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KONY 2012 - Has anyone been watching media coverage of this now viral video?

From CNN to MSNBC and the NY Times, the media seems to be telling people to temper their reaction to the 27 minute documentary calling for a worldwide manhunt/awareness campaign for the leader of this outlaw militia.

Sam Childers who the movie Machine Gun Preacher was based on was just on CNN talking about how complex this issue is and that it isn't really Kony anyone should be going after, it's the African president who's empowered him.

So, is the KONY 2012 campaign legit, or just a tactic to increase funding for the charity Invisible Children? What do you think?

by Anonymousreply 14910/08/2012

I don't quite get it. The charity spends way less on overhead than Komen Foundation....

by Anonymousreply 103/09/2012

Let's keep this DL: MSNBC had the director of the film last night. Hot! Possibly gay.

by Anonymousreply 203/09/2012

P.S. He said they are not doing any fundraising.

by Anonymousreply 303/09/2012

I have heard that Kony has not been in Uganda for years. Also, there is criticism that this video has fostered the condescending notion that Western intervention must rescue infantile Africans.

by Anonymousreply 403/09/2012

I've read some things about Invisible Children and how a great deal, if not most of their money is put into this sort of marketing which they justify as being for awareness. I don't want to judge them yet however until I know more about them.

R3 - I think he's married because the video indicates he has a wife. He was int he delivery room when his son was born.

His son is absolutely one of the most adorable little kids I've ever seen in my life. The dad however seems just a wee bit self precious.

by Anonymousreply 503/09/2012

But several observers are urging caution, saying that Invisible Children has manipulated facts in the past and advised viewers to watch the documentary with that in mind.

Others warned that calling for military campaigns against Kony would only bring more harm to the LRA's victims.

A student blog called "Visible Children" linked to a photograph of Invisible Children's founders -- Bobby Bailey, Laren Poole, and Jason Russell -- posing with hardcore weaponry with members of the Sudan People's Liberation Army (SPLA), who have battled the LRA.

"The group is in favor of direct military intervention, and their money supports the Ugandan government's army and various other military forces," the Visible Children blog post said. "Both the Ugandan army and Sudan People's Liberation Army are riddled with accusations of rape and looting, but Invisible Children defends them."

Bloggers debated the merit of arming one group to fight another and questioned why only about 30% of Invisible Children's budget was used to help children in Uganda.

"We're an unorthodox organization," Russell told CNN. "We work outside of the traditional box of what you think about charity and nonprofit."

He said a third of fund-raising dollars were spent on the film, another third on film-related advocacy and the rest on a mission to end the war and rehabilitate war-affected children.

"So that's our model," he said. "That's who we are. We're not World Vision. We are not these other organizations that do amazing work on the ground. If you want to fund a cow or you want to help someone in a village in that component, you can do that. That's a third of what we do."

On its website, Invisible Children said it spent 80.46% on programs in 2011; 16.24% on administration and management costs; and 3.22% on direct fundraising.

"KONY 2012" skyrocketed to popularity on YouTube propelled by thousands of posts on Twitter and Facebook, especially by celebrities.

Invisible Children sent Twitter messages about the documentary to 20 celebrities, including Bono, Angelina Jolie, Jay Z, Ryan Seacrest and Rihanna. Many of the tweets about the film appear to be from fans who follow those celebrities.

Invisible Children spokeswoman Noelle Jouglet told CNN that any money generated from the film will go to Invisible Children, which builds schools in Uganda. Money will also go to support a high-frequency radio station that Invisible Children operates, which broadcasts anti-LRA messages to fighters urging them to defect. CNN is unable to immediately verify this information or any of Invisible Children's activities in the Congo.

"The celebrity strategy is simply, you have a voice," Russell said. "Some people have a larger voice than others. We're not obsessed with celebrities. We're not celebrities ourselves. We're human beings. That is what this is about."

Over the past decade, Invisible Children has been one of the most influential advocacy groups, putting pressure on the George W. Bush and Obama administrations, imploring the U.S. government to take a side in the fight between the LRA and the Ugandan government, according to a November 11 article in Foreign Affairs, a publication by the nonpartisan Council on Foreign Relations.

It said Invisible Children and other advocacy groups "have manipulated facts for strategic purposes, exaggerating the scale of LRA abductions and murders and emphasizing the LRA's use of innocent children as soldiers."

"They rarely refer to the Ugandan atrocities or those of Sudan's People's Liberation Army, such as attacks against civilians or looting of civilian homes and businesses, or the complicated regional politics fueling the conflict."

Invisible Children addressed the criticisms on its website, saying it simplified a complex crisis.

"KONY 2012 portrays, in no uncertain terms, the image of a madman who manipulates children spiritually for his own tactical gains," it said.

"In our quest to garner wide public support of nuanced policy, Invisible Children has sought to explain the conflict in an easily understandable format, focusing on the core attributes of LRA leadership that infringe upon the most basic of human rights. In a 30-minute film, however, many nuances of the 26-year conflict are admittedly lost or overlooked. The film is a first entry point to this conflict for many."

by Anonymousreply 603/09/2012

NOT good if true.

by Anonymousreply 703/09/2012

He definitely pings. And this connection to Liberty University is troubling, imo....

by Anonymousreply 803/09/2012

They're way too cozy with the current Ugandan government, which isn't much better than the LRA.

by Anonymousreply 903/09/2012

I couldn't get beyond the first 10 minutes, I felt so bored and manipulated.

by Anonymousreply 1003/09/2012

r7, as a Christian, I have no problem with it being a Christian org (I am enthusiastic about that aspect), but I hope it operates with integrity, transparency, and is not inappropriately cozy with the Ugandan and Sudanese governments, which have committed their own atrocities. Moreover, I hope they have not slanted the facts to portray this matter too simplisticly.

by Anonymousreply 1103/09/2012

Not all charities fund programs or give money out. Many nonprofits like this are all about raising awareness or advocacy. That can be a valuable endeavor. So complaining about that is not how you judge an organization's effectiveness.

Also if the organization's biggest asset is its director who is also their biggest advocate then his/her salary, while most likely grouped with administrative costs, is really mostly program related.

Similarly if a charity is educational and employs teachers then sometimes those teacher salaries are labeled staff rather than services provided. But in reality the organization's staff/administration IS the service/program.

Stop thinking in knee jerk ways.

