Ben Affleck pressured PBS documentary to omit the fact that his ancestor was a slave owner

The exchange happened in July last year and the second series of Finding Your Roots was shown in September last year.

The two men appear to be friends and Mr Gates seems to be asking for advice on what he calls a 'dilemma'. Sony is not listed in the production credits for the show.

Mr Gates writes: 'Confidentially, for the first time, one of our guests has asked us to edit out something about one of his ancestors--the fact that he owned slaves.

'Now, four or five of our guests this season descend from slave owners, including [documentary filmmaker] Ken Burns.

'We've never had anyone ever try to censor or edit what we found. He's a megastar. What do we do?'

Mr Lynton's advice is 'all things being equal I would definitely take it out' but warns that if such a move becomes public then 'it gets tricky'.

He also says that a big question is who knows about the request, to which Mr Gates replies that all of his producers were aware of the situation.

Mr Gates writes: 'To do this would be a violation of PBS rules, actually, even for Batman [Affleck]'.

Lynton replies: 'Then it is tricky because it may get out that you made the change and it comes down to editorial integrity.'.

Gates says: 'It would embarrass him and compromise our integrity.

'I think he is getting very bad advice. I've offered to fly to Detroit, where he is filming, to talk it through.'

Mr Affleck's request seems all the more inexcusable as other guests in the series found out that their ancestors were slave owners, including Anderson Cooper whose distant relative was beaten to death with a farm hoe by a rebellious slave.

Instead of finding out about Mr Affleck's story, in the episode viewers were shown footage that painted him in an entirely positive light.

Mr Affleck told how he traces his social consciousness back to his mother Anne Boldt, a teacher and activist who was a Freedom Rider in the Civil Rights Era.

He says that she taught him: 'The character of a person is defined by adversity, rather than by like when, you know, everything's going well'.

He says: 'She definitely imbued us with a very strong sense of social justice and social equality and kind of things that I've, uh, carried with me, but always using other people as examples, never herself.'

In a humorous moment Affleck is told that he is the 10th cousin of Matt Damon, a good friend of his who comes from Boston, his home town.

Viewers were also shown stories of how his third great grandfather, Almon Bruce French, comforted the bereaved in the Civil War by claiming he was a spiritualist who could see the dead.

Affleck learns that his sixth great grandfather Jesse Stanley fought in the American Revolution and was one of just 2,000 soldiers who served under George Washington in some of the toughest times of the war.

Affleck says: 'That is really, really something. I love it. I'm developing this movie about, um, the Revolutionary War. Now, I see why I was drawn to it.'

With warm smiles Affleck tells Mr Gates that these stories 'make me feel more connected to the country...this is a big surprise and I'm really proud of it'.

He also says: 'I'm sure that there's so much of people's history that gets lost over time. You have to really work to hold on to it I suppose.'

The revelations come at a time when television presenters are under scrutiny for the veracity of their claims after NBC host Brian Williams admitted lying on some of his news reports.

Gates is one of the most respected African American filmmakers in America and his PBS documentary ‘The African Americans: Many Rivers to Cross’ won him the Peabody Award, one of the highest awards in journalism, and an NAACP Image Award.

Affleck is the latest celebrity to have embarrassing personal details released by the hacked emails that were stolen from Sony Pictures Entertainment, the company's movie division, last November.

This week WikiLeaks uploaded 30,287 of the documents and 173,132 emails into a database which is the first time the information has been made available in one place in a searchable format.

The emails were stolen by a calling itself Guardians of Peace, though it later emerged that it was the work of North Korea in response to the release of the Sony film: 'The Interview', a parody about the secretive communist nation.

When North Korea threatened to carry out further attacks at screenings Sony cancelled the opening but changed its mind after pressure from the White House.

The film eventually came out on limited release in December and on the Internet at the same time.

A spokesman for Mr Gates claimed that a slave-owning ancestor was not interesting enough for the show.

'Ultimately, I maintain editorial control on all of my projects and, with my producers, decide what will make for the most compelling program,' he said through a spokesman.

'In the case of Mr Affleck - we focused on what we felt were the most interesting aspects of his ancestry - including a Revolutionary War ancestor, a 3rd great–grandfather who was an occult enthusiast, and his mother who marched for Civil Rights during the Freedom Summer of 1964.'

A PBS spokesman claimed the emails showed Gates was taking editorial integrity 'seriously'.

'It is clear from the exchange how seriously Professor Gates takes editorial integrity.

'He has told us that after reviewing approximately ten hours of footage for the episode, he and his producers made an independent editorial judgment to choose the most compelling narrative.

'The range and depth of the stories on Finding Your Roots speak for themselves.'

Sony declined to comment. Daily Mail Online has reached out to Mr Lynton.

Among the celebrities who have been dragged into the row have been Angelina Jolie, Brad Pitt and Jennifer Lawrence.

THE EMAILS WHICH REVEALED BEN AFFLECK'S SHAME AT SLAVERY ROOTS

Gates

By the way, I need your advice: I'm on a flight to L.A. for the TCA Press Tour. We launch season two of Finding Your Roots tomorrow at noon, and four celebrities, including Nas, are showing up. Here's my dilemma: confidentially, for the first time, one of our guests has asked us to edit out something about one of his ancestors--the fact that he owned slaves. Now, four or five of our guests this season descend from slave owners, including Ken Burns. We've never had anyone ever try to censor or edit what we found. He's a megastar. What do we do?

Lynton

On the doc the big question is who knows that the material is in the doc and is being taken out. I would take it out if no one knows, but if it gets out that you are editing the material based on this kind of sensitivity then it gets tricky. Again, all things being equal I would definitely take it out.

Gates

All my producers would know; his PR agency the same as mine, and everyone there has been involved trying to resolve this; my agent at CAA knows. And PBS would know. To do this would be a violation of PBS rules, actually, even for Batman.

Lynton

then it is tricky because it may get out that you made the change and it comes down to editorial integrity. We can talk when you land.

Gates

Will call. It would embarrass him and compromise our integrity. I think he is getting very bad advice. I've offered to fly to Detroit, where he is filming, to talk it through.

Lynton

Yeah,, the past is the past…..

Gates

And he wasn't even a bad guy. We don't demonize him at all. Now Anderson Cooper's ancestor was a real s.o.b.; one of his slaves actually murdered him. Of course, the slave was promptly hanged. And Anderson didn't miss a beat about that. Once we open the door to censorship, we lose control of the brand.

Lynton

Yes, bad idea. .

Everything after Gigli has been a mission to create a golden image of himself. Affleck has been enormously successful in doing so, but it's a creation, a Hollywood production.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if this was a common shakedown scheme. Find a celebrity, dig up his slave owning ancestry and blackmail him into making a substantial donation to a 'racially sensitive cause'.

Bet they won't touch Obama, even though the Kenyan upper class sold more slaves than everyone in America put together.

Why would he possibly care?

My ancestors owned slaves, and apparently they were big time KKK members, but what on earth does that have to do with me over a century later?

What a fucking bizarre country we live in, built on the backs of slaves but everyone wants to pretend it was someone else's ancestor responsible for the exploitation.

I bet the slaves were really Gwyneth's and he is just taking the blame.

It would not surprise me if Affleck wanted to run for office one day.

This just seems stupid. Stupid of Affleck to even ask and stupid of Gates to acquiesce.

There are many, many people in this country that have had ancestors involved in slavery. That is reality. That is history. It's not like there is a half dozen people that this applies to and that there would be a huge scandal.

I'm surprised and disappointed that Gates consented to it.

Now, if we could just identify a black celebrity who is descended from slaves owned by Affleck's ancestors, we'd have the casting for a great action flick where the two male leads become unlikely buddies.

"Ben Affleck persuaded the producers of Finding Your Roots..."

