The crimes in LA are the strangest of them all

"The King Tut Killings." 1987

Robert Blake

Phil Spector

The severed head found by the Hollywood sign.

Ronnie Chasen

Black Dahlia

Johnny Stompanato

Ronni Chasen

William Desmond Taylor

Black Dahlia

William Innes

Melissa Rivers' career.

Too much nice weather. If it would rain or snow more it would keep people inside.

OP = James Ellroy, out of ideas.

Who is William Innes and what was the crime? I've never heard of it.

Tangentially related: my co-worker's mother was a neighbor and friend of Manson victim Gary Hinman. She says that Los Angeles in 1969 had the baddest vibes imaginable.

I'd like to hear more of that, R10

Patty Hearst wasn't an LA crime. She was abducted in Berkeley. It was definitely a Bay Area crime, which are also weird.

Yeah I'm convinced the Manson narrative is a big cover-up.

Did you know that the prosecutor, Bugliosi, was a paranoid pathological liar? It's true.

Around the same time as the Manson trials, he got the idea in his head that his newborn son wasn't his, and that his wife maybe had an affair with the milkman. So he abused his authority to get the address of the former milkman, illegally, and then stalked the poor guy for months.

Then, as soon as he cut settlements with the poor former milkman, he beat the crap out of his mistress for not having an abortion like he demanded. He then went to her house and made her recant her accusation, because Bugliosi was running for Attorney General by then.

Luckily, the truth about both cases emerged when the lawyer who represented both the milkman and the mistress spilled the beans to the press, right before the AG election. The milkman and mistress had signed non-disclosure agreements as part of their settlements, but they didn't cover the righteous lawyer.

The Perelson house sitting untouched since 1959 is strange; not so much the crime itself.

Robert Kennedy assassination is another one. Check out the documentary "RFK Must Die" for an excellent takedown of the official narrative.

Did you know that the Beverly Hills lawyer for Sirhan Sirhan, the Palestinian patsy, was also the "friend" of Charles Manson who spoke on his behalf for Manson's '67 parole hearing?

Yup, it's true. I think Manson may have been one of probably several alternative patsies for the RFK job the next year.

Manson moved down to LA in April '68, two months before RFK's assassination on June 6 I believe it was.

And get this: Manson didn't even want to leave prison in '67, but Sirhan Sirhan's lawyer and Graham Parson's manager/corpse burner Kaufman both pled Manson's case before the parole board.

William Innes was involved in "The King Tut Killings" in 1987.

The Greystone Mansion Murders

The Los Feliz Mansion Murders

The Wonderland/Laurel Cyn Murders

Sal Mineo

Susan Cabot

Phil Hartman

Elisa Lam

Oh, and Dorothy Stratten.

Speaking of really weird Bay area crimes:

Stanford U Chapel murder 1974 Satanic Ritual Murder Still Unresolved

Even weirder is her husband, who she had just had a fight with right before she was killed, is now a famous author and child psychologist who insists there's basically no such thing as satanism. It's all satanic panic, he says...

Gwyneth Paltrow winning an Oscar...

Jane Mansfield was found decapitated.

[quote]William Innes was involved in "The King Tut Killings" in 1987.

Uh huh.

Ramon Navarro.

The Manson and OJ crimes became sensational because they were in Los Angeles.

OJ involves a (former) football player assaulting and killer his wife.

The Manson murders involved an initial heat-of-the-moment drug murder and then a bunch of idiots trying to get their friend out of jail by engaging in copy cat crimes.

Roman Polanski and the 13 year old girl. With Anjelica Houston in the other room. Of Jack Nicholson's house.

It's not just LA, there were weird Santa Cruz murders, and weird Redwood city murders, as well as still unsolved SF murders.

Listen to Polanski's lie detector test after Tate's murder spared him the child support and alimony he was going to have to pay after she left him:

Part One of Roman Polanski lie detector test in September 1969

He admits he's on valium, which helps with polygraphs.

R21, you ninny, that's not true. For one thing, Mansfield died in a car accident, not a crime, which occurred near New Orleans. And her body was intact - the coroner who dealt with it has sworn to that fact. It's a myth that she was decapitated.

Interesting blog about the Perelson House

Scientology is one big crime in itself.

And Goleta, Ventura, and Irvine had the Original Night Stalker murders, which are still unsolved.

Right after the Manson murders, this happened just outside a Scientology owned house in L.A. The detective who gave Polanski his polygraph thought it was connected to the Manson murders.

Manson was a scientology nut in prison, and learned how to audit.

"Doreen Gaul 19 and James Sharp 15 were murdered in L.A. in 1969. Sometimes this unsolved murder is called the Scientology murders or possible victims of the Manson Family.

Doreen was striped and both were stabbed repeatedly about 50-60 times each and beaten in the face and head. Both of their eyes were slashed with the right eye cut out. Their bodies were so badly beaten that police first thought that they had been shot with a shotgun. There were motorcycle tire marks on the bodies. Both of the victims were members of the church of Scientology."

The number one suspect in the Black Dahlia murder was a J-ish doctor like Dr Perelman.

He lived in the scariest house imaginable: "John Sowden House, also known as the "Jaws House" or the "Franklin House", is a residence built in 1926 in the Los Feliz section of Los Angeles, California."

He was friends with John Huston, and his daughter's best friend was Michelle Phillips of the Mammas and the Pappas.

