Do they actually steal kids?
Pale, blonde and blue-eyed, the 4-year-old girl looks shyly into the camera.
This is no ordinary photo, though. The little girl pictured is at the center of a mystery.
Police in Greece say they found her Thursday with a Roma couple posing as her parents but have no idea who she is or where her real parents are.
They hope releasing the pictures of her might prompt people to come forward with information.
The girl was discovered during a search of a home in a community of Roma, also known as gypsies, near the town of Larissa in central Greece, police said.
I'm just guessing but maybe because Roma is a proper noun and gypsy is an abbreviation of Egyptian R2?
[quote]"The girl looks Scandinavian or could be Bulgarian," said a police official who declined to be named. "It is either a case of abduction or trafficking."
It always amazes me how Europeans can tell the heritage of other Europeans immediately just by looking at their facial features.
Me, too, r4. Europeans take one look and know my ancestry is French. Americans tend to go by surnames, which is misleading in my case.
See? I told you that cadaver dog was having an off day.
Could this be a child who was actually sold to the gypsies after her mother made the threat, "If you don't behave, I'm going to sell you to the gypsies!" She must have been a hardcore miscreant.
I want to know what's up with that little tots two tone hair.
The hair was a disguise ? And they were too lazy to redye the hair when it grew out?
I thought you typed Marilyn McCoo, R1. It would explain her absence.
Sad to say but the gitanes are everything people say or more.
I was told that if you ever hire a gypsy whore (they all have their price and would sell their children if you asked), you must make him strip naked at the door, to make sure he has no weapons.
Then, insist that he shower (an absolute necessity) and, while he's cleaning up, hide all your valuables in the hotel safe. There should be one in every room.
Thanks for your gypsy whore tips, r14. I'll be sure to remember them the next time I hear Cher sing "Gypsies, Tramps & Thieves."
R14, I wasn't a gypsy
and you didn't bother bathing properly yourself
and I saw your Sienna parked outside, Big Spender
They finally found Janet's abandonded kid.
abandoned, of course.
The Roma (or Sinti, as some prefer to be called) have a centuries-old tradition of human trafficking (and trafficking in whatever is illegal and profitable).
True story: my grandmother's family were farmers in Central Europe. One evening her sister (who apparently was a pretty blue-eyed child, and about four years old at the time) turned up missing, and the neighbors remembered seeing a gypsy caravan around. The family rushed off in the direction the gypsies were said to have taken, and sure enough, they found them in the next town over with my grandmother's sister in their cart.
This would have been in the first decade of the 20th century. The were said to kidnap non-gypsy children to steal and to beg (sometimes mutilating the beggars to make them more pathetic) because begging children who looked "whiter" apparently took in more cash.
My take on it is that for the gypsies, generations of living a nomadic existence on the fringes of mainstream society and facing discrimination has resulted in a chicken-and-egg cycle of mutual resentment and disrespect.
The fact that Roma culture has zero appreciation for formal education and a literally medieval attitude towards women is probably the first thing that needs to change if they're going to succeed within mainstream society (assuming they want to, which is not a given). Offering them realistic opportunities to get an education and a steady job is the next thing.
Did they invent those oblong tomatos that taste so good on sandwiches?
[quote]I want to know what's up with that little tot's two tone hair.
The girl's hair was dyed brown so she blended in with all the other Roma, but has now grown out in her natural blonde colour.
They were grooming her for a Berlin tribute band.
If anyone's looking for an interesting take on Gypsy/Roma culture (at least in the UK), I couldn't recommend Mikey Walsh's _Gypsy Boy_ enough. Though there's nothing in there about human trafficking, the macho, violent, antigay culture and its celebration of illegality (or "taking advantage of anyone who's stupid enough to be taken advantage of," as they have it) is very objectively dealt with. Amazing story of how "gay Mikey" managed to break away.
[quote]Offering them realistic opportunities to get an education and a steady job is the next thing
Many European countries have tried and partially failed. Some integrated fully but many haven't. Those that have integrated basically left behind their culture, eventually married non gypsies and assimilated. Those that haven't are a pest. The just resist all efforts of integration and progress.
Well, maybe someone will come up with a Final Solution for them?
[quote]The Roma...have a centuries-old tradition of human trafficking (and trafficking in whatever is illegal and profitable).
So true. And I certainly wasn't suggesting hiring any gypsy whores, just passing along what I was told.
On the contrary, when you pick up any street trash, you'll be lucky if your money and valuables are all you lose.
So do they really kidnap and traffic people?
Does that actually happen in Western[ized] countries?
Gays can't have children and don't care about children. This is a frau thread.
R29, NO, but we can buy quality blonde children if they're not damaged.