C'mon, didn't the title alone give him fair warning that slavery was in the topic scope?

Douche unsurprisingly. He needed to reform his image at all costs. He even got Morley Schaeffer to lie and say he graduated with honors from Harvard on his sunday news program. Affleck really wanted that Oscar for Argo.

It's perfect that they actually discuss people finding out. Bad decisions made, and they know it. Although, we don't know how the conversation went when they met up later.

Affleck is such a dope. If anything, revealing it would have given him an opportunity to prove how different he is from his ancestors.

Why should he be worried? He had no control over that. I have people in my family even today that are racist and homophobic - doesn't mean I am. It's silly to think your entire family lineage lines up perfectly with your own perspectives and views, and likewise it doesn't necessarily mean someone is racist because their great great uncle was.

Wow, what a brilliant, original thought, R14. The point is Affleck pressured a tax-payer supported show to lie by omission in order to preserve his own Democratic-cred.

r15 If Ben did that, it reflects the sad state of society which might put racist allegations thanks to her ancestors.He probably would have had to prove that he isn't hypocrite and be even more liberal just to shake off his ancestors dirty past. I would be worried if I were in Ben's place too.That's why he didn't the story to go public.

Sorry for the grammar in r16.

May be I had a little too much at the party. lol

Somehow I suspect Ben's ancestors are the least of his secrets. Alcoholics always have lots of skeletons in the closet.

Yeah, it's a bad reflection on society that Afflack felt pressured to lie about an ancestor's behavior that was entirely beyond his control. But liberals are the ones who promote a culture of shame about intergenerational white privilege and guilt. And Bennie is a proud member of that Howard Zinn camp.

R15, why don't you go buy a copy of American Sniper and shove it up your ass

Shouldn't the fucking OP be a little more worried about "Creationists" trying to use tax payer money to peddle their bullshit fairy tales?

Shows like that love to find ancestors who were slave owners and have the descendant look surprised and upset and denounce slavery and things like that. It teaches us how to think about it like brainwashing. I know my ancestry, but if I were on the show and had a slave owning ancestor I would not react to it. I would not be baited. I would just keep moving on. My ancestor would be too far removed from me when it comes to slavery. Just because I don't believe in slavery doesn't mean I have to make a drama out of it on a television show.

Absolutely, which is why I oppose intelligent design curricula being taught in the public schools. Look Mommy, no contradiction!

Benedit Cumberbatch never had an issue with people knowing about his ancestor owning slaves. This is not societal pressure; rather it's Affleck being a controlling, politically correct coward and asshole.

Well said, R19

This says everything about Ben Affleck.

He's the worst. I wonder if the other one is just as bad.

Affleck's dishonesty has now been proved, not that I'm surprised.

Why didn't the show discuss Benjamin Géza Affleck-Boldt's Islamic heritage?

He is an idiot. Skeletons in the closet are one thing, but here he is actively pushing the skeleton in there - creating a big bad secret for people to find out.

What a tool.

Gay conservatives are mentally ill. This is news?

Now OP, if you can find a way to blame this on the Clintons, you'll hit the Wingnut Trifecta!

*rolls eyes*

It was stupid of Affleck to ask, and it was stupid for Gates to succumb to the request. But I'm most insulted by the bullshit they're now shoveling about this being some independent editorial decision.

You were caught in your deception, now own it. I'd have much more respect for Gates if he said: we made a call at the time, and it's now clear to me it was the wrong call, and I regret the decision. Instead of some mealy-mouthed, contrived, transparent bullshit you're now hiding behind.

He's scared honkey haters will attack him or something, should the news of his slavery past come out.

Why do people want to research their roots anyway? All those past people are dead. And your time span is separate from theirs. Is it really that important to dig up your "roots"? Will it make a difference in your life and who you are, really?

I think people are missing the point. He didn't ask this be covered up because it would ruin his liberal cred. Please. It's ben affleck, narcissist. The show played up his patriotic ancestors and overall made him look good. This is all about crafting his image in the public s eye. He wants to be known as a very serious filmmaker and actor now. He's trying to distance himself from his obvious famewhore/Jlo days albeit by being a more respectable kind of famewhore.

[quote]Viewers were also shown stories of how his third great grandfather, Almon Bruce French, comforted the bereaved in the Civil War by claiming he was a spiritualist who could see the dead.

Confronted? You mean, shook down.

This is so earthshattering I can hardly stay standing.

Oh wait, no. That's the hunger that's making me dizzy.

He more than asked. He was clearly putting a lot of pressure on the show to take it out. And I have no doubt they told him that like 4 or 5 other people from that season have slave-owning ancestors but none requested that this information be edited out.

He's an entitled, pretentious and dishonest asshole. I wouldn't be surprised if he runs for office one day, as he's just the type to be a politician. Complete phony.

R32 nailed it. Gates' response is worse than the original act.

[quote]Benedit Cumberbatch never had an issue with people knowing about his ancestor owning slaves.

Why would he? He still calls them "coloUreds."

R28, do you pride yourself on being a nose-picking speed bump?

[quote]His parents named him Géza for a Hungarian friend who survived the Holocaust

How depressing to think that r21 imagined he was making a good point. The poor man.

R21 is Ben Affleck.

Well said, R21.

Great point, R21

Awwww....R21 is talking to himself again.

Affleck is a racist. I'm not surprised he tried pulling this shit. Not at all. If he wasn't he wouldn't have tried to cover it up. Typical white persons move.

[quote]Typical white persons move.

How very racist of you to say so.

I understand why he would have wanted to hide that part of his past, but the past is just that - the past. It doesn't mean it's who he is. All our ancestors were racist, just as many of us are, now. It's not a revelation.

R47, All WHITE people are racist. As my brothers have pointed out, racism is a white mans disease. They just try and fake us out. The panders are the most fake. They think we are to stupid to see past their shit. Affleck is clearly a racist. If he wasn't he wouldn't have to cover anything up. Anyone who can't see that is clearly racist themselves. BA has a career because he white. It's bullshit but hopefully this racist shit will finally put an end to his career.

If that's true he's an asshole but I'm not sure I believe it.

The only amusing thing Goop has ever said was that Ben was a "knucklehead." I believe her - he seems like dolt.

I don't really care.

BA has always struck me as a bit of a poseur. This story just shows how fragile and superficial his sense of self is that he can't even handle having others know that he has a slave owner in the family tree.

Sounds like Anderson Cooper at least had the ability to handle the news and accept that most of us have parts of our history that are shameful.

And Gates has now come out and released a statement that just struck me as pandering and weak. He caved to "Batman" but wants to blur the lines for all involved by stating he and his producers ignored the slavery issue to focus on 'more interesting' aspects of BA's family tree. Riiiiiight...

Gates has no integrity whatsoever. In another show he glossed over the fact that Alan Derhsowitz's DNA revealed that he is part sub-Saharan African. That should make him a black man in Gates' eyes. He just kept going and did not say a word.

Why is PBS caving in to celebrity demands? They lose all credibility for what is supposed to be a show based on sound research and genealogy. I was born in Texas so I would not be surprised to find out my ancestors were less than honorable. But I would not cry about it. He is a total pussy.

R49 = Racist

I trust it goes without saying: Don't feed the troll.

Ben Affleck sounds like such a dick. This story just confirms it.

R56, It clearly doesn't go without saying because your racist ass responded. I'm here to fight racism and if you don't like it don't fucking respond. You have no business doing so. I should be able to speak up against racism without being bullied. Read the truth then move the fuck on. Simple.

I don't blame Affleck. Look at what Azealia Banks is doing, which is gaining traction. Last thing I would want is for someone like that creature to find out long dead relatives were slave owners.

I would also guess he didn't know this before agreeing to the show and it may not be something he expected and needs to procees alone and not with an audience.