R12 Yes, but the final SLA shootout was in LA.

Speaking of Michelle Phillips, I heard she was friends with Sharon Tate and Polanski, and that she had an affair with Polanski, hurting Sharon's feelings and ending the friendship.

Marilyn Monroe's suspicious death is another, as is Michael Jackson's.

Occultist and JPL founder Jack Parsons' explosive death in Pasadena is a good one

SF had the Zodiac killer, and it spawned the People's Temple.

Is R5 getting Thomas Ince's and William Randolph Heart's names confused?

Judy Garland getting the shiksa treatment:

" Judy Garland was 16 when she won the role of Dorothy in the MGM musical in 1938 and it was to mark both the beginning and the end of her career. The insecure teenager was by that time addicted to barbiturates and amphetamines and was on the road to alcoholism. In addition, she was routinely molested by older men including studio chiefs who considered her little more than their “property”."

Oh yeah, and People's Temple had a big L.A. branch.

Harvey Milk went waaaay out of his way to defend JJones, writing a letter to Congress defending the good reverend's name.

And that was loooong after dozens of allegations of JJones abuse was all over the SF media.

Why did Milk do it? I think he got access to runaways.

I heard Milk was scared of JJones -- so maybe that's why.

The Patty Hearst case only had the shoot out in LA. Most of it took place in Berkley and SF.

I heard Milk wasn't the scrupulous hero of principle he's made out to be. Much like Rubin "Hurricaine" Carter.

I heard Milk shouldn't be on a GD stamp.

Oh please r44. Bart Simpson was on a stamp.

and no one uses stamps anymore anyway.

Harvey Milk probably would have taken a liking to Bart Simpson.

The Menendez Brothers case was insane.

Richard Ramirez/Night Stalker paralyzed Southern California in terror in the '80s. Especially families who lived in yellow hones off the freeway. Scary times.

Yet the Night Stalker's first victims lived far from freeways -- one lived in an apartment across from Forest Lawn.

The last woman he killed was in the middle of an Alhambra Street.

'The King Tut Killings" in 1987 were very similar to the 939 Palm Ave murders only they happened in a condo made of stone-a.

R33 posts bs information. The doctor he refers to "Dr. Perlman" is bs. He's talking about Dr. George Hodel. Hodel's detective/police officer son has published several books and there's been several DL threads about it. Hodel DID rape his teen daughter Tamar. Allegedly. But the son says that his father was both the Black Dahlia killer (LA) AND the Zodiac Killer (SF) as well as the Lipstick Killer.

R51, I said he was J-ish LIKE Dr Perelman.

Like,

Yes R49, but the media theorized that he was targeting yellow homes near freeway exits. It certainly put the fear of life into my own mother, who insisted that my dad paint the house immediately.

Ironically, Ramirez loved to stay at the rundown Hotel Cecil (where Elisa Lam died mysteriously). That hotel (and its water tank) still stand, but management has tried to re-brand the place as "The Stay on Main" hotel. And eh, the place is still beyond creepy and still borderline SRO.

Jean Spangler murder .........

Kirk ................. Douglas ? (rumored)

FAVOR PLEASE -- Post links to your posts.

Start of a great thread !!

Jack Unterweger stayed at the Cecil, too.

The Lipstick Murder

Karyn Kupcinet

[quote]Stanford U Chapel murder 1974 Satanic Ritual Murder Still Unresolved

Hasn't that case been linked to the David Berkowitz/Son of Sam cult murders?

Stanford and Palo Alto have the creepiest vibes

The King Tut murders? I can't find any info online. Can you elaborate?

Yes, not finding any info on the King Tut murders either.

You see?

The brainwashing is working. Soon no one will remember the King Tut Murders.

Hopefully this post will still exist to alert the others.

The only King Tut "murder" I know of is the possible murder of the young pharaoh in ancient Egypt. Though it's been theorized that he could have died of natural causes,

Sacramento in the 70s: Richard Chase, the Galegos, the Easr Area Rapst, plus murders by the SLA and Unabomber. Squeaky Fromme also tried to shoot Predident Ford in that mudhole of a town.

Sacramento in the 70s: Richard Chase, the Galegos, the Easr Area Rapst, plus murders by the SLA and Unabomber. Squeaky Fromme also tried to shoot Predident Ford in that mudhole of a town.

I agree with the posters who mentioned Susan Cabot and Karyn Kupcinet.

Susan Cabot was like "Psycho" meets "Sunset Boulevard" -- beautiful but faded actress, old mansion, lived like a hermit with a son who was a little too attached to "Mother." He hid the murder weapon in a box of Bold detergent and told the police that "ninjas" had broken in and slaughtered poor Susan.

And Karyn Kupcinet is the exact bridge between the Jack-and-Jackie "Mad Men" Sixties and the hippie-on-a-bad-trip Sixties.

Both are fascinating cases.

The 1980s brought stalking murders to L.A., sometimes with killers who were known to the victims: Dorothy Stratten, Rebecca Schaeffer.

This is O/T but ON TOPIC to California. Please make a thread. I am outraged.

There's a natural aquifier underneath these Palo Alto homes & the people who own the homes (tech people) are DRAINING it. We have a drought! There's 72,000 gallons!

Why is murder in L.A. any more strange than murder elsewhere?

Because a known name is once-in-a-while involved and nothing else.

