Harvey Milk Was An 'Evil Man' Who Raped Teenage Boys, Unworthy Of Postage Stamp: Matt Barber
Harvey Milk, the first openly gay man to hold political office in California, is set to break new ground once again as the first LGBT official to be featured on a postage stamp. But not everyone is pleased with the honor.
In a new interview, the Liberty Counsel's Matt Barber accused the U.S. Postal Service of "whitewashing" reality and "historical revisionism" in choosing to feature Milk on the forthcoming postage stamp, which will be issued next year.
"Harvey Milk was known as a pederast,” Barber told One News Now. “That's a man who in his mid-30s had a sexual appetite for teenage boys as young as 15 years old.”
He continued: "Harvey Milk was demonstrably, categorically an evil man based on his rape of teenage boys, And the fact that our U.S. government would be commemorating and recognizing him as some kind of hero really just boggles the mind.”
You can read the full interview with Barber here.
Of course, the remarks come as little surprise given Barber's history of anti-gay proclamations. Earlier this year, he slammed adoption rights for same-sex couples as "egocentric" and "purchasing children."
In April, he referred to the LGBT community as a "cancer that brings down societies," and implied that same-sex marriage was somehow connected to the "Great Flood" referenced in the biblical narrative of Noah's Ark.
So, are we supposed to get all tribal and indignant now? I'm going to do something different, and ask you to provide some further information so we can have an intelligent discussion. Sorry if I'm supposed to know all the in-depth facts about Harvey Milk's activities but I just don't.
If they guy was abusing kids I don't want him on a stamp either, not that I'm taking any gay-basher's word for it, but what's the story?
Did Harvey Milk have a big dick? If so, all is forgiven.
Ok, so now they are pissed over perception of losing from the shut-down so now they are going to double down on gays and religion.
Fake twitter accounts EVERYWHERE fake facebooks too, these people are spending ton of money. They have infested this place.
Harvey Milk was not raping or fucking 15 year old boys.
We knew him and this fundie freak is, like most fundie freaks, lying and talking out of his ass. Don't believe him for even one second.
R1, you are cordially invited to die in a grease fire.
Matt Barber is a baldfaced liar who offers no proof of anything except his stupidity. No victims has come forward to testify against Harvey Milk, except in the cellar of Barber's mind.
He looks like a typical Republican pedo himself.
Holy shit, the pic at R5 is more gruesome than I even dared fear!
What a hideous beast, no wonder he's so angry.
Duh. I'm sure there's still plenty of stupid people who think that about ALL of us gay men.
Where's my postage stamp ???
A quick search reveals they have been trying to smear him for years. Many accusations that he was a "murderer" and died of "Aids".
We know he didn't die of aids for one thing. He died in 1978. No one has ever come forward to make an accusation of being molested etc., as for as I can tell.
What bothers me greatly is the length that haters will go to smear someone. It is what they have done to Obama. NO lie goes to far for them. It is easy to make an accusation. I am also suspicious of the claims he liked them young, being 15 in what I read. Not exactly a pedophile, yet it smears and would be hard to refute.
Attempts to tie homo and pedo together have always been constant in the hate.
They smeared gays in Cali over prop 8 , planting subtle thoughts in bigots mind.
"Dan and I just love his lesbo sister, she is part of our family, we have NO PROBLEM THAT SHE CHOSE TO BE GAY". That plants the idea that gay is a choice. These people are guilty of the worst evil against us and I want to KILL EVERY LAST ONE OF THESE MOTHERFUCKERS, pull their finger nails off, waterboard them.
I also see where, most parents recognize a certain vulnerability in a 15 year old to experiment or be vulnerable as they themselves were. The message that are getting out there unchallenged is that the fags are preying on your kids.
I think he had a big dick. Can someone please confirm? It's the only thing that really matters in life -- the size of your cock.
I'm accusing R1 of being a shit-stirring dumbfuck troll who's stupid enough to embrace an obvious homophobic smear as true unless "proven" otherwise, all in the guise of playing "devil's advocate", because he's not going to be duped into "going all tribal and indignant" by a bunch of leftist PC homos who are always embarrassing him for being soooooo gay in public and militantly demanding "special rights" when he's just one of those private, normal, real American closet cock-suckers who doesn't need to shout about it from the goddamn rooftops or force unproven-to-not-be pedophile leftist PC homos on normal people's goddamn postage stamps.
