Turmoil at Tesla

[quote]Tesla is also laying off 14,000 workers due to declining sales.

Holy shit, that's a lot of workers.

[quote]its share price has lost one-third of its value.

And still way, way overvalued.

The key demo for Tesla was high income eco-conscious lefties. What lefty wants to buy or be seen in a Tesla now that comrade Musk has revealed himself as a right winger? I live in a purple area of a red state and I hardly ever see a Tesla of late when they were once more numerous. I presume the lefties got rid of theirs and the righties are all driving trucks.

Couldn't have happened to a bigger, fucking rancid, putrid cunt.

It was status at one point to own a Tesla. My techie 20-something neighbor paid $75,000 cash, for his— at the urging of his status-conscious wife.

Glad I sold my stock

When will the Tesla Board realize that Elon Musk is their biggest problem, and that they'd do a lot better if they completely ousted him. And part of that is admitting the cybertruck was a horrible mistake, and just cancel that thing.

And yeah, Teslas went from being a status symbol to an albatross. Many are selling theirs because they don't want to be associated with Elon Musk in any way. Also? The reality of the fact that the quality control is TERRIBLE has really tarnished the brand above and beyond Musk (though it must be said, Musk is the root cause for the quality issues).

It's time for the Tesla board to fire Elon Trump. Unfortunately, they won't, because Elon Musk stacked the board with acolytes and sycophants.

Teslas are actually now kind of a good deal. The Model 3 was just recently updated and has been getting very good reviews, and the prices have been lowered significantly. The Supercharger network is superior to any of the competition.

I am shocked (shocked!) that the world's most-overvalued company is dropping in worth faster than you can say "Elmo is an idiot".

Tesla was supposed to open a dealership in my city years ago but it fizzled out.

They are fascinating cars but if you have Corolla money and don’t think much of Elon, why bother.

DON'T GO WOKE GO BROKE!

Come on Tim Cook, swoop in and buy Tesla for cheap.

Make the brand the "must have" car again as only Apple can do!

NOOOO! APPLE CAN NEVER OWN TESLA! GOD BLESS DONALD TRUMP.

Elon Musk is a fascist dick and the only people who would buy a car from a fascist dick are people who think EVs are woke... lose/lose 😛

Then there was this piece of marketing genius, get people to buy a $100,000 truck by showing them how easy it is to vandalize 🙄

R11, supposedly Musk offered to sell years back. But, love your idea for now.

Tesla has too much technological know-how and advanced production techniques to just die. It'll merge with some other company. I could imagine it merging with Stellantis or most likely a Chinese company.

Sales are down for all American EVs. If any car companies are going to die soon, it'll be Rivian and Lucid before Tesla.

^ EVs came on too fast and people are resisting and until the charging network is more complete you'll never get people who live in apartments to buy them

[quote]EVs came on too fast and people are resisting and until the charging network is more complete you'll never get people who live in apartments to buy them

Ya think?

^ There you go and even with a more complete network it's still a hassle for people in apartments/urban areas to get charged, because even with charges on every corner there is still that long wait. EVs are great for people in suburban areas who have a garage and can just plug-in at the end of the day

Fisker is going to go broke first, R16. Not that Rivian or Lucid are doing that well... but yeah, Tesla will be bought and merged into one of the real car companies, probably at an inflated price that will net Elmo $billions. Maybe he'll buy Truth Salad and run that into the ground, too.

What should happen to Tesla is that a competitor like BMW should buy it out, take all the technology, and bury the name in a trash heap.

"I could imagine it merging with Stellantis."

If Stellantis does to Tesla what it is currently doing to Dodge, Chrysler, Jeep and Ram you can kiss it goodbye within 5 years of purchase.

Other than some vague promise of future EVs, Stellantis hasn't introduced a single new vehicle, EV or ICE, since it purchased Fiat Chrysler. But has laid of hundreds and hundreds of Chrysler employees while discontinuing the Chrysler 300, the Dodge Charger and Challenger, and the Jeep Renegade and Cherokee. Meanwhile Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep/Ram dealers have by far the highest inventory of unsold cars on their lots than any other brand and can't give them away.

[quote] Maybe he'll buy Truth Salad and run that into the ground, too.