Hillside Stranglers

Skid Row Slasher (not to be confused with the Skid Row Stabber)

THREE different Freeway Killers

Rodney Alcala, the "Dating Game Killer"

and L.A.'s newest serial killer, the Grim Sleeper

Atisone suiuli

and

what kind of Wood doesn't float?

[quote]The King Tut Killings" in 1987 were very similar to the 939 Palm Ave murders only they happened in a condo made of stone-a

Uh-huh. Your comedy is the only thing that's dying here.

There was another victim of a murder that was thought to be part of the Manson killings - Marina Habe, whose mother was an actress and father was a screenwriter. Here's a news article from when her body was found:

And here's an old 1988 article written by a friend of Marina Habe's.

That Dirk guy of Playgirl fame. I hope it's solve by now.

!

I thought King Tut moved to Arizona.

The Bobby Fuller ("I Fought the Law") case is a weird one too.

Also - anyone ever read about the unsolved murder of a high school girl found dead in her bedroom after coming home from school somewhere on the westside around 1965? I can't remember the name but the case got lots of coverage over the years.

Welcome to the jungle, baby...

You're GONNA DIEEEE!

What are the King Tut killings?

"Stanford U Chapel murder 1974 Satanic Ritual Murder Still Unresolved Hasn't that case been linked to the David Berkowitz/Son of Sam cult murders?"

Yeah I believe so. But I don't think Berkowitz was a lone wolf.

Robert "shalom" Durst

Also the McMartin pre-school satanic ritual abuse ring.

The media and "experts" worked overtime that the whole thing was a delusional hysteria, but 80% of the children's claims checked out. The media ran with the 20% of testimony that didn't check out, to draw attention away from how high level that ring actually went. Judges, celebrities, and child psychologists were involved.

Arlis Perry is the name of the poor victim in the Stanford Chapel case. Never solved, but David Berkowitz (son of Sam) hinted, while in prison, that he knew the identity of the killer.

Justice for Ronni!

What planet are you from, R82? Where was it proven that the children's testimony checked out?

The Anti-Semitic troll is working overtime in this post.

"Arlis Perry is the name of the poor victim in the Stanford Chapel case. Never solved, but David Berkowitz (son of Sam) hinted, while in prison, that he knew the identity of the killer."

by: Anonymoustreply 83

Arlis Perry's husband became one of the biggest McMartin/Satanic Panic cover-up artists. He wrote in his best selling book that there's basically no such thing as organized satanic activity.

He's the head of the Houston child trauma center. Bush territory.

Good lord there was no cover up of a Satanic Panic. It was all bullshit. Kids are so easily manipulated to say all sorts of shit. All you have to do is say "they did this right???" while nodding your head. That's a cue for the kids because they want to please adults.

This is a good take on the McMartin trial.

R85, the tunnels under McMartin were right where the children said they were, as was the connecting tunnel to the building next door, from which the children were driven away.

The prosecutor made a fake half-assed attempt to look for tunnels, and immediately declared there were none.

Victims families hired a private investigator, who was a former head of the LA FBI office, who hired top archeologists and got permission from the new property owners to look for the tunnels in a real way.

They found the tunnels, which had been filled in with new and different dirt, and in one of the tunnels was a disney lunchbox from 1982, exactly the same time as the abuse was going on.

And yet the judge prevented this discovery of the tunnels in exactly the places where the children described them to be admitted into evidence for the jury to hear.

The Eberles who wrote the big book that denied the whole McMartin case as a frenzy were professional child pornographers. That's a fact. And yet Oliver Stone and his bosses used that book as the basis for their BS movie that painted the whole case as figments of the children's and parents' imaginations.

The children described being taken on a private plane, and a close friend of the McMartin's had a private plane stationed nearby McMartin.

The children described being taken to a horse farm, and a McMartin friend owned a horse farm within driving distance.

It goes on and on. Multiple kids came home with bleeding anuses and doctor confirmation of sexual abuse. One of the kids even got herpes. And yet the professional skeptics dismissed this as "red bottom".

R90 you're either trolling or an idiot. You've been posting all over this thread with false information.

No evidence of sexual abuse was found.

Frankly, you must be mental. You're also a bigot judging by your other posts.

Christ, where do all this weirdos come from?

Also, the children testified that the McMartins would kill small animals in front of the children, while under the school in the tunnels, including turtles. Turtles and other small animals were found in the tunnels.

From your Linder cover-up article, R89 :

"Judy Johnson's reports of misbehavior at the McMartin Preschool became increasingly bizarre. She claimed that Peggy Buckey, Ray's mother, was involved in satanic practices: she was said to have taken Johnson's son to a church, where the boy was made to watch a baby being beheaded, and then was forced to drink the blood. She insisted that Ray Buckey had sodomized her son while his head was in the toilet, and had taken him to a car wash and locked him in the trunk. Johnson told police that Ray pranced around the preschool in a cape and a Santa Claus costume, and that other teachers at the school chopped up rabbits and placed "some sort of star" on her son's bottom."

R92, post some links to this.

R93 it's just another paranoid conspiracy nut with tons of fabricated "facts". Just troll-dar it and you can see all of it's crazy posts. Anti-Semitic ones too.

R93, that was a quote from R89s coverup link.

If the crime is sick enough and enough powerful people are involved, the allegations will be dismissed by legions as "insane".