Asians can also distinguish among other Asians. I recall a Korean friend speaking to another in Korean, and then looking into her face, apologizing, saying I can see now you aren't Korean.
wOW R31, that is so racist and ignorant of you.
It was in the 70's, satellite Methodist hospital, Duncanville, Texas, just outside Dallas. I was a department manager.
The Gypsy queen was a patient. The waiting room near her hospital room was full of her clan, they were living there around the clock. Bathing in the rest room, eating and generally settling in for the duration. My boss was concerned and didn't know how to contain this, many were complaining. He came to me for counsel as I was the boy wonder among the managers.
The same clan had previously been encamped at the main hospital which had a fountain. They were bathing in that fountain and washing their clothes.
Gypsies? In America??
[quote]Gays can't have children and don't care about children. This is a frau thread.
You're the one who sounds like a fundie frau.
r33 then what happened?
Well, there goes the neighborhood.
Because they travel in family groups inbreeding is a constant risk, which is another reason for stealing non-Roma kids. They put them out on the street to beg while young and when they're old enough they start breeding.
The gypsy queen was discharged before long, which resolved the problem. I don't recall anything overt being done about it.
They were going to make Roma-ine lettuce out of her! It's a cookbook!
These are the most disgusting people you will ever encounter. Each day, in any given European city, you basically have to padlock your house to avoid their shifty ways of entering your home and taking all of your shit. They stand at toll booths, right where you give your money, and ask for the change. Most times they are close enough to reach in a grab stuff if you aren't careful. They pile around you at the Bancomat and have their dirty bird kids pull on your shirt and tell you they're hungry while they rob you from behind. You can say I am sick all you want but I wouldn't blink at every last one of them sinking into the Black Sea.
A female friend of mine was on vacation in Rome when a gypsie woman threw an infant child at a her. When my friend scrambled to catch the child, they tried to steal her shoulder bag.
I remember in the 1980s, in Upper Arlington, there were gypsies entering people's homes and stealing. It was really a problem, and like these cited here, used children as decoys.
[quote] Asians can also distinguish among other Asians. I recall a Korean friend speaking to another in Korean, and then looking into her face, apologizing, saying I can see now you aren't Korean.
My son is Korean and Korean shopkeepers in NYC were always asking us if he was Chinese or Japanese, so it's not true that Asians can even identify their own ethnic group.
They have this 4 year old girl's DNA. It should give them an idea of her ethnicity.
My husband had his DNA profile which showed he was mostly Middle Eastern (Jewish), 8% Eastern European and 6% Scandinavian (probably Baltic). His family moved about for a couple hundred years. This girl's DNA should show what her main ethnic group is. It's unlikely a blonde, blue eyed European girl had to move around to escape pogroms. She's probably Russian or Ukranian.
[quote] The gypsy queen was discharged before long, which resolved the problem. I don't recall anything overt being done about it.
There was an episode of House where a gypsy teenager was the patient. The entire family camped at the hospital and became a nuisance.
Roma are scum. That is all.
The whole "Europeans can recognize faces" train of thought etc so on is so far off. Roma/Gypsies/Sinti are originally from India(many of them look Indian or Pakistani) and look markedly different from Greek people. When Greek police go into a Gypsy camp and see a blond hired/blue eyed little girl that is an anomaly. There are some ethnic Greeks that look like that BUT not ethnic Roma in Greece. Who look like they just came off the place from Calcutta. The girl could be Bulgarian though. A lot of Roma in Bulgaria snatch children and send them to Roma in Greece
I meant:They look like they just came off the plane from Calcutta.
Can someone explain why they steal children? What would they use her for? To beg? Or sex stuff?
They're called Travelers, not Gypsies.
 I'm Dutch and I can tell you there's definitely a pecking order in Europe when it comes to facial-features, hair-color, eye-color, etc.
You can compare it to African Americans on the American continent who classify each other on the basis of their skin-tone.
I think it's a legacy of the Nazi race-propaganda in the 30's. To this day Europeans with blonde hair and green/blue eyes have a major superiority complex. I remember when I was in school a lot of blonde kids proudly labeled themselves as 'arians'.
"Can someone explain why they steal children? What would they use her for? To beg? Or sex stuff?"
All of the above, r50. See also some of the other responses on this thread.
In this particular case, the child was apparently "only" made to dance for pennies, but who knows, since she apparently hasn't said much yet.
I have read in generally reliable sources that gypsies are deeply involved in the child-sex trade, and apparently -- and this is what I find really shocking -- they have been known to prostitute even their own underage children.