I think current management will beat him to it.

r21 BMW does not need to. I had a Tesla, have a BMW i4 now. It is light years better of a car and gets just as good of range

Where I live, Teslas are the car of choice for ride share drivers who get some kind of monthly rental deal on them.

[QUOTE] BMW does not need to. I had a Tesla, have a BMW i4 now. It is light years better of a car and gets just as good of range

Yes, much of their decline is due to the fact that competitors are just flat out making better and sexier cars than them. Who wants a Tesla when you can have an electric BMW or Benz?

r26 not just that but QC. Teslas have huge quality control issues. Panel gaps, sub par build materials. Repairs take months for simple things.

[quote]Stellantis hasn't introduced a single new vehicle, EV or ICE, since it purchased Fiat Chrysler.

You don't know what you are talking about.

It has introduced several new vehicles. In Europe.

Stellantis is doing very well in Europe. It's the 4th largest car company in the world in sales. Bigger than GM. Bigger than Ford.

It has now even surpassed Tesla for EV sales there.

Tesla makes their European cars in Germany in a new state-of-the-art factory.

I sure could imagine a merger between Stellantis and Tesla.

Ellen is focused? More like she throws span at the wall and treats others as “human capital”.

Spahgetti* not span

[quote]Yes, much of their decline is due to the fact that competitors are just flat out making better and sexier cars than them. Who wants a Tesla when you can have an electric BMW or Benz?

That’s why Tesla has had to drastically cut their prices. A base Model 3 now starts at $39k, while a base BMW i4 starts at $52.

[quote]Teslas have huge quality control issues. Panel gaps, sub par build materials. Repairs take months for simple things.

BMW and Mercedes also have far superior dealership networks and offer a better ownership experience. What Tesla has is their superior charging infrastructure.

The Tesla factory in Germany

r32 and most every EV will use it in 2025.

Stock is down 60%

^ Gee...

Cybertruck sales halted due to “unintended acceleration” issues

Wow, R37. That's build quality for you. What, did they show this design to Elmo when he was injecting or smoking K?

With luxury brands finally waking up to the fact that diving head first into EVs was stupid and now committing to building hybrids, Tesla will be in even more trouble. I would never buy an EV. I already have enough anxiety in my life without adding “charging anxiety. I will, however, buy a hybrid if it’s a vehicle I like.

Yeah I’m shocked by Tesla’s anti-hybrid stance. They’re leaving money on the table. More Americans are comfortable with hybrids, it’s obvious.

Tesla is run by somebody who treats cars as a part time job.

EVs are fully viable. Hyrbid is the oil industry's way of staying in the game. China is light years beyond us in EV. Companies like BYD and Nio are putting out cars that go farther and charge faster. BYD has a battery swap technology where you drive up and they swap out a new fully charged battery in 10 minutes. It's why Tesla and others are fighting to keep them out of the US.

Apple buys Tesla, the promptly splits into five companies- transportation, entertainment, hardware, software and music.

Honda had one of the best plug-in electric hybrids (the "Clarity") and yet... they discontinued it. Inexplicable. I have one that is six years old now, and I would love to replace it with a newer model, but there isn't one. I've looked around and none of the other plug-in electric hybrids even come close. This kind of hybrid is perfect for me. No range anxiety for longer trips where there's little charging infrastructure, but I can spend most of my time all-electric and not spend much on gas at all.

I don't get why Honda stopped making this amazing car.

Honda should have checked with you first, right r43?

@r41, " China is light years beyond us in EV. "

They have EV issues in China

I'll stick with my Stanley Steamer, thank you.

Teslas became too mainstream, lost their exclusivity as a result, and the quality control issues didn't help. Any idiot who can pay $500/mo can lease one. You can literally live in your Mom's basement and have one, which is common here in the Bay Area. Uber drivers use them regularly.

Musk's lunaticism aside, the product did itself in.

Our local strip mall has a row of charging stations, and as one poster noted above, it's full of Indians charging their Teslas. I mean that in the most deragotary, classist, but not racist way. Anyone who lives in the Bay Area knows what I mean. And it doesn't = luxury.

R44, it's a nearly perfect car... 45 miles all electric (easily handles a 20 mile roundtrip commute on a single charge), it's very comfortable, zero maintenance issues in six years, looks good, drives great, and it's priced right (it was $40k for this car, the top of the line model with all the bells and whistles).

