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GOP TAXScam bill passes. CALL AND PROTEST IN THE STREETS FOR THIS.

This is turning over our money to the KOCH brothers and other wealthy GOP Donors. This guts everything. The GOP Senators have lost their minds. IF they were worried about being primaried, they should pass Campaign Finanace Reform instead?

They did this on WORLD AIDS DAY too. I hate these guys so much. BTW, Senator Lisa Murkowski got what she wanted, drilling oil in the National Arctic Refuge, and natural conservation area. What kind of Psychpath are you, when you want to drill in a natural reserve? And what about Global Warming, which fossil fuels and even drilling cause?

I am so pissed. I hate this.

--Anonymous
replies 306Dec 1, 2017 10:23 PM +00:00

WEll, I guess I should hope for State Encouraged euthanasia, because they just fucked my future.

--Anonymous
replies 1Dec 1, 2017 10:25 PM +00:00

Get in out the streets and riot Americans. A lot of us in other countries wonder why you don't and haven't already. Black Lives Matter have got the right idea. Now you need to all join up and riot the fuck out of your country until you get it back from the 1% and corporately owned and controlled government...

How much worse are you going to let it get? Seriously.

--Anonymous
replies 2Dec 1, 2017 10:29 PM +00:00

What the fuck can we do? This is bad? Everything will be gutted. Graduate students have to pay taxes on tuition waives, so they will not be able to afford university. They are going to gut medicare, soc ail security and medicaid.

This is the death of DEMOCRACY and many Americans will die because of it.

--Anonymous
replies 3Dec 1, 2017 10:31 PM +00:00

Didn't the TransCanada pipeline just have a major oil spill?? Great timing.

--Anonymous
replies 4Dec 1, 2017 10:31 PM +00:00

Not completely done yet. The house and senate have to each come up with bills and they have to reconcile. there will be one more vote

--Anonymous
replies 5Dec 1, 2017 10:34 PM +00:00

Fiscal responsibility.

Never ever trust a Republican senator. Never ever vote for them. Who does these days anyway?

--Anonymous
replies 6Dec 1, 2017 10:35 PM +00:00

The only hope now is to make sure that every single Democrat is registered to vote and follow it up - make sure they know what ID they need, where the voting takes place and make sure they know to verify if they get a robocall telling them that their voting station has changed. If they've been purged from the voting list, there needs to be some kind of action committee in every single state - maybe made up of lawyers - to get the word out to MSM.

That's going to be a key element ---- there needs to be a nationwide focus on making sure that legitimate voters aren't denied their rights and if they are, that needs some kind of million man march on Washington.

--Anonymous
replies 7Dec 1, 2017 10:37 PM +00:00

R3, I paid my way through graduate school. So can everyone else.

--Anonymous
replies 8Dec 1, 2017 10:39 PM +00:00

R8 "Graduate school"! LOL! Typical voice of privilege.

--Anonymous
replies 9Dec 1, 2017 10:42 PM +00:00

Fuck you and your "I got mine" attitude, R9: You are part of the problem, and I hate you. I hope poor people invade your home and steal your Franklin Mint collection.

--Anonymous
replies 10Dec 1, 2017 10:42 PM +00:00

^

I paid my way through college too. I got up at 4am for three years to sweep floors and empty garbage bins.

4am. Rain and shine.

--Anonymous
replies 11Dec 1, 2017 10:42 PM +00:00

Oops, I meant R8. Sorry R9.

--Anonymous
replies 12Dec 1, 2017 10:43 PM +00:00

Fuck all of you Bootstraps I got mine assholes. I hope homeless people camp in your yard.

--Anonymous
replies 13Dec 1, 2017 10:44 PM +00:00

R8 is likely several thousand years old.

College tuition has gone up by 260% since 1980, while real wages have gone down.

--Anonymous
replies 14Dec 1, 2017 10:45 PM +00:00

They are fixing to go down again, R14. Insurance rates and taxes are going up for wage slaves. That means their paychecks will be less.

--Anonymous
replies 15Dec 1, 2017 10:46 PM +00:00

It's time to start killing the elites.

--Anonymous
replies 16Dec 1, 2017 10:47 PM +00:00

How long before this shit kicks in? This is really bad.

--Anonymous
replies 17Dec 1, 2017 10:49 PM +00:00

^ Yes! Eat the Rich.

--Anonymous
replies 18Dec 1, 2017 10:50 PM +00:00

It's going to get worse. Automation is coming. Many jobs are going away.

--Anonymous
replies 19Dec 1, 2017 10:50 PM +00:00

The Rich must be forced to provide free board and lodging to young students

--Anonymous
replies 20Dec 1, 2017 10:52 PM +00:00
The Rich must be forced to provide free board and lodging

Lotsa luck forcing that idea on Barbra Streisand.

c1.staticflickr.com
--Anonymous
replies 21Dec 1, 2017 10:58 PM +00:00

That Barbara Streisand is the epitome of the Selfish Bitch.

It's always Me, Me, Me with people like that.

(At least that crazy Madonna and that Jolie woman adopted some little black babies from the other side of the world to enter their own world of culture shock and culture-alienation.)

--Anonymous
replies 22Dec 1, 2017 11:06 PM +00:00

The Senate bill doesn't tax grad students on their tuition-- that's the House bill. So when they reconcile the two, they better not fucking keep that provision in or they'll be almighty hell to pay.

--Anonymous
replies 23Dec 1, 2017 11:06 PM +00:00

House Republicans are worse. The so-called moderate republicans in the senate voted for this #GOPTaxScam bill. It is a very dangerous bill.

*Raises taxes on the American people to give money to the billionaires, who do not need it obviously. *Guts health care, social and education *Blow a fucking 1.4 trillion dollar deficit hole in the budget *This triggers guts to medicare, social security and medicaid.

Americans are going to die because of the lack of services to protect them or provide care to them. The republicans gutted #CHIP, the children health care program already. Billions of dollars will be pulled from the US Economy and moved to off shore accounts and to rig our elections. This will trigger a larger recession, or worse.

This is the death of Democracy. Net Neutrality comes next, so no more DL or Twitter to get your message out and to organize Politically or Socially. You have to pay more for the internet and the companies control the website you go to. Think of it as Cable.

People think well this will be over in 2020. But, the election will be rigged. The information will be LIES. Access to information, will cost most. Americans will have no money to spend on it. Billionaires can run candidates as Democrats.

DEMOCRACY IS OVER!

PROTEST!!

--Anonymous
replies 24Dec 1, 2017 11:08 PM +00:00

We must ACTION in the STREETS!!

--"Rosa"
replies 25Dec 1, 2017 11:17 PM +00:00

If Democrats take the House and even more hopefully, the Senate next year, can't they they propose a new tax plan to negate this crap and put forth their own ideas? They've been pretty much locked out of the writer's room on this latest plan.

--Anonymous
replies 26Dec 1, 2017 11:18 PM +00:00

The thing is everything is so gerrymandered and so many are disenfranchised that it'll be difficult to get a lot of dems in the house and senate. And voting repubs out only to be replaced by another repub does nothing. The next batch will also be bought.

You gotta get rid of the people paying the politicians. And I'm not saying a guillotine would be a good idea, but a guillotine would get rid of he people paying the politicians.

--Anonymous
replies 27Dec 1, 2017 11:20 PM +00:00

You can't the people in Washington.

--Anonymous
replies 28Dec 1, 2017 11:25 PM +00:00

You can't trust the people in Washington.

--Anonymous
replies 29Dec 1, 2017 11:26 PM +00:00

Eventually, there will be a guillotine. History has shown this over and over again.

--Anonymous
replies 30Dec 1, 2017 11:26 PM +00:00

It is too late to do anything now, we are already completely fucked. I have warned people about this looming disaster for weeks and no one seemed bothered.

--Anonymous
replies 31Dec 1, 2017 11:29 PM +00:00

We need another Women's March like this one:

www.historywiz.com
--Anonymous
replies 32Dec 1, 2017 11:31 PM +00:00

I agree, r30. Start sharpening it up.

--Anonymous
replies 33Dec 1, 2017 11:31 PM +00:00
m.popkey.co
--Hillary
replies 34Dec 1, 2017 11:49 PM +00:00

BUT YOUR EMAILS!!! YOU FORCED ME TO VOTE STEIN!!

--Anonymous
replies 35Dec 1, 2017 11:51 PM +00:00

I hope someone starts taking out the rich Repug donors. Once that starts happening, the other rich fuckers who want to back Repugs will think twice.

--Anonymous
replies 36Dec 2, 2017 12:02 AM +00:00
A lot of us in other countries wonder why you don't and haven't already.

I think we've had enough of other countries telling us what to do and meddling in our affairs.

If the deepest political thought you can muster is "Garsh, why haven't you done this one single thing I just thought of?" then your ideas aren't particularly useful to us anyway.

--Anonymous
replies 37Dec 2, 2017 12:05 AM +00:00

time to leave the usa. which country are you all going to? is that internet regulation gonna affect other countries? i'm so sick of this shit!

--Anonymous
replies 38Dec 2, 2017 12:07 AM +00:00

Zimbabwe welcomes American progressives.

jonahvatunigere.files.wordpress.com
--Anonymous
replies 39Dec 2, 2017 12:15 AM +00:00

Go learn Chinese and Russian. Because these two will be THE important languages in the future as the importance of the USA, and so the English language, more and more wanes.

--Anonymous
replies 40Dec 2, 2017 12:17 AM +00:00

What will Susan Sarandon say now? Well, I guess this is good for her.

--Anonymous
replies 41Dec 2, 2017 12:19 AM +00:00

Did they tuck-in an addendum ordering gays to be sent to internment camps?

--Anonymous
replies 42Dec 2, 2017 12:21 AM +00:00

R2 You're right.

R37 you smug exceptionalist I guess we won't be seeing your ass on the line anytime soon,

& we can't wait for the Senate and House to examine each other's crap and decide to stick it to us anyway. The time is now.

i.pinimg.com
--Anonymous
replies 43Dec 2, 2017 12:26 AM +00:00

This bill is immoral. Can the House make it even worse?

--Anonymous
replies 44Dec 2, 2017 12:32 AM +00:00
you smug exceptionalist I guess we won't be seeing your ass on the line anytime soon

I've done more than you have, you lazy piece of shit. I'm not sitting online all day telling others what to go do, I'm actually doing it. None of us need some holier-than-thou stranger on the internet from some other country making demands on Americans, as though they could possibly understand the country or its politics well enough to give us good advice.

Reactionary "you stupid Americans just need to protest" advice is bullshit. It's just whiny know-it-alls showing off on the internet. Enough.

--Anonymous
replies 45Dec 2, 2017 12:33 AM +00:00

R44, with the House we have a chance of getting some changes or, in the best case scenario, blocking the bill. The House Dems have been much stronger in opposing Trump and the corrupt GOP than the Senate has. Several Senate Dems were on Twitter asking people to RT in agreement as if that would do anything, and that's all they did. Very little yelling -- and the LEAST this bill needed was some yelling on the floor -- and almost no protesting, no walk-out, nothing. Just tweets.

The House is much better at organizing and galvanizing the public beyond "RT if you agree." Because of that it's possible we can help mitigate what's happened. I don't want to say we can prevent it, but that possibility still exists.

Probably the best thing we can do right now is encourage all Dems running in 2018 to talk about this bill 24/7, talk about what it's going to do to citizens who are living paycheck to paycheck. But it's going to take work because, as much as it pains me to say it, we have a lot of lazy Democratic politicians, and the media is not even close to being on the side of the people.

--Anonymous
replies 46Dec 2, 2017 12:38 AM +00:00

BUT MADONNA FELL DOWN THE STAIRS!!!!!!!!!!

--Janbot
replies 47Dec 2, 2017 12:41 AM +00:00

The House Republicans are more Batshit. Paul Ryan is the Speaker of the House. Paul Ryan is a whore of the Koch Brothers. They want to gut social security, medicare and medicaid. So, no it is worse in the house.

The so-called moderate Republicans are in the Senate. All of them voted for this #GOPTaxScam Bill.

The best hope is to continue to call the Republcans, really all senators to dump this bill. Senator Corker can still vote yes on the tax bill. But all the so called moderate republicans senator can vote it down, sabatoge it. How do we get them to do that?

CALL CALL CALL them in outrage.