Joseph Kony is one of the most evil humans on this planet. I have no problem using a small amount of our military resources including personnel to help find him and arrest him. There is ceratinly precedent for utilizing our military for humanitarian purposes. And, yes, sometimes humanitarian purposes includes force. Deal with it. It's the reality of the world we live in.

by Anonymousreply 1203/09/2012

Another specialist in the region was on CNN last night saying they thought Invisible Children are being careless and will be having legions of young people, college kids, etc.. setting off to rescue children and possibly either funneling money to organizations or efforts which are less than honest or potentially putting themselves at physical risk somehow.

I hope the intentions behind this were pure but everything I'm reading and hearing about this, this Kony asshole isn't even in Uganda anymore and there are legitimate organizations that have been on the ground rescuing these kids over the last decade or so.

by Anonymousreply 1303/09/2012

r11 - Why are you "enthusiastic" about that aspect? Considering some twisted evangelical Christian thinking is behind Uganda's persecution of gays, that's an especially vapid & ridiculous statement for you to make.

by Anonymousreply 1403/09/2012

r14, because I believe all Christians have a duty to share the love and truth of Christ with all people. Part of loving Jesus is serving people, and it seems this group at least is doing that. Until you can show how this group is involved with anti-gay legislation, there is no reason to make the large logical leap that this group has anything to do with that. The fact is the overwhelming majority of Christian groups are not involved in such activities, so why would I assume this group is. Moreover, I am mature enough to distinguish, recognize that Christians are very diverse.

by Anonymousreply 1603/09/2012

r15 - It's important if, among other things, this group is misrepresenting itself as secular when it has a hidden evangelical agenda.

by Anonymousreply 1703/09/2012

There's another Kony 2012 thread; I linked a bunch of stuff there which shows that this is just a bullshit organization and probably propaganda. Oil was discovered recently in northern Uganda.

Uganda is peaceful now, they don't need the help. Kony hasn't been active for a couple of years and this video is really pissing Ugandans off right now. Not just the "soft bigotry" of the video, as The Atlantic put it, but also because this organization wants fucking military intervention and the Ugandans don't want that at all.

The organization has been active on college campuses for a few years. They're really focusing on younger people, hence the viral video. Smart move. Armchair activism makes people actually feel like they're doing something useful, when all they're doing is making a bunch of Christians wealthy.

Anyway, I'll go dig up all those links. Read 'em and learn, so as to make an informed decision about this organization.

by Anonymousreply 1803/09/2012

[quote]Joseph Kony is one of the most evil humans on this planet. I have no problem using a small amount of our military resources including personnel to help find him and arrest him. There is ceratinly precedent for utilizing our military for humanitarian purposes. And, yes, sometimes humanitarian purposes includes force. Deal with it. It's the reality of the world we live in.

Wow. Someone drank the Kool-Aid.

by Anonymousreply 1903/09/2012

Re: the Christian thing -- if you go the Invisible Children site, you'll note that there is a fundie Christian on its board of directors.

by Anonymousreply 2003/09/2012

The Soft Bigotry of Kony 2012

by Anonymousreply 2103/09/2012

Visible Children Tumblr

by Anonymousreply 2203/09/2012

Large oil field discovered in northern Uganda.

Wouldn't be surprised if Invisible Children is covertly funded by a corporate interest.

by Anonymousreply 2303/09/2012

Article from 2006, The Visible Problem with Invisible Children.

by Anonymousreply 2403/09/2012

The Daily What's post about Kony 2012.

by Anonymousreply 2503/09/2012

Yes, I'd really love to fork over some of my money to a shady "charity" with strong fundie ties who are in cahoots with a government trying to instate death penalty for gay people in their country. Sure, where do I send my check?

by Anonymousreply 2603/09/2012

Proselytizing is sick. And, quite frankly, immoral.

by Anonymousreply 2703/09/2012

Of course WE owe them reparations for SLAVERY... because they treat each other so well....

by Anonymousreply 2803/09/2012

If the money doesn't get taken by the charity it will by the African officials. African officials have an extensive track record of taking charity money, food, clothes and other resources for themselves. African should do for themselves instead of looking to white people to take responsibility.

by Anonymousreply 2903/09/2012

There's obviously good reason to be wary of this group. It's been a weird viral Facebook experiment, that's for sure.

by Anonymousreply 3003/09/2012

" The organization behind Kony 2012 — Invisible Children Inc. — is an extremely shady nonprofit that has been called ”misleading,” “naive,” and “dangerous” by a Yale political science professor, and has been accused by Foreign Affairs of “manipulat[ing] facts for strategic purposes.” They have also been criticized by the Better Business Bureau for refusing to provide information necessary to determine if IC meets the Bureau’s standards.

Additionally, IC has a low two-star rating in accountability from Charity Navigator because they won’t let their financials be independently audited. That’s not a good thing. In fact, it’s a very bad thing, and should make you immediately pause and reflect on where the money you’re sending them is going. "

by Anonymousreply 3103/09/2012

Mia Farrow was just on CNN, making this cause her own.

Mia Farrow is the Gloria Allred of social causes.

by Anonymousreply 3203/09/2012

And what was her take? Pro or con "Invisible Children"?

by Anonymousreply 3303/09/2012

You don't need to drink Kool Aid to know that the ICC indicted Kony years ago and he needs to be arrested and tried. So this is not just a local issue. Not anymore than the Nuremburg trials were a local issue. Crimes against humanity are everyone's business.

If this group isn't raising money then why would they need to share their books except with the IRS. Of course, if they are soliciting donations from the public then they should.

I don't remember the video advocating that people just go to Uganda. I remember it was about raising awareness and lobbying Congress to continue the assistance in finding and arresting Kony. If young people want to be idiots and put themselves in harm's way then what are you gonna do?

I'll check out the links of the critics.

by Anonymousreply 3403/09/2012

Hipster Charity Alert!!

