The BF and I moved from Los Angeles to Las Vegas last year, thinking it would be cheaper to buy a house, lower cost of living, etc. We hate it here! We have decided to move back to California, but don''t want to head back to LA. We are seriously looking at San Diego, but don''t know much more than Hillcrest. How is the house rental market? Where should we look? Thoughts?
Why do you hate it there, OP?%0D\
I ask because I am seriously considering moving there. %0D\
There is no gay scene. None. Seriously. One tiny little bookstore. We have been gay bashed twice (verbal) in less than 7 months. And also there is nothing here but The Strip. Nothing. Once you tire of it (and you will), there is absolutely nothing to do.\
On the plus side, we are renting a 3BD/2BA house for less than the one bedroom we were renting in LA.\
And don''t get me started on the heat.
San Diego is beautiful. We lived in Point Loma and it was easy to get to the freeways, downtown, and the airport. Great weather, convenient shopping, lots to do. We are looking forward to moving back there as soon as we can. Good luck!
It''s unbelievable living in San Diego, OP!\
R1, do NOT move to Vegas. I have been here 15 years and it is a horrible, lonely place for gay people. I''m stuck here for many reasons, don''t do the same to yourself. Go anywhere else but Vegas.\
I also want to move to SD
I'm from Boston and have lived in San Diego for many years. I couldn't stand living here for the longest time because I just like the metropolitan feeling of the East Coast. But San Diego has grown into the city I wanted it to be. It could be even more cosmopolitan, but it's really become a quite the city.%0D
The cost of living is high, and even in the best of times, the economy and the job market are difficult. But if you can find your niche, you will enjoy it. The climate is moderate. No, it's not always sunny, in fact, we haven't had much of a summer. But usually it's nice in the summer. And we get our share of rain in the winter. And there are so many beautiful areas of San Diego. %0D
San Diego has a large gay population centered around Hillcrest as well as North Park and Mission Hills. San Diego has one of the most beautiful nude beaches there is--Black's Beach. There is lots of wealth and natural beauty in San Diego. There is also a big homeless problem just like in any city. Geographically San Diego is vast and very spread out and has a variety of landscapes. The demographics are wide and varied from rich to poor and ethnically diverse. And it's no longer a "Navy" town. Yes, the Navy is here, but it's more or less confined to certain areas. %0D
San Diego has a vibrant and great arts and cultural scene. There is so much theatre here--really great theatre. San Diego is either the first or the third city in the country that sends the most shows to Broadway. We have a great symphony, and Balboa Park with all the museums in the center of the city is a gem.%0D
Real estate is high, and we do have our share of crime. Traffic can be try your patience, but there's faily decent public transportation system. The politics is often Republican with Democrats gaining. %0D
San Diego is a good city with a good quailty of life. I love having lived on the East and West Coasts. And if you can find a job in San Diego, you'll like it here too. %0D
I''ve only been to San Diego once back in the mid 90''s when I was being courted for a job as a Production Manager at a San Diego based microchip company. I didn''t want to leave! The town is awesome...very friendly (Unlike what I''d heard about California-I''m from Austin, TX). I spent 2 weeks in SD being wined and dined by this company. The University area is very gay with nice little gay owned/operated shops and some hot Bars (Is Flicks still open?). Lots to do...healthy environment, culture...it''s all there. The only negatives is the California Income Tax (Texas has none) and housing is/was very expensive compared to Austin. I may retire to San Diego in a few years as I enjoy the climate (Very temperate...not too hot; no too cold). I unfortunately didn''t get the job as at the last minute a local with the same experience as I popped up and was hired.
I heard San Diego is very anti-gay Republican, I have always boycotted it for that reason.
I find SD itself boring but the people are pretty great. Much friendlier than LA and SF probably because they aren''t suffering from delusions of grandeur. I like the vibe of Ocean Beach.
Most comfortable climate for a major city on earth. It''s paradise here.
It''s one of the mist relaxed major cities I''ve ever been to. I lived for a whole in Pacific Beach and just loved the vibe there -nice, quiet suburban, yet so close to the beach. Loved Mission Bay too. \
I'' d love to go back. When I winthe lottery I''m going to buy me a little beach front house on Ocean Boulevard.
