time in history, you see that there is an explosion of commerce, middle class wealth, education and literacy.

The problem for the elite sociopathic types who like to cluster, is that backed currencies do not support their ponzi scheme economies.

Self governing, educated, literate and wealthy masses don't need royalty getting fat. They start to poke their noses where they shouldn't.

by Anonymousreply 5801/15/2013

[quote] When you look into backed currencies throughout the world at any time in history, you see that there is an explosion of commerce, middle class wealth, education and literacy.

Not just untrue, but ridiculous.

"Backed currency" was the only currency in the Western world until the 19th century.

I'm not going to waste my time explaining what you could read in a book.

by Anonymousreply 5901/15/2013

Opinions, like assholes....

by Anonymousreply 6001/15/2013

R59 - And that backed currency is how the United States thrived and rose to dominance is such a short time.

You're ridiculous.

by Anonymousreply 6101/15/2013

How the hell can you even make it on 12 $ an hour? We don't even have minimum wage in my country, but the lowest wages are usually around 20-25 $/hour.

by Anonymousreply 6201/15/2013


Wrong again.

by Anonymousreply 6301/15/2013

R58 gets it.

by Anonymousreply 6401/16/2013

[quote]The biggest economic problem today is not taxes, or the deficit, it is that wages haven't stayed level with the inflation rate. If employers paid more, the tax base would grow. All problems solved. Employers who complain should work for $12/hour. Problem solved.

I am a small business owner. I made a significant financial investment to start my business. I took a risk. I would not have done so for $12 per hour.

No new start ups = no new jobs for millions of workers

by Anonymousreply 6501/16/2013

I love R31 ..........

by Anonymousreply 6601/16/2013


With a high minimum then more businesses would thrive, if the guy at the Y makes 25 bucks an hour he can afford a sandwich at the deli and the guy at the Deli can afford a gym membership and new shoes so the shoemaker can afford a new roof.

We will NEED more small businesses with a higher wage.

Though since you are such a stupid greedy bastard it is okay if your business closes.

by Anonymousreply 6701/16/2013

[quote] he guy at the Deli can afford a gym membership and new shoes so the shoemaker can afford a new roof.

R67 is posting from 1957.

Where does one ever find a shoemaker anymore?

by Anonymousreply 6801/16/2013

My business is thriving and growing. It's been successful beyond my expectations, actually. But thanks for the crash course in runaway inflation, R67.

by Anonymousreply 6901/16/2013

R68 Yes...I can find you two excellent shoemakers in NY.

by Anonymousreply 7001/16/2013

[quote]Where does one ever find a shoemaker anymore?

all over my part of town

by Anonymousreply 7101/16/2013

Start ups which produce $12/hr jobs are not needed in this Country. Go to China.

by Anonymousreply 7201/16/2013

The money is all drawn to the top. When the CEO is making 100 times what his workers are, this is what you get.

by Anonymousreply 7301/16/2013

America needs anti-pillaging laws.

by Anonymousreply 7401/16/2013

I make my own shoes out of chicken patties and rubber bands. I have a part time job at McDonalds and a part time job at OfficeMax.

by Anonymousreply 7501/16/2013

Don't exaggerate, R73. I only make about 10 x what my average employee makes, which is more than fair considering the financial investment, risk, years of experience, stress and hard work (24/7) it takes to launch and operate a successful business.

by Anonymousreply 7601/16/2013

Felix the cat

The wonnerful, wonnerfullest cat

When ever he got in a fix

He reached right into his bag of tricks

Felix the cat

The wonnerful, wonnerfullest cat

You'll laugh so much, your sides will ache your heart'll go pitter pat

Watching Felix, the wonnerful cat

by Anonymousreply 7701/16/2013

Great, R76, but you don't pay yourself 100 times the amount, do you?

by Anonymousreply 7801/16/2013

R76, if you don't pay your workers even $12/hour and you only make 10x what they make, how fucking successful can your business possibly be? Let me guess, you're that asshole business man from the other thread about paying workers shit who was calling them your 'worker bees', etc., right?

You sound like a dick.

by Anonymousreply 7901/16/2013

I make $8 an hour in my current job in CA. It's impossible.

I made $75K in my previous job but the market out there is so bad I took a job that still equates to my resume but it's a hiring market out there. Businesses can pay nothing and still get people.

by Anonymousreply 8001/16/2013

agree with r80

The tables will turn - not sure when, but they will.

by Anonymousreply 8101/17/2013

How did you come across that initial "investment", R69/R76?