The other reason they want all the children they can get is for the welfare benefits. They register the kids multiple times under different names (taking advantage of the loose requirements for paperwork when it comes to Gypsies), and now with the EU they can register in multiple countries as well.
What about this theory? Could it be Baby Lisa from Kansas City?
Its funny because most of them operate in European welfare states where they could conceivably give up the gypsy life and go straight with state assistance. They seem to have no interest in doing so. When I was in Spain they were everywhere. None of them tried to trick me, they just aggressively panhandled, which was enough to turn me off of them. I think it is highly conceivable that a European leader, especially east of Switzerland, could begin a program of deporting/imprisoning them without citizens batting an eyelash.
I don't care what you all say; Esmeralda is still my favourite!!!!
There's no way that 'Maria' is Lisa Irwin. Maria is at least two years too old and Lisa had blue eyes, not green.
The people running that gypsy camp are amateurs, letting this little blonde attention-whore run loose when police are present.
Europeans use other discerning factors to distinguish nationally. Americans are lazy and only see (and care about) skin color.
I just saw a news report where they believe she was born in the wagon of a travellin' show. They said her mom used to dance for the money they'd throw. It seems her father would do whatever he could, preach a little gospel, and I think he distribued Amway because they said when times were tough he would sell a couple bottles of something called Dr. Good, must be a soap or something.
Filthy, dirty, thieving...gypsies!
I lived in an apartment building in Hollywood that was taken over by Roma. They're insane and ill-educated. The kids, literally, did not go to school.
We finally formed a tenants' association, went to the owners, and had them thrown out.
A family of gypsies on the dole in the UK had 5 mansions back in Romania. All were unfinished, in order to avoid paying property taxes.
They seem to be the one minority where most people agree the stereotypes apply.
I read the thread title quickly and I thought it said:
"Meryl Found Living With Gypsies"
It's my Cosette!
#51. Travellers are Irish 'gypsies', not of the Roma tribe, but just as dangerous.
Google Disney World and the Travellers for info on the scam they perpertrated re rape.
Here she is world!
Whether Roma gypsies or Irish travellers they are parasites (I so want to say parasights but would receive the inevitable "oh, dear").
They are a plague on any unfortunate community they descend upon. Wherever they go a crime wave unfolds. Everywhere I've encountered them in Europe there has been theft, violence, fraud, every sort of nastiness, all the while loudly proclaiming themselves to be victims. I have never had a dislike and distrust of any group of people before like I now have with gypsies. To be fair, I hadn't any experience of them before. Never trust them, they see outsiders as a target, nothing more.
I know the Irish travellers have the toilets removed when they buy a new trailer, they think indoor toilets are dirty and it's somehow better to leave plastic bags full of shit wherever they camp. Romantic, ain't it?
I can't figure out how to post a link but the site gypsypsychicscams.com has some interesting stories about the gypsy psychics all over the US. I went to a couple when I was younger and they totally have the dark Roma facial features. They like to spend their money on luxury cars and now I always notice the Mercedes,etc. parked outside these places.
I work two months a year in the Netherlands and Romanian (and some Bulgarian) Gypsy pickpockets,shoplifters and car thieves are everywhere.
Frank Buis of the Dutch Royal Press in cooperation with the Dutch Police documents and films much of the thievery and post on youtube.
Watch a few of his "zakkenroller" vids.
Many good lessons in scam awareness for those who travel to any part of Europe theses days.
R66 There are Scottish Travelers here is the U.S. who do there same. They take over entire neighborhoods of lavish homes and then live several families to each house.
Why aren't European countries rounding them up and deporting them back to Romania? It's going to kill the tourist trade. I was thinking about a trip to Spain. Not now.
R74, what am I supposed to be seeing in that video?
I can't understand the language, and it's not clear what's going on.
Is he filming gypsies who are about to shoplift in a store? So what?
Please, r6. Romania has enough problems of its own.
Also, many of the gypsies apparently now come from Albania (another country with plenty of problems, but at least there, they blend into the general criminality).
Here's an pdf file article on the Protestant Scottish "Terrible" Williamsons.
I fucked a catholic priest who told me he was Roma. I didn't really know what he meant and said that I was raised Lutheran and didn't care.
One of my favorite little stunts is where people park their cars in a huge carpark, like at an airport or near a historic site, and try to either lead you to a spot (like they're a traffic warden) or offer to, "protect your car." If you decline their unnecessary offer and don't throw them a couple euro, you may come back to a gashed drivers side door or some other damage. This has happened to someone I know in Milan at the train station and I hear it is widespread.
We HAD a Final Solution to this problem,
[quote]Why aren't European countries rounding them up and deporting them back to Romania? It's going to kill the tourist trade. I was thinking about a trip to Spain. Not now.
