Serving up this steaming pile of
Celebrity Gossip
Gay Politics
Gay News
and Pointless Bitchery
Since 1995

I just pulled out my lower back - OH I WANT TO DIE

SO MUCH PAIN. I bent down to pick something up, and my entire lower back seized up. I could hardly stand up. I sat down for awhile and finally rolled over and was able to hobble into a (vaguely) upright position. I took Aleve and it's doing nothing. OUCH. Help.

by Anonymousreply 7811/19/2014

I HATE lower back pain. I'm SO sorry, OP

by Anonymousreply 303/24/2012

Ice the first day, heat after that.

Long hot shower tomorrow

by Anonymousreply 1103/24/2012

I sympathize with you, OP. The only thing that works for me when I throw my back out is a Med-Rol pack. But as others have suggested, alternate ice and heat and rest.

by Anonymousreply 1303/24/2012

OP, I am so sorry but r1 made me laugh. I haven't slept in 18hours though.

Seriously, take the advice above. Ibuprofen for pain/muscle relaxation. Knees bent, lie flat, hard surface.

If it persists consider seeing a (registered) chiro or physio. I got a great recommendation from a friend for a chiro for my Mum because she could not bear the pain at that point. Two sessions - sorted.

by Anonymousreply 1403/24/2012

Lie on the floor and put you legs up on a chair (or bed) - it will alleviate the pain immediately and give you some relief. The doctor told me to do this when I did the same thing about five years ago.

by Anonymousreply 1603/24/2012

Fuck ibuprofen, gurl.

What you need is some VICODIN. Or PERCOCET.

Ask for it by name.

by Anonymousreply 1803/24/2012

Is it the same as a slipped disk? I had that, wanted to die because of the pain I was in.

Doc didn't give me meds and suggested what R7 said and to sleep with pillows under my knees, again to elevate my legs. Also to lie in a fetal position on my side. Told me to put boards under my matress for added support.

It's actually happened about twice now.

by Anonymousreply 2003/24/2012

OP, I know this is going to sound very weird, but have you been able to pee since this happened?

If you have felt like you need to pee and just can't get to the ER right away.

Most people think lack of bladder control with back injuries means you end up peeing yourself. The oposite is true. With a serious back injury notbeing able to go to the bathroom is a HUGE warning sign.

Also saddle numbness, of any kind.

Don't mess arround with this if you have these symptoms. I ignored them thinking it was just a bad back type thing. I'm in a wheelchair today with cauda equina syndrome.

by Anonymousreply 2103/24/2012

Poor OP, Im glad there are other eldergays here to give you so much advice.

by Anonymousreply 2303/24/2012

COLD! COLD is for accute pain, heat is for chronic. That's why you don't see football players with heat packs around their ankles on the field.

by Anonymousreply 2503/24/2012

naprox works better on this than ibu. Change the formula.

by Anonymousreply 2603/24/2012

this thread proves what huge drug addicts we have all become. Weed is not the problem. It's prescription pills and doctors are the dealers.

by Anonymousreply 2703/25/2012

Thank you, r27. Too true.

by Anonymousreply 2803/25/2012

The last two days I was also having back spasoms. There shoot pains every where. A few days ago I was having problems with my right leg but ok now. I'm only 45, it's not like I'm getting old..

by Anonymousreply 2903/25/2012

Your pain is not my pain, stop your belly aching!

by Anonymousreply 3103/25/2012

I can see this will quickly become a competition of who is enduring the most agony. Then someone is going to flagellate and crucify themself and win the top prize for most and longest suffering.

by Anonymousreply 3203/25/2012

[quote] Prescriptions for Poison - by Jay Hammers on April 9, 2011 - in Decline

[quote] Americans are being poisoned on a vast scale by toxins generated by corporations whose only goal is profit regardless of the consequences to humanity and its future. These corporations include but are not limited to pharmaceutical companies and the medical establishment, which thrive on treating illnesses with expensive toxic drugs rather than simple, natural treatments that wouldn’t turn a profit.