Hipster Charity Alert!!

by Anonymousreply 3503/09/2012

I'm actually tired of hearing about it. Starting to get on my nerves now, with all this media coverage bombarding you.

by Anonymousreply 3603/09/2012

Yes! We MUST save the little, helpless, feeble, Africans!!!

by Anonymousreply 3703/09/2012

The world is shit. This we know. I'm sorry for the world - I wish I could fix it all. Unfortunately, I have to focus on my immediate family and friends at this point. Thus, fuck Kony and all this viral video bullshit. I'd like to prevent the Holocaust, but I can't. I'd like to cure cancer, but I can't. I can't help the Ugandans - I'm very sorry, but it is what it is.

by Anonymousreply 3803/09/2012

Jason Russell,the film director, has issues that have NOTHING to do with this one. It's apparent with each succeeding interview-his ego proceeds him.I fear for HIS children,knowing myself personally what it's like having been raised by white men trying to save the world and SO getting off on their mission the whole time leaving NO time for much of anything else like,for instance,self reflection and inquiry. It's just another drug and means to escape into another world far from where their hurt lies.

by Anonymousreply 3903/09/2012

I LURVE this... "Sick of all the Kony bullshit being spammed everywhere ? I fucken well am. By IC’s own admission, only 31% of all the funds they receive go toward actually helping anyone. The rest go to line the pockets of the three people in charge of the organization, to pay for their travel expenses (over $1 million in the last year alone) and to fund their filmmaking business (also over a million) — which is quite an effective way to make more money, as clearly illustrated by the fact that so many can’t seem to stop forwarding their well-engineered emotional blackmail to everyone they’ve ever known."

by Anonymousreply 4003/09/2012

Entertainment Lawyer posted that one of the founders of Invisible Children uses charity money to pay his mistresses.

by Anonymousreply 4103/09/2012

Sadly I think all the scorn here may be, at least in part deserved. CNN, MSNBC, ABC News and the NYTimes have all run pieces in the last 48 hours about this organization not being entirely what it seems to be.

How sad.

by Anonymousreply 4203/09/2012

Sick of the Kony bs & this faux charity "Invisible Children".

by Anonymousreply 4303/09/2012

I am wary of Great White hope solutions. The West messed up and exploits Africa. We are not morally superior in most cases.

by Anonymousreply 4403/09/2012

Jason was on Ann Currie's show today. He seems very gay. And very defensive.

by Anonymousreply 4503/09/2012

Yes,defensive and like a child with a new toy.

by Anonymousreply 4603/09/2012

so who is the real father of that kid he is tossing up and around as his, since he clearly is a penis lover and not a vagine afficianado?

by Anonymousreply 4703/09/2012

[quote}"The celebrity strategy is simply, you have a voice," Russell said. "Some people have a larger voice than others. We're not obsessed with celebrities.[/quote]

Oh bs. You ARE obsessed with celebs.

by Anonymousreply 4803/09/2012

Jason pings even in his narrative in the video. Cookie-smelling voice if I ever heard one.

[quote]I am wary of Great White hope solutions. The West messed up and exploits Africa. We are not morally superior in most cases.

The sick thing is, there are hundreds of Ugandan blogs, Tumblrs, YouTube channels, grassroots organizations and podcasts, most of which are at least offered in English, that are vehemently saying they don't want military help at all, and that if foreigners want to help, they should lend aid to the grassroots efforts in the country by its own people to improve healthcare, education and infrastructure.

In the face of that, and the fact that only one non-politician Ugandan was featured in the IC Kony video, it becomes blatantly obvious how self-serving it all is on IC's part.

by Anonymousreply 4903/09/2012

r50 you must be the fundy on the thread.

I am posting r7 's link again, this group IC is a fundy group and DISGUSTING!

by Anonymousreply 5103/09/2012

R50, how on earth is R7 trolling when all he did was provide a link to an Alternet article which clearly shows that the IC org is a fundie Christian org. Are you an offended Christian?

by Anonymousreply 5203/09/2012

[quote] vehemently saying they don't want military help at all,

The military assistance consists of training the Uganda forces how to track Kony and arrest him. If Uganda is not going to arrest him or make the attempt then international forces will. As I said upthread, Kony is a wanted man and needs to be tried. I hope to god the govt is not being bribed to shield him.

I don't care about this guy who did the video but I do care about Kony and seeing justice done for all the children and others this man has subjected to the horrors of his child armies.

It almost seems as if there's a Kony PR team at work here. And Uganda is getting help. This is not in lieu of that.

by Anonymousreply 5303/09/2012

Now girls, R52 and R50, there's obviously been a terrible misunderstanding. You just let it rest! There's no point in pursuing this argument any further. Now go wash up, it's almost time for dinner.

by Anonymousreply 5403/09/2012


by Anonymousreply 5503/09/2012

r56 who the FUCK are you FUNDY FREAK alert!

"Sick of you freaks" - Gay Basher alert!

by Anonymousreply 5703/09/2012

R4 has it. Back the fuck off and let them run their own countries. We don't need to get involved This isn't our issue.

by Anonymousreply 5803/09/2012

Who is pushing this, and why is this getting national media?

This smells to high heaven. We have bigger issues that deserve national attention. Not this shit.

by Anonymousreply 5903/09/2012

94% of all organized religion deserves to be bashed.

by Anonymousreply 6003/09/2012

The world needs to stop enabling African despots and keep out. Remember Jesse Jackson, Mugabe, and the blood diamonds? Everyone wants to rape the Continent and not get caught. The UN included, just as they were culpable in Iraq.

by Anonymousreply 6103/09/2012

I can't believe Nicholas Kristof is trying to defend the Kony campaign. I thought he, of all people, would point out the dangers of having a sketchy non-profit co-opt a human rights cause.

by Anonymousreply 6203/09/2012

I just don't see the problem here

by Anonymousreply 6303/09/2012

[quote]The military assistance consists of training the Uganda forces how to track Kony and arrest him. If Uganda is not going to arrest him or make the attempt then international forces will. As I said upthread, Kony is a wanted man and needs to be tried. I hope to god the govt is not being bribed to shield him.

So you think that a fundie Christian "charity" should be allowed to take up arms and invade a sovereign country?

Fuck, you are such a typical American.

Have you not even read the links here? Kony is no longer a fucking threat to Uganda. Ugandans are pissed at Invisible Children. If Uganda wants help, let them go to the United Nations.

There are thousands of despots on this planet, they're not just in Africa. What about all the child labour in China? Or the child sex slaves in Thailand? Don't you care about them? Why are you so gung ho for this Kony guy?