Gypsies are not a new problem to Europe. They've been in Spain and elsewhere for centuries.
Here's an article about the Irish Travelers pulling house repair scams in Georgia.
[quote] They're called Travelers, not Gypsies.
In the US, the Travelers are of Irish heritage with light skin. Maybe there was Roma in their background 200 years ago, but there hasn't been one since. They're Irish and they look Irish. They have Roma superstitions -- they don't finish building their homes and often build a huge hideous, unfinished mansion and live in a trailer behind it. And they go out on the road most of the year, stealing and grifting while the older ones stay back at the settlement.
In the UK, Roma get most of their money from the government dole. They collect millions for non-existent children and have hideous mansions with Mercedes symbols on the roof back in Romania.
They should be subject to something like RICO laws
I watched a documentary on this where teenage gypsies hang around ATM's and reach over the person's shoulder to try to grab the cash that comes out of the machine. There was film of it happening over and over (Spain). What I couldn't believe is how relatively tolerant people were. They just shoved them back like swatting an annoying fly, even when the brazen little shits made several attempts to grab their money. Grown men who could easily overpower them just took it and did nothing to fight back. Try that in the US an you'd get the living shit kicked out of you.
R87, gypsies carry knives, screwdrivers, icepicks. They will shank you if you try to grab them.
[quote]Here's an article about the Irish Travelers pulling house repair scams in Georgia.
In the Chicago area the big scam is driveway paving. They use asphalt that comes apart in the first big rain storm.
Are there any actual Roma gypsies in the US? I live in TX and have never had a run in with even the Travellers.
Is that show about Gypsy weddings still on? The ultimate in tackiness and a grotesque lack of taste.
[quote]Are there any actual Roma gypsies in the US?
Yes. There is a "King of the Gypsies" buried in a historical cemetery in my town. This dates back to the 1920s. The last name is Adams and he has a rather nice indoor crypt/tomb.
I also walk by what I can only describe as a "compound" that that sits on about a third of a city block (continuous from one street to the next) that has several homes on it as well as Winnbago out front an an Airstream in a driveway. It's very well-maintained, but quite fenced off. I can't help but think they are Roma.
Apparently, there's a "gypsy region" in the cemetery with some very nice tombs. It sounds like the Roma in the area are relatively well-integrated into larger society.
Ironically, the Gypsy King's grave was robbed not too long after his burial.
[quote] Are there any actual Roma gypsies in the US?
Yes. We had a relative of NYC's "King of the Gypsies" as a patient in our open-heat unit about 20 years ago. They were camping outside the doors of the unit and we demanded a security guard out there 24 hours a day. There was a wall rack out there where drs used to hang their white lab coat before going into the OR. Those lab coats vanished in about 20 seconds. We took down the rack and never put it back up again. We caught them trying to get in through a very little-known back stairway.
The funny thing is that the ultra-orthodox Jews did the same thing (except steal lab coats -- they weren't there anymore) when one of their rebbes was a patient, but they were not restricted like the gypsies were. In fact, they were given free housing in a building nearby to hang out in. We'd find them sneaking up the back stairs at 2 am. Like the gypsies, when you said, "family only," they'd tell you they were all family.
 the one where thjey gay gypsies are marrying and the mother of one of grooms rejects his imploring son is heartbreaking.... :(
I read a true crime book about gypsies in the US awhile back - it's a bit dated, but still a good read. The women would seduce elderly men and poison them after the men had given them their money and property.
Hastened To The Grave: The Gypsy Murder Investigation by Jack Olsen
R96, does that include the Andrew Vlasto/Sylvia Mitchell case in NYC in the 1990's? The law firm were I work was involved with that case; not on the criminal side but on the probate side. We were engaged by the decedent's brother. IIRC, part of Sylvia Mitchell's plea deal was returning stolen assets to the estate.
Amsterdam has the best anti-pickpocketting,anti -retail theft plainclothes team in Europe.
That film by Buis is surveillance of a well known Romanian Gypsy criminal gang that works Amsterdam in the summers.
The guy in the Mickey Mouse shirt has just shoplifted a new pair of shoes and dumps his old ones.
The surveillance follows them and with the cooperation of various retail security and the police, one sees members of the gang being arrested - all in fresh new outfits!
There are plenty of these videos around.The Dutch don't seem to have any problem filming the faces of people who have already been recorded committing crimes.No trial and your face is out there forever and ever.
This vid might be more interesting R77 Romanian gypsies now disguise themselves as Muslim women using the chador for concealing stolen merchandise.
As usual the women who conceal the stuff under their skirts work with a male accomplice.