[quote] I stumbled upon all this after experiencing side effects from Ciprofloxacin, a fluoroquinolone antibiotic that is highly toxic to human tissue yet still prescribed like candy by doctors. My side effects have been mild so far (aching joints and muscles, primarily) but were significant enough to drive me to stop taking the drug after three days and to research the treatments for exposure to fluoroquinolones, including Cipro, Levaquin, Floxin, Avelox, and others.

by Anonymousreply 3303/25/2012

I quickly learned not to blindly trust doctors regarding my health, and when in doubt, to do my own research. I also learned that the FDA is funded largely by pharmaceutical companies and thus has a glaring conflict of interest, which is why the fluoroquinolone antibiotics have not been pulled from the market despite the debilitating side effects. The FDA had to be sued just to issue a black box warning regarding only one of the potential side effects of the FQs, tendon damage and rupture. The black box warning is only visible to doctors, who largely ignore it. Patients who are prescribed the drug are rarely warned of the dangers.

The adverse effects of fluoroquinolones include chronic fatigue, tendonitis/tendinopathy, tendon rupture, joint pain, muscle weakness/soreness/fibromyalgia, peripheral neuropathy, muscle spasms, popping/cracking joints, endurance problems, tinnitus (ringing in the ears), heart palpitations, anxiety attacks, brain fog, depersonalization, memory loss, difficulty finding the right word at times, seizures, buzzing/tingling/vibratory sensations, dry eyes/mouth/sinuses, numbness (especially at night), floaters/blank spots in field of vision, depression, and death.

The worst part about the symptoms of fluoroquinolones is that they are not temporary. FQs can cause chronic mental and physical pain and disability. They can ruin lives, and the longer you are exposed to them, the more likely you will suffer these “side effects.” These chronic ailments are not often connected with the use of fluoroquinolones because doctors often rely on drug reps (salesmen) for their information rather than examining the readily available literature on the drugs they prescribe, such as the Physician’s Desk Reference, regarding side effects and contraindications. Patients are rarely given informed consent about the dangers of these drugs.

by Anonymousreply 3403/25/2012

Ciprofloxacin is routely subscribed for urinary tract infections, which affect women about ten times more often than men, even though there are far safer alternatives than Cipro. Lo and behold, fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue syndrome affect women about ten times more often than men, too, and these illnesses just happened to sprout up all over the place shortly after fluoroquinolone use became widespread.

Fluoroquinolones are also routinely prescribed for a variety of off-label indications such as suspected sinus infections or prostate infections. These antibiotics are extremely dangerous toxins that may cause symptoms of severe fluoride poisoning quickly in perfectly healthy individuals. Sometimes they are even given to children or in combination with NSAIDs such as Ibuprofin, which increase the dangers.

Many of the illnesses we see today, such as cancer, were exceedingly rare only 100 years ago. However, toxins introduced into our environment by industry now circulate in our bloodstreams and reside in our tissues. Combined with irresponsible agricultural practices that have robbed vital minerals such as boron from the produce we buy from the supermarket, these toxins have contributed to many chronic diseases of the heart, body, and mind. It is true that we live longer today and are more likely to be afflicted by cancer as we age, but it’s also true that we are exposed to far more toxins in our environment than ever before, including carcinogens and female hormone mimickers (including BPA and unfermented soy such as tofu or soy milk) which not only increase the chance of cancer, but feminize boys and lead to early puberty for girls.

by Anonymousreply 3503/25/2012

The government’s fluoridation of many communities’ water supply has exacerbated our insufficient intake of iodine and is suspected as a major contributor to fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, thyroid problems, cancer, and various neurological pathologies. Aluminum, teflon (fluoride based), mercury, and other contaminants in the food we eat, the cookware we use, and our unnecessary dental fillings may lead to chronic diseases such as Alzheimer’s and cardiovascular disease. Yet the government continues to allow us to be poisoned and devotes no effort to investigating the ill effects of these contaminants, even though research has shown their detrimental effects.

Doctors continue to ignore natural, diet and supplement-based strategies to combat illness, instead relying on poisonous substances to treat the symptoms of disease rather than the underlying causes, because natural diets and lifestyle changes are not profitable. One-third of pharmaceuticals contain fluoride, which is toxic to every cell in the body, is not an essential nutrient, and was shown in at least one study to lower the IQ of children. Fluoride allows chemicals to penetrate human cells more easily and even helps aluminum contaminants penetrate the blood-brain barrier.