He's also definitely a registered republican.
These religious and political wing nuts will stoop to blatant lies in order to further their fascist agenda, Matt Barber is likely the child molester. This type of person projects their own faults.
Ann Coulter did say that Harvey stuffed the ballot box to win the election.
Projection is such an ugly trait.
I am accusing you of being dense. The smears about Milk are endless. You and I might recognize these charges are not true. However, that in no way sets the record straight.
When propaganda and lies are not refuted those untruths become truths. Lies become myths and we all participate by not challenging them
Now can we talk about Richard Gere putting hamsters up his ass? People really believe that and many of you would be found guilty of embracing that as true.
It would be no surprise if Milk, in his pre-political days, hired a teenage hustler now and then. Back then, an adult having sex with a 15-18 year old was not the horror of horrors that it is today. Sure it was a crime, but so was sex between consenting adult men.
That's your reply to these scurrilous charges, R18? Here's a suggestion, don't help.
I don't know how old you are, R19, but R18 is correct in his assertion that sex with someone 15-18 was no "horror of horrors" in 1978 in California.
I had a 17-year old boyfriend when I was in my 20s, and no one thought much of the age difference. I'd met him in the bar we both attended regularly, which signified by inference that he was over 21. Yes, he had lied about his age.
But even after I found out, we'd sometimes sleep together at his house, which, of course, was his mother's house. She didn't mind. She liked me. The age difference issue just wasn't the monumental source of OMG it is today.
Actually, Matt Barber doesn't look much different from some of the men some of you cream over in the Presenting Troll's threads.
Obviously this didn't happen.
As far as R1 and those like him - you are as bad as Barber. And as stupid. Let's just turn the tables for minute - go ahead and prove you never raped a 15 year old. That after all is what you are expecting people to do in response to Barber's accusations.
For those of you who somehow think it wasn't "horrors of horrors" in 1978 California for adult men to have sex with teenage boys - that somehow times have changed - nonsense.
You seem to be forgetting Roman Polanski fled the country in 1978 to avoid the consequences of being caught having sex with a minor.
Obviously adults having sex with minors would attempt to rationalize it as OK - but please don't attribute that belief to the rest of us.
Oh, give it a rest, R23. My boyfriend was 17 for a week between the time I found out he was 17 (rather than 21+) and his 18th birthday. He did not feel one bit abused. Actually, I was the abused one: he gave me crabs.
I would bet that Milk liked younger guys, back then called "chicken," and he was probably lewd about it sometimes. I have known many gay men (and straight guys, too, of COURSE) who "liked 'em young." Men are sexually attracted to the younger types, both gay and straight. SOME men, that is. And some men can be "gross" about it, too.
Those "chicken hawks," (again, an antiquated phrase that was current during Milk's time) usually kind of skeeved me out and always have but, hey, to each his own. I have no idea how Harvey Milk acted out his sexual urges, how he flirted with guys, if he hit on underage boys or not. I am inclined to think he didn't do anything TOO terrible since there is zero record of his ever being arrested for anything in that regard. But he did an awful lot of good, too and ended up being a gay martyr. The gay MLK, sort of. And he deserves a damned stamp. You think everybody else on a stamp was PERFECT? Please.
Roman Polanski was accused of drugging and raping a 13 year old. That wouldn't have sounded a lot better if she was 18. Drugging and raping is still bad no matter the age.
Anybody who didn't live in the 1970s may not realize, everybody fucked everybody and people didn't judge like they do now. A 40 year old man propositioned 15 year old me and my 16 year old gf. His age was not an issue to us. None of us thought that was pedophilia or child molestation. Today it would be.
Most young people today don't know a lot about Harvey Milk unless they saw the movie, and not everybody did. Republicans saying stuff about some historical guy they don't remember isn't going to automatically ring a bell with people, unless they're just assuming because it's a republican talking, it's a lie. Not everybody will assume that, some people are easily swayed.
"You seem to be forgetting Roman Polanski fled the country in 1978 to avoid the consequences of being caught having sex with a minor."