Just because you watched a video that tugged at your heartstrings doesn't make you an activist. And for you to get behind an organization that wants to help via military intervention instead of actually helping the people is just such a sick frame of mind.

by Anonymousreply 6403/09/2012

A "charity" which is actually military aid to the bloodiest dictator in the world since Mao died. How exciting. President Museveni of Uganda has killed half a million of his own people, and on the basis of a pretended threat from Kony, rounded up 2 million tribal enemies and put them in concentration camps where they die at a rate of 1,000 per week. And the people who made this movie want to give him more money and guns.

he has also fomented civil war and genocide and rebellion in every single country which borders Uganda. The total deaths on his head is probably somewhere around 10 million, which makes him a bigger killer, by far, than Pol Pot.

by Anonymousreply 6503/09/2012

Look..."Invisible Children" is as fundie outfit and that's been known for some time. They pocket most of the profits they get. They're liars and in bed with the current Ugandan government, which has committed horrible human rights abuses. The man in this video moved on from Uganda years ago, and his "army" is less than 100 people now. This is a SCAM.

by Anonymousreply 6603/09/2012

I am appalled at how many of my Facebook friends are defending this whole operation. Are people that easily swayed by a flashy online viral campaign?

by Anonymousreply 6703/09/2012

Jesse Jackson?

by Anonymousreply 6803/09/2012

this is racism!!! leave the poor Kony alone!!!

by Anonymousreply 6903/09/2012

[quote]I am appalled at how many of my Facebook friends are defending this whole operation. Are people that easily swayed by a flashy online viral campaign?

Welcome to the 21st century, I guess.

I kept wondering what the hell the hoopla was about when on NPR they mentioned that this dude's army now consists of about 200 people which are scattered in groups in (west?) Congo. Yeah he did terrible things, but if he's barely a threat now, there are more pressing matters in the world that people can focus on.

by Anonymousreply 7003/09/2012

But I want to feel like an activist by wearing a wristband!

by Anonymousreply 7103/09/2012

Anyone who thinks that these videos are legit is half-tarded.

The US & Israel want us to think that the middle east /north Africa is a cesspool of violence (it is) and that intervention will make it better (it won't)

The West has fucked with MENA for a century and installed many of the leaders. They get killed once they decide to disobey Washington DC. A deeper examination of what is really happening will dispel any notion of benevolence on the part of the media or the US government.

by Anonymousreply 7203/09/2012

[quote] So you think that a fundie Christian "charity" should be allowed to take up arms and invade a sovereign country?

Are you insane? That's not what's being done. The group and others lobbied to get foreign aid earmarked to assist (via US advisors) the Ugandan govt to track done (via satellite and other technological means) and arrest Kony so he can be brought to the ICC for trial. Do you not even know how this works? The deployment of advisors also includes the Congo and South Sudan so it doesn't matter that he may not be in Uganda anymore.

It makes no difference that he is a lesser threat now. He is still a wanted criminal for horrendous crimes against humanity. Hell we've been hunting done old nazis for half a century and they pose no threat at all. They haven't for over half a century. And you can be sure that the US govt has assisted in their capture and prosecution as well. There is no statute of limitations on murder and genocide.

What the fuck is wrong with you people? I am not convinced there is something devious about this group. It may be poorly run but if it's effective then the administrative issues can be worked out. As an atheist I still think that even crazy religious people can accomplish good things. There are plenty of those Christian types helping communities in Africa dig for water so they can have fresh water for the first time. Good for them. I couldn't care less if the group's leader is a famewhore or not. It's a worthy endeavor which is why someone like Kristoff can see the value in it. It's also why the prosecutor at the ICC is happy about it as well.

Yes, the govt of Uganda wants it. Just cause some bloggers or some NGOs aren't supportive of it or are worried that it might detract from them it means they shouldn't do it? You're ridiculous. In fact, it will more likely drum up more support for work in Uganda and increase donations to any group working there. There certainly is support from human rights and anti-genocide groups.

Kony's indictment is some 7 years old now. I don't know about others but I was aware of it when it happened. I say it's about time they got serious about bringing him in and used modern technology to do it.

And it matters not one bit that we can't take care of all the world's ills. Or rescue everyone. Or bring everyone to justice. That is always the lamest argument against doing something. When we can do something right we should do it.

And, 72, just because you feel better doesn't mean you should stop taking your meds. I should have known this would bring out all the tin hat, illuminati, anti-Semitic and Area 51 theorists.

by Anonymousreply 7303/09/2012

R73, baaaaaah, baaaaaaaah, baaaaaaaaaah

by Anonymousreply 7403/09/2012

Girls, girls, self-control, self-control!

by Anonymousreply 7503/10/2012

Wrong, r73.

by Anonymousreply 7603/10/2012

Obviously there will be people who would always want to counteract any good being done its to be expected that there is opposition building up against this campaign

regardless of funds can put a prince on the kinda awareness he has brought on the situation ..i mean i live in africa and i had no idea such a thing was going on

by Anonymousreply 7703/10/2012

what country in africa, r77?

by Anonymousreply 7803/10/2012

So, the IC activists AKA trolls R73 and R77 should try to answer the following questions without constantly going back to the same memes: is the government of Uganda a factor of instability in Central Africa? Is the government of Uganda and its troops responsible for atrocities, rapes, etc, against civilian population? Is the government of Uganda trying to make homosexuality in its country punishable by death?

Please address these questions, I'm eagerly awaiting your answer.

by Anonymousreply 7903/10/2012

And Anderson Cooper's guest on Anderson is the leader of the organization. Tune in Monday folks!

by Anonymousreply 8003/10/2012


by Anonymousreply 8103/10/2012


by Anonymousreply 8203/10/2012

and i meant Price not prince it funny how the government is more concerned in killing homosexuals that it is in protecting their own children

by Anonymousreply 8303/10/2012

R73/77...we're all still waiting for your answers.....

by Anonymousreply 8403/10/2012's horrifying, but this is our country in 2012. A bunch of gullible sheep who are easily herded into an opinion using lies that manipulate their emotions. This is why would should all be terribly afraid that the Republicans might win the Presidential election. Just look at that situation...even though the Republicans are responsible for the mess this country's in, people keep voting for them. Because it's so easy to play on people's emotions. People no longer have critical thinking skills.

by Anonymousreply 8503/10/2012

[quote]African should do for themselves instead of looking to white people to take responsibility.

As if the Africans have invited this kind of attention. Last I checked, Invisible Children Inc. is an American charity. These do gooders would do well to keep their noses out of other peoples' affairs.