I had a Gypsy family living next door to me years ago in Chicago. They were quiet enough neighbors. You never saw her, and he was in some home improvement business of some sort that might have been a scam, but I never heard. About the only weird thing was the fact that his daughters were wearing earrings and makeup, and trompsing around in baby high heels when they were still toddlers.
[quote] Amsterdam has the best anti-pickpocketting,anti -retail theft plainclothes team in Europe.
Do they imprison these people? In the UK they found this traveler family that took in all this money and didn't pay a half a million dollars in taxes and they got a suspended sentence.
R100 that's not strange for them. Their culture sexualizes girls at a very young age. Watch My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding.
Do they wear caftans too?
yep...but only with booster slings between the knees under the caftan.
Entire fixtures of earrings and even blonde toddlers can be boosted this way!
What was on their accordion?
One of the towns the Irish Travelers live in here is Murphysville, (Murphy Village) South Carolina.
Sherlock is a popular last name among the travelers.
R90, where in TX do you live? The Travellers are all over the D/FW area in the winter.
Irish girl, seven, returned to Roma family after DNA tests prove she IS their daughter
The seven-year-old was put into care on Monday in south Dublin suburb
DNA tests proved she is the daughter of the Roma couple
Police received tip-off that a fair-haired girl was living with large Roma family
Campaign groups call for inquiry into the 'abduction' by authorities
She wasn't "abducted." She was taken info custody until an investigation was conducted. The parents knew where she was, who she was with and that she would be returned as soon as the DNA test results came back.
Question is, why was the child's birth certificate in doubt? Travelers and gypsies do a lot of welfare fraud using false birth certificates. I'd check into that if I were the police. I'd check them for any type of welfare fraud.
And that fucking European Council that's accusing people of racial profiling for investigating these gangs of thieves and fraudsters can suck my balls. Europe needs RICO laws. These are criminal organizations. Freeze the assets of everyone in the families until years-long investigations are carried out.
[quote]And that fucking European Council that's accusing people of racial profiling for investigating these gangs of thieves and fraudsters can suck my balls.
I agree. The gypsy couple were trying to pass off the girl as their own biological child, when physically that would have been impossible. The girl was clearly not theirs, and the police became aware of the situation immediately. This wasn't a case of racial profiling, it was just common sense.
Africans can also identify tribal/countrymen and women by their appearance to the extent of recognizing facial and other physical characteristics among tenth-generation Black Americans that source back to their probable ancestral and regional roots. Fascinating stuff.
Cue Bonnie Franklin:
She's No Longer A Gypsy!
NIKOLAEVO, Bulgaria -- DNA tests have confirmed that the parents of the mystery girl known as “Maria” are the Bulgarian Roma couple who came forward earlier this week, police said Friday.
So now that she's been proven to be of Gypsy blood and was being raised by legitimate caregivers, is every racist fucker who posted garbage about gypsies going to apologize?
I still tink vee should procede mitt der final solution.
Yahh! Yahh, Herr Bratwurst! Schnell!
The fact that the child was apparently sold for 500 Euros and -- like many other children in the custody of "legitimate" Roma caregivers -- made to dance and beg for (or steal) money is of course irrelevant. Standard European child-protection laws should never be applied to the unique Roma culture, even when large amounts of child support are being claimed for the relevant children.
While we're at it, laws regarding theft, fraud and human trafficking should also be suspended for the Roma. Because, you know, they face discrimination.
PARIS — For centuries across Europe, children were raised on folk tales with a disturbing message: Wander into the woods and you risk being snatched by Gypsies.
The New York Times
October 25, 2013
Roma, Feared as Kidnappers, See Their Own Children at Risk
By DAN BILEFSKY
PARIS — For centuries across Europe, children were raised on folk tales with a disturbing message: Wander into the woods and you risk being snatched by Gypsies.
Such a warning seems like an anachronism from medieval times. But the stereotype of the child-stealing Gypsy was reawakened in recent days when a Roma couple in Greece were jailed on accusations that they had abducted a blond, green-eyed girl called Maria — or “the blond angel” in the Greek news media. This week, two blond, blue-eyed Roma children were taken from their parents in Ireland after suspicions that they had been abducted, too.
The children in Ireland were quickly returned to their families after DNA testing confirmed that the Roma were their parents. In Greece, the police confirmed on Friday that Maria was the child of a Roma couple from Bulgaria. An investigation continues into whether Maria was sold, adopted or given to the couple as they have claimed.