He raped her, they didn't have sex.
Btw, Charlie Chaplin and Elvis both dated teen girls and straight guys don't dog them for it. Fact of the matter is that heterosexual men have a near universal preference for women younger than themselves. Marriage statistics and statistics from dating sites prove it.
Harvey Milk probably had sex with a 15 year old when he was 15. Nobody has said he preferred underage at any time....except of course Christian fundies, who are making it up.
Did he date men younger than himself. Probably, since they were the ones who took up his cause politically. Probably dated men who were older than himself also, which was probably his preference from an early age.
Why did it become an issue? Because Harvey led the fight against banning gay teachers, so naturally he was a lightning rod for people who associated gays with pedophilia. Harvey, however, was not a gay teacher.
Harvey Milk was not a pedophile or engage in sex with underaged boys. As an early community activist, he realized that so many gay kids came to San Francisco thinking it was some form of utopia for them, only to discover that it was little different than everyplace else -- at least as far as they were concerned. I know guys who thought if they came to SF, they'd would be welcomed like a family welcomes a long lost son, only to discover that they were homeless, penniless, and crashing with hippies. Harvey was one of the few who realized that gay kids were in crisis, and worked to give them a chance. And that included befriending them, giving them food and shelter, and generally a helping hand. And for that, malicious Xtian homophobes want to cast him as a pedophile.
Now, there is no doubt that Harvey liked younger men. He is well known to have boyfriends who were many years younger than himself. But they were not minors. They were adults themselves. And as others here have pointed out, where are the accusers? Remember, one of Harvey's achievements was fighting the Briggs amendment, and if there were a shred of evidence that he had engaged underaged boys for sex, it would have given those homophobes all the ammunition they would have needed to destroy Harvey and the opposition, and we'd have been living under (even more) institutionalized homophobia.
When faced with anything related to gay rights and celebration of gay historical figures, the Xtian right always drags out the canard of pedophilia. It worked for them for years. But we all know that it is simply not true, by no means supported by evidence, and is just a nasty smear. Statistically, pedophiles should be considered straight if the gender of the child were a factor, but pedophilia itself is not an expression of sexual orientation but rather a disorder that knows no orientation. Or, more bluntly, most pedophiles are men who engage in sexual behavior with underaged girls.
It is awesome that Harvey is going to be on a postage stamp. I never thought I'd see the day, but then again, I never thought I'd marry my partner and file a joint income tax return. The homophobes are losing, and they know it, so expect more of this kind of crap as they fade into obscurity. We must fight it, however, because they never give up (see, Scott Lively in Uganda and Brian Brown in Russia).
R1 is one of those FREEPER TROLLS who show up between 2 a.m. and 6 a.m. ET.
It would be good if there was a WEBMASTER who would eliminate their posts.
R24 - how is your little store relevant to Barber's accusations about Milk - and a discussion about whether or not having sex with minors was OK in 1978 in California?
I take that back - I think it is relevant now that you've become defensive about. Feeling it was necessary to explain your actions.
What need to explain, elaborate or become defensive if it was OK?
Yes - I think when you tell someone to "give it a rest" after their only comment, it's defensive.
I think you are trying to create a cultural norm that didn't exist - and I don't see how you can prove it did exist. You want to argue people, for many reasons, were more likely to turn a blind eye to the behavior. Go ahead.
We have to look no further than the Roman Catholic Church to establish.
"no doubt he liked younger men." He was surrounded by political activists - VOTERS (18 & up) who tended to be young. But there is no evidence whatever he preferred them to men his age or older.
R32 What little store? You talking to Harvey? He's dead. But he had a little store.
Read one of his biographies, R33. He had relationships with guys who were a few years younger when he was in his 20's and as many as 20 years his junior when he was in his 40's. And it means nothing except that, like some guys both straight and gay, he spent more time around people who were younger than he was. That's no excuse to call him a pedophile, just one that asses like Barber use to smear him.
There has been nothing to suggest Milk was pedophilic. Whatever the differences in sexual mores (and we have entered a period of sex-aversive naivete and false moralism that distorts the historical record in many places) now versus the past, this reeks of homophobic strategizing.