And Judy Johnson did have mental health problems, which is why the coverup artists focus entirely on her version of the story, and not the dozens of other parents whose children told them the same basic details.

This has been going on in a neighborhood in Jerusalem lately, and two years ago it happened in another Jerusalem neighborhood. The kids were being taken out of elementary school for the exact same ritualistic abuse. They were even editing the school surveillance video to remove the comings and goings of the adults taking kids out of the school.

Now they have armed guards at every school exit, and the adult must prove that they are the parent of the child. And there are now cameras in every single room in the school.

One rabbi looked into the case for two years, and finally spoke out to the parents a couple months ago. But he could not bring himself to accept that fellow rabbis and teachers were involved, so he avoided that part of the story and just told the parents that it must have been happening while the children were walking home from school, or maybe some of the bus drivers were involved. Total cop-out.

Virginia Rappe. 1921 Fatty Arbuckle accused but not convicted. How soon they forget.

Ah, makes sense now. It's the nutter over on the Columbine thread claiming the government arranged Sandy Hook to take gun rights away.

Mental illness is an ugly thing.

Allegations from the movie, Confessions of a Dangerous Mind.

TV game show host, Chuck Barrister, was a CIA operative who killed foreign agents, overseas, in between hosting gigs in LA.

R94 is waiting for the Woody Allen biopic that clears his good name, and celebrates the triumph of true love over decades of persecution.

You mean Amy Weidner, R77? That one was finally solved, though.

I am R99. Gosh, that's funny. I think Woody Allen is a scumbag but that has nothing to do with your paranoia and mental illness.

Non-sequitur.

McMartin tunnels: "Most reporters in Southern California pooh-poohed evidence of coercion, but there was a great, gaping silence when the tunnels were found. "I asked my daughter," recalls Jackie MacGauley, a mother of two children who attended the preschool, "'How could they have taken you to these places without being seen?' And she answered me as though I was silly to ask such a question. She said, 'Through the tunnels, of course.'"

The Los Angeles Times ran a spate of features poking fun of the excavation team until actual evidence of tunnels was discovered. Then the Times ran a brief news item, one paragraph long, dryly noting that "evidence" of tunnels had been found, and never mentioned the subject again."

R102, cite your sources.

Or are they also wingnut sources?

R102 you are simply wasting your breath. No one can take you seriously. How you stumbled her is anyone's guess but you are paranoid, anti-Semitic, and a libertarian, Ron Paul nutbag who has been posting false information.

Think about the Jeffery Epstein scandal, and how many HUGE names are involved, and how high the ratings would be if our media actually covered the story. Okay? Huge cover-up, coordinated on a systemic level.

Just about the only news stories we do get about the case are ones like this:

Jeffrey Epstein accuser was not a sex slave, but a money-hungry sex kitten, her former friends say BY RICH SCHAPIRO , OREN YANIV

Yeah, if you search on some of the text R102 posted, it takes you to the article which is only on sites like FreeRepublic and places which blame the "Illuminati J*ws" on everything.

Ex FBI Head Ted Gunderson Satanic McMartin Preschool Tunnels Pt 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YLpvKAR5fA

Gunderson was hired by the McMartin parents (there were many), as a private investigator, and he also oversaw the excavation by top archeologists.

illuminati J3ws. that's absurd. Jeffrey "Trilateral Commission" Epstein would laugh at that false accusation, as would Barons Brittan and Janner, if they weren't so "senile" and "unfit for trial".

If this expert wrote a book dismissing the McMartin case, some of you would be quoting him, and insisting that any skepticism of his arguments was "crazy".

YU Medical School Child Psychologist Busted For Trying To Have Sex With 14-Year-Old Girl

The poor McMartin kids were funneled to people like this to discredit their "red bottoms"

"Why Is This Man On The Board Of An Organization That Claims To Fight Child Sex Abuse And Help Survivors?"

Not only paranoid but on a manic streak.

This is the ongoing scandal that is exactly like McMartin

Thursday, March 19, 2015 Satanic child abuse - Is there a ring of such pedophiles operating in Sanhedria Murchevet?

Dude chill the fuck out. No one is interested in your flaming paranoia here. Take it to Alex Jones.

Well, I'm interested. The child sex/murder cabals are now pretty much undeniable. It USED to be the domain of the schizoid, but thanks to Jimmy Saville, Thatcher's cabinet, the Franklin Union coverup ETC, it is now gruesomely mainstream. We just need to the links to self-educate.

R114 I know of about 50 sites where you can read all you care to read about every "coverup" and conspiracies of "the Elite" until your eyes cross. I just don't want to see DL become one of them.

R114, that's fine and dandy but this paranoid nut job isn't posting any legitimate links. Just paranoid rantings from other freeper links. Some of the stuff he's posted has been debunked. Jayne Mansfield was not decapitated. The McMartin trial was a witch hunt that wasted tons of money.

Gay killer Randy Kraft, the "Scorecard Killer," who may have murdered over 65 boys and men in Southern California (and a few other states) in the 1970s and '80s. He was finally caught when pulled over by the CHP on the 405 Freeway and they discovered a dead Marine in the passenger seat.

Prosecutors could only prove 16 of the murders, but it was enough to put Kraft on Death Row, where he languishes today, filing appeals and, until the late '90s, playing canasta with fellow serial killer William Bonin (who was eventually executed).