R59, You are racist. And keep AZ out your mouth.

...

Stupid decision on Gates' part. I'm black, but my great-grandfather was a sheet wearing, midnight riding, cross burning, limb lynching Klansman who had [bold]7(!)[/bold] children with a black woman. And these children called him "Papa." My grandmother spoke fondly of him. I can't reconcile it, but personal ancestral histories are fucked up for A LOT of people. There's no reason to be ashamed of them.

I don't get why this is a big deal. It's not like the show make up an alternate history for the guy. Who cares? Nobody lied.

[quote]All WHITE people are racist.

I disagree, but I'm not going to argue this with you. If you truly believe this, an anonymous poster on a message board isn't going to change your mind. But I'm hoping you posted this just to be a shit-stirrer and not because you actually think this way.

He IS a shit stirrer, R64. In any thread even tangentially related to black people, he'll be there ranting about nothing. And hating lesbians. That's this thing's tired shtick. Ignore it.

R64 and R65, A lot of people have those views. Do you only think one person dare speak out against racism? But that makes us shit stirrers? I can't believe how far we have yet to go. All white people are racist. It's inbreed in them. I'm proud when my brothers speak up. If you don't agree I suggest you take your own fucking advice and ignore the posts. We have our rights too. You have zero say. So just move the fuck along.

Troll, it would be one thing if you were speaking out about actual racism. But you seem to conflate the barest mention of a black person as racism. I'm black, not white washed, and I think you're a lunatic.

Thank you, R67, on behalf of sane people of all races.

r66, actually, you're partially right. But the real issue is blacks can't be racist because they have no power. No black person can say something about my life in any way that has an impact. I, however, could say something that would either improve the lot of a black person's life or lessen it.

It's PC to believe otherwise. But it's obviously true because this power goes hand-in-hand with privilege (privilege of all types, by the way).

R69, what word would you use to describe a black person who hates your fucking guts for no reason other than the fact that you're white?

Listen as this insane black judge berates the white victim of a home invasion for racism. Apparently even three year olds with guns pointed at them hold all the power, so long as they're white.

R67, You ain't black.

R70, I'm not R69 but I can answer your question. You are trying to deflect. You are hated for your racism. Stop trying twist it. Own your behavior and stop trying to blame us for your issues.

I posted some of this on the other thread claiming that it was Matt Damon who made the request rather than Ben Affleck:

I am a serious genealogist.

In my experience, once you start researching a family's roots, there is a high likelihood that you will uncover some less than positive family secrets. Back in the old days, these facts faded into the mists of time and became rumors, gossip, or unsubstantiated tall tales. With the current access to birth, marriage and death records, immigration records, prison records, old newspapers, etc., it's wise to assume that something surprising will surface: bigamists, criminals, swindlers, deserters, cowards, whores, ... you name it, and it will turn up. I've researched many families and more have such a secret than don't. Some researchers look with a sort of bemused affection for the "Black Sheep" that they uncover.

As for Dr. Gates, I've seen several episodes of his show and he LOVES finding out racists backgrounds of his guests, or tracking down some little old lady who is a descendent of slave owners, hoping to be able to uncover some current day dastardly deeds of the elderly pensioner.

Additionally, early on I became suspicious of the quality of Gates's show after one episode covered the relative of the show's guest, who was a resident of Germany during World War II. I couldn't believe my ears when Gates himself calmly states that the family's shop was "bombed by the Allies in September of 1945". If Dr. Gates doesn't know that World War II (particularly in Germany) was long over by then, he certainly should and that makes the quality of the research on this show very suspect.

I'm not really surprised to hear that the Gates's show chose to cave to Affleck's request.

R70 The word you're looking for is "racist."

r70, you're "frustrated" by your lot in life. It's completely understandable, and very common.

You need to look in a mirror, R72. Your words against others apply to you as well.

What a douche.

I was going to post an observation about the original post - but as the thread continued, I see that it has been taken over by racist assholes of the worst type.

So ... nevermind.

Can't stand this motherfucking poser hope this blows up in his face.

It's odd that Affleck didn't anticipate that there might be some unsavory types mixed in there.

R78, Racist whites are to blame for that and you know it. But you don't want to admit it because you are a racist yourself.

Funny, R81, but R78 made no mention of which race was being so offensive.

But go ahead and let anger and rage define you. That'll really help.

Everyone who is a racist has power (twisted though that power is) but not everyone who has power is a racist.

Affleck is an idiot who has confused himself with someone who is important. He has delusions of grandeur much like Alec Baldwin. They're both fools who think they are destined for greatness.

"Anderson Cooper whose distant relative was beaten to death with a farm hoe by a rebellious slave."

Would anyone be surprised if they heard Anderson himself died under similar circumstances, beaten to death by a farm ho?

R82, Save the racist shit. You know damn well which race is racist. White. You all have the power. You all started racism. It's a word because of you. But go ahead and pretend like you don't know it.

See what lying does? Even when lying by omission this has not only made Ben even more suspect and image obsessed,but compromised the integrity of Gates and the show,if not PBS as a whole.

And why on earth would Gates seek advice from Lynton on such a matter? Of course he would give him the predictable advice to leave it out.

Ben and Lynton will be fine. Gates is the one who stands to lose the most in all of this.

R85 is some white guy sitting in his Mama's basement with a Fight The Power! Tshirt on.

R62, if your family story is true as you wrote it and if you have documentation to substantiate your story, I would seriously consider shopping it to an agent. Lots of psychological/political/historical angles there.

R87, I'm black you stupid shit. But your racist comments ain't going to shut me up. Ain't no way you'd pull that shit if you wasn't in front in front of a computer screen.

i would love to pressure ben affleck, bend him and bone him like the whore he is.

Another reason to dislike this fucking cunt.

Such Empowerment!

Ranting on an anonymous message board of no consequence.

Your mama must be so proud.

Oh, that's right. She hates you because you're gay.

R73, it makes me wonder if Gates was upset because PBS did agree to the request and he wanted to have his gotcha moment with "batman".

Gates' email seemed star struck and oddly worded, almost like he disappointed because he was already told to skip over that relative and was looking for Lyton to talk Affleck out of his decision.

The relative was omitted instead of included with a new background so the integrity of the show would have remained intact. If integrity was an issue, then Gates could have said no and not have gone to Lynton with his, "should I agree or not" email.

Out of the three, Affleck seems like the lesser schmuck here. Affleck just asked, the other two could have said "no" and Gates didn't have to be a drama queen by running to Lynton.

He's got a big duck tho.

I think if his duck is that big, R94, it might really be a goose.

Is this show still on? I want to like it like I want to like Who do you think you are? but both are so inferior to the original BBC series. Gates' show is way too concentrated on him and doesn't go into enough depth with the interviewees.

I'm surprised Affleck would do this but if Gates allowed it, it's really his fault. Admitting he had an ancestor who had slaves, Affleck could have done a super-actory horrified rant. But then again, Affleck isn't much of an actor.

No, Affleck is the biggest schmuck because he should have never asked anything to be removed. Plain and simple. Everyone is expected to cater to celebrities and their idiotic requests, and he put Gates in an awkward position. Simply having the ancestor wouldn't have meant anything, he made it into a big deal by trying to hide it when all he had to do was discuss it for maybe a few minutes.

I had a story line like this.

So you have never asked for anything in your life R97? Not one thing? Not a favor? Always take whats handed to you?

You never know, till you ask... Gates is the biggest schmuck and a drama queen who was afraid of "batman".

R99 My point, again is that Affleck should have never asked. There was no reason to hide the ancestor.

R100, you are projecting what you would do and how you would feel onto someone else. Affleck's reasoning was never madeknown, was it?

R101 There is no acceptable reason. It's not about what I would do, it's what any normal person would have done. Stop defending Affleck.