What is the American obsession with Uganda, btw? Evangelical proxies pushing for the death penalty for homosexuals, now this?

by Anonymousreply 8603/10/2012

The Uganda is obsession is driven by the Family, the vile "world domination" Christians who run the National Prayer Breakfast. Uganda gives them money or takes their advice and money or otherwise sucks up to them and to the British, and for that reason, the US and UK have been actively supporting the world's worst mass murderer, perhaps second only to the Sauds as a force for evil in the world. All in the name of JESUS. Jeffrey Sharlett exposed these fuckers and still they peddle their shit. And Obama and the Clintons are all part of their network of right wing pets. It's time to shut them down and jail them for treason.

by Anonymousreply 8703/10/2012

R73, since you are so sadly gullible, let me spell it out.

From an Afro-centric paper-

The U.S. government and Invisible Children are using the brutal Joseph Kony as a bogeyman to justify the U.S. long-term plan, which is to impose AFRICOM on Africa. Since everyone knows about Kony's atrocities, who would object if the U.S. sends 100 U.S. "advisers" to help Uganda, after all? Brilliantly devious. Of course it never stops at 100 "advisers." That was the announced deployment; there are probably more U.S. troops in the region. Even before the deployment some had already been training Museveni's soldiers. And more will come; unannounced.

AFRICOM, the ultimate objective, would allow the U.S. to be able to counter resource-hungry China by having boots on the ground near the oil-rich northern part of Uganda, South Sudan, Congo's region bordering Lake Albert, and the Central African Republic. The troops would also be near by in case a decision is made to support regime-change in Khartoum, Sudan. After all, the U.S. foreign policy reasoning is that since Sudan's president Omar Hassan al-Bashir and his defense minister have both been indicted by the International Criminal Court (ICC), few would shed tears for them.

The U.S. is aware that African countries oppose AFRICOM. So what does the U.S. do? Go after a "devil" and in this case it's Kony. Tell the world --with the help of Invisible Children--that our mission is to help rid Uganda of this "devil"; who by the way is hiding somewhere in Central African Republic, while the dictator who most recently stole elections last February, sits in Kampala and meets with U.S. officials and leaders of Invisible Children.

by Anonymousreply 8803/10/2012

Uganda Just discovered oil ...guess we know which country the Usa will be taking over soon

by Anonymousreply 8903/10/2012

R89 = Posting from the United Kingdom... home of the world's 7th largest economy.

by Anonymousreply 9003/10/2012

Seems to me that at least the kids in Kony's Army have some direction, discipline and structure now in life. Kinda like US teens going to a military boarding school. Tomato/tomahto.

by Anonymousreply 9103/10/2012


by Anonymousreply 9203/10/2012

[quote] Last I checked, Invisible Children Inc. is an American charity. These do gooders would do well to keep their noses out of other peoples' affairs.

Yea, just like those silly, busybodies who tried to get the US involved in "saving" the Jews in Germany and Europe. Why didn't we mind our own business and let Europe take care of its pesky problems?

by Anonymousreply 9303/10/2012

R91 = Bar Bush

by Anonymousreply 9403/10/2012

Nice try r93

by Anonymousreply 9503/10/2012

Uh, 2/88, where's the link? There are plenty of goofy "Afro-Centric" papers. Some of them spout crazy conspiracy theories with regularity. But since you didn't take my advice about your meds I am not surprised you are gullible enough to believe every conspiracy theory out there.

This conspiracy theory is liek the one by some Afro-Centric circles that providing safe and effective family planning to women in the developing world was nothing more than genocide by the big bad USA.

LOL at 91. I'm afraid there are people who will think you are serious but funny nonetheless.

by Anonymousreply 9603/10/2012

Another day another Christian scam.

by Anonymousreply 9703/10/2012

I feel like unfriending everyone on Facebook who, over the past 3 days, has posted this video and written something like "PLEASE WATCH!!!! TOGETHER WE CAN HELP!!!"

by Anonymousreply 9803/10/2012

Well a lot of those kids would've had HIV anyway, so this is working out well for them.

by Anonymousreply 9903/10/2012

Moron at R96-

BlackStar News is the leading investigative newspaper in New York, not some fly-by-night rag.

People like you that believe any piece of propaganda shat out by the Pentagram are the reason we are in Iraq now.

by Anonymousreply 10003/10/2012

Here is a link to BlackStar for the poster too ignorant to be able to google.

The propaganda against Uganda is just another piece in the NeoCon plan to take over the middle east and north Africa.

by Anonymousreply 10103/10/2012

I know a young man who works for Invisible Children. He just graduated from a fundy college. In fact, the organization just visited my town and swayed the young people here to post and promote their agenda, and they have all done it without questioning. I told a young 13-year-old today that Kony hasn't been in Uganda for years now. She was horrified. Had NO idea.

by Anonymousreply 10203/10/2012

R102, google "Arab spring + CIA" and you will see the link. The US has been funding revolutionary groups for years to destabilize these regimes, while paying billions in "foreign aid" to the leaders.

Foreign Aid is just taking money from poor people in rich countries to give to rich people in poor countries, and that has been the case for 50+ years.

I'll bet that the supporters of KONY don't believe that the US trained and armed Bin Laden and Al Qaeda during the 90s, and refuse to see any link between that and our current occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan. I'll bet they also don't know that Israel gets more foreign aid than all the other poor countries combined.

by Anonymousreply 10303/10/2012

[quote] BlackStar News is the leading investigative newspaper in New York, not some fly-by-night rag

So they say. So you parrot. They do have a political agenda so I take what they say with a grain of salt. It is still riddled with conspiracy theories and full of supposition everyone is just supposed to buy without question.

By the way this has ZERO to do with WMDs. You can question things without accepting point blank the opposing views. You don't seem capable of this.

Where are the lies in this video - I see the puffery for the narrator/group head and the cheesy parts but am not seeing how it is misleading. It's not meant to be a complete treatise on the history and politics of Uganda. It's meant to raise awareness of this particular person, what he did and the crimes he committed and urge his capture. Are people opposed to that?

It's almost as if people are envious of this guy's success with this project so far. I can oppose his religion and his politics and still support this project. You really have to learn to be more discerning, less kneejerk and doctrinaure and understand how things get accomplished in the world without freaking out because you can't support everything about someone.

When I lobbied I had to work with lots of people I never imagined I would - but that's what gets things done. I also had to put my preconceived notions aside about people I thought I despised and discover another side to them if for a particular objective we were on the same side.