Whatever the outcome, the Roma say that it is they who now live in fear — of having their children snatched for no reason other than their cultural identity or skin color. The cases, they say, have helped fan a sometimes violent backlash against the roughly 11 million Roma scattered across Europe. In an era of budget cutbacks and high unemployment, politicians on both the left and the right have singled out the Roma as emblematic of the problems of illegal immigration and have questioned whether they can ever be integrated.
“Imagine if the situation were reversed and the children were brown and the parents were white, would they have ever been taken away?” said Dezideriu Gergely, the executive director of the European Roma Rights Center, based in Budapest. “The most dangerous consequence of the hysteria is that now we have to live in fear that our children can be removed from us on the basis of a wrong perception. No one should be profiled on the basis of their ethnicity.”
Mr. Gergely, a human rights lawyer who has a Roma father and a white Romanian mother, noted that many Roma, who arrived in Europe from India centuries ago and are also known as Gypsies, came from mixed families.
He himself has light skin and blue eyes, which he said punctured the widespread stereotype that Roma have dark hair and dusky complexions. “It is mystifying that those accused of criminality are seen to represent the Roma community,” he said, noting that if people engaged in human trafficking it was because of severe poverty, not their cultural background. “Applying collective responsibility to the entire Roma community is unacceptable.”
Despite such warnings, anti-Roma sentiment appears to be spreading., Serbian news media reported this week that a group of skinheads in Novi Sad, Serbia, tried to abduct a Roma child in front of his house last weekend because his skin was fairer than that of his father, Stefan Nikolic.
In Italy, the anti-immigrant Northern League responded to news of Maria’s supposed abduction this week by demanding inspections of all Roma communities to check for missing children. Gianluca Buonanno, a member of the Northern League in the Italian lower house of Parliament, said he had submitted a petition to the Interior Ministry demanding identification of camp occupants.
“If it happened in Greece, it could very well happen here in Italy — maybe it’s happening already,” he said in an interview with Repubblica TV, shown on the Web site of the newspaper La Repubblica.
Even before the cases, rights groups say, violence and intimidation against the Roma were intensifying. Earlier this month, a woman threw acid at a 2-year-old Roma boy and his mother in Naples, according to the European Roma Rights Center. In Hungary, at least seven Roma were killed between 2008 and 2010, and Roma leaders have counted dozens of firebomb attacks in the past.
In Greece, where the far-right Golden Dawn movement has been fanning anti-immigrant fervor, the head of the Greek Union of Roma, Yiannis Halilopoulos, said
[quote]is every racist fucker who posted garbage about gypsies going to apologize
I didn't post anything racist, but I still think gypsies have earned their reputation.
Are 'travelers' in the USA gypsies?
No, travelers are not related by DNA to Roma. The travelers in the US are of Irish and Scottish heritage. They do, however, follow certain superstitions of the Roma. They build new houses but don't live in them for a number of years. Marriages are usually arranged. The younger women wear elaborate hairstyles and sexy clothing, almost looking like they are wearing sexy halloween costumes. Like the Roma, they have a home base from which they travel most of the year.
They are swindlers. They engage in roofing, paving and tarring swindles. They target older people. While one traveler talks to a homeowner at the front door, spiel isn't a story about having extra asphalt leftover from a job, other travelers try to gain entry into the house to look for cash and valuables. They also sell badly made tools. See the fraudsters link posted earlier in the thread.
In Ireland, they were called tinkers. Whenever they showed up in town, my grandmother said windows had to be closed, doors latched and livestock watched at night, otherwise your house would be robbed and your chickens, pigs or sheep stolen.
R114 "being raised by legitimate caregivers" - you really think that? The current situation is that her biological parents are Bulgarians who have twice been arrested and skipped bail for trying to sell children.
The people she was with have posed as her parents for four years to make money from her begging. The bio mother claims she had to leave the child behind in Greece with a woman who's name she cannot remember. WTF?
The police are trying to work out who gets charged with what offence, either child trafficking or abduction. That sounds nothing like legitimate caregiver. All involved in this are scum. That's not racist, that's just a statement of fact. People involved in child trafficking are not good people.
They aren't just making money from having her beg, they are also getting government subsidies for her. A huge gypsy scam is to go to different countries, register children and collect benefits for them. That's how they build those horrible mansions back in Romania. The men and women also collect unemployment/welfare benefits while making cash on the streets from begging and stealing.
The photos of that little girl in Kansas City have been haunting me all week. She looked so happy and safe in her father's arms. I'm sick about it. So sad.
DL has Freepers, Fraus and now gypsies. You can't make this shit up.
R119 The Romanian half gypsy in question looks Romanian because his mother is Romanian! The vast majority of Gypsies in Greece don't look like little Maria at all. They look like they are from India(where the Roma came from originally). The albino allegations seem like bullshit as well. Have you seen Maria's brothers and sisters? The family looks like it has Bulgarian ethnic roots as well. One of Maria's sisters has red hair for Pete's sake.