Tell them to VOTE NO

KILL THIS BILL

PROTESTS

This is the only hope. Fuck these a-holes, it is Christmas. Imagine, doing this to sick people, sick children, families and all of us for Christmas. HATE THEM!

--Anonymous
replies 48Dec 2, 2017 12:48 AM +00:00

R37 / R45 is triggered. R2 did not "make demands". Nor did R2 call Americans 'stupid'. YOU did that.

You say you've done more than I have and "are actually doing it."

Yes, you're fingering your smugma. You smell exceptional.

--R43
replies 49Dec 2, 2017 12:52 AM +00:00

Taxation Without Representation. We really need to look into this. Allegedly 6000 lobbyists worked on this bill. Media reports indicated that all the handwritten notes in the margins of the final printout given to Senators two hours before the scheduled vote were last minute lobbyist addenda. Dem. Senators called for a delay until Monday to review the bill but Rep. Senate leadership said fuck you. NOT ONE SENATOR had time and opportunity to review the nearly 500 page bill.

It's time to say fuck this shit, not roll over in defeat. We need constitutional law scholars such as Laurence Tribe and Norm Eisen - and more - to review the 'regular order' violations in this secretively written and opaquely presented bill, and we need their feedback to tell us if the Taxation Without Representation charges hold merit in court. If yes to any of this then We the Fucking People SUE over this bill.

And if that's not doable then we roll up our sleeves and just keep pushing back. Grassroots efforts stalled the trumpcare bill. This tax bill was a desperation need for the R Senate. We can take each provision in this bill and tear it apart with lawsuits. If nothing else, we gum up the enactment of the legislation until Dems take back the House and/or Senate. If nothing else, we stymie these R fuckers by slowing down enactment of each provision. Let's make this Trojan Horse bill their nightmare through grassroots judicial challenges.

--Anonymous
replies 50Dec 2, 2017 12:59 AM +00:00

Just stay pulled in to this Tax BIll PRocess. Call your senators/write/Tweet at them/protest still/. Tell them NO WAY, VOTE NO on this #GOPTAxScam Bill

Follow #GOPTaxscam on twiiter. WE all need to shut this bill down. IT is very very dangerous bill.

Sleep now.

Wake up

CALL WRITE TWEET ORGANIZE PROTEST CALL CALL CALL

Stay pulled into this now.

--Anonymous
replies 51Dec 2, 2017 1:00 AM +00:00
CALL CALL CALL

Calling is useless. No one listens. These Republican don't even listen to their own vote base why do you think they will listen to Democrats?

--Anonymous
replies 52Dec 2, 2017 1:33 AM +00:00

For those who would like to read the GOP Tax Bill for yourselves, you can find it here:

Please read it and tell us pros and cons.

Also tell which claws will benefit you and which will harm you individually

House Republicans on Thursday released their plan for the most sweeping rewrite of the tax code in decades.
www.nytimes.com
--Anonymous
replies 53Dec 2, 2017 2:12 AM +00:00

I haven't read the bill, but I read in a news article that Susan Collins introduced an amendment that will lower the threshold for the medical expense deduction (where the House bill had eliminated the deduction completely). If that amendment makes it through to the final version, it will be a godsend for me.

--Anonymous
replies 54Dec 2, 2017 2:38 AM +00:00

Yes but that is iffy R54. She got 'guarantees' about health care legislation she favoured getting voted in later as quid pro quo for her Tax Bill vote. I am So disappointed in her... And Lisa Murkowski excitedly sold us out by voting for the drilling rights in the Arctic. Fuck both of them. And McCain. At one point they seemed to have a conscience about impact on citizens but evidently their true colours now emerge.

--Anonymous
replies 55Dec 2, 2017 2:49 AM +00:00

Seriously, r55. And just as it's clear that Trump's presidency is about to hit the iceberg. You'd think one of these motherfuckers would say no, this is not the time for a bill like this, but no. Corrupt as shit, the lot of them.

--Anonymous
replies 56Dec 2, 2017 2:57 AM +00:00
[R37] / [R45] is triggered. [R2] did not "make demands".

I'm reading r2 right now and yeah, he is.

Nor did [R2] call Americans 'stupid'. YOU did that.

They didn't call Americans stupid, but they were right that r2 is implying Americans aren't smart enough to realize protest works. Except BLM, their example, hasn't worked, and protests in the past were marginally successful; Boomers like to claim protest ended the war, but it was Middle America finally coming around after years of thorough media coverage that did the most.

So it's not wrong or stupid to not protest. There are significant reasons to believe energy is best spent elsewhere.

Yes, you're fingering your smugma.

If you really want to make a difference, why would you be such a troll about it?

--Anonymous
replies 57Dec 2, 2017 3:04 AM +00:00

'I think we've had enough of other countries telling us what to do and meddling in our affairs.'

Bit fucking rich coming from an American. Then again, the rest of the world says you 'don't do irony'.

BTW, I've been to America, I've liked most Americans I've met, and like many others around the world hope you manage to get rid of that Orange Asshole and all his cronies, but fuckwits like R37 are why America is often viewed with distaste from afar.

--Anonymous
replies 58Dec 2, 2017 3:10 AM +00:00

I agree with r58, we fuck with every country and what we do impacts other countries in a big way.

--US citizen
replies 59Dec 2, 2017 3:14 AM +00:00

r53, "claws"??

You think like a Republican: "What hurts you individually?" A Democrat, nay, just a decent human being, thinks in terms of "What hurts people?"

--Anonymous
replies 60Dec 2, 2017 3:22 AM +00:00

R37 was pretty obviously talking about Russian meddling. And yes, r2's advice is mostly useless.

If it makes you feel better to derail the thread into some kind of America bashing then go ahead, but you're kind of proving the point that individual anonymous posters aren't helping the situation any.

--Anonymous
replies 61Dec 2, 2017 3:27 AM +00:00

Graduate school? Who needs liberal elite experts? PhDs in genetics, health, biochemistry, engineering, IT, what contribution could those people possibly make? Screw 'em. Failing my high school diploma was good enough for me.

--Anonymous
replies 62Dec 2, 2017 3:28 AM +00:00

It's not just that, r62, it's that the dipshit rich kids will be able to afford higher education and be the only ones who can get degrees. We'll be well and truly screwed when the only doctors are Colin and Tiffy Recherche of the Syosset Recherches.

--Anonymous
replies 63Dec 2, 2017 3:34 AM +00:00

I’m fine with this bill.

My investment portfolio will get a boost.

Lower taxes are a good thing, hysterical foreigner cunts.

--Anonymous
replies 64Dec 2, 2017 3:36 AM +00:00

^^^doesnt understand one fucking thing about economics.

--Anonymous
replies 65Dec 2, 2017 3:41 AM +00:00

If you're talking to me R61 it was not my intention to derail the thread. And I don't see it as being at all obvious that R2 was referring to Russian interference - it just read as a 'don't tell us what to do' response from a citizen of the country that has probably meddled more in other people's affairs since the Romans were rampaging around. But I'll take your point and leave you to deal with your own issues. At least until the next time your president hangs up on our prime minister*. Best of luck dealing with the craven Republicans and their tax bill. I'll go see if there's any more gossip on rock stars being jerks. Hope there's some more Sting stories.

* He's an asshole too so I don't really care if your Orange Asshole hangs up on ours.

--R58
replies 66Dec 2, 2017 3:47 AM +00:00

It's over. We lost. There is no coming back from this. People holding hope for some sort of reversal in 2018 or 2020 are deluding themselves. The US is officially a third-world banana republic with an oligarch class ruling a mass of serfs.

Because, you know, her emails.

--Anonymous
replies 67Dec 2, 2017 3:59 AM +00:00

As an over 60 year old who financially is doing pretty good, and has a stock portfolio, and my health, this bill is not on the face as damaging to me as many others BUT it is Just Not Right. I was raised to believe that you work hard, and do well, and then leave enough for others, or even better, spend time helping others, encouraging others, supporting others.

I'm a fucking dinosaur, flame this old fogey.

--Anonymous
replies 68Dec 2, 2017 4:10 AM +00:00

I'm in the same boat, r68. I am worried for people who are barely getting by and for people who need health insurance. Down the road though, I think the economy will tank bigly. Without a healthy middle class we will not have a healthy economy.

I plan to start selling off some stocks in about six months and will sit on a pile of cash.

This is not going to end well and I'm so sorry this orange turd was elected and that Republicans are such fucking selfish crooks.

--Anonymous
replies 69Dec 2, 2017 4:18 AM +00:00
Susan Collins introduced an amendment that will lower the threshold for the medical expense deduction. If that amendment makes it through to the final version, it will be a godsend for me.

Spoiler alert: It won't. The medical expense deduction will be done away with entirely.

--Anonymous
replies 70Dec 2, 2017 4:18 AM +00:00

Collins basically blew away any good will she has built up over the years. I would love if this backfired on her and eventually cost her in the next election, but she probably has enough time will pass before then. Also, I suspect many of the Republican voters will be blind to this and when they are affected negatively will somehow blame it on Obama.

--Anonymous
replies 71Dec 2, 2017 4:34 AM +00:00
It's time to start killing the elites.

Start with Elizabeth Warren. She made over $400,000 in one year teaching part-time at Harvard. Why anyone would listen to, let alone vote for this hypocrite, is anybody's guess.

College tuition is so high for two reasons. It is no longer a luxury, it is a necessity. And when you have a necessity, the price goes up. And the second reason is that college's spend so much money on stupid shit like Women's Studies and Black Studies that raise useless anarchs like OP and then they get their ass sued off because of it. Examples inlcude: Duke University, Mizzou, etc.

--Anonymous
replies 72Dec 2, 2017 4:38 AM +00:00

I posted this in another thread from PBS

some are really screwed. guess they are going to get rid of the poor.

d3i6fh83elv35t.cloudfront.net
--Anonymous
replies 73Dec 2, 2017 4:38 AM +00:00
I suspect many of the Republican voters will be blind to this and when they are affected negatively will somehow blame it on Obama.

Republicans are assuming that Democrats will be back in the majority when the worst effects of this tax cut hit the middle class -- and middle-class voters, being idiots, will blame the party in charge at the moment. They'll then return Repugs to the majority.

--Anonymous
replies 74Dec 2, 2017 4:38 AM +00:00

Legislation that was ostensibly meant to simplify and optimize the tax code has become, in no particular order, a massive corporate tax cut; a massive tax cut for wealthy people; a tax hike for millions of middle-class Americans; a partial repeal of Obamacare; a ticking time bomb for the social safety net, including previously untouchable programs like Medicare; an all-out assault on graduate school education; and sops to the evangelical right, such as recognizing new legal rights for fetuses. “It Started as a Tax Cut,” reads a headline in The New York Times. “Now It Could Change American Life.”

How tax reform turned into a Frankenstein’s monster of bad Republican ideas
New Republic
--Anonymous
replies 75Dec 2, 2017 4:40 AM +00:00

It should be painfully obvious at this point that facts don't matter and logic is completely irrelevant. The Rethugs don't care. They have no principles, they have no morals, and they have no shame. Yes they are hypocrites. They screeched at Obama over anything that he wanted to do because it would raise the deficit. Now, a trillion dollar addition to the deficit matters not at all. They are liars. It has been proven over and over again that tax cuts to the wealthy and the corporations do NOT stimulate the economy; there is no "trickle-down" effect. Doesn't matter. Rest assured, they are going to keep repeating that falsehood over and over again no matter what. And yes, they will next turn their sights on "entitlement programs" to start slashing benefits in an effort to reduce the deficit.

This is the scam, and we've been had. It is nothing short of criminal theft with a veneer of legitimacy thrown over it by a bunch of craven pricks who were nominally elected to represent the best interests of their constituents and the country. However, they are too addicted to power and the influence it brings with it to care about anything other than the money their wealthy donors will give them.

Despicable.

--Anonymous
replies 76Dec 2, 2017 4:41 AM +00:00

The real problem will be when the Repubs re-focus on the deficit (which they just blew up) and go after medicare and social security. It's coming brothers and sisters...

--Anonymous
replies 77Dec 2, 2017 4:41 AM +00:00

So is that the plan? Transfer all the vagina hate from Clinton to Warren?

We are so fucked.

--Anonymous
replies 78Dec 2, 2017 4:42 AM +00:00
So is that the plan? Transfer all the vagina hate from Clinton to Warren?