F&F R1 for her idiocy and meanness. Homophobe.
Why can't we talk about this reasonably?
Randy Shilts talked about Harvey's penchant for teen under-age boys in Mayor of Castro Street.
Further, the founder of the Mattachine Society was also another one who fucked teen boys.
Things were semi-acceptable then unfortunately. The 70's were really fucked up.
"Harvey Milk was a famous gay politician in California. His fame came from his very public "work with at-risk youth". However, at the same time he was reaching out to these youth, he was preying on them sexually. One of the most notable cases of this was his sodomizing a 16 year old named Jack McKinley, though there were others...as the text indicates:
"...sixteen-year-old McKinley was looking for some kind of father figure...At 33, Milk was launching a new life, though he could hardly have imagined the unlikely direction toward which his new lover would pull him." (pages 30-31)
"It would be to boyish-looking men in their late teens and early 20's that Milk would be attracted for the rest of his life." (page 24)
"Harvey always had a penchant for young waifs with substance abuse problems." (page 180)
"Harvey confided one night that at twenty-four, Doug was the oldest man Harvey had ever started an affair with." (page 237)..
“…sixteen-year-old old McKinley was
looking for some kind of father figure…within a few weeks, McKinley moved
into Harvey Milk’s Upper West Side apartment…and settled into a middleclass
Coldly agreed with a former lover’s suicide threat
“…the phone rang. As soon as Harvey heard the voice, he rolled his eyes
impatiently at Jim. ‘It’s Jack McKinley,’ he said. He paused and listened
further. ‘He says he’s going to kill himself.’…‘Tell him not to make a mess,’
Harvey deadpanned. Jack hung up.” (Source: Randy Shilts, The Mayor of
Castro Street, p. 126)
Randy Shilts was a Republican nutjob. I wouldn't trust his "journalism" as far as I could throw it.
What really deserves a closer look is Milk's connection to Jim Jones and The People's Temple, the cult that perished in the Jonestown Massacre just days before Milk's assassination.
Everyone in SF was connected to Peoples Temple.
Nobody would have thought what would happen.
He gave a home to a kid on the street. He was not out preying on people. And all those quotes there is only one "example" - McKinley- and we'd have to have it corroborated.
All the above poster is saying is that it was commonplace for adults to date teenagers, and he is right. It was offensive to some, acceptable to others, but all-in-all everywhere.
But so were addictive drugs, incest pornography, prostitution/pimping, and serial murders. The drugs allowed for a lot more exploitation and carelessness. The seventies were all about feeling good, which unfortunately, left a lot of victims in its wake.
The seventies were just the extension of the sixties but with haircuts and flared pants. The concept of sexual freedom was hijacked by the sociopaths who applied that to molesting children and selling women.
That is why the eighties turned it's back on "free love" and worshipped money. People saw the hypocrisy and closed their hearts.
It was a case of mass PTSD.
Very true, R45.
Well, you forgot birth control.
He was not remotely a pedophile and did not chase under age men. I was there in the 1970s and knew a number of guys who knew him well. This is just another pathetic right wing bigot lying. Harvey was a mensch- a guy who would give a stranger a helping hand without asking questions. Astounding bullshit and just as astounding that people on this thread believe a turd like this guy.
"But so were addictive drugs, incest pornography, prostitution/pimping, and serial murders."
ROFLMAO. Those things were all around long before the sexual revolution. Prostitution is called the oldest profession for a reason...
Harvey's lover was 16 and most likely a hustler. He was dead at 33 btw, the same age when Harvey met him. He wasn't the only one that was underage.
And it's very fucked up.
Anyone around Polk St during that era knows what was going on & STILL goes on.
[quote]Everyone in SF was connected to Peoples Temple. Nobody would have thought what would happen.
Yes but most people in SF weren't in a position to give Jim Jones political aid, which Milk and Moscone apparently both did.
Jim Jones was a Californian Republican operative connected with the John Birch Society during the 1970s. Then he suddenly started supporting (infiltrating) progressive causes in the SF Bay Area, of which Milk and Moscone were leaders. Jones' CIA ties have been too well documented in the MSM media to repeat here.