The typical American diet provides a breeding ground for fluoride-based drugs to do their damage: we ingest copious amounts of the toxic halides fluorine, chlorine, and bromine in our food and water while subsisting on a diet low in the essential nutrient iodine, which competes against these toxins in the thyroid and other tissues. The FDA’s recommended daily intake of iodine is several magnitudes too low for thyroid sufficiency, especially in an environment where most fluids we drink contain added fluoride and most breads and flour contain added bromine. Neither the government nor the medical establishment is willing to recognize or honestly investigate the disastrous effects these toxins and general poor nutrition are having on us. It will be up to us as individuals and small communities to educate and protect ourselves and our families from the physical and mental horrors resulting from fluoride, fluorine-based drugs, and other toxins the establishment callously subjects us to.

by Anonymousreply 3603/25/2012

If you or a family member suffers from symptoms of fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue syndrome, or an autoimmune disease, I’d urge you to check their medical history for use of quinolone antibiotics. Cipro, Levaquin, Floxin, and Avelox are common examples but there are others, though many have been removed from the market due to the dangers. And please never let a doctor give these drugs to you or your loved ones, especially children. There are almost always safer alternatives.

Limiting one’s fluoride exposure (from drugs, fluoridated water, toothpaste, and processed drinks) is important to overall health, but fluoride and fluorinated drugs such as the fluoroquinolones, Prozac, and Paxil are just the tip of this iceberg. The truth is that pretty much everything you can buy at the supermarket may be contaminated with various toxins. Organic and locally grown foods are usually safer. Still, it is quite difficult to limit one’s exposure to harmful substances.

Dr. Joseph Mercola runs a website exposing much of the dangers of common foods and products. He is a businessman, too, so take his advice with a grain of salt. Always do your own research. He does have an excellent article on the fluoroquinolones and the failure of the FDA I urge you to read.

I am actually thankful for my exposure to Cipro for two reasons. First, I was able to prevent my mother from taking a prescription of Cipro which I am certain would have led her to experience chronic joint pain for the rest of her life, if not worse. Second, I am now motivated to protect myself and my loved ones as much as possible from dangerous chemicals which prevent people from reaching their full potential by stunting their growth, lowering their IQs, and leading them to an early death.

by Anonymousreply 3703/25/2012

I’ll leave you with a video of Bob Grozier, who lost his wife and his daughter, nearly died, and now suffers from debilitating physical and mental side effects from the combination of Cipro and Vioxx, a dangerous NSAID. It is important to note that fluoroquinolones can do their damage alone, even without the combination of NSAIDs.

I warn you, this video is extremely disturbing. And I’ve seen some pretty disturbing stuff.

Bog Groz under the painful influence of Cipro and Vioxx at 9:20 in the video:

I can’t live, I can’t live. Oh Jesus take me home, take me home, take me home Lord, take me home.

Jay Hammers is a member of the Fluoroquinolone Antibiotic Toxicity group on Facebook, amongst other things.

Originally published at The Spearhead on June 10, 2010.

by Anonymousreply 3803/25/2012

Its in the mind. Look up and read Dr. Sarno

by Anonymousreply 4003/25/2012

Rolfing

by Anonymousreply 4103/25/2012

I read Dr. Sarno, R40. It made really interesting toilet paper when the problems came back.

by Anonymousreply 4203/25/2012

U go 2 the ER and they will think U are just tryin' to get drugs. "Gimme drugs, gimme drugs, gimme drugs" to get high.

by Anonymousreply 4303/25/2012

What you need, OP, is some surprise anal.

by Anonymousreply 4403/25/2012

Do you have any Valium? That will help relax the muscles. Also, although it might hurt at first, walking around does help eventually because your muscles begin to think everything is back to normal. They seized up to protect your spine.

by Anonymousreply 4503/25/2012

Weird thread.

by Anonymousreply 4603/25/2012

[quote] Weed is not the problem. It's prescription pills and doctors are the dealers.

Hello? If we could get weed, we might use it instead of using painkillers when we are in pain. If we could smoke a joint instead and it would take the pain away, we'd do it.

Not everyone has a dealer, nor does everyone grow weed in their backyard or basement.

If the helicopters overhead don't spot your outdoor weed, the electric company will notify police that you are using too much electricity 24/7 for growing pot in your basement.

In my area, helicopters actually do go out in summer looking for pot plants.