Some of you do not live in the real world.

by Anonymousreply 10403/11/2012


by Anonymousreply 10503/11/2012

So this Invisible Children group has ties to anti-gay Christian groups:

Invisible Children Funded By Antigay, Creationist Christian Right

What does Invisible Children share in common with the Discovery Institute, the leading organization promoting “Intelligent Design”, a pseudo-scientific theory created to insinuate creationist ideas into public schools — or with The Call, whose leader Lou Engle claims homosexuals are possessed by demons, calls God an “avenger of blood” and a “terrorist”, and in May 2010 staged a rally in Kampala, Uganda, at which Engle warned of a gay menace to society and shared a stage with one of the authors of Uganda’s notorious Anti Homosexuality Bill ?

990 IRS tax forms and yearly reports from Invisible Children, and 990s from its major donors, tell a story that’s jarringly at odds with the secular, airbrushed, feelgood image the nonprofit has cultivated.

Among the tens of millions of people who have watched Invisible Children’s KONY 2012 viral video, including Oprah Winfrey – a dedicated supporter of LGBT rights who also has given $2 million dollars to Invisible Children, how many were aware of IC’s extensive financial ties to far-right fundamentalism, including major funders of the mounting global war on gay rights ? IC doesn’t go out of its way to advertise these things.

But Invisible Children’s first yearly report, from 2006, gives “special thanks” to the “Caster Family Foundation” and IC’s 2007 report is more specific, thanking Terry and Barbara Caster. In the lead up to the 2008 election, the California-based Caster family was identified as one of the biggest financial backers of the push for California’s anti-same sex marriage Proposition 8.

Capping the pro-Prop 8 push was a November 1, 2008 San Diego stadium rally held by The Call, whose leader Lou Engle warned that same sex marriage could unleash a “sexual insanity” that would be “more demonic than Islam” and suggested believers should carry out acts of martyrdom to stop gay marriage and legal abortion, which Engle predicts will lead to a second American civil war.

One of The Call’s major donors in 2008 also gave, that same year, over 400,000 dollars to Invisible Children. These links weren’t anomalies. They were part of a pattern.

What does Invisible Children share in common with James Dobson’s Focus on the Family, the Family Research Council (pegged by the Southern Poverty Law Center as a “hate group”), or the Fellowship Foundation — one of the nonprofit entities of the Washington-based evangelical organization also known as “The Family” (covered in two books by journalist Jeff Sharlet) whose leader Doug Coe has been captured on video celebrating the dedication inspired by Hitler, Lenin, and Mao ?

What does IC have in common with the ministry of California evangelist Ed Silvoso, who works directly with leading Ugandan author and promoter of the Anti Homosexuality Bill (also called the “kill the gays bill”) Julius Oyet — who claims that “even animals are wiser than homosexuals”?

The answer? — all of these ministries – the Discovery Institute, Focus on the Family, the Family Research Council, The Fellowship Foundation, The Call, Ed Silvoso’s Harvest Evangelism, and Invisible Children – received at least $100,000 in 2008 from what has emerged in the last decade as the biggest funder of the hard, antigay, creationist Christian right: the National Christian Foundation.

[snip; article too long to copy/paste; read the rest for yourself at the link]

by Anonymousreply 10603/12/2012

It sounds like they are using Kony as bait to draw young people into this religion.

by Anonymousreply 10703/12/2012

Jason Russell pings hard. Kind of effeminate. Also into himself.. there's a photo of him on google images yelling into a megaphone where he also manages to look at the camera too.

by Anonymousreply 10803/12/2012

In defense of their salaries I don't think 80 grand a year is outrageous. It doesn't make you Gandhi. By my estimate you need perhaps 40 grand a year to have an ok middle class life in NYC. Discussions on Datalounge have put this requirement as high as 75K. So no, I don't think 80 grand to head a charity is messed up.

by Anonymousreply 10903/12/2012

[quote] By my estimate you need perhaps 40 grand a year to have an ok middle class life in NYC.

R109, do you live here? I'm not a wealthy guy but I have NO idea how anyone could survive in NYC on 40k per year unless they're single, have no major debt outside living expenses and live in Bronx or Queens or some other area far removed from Manhattan, (yes, I know the city isn't limited to Manhattan but so many people work or make Manhattan part of their daily or weekly lives.).

It would be near impossible to be married and have kids in this town on just $40,000 annually.

by Anonymousreply 11003/12/2012

R110, I'm single. I recently have 100k in student loan debt which is a problem. I get money from my family (a blessing and humiliating). I live modestly more or less. No car, not a lot of eating out or shopping. I would like a proper livable salary but I've lived in Manhattan now Brooklyn on never more than 40, 50 k a year in creative jobs for Years.

by Anonymousreply 11103/12/2012

No children?

End of story.

by Anonymousreply 11203/12/2012

that's 40-50 k including parental help. No children. I hear they're pricey.

by Anonymousreply 11303/12/2012

More food for thought from "The Nation."

by Anonymousreply 11403/12/2012

If their "ties" to groups you find objectionable make you not want to support them then that's a legitimate reason. Obviously this is an organization with religious ties so that can turn a lot of people off. Your choice. But then it seems to me to be consistent you'd have to refuse to support other groups that have any ties to groups that oppose Prop 8 et al.

But the fact that the organization's head makes $80,00 a year is not a legitimate reason. That is a laughably low salary for such NGOs. Most heads of NGOs -even midrange ones which this seems to be - make well over $100,000.

I think some posters here have no idea about what people make in the real world.

Charity Navigator which monitor nonprofits and overcompensated nonproofit CEOs believes that nonprofit CEO's should be paid what the market demands. They perform a CEO compensation study each year and have consistently pointed out that a low six figure salary for a CEO of a mid-to-large sized nonprofit is the norm and should be acceptable to donors. They note that these are complex multi-million dollar operations that require a high level of expertise.

It's important to note that Charity Navigator in comparing CEO salaries does not take into consideration the CEO's involvement in the organization apart from the traditional purely administrative role of head of the organization/company. The activities and leadership of non-traditional CEOs such as the head of IC who do much more than just run the organizaiotn but also advance the primary mission of the charity is a factor not assessed by Charity Navigator as a factor in compensation and it should be.

I once worked for an American NGO advancing health care for women in the developing world. Our CEO filled a number of roles in our primary mission and, in fact, without him there would have been much less accomplished and much less money raised by other organizations and much less money from governments around the world directed toward women in the developing world.

There may be legitimate reasons that turn off people to IC but they don't include nitpicking finances, which many of IC's critics don't seem to or want to understand, and begrudging what seems to be a hard working CEO an appropriate compensation.