It has nothing to do with vagina hate. Those women were in it for themselves disguised in the costume of "We care for all people." I call out men who do the same shit.

--Anonymous
replies 79Dec 2, 2017 4:45 AM +00:00
Those women were in it for themselves disguised in the costume of "We care for all people."

All politicians are in it for themselves.

--Anonymous
replies 80Dec 2, 2017 4:46 AM +00:00

r72, I think college tuition started going up when loans began replacing grant money. Grant money was a limited amount and if that money didn't cover tuition then students would go else where. When student loans replaced grant money people could borrow more and that meant universities could raise their tuitions.

I suspect Reagan was behind the reduction in grant money.

--Anonymous
replies 81Dec 2, 2017 4:48 AM +00:00

A Ted Cruz amendment to expand the use of 529 education savings accounts got stuck at a 50–50 vote early this morning. It was held open until Vice President Mike Pence arrived to break the tie in the amendment’s favor. The wealthy and upper-middle class can now more easily use tax-preferenced vehicles for sending their children to private K-12 schools.

Chris Hayes:

The 529 is designed so that the more money you make, the greater the subsidy. Ted Cruz’s family gets a bigger savings from the gov’t than a firefighter or a nurse or a Marine.

--Anonymous
replies 82Dec 2, 2017 4:49 AM +00:00

Taxing the tuition of PhD students would completely cripple the American research apparatus. It is not in the Senate version though, they werent that stupid.

The Republicans are counting on people being happy about their taxes going down, but this will explode the deficit and cripple the federal budget. Then they will use it as an excuse to go after social security/medicare/medicaid.

--Anonymous
replies 83Dec 2, 2017 4:54 AM +00:00

Yes, how dare Warren take a high paying job. That is immoral.

And how dare she think as a wealthy person she SHOULD pay more in taxes than the poor. She is betraying her class.

--Anonymous
replies 84Dec 2, 2017 4:55 AM +00:00

EXACLTY R14. I paid my way through school too, thirty goddamn years ago. RECOGNIZE that tuition and the living expenses associated with "putting yourself through school" are ridiculously high and getting up at 4 am to do a shitty minimum wage job ain't gonna by you a fucking textbook these days. The fuck do you want to rely on an uneducated society to make America great again? Fuck off cunt at R8

--Anonymous
replies 85Dec 2, 2017 4:56 AM +00:00

"It is a period of civil war."

--Anonymous
replies 86Dec 2, 2017 4:56 AM +00:00

Jeff flake only voted because he received a commitment from Republican leadership and the White House that they would pursue a permanent solution for the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) illegal immigrants .

Or at least thats what he is saying

--Anonymous
replies 87Dec 2, 2017 4:59 AM +00:00

His tweet

“I will support #TaxReform bill after securing language to eliminate an $85 billion budget gimmick as well as commitment from the administration & #Senate leadership to advance growth-oriented legislative solution to enact fair & permanent protections for #DACA recipients”
Twitter
--Jeff Flake
replies 88Dec 2, 2017 5:00 AM +00:00

They need to keep DACA separate from this.

--Anonymous
replies 89Dec 2, 2017 5:01 AM +00:00

Lisa Desjardins @LisaDNews

WHAT DID FLAKE GET ON DACA?: WH aide Marc Short tells me he will be part of the conversation. ("Happy to include him".)

Me: Does that mean any agreement on timing (this year or no), substance?

Short: No, it is to include him in our talks.

--Anonymous
replies 90Dec 2, 2017 5:02 AM +00:00

R89. Democrats and some Republicans have already said that they would not allow spending bill to pass until permanent protection for DACA

--Anonymous
replies 91Dec 2, 2017 5:03 AM +00:00

r91, I'm surprised any republican would care. Must be republicans in the SW?

--Anonymous
replies 92Dec 2, 2017 5:06 AM +00:00

They care . They need cheap labors for chamber of commerce

--Anonymous
replies 93Dec 2, 2017 5:10 AM +00:00

Flake is a coward. So is Collins. Fuck them both. I hope they have nightmares.

--Anonymous
replies 94Dec 2, 2017 5:15 AM +00:00

Hawaii Senator Brian Schantz:

For those of you who were concerned about storing and staffing private jets, Alaska cruise ships, and private colleges ineligible for federal funding because of discrimination - DON’T WORRY. They are all taken care of in this bill.

Also in this bill hedge fund managers are A OK, and the estate tax threshold is higher. But there was no room for a child tax credit because of the deficit.

--Anonymous
replies 95Dec 2, 2017 5:21 AM +00:00

I looked at that PBS table related to the tax. According to the table, I'll be bringing home roughly an extra 800$ a year. Over the course of the year, that's not a lot, but it will help cover gas and groceries.

--Anonymous
replies 96Dec 2, 2017 5:27 AM +00:00

It really is like they decided to stop any pretense with this bill, blatantly including things that only benefited the rich (private jets - golf courses) while cutting things such as deductions for teachers. Many also openly admitted that they needed to have this pass because of pressures they were getting from their donors.

--Anonymous
replies 97Dec 2, 2017 5:29 AM +00:00

For how long, R96? Keep in mind that the changes to the individual code are mostly temporary; the other structural changes are mostly permanent. This will do nothing but drive up the debt and guess where the Republicans will go next?

--Anonymous
replies 98Dec 2, 2017 5:30 AM +00:00
If Democrats take the House and even more hopefully, the Senate next year

There is no way Democrats will take the senate. In fact, they might lose some senate elections and the number of Rs in the senate will rise.

The House can do whatever they like but the GOP senate will vote everything down.

--Anonymous
replies 99Dec 2, 2017 5:33 AM +00:00

It would take large scale rioting in the streets to enact any real change. You could take away everything folks have, push grandma out of the nursing home to die, and that wouldn't happen here. We're just too weak and lazy for a revolution.

--Anonymous
replies 100Dec 2, 2017 5:38 AM +00:00

. There will be a small tax cut for the sheeple and that will make them happy. A huge pay day for the rich of course. Then in a few years the deficit will be the number 1 issue again. Repubs will then destroy Social Security and Medicare (their wet dream for decades.)

For some reason, American morons keep feeling for this shit.

--Anonymous
replies 101Dec 2, 2017 5:39 AM +00:00

R96, you’re more likely to be turning that extra $ over to health insurance companies. Or maybe your state will have to raise taxes to compensate for fewer federal $. Or maybe some private entity will get a fat contract for what was an essential service but has had to be outsourced. You pay now or you pay later. We will be paying later for this bill.

--Anonymous
replies 102Dec 2, 2017 5:40 AM +00:00

....falling not feeling...of course.

I worry that the media focus on sexual harassment has turned the tax bill into a non event. The most significant events get ignored while all the energy goes to stuff that titillates people and boosts ratings.

--Anonymous
replies 103Dec 2, 2017 5:48 AM +00:00
I'll be bringing home roughly an extra 800$ a year. Over the course of the year, that's not a lot, but it will help cover gas and groceries.

LOL you're gonna lose that $800 in higher State and local taxes that will need to be paid after the Koch Mercer tax bill goes through. And since government services will be slashed, you'll be paying the private $ector for those services and the private $ector always charges more.

--Anonymous
replies 104Dec 2, 2017 5:58 AM +00:00

It's just such awful long term planning for rich people. In five years when 75% of the country is in poverty who exactly is going to have any money to buy anything made by the company's rich people own?

--Anonymous
replies 105Dec 2, 2017 5:59 AM +00:00

That's what is so ridiculous about this tax bill, R105. If companies were hurting for investment capital, if they didn't have any cash to retool, expand, etc., then doing something on the supply side might make sense. But we aren't in that situation and we haven't been in that situation for decades. Companies are sitting on hundreds of billions in cash and there is so much investment capital floating around that we're constantly seeing bubbles in various areas.

If you want to grow the economy, do it on the demand side: give the money to the people who will immediately go out and spend it.

--Anonymous
replies 106Dec 2, 2017 6:02 AM +00:00

I think everyone should stop paying health insurance premiums. Everybody drop coverage and go to hospitals in ritzy areas and use their ERs. Ritzy area hospitals will be forced to close and the 1% will be forced to use public hospitals. That's when you'll see change in health insurance.

There should be a movement - Drop Health Insurance - and a specific date planned for a few months into the future as the day everyone drops their insurance. No insurance payments after that date.

--Anonymous
replies 107Dec 2, 2017 6:02 AM +00:00

I used the calculator to see how I'd do under the new tax bill. I'm actually shocked. Someone making around 70K will get an $800 reduction the first year but In 10 years that will drop to $300 a year. I make 200K and will get a $2K reduction that will be reduced to about 1K in 10 years. As I live in NY state my taxes will in fact go up due to my loss in deductions. Anyone making 50K or so is absolutely screwed. No tax reduction at all.

The real benefits kick in when you make 5 million or more. Those people will get 6 figure tax decreases that continue for 10 years. I'm actually shocked the Republicans did this. It's like they don't give a fuck anymore. Let's just give the elite their money and stop pretending we care about anything else.

--Anonymous
replies 108Dec 2, 2017 6:11 AM +00:00
In five years when 75% of the country is in poverty who exactly is going to have any money to buy anything made by the company's rich people own?

Now that American companies are mostly global, they don't care about selling to their native country. China and India are much bigger and more lucrative markets.

--Anonymous
replies 109Dec 2, 2017 6:15 AM +00:00

We Americans are too ignorant to understand this tax bill or care how it affects us. We are more concerned with keeping up with the Kartrashians. How do you think Trump won?

--Pussy Grabber
replies 110Dec 2, 2017 6:20 AM +00:00

Economics is not black and white. Some cities/states are passing mandatory laws of $15 minimum wage. Organizations that employ low skilled employees will cut down on employees. When a machine can do the job, like at McDonalds, why employ a person? Perhaps with these tax cuts, decision makers will choose to keep the low skilled employees rather than introducing machines.

--Anonymous
replies 111Dec 2, 2017 6:23 AM +00:00

One boon of migrants from poor countries is that they will block any attempts at revolution...

--Anonymous
replies 112Dec 2, 2017 6:39 AM +00:00

Senators and representatives answer only to their $$$$$$$$$$$$$ donors.

--Anonymous
replies 113Dec 2, 2017 6:49 AM +00:00

I know, it's fucking ridiculous how expensive the textbooks are!

we need hackers to hack them and get their nudes or expose their misdeeds, to get them out of office.

This country is over! Drilling in that beautiful nature! i'm so pissed.

--Anonymous
replies 114Dec 2, 2017 7:24 AM +00:00

there are protests in nyc right now, outside midtown where he is having breakfast meeting. Cipriani.

--Anonymous
replies 115Dec 2, 2017 7:26 AM +00:00

Americans don't need a tax cut, our tax burden is not that high as it is.

The only thing this accomplishes is gives peanuts to the masses to keep them happy while giving massive benefits to corporations and the rich.

. There will be a small tax cut for the sheeple and that will make them happy. A huge pay day for the rich of course. Then in a few years the deficit will be the number 1 issue again. Repubs will then destroy Social Security and Medicare (their wet dream for decades.)

+1. As some other posters have pointed out, this will run up to the deficit which will give the GOP an opening to gut their safety net. That is their plan. And if Dems retake power, they will have to the party who raised taxes.

--Anonymous
replies 116Dec 2, 2017 7:36 AM +00:00
And if Dems retake power, they will have to the party who raised taxes.

So nothing changes?

--Anonymous
replies 117Dec 2, 2017 7:48 AM +00:00

At one point in my life, I would've had some sympathy for the Trumpers ("They don't know any better", "They're caught up in ideology not facts", etc) but not any more. Reading reactions on social media this morning from his supporters was mind-numbing -- "Liberal tears", "Trump, winning again!" and so on. Although everyone else will get screwed as well, I'm waiting for these people's health insurance to skyrocket (as almost every non-partisan assessment of the budget has said will happen) and/or lose their coverage. Let the companies and corporations they work for use every new amendment and loophole to screw them over. Of course, they'll likely forget which party put them into the mess.

--Anonymous
replies 118Dec 2, 2017 8:00 AM +00:00
Organizations that employ low skilled employees will cut down on employees. When a machine can do the job, like at McDonalds, why employ a person

Wtf does a $15 minimum wage have to do with automation? Do you think if the minimum wage was $7 and automation existed to do the job of the $7/hr worker that the company would keep the worker and not automate because they're only paying the worker $7?

