How do you reconcile being gay and a Christian/Catholic.
Very well, thank you.
Pope Benedict XVI
Ugh...don''t get me started. Those two things could not be more diametrically opposed!\
Why would you want to be a part of an organization that hates you just for being born??!!
OP, you do understand that Christianity includes both Protestants and Catholics, don''t you?
some folks aren''t smart enough to start threads
The syndicate in Rome likes to think that it owns all the rights to being a Catholic.\
I just knock up chicks, then go on violent rages against her. Makes every one think I''m straight rather than just some deeply conflicted closet queen.
Sugar Tits, somewhere in Malibu, California
Too bad about search.
OP = Mel Gibson
One makes you shun the other --- your choice which
Dress up on halloween is made more fun with my confessional on wheels and my priestly drag made up of my mini pink cassock and my fish net stockings the sinners don''t know which way to turn but to the lawd. Everyone enjoys the penance and form the chain without instructions. Then we bend over and spread our cheeks for the lord.
I call my ex-girlfriend and call her a fucking cunt.
I am not Christian, but I assume people who are would have no difficulty reconciling it. If you are alluding to the Catholic church''s inability to accept gay people, OP, the church, like anything else, is a growing institution with changing rules. Therefore, gay people in it might be working toward progress in it. If you are alluding to alleged scriptural condemnations of sex between men, perhaps you should be asking Catholics who eat shrimp how they reconcile that with their religion, since there are scriptural prohibitions against that as well. \
I belong to many things, including the U.S., which I disagree with vehemently. I don''t have to reconcile my beliefs to maintain my citizenship. I fight to change what I object to.
I think gay priests reconcile it by engaging in pedophilia instead of adult gay relationships.
Gay Catholics are the very saddest cripples on earth. Pathetic, yet I waste not an ounce of pity for them. Quislings!
In the New Testament, I''ve read the gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke, Paul, John, George and Ringo.%0D\
Ostensibly, they are narratives which record the teachings of Jesus. They record his admonitions regarding how how humans should relate to each other.: mercy, forbearance, kindness, tolerance,yada, yada, yada.%0D\
Jesus had a lot to say about the human condition. He had plenty of time to note the existence of all sexual orientations, yet, all gospels are absent of any observation about homosexuality. To me, that silently says it all: Jesus did not think it was noteworthy. %0D\
On the one hand, I admire Jesus. Otoh, It''s his so-called followers that create grief.
[quote]The syndicate in Rome likes to think that it owns all the rights to being a Catholic.\
isn''t that the PRIME reason for being Catholic? Why aren''t you church of England then? or Episcopalian? or Russian ORthodox - if the Pope isn''t that important?
Go to an Episcopal church. The liturgy is remarkably similar but you will be welcomed and not made to feel like a defective being.
[quote]The syndicate in Rome likes to think that it owns all the rights to being a Catholic.%0D\
Lame excuse of pathetic gays too self loathing to face the truth...the catholic church HATES you.
[quote]The syndicate in Rome likes to think that it owns all the rights to being a Catholic.\
Who is stupider? Gay Catholics or Black Republicans?
R20, you forgot gay Republicans and gay Catholic Republicans.
Or Log Cabinettes, R20.
Except, R11, have you ever asked a gay catholic what they are doing exactly to fight the horribly anti-gay church? I have, and there is almost without exception a dead silence.\
Also, the analogy with the U.S. doesn''t fit. Americans can replace their governing officials if they don''t like their policies. Lay catholics have no such option.\
The truth is if you are gay and catholic, you are gay and a member/supporter of one of the most virulently homophobic institutions on earth.And not only does this institution show no signs of softening on the issue, to the contrary it has gotten worse.
I don't, OP. I left the church within a few years of coming out. I hadn't really practiced for a few years before that (since graduating high school and moving out of my parents house). There really is no logical way to reconcile the two, and my sexuality (which I believe is a gift from God) obviously came first, over a homophobic, misogynist organization of closeted homosexual, wealth-hoarding child rapists and their collaborators and enablers. It is a vile organization when you really look at it, and if you truly believe in God and his goodness, I don't know how you can consider the Catholic Church as divinely sanctioned. I'm sure Jesus never intended his church to look like that today.