Many heads of such organizations make in the several hundreds of thousands. And they have been for over 10 years now. Go Google it.

by Anonymousreply 11503/12/2012

What's your point, 103? That we once backed the wrong guy and he turned on us? Yea? Not the first time we did that and won't be the last. Remember Stalin?

If you don't believe in helping other countries then that's your opinion. But to denounce all foreign aid because it's not perfect is just plain selfish and dangerously isolationist. That is not going to work in the real world.

There are ways to deliver foreign aid besides bi-laterally.

Where did all these right wing kooks come from and why are they here at a gay discussion forum?

by Anonymousreply 11603/12/2012

R116, we should not be helping the mass murderer Museveni, period. You don't even know if Kony is REAL, he could be a phantom enemy made up by Museveni.

by Anonymousreply 11703/12/2012

Please, 117. Just stop. Kony was and is real. Getting him to justice may deter others.

Ugandan history and politics is very complicated. I think it's clear that Museveni is very flawed and may be getting worse but he is in no way the equivalent of Idi-Amin or Obote. There has been much, much progress for Uganda under him. Unfortunately not for gays. Even in the army which he still needs to have better control over. I'm not interested in propping him up because it's been time for him to step down for a while now but objectivity is better than your mindless screed.

When you accuse someone of being a mass murderer perhaps you should be more specific. The world is a complicated mess at times.

by Anonymousreply 11803/12/2012

The point is: the group behind this video is USING Kony and his evil ways to proselytize.

That is shameful.

And furthermore they are anti-gay.

by Anonymousreply 11903/12/2012

"Bruce Wilson digs in to the sources of funding for the group behind “Kony 2012,” and finds that 990 IRS tax forms and yearly financial disclosure reports from the nonprofit and 990s from its major donors “tell a story that’s JARRINGLY AT ODDS with the secular, airbrushed, feelgood image the nonprofit has cultivated.”

The documents show that Invisible Children received hundreds of thousands of dollars from the biggest financial backers of California’s anti-same-sex marriage Proposition 8, with links to James Dobson, The Family (see Jeff Sharlet’s excellent book on the subject), and similar Christian Right entities."

by Anonymousreply 12003/12/2012

r118, part of the issue, IMO, is the media on which this was spread.

Social media is not known for balanced, intelligent linked information. From Wiki to youtube it's now just a propaganda tool. After I looked into the charity, I wasn't surprised where it originated.

The fact that it was a viral release was deliberate: any legitimate news outlets covering it would know about the LRA and put them in context.

The situation is not that complicated. The West (and recently China) have enabled the current African systems and leaders to further their own ends.

I have read about Kony for years, and have no doubt he is an evil man. Museveni should also be in the Hague, and the West will never acknowledge that. The people support the Konys of Africa partially for tribal reasons, but also because the rulers are so brutal.

The real problem is that Kony and people like him are loose cannons. They don't fit into the 'acceptable evil' that outsiders can control.

This is not unique to Africa, either. The Karen twins in Burma are another example. (I've been trying to find out what happened to them for years, but I believe they were co-opted by the Americans and now live there.)

by Anonymousreply 12103/12/2012


by Anonymousreply 12203/12/2012

it achieved what it wanted to mad KONY FAMOUS ..and exposed his atrocities to the world

by Anonymousreply 12303/13/2012

[quote]it achieved what it wanted to mad KONY FAMOUS ..and exposed his atrocities to the world

What it wanted to do was enrich the Invisible Children's leaders and it will do just that.

by Anonymousreply 12403/13/2012

How has it enriched someone who makes a lousy $80k a year? Please. You can do better than that.

So when are we getting the stories of his secret gay life on the streets of Manhattan?

by Anonymousreply 12503/13/2012

R125...go away. Honestly. Gullible sheep like you make me sick.

Kony hasn't been a problem for years. This is all bullshit. It's a group of fundies trying to get rich and famous by lying. Big surprise there.

by Anonymousreply 12603/13/2012

The head honcho really DOES ping.....

by Anonymousreply 12703/13/2012

Yes, he pings. Big time. Is he married or does he just have a kid? He's a bit twee for me.

Fuck off, 126. Kony is an indicted war criminal and bringing him to justice is important. I supported bringing former nazi war criminals to justice after they hadn't "been a problem" for half a century. Why is this different?

Your logic is sorely missing unless you have another agenda.

by Anonymousreply 12803/13/2012

He's married with kids. But still could be on the down low.

by Anonymousreply 12903/13/2012

I haven't watched the video.

Does it mention that last October the U.S. sent combat-equipped special forces to central Africa to provide assistance to regional forces that are working toward the removal of Joseph Kony from the battlefield?

LRA are now thought to number just a few hundred fighters, their mobility and the difficulties of the terrain has made them difficult to tackle.

Uganda and Congolese officials said last year they thought Kony had returned to eastern Democratic Republic of Congo?

What does Invisible Children expect from the video?

by Anonymousreply 13003/13/2012

R128...hon, take your meds. You're completely unhinged. No one said anything about not wanting to see him punished for his crimes. But it's a nice piece of diversion on your part.

I said he was no longer a threat, and that this video is fundie propaganda from a bunch of greedy, self serving assholes. You obviously relate.

by Anonymousreply 13103/13/2012

126/131, Your posts have no purpose except to what? to insult me because I don't agree with your myopia? Grow up.

Of course, it's propaganda, PR - call it whatever you want but it's goal is to pressure those in positions to do so to find Koney and bring him to justice. So far they have succeeeded in getting legislation passed and funded that can help accomplish that.

Trying to paint me, an atheist, as sympatico with fundies is amusing but just a diversion from some agenda you're pushing. You clearly don't care if this guy is tried for his crimes. If you do then you still have no problem undermining those who may stand a decent chance at succeeding in getting done what the regional govts have either been unable or unwilling to do for many years.

I on the other hand recognize that I don't have to agree with everyone I work with to accomplish goals. Real life. Try it.

by Anonymousreply 13203/13/2012


by Anonymousreply 13303/13/2012

[quote]Of course, it's propaganda, PR - call it whatever you want but it's goal is to pressure those in positions to do so to find Koney and bring him to justice. So far they have succeeeded in getting legislation passed and funded that can help accomplish that.