The book "Angel of Darkness" by Dennis McDougal is an excellent account of the case. In fact, Kraft attempted to sue McDougal (while on Death Row at San Quentin) for $62 million, claiming the book was "detrimental" regarding his "prospects for future employment." The lawsuit was dismissed as "frivolous" in June 1994.

The Elisa Lam case. I suspect murder. I can't believe it was ruled an accident.

R117: Kraft would appear to be the poster child for limiting death penalty appeals.

He should have been fried a couple of decades ago & saved us money on keeping his sorry ass alive.

[quote]claiming the book was "detrimental" regarding his "prospects for future employment.

Okay, that is funny.

I used to think the Elisa Lam case was murder but now I think perhaps some mental breakdown it still doesn't explain how she accessed the roof, got in the tank and pulled the cover back on, which was supposedly very heavy.

Back in the 80s and 90s, the public was still innocent enough to be easily and gratefully convinced that child abuse rings were impossible and absurd.

Due to the internet, the coverup trolls have a much harder job convincing us that nobody would do such a thing...

And all the mountains of evidence have come out on the internet, much to their chagrin.

R121 no one denies that there are pedo rings but you are wrong on the McMartin "Satanic" shit. You are still a nut job and a troll though.

As another poster said, please take this to another board as we don't want other paranoid wingnuts coming in.

Speaking of "witchhunts", you guys might be surprised to learn that the Red Scare was very real, and that Senator McCarthy, though flawed and an alcoholic, was absolutely on the right track, and there were hundreds of Communist agents inside the US government.

JFK and RFK knew the score and knew that McCarthy was a real patriot. That's why McCarthy was the godfather to RFK's child.

Whatever happened to JFK and RFK anyway?

When the Soviet Union fell, and mountains of documents were released, many but not all of Joseph McCarthy's "paranoid" concerns were proven correct.

I think someone was molested as a child and is carrying a shitload of baggage around and sees pedos everywhere and if you don't agree with her you are a defender of Woody Allen and Hollywood J*ws.

Elisa lam

Yeah? What the hell is the King Tut stuff about?

R122, assuming your beliefs about McMartin are sincere, if misguided, you should start looking into the key figures of the effort to dismiss the case as an irrational "panic".

Because you make huge assumptions about the character of these "experts". Recall that Dershowitz was Epstein's lawyer when he negotiated a secret deal with the government to give Epstein and **all co-conspirators, including Dersh himself, immunity.

These are the two authors who led the effort, and their book was the basis of Oliver Stone's cover-up movie that told America to go back to sleep.

"Paul R. Eberle and Shirley Eberle are American authors.

In the 1970s, the Eberles published a pornography publication called Finger.[2]

In 1972 they wrote The Adventures of Mrs. Pussycat, a children's book.

In the 1970s, they edited the underground newspaper L.A. Star.[2][3][1]

They published The Politics of Child Abuse in 1986. It discusses false allegation of child sexual abuse in the day care sex abuse hysteria.[4][3][1]

In 1993 they published The Abuse of Innocence on the McMartin preschool trial. Alan Dershowitz called the book, The Abuse of Innocence, "... a wake-up call to those who believe that prosecutors and their experts can be trusted to do justice in the emotional context of child abuse."[5][6][1]"

No thanks conspiracy troll.

"What is startling about the Eberles’ reputation as ground-breaking experts in the field is that their dubious credentials have not been widely challenged. Paul and Shirley Eberle edit a soft-core magazine in California called the L.A. Star that contains a mixture of nude photos, celebrity gossip, telephone sex ads, and promos for The Politics of Child Abuse.

In the 1970’s, however, the Eberles were also publishing hard-core pornography. Their publication, Finger, depicted scenes of bondage, S & M, and sexual activities involving urination and defecation. A young girl portrayed with a wide smile on her face sits on top of a man whose penis is inside of her; a woman has oral sex with a young boy in a drawing entitled “Memories of My Boyhood.”

"LAPD was never able to prosecute for child pornography: “There were a lot of photos of people who looked like they were under age but we could never prove it.” The pictures of young children in Finger are illustrations, and child pornography laws were less rigid a decade ago than they are today.

“Sexpot at Five,” “My First Rape, She Was Only Thirteen,” and “What Happens When N!ggers Adopt White Children” are some of the articles that appeared in Finger. One letter states: “I think it’s really great that your mags have the courage to print articles & pixs [sic] on child sex…Too bad I didn’t hear from more women who are into child sex…Since I’m single I’m not getting it on with my children, but I know of a few families that are. If I were married & my wife & kids approved–I’d be having sex with my daughters.”

"Another entry reads: “I’m a pedophile & I think its [sic] great a man is having sex with his daughter!…Since I didn’t get Finger #3, I didn’t get to see the stories & pics of family sex. Would like to see pics of nude girls making it with their daddy, but realize its too risky to print.”

Lyle Stuart plans to print the Eberles’ forthcoming book on the McMartins preschool trial. Carole Stuart, the publisher, describes the Eberles as “experts in the field,” and family friends “for years.”

Why must every thread with potential be hijacked? Psycho vet is all about abortion, Michfest is all trans, and now this one.

Where is Cheryl's all-powerful editor?

Jesus effing Christ, dude, get another hobby. You are obsessive and in need of dire help or, at least, a fucking job.

Frankly, and I rarely do this, but I'm getting so sick of your posts that I'm going to start reporting you.