Wow..."stop defending Affleck". Fuck off and die R102. Don't. You. Fucking. Tell. Me. What. To. Fucking. Do. You. Cunty. Control. Freak.

He obviously had his reasons that you don't agree with. Get the fuck over it. It's not like he asked them to come up with a new history or lie.

I blame PBS for bowing to pressure. Dumb fucks. Never gonna donate again.

Gates made the decision not PBS.

It really doesn't take a genius to figure out Affleck's reasoning. He clearly sees himself as one of the superheroes he plays on screen. He's afraid that having any unsavory types in his family will tarnish his perfect image of superstar, family man, and advocate for certain causes. This is a guy who will run for office one day. And he's perfect for that life because he's a complete douche and phony.

Run for office? Ugh! No!!!! Poor people of Boston, Hahahahaha!!!!

Fuck Boston, they can fuck off.

R106, so? And you expect any different out of Hollywood?

He's such an ugly old hairhat cunt. He really is the Gen X version of Kevin Spacey.

The Beatles "Penny Lane" (The lane that is) is named for a Liverpudlian sea captain who was a slaver...

It isn't crazy that someone high profile would want to hide this. If you agree otherwise you're a fucking hypocrite. You're telling me you'd be fine w that out there if you were Affleck

Give me a break

Why was he the only high-profile person to make this type of request? Anderson Cooper had a slaveholder ancestor and he didn't make such a request. Nor did anyone else.

I'm not surprised that Affleck's an idiot. His performance on Bill Maher's show proved it. But what did he expect when going on an ancestry show? He's a white American. There's a good chance he had some slaveholder or Confederate soldier in his family.

I appreciate people who can face adversity and what's unsavoury about themselves and family. He had ancestors that he couldn't be proud of, every single one of us have, he could've seen that and reconciled himself. He chose not to. This tells me he can't face reality. It takes bravery to face facts. In this world, most can't and he's just another one of those.

If Affleck runs for office, I hope this haunts him.

Not his slaveholding ancestral past, but the attempt to deny it.

Are all Democrats habitual liars?

Did Ben even finish college? Run what? Run from his wife and kids probably...

Anderson Cooper is not a movie star, he's a news personality and probably gets more cred by having his genealogy known. Plus Cooper is an out-of- the-closet gay man, so there is not much more the flyovers and fraus can pick apart.

Who says he can't face reality R113. Maybe he didn't want to do so publicly. I can just see the tweets from some of these young, black celbs demanding he pay reparations. I wouldn't want that shit either, especially if I thought my family had a different history than it did.

We need to dismiss the idea of collective guilt and inherited guilt. No one is responsible for the actions of his or her ancestors. None of us would be here but for the acts of our forebears.

You are responsible for your own words, deeds, thoughts, and acts. You are not responsible for anyone else's, least of all anyone who died before you were born.

R117 tell that to the likes of Azealia Banks. I just get my may be my last shot to carry a major franchise and people aren't happy that I've been chosen, the last thing I want is an ignorant, little twat like Azealia Banks screaming I owe black people reparations because some previously unknown relative owned slaves.

I bet his PR people advised him against making it known and it looks like Sony was all too happy to say kill it. With that much money on the line, who wants Azealia Banks, Amandla Cornrow Appropriation and Zendayya It's Because I'm Black stealing the PR narrative from the Batman movie.

Fuck that, good for Affleck. I'd rather face you faux rage queens than ignorant history rewriting teens.

I posted this on the other so-called parody Matt Damon thread-

It's Affleck who pressured HLG to excise the slave-holding ancestor and got his way, no matter what HLG now spouts about it being his independent editorial decision.

I was indifferent about Affleck. Now, however, he's an asshole.

Moreover, there was an opportunity here to say that his family ancestors have came full circle because his mother marched for civil rights in the 60s. That is, of course, if we believe that she did because this episode has called into question the entire series.

Which brings me to PBS. They've jumped into the whole reality show genre pool and got bit in the ass with this episode.

I'm a constant PBS watcher except for this program. From when it premiered and for reasons I couldn't put on my finger I avoided it. Now I know why- I sensed the phoniness

I'm with Della. As soon as I read Henry Louis Gates, Jr. was producing a history show on PBS pandering to celebrities, my bullshit detector went into orbit.

It was only a matter of time…

The one excuse he might be able to explain why he didn't want this info revealed is that other family members objected to it getting out. Cousins, aunts and uncles. He's not the only one that might be embarrassed by this and shouldn't be the only one who makes the decision on whether or not the families dirty laundry gets aired.

All people who wear toupees are their own special brand of stupid.

Then he shouldn't have agreed to be on the show, R121.

Thanks,r120.

And what r121 wrote brings me to another point. Common sense has me avoiding obtaining info on my ancestors.

The chance, however remote, of my finding out that, say, my 8th Great-Grandfather was, during the Inquisition, head blade sharpener for the guillotine crew, is one I'll forgo.

R121 It's pretty obvious he didn't know about the slave owner relative until the show was being filmed otherwise he wouldn't have done it at all.

A co-worker was obsessed about researching her history until she found out a multiple-murderer cousin had been executed by the state of Florida.

I think she expected to discover she was related to royalty. Like I told her, when you set out to dig into family history, it's probably best if you expect to uncover a horse thief or two.

The reason why he didn't want it known because it goes against everything white Americans and immigrants who 'made it'off the struggles of black slaves keep shoving down the worlds collective throat-that their success has NOTHING to do with their pale skin. Right. It makes it very hard to stand on a soap box and judge blacks about pulling themselves up by their bootstraps when ones family wealth is based on the foundation of slave labor of their ancestors. Something Benedict Cumberbatch's mother was fully aware of. And to see the descendants of those slave owning ancestors perhaps still struggling from the remnants of that time must be very hard to take while they make millions.

It's embarrassing for Affleck,Gates and all involved to try to 'white wash' history but especially Gates,a so called historian who's brand has really been damaged by this.

The show is, of course, not really a "documentary" as the DL title says. That is, the show's producers (and I would include Gates, whether he is technically a "producer" or not) have to decide selectively what to feature. One of the posts said there was 10 hours of footage shot for a one hour show. None of these ancestry reality shows feature the star's boring ancestors. Actually, we don't know much if anything about the ancestry -- 99% of the subject's ancestry -- that is not shown. Probably in conceiving of the arc of the season, Gates and his producers are seeking for a balanced, interesting mix. So I am not sure why another episode focusing on slave-owning ancestors of a star with southern roots would add much.

Having said that, this will without doubt lead to a review of the contract language used. Doubtless there is a contract between the featured star and the production company....

[quote] So I am not sure why another episode focusing on slave-owning ancestors of a star with southern roots would add much.

I know why it would have added much. Affleck, of course, didn't object to the "truth" of his mother marching for civil rights to be aired.

So,here he has a slaveholding ancestor and a mother who marched for civil rights. Does it really take a hay-shakin' flyover country Podunk like me to point out that he should have recognized the opportunity to sieze the moment to say something like, "Wow, my ancestors really came full circle." and thereby have spared himself the embarrassment of having it revealed he tried to cover it up, plus score image control?

Add Affleck's poor judgment about managing his stardom to this pile of mess.

I knew Affleck was racist. I didn't know it was so deep but I knew it was there. His career is toast. As it should be.

Cut Affleck some slack. He had a lot going on at the time, what with his fluffing his dick for the "Gone Girl" nude scene.

It would have been a stronger segment to tell the truth -- the long-ago grandfather who owned slaves, the mom involved in civil rights, the complexity of the American story.

Look, if you are white and have relatives in the South, you are likely related way back when to someone who owned slaves. So what? Why should that shock anyone? It's just history, it's not who you are today.

If you are black, you are likely related to slave-owners too, but it's never been my impression that African Americans are especially invested in denying the horrible reality that slave owners raped their slaves.