We really need to rise up against retards like this poster who believes a higher minimum wage leads to automation.

Automation leads to automation no matter what workers get paid.

And BTW, when we rise up we'll be met by Eric Prince's security forces, paid for by Kochs, Mercedes, Adelsons, Thiels. The houses of the 1% will be fortresses with guards, drones, electronic pressure sensitive alarms on the grounds, etc. so we'd better bring AK 47s and not pitchforks.

--Anonymous
replies 119Dec 2, 2017 8:17 AM +00:00
so we'd better bring AK 47s and not pitchforks.

Good luck with that, numbnuts. Democrats are trying to get all guns banned.

We really need to rise up against retards like this poster who believes anyone in government gives a shit about his life.

--Anonymous
replies 120Dec 2, 2017 8:21 AM +00:00

Not this old bullshit again. Sorry, R120, but no matter how you try to spin this, you cannot find any Democratic legislation that is "trying to get all guns banned."

--Anonymous
replies 121Dec 2, 2017 8:28 AM +00:00

if any of them died, i would not shed a tear.

--Anonymous
replies 122Dec 2, 2017 8:48 AM +00:00

Americans should protest by not paying their taxes on April 15.

--Anonymous
replies 123Dec 2, 2017 8:55 AM +00:00

R96, how much is your health insurance going to go up? I would guess it will suck up that "break" you are receiving at the beginning.

Like to drive on roads? Where will the $ come from to pay to fix them?

--Anonymous
replies 124Dec 2, 2017 9:21 AM +00:00

Of course they care about immigrants: someone has to staff their businesses.

--Anonymous
replies 125Dec 2, 2017 9:28 AM +00:00

America's collapse is complete.

--Anonymous
replies 126Dec 2, 2017 10:54 AM +00:00
Start with Elizabeth Warren. She made over $400,000 in one year teaching part-time at Harvard. Why anyone would listen to, let alone vote for this hypocrite, is anybody's guess.

I don't get it. That was the salary she was offered. What was she supposed to do? Say no, I want less?

She can fight the banks even with one high paying year in her life.

Sanders made one million dollars last year. Do you every call him a hypocrite? Something tells me that you don't.

--Anonymous
replies 127Dec 2, 2017 11:03 AM +00:00

Sorry people, but the time to riot in the streets was BEFORE the tax cut for the wealthy bill was passed. Now it's rather a moot point. Once the House and Senate bills are reconciled, it's over. Vote out the Repigs. Get rid of Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell. Impeach Trump.

Regarding this grifter tax plans that cuts taxes for the wealthy, it's the cuts to Medicare and how it will affect millions and millions of Americans including middle class senior citizens--you and your parents This tax bill also guts Obamacare denying health care to millions. The Repigs don't care. They are fucking heartless, soulless monsters.

--Anonymous
replies 128Dec 2, 2017 11:11 AM +00:00

Americans get irony, at least on the east coast.

--Anonymous
replies 129Dec 2, 2017 11:13 AM +00:00

R116 Obama raised taxes and not by much. Dems are the party of fiscal responsibility. They get the fact you get what you pay for. Taxing the wealthy is not an unpopular stance. We can do it again.

--Anonymous
replies 130Dec 2, 2017 11:16 AM +00:00
Bit fucking rich coming from an American. Then again, the rest of the world says you 'don't do irony'. ... fuckwits like [R37] are why America is often viewed with distaste from afar.

You're talking about two different things, R58. Yes, the U.S. interferes politically and militarily in countries where it has no fucking reason to except greed -- I agree with that, and if you knew anything about U.S. politics you'd realize most anti-Trump people feel that way. It's the Trumpsters who want to invade and screw over other countries. We want to stop them.

You're conflating that with my talking about the Russian meddling, often from Russians who don't understand U.S. politics any more than some rando anonymous people on DL who think a huge protest or two will solve all our problems.

I seriously doubt people like me are why America is hated. People like me are trying to make America a decent country instead of letting it get taken over by absolute scumbags.

We just also know for a fact that people like you and R2 and R59 are useless internet warrior trolls who are taking out your petulance on random Americans online. You're distractions and unimportant. If you think my knowing that makes me a fuckwit, then so be it.

--Anonymous
replies 131Dec 2, 2017 11:19 AM +00:00

Absolutely, R74. And they also know that if a Democrat tries to introduce legislation to take down this entire bill, they have a ready-made "Democrats are raising your taxes again" lie to run with -- that's why they've pushed the "this lowers your taxes" lie so hard, not just to pass it now but to have that excuse right there in the future if they need it.

This still has a House vote and then maybe even another Senate vote. The time to call your Reps and Senators is NOW. Keep hounding them with letters and calls. Look for local protest groups, too.

--Anonymous
replies 132Dec 2, 2017 11:23 AM +00:00

I see friends on FB freaking out about this tax cut bill, but none of them are actually saying why it is so bad. So I ask, how will this bill adversely affect me? How will it change by daily life (for the worse)?

--Anonymous
replies 133Dec 2, 2017 11:26 AM +00:00

Flame me but I figured since the bill is inevitable, I emailed my Senator(Roy Blunt. YUCK) and basically selfishly asked him to endorse the House plan as that keeps my income level at 12percent rather than 22 per cent of Senate plan. I had to adopt a selfish stance in this instance as the greater issues at hand seem too far gone.

--Anonymous
replies 134Dec 2, 2017 11:31 AM +00:00

None of them linked to any of the many articles written about this bill, R133? I find that hard to believe.

--Anonymous
replies 135Dec 2, 2017 11:31 AM +00:00

This isn't over yet and it does have to go back to the house. So yes, get out there and raise hell, absolutely. Sit in at Congressional offices and raise pure hell. No one knows the impact of this written on the fly, no hearings no CBO scoring, it's terrible. We need to go to the mattresses.

--Anonymous
replies 136Dec 2, 2017 11:34 AM +00:00

R135, I read an article on CNN, but nothing seemed that bad about the bill. From the chart someone posted in this thread, my taxes will go down. I guess I’m not seeing the connect to all the outrage.

--Anonymous
replies 137Dec 2, 2017 11:58 AM +00:00

r133:

What state do you live in? Do you own a home? What is your tax bracket? Do you currently deduct state and local taxes Do you own a small business? Do you offer stock options for you business. Do you work in Education? Do you have children?

All this is going to be effected. The tax cut for individuals will expire the ones for corporations won't . We went for being a democracy to a country where corporations wil run everything.

--Anonymous
replies 138Dec 2, 2017 11:59 AM +00:00

Just when I get my student loans out of default and my credit in better standing.

--Anonymous
replies 139Dec 2, 2017 12:03 PM +00:00

The tax bill will also most likely drive up the deficit and there is talk of having trigger points where once it reaches a certain point, the middle class and lower class taxes will go up, but not the corporations. They are also trying to set up a mechanism to work on dismantling social security and medicate at that point rather than raise the corporate taxes.

But yes -- deductions for private jets, golf courses, one college that DeVos has a personal interest, and cutting deductions for teachers, child-care, seniors, and property which hits the middle class harder.

--Anonymous
replies 140Dec 2, 2017 12:03 PM +00:00

Deplorables on here, is this the Trump you voted for. This is the drain the swamp guy? This guy said he was for the middle class. He is a billionaire just working for his billionaire buddies.

FUCK THAT. This guy is full of shit. You should be outraged.

--Anonymous
replies 141Dec 2, 2017 12:04 PM +00:00

Nothing will happen. Americans are the laziest cunts on the planet. They will stay hypnotized to their cells. Nothing will change. Doomed.

--Anonymous
replies 142Dec 2, 2017 12:08 PM +00:00

I'll say it again: you pay now or you pay later. We will pay for this tax bill. You may realize a return in the first year but wait until the 2nd or the 3rd or even 10 years later. Wait until you need social security and it's gone because they need to finally pay for this bill.

--Anonymous
replies 143Dec 2, 2017 12:12 PM +00:00

Yes, you must pull yourself up by your bootstraps....Except if you inherit lots of money tax-free.

--Anonymous
replies 144Dec 2, 2017 12:18 PM +00:00

Having read your response R131 I see that you are more thoughtful than the 'ugly American' I took you for. And I made the wrong assumption that your comment was a blanket 'mind your own business foreigners' rather than aimed specifically at Russians and their interference. So my apologies for misreading you. Having said that, you have no idea what area I work in or what I do so your labeling me and others as 'useless internet warrior trolls' is as big an assumption as the one I made about you so perhaps we should both try to avoid jumping to conclusions. Anyway, back to the asshole rockstars.

--R58
replies 145Dec 2, 2017 12:19 PM +00:00

R138, I live in NY(C). I rent an apartment and make 120,000. I get the full amount taken out of each paycheck. I don’t own a small business or work in education. I do not have children.

--R133
replies 146Dec 2, 2017 12:21 PM +00:00

Do you claim deductions, R146?

--Anonymous
replies 147Dec 2, 2017 12:22 PM +00:00

I'll repeat it, Americans don't need a tax cut r137.

This bill is not good for the fiscal health of our nation, as has been repeated many times it will run up the deficit thus forcing major cuts to programs Americans care about. And it repeals the mandate for healthcare which will also will cripple obamacare.

--Anonymous
replies 148Dec 2, 2017 12:31 PM +00:00

R146, I do not claim any specific deductions.

--R133
replies 149Dec 2, 2017 12:36 PM +00:00

R133, yes, initially you’ll get a tax break, but look at your “savings” come 2027. Over the next 10 years, you’ll basically be giving all of that money right back (assuming you remain in the same tax bracket).

--Anonymous
replies 150Dec 2, 2017 1:01 PM +00:00

Ok, so it sounds like I’ll gain a little in the short term and then have to pay it back in a decade or so. Ok, fine. Doesn’t seem that bad. This goes back to my original question then, if this bill is really no big deal, then what are some people freaking out about?

--R133
replies 151Dec 2, 2017 1:11 PM +00:00

What if we just don’t pay our taxes?

--Anonymous
replies 152Dec 2, 2017 1:31 PM +00:00

OMG

Yesterday I said "Eat The Rich" and 120 posts have appeared overnight.

--Continue to Eat The Rich
replies 153Dec 2, 2017 1:34 PM +00:00

Because it will cause a recession like the last big giveaway to the rich.

Because it will blow a whole in the federal budget that Republicans plan to use as an excuse to eliminate Social Security, Medicare, and every other aid to the poor and sick.

Because the Republicans who passed this lied about it being a significant tax cut to the middle class when it is really a giveaway to the rich.

Because the Republicans who passed it lied that it will create jobs. It will not.

What exactly do you need?

--Anonymous
replies 154Dec 2, 2017 1:34 PM +00:00
What if we just don’t pay our taxes?

YEAH!

i.pinimg.com
--Big Al
replies 155Dec 2, 2017 1:34 PM +00:00

on ny1 they are reporting that Jared pressed flynn to contact russia and other countries to delay some UN vote regarding Israel settlements. I wonder if Jared's jewish friends will help him get off. you know they have very creative ways. they probably have blackmail material on every single person in the US govt.

--Anonymous
replies 156Dec 2, 2017 1:38 PM +00:00

there are no fucking jobs, robots are taking over and everything is going off shore. fucking liars.

--Anonymous
replies 157Dec 2, 2017 1:41 PM +00:00

What exactly do I need, R154? Something that will affect me to make me care about this.

--Anonymous
replies 158Dec 2, 2017 1:42 PM +00:00

Well aren't you a sack of shit, R158!

--Anonymous
replies 159Dec 2, 2017 1:47 PM +00:00

I can't believe how republicans can tell blatant lies to the American people. About the tax bill. They must really think everyone in the country is stupid.

Deplorables have a lot to answer for.

--Anonymous
replies 160Dec 2, 2017 1:57 PM +00:00

"Something that will affect me to make me care about this."

Do you have a parent living? Do you plan to retire some day? Do you ever expect to get sick some day?

And do you give a shit about anyone but yourself, you enormous piece of crap?

--Anonymous
replies 161Dec 2, 2017 2:00 PM +00:00
They must really think everyone in the country is stupid.

That's because WE ARE!!!!!! DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

--Anonymous
replies 162Dec 2, 2017 2:03 PM +00:00

They think they're smart by having the tax cuts expire a year or two down the road after midterms.