Jones' best friend was Dan Mitrione, whom Jones grew up with from childhood. Mitrione was the CIA agent connected with the International Police Academy, a CIA front for training counterinsurgency and torture techniques.
There was always speculation that Dan White was an MKUltra zombie sent to silence both Milk and Moscone on what they knew about Jones.
[quote]Fake twitter accounts EVERYWHERE fake facebooks too, these people are spending ton of money. They have infested this place.
What fake accounts are people making? You mean Republicans are making up accounts to artificially inflate their presence?
I scrolled past the thread quickly and wondered why Matt Bomer would say such things about Harvey Milk. Time for bed...
It wasn't the 70s, it was the early 60s. And we don't actually know McKinley's age for a fact. And guess what else. Harvey Milk got Jack McKinley to work with him in BARRY GOLDWATER'S CAMPAIGN in 1964. McKinley stayed in NY and did not go west with Milk.
1. In the 1960s New York sodomy was illegal so for Harvey to have any gay relationships was illegal.
2. Harvey was a conservative Republican at the time.
3. Did Shilts verify McKinley age? As we can tell from his other work, when he falsely blamed AIDS on a Canadian flight attendant, Shilts was not one to check facts and was one to present gossip as fact.
4. Harvey stayed with the alleged victim for five years, only breaking up with him when he moved to California.
5 years = 21 years old in Jake's life. Jake met him at 16.
I'm loving people saying that Barver is lying about Milk, gays don't fuck kids, but fucking 15-17 year olds - no big deal. Unreal.
Again we need to find Jake's birth certificate. My guess is, not as young as Shilts thought.
Why in the world would anyone believe the idiot, with his lies about Milk?
I think it's time to investigate the lying sack of shit.
From the way I heard it, R1 is raping 12 year olds on a daily bases. So IMO, he should probably be in jail.
I heard it from the evangelist down at Bible Banger Church. I'm pretty sure it's true.
It is a shame dead men can't sue for slander.
R61, this was 1963-64 when they met.
In 1960, the Sherman Brothers wrote a song "You're Sixteen" which was No. 8 in the US sung by Johnny Burnette, and No. 3 in the UK.
Ringo Starr later took it to No. 1 in the US in 1974.
But, but... Bill Donohue of the Catholic League says that priests fucking altar boys is just homosexuality, not pedophilia, so how can Barber claim that Milk's alleged sexual relations with 16 year-olds is pedophilia? Can't these bigots get their stories straight?
Harvey Milk was not perfect but none of us is. We should remember Milk for the great things he did, not for his shortcomings.
Exactly. No great man is ever perfect.
Well, this dates me terrifically but I dated Harvey twice and he was not into twinks. He was into Castro clone types. No one I know who knew him ever heard that he was involved with underage guys. It is just a made-up lie.
Scott Smith was 21 and Harvey was 40 when they first got together. Jack Lira was young, but certain not underage. I remember the day of Harvey Milk's inauguration, with a photo on the front page of the Chronicle of Harvey and Jack walking down Market Street together, leading a parade of supporters. Even in San Francisco in the 70's, if Jack Lira had been underage, it would've been a scandal.
On a side note, people talk about remembering where they were when they heard JFK was assassinated. I was too young for that, but I remember everything about the day Harvey Milk and George Moscone were killed. It ended the so-called 'age of innocence' for so many of us. I can't help but think the government response to the AIDS crisis would've been different if Harvey had lived to fight for us.
Age of consent in New York was 17, but misdemeanor only if 16. That's why it was necessary and lie and claim 15 for the age of the individual. In truth, we don't know what the age was. They say Harvey was 33, which would have been 1963, but the first example of them together was 1964, when Harvey would have been 34, and that the relationship, which ended in 1969, when the kid was supposedly 21, was shorter than a six year relationship he had with someone else. In no case has anyone actually attempted to find out when Mr. McKinley was actually born. My guess is that he was of the age of Consent and the whole thing is a slander.
r40, thank you.
I brought that up on another thread and was dismissed as a conspiracy loon. He courted Jones to deliver votes. He was a cunning, small-town pol. The fact that he fought for gay rights doesn't speak to the entirety of his motives.
We've had discussions here about Milk liking them young for years; not pedophilia, ephebophilia. No one ever suggested rape, either.