Ben Affleck is a hypocrite. So is HLG. No one comes off looking good here. They're all sluts.

Circa 2004 I was in a room that Ben Affleck walked into that contained a few of his buddies. He said something along the lines of "What are you F-A-G-G-O-T-S up to?" and he gave high fives and bro-hugs. He later said something about "pole smokers". There were several people in the room (myself included) that he didn't know, who may have been gay for all he knew (I am).

He is a sanctimonious piece of shit. When Bill Maher gave his common sense opinion on that religion Affleck called it "gross". Mr. Casual homophobia was calling someone else gross.

FUCK him. I'm glad this has happened. If he'd let it be in the show, no one would have seen it. But now everyone knows, and everyone knows he tried to cover it up. LOL.

i think it shows how much of a phony he is.

anytime you do ancestry research expect a few tragedies and sad things to happen.

The truth of the matter is we will never know Affleck's reasons.

It could have been his idea as many here are assuming. However, with his backlog of projects, the reason could be as beign as either his PR people, a studio's PR people, PR people for a specific project, a producer, or a director said, "Ben, we don't think this is good for the project because..."

As Gates noted in his email to Sony, he didn't think Affleck was getting the best advice from PR people... so it would seem that the idea originated with PR, and possibly Sony's PR, since Gates emailed Lynton.

Tand to add Lynton's response seems to back up that the idea originated with Sony's PR people. Lynton keeps, agreeing with Gates about it being a bad move while pressuring him to not to include the relative.

Lynton didn't pressure him to do anything, R135. Lynton said that he'd keep it out although he agreed that the advice is bad. That was the end of Lynton's advice. I'm not surprised Lynton reacted this way. They will do anything to keep their A-list caliber stars happy.

I know you have a hard-on for Affleck but there is no good reason to keep this out. I'm sure it was originally Ben's idea to ask that this information be withheld. Maybe he then asked his PR people and they agreed (because why not). If it was his PR's idea, then he's clearly a person who doesn't think for himself. Any somewhat intelligent human would expect a black sheep or two. He'd also understand that imperfection can be appealing to a limited extent. Trying to present yourself and your family (no matter how far back they go) as perfect appeals to no one.

R137, I don't have a hard-on for Affleck. I find it amusing how you Affleck haters foam at the mouth everytime someone defends his position.

Please, do continue to amuse me.

Affleck is like Jon Hamm---two frat boys who never became men.

Wrong r138.

Before this, I was indifferent to Affleck, except that I thought he was robbed of an Oscar nom for his performance as George Reeves in the underrated "Hollywoodland."

So,I'm far from a hater. There is just no good way to spin this. And it all could have been avoided if he had just accepted the truth.

Still, the lion's share of this fiasco rests squarely with HLG and PBS. Whatever credibility "Finding Your roots" had is gone.

He's an egotistical idiot. It's not like anyone would blame him for what his ancestors did. His attempt to cover it up is what makes him look bad.

When Ben rides the talk show circuit to promote Batman, will he demand the interviewer suppress the story of how he demanded PBS suppress the story of his slave-owning ancestors?

You haters are too funny.

I'd tell you to unclench, but I wouldn't want the posts to stop.

Go on, Della, please explain "Wrong R138". I love for you to tell me how you think that I really don't find you all amusing. Please, do continue, this is funny shit.

R34 nails it.

Narcissism 101.

I blame Affleck less than I blame Gates and Morley Safer if these allegations are true. They should hold the ethics line and pull the episodes rather than do a cover up. Also, if I were them, the fact that Affleck would even request something like this would lower my opinion of him immeasurably, so that I really wouldn't care whether he was happy with the presentation or not.

I've never seen the show. Does it promise to air everything that was uncovered and go into detail on every lerson they find in a family tree? Sounds dull.

The Brits have an ancestry search show for celebs but unlike the US they actually have the celebs do the search and the legwork. Makes it much more interesting. There are lots of episodes on You.tube.

Her's part 1 of Rupert Penry Jones' search. The show's called Who Do You Think You Are. I got hooked and watched a bunch of these episodes and they really are much better.

R148 I think they have the same show in the states. I remember one with Helen Hunt only doing her father's side.

That Affleck was the only participant who asked for something to be censored makes his request and what he wanted censored the most interesting thing on his show and even the series by definition. Gates is such a ridiculous weasel to state the anything was more interesting than this request. The story of the slave owning and the request from Affleck should both have aired in the episode.

Even if Gates had decided that the other relatives were more interesting, he should have made the disclosure that a request to censor had been made. The fact that he didn't ruins whatever credibility he had left.

R139 Pretty much. Ben is repped PR supremeo, Ken Sunshine. Ken reps another perpetual frat boy (Long term inhabitant of the closet), Leonardo DiCaprio. What Ken has been adept at is rebranding both men. This has included giving each men a 'Cause' to make them look sincere and worthy.

R138= racist.

I agree and Affleck actually questioning this and asking for that fact to be removed from the show would have made it MUCH more interesting if they'd included it.

[quote]He's an egotistical idiot. It's not like anyone would blame him for what his ancestors did. His attempt to cover it up is what makes him look bad.

Agreed. This is the consensus I see out there on social media this weekend.

Haha! R152 = ignorant twat with no clue what the word racist even means. Good to know my posts bug you.

More from the binary thinkers please, you guys are the funniest of the lot.

Just a self important POS. Relax benji.

I know Leo is in the closet but I hoped he really did care about the environment.

I think it's possible that Ben's mouthpiece was working for Ben without his knowledge.

I didn't know Ben's family was ever from the south or did they own slaves in Boston?

It doesn't matter if your distant relative was a slave owner if you flip burgers for a living.

.

What a douchebag. All these actors (looking at you Benedict Cumberbitch) want to be cast as the glorious white savior. Reality check: if you lived back when these movies take place (in times of slavery, or the civil rights era)? In all likelihood you would have been the bad guy. Their gigantic egos can't accept this kind of thing. They honestly have convinced themselved that they've earned their place in life, despite the fact that they're white men, kind of the most privileged people in hollywood.

I love how now it's going to come out and get even more attention.

[Quote]I love how now it's going to come out and get even more attention.

It's not that big of a deal in the news and even less so here on DL.

Liberals don't give a shit; it's just the repugs.

I can't stand Affleck but its not his fault his ancestors were assholes. Apart from his obvious flaws he seems to be doing the right thing now.

He is a closet racist.

How embarrassing for Ben, who cheats, wears wigs, drinks heavily, does coke, did anal with JLow and is a gambling addict.

[quote]How embarrassing for Ben, who cheats, wears wigs, drinks heavily, does coke, did anal with JLow and is a gambling addict.

And people of DL think he's concerned about having a slave owning ancestor as a skeleton in his closet if he ran for office. It's the least of his worries.

I would love to hear about Pitt's ancestry. I bet it's all dumb hicks.

If Affleck really was the first who actively tried to cover up his familie's dirty past he is a major ass.

Did anyone catch tonight's episode of "Who Do You Think You Are?" with Bill Paxton? In a coincidence, Paxton traced one of his relatives back to the Revolutionary period and found he owned slaves. As is usually the case, Bill Paxton accepted it grudgingly, stating that it was difficult to accept by looking at it with a modern insight.

IDK

[quote]I can't stand Affleck but its not his fault his ancestors were assholes.

Which makes his decision to cover this up ridiculous. It takes a special kind of stupid to think that people will look on you adversely because someone in your family owned slaves 150 years ago. Unless, of course, he was worried someone would ask him for reparations?

[quote]Which makes his decision to cover this up ridiculous. It takes a special kind of stupid to think that people will look on you adversely because someone in your family owned slaves 150 years ago.