I just moved away from Vegas after living there for 8 years. Brrrrr.
R13 here - ''whole'' = ''while''
Fucking iPhone keypad
Just go back to LA. It''s like choosing Boston when NYC is a mere stone''s throw away.
[quote]There is also a big homeless problem just like in any city.\
Um, no: the homeless problem in all of California''s major cities is MUCH worse than the rest of the country mainly because the summer weather''s great and the winters are so mild, even in San Francisco. Sleeping outside is thus rarely a problem.\
[quote]And it''s no longer a "Navy" town. Yes, the Navy is here, but it''s more or less confined to certain areas.\
True. Thankfully Oceanside is a good 40 miles from SD proper.\
[quote]I heard San Diego is very anti-gay Republican, I have always boycotted it for that reason.\
San Diego is like Austin in the context that its central core, e.g. areas like Hillcrest, are young and gay and progressive, but it still has a sizable older population in the ''burbs that votes Repug. Same can be said for L.A. btw; OC is solidly Republican. That alone is not reason enough to boycott the city; it''s mainly the geriatrics and the military assholes who still vote Repug.
Don''t move back to LA. I enjoy visiting SD.
The whole lowdown:%0D\
You have to have a car.%0D\
There''s a "California cluelessness" over the whole city that gets really annoying.%0D\
The homeless at Ocean Beach are actually all right, as far as homeless people go. More of a hippie love kind of vibe, but I''d avoid them like crazy, because they are crazy.%0D\
The weather is great, but not as great as everyone thinks, and not consistently.%0D\
The boys are insanely hot, and insanely taken with themselves.%0D\
Hillcrest has really gone downhill - it''s hardly even a gay burgh anymore, more like a couple of coffee shops and a thrift store.%0D\
Anything you would move there to do will be too expensive to do, unless you came with money.
I can''t tell if R19 Likes San Diego or not. I''m not sure what California cluelessness is. The weather has to be better than Atlanta.
I love San Diego - but I hardly hear anyone be realistic about it. It''s a wonderful, wonderful place to visit, fun as hell, gorgeous, but if you want to live there here come the caveats.
What are the caveats?
The biggest negative that it has is that it''s right next to Mexico and therefore overun with Mexicans. Otherwise, it would be a nice city to live in.
SD is better than LA.
San Diego has the best climate.
I''ve heard the cost of living is outrageous compared to how much employers pay. Is there truth to that?
Well, at least the weather permits ample opportunities for you to line dry your white sheets, r23.
How does SD compare to Laguna Beach? Is the cost of living about the same for both places?
I find it hard to believe that you lived in LA and never once made it to SD.
I know - what a god damned liar.
BURN THE WITCH
What are the good bay bars and beach?
It is way too Republican, very anti-gay.
Seems quiet and kind of boring but pretty easy living. It felt kind of empty and lonely in a way. Weather is consistently boring too and summers are kind of cold in the city proper. It''s cloudy for a lot of May and June too but nice most of the year. Nice that is a good way to describe it. Meh.
Don''t go. When people say it''s "laid back" that''s code for "It''s boring as hell." The people are boring. The weather is boring. The clubs are boring. Socializing tends to revolve around endless low-key beach gatherings. That may sound great if you live in a land locked city. But it loses its charm pretty fast. On top of everything else it''s expensive without any payoff. I could not get out of there fast enough. I seriously hated that place. It actually made me appreciate L.A. At least the people there have both professional ambition and the ability to throw a decent party.
Left After 6 Months
How''s Santa Ana? Isn''t it a Democratic oasis in otherwise Republican Orange County?
[quote]It is way too Republican, very anti-gay.%0D\
That is not really true. Admittedly, San Diego County is solid Republican. The city itself is moderate, shifting slightly from left to right and back. Mayor Sanders, a Republican, has become a powerful supporter of the gay community after his daughter came out to him. We have two openly gay council members. One took the seat of an openly lesbian after she termed out. One of our state senators is openly lesbian too. I don''t think you can call SD republican altogether, and certainly not anti-gay.%0D\
[quote]The weather is boring.%0D\
What makes weather boring? And what weather would be exciting?
Boring=lack of distinct seasons and changes in atmosphere.