--Anonymous
replies 163Dec 2, 2017 2:12 PM +00:00

Hey young people. Because of this #GOPTaxScam bill, there will be not health care, social or education programs for you. Also, social security, medicare and medicaid will be gone.

YOU WILL BE SCREWED. GET IT!

GO TO A PROTEST NOW! Especially, at a Congressional Office.

WE HAVE TO KILL THIS BILL IN RECONCILIATION PROCESS.

--Anonymous
replies 164Dec 2, 2017 2:14 PM +00:00
Hey young people.

They're hypnotized by their cell phones. Don't bother them.

--Anonymous
replies 165Dec 2, 2017 2:17 PM +00:00

I do have parents living. They were smart and saved up quite a bit of money to retire on. They're not on Medicare/Medicaid. My dad gets decent money from a pension too.

At 35 years old, I never expected social security to last long enough for me to use it another 30 years from now. If it's not going to hold up let's just get rid of it and find another solution.

I think it's disingenuous for gay people on a gay site to be overreacting to this bill when it probably won't affect any of us (except to give us a short-term tax relief). We should be focused on the Russia investigation and more importantly making sure Pence and his ilk don't take away any of our rights. THAT is what will affect us here.

--Anonymous
replies 166Dec 2, 2017 2:23 PM +00:00

The truth is that the GOP does not care about anyone who works for a living. They really don't care if we live or die and if you are black, brown, gay, non-Christian, female, old, poor or can think for yourself they would prefer that you die. In order for issues like gun control, pro-choice, fair elections, affordable healthcare and keeping churches in their place to be settled satisfactorily for the majority of Americans there's going to have to be bloodshed.

--Anonymous
replies 167Dec 2, 2017 2:24 PM +00:00

Gay people might have parents who'll need Medicaid. Eldgergays might need it themselves. How fucking oblivious ARE you??

--Anonymous
replies 168Dec 2, 2017 2:25 PM +00:00

"They think they're smart by having the tax cuts expire a year or two down the road after midterms."

Not all the cuts. Just the ones to the Middle and Lower classes are temporary. The cuts to the 1% are permanent.

--Anonymous
replies 169Dec 2, 2017 2:27 PM +00:00

"I do have parents living. They were smart and saved up quite a bit of money to retire on. They're not on Medicare/Medicaid. My dad gets decent money from a pension too."

Oh, THAT's what my parents did wrong. Instead of being "smart" they worked their asses off until they were 65. They should have been smart like your parents.

"At 35 years old, I never expected social security to last long enough for me to use it another 30 years from now. If it's not going to hold up let's just get rid of it and find another solution."

Yes, let's run down to the solution store and find another solution. There must be dozens.

"I think it's disingenuous for gay people on a gay site to be overreacting to this bill when it probably won't affect any of us (except to give us a short-term tax relief). We should be focused on the Russia investigation and more importantly making sure Pence and his ilk don't take away any of our rights. THAT is what will affect us here."

And I think you are a giant sack of crap and that you are under-reacting because you think this won't effect you, when it surely will.

--Anonymous
replies 170Dec 2, 2017 2:30 PM +00:00

There will not be health care programs for the American people. They are gutting them. You will be priced out. How do you think there are billionaires in the US anyway? IT is because the do not pay taxes. They go after health care, social, education, science programs that used to be funded by pooled tax money. Now, they are going after our pooled money in social security, medicare and medicaid.

WAKE UP! There will be nothing funded by the American people anymore. The Koch, Buffets, Gates of the world will become richer. THEY ALREADY should be paying more in taxes. BUT, no they are going after the money in all the remain programs, the bedrock programs of our DEMOCRACY.

THIS IS A VERY DANGEROUS BILL!

PROTEST AT YOUR SENATORS OFFICE NOW!

--Anonymous
replies 171Dec 2, 2017 2:34 PM +00:00

So, R166, all gay people are rich. Damn, I never got the message. I've missed out on being rich my entire life.

Really R166 this world would be so much better without you and probably your parents since you probably are the piece of shit you are because of them.

--Anonymous
replies 172Dec 2, 2017 2:48 PM +00:00

R166 a catastrophic illness for either of your parents could easily wipe out savings. I have seen it happen to many couples or single elderly people who had a big nest egg (whether a stock & bond portfolio or not.) The costs of acute medical care, a long hospital stay (especially if in ICU/CCU) followed by recuperative care or nursing home care (possibly long term) can destroy that 'retirement savings.'

That's now, with the provisional level of coverage from Medicare but if they also have supplemental insurance to cover what Medicare doesn't (which they majority of seniors have) THOSE premiums will skyrocket, and perhaps cover less. Out of pocket fees and medical bills could be very daunting.

You could get hit by a vehicle or suffer a catastrophic illness that leaves you temporarily or permanently unable to work. You might need and qualify for the benefits provided by Medicaid, SSI or other safety net programs to help you survive that calamity in life circumstances. No one knows in advance if that stuff is about to happen or happen in 10 years.

You are either young or naive if you think this tax bill is of no concern and all that is relevant is the Mueller investigation. One can be equally focused on two critically important issues that are and will impact all of us for decades to come.

--Anonymous
replies 173Dec 2, 2017 2:49 PM +00:00
democrats are trying to get all guns banned

This

Never

Happened

(Seriously)

--Anonymous
replies 174Dec 2, 2017 2:51 PM +00:00

Go to the streets before such bills pass, not after the Congress and Senate have voted.

--Anonymous
replies 175Dec 2, 2017 2:55 PM +00:00

Social Security will be gone, Medicaid will be gone, Medicare will be gone? We've been told for years it was already going. Deficit exploding? We've been watching it increase for years anyway. State and local taxes going up? We'll cross that bridge when we come to it. Rich getting richer? Don't care - the rich always find a way to protect themselves. In ten years I'll be screwed? Who expects the tax code to be the same in ten years? Pay now or pay later? Personally, I'm so in debt, the future is already a financial black hole.

On the flip side, so many people are furious about this bill, maybe that will light a fire to get Democrats and moderate Republicans to start thinking and proposing some new, creative ideas. I look forward to reading them.

--R96
replies 176Dec 2, 2017 2:57 PM +00:00

CALL ALL YOUR HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES NOW! Tweet/e-mail too

Say: I want Representative (the name of your house of representative person),

to Vote NO on the Tax Cut and Job Bill, in any form. It will hurt the American people and blow a hole in the deficit. VOTE NO on the Tax Cut and JOB BILL in any form.

Call now/email now

Call Monday

TWEET

PROTEST AT THEIR OFFICES

Stay Pulled in. This is happening right now.

CALL CALL CALL

www.house.gov
--Anonymous
replies 177Dec 2, 2017 2:58 PM +00:00

R175 this is from a poster on another thread with legislative experience. It is not too late:

Despite its progress, the margin on this bill is thin. Republicans are voting for it because they haven't gotten much pushback. (With everything else going on). They want to rush this out before recess.

All of us (but especially those who live in Red and Purple States) need to cal and tweet your HOUSE Members and firmly yell them The Truth. Some variation of:

"You are going to explode the deficit, and take away the ability to deduct my state taxes, just so you can give a trillion dollars to millionaire donors and corporations. If you do this I will never, ever vote for you."

Do it soon.

—Former staffer

--Anonymous
replies 178Dec 2, 2017 3:00 PM +00:00
You could get hit by a vehicle or suffer a catastrophic illness that leaves you temporarily or permanently unable to work.

Exactly. In the past year I've known 2 healthy people who developed multiple pulmonary emboli after a plane trip. Experienced travelers, they were both shocked that it happened to them. Now, the more you travel the higher your chances of developing one but many people are predisposed to clots and could develop one after traveling by air once or twice.

What happens when you clutch your chest in overwhelming pain? You have to stop and think -- how much is my deductible? Maybe it's just gas. Maybe I should wait until my doctor is in his/her office; it will cost less than an ER visit. It'll pass if I wait.

Finally you say fuck it and go to the ER and get a $40, 000 bill.

--Anonymous
replies 179Dec 2, 2017 3:03 PM +00:00

Believe it or not, my GOP congressman, who I cannot stand, is voting against the bill. He voted against it when it passed congress. People paid attention and went, "Whoa there, feller! Doing away with all middle income deductions? Don't think so!"

I went to his twitter account and tweeted "Can't wait to vote against you in 2018! Wish the election was today." Got a call from his office. "But he voted against the tax cut."

Me: Sorry, all republicans must pay for this anti American DISGRACE. Tell your boy to switch parties and I'll vote for him.

--Anonymous
replies 180Dec 2, 2017 3:10 PM +00:00
We should be focused on the Russia investigation and more importantly making sure Pence and his ilk don't take away any of our rights.

No. Democrats need to stop focussing on the top of the tree and get down to the grassroots. Elect good quality progressives onto school boards so that quality education (with a strong emphasis on critical thinking) can prevent the next generation from being a bunch of easily led idiots.

There won't be any protests about this because people are wise enough to understand what's going on, because critical thinking skills are basically non existent.

--Anonymous
replies 181Dec 2, 2017 4:05 PM +00:00

R181 Well said, thank you. We need to focus on precisely that - teaching critical thinking in education from the earliest age. We need people in office at the local level on up who champion that. We need to champion school funding for a variety of subjects and programs that enhance and reinforce critical thinking.

--Anonymous
replies 182Dec 2, 2017 4:48 PM +00:00
R64: Lower taxes are a good thing, hysterical foreigner cunts.

Dubya reduced taxes and then, when the Great Recessian hit, we were too far in debt to better spend our way out of it.

The US economy is doing well now. If we changed taxes at all now, we should be raising them. Especially on the rich. Then, when the next downturn hits, we could reduce taxes then.

So, I disagree that lower taxes is good. The rich haven’t been carrying their weight.

--Anonymous
replies 183Dec 2, 2017 5:52 PM +00:00

NYT total listing of all votes on the tax scam bill & amendments linked below. Time to call all repubs but really put the screws to R-Nev Dean Heller. He's up for '18 re-election and he's the most vulnerable in the Senate.

The Senate approved the final bill, 51-49. A list of every senator’s vote on the bill and selected amendments.
www.nytimes.com
--Anonymous
replies 184Dec 2, 2017 6:09 PM +00:00
R137: I read an article on CNN, but nothing seemed that bad about the bill. From the chart someone posted in this thread, my taxes will go down. I guess I’m not seeing the connect to all the outrage.

I think some or all the outrage is from the disproportionate benefit to the very rich. You benefit in the short term a small amount, while the rich benefit by many, many times as much.

The middle/lower class benefits all sunset.

The elimination of the estate tax on estates over $5 million is symbolic of the tax bill in general. This helps only the very rich.

This bill raises the deficit.

The tax cut is being executed when the economy is doing well, and it should be executed, if ever, when we’re in recession. When we are in recession, we will be unable to get ourselves out, because we will be out of remedies, such as a tax cut.

People fear that when the deficit increases, as a result, the Republicans will say we must cut Medicaid and Medicare and other vital programs to reduce the deficit.

Trump and top Republicans are lying about the above, and that’s a bad sign.

--Anonymous
replies 185Dec 2, 2017 6:24 PM +00:00

I wish the Dems would pledge now, for when next in power, to double the inheritance tax, and double the other tax cuts on the rich, unless the Congress passes a bipartisan tax bill.

--Anonymous
replies 186Dec 2, 2017 6:29 PM +00:00
R158: What exactly do I need, [R154]? Something that will affect me to make me care about this.

Maybe you might consider that it hurts people with lower income, as a humanitarian matter.

Or, maybe, you might care about the country in general.

--Anonymous
replies 187Dec 2, 2017 6:33 PM +00:00

R166, at the age of 35 you should have a little bit of life wisdom in you. You seem to be taking things for granted, which is usually the attitude of people much younger than you.

As far as not caring about anyone else but yourself, that's your upbringing. You seem to have no ability to recognize, or be concerned by, the needs of the society at large, or even your neighbors or colleagues at work, maybe even your relatives.

You will learn, though. Life will humble you sooner or later.

(Ignore this if you are a troll, though.)

--Anonymous
replies 188Dec 2, 2017 6:36 PM +00:00

Calculate your tax cut.

Offsite Link
--Anonymous
replies 189Dec 2, 2017 6:38 PM +00:00
R166: At 35 years old, I never expected social security to last long enough for me to use it another 30 years from now. If it's not going to hold up let's just get rid of it and find another solution.