Exactly. He brought more attention to this after whining than if he had just left it alone. Plus, WTF did he think was going to happen doing a documentary like this? He should've known anything was possible.

What the Sony emails have shown is there is a whole world of bad things that celebrities and corporations do with impunity because they expect what they do will stay hidden within their strata of wealth and privilege. We need more communication exposed to show what these people are really like.

Slightly off topic, but following R173. "Liberal Hollywood" is hardly Liberal - because where there is great sums of money and power involved, they become cautious, conservative and probably Republicans on the downlow.

Case in point, as learned from reading the Wikileak Sony e-mails - the biopic of Freddy Mercury: Sony wants to downplay, if not skirt completely, Mercury's homosexuality.

Fucking Right-Wing Leftists!

What DL has shown here is there are only a handful truly dumb asshats who think the sky is falling and a whole world of bad things are done by celebrities because one celebrity asked not to share a piece of his own own history.

You do not own his life story or anyone's but your own and DL's asshats can't handle that simple truth.

Stamp your large clown feet and raise your tiny fists into the air with rage and impunity.

R171

I agree, I hadn't read all of the story before I made my comment. I guess I have more reasons to dislike him now. What a stupid idiot.

[quote]Case in point, as learned from reading the Wikileak Sony e-mails - the biopic of Freddy Mercury: Sony wants to downplay, if not skirt completely, Mercury's homosexuality.

That's just fucking pathetic.

I agree, "liberal Hollywood" is anything but. There's a reason why there are no A-list gay actors to this day.

Anyone ever stop to think this is all hearsay? I mean, obviously not freeper asshole OP, but people with brains?

R171 there may be some truth to the reparation concern.

In the last year alone 1) parts of Texas passed legislation calling for reparations, 2) an online petition supporting it was created, 3) Dave Chapelle, Azelia Banks and others celebrities have become more vocal, with Chapelle creating a YouTube video about it earlier this year, and, my favorite 4) Even Republicans are starting to say its a good idea, which means it is a very, very bad idea.

It is quite possible that Bill Paxton and Anderson Cooper might very well wish they hadn't publicly embraced their heritage.

.

Good. I hope the descendants of slaves go after Affleck and that inbred looking cunt, Cumberbatch.

If reparations had been paid when slavery was abolished, then these idiots wouldn't be afraid of people knowing their slave owning history.

Reparations only make sense for old family money. Trying to squeeze money out of someone who earned their wealth in their own lifetime doesn't, imo

Who fucking cares? Michelle Obama is related to a slave owner. Married to a useless, affirmative action President and related to a slave owner.

She had a choice about the slave-owning ancestor, R183?

-

Does anyone, R183?

R183, I'd say Michele married pretty well. You may not like Barack Obama, but he's still the President of the U.S. If he's the result of affirmative action, he has brought honor to the policy. If you designed such a policy, you could do much worse than have one of your graduates become president.

Some of you act like you think Gates would take the high road. This is a man who exploited the police and had Obama say from the White House that they "acted stupidly" so he could get publicity for his upcoming show. Affleck slipped Gates a couple of Benjamins and it was taken care of.

R183 & R187 It is obvious that you have already drunk the Kool-Aid. Not much to be done about that.

R187 That is not what I meant by "affirmative action" President.

"She had a choice about the slave-owning ancestor R183?" OMG!! Stupid answer. Unbelievably stupid.

I don't know R184. Did Ben Affleck get to make a personal choice as to he is related to? Did the children that Charles Manson sired have a choice as to who their biological father would be? You are a retard R184.

The "poor little black people" mentality will never go away. But then again if it weren't for handouts, lowering of standards and white guilt they never would have survived this long.

Michelle Obama had no problem in finding out she was related to a slave owner (not by choice of course) but Ben Affleck knows that if those of African descent find out he is related to a slave owner (not by choice of course) they will never let it go.

I loathe the progressive movement. Hypocritical cunts to the core.

Hypocrites yes, but they are mainly driven by a fear of blacks and feel if they keep kowtowing to them then some magical day we will no longer have reason to fear them. Hasn't worked so far.

R183 So blacks benefit for affirmative action?? That's heartwarming, considering the main benefactors of affirmative action are WHITE WOMEN

R189, you may need to be on meds.

You think Ben is scared of black people? Lol. Ben isn't scared of anything other than powerful faux white liberals. That's who he was likely thinking about when he asked PBS to edit his history.

Oh, and as far as white guilt goes, long may it continue. If reparations were paid out to slaves in the first place, perhaps this underlying 'guilt' and 'fear' whites have about blacks wouldn't exist at this high level.

R192 So black have trouble succeeding even with the help of affirmative action. Not very nice of you to point that considering how embarrassing that must for black people. Just sayin'!

Thank you R175. As for the rest of you- Wow.

[quote]You do not own his life story or anyone's but your own and DL's asshats can't handle that simple truth.

This is not Affleck's life story, it's the story of his ancestors. At no point did this PBS "history" show say it would be altering ancestors' history into fiction for the sake of its celebrities.

What R175 and R196 do not seem to understand is that Ben Affleck chose to appear on the PBS show knowing they were going to delve into his history.

It's dishonest for him to decide to sanitize that history when it didn't come out the way he wanted.

R194 Reparations have already been paid in the form of allowing generation after generation after generation of blacks to remain on welfare (even though they have free access to contraception and education), lowering standards so that they can get into good schools and receive job promotions, millions of dollars in payouts as a result of bogus "discrimination" lawsuits, the money they cost the penal system, the money their crimes cost individuals and taxpayers, etc., etc.

And their out-of-wedlock birth-rates are holding steady at 70%, their poverty rate is holding steady at about 50% and they still remain the most violent, crime-prone and openly hateful and racist groups in this country.

Maybe its me but I don't think reparations would make much difference in this case. (I also don't think Affleck is the one who should feel ashamed.)

[quote]I also don't think Affleck is the one who should feel ashamed.

This is the only thing you said with which I agree. I don't believe Affleck should be ashamed; neither do I think he should fabricate history.

Drop dead R183, you goddamn stupid, lying cunt.

Want to hear a story about 'welfare",r183? Recently I found the wallet of a (white)man. It had a few dollars in but was most surprising was all the welfare benefit cards from the government he had in it. I thought he might be disabled and poor but when I searched the address he lived in an exclusive neighborhood. When he came to retrieve his wallet(in a fancy car I might add!)not only was he not disabled or a veteran but ran his own business! He tried to make excuses about all the benefit cards but he knew the cat was out of the bag. So please stop with this 'blacks are all on welfare'crap. Where is your outrage about all the white people who don't need welfare and who are taking advantage of the system? A care less about this mans business and milking the system but his is not the kind of face that is associated with welfare fraud!

You aren't owed reparation for slave labor unless you were forced to perform slave labor.

R201 = conveniently made up anecdote

R201 I am going to assume that your little story is true (which I don't believe that it is).

I would have much less of a problem with this white adult man living in an exclusive neighborhood getting welfare benefits as he is much less likely to roam the streets with a pack of other white adult men playing "Pick 'Em Out, Knock 'Em Out" or "Knock Out King" and then proceed to post the filmed attack on Facebook and then get hundreds of thousands of "likes" and then still want people to see him as a victim.

He is also much less likely to gladly receive tax payer funds and then spend his life whining that other ethnic groups aren't doing enough to help him.

And since he is a male it would impossible for him to mindlessly reproduce with multiple partners and then spend his life blaming the fact his children wound up in prison on "the system" or other ethnic groups.

So, no, a white male living in an exclusive neighborhood getting welfare checks doesn't bother me at all.

(Your story is complete bullshit R201.)

Was he hassidic, r201?

That was my first thought too, R205. My second thought was a San Francisco "homeless" man.