I avoid church, except for weddings and funerals, and even then I feel like any other outsider. I won't take communion and won't participate beyond the most perfunctory sit-stand-kneel routines that Catholics love so much.
Gay Catholics rank with gay Republicans in my view, which is one short step below Jewish Nazis or black Klan members. Self-loathing idiots with no concept of personal dignity or self-respect.
I love how R11 writes an entire post about something he clearly knows nothing about. "I am not Christian"...so why the fuck did you respond to the post?\
I''m not Hindu, but I don''t go around trying to explain why some people are...because that would be STUPID.
I believe in Christ and what he taught, specifically. I believe the things that came out of his mouth. \
I believe in the Commandments. ("Adultery" to me = "cheating.")\
Everything else is filler. I take it or leave it as my heart, conscience and mind dictate.
We must remember that it is not a sin to be gay, it is only a sin to engage in homosexual acts.
Uh, no r27. That''s bullshit.
CATHOLIC AEROBICS!! Ready and...\
And burn in hell!!
OP, I am a gay Catholic. I believe that once a Catholic always a Catholic. That being said, I don''t believe in all of the Catholic teachings. I have not been to church since my moms death in 1998. I got to say the priest was really cool. I believe I will be judged by how I lead my life and not by who I love. So tired of people preaching the hell and damnation. I am sure God has a hell of lot more important things to worry about then who I love. Take what you can for your Christian teachings and ignore the ignorant bastards that preach hate.
Reconcile being gay and a Christian? \
Isn''t that like being a vegetarian butcher? \
An African American white supremacist?
Stupid question. How do you justify being gay and American? What''s the difference?
Big damn difference.
Well, that settles it then, r33.
I am so glad y''all are telling people what they should believe. It has worked out so well for us in the past.
By Stephanie Pappas, LiveScience Senior Writer
Published 05/23/2013 11:28 AM EDT on LiveScience
Between the faction of gay Christians who are happy with their sexual identity and "ex-gays," who say they've removed their homosexual yearnings, is a third group that gets little attention. These so-called Side B Christians identify as gay and believe it's not sinful to do so. But because they see acting on their orientation as ungodly, they commit to a life of celibacy.
Now, for the first time, a sociologist has taken an in-depth look at what makes Side Bs tick, particularly how they navigate their same-sex desires and their awkward position as stuck in the middle of ex-gay groups and content gay Christians. The study is small, but finds that Side Bs experience both tension and connection with these two groups. (The origins of the "Side B" term are foggy, but the terminology seems to come from the organization the Gay Christian Network, which labels gay Christians who do not see their sexuality as sinful as "Side A" and those who do as "Side B.")
"The networks overlap with these two groups very strongly, and they did often feel kind of caught in the middle, certainly," said study researcher S.J. Creek, a sociologist at Hollins University in Virginia. [5 Myths About Gay People, Debunked]
Christian and gay
The study of Side B Christians grew out of a larger research project by Creek looking into the lives of ex-gay Christians. This movement, which centers largely around the organization Exodus International, claims that same-sex desire can be stifled and that sexual orientation can be changed — hence the term "ex-gay." Numbers on ex-gay individuals are hard to come by, but Exodus International claims 3,000 people worldwide attend one of its ministry events each week.
In interviewing people who had sought help from ex-gay groups and then left, Creek found two distinct groups: Side As, who reconciled their sexuality with their religion and believe being gay and Christian is not contradictory; and Side Bs, who accept their orientation but commit to celibacy in order to remain in line with anti-homosexuality tenets.
"How each group thought about and acted on desire was different," Creek said.
For her new study, published May 13 in the journal Symbolic Interaction, Creek interviewed five Side B Christians about their emotions and interactions. Four of the interviewees were men and one was a woman; one of the men was married to a lesbian who also struggled with her desires.
Dealing with desire
The interviews revealed that desire was a complex problem for the Side Bs. "Allen," the 30-something man married to a lesbian, noted that he'd even had gay friends try to seduce him to test his limits. Such an experience is not uncommon among abstinent people, Creek wrote. [10 Milestones in Gay Rights History]
Admitting to same-sex desires is also a problem for Side Bs interacting with ex-gays, as the ex-gay philosophy holds that even homosexual desire is not OK. Creek's interviewees reported keeping their sexuality and their celibacy closeted in many cases.