I can’t imagine why you wouldn’t expect SS to be there when you retire. Only if the majority surrenders to this claptrap, will it come true. As for “another solution”, there is nothing stopping you from proposing such a solution now, except that anything you come up with is probably not as good as SS.

Incidentally, SS is already protecting you now. If you are orphaned as a minor, you get SS benefits. If you are disabled, you get SS benefits. It’s not just for retirement.

--Anonymous
replies 190Dec 2, 2017 6:40 PM +00:00

I'm a freelance musician. I make $40,000 per annum

this is what I get out of the fucking bill.

financeformusicians.com
--Anonymous
replies 191Dec 2, 2017 6:41 PM +00:00

EVERYONE HERE

Send an Email to your US Representative NOW.

It is Fast

GO here for information. (click the picture).

**We have to Stop the #GOPTaxScam Bill NOW!** Email your House of Representatives. It is fast. Here is how: 1.) look up the email (and phone...
reddit
--Anonymous
replies 192Dec 2, 2017 6:42 PM +00:00

R189, according to that I'd save $129

Big fucking deal

--Anonymous
replies 193Dec 2, 2017 6:42 PM +00:00

r192 SENT

--Anonymous
replies 194Dec 2, 2017 6:47 PM +00:00

^^ I wish this deranged loon would go out, get drunk & get laid.

--Anonymous
replies 195Dec 2, 2017 6:51 PM +00:00

You could buy three or four Agnes Martin or Joan Mitchell paintings for that. A MUCH better deal if you ask me.

--Anonymous
replies 196Dec 2, 2017 7:12 PM +00:00

I don't know about y'all, but I'm looking forward to my tax cut!

--Anonymous
replies 197Dec 2, 2017 7:48 PM +00:00

WRONG THREAD ^^^

--Anonymous
replies 198Dec 2, 2017 8:02 PM +00:00

trump was at a fundraiser today in midtown and there were protests, on ny1, they interviewed a protester as well as a fan of trump who was obviously attending the event, he praised trump doing a great job and said sky's the limit! omg, i couldn't believe it. he was old and white of course.

--Anonymous
replies 199Dec 2, 2017 8:28 PM +00:00
I do have parents living. They were smart and saved up quite a bit of money to retire on. They're not on Medicare/Medicaid.

Bullshit. If your parents are retired, they're on Medicare. If they're not retired yet, they will be on Medicare when they do.

At 35 years old, I never expected social security to last long enough for me to use it another 30 years from now. If it's not going to hold up let's just get rid of it and find another solution.

Social Security will hold up just fine if Republicans don't pass idiotic tax bills like this. There is nothing wrong with Social Security that cannot be fixed with a simple change.

I think it's disingenuous for gay people on a gay site to be overreacting to this bill

It's not "disingenuous." This bill is a legitimate fucking disaster: social engineering, massive tax cuts for the wealthy, a couple hundred billion dollars added to the deficit every fucking year, and all of this when the economy is doing pretty well and we should be reducing the deficit. What do you think will happen when the economy goes south, as it inevitably will? What do you think will happen to the deficit when we go into a recession?

This bill is a crippling bill, one that will ultimately raise taxes on most Americans, that will damage the U.S. economy for years to come if it passes, and that Republicans will use as an excuse to get rid of Medicaid, Social Security, and Medicare, three programs that work.

--Anonymous
replies 200Dec 2, 2017 9:01 PM +00:00
Calculate your tax cut.

It raises my taxes by $1000.

--Anonymous
replies 201Dec 2, 2017 9:03 PM +00:00

it cuts mine by $129

--big fucking deal
replies 202Dec 2, 2017 10:50 PM +00:00

Serious question: Is there any point in calling your reps if they are all Dems and have already voted against the bill?

I also think the sky is falling posters are right on this one. America doesn't come back from this. This is the end of the Republic. We will devolve into the type of societies we see in Central and South America. It's not just about the permanent enrichment of the 1%, and corporations. Public and higher education will be gutted, college and graduate school will become out of reach for all but the wealthy. Then they go after the safety net and turn back the clock and undo everything that's left of FDR's legacy with this bill and its scribbled in amendments.

The GOP are craven and traitorous. They don't fear anything. There will be no impeachment or resignation. If people take to the streets, a North Korean Reichstag Fire is waiting in the wings. Their smugness says it all. They are exacting their revenge on all who are not them for being forced to endure 8 years of a "ni**er" president, and the U.S. will be eternally removed from the world stage as a major player. In a decade our economy will be in shreds, tech innovations will be coming from China and India, and our citizens will be dying in the streets. Game over. Putin wins the cold war with the help of Republican traitors.

--Anonymous
replies 203Dec 3, 2017 3:43 AM +00:00

People need to understand there is no such thing as a tax CUT. This is a shell game, and it is a tax SHIFT. And as they weaken or eliminate these EARNED benefits, the people who depend on them will not simply evaporate into thin air. They will still be here and the burden will shift to all of us in other forms. Remember this: Somebody ALWAYS pays.

States will either lay people off, eliminating basic programs, or raise taxes to cover things the federal government has "cut." Healthcare will once again be relegated to using ERs as primary care physicians, unless you are among the wealthiest. As a whole, our population will become sicker, less healthy, and less well educated.

If you think this tax bill won't affect you you are a complete fool. The costs for it will definitely be passed on to you in a million ways both seen and unseen. Educate yourself. And FIGHT LIKE YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT. This bill which, will also increase our deficit well into the trillions, is a threat to our national security.

Decide what kind of country you want to live in. Because these bastards are on a mission to completely dismantle government and privatize everything they can get their hands on. No accountability. We are going back to the dark ages. There was a reason why certain programs were put in place in this country. We thought we had learned from the past, but they want to turn the clock back to the 19th fucking century.. #RESIST.

--Anonymous
replies 204Dec 3, 2017 5:00 AM +00:00

Most of the people who are defending this tax bill don't even know what's in it. Hell, the fucking bastards who voted for it don't know what's in it.

--Anonymous
replies 205Dec 3, 2017 5:01 AM +00:00

I’ll see a tax cut because I itemize. However, I am also a public school teacher in NJ and there is a real chance I could lose my job in a few years as a result of the potential changes to SALT.

--Anonymous
replies 206Dec 3, 2017 5:02 AM +00:00

Drat. I don’t itemize.

--R206
replies 207Dec 3, 2017 5:03 AM +00:00

[quaote]ose my job in a few years as a result of the potential changes to SALT.

What is SALT? State an d local taxes ?

--Anonymous
replies 208Dec 3, 2017 5:10 AM +00:00

Where is the practical benefit to giving the wealthiest 1% a ridiculously high tax cut? Practically speaking? A tax cut that blows a hole in our deficit and imposes an incredible tax burden on people earning less than $75,000 a year? If this bill were above board ask yourself why was it developed in secret? Why were the people who had to vote it up or down not allowed to actually see it until it was called for a vote? Why was there no public hearing from the committees that developed it? Why were they allowing lobbyists to actually scribble amendments to the bill as it reached the floor for a vote and no one actually knew WTF they were voting on. What happened in the U.S. Senate this past week was shameful. They don't even pretend to represent the interests of the people who elected them. The same thing will happen in the House if we allow it. They did this in secret and some how it was OK with 51 Senators.

--Anonymous
replies 209Dec 3, 2017 5:20 AM +00:00

R208, yes, particulary property taxes in states like NJ.

--Anonymous
replies 210Dec 3, 2017 5:22 AM +00:00

May be Joy Ann Reied . Rachael Maddow, Chris Hayes, Chris Matthew , Laurence O Donnel , Joe and Mike and other DL favorites on CNN and CBS news etc should invite their new favorites politicians like John NcCain , Lindsay Graham , Paul Ryan , Cory Gardner , :Lmar Odam, Tim Scott , Roy Blunt and many more on their show

MSM quickly manages to get these Republican on their shows when these Republicans have to bash Trump on trivial issue. May be MSM should hound them and ask them why they voted for this bill and in this manner

--Anonymous
replies 211Dec 3, 2017 5:32 AM +00:00

It's not a tax cut for most middle class people. I'm fact it will be a tax increase after the first few years.

It's shocking because it goes against everything the "tea party" and "deficit hawks" stood for. Everything was bullshit after all.

--Anonymous
replies 212Dec 3, 2017 5:38 AM +00:00

I don’t know if it’s mentioned up thread or not, but this bill trashes many of the benefits that are particularly useful in Blue States. Reduction or elimination of deductions for State and Local taxes, for example. Also, the mortgage interest deduction. You’ll recall that Blue states already generally pay more in taxes that they receive in benefits.

--Anonymous
replies 213Dec 3, 2017 5:44 AM +00:00

They are also looking at reducing or eliminating the medical deduction. I don’t understand this one at all. To get that deduction, you have to spend more than 10% of your taxable income on medical care. Shouldn’t we have some pity on people in this circumstance? It’s not like it’s elective.

Sen. Susan Collins is fighting to reduce this threshold from 10% to 7.5%. It was 7.5% for years and years but was increased to 10% to Fund the ACA. I take the deduction and am pissed that it’s threatened. It could cost me $3000 a year.

--Anonymous
replies 214Dec 3, 2017 5:48 AM +00:00

Yeah, R212, it’s almost not worth using the calculator for this, because the bill is designed to tighten the screws on the middle class in later years.

I wish they were prohibited from doing this kind of thing, messing with the future like this. A future congress and President will get stuck with this when it all goes pear shaped.

--Anonymous
replies 215Dec 3, 2017 5:52 AM +00:00

We have to hope that this bill makes its horribleness further known during the year once people can finally read it. Maybe it will spook reps worried about 2018. Congress van always amend or undo.

--Anonymous
replies 216Dec 3, 2017 5:55 AM +00:00

It still has a to be reconciled.

--Anonymous
replies 217Dec 3, 2017 6:03 AM +00:00

R217 it will be reconciled in favor of the 1% ers the middle class and anyone in high property tax states are about to get screwed.

--Anonymous
replies 218Dec 3, 2017 6:11 AM +00:00

R203 yes, it important to call your Senators and Representative even if they are Democrats. First, it shows them that their constituents are paying attention to how they are voting. If you approve of their performance and record as it pertains to your beliefs and needs for representation then tell them so and thank them. Ask how you can advocate for the democratic agenda regarding this bill. Ask where the bill is available for viewing and read it.

Email EVERY Republican, especially Representatives right now, if you wish, to express your point of view on particular items in the bill that are egregious and unacceptable and demand that they justify their reasons for supporting those items. Let them know you are paying attention and will watch how they handle this next step. Suggest you will participate in the grassroots campaign to unseat them in '18. Representatives are looking at '18 elections and need to hear from all voters who disapprove of their voting record.

When you're done with the Representatives, you can start with the Senators up for re-election in '18 who voted for this tax bill: Dean Heller (R-NV) Ted Cruz (R-TX) Roger Wicker (R-MS) Deb Fischer (R-NE) John Barrasso (R-WY) Orrin Hatch (R-UT)* * Possibly retiring

(R-Nev) Sen. Dean Heller who voted for the tax bill tossed a constituent out of a town hall meeting. She is a Stage 4 Cancer patient who was asking him about health coverage in this bill. He's a snivelling coward.

Oh, and he's considered the most vulnerable R Senator up for re-election in '18. Datalounge, let's unseat this sorry excuse for a human. We can do it. Call, call, call on behalf of his D opponent. And call his office to spout off - especially about this treatment of his constituent.

--Anonymous
replies 219Dec 3, 2017 6:16 AM +00:00

Here's the story about Sen. Heller and the Stage 4 cancer patient at the town hall meeting on Saturday 12/2.

"Why is Sen. Dean Heller so afraid of a stage 4 cancer patient?" 
shareblue.com
--R219
replies 220Dec 3, 2017 6:23 AM +00:00

What imbecile thunks removing money from the economy in the form of spendable income, will strengthen the economy.

--Anonymous
replies 221Dec 3, 2017 6:25 AM +00:00

The calculator says the Senate plan would save me $300, the house plan will cost me $200. Actually, I think both plans could cost me $5000 per year.

--Anonymous
replies 222Dec 3, 2017 7:07 AM +00:00

For what tax year would this take effect?

--Anonymous
replies 223Dec 3, 2017 7:10 AM +00:00
I also think the sky is falling posters are right on this one. America doesn't come back from this.

nature abhors a void, you take something away, some other thing will immediately take its place. Medicare goes away, a fucking discretionary military budget will take it's place. it's just physics.