If Affleck doesn't pay reparations to the heirs of his family's slaves, he should at least offer them a job, maybe working on his estate for old times' sake.

Affleck should pay reparations only after blacks pay reparations for all of the damage they have done to this country and to all of the victims of their many, many, many, many, many, many violent, heinous crimes R207.

I will stand up and say my family owned slaves. Hundreds of them. I cannot change that fact. However, my family has done more to help the poor, minorities, the homeless, the hungry than all descendants of slaves combined.

[quote]However, my family has done more to help the poor, minorities, the homeless, the hungry than all descendants of slaves combined.

... with the money, education, and privilege gifted at birth from ancestors who stole from the poor and minorities?

What have you done, r210? Precisely nothing, right?

I think the last word on this subject was spoken by Whoopi on the View today. She supported Ben and said that she was the first celebrity whose ancestry was explored on the show. They discovered some uncomfortable history about her family and she asked them to avoid mentioning those things in the broadcast and they agreed not to. The show has never been pure. PBS should now stick only to fictional programs like Downton Abbey. Their credibility is shot.

R183 serious questions: why are you so racist? Do you even know any black people or just digest was you "see" and draw horrendous conclusions? Did something happen to you involving a black person that you have to malign the entire race? Are you on psychiatric medication?

Whoopi supported a celebrity? Seriously?

If Ben feared that his children would become aware of this knowledge, well he sure fixed that.

R212, PBS' credibility was shot before Henry Louis Gates, Jr. ever showed up with this mess of a show.

They destroyed any credibility they had with me when they allowed Nova to be funded by the David H. Koch Fund for Science. I'm no longer a Nova viewer because its funding makes me doubt its information, but I'm expecting one of its future shows to prove the earth is flat.

I wonder if Whoopie's story is true, or if she made it up to defend Affleck.

I wouldn't be surprised if Whoopie's story was true. I doubt they do a tell all on those shows. But why did they expose Affleck to be asking them to not mention his families dirty past?

R213

"Pleading White But Not Guilty", by John McCarron

Just because I'm a white liberal doesn't mean I'm guilty.

Nobody in my family owned slaves. Anything I've been able to scrape together in this world--the job, the mortgage, the mini-van and the IRA account--is the product of my own hard work and the support of my parents and family. I didn't exploit anybody and nobody exploited me.

Sociologists might call it a working-class background.

Whatever you call it, I think it's why I begged off last month when a friend invited me to dinner at their home, where a carefully selected bi-racial group of "leaders" was to discuss the tender issue of race in America. Dozens of these "unity" dinners have been held throughout the Chicago area over the last year.

Judging by the background of my would-be host and hostess (highly educated charitable-foundation types), I had a pretty good idea of how the evening would go. The African-American professionals at the table would relate the subtle, and not-so-subtle, forms of racism they have encountered throughout their lives. The white professionals would nod sympathetically and, when their turns came, confess to their own little acts of bigotry. Perhaps the time they mistook a black executive for a secretary, or switched lines at Dominicks to avoid the cashier with the dreadlocks.

In other words, the evening was likely to be a warm and fuzzy white guilt trip. And frankly, with apologies to my liberal friends and co-workers, I no longer do white guilt trips. Not if I can avoid them. And almost never on my own time, because my day job requires me to attend far too many one-sided discussions about race and racism.

Normally I just look at my shoes, because my perspective most often doesn't square with the racial correctness that suffuses most college seminar rooms, non-profit workshops and, yes, newsrooms and editorial boards.

Within such rarefied circles, racism is almost always regarded as something whites perpetrate against blacks. Bad behavior by whites is almost always attributed to hatred, greed or some other base motive. Bad behavior by blacks is generally laid to negative social circumstances (bad schools, job discrimination, ineffective social programs) and those circumstances are almost always blamed on whites.

There is a measure of truth to such generalizations, to be sure. I spent too many collegiate hours listening to cultural historians such as George Frederickson and the late Christopher Lasch to be unaware of the effects of Negro slavery, Jim Crow and "benign" neglect. As a reporter, I've seen too many black neighborhoods destroyed by white slumlords and fast-buck mortgage brokers. Blacks have plenty to be angry about.

But so do whites. And that's where these one-sided attempts at "dialogue" fall short.

Somehow I don't think my hostess would have appreciated it if, over coffee and dessert, I had complained about the time my wife and I were chased off a tennis court in predominantly black west Evanston by a stone-throwing black guy. Or if I had pointed out that blacks commit twice as many acts of lethal violence against whites as whites commit against blacks.

You can look it up, though you'd never guess it from reading the newspapers or listening to the race experts on TV. Black-on-white murders, like the slaughter last week of a Downers Grove teenager in an Oak Park alley, are not generally reported as racial incidents, nor do they prompt indignant editorials about hateful behavior. But let some white punk try to burn a cross on a black family's lawn, or spray the "N" word on a garage door, and the journalistic brimstone just flows and flows. As it should. But where's the balance?

My suspicion, based on recent election returns and conversations with the sort of people who don't get invited to "leadership" dinners, is that most working-class whites, including those who sympathized with the civil rights movement, have had it with the gospel of white oppression and black victimization. They've been preached to by "Roots" and scolded by innumerable PBS documentaries on the black experience. . . and they're ready to move on.

They do not see themselves as oppressors. On the contrary, they have begun to see themselves as victimized by the failure of fully a third of American blacks to assimilate into the economic mainstream. This despite 30 years and several trillion tax dollars worth of anti-poverty spending. They're angry, not sympathetic, that our state and federal jails are bursting with minorities, and that black men are being put behind bars at a rate six times that of white men.

Intellectuals call this "blaming the victim," which, to my mind, shows how out of touch they have become with the common understanding of who is a victim and who is a victimizer.

Is white racism a continuing blight on life in these United States? You bet it is. And it must be fought on every front.

But there's also something called black racism. And one of its symptoms is an unwillingness to move beyond the victim/oppressor paradigm. It's so much easier to blame others for one's troubles. But so very debilitating.

Until the paradigm shifts, guess who's not coming to dinner.

R213

I am not forming my own hate group or joining an existing one. I don’t like the state of race relations in this country. I do live by the “do unto others” code and can return kindness, courtesy, consideration, empathy and friendliness when it is offered to me by others, regardless of their pigmentation.

But, yeah, I have some anger. As if you couldn’t tell.

When black hate crimes are taken as seriously as Paula Deen's past use of the n-word and not relegated to some second-rate Wordpress website (link below) maybe I'll start smiling on my brother.

When black Americans are as familiar with the names Jessica Chambers, Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom (and the thousand of other white victims of black hate crimes - I only mentioned a measly three incidences) as they are with Trayvon Martin and openly, emphatically and loudly express genuine outrage over what was done them, then perhaps my feelings will change.

When ALL PEOPLE are held equally accountable for THEIR racism and hatred and for THEIR hate crimes maybe then I'll start actively spreading the message of peace, love, mutual respect and unity.

"Violence Against Whites - Is Diversity Worth Dying For?"

My impression of BA decision not to reveal his slave owning relative is he knows that if this had happened to a conservative or a Republican he would have been all over them, mocking and making fun of them. So because he thinks that way he thinks everyone will do the same to him.. He's a douche at heart.

He is a douche at heart, R220, and a mainstream wussy bully. Typically the type of guy I would steer clearly away from. He had me at that stupid role from the Kevin Smith movie. The one with Joey Lauren Adams.

You can't compare Whoopi to Affleck until we know what she's talking about. For instance if there was a father who went to jail for molesting his children, Okay I can buy that. That's highly personal and damaging to the descendants who may be the result of incest. Lots of highly personal scenarios I could say okay to omitting.

But having slave owners in your family tree? That isn't personal nor should it hurt the descendants. That's political.