I have no idea why it didn't sell better... obviously it's not great for apartment dwellers, but anyone with a garage where they can install a level 2 charging station like I did, it's a no-brainer. Better than a typical non-plug-in "hybrid", and better than most plug in hybrids (which can only do something like 10 or 20 miles all electric), and no range anxiety at all unlike all-electrics. It's a perfect transition vehicle while waiting for the charging grid to be built out.

It's easily the best car I've ever owned, and I spend less than $60 a YEAR on gasoline.

I'm thinking about a PHEV. (I could never go all-electric.) What do we think about the BMW x5?

[quote]Honda had one of the best plug-in electric hybrids (the "Clarity") and yet... they discontinued it.

I don’t think plug-in hybrids are really that appealing to most people. If you have to charge every night anyway, why not just go all-electric? And if you’re doing a lot of long-range trips, then a regular hybrid is probably the right answer. Plug-in hybrids make sense for some people, but I don’t think they have a wide appeal.

[quote]If you have to charge every night anyway, why not just go all-electric?

Because I can go on a long trip, even on a spur of the moment, without having to meticulously plan out how to recharge. And if I forget to charge overnight, who cares, I can just drive anyway because gas is the backup, and it's readily available everywhere. I don't understand why it's NOT more appealing to more people. It makes the most sense.

Why a PHEV? Because you can charge with a regular outlet, for one. It would cost me a bundle to upgrade my electrical panel to accommodate a 240 charger. And 95% of of my driving is within the range of a PHEV. (I'm retired and don't commute.)

Once you deplete the battery on a PHEV and you’re running on gas, the engine is less efficient than a regular hybrid would be. So if you’re not charging every night and running it all-electric…it defeats the point of even buying a PHEV. I just don’t see how it’s better than a Tesla or other EV.

[quote]Because I can go on a long trip, even on a spur of the moment, without having to meticulously plan out how to recharge.

But how many long trips are you really doing, if you said you spend less than $60 a year on gas?

If you can't see it, then you're just blind, R53. It's perfectly efficient, imho. I have a 7 gallon gas tank and on a full charge can drive over 350 miles no problem before I have to fill up at a gas station or recharge. You can also toggle between the modes to use the electric in stop-and-go traffic where electric is tons more efficient, and switch to gas on steady freeway speeds where a gas engine is most efficient.

R48, I think the Clarity was too early and hobbled by its looks (I happen to love its looks now). You'd have to chime in on how it was priced relative to the market.

I wouldn't mind one either, and I have no place to plug it in except 5 minutes away by foot at City Hall.

R54, the point you seem to be missing is completely eliminating the WORRY about it. ZERO range anxiety. If I had a full electric, I'd never EVER take long trips because I'd be constantly worried of running out of juice and not being able to find a place to charge, or having to sit there for HOURS while it recharges.

How do you not GET this?

Whether I actually went on a long trip last year (I didn't) is irrelevant to the point I COULD at ANY TIME (like I have in the past) and not have to worry about it or plan it out or make any effort at all.

R57, I've read that the Clarity averaged 40 mpg without the battery, so that's pretty amazing.

Back to Tesla, Musk will run the company into the ground with stupidity like the Cybertruck, lack of quality, and, above all, his alienating of those who are the buyers of his cars.

He needs to go.

Chevrolet had the volt, which was a hyrbid that used the gas engine to recharge the electric motor, so the car ran on electricity but was recharged by a small gas engine when the battery ran out. It could get about 50-60 miles on pure electric charge which was good for most commutes around town and would charge overnight. The Clarity came in three different versions - the hydrogen one, the ev that only got 90 miles range and the hybrid the poster is talking about. The Fiskar Karma was based of the Chevy Volt engine. Dodge has a ram truck coming out with a similar concept but using today's battery technology where they claim 700 miles range on a charge/full tank

It's clear Musk is a great "big idea" guy, and a terrible "sweat the details" kind of guy.

Unfortunately, sweating the details is what makes a product better than their competition. See: Toyota.

I'd say one thing that people tend to forget is that electric vehicles are not a mature technology yet. Some claim that it is just as dirty as ICE cars because of the energy-intensive manufacturing process.

This type of thinking excludes (deliberately?) the realization that the technology will mature at some point. The manufacturing process will be cleaner, batteries will become more capable, charge faster and will have longer range. And then their eco-footprint will be a lot better than today and compared to ICE vehicles. So just because an EV is not for you right now, it doesn't mean that it isn't for you forever.