--Anonymous
replies 224Dec 3, 2017 7:29 AM +00:00

If this bill or a similar one gets passed, I plan on pre-paying some of my bills in 2017. I itemize on my taxes. I’ll bunch-up deductions in this tax year.

My property tax bill is issued right after the new year. I’ll pay it around December 15th.

I’ll pay my long term care insurance premium in December. It’s otherwise also due in January. It’s a medical deduction.

Ditto for state income taxes.

I just gave away $500 in clothes, too. I don’t think the charity deduction is threatened, but no matter.

--Anonymous
replies 225Dec 3, 2017 7:38 AM +00:00

R224, oh, I hate that. The military should be cut.

--Anonymous
replies 226Dec 3, 2017 7:39 AM +00:00

This bill will leave us with at least a $1.4 trillion deficit, if not more.

So the fiscally responsible party is doing what it always does-- borrow and spend.

It did it with two wars, Medicare Drug Law, and the huge tax cuts for the rich under both GWB and Reagan. THAT is why our debt doubled under Obama, not because anything much Obama did himself.

Obama was able to bring the years deficit down by filling the fiscal holes in the drug law via Obamacare, ending the wars, and raising taxes slightly on the wealthy.

This bill will now reverse it all again. And when a Dem is in the WH again, he will get blamed for the ballooning debt. I've seen this movie over and over

--Anonymous
replies 227Dec 3, 2017 7:44 AM +00:00

Trump promises every family gets raises and brings back $4000 more per year.

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOLOLLOLOLOL

--Anonymous
replies 228Dec 3, 2017 7:45 AM +00:00

Tax rates on corporations and high-income people need to be RAISED, not lowered.

--The booming 1950s and 1960s, with 70% top tax rate.
replies 229Dec 3, 2017 7:47 AM +00:00

The Senator from South Carolina who has been propped up by the GOP as a spokesperson for the bill (and was recently on the CNN forum about the tax bill) admits he didn't read the whole bill

--Anonymous
replies 230Dec 3, 2017 7:48 AM +00:00

Economies boom when the middle class has lots of money to spend. FACT.

This is why China's and India's economies started booming and the US' was its strongest after WWII.

Giving all the money to the rich doesn't suddenly make they create jobs, particularly if there's no middle class demand. That's the lie the GOP constantly spreads

--Anonymous
replies 231Dec 3, 2017 7:50 AM +00:00

Teachers lose a small deduction for buying school supplies while 1% get tax break for private jets.

The Repubs aren't even trying to hide their agenda anymore.

--Anonymous
replies 232Dec 3, 2017 7:50 AM +00:00

R282, clearly teachers need to hold class on private jets

--Anonymous
replies 233Dec 3, 2017 7:56 AM +00:00

i’m gonna enjoy my tax cut! 😍

--Anonymous
replies 234Dec 3, 2017 8:39 AM +00:00

I am in a blue state, can I call the reps in the red states using a phone card or something so that they can trace where I'm calling from to protest?

--Anonymous
replies 235Dec 3, 2017 8:56 AM +00:00

sorry, i meant CAN"T trace where i'm calling from ? i'm post R235

--Anonymous
replies 236Dec 3, 2017 8:57 AM +00:00

R202, if you had to pay an additional $129 you'd be screaming bloody murder.

--Anonymous
replies 237Dec 3, 2017 9:21 AM +00:00

There are always options...

pics.me.me
--Anonymous
replies 238Dec 3, 2017 9:52 AM +00:00

My question too R236. If you don't live in a red district or state how can you call and email these GOP fuckers to tell them you will be giving your money and time to their future opponents?

--R203
replies 239Dec 3, 2017 9:55 AM +00:00

Will property values collapse?

--Anonymous
replies 240Dec 3, 2017 10:03 AM +00:00

R240. I hope so

--Anonymous
replies 241Dec 3, 2017 10:19 AM +00:00

TO THOSE SAYING VOTE OUT ALL REPIGS BECAUSE THEIR YES VOTE.

IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN.

DEMS ARE LAZY ASS CUNTS WHEN IT COMES TO VOTING.

REPIGS WILL GET MORE REPIG VOTERS TO SHOW UP.

SAD!!!!!!!!!!

--Anonymous
replies 242Dec 3, 2017 10:20 AM +00:00

Hi Donald aka R242. How long have you been lurking on DL?

--Anonymous
replies 243Dec 3, 2017 10:56 AM +00:00

On Friday night these 3 Democrats in the Senate voted AGAINST an amendment to protect Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. Plz call them to let them know what you think of their vote.

@SenatorDurbin (IL) (202) 224-2152

@SenatorCarper (DE) (202) 224-2441

@MarkWarner (VA) (202) 224-2023

--Anonymous
replies 244Dec 3, 2017 11:12 AM +00:00

Why the fuck would they do that, R244?!

--Anonymous
replies 245Dec 3, 2017 11:14 AM +00:00

Yes R240 with the elimination of the deduction for state and local RE taxes you're going to see a big devaluation in RE prices. It's going to help push us back into a recession.

--Anonymous
replies 246Dec 3, 2017 12:01 PM +00:00

" We have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it, away from the fog of the controversy. "

Nancy Pelosi 9 March 2010

--Anonymous
replies 247Dec 3, 2017 12:23 PM +00:00

Jesus Christ, r247. You are so fucking stupid I can't believe you are able tie your own shoes without accidentally hanging yourself.

--Anonymous
replies 248Dec 3, 2017 12:25 PM +00:00

Why liberals groups like Antifa and BLM are not protesting this bill ?

--Anonymous
replies 249Dec 3, 2017 12:26 PM +00:00

they were only given 4 hrs to read the bill before it was passed. how could anyone fucking read the whole thing?

--Anonymous
replies 250Dec 3, 2017 12:29 PM +00:00

They couldn't. A lot of it still basically consisted of margin notes scrawled by lobbyists.

--Anonymous
replies 251Dec 3, 2017 12:44 PM +00:00

Yup, R248. That particular bit of trolling has been debunked so many times it's not even worth doing it again. The very fact that someone would bring that up reveals that they are either a) a moron, b) a troll, or c) both, usually the latter.

--Anonymous
replies 252Dec 3, 2017 12:45 PM +00:00
Why liberals groups like Antifa and BLM are not protesting this bill ?

well, first. Antifa isn't real, bunky, it is something for fox net ratings.

BLM is probably too worried about getting beat up to think about tax law.

--I see STOOPID PEOPLE
replies 253Dec 3, 2017 12:52 PM +00:00

The tax bill blow a $1.4 trillion dollars hole in the deficits, adds to it. We already have a deficit and you pay it down by raising taxes on corporations, stock exchanging fees and high end income and assets earners, like billionaire and millionaires. The longer we wait to do this, the worse the deficit becomes. This bill makes no sense economically, just on this only. The fall out for no tax revenue, and a huge deficit is a destructive one for our DEMOCRACY and the very lives of the American people.

When government sector does not have the money to employ people and there are lay offs, this is called a DEPRESSION. VERY VERY DANGEROUS. The government is the only entity that can pull a nation out of a recession/depression. But, you need tax revenue for this and coherent economic policy, you know based on math and evidence-based theory.

Clearly, if the government does not have tax revenue, this equals depression. How do you avoid a depression? You raise taxes and move to stabilize income equality/purchasing power.

--Anonymous
replies 254Dec 3, 2017 1:24 PM +00:00

This, from Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) It would appear that the senator is speaking for a vast majority of us. Please watch it through - he tears a hole.

--Anonymous
replies 255Dec 3, 2017 1:29 PM +00:00

R235 R236 R 239 R203 Yes. First, It is important to call your Senators and Representative even if they are Democrats. First, it shows them that their constituents are paying attention to how they are voting. If you approve of their performance and record as it pertains to your beliefs and needs for representation then tell them so and thank them. Ask how you can advocate for the democratic agenda regarding this bill. Ask where the bill is available for viewing and read it.

R235 R236 I believe it would be fine to use that card, pay cash. But I'm no expert.

Email EVERY Republican, especially Representatives right now, if you wish, to express your point of view on particular items in the bill that are egregious and unacceptable and demand that they justify their reasons for supporting those items. Let them know you are paying attention and will watch how they handle this next step. Suggest you will participate in the grassroots campaign to unseat them in '18. Representatives are looking at '18 elections and need to hear from all voters who disapprove of their voting record.

When you're done with the Representatives, you can start with the Senators up for re-election in '18 who voted for this tax bill: Dean Heller (R-NV) Ted Cruz (R-TX) Roger Wicker (R-MS) Deb Fischer (R-NE) John Barrasso (R-WY) Orrin Hatch (R-UT)* * Possibly retiring

(R-Nev) Sen. Dean Heller who voted for the tax bill tossed a constituent out of a town hall meeting. She is a Stage 4 Cancer patient who was asking him about health coverage in this bill. He's a snivelling coward.

Oh, and he's considered the most vulnerable R Senator up for re-election in '18. Datalounge, let's unseat this sorry excuse for a human. We can do it. Call, call, call on behalf of his D opponent. And call his office to spout off - especially about this treatment of his constituent.

--Anonymous
replies 256Dec 3, 2017 1:37 PM +00:00

R244 Thank you. I will be calling their offices on Monday to check on the details you posted.

--Anonymous
replies 257Dec 3, 2017 1:41 PM +00:00

Call you US representative (you have 1) via this number (Move-on.org): 844-311-7810

Call your US senators (you have 2): Sierra Club call system is: 855-980-5639

****************************** - ****************************** - ********* Also, you may call your US Senator and Representative through the US Senate Switchboard here:

(202) 224-3121. A switchboard operator will connect you directly with the Senate office you request.

Please Stay Plugged-in. WE can a limited period of days to kill this bill. Actions need everyday. Changes may be with in an hour.

Buy Safe Buy Green Guide 2017 Cruelty Free, Green and American made/Indies products and companies to buy from this Holiday season and beyond
reddit
--Anonymous
replies 258Dec 3, 2017 2:09 PM +00:00
erious question: Is there any point in calling your reps if they are all Dems and have already voted against the bill?

Call them and thank them. They're not used to getting calls like that.

We should start stockpiling guns so we can shoot GOP lawmakers. It needs to be done, after all. Look at all the mass shootings that kill ordinary, innocent people. It's not fair. America should be shooting the right people - GOP politicians who want to strip US citizens of everything

--Just Kidding!
replies 259Dec 3, 2017 2:18 PM +00:00

If you call the Congressional switchboard, can you talk to any Senator's office or only your home state's Senators? I'm not sure thanking your Dem Senators and House members is worth wasting your time on right now. They know where we are and they voted accordingly. Their polling shows them that. We need to kill the phone lines and offices of the GOP pieces of shit. Can we do that as out-of-staters?

--Anonymous
replies 260Dec 3, 2017 3:48 PM +00:00

Call your own and then call those that appear accessible to reason, then call those who aren't reasonable. Call everyone yu can no matter where you live. RAISE HELL. Do a little bit of research: Indivisible has good script suggestions on their websites and they have ranked the various members of Congress in terms of who may still be on the fence or have reservations or objections, but get busy.. If they don't respond to calls, "Mail box full" send them faxes and emails. But DO something. Find out who the staff is and contact them through their staff. Call their home offices in the districts or states where they live not just the D.C. offices. Keep calling. We have to pull this out. I hate McConnell and Orrin Hatch. Those cold smug corrupt pieces of shit they are celebrating too soon. Let's derail their fucking dreams.

--Anonymous
replies 261Dec 3, 2017 4:12 PM +00:00

Chuck Grassley believes ordinary people don't deserve tax breaks.

--Anonymous
replies 262Dec 3, 2017 4:17 PM +00:00

Here's a link to the Indivisible site. If you're not familiar with them get familiar. they do an outstanding job. They talk about the reconciliation process and the Senate and the House versions. if there is a conference committee they sense danger because it will expose their ratfucking for what it is. So the speculation is that Ryan will persuade his members to accept the Senate version and no need for a conference committee. Just support the Senate version and move on. if they do that our chances of stopping it are low. But we have alternatives. We can fuck with other legislation and end up funding programs one at a time.

Offsite Link
--Anonymous
replies 263Dec 3, 2017 4:23 PM +00:00

R259, you’re funny!