[quote]Sacramento in the 70s: Richard Chase, the Galegos, the Easr Area Rapst, plus murders by the SLA and Unabomber. Squeaky Fromme also tried to shoot Predident Ford in that mudhole of a town.

Don't forget John Riggns and Sabrina Gonsalves who were abducted in Davis, killed and thrown into a ravine. And the mentally ill man who bought a shotgun at a sporting goods store, walked over to the B of A, blew a hole in the roof and took hostages. (I was about to attend UC Davis around the time of these events and my parents were freaked out.)

I was born and raised in Sacramento and live here now after many years away. The crime in the area was crazy in the '70s. It was crazy in all of California in that decade. Police helicopters were a near nightly occurrence in East Sac which has the lowest crime rate in the city now. Crazy times back then.

Re: Sacramento --

ABC recently did a special on this case:

(Also, there was an ice cream store in the Sacramento area that got obliterated by a fighter jet...)

R115, R116, While I certainly agree that the way the entire McMartin case was initially investigated was way out of line, and in fact did lead to substantial changes in gathering evidence from child witnesses, I've always wondered if just a few of the more minor charges against the son weren't true. There must be a way for DL to evaluate evidence in controversial cases without resorting to extremist sites.

R136 I agree. I think it can be discussed but our tinhat poster was just bombarding with freeper links and was essentially hijacking the thread and he's been hijacking a lot of threads for days now. Go look at the Columbine or Walmart/military threads. He's an Alex Jones aficionado.

The Farrell's ice cream parlor disaster. Over 20 people, the majority children, were killed. (It was insane that the fighter jets were allowed for that airshow because the runways were considered to short.) Being a kid in the area was super-creepy at the time.

I'm embarrassed to say this is the first I've heard of the hostage situation. I was off in the midwest in grad school. I rarely watched TV and didn't get a newspaper. Thanks for the link.

When was that R138? I remember Farrell's when I was a kid. They had them in malls but they all closed at some point. This was Houston. There are none here now but I remember the kind of 1890's décor and theme.

R139: Early 1970s, I think

R139, here you go.

Horrible story. One eight-year-old survivor lost both parents, two grandparents, three siblings and two cousins.

How does one ever get over that?

Ice cream parlor link:

A new Farrell's with pretty much the same decor opened recently on Watt Ave. near Arden. I was surprised to see it because I thought the company had gone out of business.

Reading the story at the link is heartbreaking. As bad as it was, it could have been worse if the wings hadn't ripped off before the jet hit the building.

Florida has the strangest crimes.

Are you kidding?

[quote] Good lord there was no cover up of a Satanic Panic. It was all bullshit. Kids are so easily manipulated to say all sorts of shit.

You'll never get the right wing board disrupters who were sent here to believe that. They are furiously clacking their rosary beads to ward off satanic murder as I type this.

Those who care about the truth can do their own research, especially on the key "experts" who dismissed McMartin entirely.

It was going on at exactly the same time as Jimmy Savile and the Westminister ring, and if those guys had been busted we would have seen the same "panic" narrative pumped out of every major media outlet in England. BBC, publishers, made for tv movies about how poor Jimmy was a victim of a "panic".

More Sacramento --

The Nuclear plant:

" Senator McCarthy, though flawed and an alcoholic, was absolutely on the right track, and there were hundreds of Communist agents inside the US government."

Since McCarthy was actually looking for "communists AND HOMOSEXUALS" working for the US government, he was at least half right.

My elementary school (St. Francis in Midtown) took end of the year field trips for picnics at a pond right by the towers. It had a little sandy beach and picnic tables. I am not joking. I recall going twice in the early/mid '70s. I don't know if it was water used to cool the reactors.

Here's the pond and park. Is it not bizarre to create a recreational area right by a nuclear power plant?

(R70) Natalie.

What are the weird Redwood City murders, R26? Jon Scott Dunkle? I Googled and only came up with gang murders.

Florida has the TRASHIEST crimes, R144. Not sensationalistic, bizarre or epic. Just trailer-trashy. Big difference.

R150 the nuclear power plant here gave tours to school kids years ago. (As did the Reynolds tobacco factory...Imagine school kids going to see cigarettes made) anyway...We get to the nuclear power plant (Surrey) and outside the main entrance it's woodsy there's deer and rabbits standing around (really). This was 45 years ago, and looking back the animals were trained actors...Look how safe nuclear power is!

Never had heard of that ice cream parlor/air show disaster (I was only 8 at the time)

DAMN, that one survivor's family members accounted for nearly 50 % of the fatalities.

Christ.

There's a nuclear power plant right on Lake Huron, in Ontario, Canada, in Southampton. Nobody questions swimming in the lake.

The McMartin troll needs to stop ruining and hijacking this interesting thread.

[quote]What the hell is the King Tut stuff about?

Good Christ, people, it was a joke.

Lots of threads have someone casually mentioning a fake whatever, just to see how many people like you they can troll. Usually, though, we don't go into the 100s of comments with people still believing it's real.

Protip: if someone mentions something on DL you've never heard of and Google turns up nothing, it was a joke.

Except the stuff about Helen Lawson. That's all real. She used to post here.

What is this HBO docu about a serial killer of black women in LA? Apparently they found hundreds of photos and videos of local women in the suspect's home.

Richard Ramirez, Jack Unterweger, Elisa Lam (victim). I can't imagine who stays at Hotel Cecil except for the morbidly curious.