And as new technology goes, it is never perfect right from the start. It needs its time to improve. Just think how many decades it took to get ICE engines to the level they are today.

[QUOTE] Chevrolet had the volt, which was a hyrbid that used the gas engine to recharge the electric motor, so the car ran on electricity but was recharged by a small gas engine when the battery ran out. It could get about 50-60 miles on pure electric charge which was good for most commutes around town and would charge overnight.

Isn’t this a PHEV?

Yeah, and really upset that GM canceled the Volt as well. A lot of people loved it. Used to see a lot of them around town.

I don't understand why they canceled the Volt and kept the Bolt... they should still have both, and be iterating and refining each of them.

[quote]Unfortunately, sweating the details is what makes a product better than their competition. See: Toyota.

Toyotas aren’t better than their competition. However, the company has built a loyal base of buyers over the years who won’t consider anything else.

[quote]If you can't see it, then you're just blind, [R53]. It's perfectly efficient, imho. I have a 7 gallon gas tank and on a full charge can drive over 350 miles no problem before I have to fill up at a gas station or recharge.

A Tesla Model 3 can go 350 miles before it needs to recharge too. Again, not seeing how a PHEV is any better.

[quote]Toyotas aren’t better than their competition.

Then tell us why they consistently get the highest satisfaction ratings — by buyers — of any brand. And then please explain why Toyota customers are so loyal if you can buy cheaper or even just other branded cars that are just as reliable, aesthetic and last as long.

We'll wait.

[quote]Then tell us why they consistently get the highest satisfaction ratings — by buyers — of any brand. And then please explain why Toyota customers are so loyal if you can buy cheaper or even just other branded cars that are just as reliable, aesthetic and last as long. We'll wait.

Comsumer Rpeorts says that BMW is the best car brand overall. They also rank Subaru and Honda higher than Toyota.

[quotes] Then tell us why they consistently get the highest satisfaction ratings

Because buyers have different expectations in brands. Toyotas are no frill. Their technology is never brand new or exciting but affordable and reliable. Toyota buyers are not the same as BMW or Ferrari. BMW buyers have different needs and expectations. High tech and excellent performance comes at a higher price point. And because the higher tech is newer it also tends to be less reliable.

Toyotas are beyond dependable. They can last 2 decades if given the chance with routine maintenance. Everything from the engine to the instrument is reliable.

Our Prius has gone two hundred thousand miles even after $13,000 worth of damage (a deer ran into the front end at 70 MPH) five years ago. Tons of almost 10-20 year old Priuses all over the roads still here in the Bay Area.

Teslas...

If Apple buys Tesla, maybe they can get Jony Ive out of retirement for some cutting edge design.

As GM's Harley Earl knew, style sells automobiles.

@r64, "Toyotas aren’t better than their competition"

Um, yes, yes they are. Toyota is consistently rated one of the best cars in the world

Hint, it's Lexus

[quote]A Tesla Model 3 can go 350 miles before it needs to recharge too. Again, not seeing how a PHEV is any better.

R65, are you exceedingly dense?

What happens at the end of that 350 miles?

Jesus christ, WTF is wrong with you that you cannot understand the concept of "RANGE ANXIETY", and that a Tesla induces that in its owners while something like a Clarity does NOT.

This is not rocket science. This is the simplest fucking thing in the world. When I was doing long distance driving through Texas (zero electric infrastructure at the time) when I got near the end of my 350 miles, I just stopped at any old gas station and was on my way fully able to go another 300 miles in just five minutes with no stress, no worry, no problem.

A Tesla in the same circumstance would be up shit creek without a paddle. You'd have to have pre-planned distances and organized your trip around charging stations.

Now pull your goddamned head out of your ass. If you can't see the difference, you're a blithering idiot.

[quote]Um, yes, yes they are. Toyota is consistently rated one of the best cars in the world. Hint, it's Lexus

Consumer Reports looks at all factors…including reliability, driving performance, customer satisfaction scores, and safety features. And they determined that BMW scores higher than Lexus, and Subaru and Honda score higher than Toyota.

[QUOTE]A Tesla Model 3 can go 350 miles before it needs to recharge too. Again, not seeing how a PHEV is any better.