Just curious.

by Anonymousreply 8201/17/2013

Because they can.

Thread Closed

by Anonymousreply 8301/17/2013

He won't answer, R82. He's a complete asshole who called his peons worker bees in another thread and said, if they don't like it, they can just leave and he'll find new ones.

Complete fucking Repug asshole.

by Anonymousreply 8401/17/2013

I'm amazed that so many people here don't even comprehend the system we live in. If firms paid what their workers ideally would want to earn, no one would buy their products and/or the owners wouldn't get rich, which is why they start firms in the first place. Solution: get an education and work your ass off when you're young.

by Anonymousreply 8501/17/2013

I am amazed that R85 is so stupid. The solution is higher wages, our country was at it's most successful when unions were strong and wages were good.

by Anonymousreply 8601/18/2013

Access to good education is not universal in this country, R85. No matter how hard someone works.

by Anonymousreply 8701/18/2013

[quote]Access to good education is not universal in this country, R85. No matter how hard someone works.

Exactly. The inequality in this country isn't going to be solved by raising minimum wage to $20/h, increasing food stamps allowances to $500/mo, or reinstating the welfare system which was done away with when Clinton was president. They simply won't happen, and even if they did, they wouldn't solve the problem.

What we can do, though, is change our education system. Do away with magnet programs and gifted student programs, since the students who participate in these programs are no more successful than students of equal intelligence who did not go through a magnet program. Focus instead on putting the best (and highest paid) teachers in poor schools. Right now, suburban public schools provide a great education because they serve upper middle class white and Asian students, and parents are willing to pay more in taxes for this education because they can afford to do so. Wealthy parents who live in urban school districts simply ship their kids to private schools, so even in diverse cities such as Chicago or NYC, the public school system is not diverse and serves only minorities. Charter schools run by for-profit management companies need to be eliminated.

We need to make sure all students are prepared for college and financially able to attend. This means room and board for rural students who cannot live at home and commute should be subsidized. Ability to pay should never be an impediment to education. Inability to perform should be an impediment to education. For students who aren't able to perform in higher education, we need to have a robust trade school and apprenticeship system. Right now, with construction in particular, we have a shortage of trained and skilled workers because union apprenticeship programs have disappeared. Now we have higher labor costs and poor quality. This is a huge problem, and it can be easily solved by investing in vocational education and apprenticeship.

And we obviously need to have good roads, and in large cities, public transit. This spurs more investment and economic growth. The government needs to facilitate business growth (and the people who benefit from government investment need to pay their fair share in taxes).

All of these things cost money, no doubt, but unlike the band-aid solutions of raising minimum wage dramatically (without investing in programs that make those higher wages economically feasible for employers), these actually create economic growth, and contribute to market-driven higher wages which increase tax revenues from both individuals paying income tax and businesses paying income tax. This is what the Democrats have been pushing for years. Unfortunately, we have Republicans who think that cutting taxes and regulations will spur economic growth, when that has never been shown to be true, and since Republicans control the media, and everyone hates paying taxes, they continue to define the debates and the issues.

by Anonymousreply 8801/18/2013

I have two graduate degrees and worked my ass off, only to be kicked to the curb when I was 50. Now I can't find a job, even for minimum wage. No one believes I am willing to work for a low wage even though I haven't worked in two years, and I know damn well the reason I hardly get any interviews is my age. I do have savings, but that was meant for when I'm 60, not 50.

by Anonymousreply 8901/18/2013

R88 is a fascist/ if we all can't see that.

by Anonymousreply 9001/18/2013

if you can live comfortably on a minimum wage job, then why try to better yourself? Minimum wage jobs are supposed to be stepping stones.

by Anonymousreply 9101/18/2013

The other side of the coin is that if wages were higher in the US, we would not be able to compete globally. This was the downfall of the unions. Their pay and benefits were so high at one time that other countries could sell the same commodity cheaper. That is why we are now building cars in Mexico.

It's a balancing act.

by Anonymousreply 9201/18/2013

Because that's what the job is worth, OP. It's called THE MARKET. Where you live, with your skills, that's what the market pays. The minimum wage was never intended to be a living wage for a lifetime. It is an ENTRY LEVEL wage.

If you want to earn more, increase your qualifications or move. You're not entitled to a well-paying job where you live - that's not in the Constitution or Declaration of INdependence. You have to find the openings, and if you're locked into a location where jobs are scarce, you likely will not be able to get a big paycheck.