That sounds pleasant, R38. Who wants the inconvenience of four wildly different seasons?
Great gay scene in Laguna and Newport Beach. Again, you need a well paying job to pay for the great beach weather, high rent, and gourmet restaurants. Especially Laguna is a mecca for the artist crowd. You get warm weather year round, but not the desert heat that Vegas dwellers endure. One man''s boring is another man''s heaven.
Even my parents thought it as boring when they visited a few years ago. As my father said, "when everyone tells you you have to see the zoo, you know there''s nothing to do there."
I''m from the midwest (with the four "wildly different seasons"), and when I lived in San Diego I described it to a friend as feeling like it was always four o clock on a Thursday, no matter what the time really was. It was the strangest, most limbo-ish place I''ve ever been - the seasons barely change, the weather is practically hardwired in, and as someone said, it does have a strange meloncholy that just adds to that weirdo twilight feelings. Just odd.
San Diego has a great arts and culture scene with a few of the top regional theatres (Old Globe Theatre, La Jolla Playhouse and San Diego Repertory Theatre) in the country sending many shows to Broadway. San Diego also has some great restaurants. The climate is rather mild, but the weather isn't always perfect. The seasons do change although not as extreme as in other parts of the country. If you like the outdoors, the ocean, mountains and dessert are all within driving distance. %0D
Hillcrest is a great community for a large gay population with lots of bars, restaurants and coffee houses...and it's very residential.%0D
I'm from the East Coast but have lived here for many years. It took me a while to adjust--maybe longer than most so I know that a newcomer's first impression might be less than favorable, but it has turned into the city I wanted it to be. %0D
But for those who don't know much about San Diego...if all you're going to do is head to the beach or go to the Zoo and never explore the arts, the neighborhoods or the scenery, then no, you're not going to enjoy yourself.%0D
The one criticism I have always had is that the job market is a challenge. %0D
I think you''re being a bit generous, R43 - especially and egregiously in regard to Hillcrest. Yuck.
Oh my god R42, 4 o''clock on a Thursday. Brilliant- but more like a Tuesday. :) Wish I thought of that.
R44. Hillcrest is not "yuck" at all. Is is perfect? No, what is? But it''s a great gay community with lots of diversity, people on the street, restaurants, bars, shopping, etc. And it''s generally a safe neighborhood. Housing is a bit expensive, but that''s also real estate in most of San Diego. %0D\
Perhaps Hillcrest might have been "yuck" 25 years ago. I lived here then, but I feel (and I wasn''t a big fan of San Diego back then) that "yuck" may have been too harsh of a term even 25 years ago. However, over the years, the gays have made Hillcrest one of the best urban neighborhoods in San Diego.
Okay, great, YOU like Hillcrest; I think it''s fallen apart from what it once was, gentrified right out of existence.%0D\
There, you see how we both have different opinions and the world didn''t die?
OP, How are you able to just pick up and move so easily? Twice?
San Diego is a nice place to vacation, but to live there? No, thank you.
PRO: More down to earth than you think. Great weather. Pretty coastline. Nice parks. Easy daily living. Much friendlier than L.A. \
CON: Soaked in meth. Transient, indifferent, shallow. Restaurants not very good. Obnoxiously boosterish. Sameness of weather makes it surreal and boring.
There are some very good restaurants in San Diego, actually.
R42, R45, please explain further the concept of ''4:00pm on Thursday''.%0D\
What are you conveying with that thought? What does 4pm on Thursday feel like?
I''m not R45, but I get the meaning - it''s sort of like a permanent twilight, like people are always at the point of the day where you''re winding down and putting on the brakes after a hard day of work. Except there was no hard day of work.\
Here''s my example of "California cluelessness" : we were at Home Depot, looking for moving boxes, so we ask a cashier, who was just standing at her till: "Do you guys have moving boxes?"\
Her response (literally): "Moving boxes?"\
Us: "Yes, moving boxes."\
Her: "Do you mean like boxes that you put stuff in to move?"\
We both just stared at each other. This is only one example - the entire city is like that. It''s permanently 4pm on a Thursday afternoon and people have shut off their brains and are coasting to the end of the day.