I am so sick of this country's puritanical attitude towards recreational drugs like pot and painkillers/muscle relaxants for people who need them.

EVERY civilization has had some kind of plant-based pharmaceutical product (or psychedelic toad they licked) for relaxation and had drugs/herbs they used for painkilling purposes. But in America, the puritans have to freak out because SOMEBODY is doing something they don't like.

I have chronic pain because I worked. my. ass. off. in a physically demanding job for 20 years. Now people are screeching because some soft-ass Hollywood stars are taking too many Xanax and Percocet. Too fucking bad. Let them die -- it's their choice. The rest of us know to take our drugs only when we need them and we DON'T need some fitness freaks who never worked a difficult day in their lives having conniptions over doctors writing prescriptions for people who are in pain.

If pot was legal, maybe there wouldn't be people robbing pharmacies. If there was a national drug registry for people who need to take pain medication every day, I'd gladly sign it when I pick up my prescription. Instead, there is an insane overreaction to the use of painkillers nowadays and it is going to adversely effect people who need pain medication because OTHER PEOPLE DON'T need pain medication, and they want to feel superior to those who do.

And because a handful of assholes abuse drugs. People. will. always. find. something. to abuse.

Fuck off and die, every last one of you who considers a doctor who writes pain prescriptions a "dealer." Give up your stash of weed to the people whose prescriptions you'd like to destroy.

by Anonymousreply 4703/25/2012

The crazies have come out to play.

by Anonymousreply 4803/25/2012

So what did OP do, or did OP die?

by Anonymousreply 4903/25/2012

this man and his exercises saved our life - we were dying from lower back pain and since using his method have no more problems

by Anonymousreply 5003/25/2012

It saddens us that r51 has such a miserable life.

by Anonymousreply 5203/25/2012

I feel really bad for you...hope you get some good advice. Don't let a surgeon talk you into surgery.

by Anonymousreply 5303/25/2012

I'm on Valium and using a heated pad. Thanks for the advice people.

by Anonymousreply 5403/25/2012

R30, get over your fear and get well. Spines do heal, no matter what your damn doctor tells you.

by Anonymousreply 5503/25/2012

Naprox. I had what you have. I couldn't walk, Ibu does nothing for that according to my physicians. NAPROX higher doses work. I started walking again after that.

by Anonymousreply 5603/25/2012

Lose some weight tubbo.

by Anonymousreply 5703/25/2012

Oh yeah, OP? Try living in MY panties!

by Anonymousreply 5803/25/2012

Careful with the Naprox. I know a 20 year old who is currently in the hospital after losing massive amounts of blood because of Naprox.

by Anonymousreply 5903/25/2012

Did it come from the opening between her legs, R59?

by Anonymousreply 6003/25/2012

It's a he, R60. It came from a previously undiagnosed ulcer.

by Anonymousreply 6103/25/2012

What exactly does "pulled my back out" mean?

I had something until a few days ago. For a month it felt like somebody had punched me in the right kidney. But I had an intuition that it was involving bones. Couldn't bend sideways. Pulling up my jeans would create a spasm.

I kept massaging my own back. Laying on my back on a firm floor, hot showers. I had one day at work where I had to walk all day long and went home to bed exhausted. The next day the pain was gone.

by Anonymousreply 6203/27/2012

OP, I truly feel your pain. Few things are more painful than back pain. Went through this in 2000 and thank god it has never happened again. All I did was bend over to make my bend and I experienced the most excruciating pain I have ever known. The only reason I moved at all that day was because I refused to pee in bed.

It didn't go away and after a few days a friend with a similar experience sent me to her back/orthopedic doctor/surgeon who diagnosed the problem immediately. One of my discs was leaking the stuff from inside and he drew a diagram of it to show me - it's a toothpaste-like substance. And it was leaking to one side.

Anyway, he gave me hydrocodone, flexeril, and a week regimen of a steroid. The pills made me sleepy and edgy but they really relieved the pain. I couldn't take the pain killer for more than about 2 weeks since I hated the feeling.

My gait was affected and I essentially had a bit of a limp for a few months. The surgeon sent me to a physical therapist and I had maybe 5 or 6 sessions with him. I only saw the surgeon twice IIRC. I got exercises to do and advice on how to prevent it. The exercises were designed based on the side of the leak or something like that.