Would you stay in LA (and probably America's) scariest hotel?

No R160. Have you read the reviews?

What memories, R149! Nimbus Fish Hatchery was another field trip favorite. And I wonder if the Pig Trough has been resized at the new Farrell's?

Honey child, Florida surpassed California in terrifying inexplicable crimes more thant 30 years ago.

A sampling of Tampa

I murdered Cary's hole in the Hollywood Hills.

The R164 link doesn't even include the mad man who went around randomly shooting joggers in 1983.

Nobody cares about trashy Florida.

Kim Basinger winning an Oscar.

"DEATH OF RAVEN, A HOLLYWOOD BEAUTY:"

R158, how shall we cast "The King Tut Murders: A Nightmare in Two Parts over Two Nights"?

I love the weird names they used to give killers. "The Sunday Morning Slasher" and such.

..

R167 Speak for yourself.

Yes, the Nimbus Fish Hatchery, R162! It's a big field trip destination now. My neighbor's kid went last spring.

We also did the Wonder bread factory off 80 and Arden (I don't think it's there anymore) We got little personal loaves of unsliced bread at the end. I was so excited because my mother refused to buy Wonder. We also went to the California Almond Growers Exchange. Not so exciting since my parents worked there and we had all sorts of almonds at home. It seems like schools don't have field trips so much any more.

The rash of freeway killings and disappearances of young women having car trouble off the sides of freeways was certainly frightening. (Late 60s/70s)

It bears repeating how fucking strange and frightening the Tate/Labianca murders were. Every year or so, one of the Manson freaks comes up for parole, and I am surprised they're even eligible considering how they paralyzed the city in fear and committed such truly shocking, gruesome acts. My family lived one block from the LaBiancas. Everyone in the neighborhood was scared. Overnight, people bought guard dogs and security padlocks. And then when they were finally caught, the girls shaved their head, carved Xes into their forehead and laughed and sang songs right on TV. If that isn't the very definition of weird and freaky, I dunno what is..

[quote] TV game show host, Chuck Barrister

His name was Chuck Barris, you fucking lunatic idiot troll.

R162, Do you remember Farrell's Ice Cream Diet?

I remember Farrell's. Delicious ice cream.

The severed head found by a dog in a bag near the Hollywood sign never seems to get its fair due.

They blamed it on a gay lover's quarrel, but I suspected Mexican drug cartels. The victim was a flight attendant for a Mexican airline...

lovers'

New York had a few weird ones. Motivational speaker Jeffrey Locker found dead in Harlem.

I still don't understand if it was murder or suicide or if he really did ask the Harlem Kevorkian for help.

NY-NJ had the Lindbergh Baby.

r181 Noel Behn wrote a good book about that case.

IIRC, He floated a scenario that the aunt did it. Apparently she was unstable and the staff had orders not to leave her alone with the baby.

The maid who committed suicide was supposed to have done so out of guilt over letting the aunt have access.

When the Lindbergs made up the kidnapping scenario to cover up the crime, they didn't count on extortionists trying to get the reward money.

White crime.

I don't buy that one, R182. Behn was a high level intelligence guy. Diversion is par for the course.

Lindbergh was one of the last great patriots, and the most popular man in America, married to the daughter of a JP Morgan partner.

He was independently wealthy, and put his country first, like JFK.

The Internationalists who formed the Council on Foreign Relations ten years earlier knew Lindbergh was a great threat to their plans and agendas, both in the banking industry and foreign policy.

The Internationalists already had the mass media on lock-down by 1932, and only a few America-first voices like Lindbergh and Father Caughlin got through.

Also, the internationalists on Wall Street that collaborated with the mafia during WW2 already had deep deep mob ties in 1932.

The internationalists on Wall St were led by the Warburg brothers. One of them controlled the German central bank and the other started the US Federal Reserve and the Council on Foreign Relations.

The guy who ended up being executed for the kidnapping claimed his German (J-ish) friend, who was a well known dealer of black market money like the gold notes, gave him a box with the gold notes, before leaving for Germany not long after the kidnapping.

I think that was basically the case, and that German fencer was the link to the organized crime wing of the German-led internationalist cabal that orchestrated the kidnapping.

If Hauptmann had carried out the kidnapping and collected the ransom, as charged, why would he spend that hot money in his own neighborhood, like at the gas station where his license plate was jotted down?

Much more plausible was his story:

"Hauptmann was arrested by Finn; he was interrogated, as well as beaten at least once, throughout the day and night that followed.[14] The money, Hauptmann stated, along with other items, had been left with him by friend and former business partner Isidor Fisch. Fisch had died on March 29, 1934, shortly after returning to Germany.[4] Only following Fisch's death, Hauptmann stated, did he learn that the shoe box left with him contained a considerable sum of money. He took the money because he claimed that it was owed to him from a business deal that he and Fisch had made.[4] Hauptmann consistently denied any connection to the crime or knowledge that the money in his house was from the ransom."

"Involvement with Bruno Hauptmann[edit] Fisch was well known in the German American community of the Bronx as a very strange character. He had approached many of the community to invest in a variety of business schemes, most of which were bogus. He was also involved in some small fencing operations which included the purchasing of "hot" money cheaply to store and re-use later. Fisch and Hauptmann met in 1932, became friends, and agreed to pool the risks and profits of Fisch's trade in furs and Hauptmann's stock investments."