It''s definitely a red state area.....all of southern California is except for Los Angeles/Santa Monica/Malibu and the close surrounding areas to that.
My old boss lives there, he loves it. He''s a runner, of course.%0D
Honestly - ANYTHING is better than Las Vegas. OP is correct, get the hell out Nevada. No gay community, thats gotta be the worst thing about living in Vegas - Hell, move to Palm Springs before you stay in Las Vegas - Same weather, same cost of living, closer to Los Angeles, and a great deal of acceptance. Crazy thing about Vegas, A hundred "show boy dancers" on the strip, but still kinda closeted.
Packing boxes to leave LV as I type!
There''s no there there...
R42 R45 R52 --\
"There''s a certain Slant of light, Winter Afternoons %E2%80%94 That oppresses, like the Heft Of Cathedral Tunes."
It's very anti-gay, my friend was gay bashed there about
15 yrs ago. You really take your life in your hands
if you in SD. I wouldn't even visit, it's not worth
I get what California cluelessness means. I live in LA. Dumber people I have never met.
The average weather is sunny and 75 degrees, more or less. Less fat people than anywhere else I have ever been. Lots of sailors and marines in the gay bars. Gay neighborhood is 80% male and average 25 years old. The hipster neighborhood overlaps with the gay neighborhood. Good restaurants, nice beaches. Active gay community, club atmosphere is more laid back and friendly than L.A. More focus on socializing than dancing.
It sure beats living in flyover redneck country, which
a lot of DLs do just because it's especially the
super tight Lesbians.
Hillcrest Selected One of 10 Great Neighborhoods in America
SAN DIEGO, CA — The American Planning Association (APA) announced today that the Hillcrest Neighborhood in San Diego, California, has been designated one of 10 Great Neighborhoods for 2007 through APA's Great Places in America program. APA Great Places exemplify exceptional character and highlight the role planners and planning play in creating communities of lasting value.
San Diego certainly has its charms. But it's still weird. Too many retired military everywhere you go. But when you see one of those sweaty Navy boys out jogging in gym shorts, it's all worth it.
Of course, you have to be prepared every year to risk losing everything to massive fires. I did fine with the Loma Prieta quake in 1989, but narrowly escaped the huge fire in the Oakland hills in the early '90's. That was it for me. No more California.
Where's Zak? He lived in SD for awhile before moving elsewhere.
[quote] It's cloudy for a lot of May and June too but nice most of the year.
As it is almost everywhere in So Cal. We call it "June Gloom" and we get it like clockwork every year.
R2- apparently you haven't been to Hillcrest. It's the One of the gayest neighborhoods in the country. My brother used to live near there and whenever we were in the area or at Brian's (fun very gay diner for breakfast), I was amazed at how gay it was. There is also a bath house, Club San Diego. I would love to retire to Hillcrest someday.
I think it's a beautiful town and a great place to visit - but I totally agree about the Thursday afternoon feeling. I'd say it's more like a permanent Sunday afternoon.
It's just lacking in energy somehow. And it has a strict bar culture - the bar owners are SOOO fast to call the cops and have you arrested for drunken and disorderly conduct. I was threatened with it twice and honestly I was not drunk and only asking a bouncer a question. The same thing happened on the Real World San Diego - they were forever being threatened with arrest OR WERE arrested.
You see bail signs EVERYWHERE and on TV. Never in my life have I seen that except in San Diego.
I have visited there often, I would get that melancholy feeling too. I think it has to do with hazy light, especially in the summer? I have no idea but it made me feel a little sad, like I am nowhere right now. Poppies??
I picked up the sad, melancholic vibe and I was only there for an afternoon.
New Orleans was the same for me, but that was back in '77. I kept going to sleep in the afternoon.
It's a pretty town, but a tad elitist and a little bigoted. Great Mexican food though.
The bad part, just like much of CA is it's overrun with Mexicans. Which bring crime, gang problems and drive by shootings.
You bumped a 2 year old thread to say that, r72? Why?
Isn't San Diego where all the gay porn gets made?
I moved from Vegas to San Diego! I took a $20k/year pay cut in the process (it's true that incomes in SD do NOT offset the cost of living--they call it the "sunshine tax"). I didn't care at the time though--I just wanted the hell out of Vegas.