I was also told to NOT SIT for months. LOL! Like I could do that. I just laughed at them and asked how was I supposed to drive or go to the toilet? But I did avoid sitting at my desk or computer and tried to do desk work standing up. I could lie down at a shallow angle.

I tried to faithfully do my exercises (there were only three of them but still I fell off). Part of why this happened was that I had been spending too much time on a computer sitting and I was overweight by quite a bit. This has never repeated itself - knock on wood - and for years I carried my leftover hydrocodone pills with me wherever I went in case it reoccurred away from home.

I don't know what your insurance or financial situation is, OP, but you should go to a doctor. I think it qualifies as an emergency.

Good luck. With the right drugs this too shall pass.

by Anonymousreply 6303/27/2012

[quote]OP, I truly feel your pain. Few things are more painful than back pain. Went through this in 2000 and thank god it has never happened again. All I did was bend over to make my bend and I experienced the most excruciating pain I have ever known. The only reason I moved at all that day was because I refused to pee in bed.

It didn't go away and after a few days a friend with a similar experience sent me to her back/orthopedic doctor/surgeon who diagnosed the problem immediately. One of my discs was leaking the stuff from inside and he drew a diagram of it to show me - it's a toothpaste-like substance. And it was leaking to one side.

Anyway, he gave me hydrocodone, flexeril, and a week regimen of a steroid. The pills made me sleepy and edgy but they really relieved the pain. I couldn't take the pain killer for more than about 2 weeks since I hated the feeling.

My gait was affected and I essentially had a bit of a limp for a few months. The surgeon sent me to a physical therapist and I had maybe 5 or 6 sessions with him. I only saw the surgeon twice IIRC. I got exercises to do and advice on how to prevent it. The exercises were designed based on the side of the leak or something like that.

I was also told to NOT SIT for months. LOL! Like I could do that. I just laughed at them and asked how was I supposed to drive or go to the toilet? But I did avoid sitting at my desk or computer and tried to do desk work standing up. I could lie down at a shallow angle.

I tried to faithfully do my exercises (there were only three of them but still I fell off). Part of why this happened was that I had been spending too much time on a computer sitting and I was overweight by quite a bit. This has never repeated itself - knock on wood - and for years I carried my leftover hydrocodone pills with me wherever I went in case it reoccurred away from home.

I don't know what your insurance or financial situation is, OP, but you should go to a doctor. I think it qualifies as an emergency.

Good luck. With the right drugs this too shall pass.

R63 loves sucking fat black cocks!

by Anonymousreply 6403/28/2012

.

by Anonymousreply 6504/15/2012

I am currently experiencing this lower back pain again for the 2nd time this year. This one would be probably the dozenth time. I fixing to go see a chiropractor. Very lower back pain so painful that the pulse of your heart cause sharp throbs, plus my nerves seem to be pinching because random jerks occur. my legs, mostly down to my knees acke like hell and when i try to stand up in a up right position my lower back is arched way in and it feels like someone is hanging on my shoulders in the front of me pulling me down. Im stuck walking around arched, nearly bent over. The problem I am having is at this point its unbearable. Each and every time this happens it last longer and longer and even more painful as well. When I was like 14-15 years old I remember being in school, walking down a hall way when someone shouted my name behind me. I turned my upper half of my body to take a glance who it was. Once I turned I was frozen my back had seize up completely. I went to a chiropractor that day and they did a x-ray. Which showed that my lower spine was completely shifted to my right side. It took 2 weeks to recover to be moving good again. I haven't had a xray on my spine since but I think its time. When I was 18 I had picked up a 3.8L V6 from a Ford T-Bird and loaded it up on a trailer and off it. I was down for the count for week or more then as well. I know I did some damage then but being a above average built male I am always pushing my limits. Another time I unhithced a trailer from my vehicle heavily loaded with books. I was on a slight hill and the trailer tried rolling into my vehicle. I did something to cause my back to seize up and I was frozen holding that trailer until 15 minutes later someone heard me shouting for assistance. I belive I have a very harsh road ahead of mean for back pain. I am only 22 Years old with 2 young children to keep up with. So those of you new to lower back pain. TAKE IT EASY OR YOU'LL BE DEALING WITH PAIN LIKE ME. My wife tells me. ' My lower back pain labor is worse then what your dealing with ' . Sometimes I dont think she really understands what this pain is like. Labor is for brief hours sometimes up to a few days. This has been going on periodically for YEARS. haha.

by Anonymousreply 6608/01/2012

Do like Roseanna did on her show. Get a breast reduction.

by Anonymousreply 6708/01/2012

OP, do not lie on the floor. Not when this first happens. You've done "something" to your vertebrae and or your joints, and the muscles, to "protect" them, have seized up. Spasmed.