You need to acquire another skill perhaps? Or more than likely, MOVE. That's what our ancestors did - they left Europe or another continent and came here because they had no opportunity there. And when the East Coast was short of jobs, they moved West.

Quit whining about the low wages and look at yourself. You sound like you feel entitled to more. From whom? Why?

by Anonymousreply 9301/18/2013

What if you can't afford to move? most of the working poor can not

by Anonymousreply 9401/18/2013

A number of economic factors: They don't value your skills enough to offer more and/or the market for those skills is so bad that they can lowball the wages and still get skilled applicants to fill the positions.

by Anonymousreply 9501/18/2013

But R95, how do you explain the "minimum wage" in my country being 20-25 $ an hour? do you think that's too high?

by Anonymousreply 9601/18/2013

[quote]R88 is a fascist/ if we all can't see that.

Given that fascism and socialism are polar opposites, and R88 advocated neither of these two political philosophies, I think it's safe to say that you're a moron. You probably think Obama is an atheist Muslim, too.

by Anonymousreply 9701/18/2013

Hilda Solis is congratulating herself for retraining a million and a half people so they would be ready to accept those $12/Hr jobs.

Ave Hilda!

by Anonymousreply 9801/18/2013

Is this state of affairs permanent?

Perhaps Americans have unrealistic expectations about what they should be earning. America had it all after WWII: its three biggest potential competitors (Britain, Germany and Japan) were reeling from the war, penniless and in disrepair. America's infrastructure was untouched; it had built up a huge industrial base and had NO competition in the world. It could afford to pay excellent union wages with benefits, enabling families to support a full-time housewife with four kids in a nice house in the suburbs and plenty of paid vacation time.

Guess what? The rest of the world caught up. Environmental laws restrict some development and business start-ups. Technology has enabled any work that can be done on a modem to be done for less. CEOs got greedy and started shipping jobs overseas. NAFTA was signed in, destroyed small farms in Mexico and began a huge wave of illegal immigration into the U.S. The U.S. turns a blind eye to illegal immigration because both parties get either votes or cheap labor out of it (and make no mistake, illegal immigration DOES depress wages--as well as killing the job prospects for teenagers and low-skilled Americans) Protest this and be called, oh horrors, a racist. (The politicians most in favor of legalization for illegal immigrants always live in the whitest neighborhoods--their jobs aren't threatened, right?)

How will this change? It's not the 1950s-1970s anymore. Buying local is a good philosophy; enforcing out border law is good policy. But it's not about the country anymore.

Corporations see "markets", they don't give a shit about their own communities or country, and there is no loyalty to employees anymore.

We're digging our own graves because we have allowed this to happen. But what can we do? I'm re-entering the job market (I was a stay-at-home parent for twelve years) and my skills are out of date. I'm finishing up my degree but I'm afraid my age (nearing fifty) will work against me. I'm working a crummy part-time job. I WISH I made $12 an hour, and so do my co-workers (many of whom are also underemployed and middle-aged.) There's a lot of anger out there.

by Anonymousreply 9901/18/2013

Fascism and socialism are not opposites, R97. They're not the same being, but they do hold hands.

by Anonymousreply 10001/18/2013

Our ancestors were poor. They borrowed the passage money or agreed to work off the cost in the New World. Whining that one cannot afford to move where jobs are better is just an excuse.

Just as it is ridiculous to think we "owe" people who came to this country for economic opportunity a wage at some artificial level just because they are here.

GO TO SCHOOL. Get retrained. Move to where the jobs are. PERIOD. Quit whining - there are places where unemployment is under 5% - go there.

As for the person who claims his country's minimum wage is $20 - where are you?

by Anonymousreply 10101/18/2013

[quote]GO TO SCHOOL. Get retrained. Move to where the jobs are. PERIOD. Quit whining - there are places where unemployment is under 5% - go there.

I've met so many people fucked over by that very advice.

by Anonymousreply 10201/18/2013

Many companies offer $8 dollars an hour and part time. And if you ask them to arrange your scheduel so that you can get another job, they get huffy and refuse to give you hours. We are pretty much the same as slaves and the work is hard.

by Anonymousreply 10301/18/2013

I hope R101 gets laid off...what a thoughtless, truely ignorant person she is. Knows nothing but opens her mouth anyway.