Anyway, I woke up happy every single day for the first year I was there--it was like heaven. But looking back, that was just my "honeymoon phase" and it eventually wore off. Once you become accustomed to the fantastic weather & begin to take it for granted, there isn't a whole lot to SD. They don't call it Bland Diego for nothing. There's no energy or feeling of excitement there--ever. Everyone wears flip flops 24/7/365. No one ever dresses up. All the straight guys wear a black baseball cap and black shades, and all the girls have a butterfly sticker on their Volkswagon Jetta. It's difficult to make real friends there, because everyone says shit that they don't really mean. "OMG lets totally hang out!" translates to, "Pssh, I'll avoid you the next time we cross paths."
The ocean is too cold to swim in 10 months out of the year, and when it's not too cold it's overrun with stingrays, jellyfish and God only knows whatever's floating up from Mexico. I was sitting on the beach late one night when a fucking RAT scurried past me. That about did it for me.
Someone had told me before I moved to SD that it was basically the midwest on the ocean. I grew up in the midwest, and they were right. There wasn't any culture shock for me in SD for sure. LA always felt way more advanced and liberal to me, and I always looked forward to getting up there whenever I could. LA has that energy & feeling of excitement I crave. I'd always get depressed when I had to return from LA to Bland Diego.
That said, it's not ALL bad. I love all the different types of plants that grow in SD (of course you can see that in LA also) and the days/nights when the fog would roll in off the ocean were magical. I lived in Hillcrest for a year, and I loved that I could walk everywhere--something I've never been able to do anywhere else I've lived. But the straights are indeed infiltrating Hillcrest with their baby strollers now.
At the end of the day, it was the people that drove me the hell out of that city. I just couldn't handle the flakiness any longer. SD is a beautiful place on a postcard, but the people ruin it.
A startling number of the gays in SD are right-wing nuts.
r75, where do you live now?
The "night and morning low clouds" or "marine layer" is often called "May Gray," and "June Gloom," and often extends into July. It annoyed me when I first moved here from Boston, but now I've gotten used to it, and it's rather peaceful. But it can often last well past the morning and linger all day at the coast and a few miles inland.
San Diego's climate is often mild, but that doesn't mean the weather is always good. And we do have winter and freezing temperature. Yes, we run our heat all winter. It's not sunny all year. And the summer overcast and winter rain are the best kept weather secrets in the entire country.
Visiting SD from LA (native Angeleno) always feels like visiting a cleaner, way smaller, milder, more laidback and more sanitized version of L.A. Every time I go there I am overcome with the desire to swing on a hammock.
That said, if you're looking for excitement and energy, I do feel it lacks the international 24-hour creative and professional energy of L.A. That can be a good or bad thing depending on what you prefer.
What's it like to live in Balboa Park ?
[quote]What's it like to live in Balboa Park ?
You'd have to ask a homeless person.
Does anyone know what it's like for black guys in San Diego? I like military guys
Like other posters said it is very anti-gay and very Republican. Also it has a very large base of Christian fundamentalists and they are everywhere.
Climate? Ok, but really just go back to LA. It would be better for you.
Vegas is a hole. I feel for you, OP. I used to live in La Jolla. I loved it there, but when the economy tanked I had to leave to find work. I'm on the east coast now and miserable. I'd love to make it back to San Diego before it gets cold here. It always cracks me up to look at Sean Cody's site and see the beaches I used to walk on in the background of their outdoor shots. Makes me homesick.
whats wrong with Vegas?
would love to visit
I've been visiting for years, and at times the climate easily could have gotten me to stay. OTOH, my friend who grew up there, a pretty worldly guy, describes it as a cultural backwater, and more of a place for people who like water/beachy stuff. There is a melancholy vibe--a lot of HIV+ guys from SF moved there, before they started moving to Palm Springs. It was affordable in those days. I think that cohort is part of the unhappy vibe, but like much of SoCal it attracts peope who think a change of scenery and sunshine will fix their problems--it doesn't. I've made many visits to LA often for long periods of time--my sister lived there--and it struck me as a place filled with unhappy people. I came to underatnd the roots of film noir.
I lived in UTC. Loved it. Miss it greatly. Couldn't get a job there though. Very sad.