You need moist heat, and to lay on your side with knees bent for about 30 minutes. Then slowly get up and walk around. Walking is good, standing in one place is not. YOu have to walk around or you'll stiffen up and make it worse. Sitting is not good unless you can put your feet up and sit on your side.

The exercise my PT recommended, is one where you are lying flat in bed or on a couch, on your back,you draw both knees up, wrap your arms around the insides in back of the knees and pull them to your chest.

This gently stretches and strengthens your back muscles. Then, holding one bent knee in place, slowly straighten out the other one, rinse, repeat. This exercise is gentle and will help you, but don't attempt it until a few days have passed.The moist heat you should apply several times a day.

Take as much advil as you can stand, too.

at a and this you should not do when the problem first begins, but perhaps in a day or two,

by Anonymousreply 6808/01/2012

i understand i have been there am there now, god bless u. i want to ask what the hell is wrong with people? i have read some of the nastiest replies on here, r u people adults? this is ridiculous, make a website of your on to trash people, leave the people in pain alone!!!!!!!!

by Anonymousreply 6909/29/2012

R69, out of curiosity, how did you find your way to DL? (That's this website, btw)

by Anonymousreply 7009/29/2012

I had a lot of back pain some years ago, one time I couldn't get out of bed and another time I hat to lay down on a street bench downtown with everyone staring at me! Dreadful pain, the only solution is not moving and take a strong muscle relaxant. After I started practicing yoga, which I do for 9 years now, my back improved dramatically. It is a slow process, as all things oriental. I stil have some pain from time to time, but it is rare now.

by Anonymousreply 7111/28/2012

I do it a lot I understand what your going through, it's agony! There's only one thing that will work. Tramadol - extremely powerful painkiller, and along with it, another tablet called - diclofenic .... It's an anti-inflammatory. Lye flat on your back and don't move, let them take effect, you will be amazed at how much better you will feel. Rest rest rest u til better, and keep taking those tablets until u can walk again. I have found that my back goes every time after I've had a hot shower, then bend down. So try not to do that in my experience.

by Anonymousreply 7211/19/2014

I know you don't want to take fluids because getting up to go to the bathroom is torture, but making sure you are properly hydrated always helps pain (though not too much fluid. No more than 64 oz. in a day, less if you are small).

by Anonymousreply 7311/19/2014

Like earlier posters have stated, I also vouch for the stretch where you lie in the floor, with your thighs resting on a bed (or couch). Then scootch-up so that your butt is against the vertical edge of the bed. Then bring your knees to your chest. Move your feet to place them flat on the vertical edge of the bed, above where your butt abuts the bed. This will stretch-out your lower back. It is very painful, but in a good way.

As a bonus, when you've got your feet wedged against the vertical edge of the bed, with your butt on the floor, right up against the edge of the bed, try throwing your arms above your head, onto the floor above your head. This REALLY stretches the lower back. It's so painful, but it does the job.

by Anonymousreply 7411/19/2014

Don't die, OP! Fellow sufferers, unite!

Take a warm bath. Bring a magazine or turn on your bathroom TV, and don't rush it.

Yes, I have a TV in my bathroom. I have back problems. I refurbished my bathroom at one time with an extra long tub, so that I could take a bath when I was on my last nerve.

by Anonymousreply 7511/19/2014

Hot shower, hot bath

by Anonymousreply 7611/19/2014

[quote] went to a chiropractor that day and they did a x-ray. Which showed that my lower spine was completely shifted to my right side

Lol

Chiropractors are such lying shits.

by Anonymousreply 7711/19/2014

I've had back pain from work injuries for 20 years.

Shit happens

Good days, bad days

Wet heat is your friend

It always calms down eventually. It either goes away completely or you will have chronic pain like I have, with occasionally acute episodes.

The world won't end.

by Anonymousreply 7811/19/2014
Loading
Need more help? Click Here.