[quote]Lindbergh was one of the last great patriots, and the most popular man in America, married to the daughter of a JP Morgan partner.

AKA a racist isolationist.

[quote]He was independently wealthy, and put himself first, like the Koch brothers.

I fixded it for you!

Lindbergh cast an icy cold eye on J-ws (and everyone else not Aryan) but I don't recall him ever Brown-shirting them.

I could be wrong, though

Charles Lindbergh was not only a Nazi sympathizer but he believed in the Nazi theories of eugenics and superior races. He fathered children by three different mistresses in Germany, because he believed that he had an obligation to pass along his superior genes.

The theory that the Lindbergh baby may have been development impaired and Charles engineered the entire kidnapping plot himself to rid his family of the baby that he considered inferior or damaged seems plausible to me. Anne Morrow would never have agreed to putting her child away in an institution even if he had been developmentally disabled. The Morrow family was too wealthy and powerful for Lindbergh to ignore their wishes but he felt the baby was personal failure and embarrassment. Lindbergh had many German friends and tremendous admiration for Germans throughout his life. While Lindbergh may not have known Hauptman personally, he had many friends and intermediaries who could've enlisted Hauptmann into the plan and given Hauptmann the detailed information he would've needed to know about the family's schedule, the schedule of the nurses, and layout of the house. When the plot unraveled, Lindbergh was perfectly willing to let Hauptman take the blame alone.

But did he ever take steps to keep J-ws from working or living? His actions to promote Aryan eugenics consisted of knocking up blonde German ladies -- the rest were just thoughts, not crimes.

[quote]His actions to promote Aryan eugenics were racist and despicable.

There, I fixed it for you. You seem to be having some trouble with your keyboard (because I'm sure you're NOT an apologist for the vile Nazis/Aryan eugenics theories that were the basis for the Holocaust.)

Always altering reality to satisfy your sticky desires, eh, R191?

The Holocaust was not about eugenics. Eugenics was the excuse the Nazis used.

The Holocaust was about greed, forced labor and emptying foreign territory for German use.

If the Holocaust was about eugenics, richer German J-ws would not have been allowed to leave after they signed over their stuff. They would have been killed along with the poorer German J-ws who had nothing of value to the Nazis, and with the Russian and Polish J-ws who had even less, other than the land under their feet.

That rogue black cop who turned on the LAPD, killing some other officers, and then hiding out in the Big Bear wilderness was like something out of Rambo.

Not any more--when they'res something weird and/or senseless, my first reaction is "Florida?". And I'm usually right. The trashy folks trying to start over moved on to Fort Lauderdale, Tampa, etc. a long time ago.

Christopher Dorner, R193 -- when it was happening, the media kept calling his final webpage a "rant" but ever since then, I've seen everything he wrote about police behavior towards civilians to be true.

Again, can people not differentiate between white trash Florida crimes (Casey Anthony, George Zimmerman) vs. sensationalistic crimes that grab the world's attention and seem like something from a Hollywood film (Manson, OJ, North Hollywood shootout)?

CNN treats them just the same.

r189 the thing that gives me pause re: that theory is the fact that he was executed.

I have a hard time thinking he wouldn't tell everything and use it to avoid Old Sparky. Enough people hated Lindbergh (rightly so) that they would have pursued that theory's leads.

The story of the aunt is mysterious, but explains the suicide of the servant, and the very tight control Lindbergh took of the investigation from day one.

r189 if he was developmentally disabled, why stage a kidnapping?

Why not just have him the victim of an unfortunate accident? Literally it would be easier to say a servant dropped him.

It would be plausible to blame a poor servant, go through a trial where she would likely be acquitted of a negligence charge, and Bob's your Uncle.

OTOH, if he was obviously and gruesomely murdered, there would be no way to hide that fact.

A simple "He fell downstairs when he got away from his nanny" wouldn't suffice.

ANYWAY! Ronni Chasen wins this thread, for me. The others are all just common or garden sensationalist tripe. But THIS. THIS. It is the apex of everything that is mysterious and murky about the beast known as Hollywood. WHO ordered the hit? And WHY! Money laundering, prostitution rings, gambling debts, art fraud, Russian mafia, celebrity mafia, gay mafia, drug pimps, arms deals, disgruntled clients, jealous co-publicists......and EVERYONE is STILL keeping their mouths firmly shut. Unbelievable. You just could NOT make it up.

Jennifer Anistakassis' career is a crime against nature and art.

The Manson murders were hyped up, there were many murders far more gruesome.

The world will never forget the great Acme School Bell heist.

Mrs. Patty was taken in Berkeley not LA.

LA was actually the SLA's downfall. The black community didn't support them the way they did in SF. People were turning in the white woman with all the guns as fast as they could dial 911.

(somebody probably said this already but as the Patty Hearst troll I feel compelled to contribute.)

Still no justice for Ronnie chasen

Eddie Murphy soliciting trannies.

R122 And what makes you discredit such claims? Is it the mention of "Satan"?

Do you know that some of these sickos expose their victums to these Satanic rituals because they know once they'te reported they will be deemed "Satanic hyterics"?

Do you even care?

R130 & R131 omg. I can't beloeve the people responsible for publishing this shit are "the experts" believed.

People need to stop being so fucking ideological and wake the fuck up.

This guy must be having a ball making this stuff up.