The Roma in Greece who raised Maria bought her. In what civilized society is that normal? They used her to make money and God knows what they would have done to her when she became marriage/sexual material.
Speaking of telling someone's ethnic origins by facial features, I'm pretty good at it myself. I can tell a Pole from a Russian, even though they're both Slavs. Poles tend to have rounder faces with high cheekbones. Russians have rounder eyes and more "chisled" features. Ukrainians often have a slight slant to the eyes and in addition to high cheekbones, which tend to be broader then Poles.
Scots and Irish are easy to tell apart. Irish tend to have a triangular, high bridged nose and close set eyes whereas Scots--lowlanders--often have rounder noses and eyes set further apart. Highland Scots often look Scandinavian, with square-ish jaws, long faces and round eyes.
So, turns out the blonde, blue-eyed girl who caused this shit-storm is actually Gypsy. What a racist place Europe is.
R111. We usually have cable news on where I work and two Africans, from different countries, working with us. We were watching CNN when one turned to the other and said, "This Cory Booker looks [insert name of tribe here]". And the other nonchalantly agrees and goes: "I was telling my girlfriend the same exact thing and she wouldn't believe me". So, I ask how they can tell especially considering he probably has some white ancestry in his family tree, and they say it's all in the face. And, apparently, in Booker's case, it's even more obvious than others. Truly fascinating.
The Roma are a problem in many countries, they are extremly poor, their children don't go to school, they are all not educated. So they are pretty chanceless, the live from begging, which is organized from criminal groups or prostitution.
I have no idea why it is not possible to socialize them. It is the responsibility of countries and leaders but Roma often lives in poor countries, even in Europe there are poor countries with bad social help. A few years ago France destroyed a few Roma Settlements. Discrimination and exclusion are also problems. I don't know why here everything failed.
The blond girl from Greece has Albinism, that's the reason why she don't look like her people. I hope for her that she can live in a nice foster Family, if not, she is will a life in poverty.
" It is the responsibility of countries and leaders". Do the Roma have no responsibility for themselves R132? I know that schooling is provided all over Europe so why do they choose to avoid it? They are choosing to be uneducated. You can't force them at gunpoint. You also can't force them to behave within society's norms. There comes a point where you have to accept responsibility for yourself. The decisions the Roma make are not the responsibility of the taxpayers and government of every country they go to.
The girl's Bulgarian Roma biological mother has ten kids, some resembling little Maria with that light blonde hair, but I noticed the youngest baby had the most fantastic shock of bright red hair. Does this colour occur naturally?
R132, you are very naive. Begging is the least of it. They exploit their children in despicable ways, forcing them to steal and even prostitute them because children can't be put in jail. They are held for a day or two in juvenile detention centers and then released. Gypsies also register a dozen children (many not their own) in several countries to scam financial aid. They are vermin.
[quote]Africans can also identify tribal/countrymen and women by their appearance to the extent of recognizing facial and other physical characteristics among tenth-generation Black Americans that source back to their probable ancestral and regional roots. Fascinating stuff.
It's not all that fascintating. It's about paying attention to more than skin color--something most white Americans know nothing about.
Now one would give a damn about this kid if she didn't have blond hair and blue eyes. If this were a child with brown skin, hair and eyes no one would have looked for her except maybe her loved ones.
R137, you are 100% correct.
r137 The little girl was obviously not a genetic relative to the couple who claimed she was their daughter because of the physical differences. If the couple had had an Asian child the authorities would have done the same thing.
Maybe so, maybe not.
Don't be so fucking ridiculous R140. You have absolutely no basis for that statement, just looking for any way to make any story all about you and your everything-is-racist view of the world.
The fact is that the child was strikingly different from the "parents" and concerned neighbors had grounds to believe she had been abducted. This story is about a child's safety, stop trying to make it your own little drama.
Pretty sure the redhaired kid is dyed.
The redhaired kid's hair is dyed. Say what you want about white people, but we can spot dyed hair from a fucking mile away. Even a quality salon job. We're really good at that.
I bet they dyed that kid's hair for the same reason Bobby, Cindy and cousin Oliver dyed those rabbits with the hair tonic.
Probably ups the price for the kid.
A kid's worth about 20G's, twice that if the eyes stay blue.
R132, the Greek Roma family were hardly living in poverty! They were (and probably still are) receiving almost 3,000 euros a month in child benefits for about 14 registered children - 10 of which don't seem to exist and 6 of which she had apparently given birth to in less than 6 months! And that's almost 3,000 euros just for child benefit, imagine how much they had been getting in other benefits.