Yeah, 350 miles with everything including the radio off. Turn on anything in that car and the range drops. They probably get about 250 miles realistically, and I’m sure the more you charge it the more it drops even further.

[quote][R65], are you exceedingly dense? What happens at the end of that 350 miles? Jesus christ, WTF is wrong with you that you cannot understand the concept of "RANGE ANXIETY", and that a Tesla induces that in its owners while something like a Clarity does NOT.

What happens at the end of that 350 miles? You plug it into a Supercharger and it charges to 80 percent in 25 minutes.

Maybe we should just accept that some of us don’t live with anxiety 24/7 and are fine with an EV. For the rest of you, there are plug-in hybrids.

We have friends with an EV and they love it. I’m happy for them. That being said, whenever they’re planning a long drive they rent a gas powered vehicle. Saves mileage on their personal vehicle and they avoid the hassle of planning their drive around available charging locations.

@r73, You're wrong and I linked an article @r71 from CR that says your wrong. It's Ok to be wrong, but you can't just keep insisting you're right when you're not. You sound like a Trumper

@r76, well that's kind of dumb, spend $50K on a car then have to rent one if you want to go further than the grocery store

[quote]@[R73], You're wrong and I linked an article @[R71] from CR that says your wrong. It's Ok to be wrong, but you can't just keep insisting you're right when you're not. You sound like a Trumper

You linked to an article that looks ONLY at reliability. Reliability doesn’t equal BEST. When Consumer Reports looked at all factors, including reliability, driving performance, customer satisfaction, and safety features…they determined that BMW was better OVERALL than Lexus, and Subaru and Honda were better OVERALL than Toyota. There’s nothing wrong with buying a car based strictly on reliability alone, but many people care about driving performance and other factors as well.

[quote]@[R76], well that's kind of dumb, spend $50K on a car then have to rent one if you want to go further than the grocery store

Plug-in hybrids are perfect for nervous people who develop “range-anxiety” if they have to travel “further than the grocery store.” For the rest of us, there are EVs and hybrids.

R71, I was just going to post what r79 said. That list was only reliability. Damn there/s my Mercedes near the bottom of the list.

@r79, So link me to an article supporting your point...

"Consumer Reports looks at all factors…including reliability, driving performance, customer satisfaction scores, and safety features. And they determined that BMW scores higher than Lexus, and Subaru and Honda score higher than Toyota. "

I'll wait 🤨

@r81, Because Mercedes is crap when it comes to reliability. I don't care how good it handles if it's sitting in the shop most of the time, it's crap

R82, the article you are requesting was already posted at R67.

So, R75, you ARE exceedingly dense. Or you think Super chargers are just everywhere. When they're not.

Maybe YOU should accept that not everyone lives in a location (or wants to travel to or through a location) that has great charging infrastructure. You incomprehensible fucking self-absorbed moron.

@r84, well, it's good to know that BMW is getting better. I hope they keep up the good work

Some employees didn’t realize they were laid off until they went to scan their badges at work

There should have been more shift to focus on hybrids. Hybrids make a lot more sense for many parts of the world, particularly colder climates. As for Tesla, dumping Musk might help, but I’m guessing a good majority of board members are firmly up his ass.

Very few people need a car or SUV that goes 100 miles in a day. Most urban drivers don't need more than that.

I hope my friend isn't out of a job. I'm longtime friends with someone who works on building Cybertrucks, predominantly the frame at Tesla Gigafactory. Was telling me that he makes a good deal of money on the usual UAW work schedule. Tesla sucks, their car sucks, but they tend to compensate well. Guess it's just an upside of being a past-his-prime billionaire's brainchild running this failing concept.

Cybertrucks suck, and the sooner they stop making them, the better.

More like cybersuck, amirite?

Agreed, R91.

The board is too busy making sure Elon gets his $56 billion back

R75, R85 girls, GIRLS!! You’re both being “EXCEEDINGLY” annoying. Tesla market cap was wildly overvalued and still is even with the drop. I think it’s got a lot further to fall yet.

Several co-workers and I placed deposits on Tesla 3s back in 2017.

Then Tesla removed free access to the Super Charger network for the Tesla 3s, then Tesla removed fully automated driving from the Tesla 3 as a standard option, then I got my deposit back and continued to drive my Prius C for several more years.