While I don't doubt r70, I think Milk was more free around people he knew and trusted.
Sanctifying people like this and denying it was even possible only gives the freepers ammunition.
I'm not willing to take this perp's word for it. However, if it's true, the stamp should be cancelled. It's never OK to take advantage of minors.
He's probably lying but who's to say he might not be right? Where is the proof? Sleeping with underage children is wrong.
R75, where is the proof that YOU haven't slept with underage children?
he was a shitstain that used vulnerable and lonely teenagers probably hooking them on drugs.
there are many men like that out there,straight and gay,met some when i was vulnerable.
you only have yourself in this life.
[quote]he was a shitstain that used vulnerable and lonely teenagers probably hooking them on drugs.
So now he was a drug pusher too?
Is there any moral offense he didn't commit?
Is it true he was also a cannibal?
R78 i am sure he didn't do anything to help the young men and was interested in exploiting them while they were vulnerable.
and ofcourse he provided the drugs and no rehab or worthwhile advice
don't try to spin this,this kind of shit goes on everywhere,i mean look at San fran.homeless teens abused and left to die.
lol to this day nothing has changed.
and nothing ever will.
milk was a shitstain asshole,you will not fool anyone.
he was an abusive pederast whether you like it or not.
[quote] lol to this day nothing has changed.
Wow, you really know how to make sure that you're taken seriously, don't you?
Illiteracy and truth aren't mutually exclusive, r80.
So r79 what makes you so certain he got young guys hooked on drugs and left them to flounder?
Where are you getting your information from?
Rehab is for quitters.
his fuck-life story R82
young drug addicted teens
in this thread there is some guy who quoted something from some book about him.
and he ''was into drug addicted twinks'' thing
he was obviously an abusive pederast
why are you so defensive about it?i am a gay man and don't think that people like him should be on a post stamp
did he really do much for anyone?maybe he did for himself,but his ''love''-life tells everything you need about that man
R80 how seriously anyone takes me is so fucking unimportant ,dude,lol
the fact is homeless gay teens are dying in the streets and noone give a fuck,even in SF.
that you are interested in my grammeer or style-shmyle is exactly what i mean.
no one cares and he also didn't .
he was some opportunist that made some money and fucked suicidal teenagers who as i understand suicided after the ''caring'' pederast was done with them.
he was a disgusting shitstain.
[quote] he was some opportunist that made some money and fucked suicidal teenagers who as i understand suicided after the 'caring' pederast was done with them.
Names and citations, please. And not "oh, someone else on a DL thread said it."
Prove it or shut up.
the point is we all know it's true.
Why don't you use capital letters? Do you enjoy presenting yourself as an idiot?
Who is this fucking freeper cunt retard???
That's redundant, R91.
Pretty sure it's easy to find McKinley's age on the internet. Randy Shilts said he was born in 1947. Randy was not a Republican, he was a gay Democrat btw & worked for the SF Chronicle.
"On February 14th 1980 McKinley committed suicide. He was 33, the same age when Milk and McKinley fell in love in 1963"
McKinley born 1947
1980 - 33 = 1947
1947 + 16 = 1963
Harvey Milk born 1930
1930 + 33 = 1963
From "The Mayor of Castro Street.
Harvey Milk was a hell of a nice guy who actually helped out a lot of young gay men in SF.
He didn't prey on them sexually and he didn't get them hooked on drugs.
Anyone who says he did is a filthy, lying, scumbag who should be beaten to within an inch of his life.
Noe Valley Elder - you didn't know him.
R89 is a nutcase.
At nutcase that speaks ill of the dead, to boot.
Randy Shilts, as a poor journalist, did not verify McKinley's age, nor did he verify when Milk and McKinley met. They worked on the GOLDWATER campaign, so most likely it was 1964, not 1963.
I stand by my comments, including Shilts' Republicanism. He was in the Young Americans for Freedom as a teenager.
A nutcase who speaks ill of the dead AND smears one of the most influential and accomplished gay Americans who ever lived.
Harvey Milk was no saint but he was not a pedophile nor a sexual predator.
R85 should go fuck a garbage disposal.
[R86] If the charges are true, he was an evil man. But where is the evidence?