Welcome to Greece, the land of austerity!
I also read in the Greek newspapers that she had two identity cards for two different names (!) and had allegedly used one of her identities as a witness in the childbirth of her other identity!
R139, at first sight the little girl does not appear genetically related to her very dark-skinned biological mother - except she's an albino and that family has a whole bunch of kids as pale and blonde as she is!
'Maria' mystery lifts lid on bumbling Greek state
(Reuters) - She has two identities and lived off thousands of euros a month in child benefits for nearly a dozen offspring that appear to exist only on paper, and but for one little girl would have continued the fraud Greek police say she perpetrated for two decades.
The girl is Maria, or the "blonde angel without an identity" as she has come to be known, and the woman is a 40-year-old Roma who claimed to be her mother but has been charged, along with her 39-year-old partner, with the girl's abduction.
The mystery surrounding Maria's real identity since she was discovered peeking out from under a blanket at a Roma settlement in central Greece has made headlines across the world and prompted a global search for her biological parents.
And in a debt-laden country eager to show foreign lenders it is reforming its state apparatus, the case has lifted the lid on a bumbling bureaucracy and patchy system of controls that allowed the girl to slip through the cracks.
So deep are the cracks in the country's birth registration system that it was "pure luck" that Maria's case was uncovered at all, said Konstantinos Tzanakoulis, mayor of Larissa, the provincial capital of the region where Maria was found.
"Who knows how many such cases exist?" he asked, blaming a system he said was riddled with loopholes. "We may never know."
After Maria's discovery, police found that her purported mother had registered one ID card and six children in Larissa, starting from 1993. In nearby Trikala, using a fake identity, she registered four more.
A few dozen kilometers away in Farsala, which houses the Roma camp, her partner registered another four children. Police say at least 10 children registered by the couple are unaccounted for and may not exist.
That allowed the couple to claim 2,790 euros in child benefits a month in a country dependent on EU/IMF loans and desperate to show it is making progress on tackling such fraud.
With no national birth registry until May and with some municipalities yet to move their files to the database, there had been no way to cross-check the births, officials said.
Indeed, the births and child registrations all appeared legal until the woman's arrest, when police realized she appeared to have given birth to six children in under 10 months.
The couple have been jailed pending trial on charges of abducting a minor and procuring fake documents, which they deny.
Maria was discovered during a surprise raid by police looking for drugs and weapons on the Roma settlement.
The couple say Maria's real mother gave her up willingly after birth because she could not raise her - an adoption that was "not exactly legal" but consensual, their lawyers said.
Officials say Maria's case is not isolated, though data is scarce.
Sifting through piles of papers on birth registration laws strewn across his desk, Tzanakoulis said the extent of the fraud carried out by the Roma couple showed the state's weaknesses.
"It was a complete shock," he said. "The level of fraud would have been the last thing to cross anyone's mind."
In this case, the woman was able to declare Maria's birth nearly four years after the fact, even though home births must be registered within 100 days. She even used her own fake ID as one of the two witnesses needed to prove the girl was born at home.
The mayor of Athens has since launched a probe into the local registry there and suspended two employees who dealt with such cases. Greece's top court has also ordered an investigation into all birth certificates issued in the past six years on the basis of a signed declaration rather than a hospital birth.
The local arm of the U.N. Children's Fund (UNICEF) says the lack of controls makes Greece fertile ground for possible trafficking.
ts head, Labros Kanellopoulos, estimates that thousands of missing children, mainly from eastern Europe, may be victims of trafficking, but there is no data on official numbers.
"There is a lack of checks, and the onus of responsibility lies with the police and local authorities, who have not shown enough interest," he said.
Police, who believe Maria is either eastern or northern European, have focused their investigation on whether she was trafficked rather than abducted, a police official said.
In Farsala, mayor Aris Karahalios says the case is a chance for Greece to finally push ahead with reforms it has promised.
"The system is anachronistic and a symptom of our entire society, which only deals with things on the surface and pushes everything else under the carpet," he said.
(Additional reporting by Reuters Television in Farsala and Renee Maltezou in Athens; Editing by Deepa Babington and Will Waterman)
[quote]Now one would give a damn about this kid if she didn't have blond hair and blue eyes. If this were a child with brown skin, hair and eyes no one would have looked for her except maybe her loved ones.
Now, the Greek authorities have said they won't return little Maria to her Greek Roma caregivers or her Bulgarian Roma biological family; does removing just her when there's a whole bunch of kids with dusky coloring in the same family amount to preferential treatment based on hair and eye color? There's a hierarchy even within white Europeans, this the Nazis all over again.