--Anonymous
replies 264Dec 3, 2017 4:32 PM +00:00

It seems, R45 that they are blue dog Dems, the very worst kind. They are for severely cutting or ending Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security. Remember it was a Blue Dog Democrat, Backus (sp) I think it was who destroyed the public option in the ACA. These Democrats have to be get a primary opponent and be voted out. They are 99.9% as bad as Republicans.

--Anonymous
replies 265Dec 3, 2017 4:51 PM +00:00

Social Security reduced poverty in the elderly by over 10%. We don’t necessarily think of that now because it’s done such a good job.

--Anonymous
replies 266Dec 3, 2017 4:58 PM +00:00

If Ryan can persuade the House members to accept the Senate version and by pass the conference committee, thus avoiding pubic scrutiny and discussion and an opportunity for us to stop this, then we're fucked. And there's every likelihood he will. Watch what happens Monday.

--Anonymous
replies 267Dec 3, 2017 5:03 PM +00:00

We're happy.

Old people used to be our best customers.

--Cat food companies
replies 268Dec 3, 2017 5:04 PM +00:00

From R262's link:

“I think not having the estate tax recognizes the people that are investing, as opposed to those that are just spending every darn penny they have, whether it’s on booze or women or movies," Grassley told the newspaper.

Is this going viral yet? If not, make it!! It's simple enough for even the deplorables to understand.

--Anonymous
replies 269Dec 3, 2017 5:16 PM +00:00

Your CALLS are working,

Senators who voted yes, are saying they might not vote yes on the final bill now. WOW! Just WOW!

CALL your US Representative (you have one)

Call your SENATORS (you have 2).

Make sure to e-mail your letters too. (to your 1 representative and 2 senators)

PROTEST PROTEST PROTEST at their Offices.

Move-on has some protest events listed on the website (you can click the picture, to go the Moveon dot org site)

GO to moveon dot org

KILL THIS BILL

TELL THEM TO:

VOTE NO on the Tax Cut and Job Bill, in any form!

Offsite Link
--Anonymous
replies 270Dec 3, 2017 7:41 PM +00:00

Would it be too much to ask of our Democrat senators to make a collective statement damning this tax bill?

At this point, I would like them to step out of their comfort zone of telling their constituents to keep calling and protesting, and stage a protest of their own.

Is that too much to fucking ask.

--Anonymous
replies 271Dec 3, 2017 7:54 PM +00:00
Senators who voted yes, are saying they might not vote yes on the final bill now. WOW! Just WOW!

I tried to google this but couldn't find anything. Please, fill us in. I hope it's true but I don't trust any of them.

--Anonymous
replies 272Dec 3, 2017 10:43 PM +00:00

STOP FUCKING AROUND WITH MY LOWER TAXES!!!!!!!!

--top
replies 273Dec 3, 2017 10:50 PM +00:00

Everyone CALL CALL CALL Monday morning

Your US Representative

Your 2 US Senators

Tell them to:

Vote No on the Tax CUt and job Bill, in any form.

We still can KILL THIS BILL, though the time is limited Monday and Tuesday.

PROTEST at their offices, join a protest and stay pulled into actions.

@moveon moveon dot org is one place

CALL ALERT URGENT CALL senators (you have 2) here: 888-701-0964 SAY THIS: 1.) Vote NO on the Tax Cuts and Job Act in any FORM. 2.) VOTE NO on...
reddit
--Anonymous
replies 274Dec 4, 2017 12:16 AM +00:00

The Senate version allow up 10K in property tax deduction. We will see if they keep it.

--Anonymous
replies 275Dec 4, 2017 4:04 AM +00:00

NEW ROUND OF CALLING

NEW ROUND OF EMAILING

The Tax Cut and Job bill (aka #GOPTaxscam) just moved to conference committee between the house and the senate. So, you can call again both your representative and your 2 senators.

Tell them:

VOTE NO on the Tax Cut and Job Bill, in any form

Reasons:

*dangerous 4 Americans

*Gives a gigantic tax break &cuts to billionaires, who do not need it.

* Allows for Oil Drilling in the Arctic Refugee, Why is this is a Tax bill?

*Guts health care, social and education programs. Bedrock programs for our democracy.

*Add a dangerous amount to the deficit, $1.4 TRILLION.

CALL CALL CALL

EMAIL EMAIL EMAIL

VOTE NO on the Tax Cut and Jobs Bill, in any form

This is a new round because the bill is in a new phases/procedure called conference committee. So say we want this bill to be stopped in the committe.

VOTE NO on the Tax CUt and Jobs bill, in any form.

Click picture for more information:

Or on twiiter go to #GOPTAXSCAM

MOVeon dot org may have a protest event near you too. PROTEST!

Buy Safe Buy Green Guide 2017 Cruelty Free, Green and American made/Indies products and companies to buy from this Holiday season and beyond
reddit
--Anonymous
replies 276Dec 4, 2017 4:57 PM +00:00
Is there any point in calling your reps if they are all Dems and have already voted against the bill?

Call and tweet reps in nearby red states telling them you can't wait til 2018/2020 to unseat them and that you're volunteering to canvas and drive people to the polls on Election Day.

--Anonymous
replies 277Dec 4, 2017 5:22 PM +00:00
Call them and thank them. They're not used to getting calls like that.

They are absolutely used to getting calls like that. Therefore they know to disregard the obvious astroturf campaigns.

--Anonymous
replies 278Dec 4, 2017 5:24 PM +00:00
Is there any point in calling your reps if they are all Dems and have already voted against the bill?

I called the office of one of the Republican reps in my state. I'm not his constituent, but my message was taken.

--Anonymous
replies 279Dec 4, 2017 5:24 PM +00:00

Thank you, r279.

--Anonymous
replies 280Dec 4, 2017 5:29 PM +00:00
They are absolutely used to getting calls like that. Therefore they know to disregard the obvious astroturf campaigns.

Says the "deplorable." Yeah, we'll be sure to take your "advice."

--Anonymous
replies 281Dec 4, 2017 5:34 PM +00:00

They don't give a shit about your fucking phone calls.

--Anonymous
replies 282Dec 4, 2017 5:34 PM +00:00

Yeah, they do. The Democrats are already going to continue to vote no on this dreadful bill but a few of the Republicans are genuinely nervous, and they damn well should be. Make some fucking noise.

--Anonymous
replies 283Dec 4, 2017 5:37 PM +00:00

Isn't it interesting how the two people trying to stop people from calling are both deplorables?

--Anonymous
replies 284Dec 4, 2017 5:38 PM +00:00

fuck congress

--Anonymous
replies 285Dec 4, 2017 7:13 PM +00:00

No, fuck Republicans.

--Anonymous
replies 286Dec 4, 2017 7:16 PM +00:00

R265 I thought it was Joe Lieberman who defeated the public option.

--Anonymous
replies 287Dec 4, 2017 7:23 PM +00:00

It was a group effort. Lieberman played a strong role, particularly in blocking allowing those 55 and older to buy into Medicare, but Baucus before that, in his ill-fated "Gang of Six" negotiations, started from the wrong point and ruled out the public option from the very beginning.

Baucus very deliberately started the talks with a template that was the core of the 1993-4 Republican plan, built around an individual mandate and exchanges with private insurers—much to the chagrin of many Democrats and liberals who wanted, if not a single-payer system, at least one with a public insurance option. Through the summer, the Gang of Six engaged in detailed discussions and negotiations to turn a template into a plan.
One reason for the continued resistance to the Affordable Care Act is a badly distorted narrative of how it became law.
The Atlantic
--Anonymous
replies 288Dec 4, 2017 7:31 PM +00:00

CALL CALL CALL New rounds of calls are needed NOW!

Call your US Representative on Tuesday (tomorrow) EMAIL THEM TOO, super fast.

Call your 2 US Senators on Tuesday and Wednesday

TEll THem:

Vote NO on the Tax Cuts and JOBS BIll

Reasons:

*Billionaires do not need a tax cut, they need a tax increase. *Bill threatens health care, social and education. *BLows a $1.4TRILLON dollar to the deficit (Adds to the deficit. *leads to guts to social security, medicare and medicaid. *Will harm our fellow Americans.

Click the picture, to go to an update page on actions to take and what to say.

CALL ALERT URGENT CALL senators (you have 2) here: 888-701-0964 SAY THIS: 1.) Vote NO on the Tax Cuts and Job Act in any FORM. 2.) VOTE NO on...
reddit
--Anonymous
replies 289Dec 4, 2017 11:32 PM +00:00

Don't worry OP- Unemployed homeless folks don't pay income tax- so scream at the moon and get back in your tent.

--Anonymous
replies 290Dec 5, 2017 1:59 AM +00:00

Indivisible is a great website. They will walk you through everything you need to know with good suggestions and great links.

Keep calling keep protesting when you can cite specific examples. There is no way you can support a tax increase on people making less than $75,000 a year. No way you can support blowing a hole in the deficit. Now way you can support destabilizing healthcare. We need our healthcare and our parents need medicare. Tell them to start paying attention to the people who voted for them.

Join the national movement to resist the Trump agenda. Learn the best ways to make Congress listen from former congressional staff. Together, we will win.
Indivisible
--Anonymous
replies 291Dec 5, 2017 2:48 AM +00:00

New from WaPo: The richest 1% now own an astonishing 40% of the country's wealth, their highest share in over 60 years. Today, the top 1 percent of households own more wealth than the bottom 90 percent combined.

Thank goodness the Republicans are giving the poor things a tax cut in this, their time of need.

Income inequality is bad enough, but wealth inequality is way worse.
Washington Post
--Anonymous
replies 292Dec 6, 2017 6:43 AM +00:00

What is the big fucking deal over making a lousy phone call or two or sending an email or a tweet.

I'm sure the ones on this thread that are discouraging people from doing it are filthy rich and can't wait to get their greedy hands on those tax cuts for the rich. Otherwise there is no point in discouraging people from doing something that takes next to no effort and can only help, not hurt.

--Anonymous
replies 293Dec 6, 2017 11:58 AM +00:00

Look at what else they've posted, R293. Most of them are our resident trolls.

--Anonymous
replies 294Dec 6, 2017 12:00 PM +00:00

I'm sure, R294. Thank you for doing the legwork I didn't think to do.

--R293
replies 295Dec 6, 2017 1:06 PM +00:00

“[The tax bill is] death to Democrats,” said conservative economist Stephen Moore, who advised Trump’s campaign on tax policy.

“They go after state and local taxes, which weakens public employee unions. They go after university endowments, and universities have become play pens of the left. And getting rid of the mandate is to eventually dismantle Obamacare,” Moore said in an interview, arguing that it would accelerate “a death spiral” in the health-care law’s marketplaces.

Grad students, government workers and public school teachers are among those who would be hardest hit by the GOP tax plan.
Bloomberg.com
--Anonymous
replies 296Dec 6, 2017 1:17 PM +00:00

oops

This is what happens when you pass handwritten legislation at 2 a.m.
Slate Magazine
--Anonymous
replies 297Dec 6, 2017 3:32 PM +00:00

R296 he is also spewing propaganda. Just don't look isn't wise but look and despise it is well justified.

--Anonymous
replies 298Dec 6, 2017 4:35 PM +00:00
Just don't look isn't wise but look and despise it is well justified.

is English your second language?

--Anonymous
replies 299Dec 6, 2017 5:25 PM +00:00

FUCKING HELL!!!!

--I'd kill congress if I could
replies 300Dec 21, 2017 2:59 PM +00:00
CALL AND PROTEST IN THE STREETS FOR THIS.

The melodrama ain't happening baby.

thumbs.gfycat.com
--Anonymous
replies 301Dec 21, 2017 3:02 PM +00:00

Then Fuck you

--Anonymous
replies 302Dec 21, 2017 5:46 PM +00:00

*Shrug* Give it time, R301. The damage will happen regardless of whether the protests do or not.

--Anonymous
replies 303Dec 21, 2017 5:49 PM +00:00

it's total anarchy

--Anonymous
replies 304Dec 21, 2017 8:52 PM +00:00

nobody will do shit .... yet. but next year, actually try to remember, millennials, and get your ass to the polls. if every millennial voted, we'd be fine.

--Anonymous
replies 305Dec 21, 2017 9:00 PM +00:00

indeed, they stayed away in droves

--Anonymous
replies 306Dec 22, 2017 8:18 AM +00:00