You have a few things to learn, R101.

by Anonymousreply 10401/18/2013

The only way things will change is if workers have a national strike. It needs to be nationwide. A two day strike and if they don't for a month long strike. All of the money is being funneled to the needs to be spread out to the workers. If you could get people to stick together...something could be done.

by Anonymousreply 10501/18/2013

You can't keep earning a higher wage if you are not adding greater value. The problem with unions is unskilled people end up making outrageously high incomes that are not commensurate with their contribution. So you have lifers making twice what the new kid makes but they aren't contributing any more....often times far less.

R85 is correct. The only way to be successful is to add value by having something to offer that is in demand---knowledge, experience, skill, contacts, etc. that the newbies lack. Then you are worth more money to an employer and you have job security.

by Anonymousreply 10601/18/2013

Totally agree R105. But in order for that to happen I think things are going to have to get a whole lot worse, unfortunately.

For now the filthy rich will continue to have a feast at the banquet while we fight over their scraps.

by Anonymousreply 10701/18/2013

Thank you, R99, for adding some much needed sense.

by Anonymousreply 10801/18/2013

[quote]The only way things will change is if workers have a national strike. It needs to be nationwide. A two day strike and if they don't for a month long strike. All of the money is being funneled to the needs to be spread out to the workers. If you could get people to stick together...something could be done.

The problem with that is they've already stacked the deck with illegal aliens, H1-Bs, and L-1s.

Those "immigrants" that get so much support from the people who would under pay blacks and call themselves Civil Rights Warriors for doing so.

by Anonymousreply 10901/18/2013

There are plenty of jobs for much less. I work a second job at a sports/concert venue pouring serving beer and wine. I make $7.05/hour (and no tips permitted).

Fortunately, I have a regular job with benefits.

by Anonymousreply 11001/18/2013

California unemployment rate stuck at 9.8%

Manufacturing, government and business-services workforces in the state all suffered declines in December, contributing to a loss of 17,500 jobs.

(The rate used to be over 12%, but the decline is thought to be in part to many illegals going home. In any case, it remains a tough market unless you are an H1-B from India.)

by Anonymousreply 11101/18/2013

R101 makes $22 an hour eating the feces from colostomy bags at nursing homes.

by Anonymousreply 11201/18/2013

Business owners are taking advantage of the job crisis.

And, I see job listings scouting people with knowledge of html, php, SEO, PPC, Adobe CS and masking it with "paid intern" title and offering $12/hour in a city like San Francisco where the cost of living is insanely high.

by Anonymousreply 11301/18/2013

Dear idiot at R101,

The world has changed. No one is willing to lend the truly poor money to go to another country any longer.

In addition no one wants them. In fact we don't want the truly poor anymore.

Legal immigration requires a lawyer and fees up the butt, you have to earn a lot of money to afford to go to another country where the 'jobs' are.

Unless dear idiot you are willing to put up money for the poor to move, if so post your telephone and I will let the poor know who to call.

by Anonymousreply 11401/18/2013

Most of you are just whiners. I sacrificed to go to law school and worked hard to graduate with honors from a top tier school. I've worked hard for 37 years since. And I worked hard in school from elementary to college too -got a full academic scholarship to undergraduate, then went in the Army, and used the GI bill for law school.

It all involved hard work and sacrifice. And I run a very small law firm that struggles every payday to meet the payroll for everyone.

What do you think a national strike will accomplish? It won't increase wages. We are in a rut because of excessive spending by our government, taxes too high on corporations - why do you think California is in the tank fiscally and losing jobs and residents?

Unions have outlived their usefulness, and the job and economic growth is happening in right-to-work states. The facts are very obvious, so keep on in denial.

by Anonymousreply 11501/18/2013

[quote]I sacrificed to go to law school and worked hard

blah blah blah. Fucking prove it, cunty! every time I hear a blow-hard start that old saw I just KNOW there was a rich daddy behind their fucking ass every step of the way goading them.

by Anonymousreply 11601/18/2013

I left a good paying job with a corporation and survived (married) on the GI bill for law school, that I finished in 27 months.

by Anonymousreply 11701/18/2013

Crazy isn't it OP. But these are hard times.

by Anonymousreply 11801/18/2013

California job growth loses steam in December as payrolls shrink

January 18, 2013, 11:17 a.m.

After outpacing the U.S. for most of last year, California’s jobs engine lost momentum in December as employers' payrolls shrank by 17,500 last month.

The unemployment rate remained unchanged at 9.8% last month, according to figures released Friday by the state’s Employment Development Department.

The loss of payroll jobs in December ends seven months of job growth in the Golden State. For much of the year, yearly job growth was hovering around 2% but has now dropped to 1.6%.