I JUST retired the 2012 Prius C and got a 2024 Prius Prime PHEV. PHEVs are where it's at.

EVs and PHEVs have the problem that charging them isn't always easy. If you have your own garage - great! You set up your own charger and you can charge every night, every week if it's an EV. But if you don't have your own infrastructure it's going to be difficult. People will not seek public charging every day for their PHEV. And apartment buildings usually don't offer these chargers. IMHO, this is what holds back further expansion. One family units are covered, apartments and condos are not.

PHEVs are much easier to adapt to for charging than EVs, which need 240V chargers.

Here's an idea. While laying off 10% of your workforce due to declining sales, lets re-instate an illegal $56 Billion (with a B) pay package for Musk.

I wonder are they getting saddled with bad debt by offering sub-prime loans? Where I live it's not the young professionals that are driving around in these cars.

r97 most new EVs come with 2-3 years free charging (non - tesla) to compensate for apartment dwellers or a free install of a l2 charger at home if you can get one. I had an l2 at home already from my previous EV so I opted for the free 2 years on Electrify America for my BMW I4. You get 30 minis of free charging - which will get my car from 10-80% but here is the trick. It is free 30 mins per session, not per day so you can charge for 30, unplug and plug back in for another 30 mins free. I get about 340 miles of range so I only charge once a week but that is free electricity for a year.

Tesla has gone straight down the shitter!!!

Into the shitter!

Musk has systematically destroyed the Tesla brand via what he's revealed about himself after purchasing Twitter which he has also systematically destroyed. He can't fix this because he IS this. People are getting sick to death of "billionaires" stomping around the planet.

Moral of the story: you can only be a gargantuan asshole for so long before everybody catches on and it causes massive damage.

[quote]reported this month that its global vehicle deliveries in the first quarter fell for the first time in nearly four years.

For any car manufacturer to go 4 years without a drop in sales is quite a feat.

Right now the Tesla model line-up looks really old. Instead of devoting so much money and effort into the Cybertruck they should have been updating their cars.

Way back when Rambler owned the compact car market their sales were booming, then everyone else came out with compacts and the company started to slide and eventually died. It sort of reminds me of the situation Tesla is in, they're no longer the only game in town.

[quote]Moral of the story: you can only be a gargantuan asshole for so long before everybody catches on and it causes massive damage.

This is also what's happening to J.Lo.

To R104, I agree with your post; he can't fix the problem because he is the problem! I met Elon 3 times thru work, never trusted him. I told my 2 bosses, "Never trust a Big Idea guy"

The Cybertruck’s failure is now complete

WTF was the "Druggie musk" on when he approved the design of the Cyber musk-truck!

Seriously, did the Tesla designers& engineers ask "real truckers" about the musk truck design& how it will work on the highway.

I laughed when I saw the design concepts years ago, my European boss (Italian Gg& his wife) were the 1st in the company to see the concepts...they laughed. I told my bosses, I know trucks& truckers, I cannot do a trucker or blow him in this truck. It's in the company record, they showed me the video meeting of these comments last week in NYC. No monies for Elon& Tesla.

My Cybertruck looks awesome!

[quote] The key demo for Tesla was high income eco-conscious lefties.

And the common herd never wanted these EVs Joe is forcing on America in the first place

That's not what the article says, R111.

R94

The new Prius is gorgeous.

Elon Musk: Tesla isn’t a car company

Grasp those straws, Elmo!

Laying off thousands at the new Austin factory.

Is there any business that Elon ISN'T running into the ground?

Like he grasped these straws ?

The cybertruck is so hilariously ugly. Who would have ever wanted to own it?

Status-seeking tools, r118

Agreed, Status-seeking tools just like all the other internal combustion haters

R120, I think you are projecting. Not all hybrid or EV drivers are "haters". First of all, "hate" is a pretty hyperbolic word in this context. So - choosing this word is not really helpful. Then, some EV owners couldn't care less about the environment. They just want the free left-lane ride on the freeway with a bumper sticker. Sure there are some smug EV and hybrid owners. But are they "all" like that?

I wish people were a bit more levelheaded and fact based in this discussion. And why does the discussion often have to become political? Some people reflexively reject EVs and hybrids because they consider it a demonic Democratic ploy. I am so sick of peoples' political feelings.