Really whats the big deal about having slave owners in your family tree? Anyone who is descended from families lived in the original 13 colonies who founded this country has slaveowners in the past. My own family must have owned quite a few judging by how many still use our family name , including Terrell, Jesse and Queen Latifah

My grandparents kept a couple of dimwitted darkies handed down from their parents as domestics, and we all suspected that Grandmaman and Granbdpapa never informed them about the Emancipation Proclamation, and those two were as happy as clams They were cherished till the day they dropped dead in the kitchen, really like part of the family.

You must think you're very funny, R223.

[quote]Anyone who is descended from families lived in the original 13 colonies who founded this country has slaveowners in the past

That is not even close to being true.

I am descended from slave owners. I mention it if the subject comes up but fortunately it rarely does. I would never hide it. My family is all lower middle class, progressive, pro-gay/civil rights/organized labor/feminism Democrats/Greens now.

My great-great-great-great-grandparents owned slaves and it is written down in their lists of belongings, very disgusting. It is not my responsibility. I have not benefited monetarily. I am responsible for my own life and decisions, and shaming people whose forebears did evil deeds is just the same as saying that because one is born "royal" that one is inherently better via so-called blue blood.

Prove it, R335.

At one time every one of the thirteen colonies was involved in slavery, Newport Rhode Island was a major slave trading port, there were slaves in Plymouth colony, slaves worked as household servants from Vermont to Georgia and every state and every menial labor in between

Even the most liberal and progressive Founding Fathers, Benjamin Franklin owned slaves, and he carried advertisements for the sale of slaves in his newspaper, the Pennsylvania Gazette. Franklin did not publicly speak out against slavery until very late in his life.

So you may want to actually read some history before you open your mouth and make an ass of yourself.

R227 posting from her Tardis.

Yes r227 Schooling thèse racist cunts

I wonder what colour slaves Ben owns now. Anyway slavery still exists...anyone who works at Walmart will tell you that.

R209 Did your family pay DESERVED repartions to thé Africans that they forcibly enslaved? If, not you can stick the supposed 'good deeds' your family have supposedly done for minorities up your ass. Slaves should have been compensated for the forced labor and the habitual abuse that went along with it. Simple as that.

I hope Cumberbatch and this toupee wearing wooden actor, Affleck get hit by lawsuits for reparations.

I hope that he isn't hiding the fact that he used a fake cock in Gone Girl. I do believe that he should provide photographic proof (real full frontal this time). What he showed in Gone Girls was partial side.

Even more evidence of Monsieur Affleck's douchebaggery.

His long winded explanation was pathetic. Didn't expect any less from Hollywood's fave wooden actor.

R231, I am a different poster than you are responding to, albeit one also descended in part from slave-owners. Yes, the slave-owners should have paid reparations AT THE TIME. Not four generations later. I am not responsible for the misdeeds of my ancestors, to be tied to their debts. The abolishing of generational debt (and serfdom i.e. slavery) was one of the ideals that this country was founded upon. You are being hypocritical to insist on generational debt.

R183.

Thanks for the laugh.

R225, it's closer than you realize.

Slavery existed everywhere in the 13 colonies.On the eve of the Revolution, the slave trade formed the very basis of the economic life of New England.The Massachusetts slave trade gave work to coopers, tanners, sailmakers, and ropemakers. Countless agents, insurers, lawyers, clerks, and scriveners handled the paperwork for slave merchants. Upper New England loggers, Grand Banks fishermen, and livestock farmers provided the raw materials shipped to the West Indies on that leg of the slave trade. Colonial newspapers drew much of their income from advertisements of slaves for sale or hire. New England-made rum, trinkets, and bar iron were exchanged for slaves. When the British in 1763 proposed a tax on sugar and molasses, Massachusetts merchants pointed out that these were staples of the slave trade, and the loss of that would throw 5,000 seamen out of work in the colony and idle almost 700 ships. The connection between molasses and the slave trade was rum. Millions of gallons of cheap rum, manufactured in New England, went to Africa and bought black people. Tiny Rhode Island had more than 30 distilleries, 22 of them in Newport. In Massachusetts, 63 distilleries produced 2.7 million gallons of rum in 1774. Some was for local use: rum was ubiquitous in lumber camps and on fishing ships. But primarily rum was linked with the Negro trade, and immense quantities of the raw liquor were sent to Africa and exchanged for slaves. So important was rum on the Guinea Coast that by 1723 it had surpassed French and Holland brandy, English gin, trinkets and dry goods as a medium of barter. New England thrift made the rum cheaply -- production cost was as low as pence a gallon -- and the same spirit of Yankee thrift discovered that the slave ships were most economical with only 3 feet 3 inches of vertical space to a deck and 13 inches of surface area per slave, the human cargo laid in carefully like spoons in a silverware case.

A list of the leading slave merchants is almost identical with a list of the region's prominent families: the Fanueils, Royalls, and Cabots of Massachusetts; the Wantons, Browns, and Champlins of Rhode Island; the Whipples of New Hampshire; the Eastons of Connecticut; Willing & Morris of Philadelphia. To this day, it's difficult to find an old North institution of any antiquity that isn't tainted by slavery. Ezra Stiles imported slaves while president of Yale. Six slave merchants served as mayor of Philadelphia. Even a liberal bastion like Brown University has the shameful blot on its escutcheon. It is named for the Brown brothers, Nicholas, John, Joseph, and Moses, manufacturers and traders who shipped salt, lumber, meat -- and slaves.

r237 is a black/victim studies major.

Any importation of slaves by northern merchants resulted in the slaves being sold to southern plantations.

Most common in the north were "indentured servants" who were white.

There was very little slavery owning in the north. There were very few blacks in the north. You can check the census records and wills.

That's why it was so easy for the north to abolish slavery. They weren't invested in it.

[quote]is a black/victim studies major.

Oh sweetie, thanks for a true laugh out loud moment. As always your personal incites are as accurate as your "facts".

In what may truly be a Datalounge first, I insist you use the dreaded "TROLLDAR" on my post and then come back and tell us all what you have learned.

Well, R239, as you yourself said at R223, "Really whats the big deal about having slave owners in your family tree?"

Why is there always a bunch of racist here...it's as if Rush Limbaugh shows up every day. Maybe he does?

Well now I am truly confused, Am I a Rush Limbaugh racist or a black victim studies major?

Why can't I be both?

"Police Kill More Whites Than Blacks, But Minority Deaths Generate More Outrage"

Analysis contradicts widespread views about racial targets.

I read comments from this story on Yahoo before reading it here, I was very shocked by the bigoted hateful comments there, but I have to say the people of datalounge have really shown the people of yahoo to be complete amateurs.

WTF?!! Why is anyone held accountable for the mis-deeds of people they never knew nor had interaction with nor influence over? If my child is a P.O.S., yeah I'm sure I have a hand in it and I'm horrible for it. But if some dude two streets away that lives in a house with the same floor plan as my house does some horrible stuff, should I take some of the blame? "Well, it seems people with that floor plan must be all bad... Hang 'em in the street and burn the lifeless body where it hangs so we can feel better." NO! My dad was a great guy and everyone loved him... I get NO credit for any of that, I'm actually generally un-liked. But I'm sure as H*LL not gonna take heat for what someone did decades or even centuries ago.

What a loser nobody would have judged him. Most white Americans who’ve been there long enough have slave owner ancestors.

R245 moron you bumped a 5 yr old thread to say that?

His middle name 'Geza' is Turkish. His father's Muslim ancestry has been whitewashed away in recent bios.

I've never checked any of it myself but I'm given to understand my family traces back to 1624 Tidewater Virginia. I'd assume 𝒔𝒐𝒎𝒆𝒘𝒉𝒆𝒓𝒆 along the line somebody would have somehow been involved with slavery. So what.

People pushing this as perpetual guilt can stick it.