"I tend to categorize myself as a gay, celibate Christian, but I am very hesitant using that [description] because in secular society, the word 'gay' means attracted to men, and in Evangelical Christian subculture, it means ‘sleeps with everybody ?ve days a week,’" said one interviewee, called "James" in the report. Dealing with the connotations of the term was often too much of a headache, James said, so he frequently kept the information to himself.
At other times, claiming a gay identity was a way to connect with other Christians, both gay and straight. "Erin," a celibate lesbian, told Creek she found a connection with married couples in her Orthodox Church who also tried to lead chaste lives. Allen told a story of a straight Christian retreat administrator who stood up for him, pointing out that Christian straight men and Christian gay men have similar struggles.
"Every day, Allen wakes up and looks around, and he sees guys he wants to have sex with — and he doesn't have sex with them because he's following Jesus," the male administrator said. "And every day, I wake up, and I see girls I want to have sex with — and I don’t have sex with them because I’m following Jesus. So, we’re both not getting any because we’re following Jesus."
The study can’t be generalized to Christian gays as a group, or even to celibate Christian gays, Creek said. Nor can it answer the burning question of who is happier: ex-gays, Side As or Side Bs.
"Ex-gays are always telling people why gays are deeply unhappy. And many gay activists are going to tell you why ex-gay activists are deeply unhappy," Creek said. "Every group seems to think the other group isn't quite as happy as they are."
However, the Side B Christians interviewed by Creek may place a different priority on their sexuality than outsiders might, Creek said.
"Their Christian identities are incredibly important to them, and they would be deeply unhappy if they felt they were compromising those identities," she said.
My husband and I have no problem being gay and Protestant. We live in Germany , so it is actually quite normal here. There are many parts in the bible that are taken out of context like the "woman can't speak in church" argument used against Christianity. My gay peers don't mind, neither do my atheist or christian friends. Germany is great in this aspect, that's one of the perks of marrying a German man. 😊
The bible is actually more of a library rather than a book. One must keep in mind that the book has been edited many times, adding and subtracting what the church wants. Many newer ones are much more accurate. It is not meant to be a science journal, it has many stories, myths, poems, documentaries, it is really amazing.
I could answer any questions. ⬇️⬇️⬇️
[quote]OP, the church, like anything else, is a growing institution with changing rules
But the catholic church claims to be the unchanging beacon of truth, not swayed by fashions of the day, and unquestionable because it came directly from jesus himself. the 'one true church' blah blah blah.
Complete rubbish. Catholicism is just emotional addiction, fed by nostalgia. That's where r30's "once a catholic/always a catholic" sentiment comes from.
I was raised catholic and got sensible.
I haven't had a problem with it, never felt that there was anything to 'reconcile'. The great thing about christianity is that it isn't supposed to be 'perfect' like some other religions (coughislamcough). The bible is known to be flawed, it was written by fallible humans. It's not meant to be 'god spoke and it got copied down word for word'
It evolves and changes as time goes on.
For me, Christianity is just 'don't be a dick', treat others as you'd like to be treated, keep believing in God and then you're all good.
Most of the people who take part in the procession at the beginning of our church are gay. Two of them are even married.
Then again, that's probably because I live in Europe. idk how well that would go down in the US.
[quote]Most of the people who take part in the procession at the beginning of our church are gay. Two of them are even married. Then again, that's probably because I live in Europe. idk how well that would go down in the US.
Does any Christian denomination do gay marriages in the US?
Is there an Anti Catholic troll or cauldron on here? What hate for the Catholic Church it seems.
Why would there be anything but hate for the Catholic Church? Or were you joking?
I've never been Catholic, but I tried being Protestant Fundamentalist more than once. Needless to say, I couldn't stick with it.
R41 - they're married as in legally married. I don't think it was a church wedding although I can't be sure as it happened before I arrived. The priest and his boyfriend certainly aren't married in any sense of the word.
In all honesty, I really can't stand the married pair. They act so superior to the rest of us. They're essentially the personification of that snooty gay fem trope. One of them prances around in an apron to serve drinks. Woe betide anyone who goes near his precious cupboards to get a glass of water.