You have to admit, the "South Park" episode of Priuses, George Clooney at the Oscars, smugness was pretty awesome.

The quality issues of the Cybertruck ALONE are disqualifying. The things are falling apart and breaking down even as they're driven off the lot. Even if they DIDN'T look like laughable shit designed by a 3 year old who knew nothing about trucks, they're awful... expensive piles of shit that don't work.

I hate buying gas. It’s a contribution to greedy, climate change denying companies and despots. I want an EV but would never buy a Tesla because of Elon. I am. Toyota driver and have been looking at hybrids but I am worried about the catalytic converter thefts and that there is no real solution. Also you can’t order the exact car you want. You can make a request to the Toyota dealership and wait a few months to see what comes in. There is so mush demand they have been charging over msrp and have a take it or leave it attitude. I would love a BMW but they are so expensive.

The new 2024 Prius is quite the looker. I’ve never even thought about owning a Prius before but I wouldn’t mind having this one. I can see why Motor Trend gave it the COTY award.

With a hybrid, trips to the gas station can be few and far between. My mother has a hybrid and I gas it up for her probably every two months.

I see a shitload of Teslas around me, but they're all driven by Indian men who work in tech. You know the type. They always have the latest iPhone, a fridge with a television in the door, and a dog cloned from a WKC champion.

They're a cheesy status symbol for idiots who care more about branding than quality. And in my neck of the woods, the Indian diaspora fits that to a T.

Argument settled

Kelli is trinnee

Cybertruck good

R127 I rest my case about trash who value image over quality.

The stock jumped today on the news that they plan to manufacture a more affordable model starting next year.

Lost in this exuberance is whether a) there really is a lower-end market in this time when EVs are losing some of their luster; b) they can actually deliver a quality product by then (considering that, last we knew, they’d abandoned plans for such a car); and c) whether the Tesla design doesn’t fall out of favor, as they plan to use some interchangeable parts, so the design can’t evolve much.

The QUICKEST way to turn all this mess around is for Musk to partner with GM to buy this light post/EV charger combo company and offer to rig every city in America with them, and offer free or almost free charging through electric providers.

[QUOTE] The stock jumped today

The stock jumped cause Katy “bought” a Cybertruck

[quote]partner with GM

Tesla is bigger than GM, Ford, and Fiat Chrysler [italic]combined[/italic]. Why would they partner with a car manufacturer that can barely make a car anyone wants? Aside, of course, for their ability to manufacture cars that don't turn into bricks in the car wash.

Katy Perry is an irrelevant has-been who has no influence on the stock market.

I used to like Katy Perry. That's all gone now. And buying one of these stupid things is just the cherry on top of that.

Nobody cares what she does or doesn't buy.

Everybody wants an electric car. Thanks for imposing them Joe.

New York CNN —

Ford’s electric vehicle unit reported that losses soared in the first quarter to $1.3 billion, or $𝟏𝟑𝟐,𝟎𝟎𝟎 for each of the 10,000 vehicles it sold in the first three months of the year, helping to drag down earnings for the company overall.

R135 Ford never could manage their finances. Remember their bailout?

If Tesla were up for sale, I am thinking a Chinese competitor would be interested to get easier entry to the US- and European markets.

The bloom is off the rose with EVs and Tesla will be affected just as the other EV makers will be.

[quote]Ford’s electric vehicle unit reported that losses soared in the first quarter to $1.3 billion, or $𝟏𝟑𝟐,𝟎𝟎𝟎 for each of the 10,000 vehicles it sold in the first three months of the year, helping to drag down earnings for the company overall.

And that's why you have to consider what Tesla has achieved in the last 10 years is really quite amazing.

Whether they will be able to sustain their success is another story...

Fisker claims that they are in negotiations with four other manufacturers to be sold to one of them. Allegedly one of them is Nissan. Sounds strange to me. Does Fisker have anything valuable? I suppose if the price is right it could be a relative quick entry into the EV world.

Tesla's so full of shit-

R136, Ford was not bailed out. GM and Chrysler were; Chrysler twice.

Ford took $6 billion, R142.

Tesla also got a loan from the government:

GM and Chrysler paid back their money, too. Over a decade ago.

R143, perhaps we are both correct. They took out loans, but never declared bankruptcy. They were shrewd in how much they borrowed.