Economists called the jobs report disappointing. Some said job losses last month might have been caused by employers to hold off on hiring as Washington grappled with the "fiscal cliff," when year-end tax increases and spending cuts were set to take place.

Congress later reached a deal on the 'fiscal cliff,' but not before hampering business confidence, economists said.

“I believe businesses were very worried about the 'fiscal cliff' issue,” said Esmael Adibi, director of Chapman University's A. Gary Anderson Center for Economic Research. “I think this report reflects that.”

Eight industries recorded job losses in December, but the steepest decline was in the trade, transportation and utilities sector. Led primarily by losses in retail trade, that industry shed 11,200 jobs. Professional and business services, which includes white-collar occupations such as accountants and lawyers, shed 8,800 jobs.

Construction, which has been aided by a recovering housing market, added 4,100 jobs last month. The sector, which saw employment grow 4.4% over the year, has seen a turnaround as demand for multi-unit housing has flourished.

Education and health services added 9,200 jobs in December.

Some economists, however, were skeptical of the sharp drop in payroll figures.

“It’s important not to overreact because of the possibility of revision,” said Lynn Reaser, chief economist at the Fermanian Business and Economic Institute at Point Loma Nazarene University. “The loss of momentum at the end of the year is a concern.”

The report, however, contained at least one bright spot.

The labor force grew by almost 73,000 as more people re-entered the workforce, a sign people are encouraged once again to look for work.

Friday’s report also showed that November’s job figures were revised upward to show a net gain of 6,100 jobs.

Since December 2011, the state has added 225,900 jobs to its payrolls, the second largest yearly increase in the country.

Still, California’s jobless rate is among the highest. Only two states have a higher jobless rate: Nevada and Rhode Island, where unemployment is at 10.2%.

by Anonymousreply 11901/18/2013

[quote]Focus instead on putting the best (and highest paid) teachers in poor schools. Right now, suburban public schools provide a great education because they serve upper middle class white and Asian students, and parents are willing to pay more in taxes for this education because they can afford to do so.

Poor naive litte R88. You think money is the reason kids in suburban schools are getting a better education? Think again. Intact families. Parents who give a damn and get involved. Kids who are required to eat three square meals, go to bed early and do their homework. Pressure to succeed. Expectation that college is not an option. Involvement in extracurricular activities, etc, etc, etc.

Schools can not parent children 24/7. They can only do so much. If kids are going home to a crack house at the end of the day, no amount of money invested in the school will make that kid a successful student. Expecting public schools to solve complex social problems is like putting a bandaid on a gaping wound.

Lots of money is thrown at inner city schools and many already have the highest paid teachers. All to no avail. Inner city teachers are paid a high wage because the job sucks and no one wants it: kids have no interest in learning, more time is spent on discipline than education, and it's dangerous.

by Anonymousreply 12001/18/2013

R120 please link to your source that confirms that kids in the inner cities have no interest in learning and/or that their parents have no interest in their kids getting a good education.

I'll wait.

by Anonymousreply 12101/19/2013

Oh and R120 why did you not answer the question about how you came up with your initial investment for your business?

by Anonymousreply 12201/19/2013

Another problem is the monopolies. There used to be laws against monopolies but those days are long past and it is easy to get around them.

A few days with no one to stock the Walmart shelves and food rotting in the trucks, companies might decided that their workers are valuable.

By the way R101, many people simply do not have an IQ high enough to do anything but menial labor...should they be treated like slaves? Should we pretend that clean floors are not important? Should window washers be paid nothing for their hard labor?

by Anonymousreply 12301/19/2013

What an annoying little gnat you are R122, chasing me around DL. LOL. Link to your sources indicating that all of society's ills can be resolved by paying inner city teachers more money.

Go ahead. I'll wait.

by Anonymousreply 12401/19/2013

Nice try, R124. You made the assertion--now back it up.

What? Silence? Thought so.

And BTW, I'm not chasing you, you were asked a question on *this* thread. So why so mum? You seem to have a lot to say otherwise.

More silence? Something to hide?

Still waiting.

by Anonymousreply 12501/19/2013

"... and masking it with "paid intern" title"

lol I've seen that too many times- intern, intern, intern... it means slave.

by Anonymousreply 12601/20/2013

We had a Rethuglican idiot on this board who understands little of how the world works. Move on you can't rehabilitate this idiot. He started a business he deserves slaves.

by Anonymousreply 12701/21/2013
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