Catholics are all damaged inside.
If you see one run!!!!
Every Catholic in the world picks and chooses which teachings they follow and which sins they avoid. This is most easily observable among Latin American or immigrant communities; how many of them have pre-marital sex, children out of wedlock, do not go to church on Sunday, hell, masturbate? But they can find comfort and solace, on both cultural and ecclesiastic levels, in God and the Catholic ceremony.
I'm 60. I wanted to be a priest from age 3 on. I had the Latin mass memorized at 10. I realized I was gay at 15, and dropped the church at 17. I've been a cultural Catholic since then, but much less so in the last two decades as the homophobia and abusiveness have combined to reveal not just a typically corrupt organization, but a sinister, wicked, smug and self-servingly vindictive one.
If I were a non-Catholic Christian following UCC, Episcopalian, or another progressive strand of the "faith," I suppose there would be no bother about it for me.
But the demands of such faith in the face of empiricism, logic, history (including the facts of Church and New Testament history), science and plain obvious truth are just too great. I like to play but not when it involves pretending about Ultimate Reality. It is as absurd to be a Christian on such terms as it is to be…. anything that requires suspension of intelligence in order to accept the hogwash.
R50 - its sad that you feel that way. It doesn't require 'suspension of intelligence' at all. As I said earlier, the bible isn't meant to be taken literally. It was written by people who lived almost 2000 years ago...its not as if they knew about evolution and the 'don't eat shellfish' stuff is in there for the same reason as 'don't eat pork' is in the old testament and the koran. it was hard to prepare without making people sick.
To be fair to you, if you've been amongst christians who do have a literalist view (they seem to be limited to america), I can see why you feel that way.
I grew up Catholic but not in the US. I dont remember a single sermon about homosexuality or hell. I do remember many sermons about the evil of judging others and how that was the biggest sin of all. Most catholic priests that our family knew were bleeding heart lefties. Our priest was funny and kept a picture of the Pope John Paul next to a picture of the football coach who led his our priests team to victory, which my brother thought was great. He believed that women should be priests. He is not a fan of the last Pope who he viewed as too conservative. He never turned away or rejected Gay parishioners. He believes that priests who commit crimes against children should have to go to trial and face up to what they did as they were in a position of trust which they abused.
That's my time as Catholic, it wasn't negative or riddled with guilt. Mass was both poignant and funny, stressing the importance of non judgement of others, forgiveness and treating others like you want to be treated. Although I stopped going when I moved away, mostly put of laziness, I continue to believe in that church. The one I was raised in should be the standard.
[quote] The syndicate in Rome likes to think that it owns all the rights to being a Catholic.
They do own the rights.
This idea that Catholics the world over are picking and choosing which beliefs they follow is nonsense. I'm sure it makes Catholics who are progressives or liberals feel better about themselves.
The Church knows the power it has.
If your Catholic and you believe in the teachings of the RCC then you know it is the one true church. If you're not a member in good standing when you die - well it's off to hell with you.
The evil isn't gay Catholics. Them I understand.
The evil is the institution. Threatening people with eternal damnation for having sex with the person they love.
Forget this change from within crap.
They just made a man who ignored rampant sexual abuse within the Church a saint.
r50 I admire your integrity. r51, you are deluded and ill-informed, and I feel sorry for you.
Yes R41 -- Episcopalians and Congregationalists (UCC) to name a couple.
There was good reason to end this thread in July 2010, but someone bumped it. It will NEVER be settled at DL.
All non catholics are going to hell so I don't' think being gay is a very big deal to most of them . Catholic gays know they can do a quickie Act of Contrician and as we know it's olly olly oxen all in free.
I'm gay and Catholic. Been heavily involved with the The Society of Jesus (Jesuits) for some time now. The hatred shown here towards Catholics is a brutal demonstration of ignorance. I wish I had the time and patience to dispel so much incomprehension.
I'm with R39: a man after my own heart.
However, I do not have the inner peace that R58 has. I admire you, but I'm too scared of dying -- too egocentric, really -- to feel peaceful about my disbelief.
Please do R59 - it will take A LOT of 'explaining away the virulent homophobia of the bigoted bishops.
Yes I would love to hear what you have to say r59.