Oh for fuck's sake. Kony is no longer a threat. Have you not read the articles critical of Invisible Children? Not only that, but Ugandans don't want IC's help and they are pissed at them. A sovereign nation is telling them to fuck off, but you think that IC should just go ahead and do whatever they think best? That's fucked up colonialist thinking and you need to get over it.

[quote]Trying to paint me, an atheist, as sympatico with fundies is amusing but just a diversion from some agenda you're pushing. You clearly don't care if this guy is tried for his crimes. If you do then you still have no problem undermining those who may stand a decent chance at succeeding in getting done what the regional govts have either been unable or unwilling to do for many years.

I don't believe for one second that you're an atheist.

Kony should be on trial for his crimes, but so should the entire Ugandan government and the people that Invisible Children are affiliated with. They are even bigger criminals than Kony. The fact that you don't know this demonstrates that you have blinders on and have clearly not read everything about these issues.

Besides, there are even bigger bogeymen out there in the world, but you want to focus on one guy who isn't even a threat anymore.

You're a fucked up colonialist fundie.

by Anonymousreply 13403/13/2012

[quote] How has it enriched someone who makes a lousy $80k a year?

Gee, I wish I made a "lousy" $80k a year.

by Anonymousreply 13503/13/2012

"You're a fucked up colonialist fundie."

Bingo. Exactly right.

by Anonymousreply 13603/13/2012

i heart r134.

by Anonymousreply 13703/14/2012

Why aren't those Kool-Aid drinkers making similar videos about Scientology, Unification Church, North Korea, Islam fanatics, Mexican drug cartels, Somali pirates etc. if they are THAT desperate for attention!?

by Anonymousreply 13803/14/2012


by Anonymousreply 13903/14/2012

What is KONY and what does is it an acronym for?

by Anonymousreply 14003/14/2012

It's pure propaganda. The purpose of the video is to deflect attention away from the true culprits and put it on a guy who isn't even relevant anymore. NTM, Konys are a dime a dozen.

Who do you think it is that makes it possible for these African thug leaders to prosper? The video is preparing us for another invasion. This child soldier thing has been going on for decades! Obama sent troops in last year, and more to come. It's all part of the takeover plan that Gen. Wesley Clark spoke about in 2007.

American/UK/France's main agenda for Africa is instablity so we can plunder the wealth of natural resources.

by Anonymousreply 14103/14/2012

[quote]What is KONY and what does is it an acronym for?

"Kony" is the name of an African warlord, Joseph Kony.

by Anonymousreply 14203/14/2012

More on Ugandans being pissed at this propaganda.

by Anonymousreply 14303/14/2012

Top Ten Ways to Tell Kony Is Phony:

by Anonymousreply 14403/18/2012

Funny how fast this disappeared from the media as soon as the CIA and other military ties were exposed, isn't it?

by Anonymousreply 14507/21/2012

Or since dude was caught with his pants down.

No, the white one.

by Anonymousreply 14607/21/2012

VIDEO: Kony 2012 Debunking Shows How Far Alternative Media Has Come

Tuesday, March 13, 2012 – by Staff Report

Why the Kony Video Could be a Hoax (But It's Not) ... The astounding success of Invisible Children's Kony 2012 video has all the earmarks of a huge hoax, most likely perpetrated by Banksy, the artist who produced Exit Through the Gift Shop. That, at least, was Rob Frankel's response to me, via email, when I asked about this particular video that is making internet history. Kony 2012, of course, is not a hoax, although Frankel makes his "what if" case well (among his arguments the viral velocity is too fast to be real and, in the how-weird-is-that category, Joseph Kony is an anagram for Phony Jokes.) – Erika Morphy, Forbes

Dominant Social Theme: This guy, Kony, the one who eats the hearts of children – get 'im! And when he's gotten, send in NATO to make sure these abuses do not continue.

Free-Market Analysis: Gee, it's getting harder and harder to be the Internet's leading analyst of elite dominant social themes. Take Kony 2012. (Please, TAKE it!)

We saw an article about the Kony 2012 "viral video" probably on Wednesday, the day it was posted. We were shocked and angered at the obviousness of the meme. But BEFORE we could write a word, everybody else had started to!

We've never seen anything like it. It bears out our contention regarding what we call the Internet Reformation – and how it is reaching a kind of critical mass.

The entire alternative media, for all its internecine quarrels, seems perched on a knife-edge now – watching carefully to see what new false-flag the "non-existent" power elite has up its sleeve. And as soon as it senses, aggregately ... even a whiff of a new ploy or gambit ... boy, does it pounce!

This must be debilitating to the powers-that-be. They haven't had this much pushback since the Gutenberg Press began threatening the Catholic Church – apparently causing them to intervene putatively by funding Luther and Calvin.

This is called "getting ahead of the curve." The powers-that-be are doing the same thing today. We can see it happening. We believe Julian Assange may be one such false flag. We were on record that Anonymous might be another, long before it was announced that the FBI has "turned" one of its apparent leaders.

This is the beauty of living through history. We can see WITH OUR OWN EYES that today's power elite is reactive as well as pro-active. There are many who would fight against this insight however, for a variety of reasons. The urge to attribute absolutely everything to one race or group is apparently an irresistable human instinct.

The trouble is that it can ENCOURAGE racism when it ought to be expanding enlightenment. Examine the history that is finally evident today and one comes to the conclusion that not only did the first information revolution drive apparent elite plans to create what became the Reformation, it also drove copyright law and many other kinds of reactive legislation.

by Anonymousreply 14707/21/2012

For those who still believe this CIA bullshit. Wow, I hope this doesn't get me arrested and thrown in a psych ward.

Isn't "The Atlantic" a radical commie mag?


The Kony 2012 campaign, by an American NGO called Invisible Children, was the most successful social media effort ever. Centered around a short movie of the same name, it was meant to raise the international profile of Joseph Kony, a notorious warlord in Central Africa famous for conscripting child soldiers and other horrific atrocities. While the Western celebrity efforts around Pussy Riot don't have the same ring of neocolonialism as the Kony 2012 videos and events -- Russia was a perpetrator of colonialism and not a victim, after all -- they do suffer from similar fundamental problems of commercializing political activism.

In a real way, Kony 2012 took a serious problem -- warlords escaping justice in Central Africa -- and turned it into an exercise in commercialism, militarism, and Western meddling. Local researchers complained about it, and a number of scholars used it as an opportunity to discuss the dos and don't of constructive activism.

by Anonymousreply 14808/21/2012

Bump for the big O

by Anonymousreply 14910/08/2012
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