Thank goodness television bullets can't pierce cars and hurt people hiding behind them!
I need a valium after watching...
I'm still routing for Walt and I feel kinda bad about it.....
I thought this show ended.
I'm rooting for Walt too. There was some redemption there for him giving himself up and shedding a tear... I'm sure Hank and Gomie get killed. Good episode, although it was slow to start.
Not rooting for Walt, though he partially redeemed himself by choosing Hank's life over his money. Rooting for Jesse and Hank--conscience and honor. They can kill Hank's partner. We know Walt escapes, but it's hard to see how Hank can.
Why are there not more comments on this thread??
A lot of people haven't watched yet. Maybe there's a rival thread.
We know Walt survives? From the flash forward? Will Jesse die? The Nazi gang when talking about the Jesse hit..didn't seem convinced that Jesse was a threat and needed to be killed.
I love Walt. He reminds me of my dad. I was hoping his hit would've been for Hank and not Jesse. If the series had ended with the phonecall to Marie and Walt's arrest, I would've cried.
Hank has to be dead. After calling Marie, he might as well have said "this time next week, I'll be out fishing as I enjoy my retirement."
Jesse probably escapes, though. There were enough shots of him looking at the door, and I'll bet he escapes during the mayhem (plus, someone has to die, and the producers would probably rather do without Dean Norris than Aaron Paul for the final stretch).
[quote]Why are there not more comments on this thread??
Because the usual OP of the BB threads (ahem) was too busy today to start one, and this OP started it too late and with a lame post inside.
When I post them, I post the title of the episode, the episode number and the date. In the inside I post a description of the episode, not a smart ass comment.
I won't let you down again, DL.
A television rule of thumb, one that is almost never broken, is that if a character suddenly appears in a car other than his usual one -- particularly if it's a much older car -- then the car's about to be toast one way or another, and the producers would rather shoot up a $4,000 beater than a $40,000 new model. Lo and behold, Hank's 2013 Dodge Durango disappears and he shows up in a '98 Tahoe!
And seriously? Hank and Gomie, armed with only a handgun and a shotgun, try to go up against SIX guys, several of whom have AK-47s?!? Why the fuck wouldn't they just get in the cars and get the fuck out of there??
Still, after a comparatively serene last week, this one amped the anxiousness straight back up to 300x...
[quote] Hank and Gomie, armed with only a handgun and a shotgun, try to go up against SIX guys, several of whom have AK-47s?!? Why the fuck wouldn't they just get in the cars and get the fuck out of there??
Well, Hank's a cowboy and isn't thinking straight because he's so puffed up over getting Walt; and I can even accept that Gomez has no choice but to follow Hank's lead. Plus they may have waited too long to get away in their cars, thinking it was the tribal police arriving. And, being law enforcement, they might have expected to exert some authority.
It was ridiculous that the shoot-out went on for so long though. Hank & Gomez would have died straightaway, and then they would have finished off Jesse. (And how many bullets did Hank's gun have anyway?)
More importantly, how did paranoid Jesse & Supercop Hank not anticipate that Walt might call for backup as soon as he realized he was set up?
Also, I can't believe that the gang would just open fire and risk killing Walt, whom they need to do a cook.
I assume Hank & Gomez would have put on bulletproof vests. But I still think they're going to get shot in the head and die. Walt will be forced to cook for Lydia & the Nazis until he comes up with a plan to recover his empire. Jesse's a wild card...not sure what will happen there. I'd be fine with him dying but I also saw something in his eye that looked like sentiment for the way things were when they started. Maybe with Hank & Gomie off their backs they will join forces again out of necessity.
I can't believe it but I like Walt again. Jesse will be all right I hope Hank lives but agree Marie might as well ended the phone call with I love you Dead Meat...
[quote]Hank has to be dead. After calling Marie, he might as well have said "this time next week, I'll be out fishing as I enjoy my retirement."
Ha, yup. Plus Marie is dressed all in black, then looks at the ripped up heart in the garbage while talking to Hank.
After Marie's therapy session last week, in which she sounded unhinged and was fantasizing about killing Walt, I think she'll become more of a factor if/when Hank dies.
R11--Dodge is a major sponsor through product placement. They probably did not want to see one of their shiny toys shot up.
Walt lost me forever when he put a hit out on Jesse.
I want Hank to die so badly. I was screaming "kill that fucker! KILL THAT FUCKER!" at the tv right in the last few minutes.
My husband, who doesn't watch the show was staring at me with one eye brow raised, lol.
I'm not rooting for Walt, but I think eventually he'll be the sole survivor by the time the series ends.
Best tv show ever.
I agree r19 - Fucking Hank. Hate him.
I'm cool with Jesse being killed. Lil punk ass.
I'm tired of him saying "Mr Hhh-white."
And Brock was fine. I'm tired of Jesses's 'save the children' bullshit. He's a meth dealer. He saw what happened to children of meth heads. That's all Jesse's fault.
And Jesse's parents had tried many times to rehab him but he kept fucking up. It wasn't their fault they mistakenly kicked him out of the house for the last time. It was Jesse's brother's fault for bringing drugs home, something he had seen his older brother do many times. So Jesse's little brother was following in Jesse's footsteps.
And how innocent was Brock's mother, living with a meth dealer? Her kid might have accidentally poisoned himself on some meth one of these days.
Jesse knows Walter is an ace scientist. Brock didn't die because Walt didn't want him to die. If Walt wanted him dead, he'd be dead.
And who names their kid Brock? It's a stupid name. Sounds look something from The Flintstones.
Of course Jesse is not a boy scout, but the process that turned Walter into Heisenberg turned Jesse into a better person.
I agree with everything you said, Mr. Belvedere.
I had to fast forward through the last scene. This season has been fraught with tension. The last shot of Walt was genius.
I started really hating Hank when he made it clear he is just using Jesse "the kid", and couldn't care less what happens to him.
I can't help to think about what Skyler's reaction to Hank's death will be. She's been on Walt's side lately.
Only THREE episodes left, all bets are off and I'm going to be a mess!
Really can't see why anyone would root for Walt. The show's creator clearly isn't. Please explain.
Jesse's a "better person"? He just tried to torch a house where innocent children live! And no, they weren't at home, but it's still their HOME, with all of their stuff in it.
Jesse's become unbearably obnoxious. I don't care what happens to him, either.
Walt stuck it to the man and transformed from milquetoast to Scarface. Of course people like him.
He was enraged (justifiably). The house was empty, and Walt can afford a new one. And he didn't light the fire.
He also gave away his money and wants justice for Walt. He's gone from a vapid punk to a man of conscience.
[quote] And he didn't light the fire
Hank WAS holding a gun on him.
He was sitting in the house when Hank found him.
Walt will lose everything. His famly will abandon him. Jesse and Hank will be dead. He'll lose his money. And kill off the Nazis.
That will be the final irony.
Jesse was about to light the match when Hank found him in Walt's house. Hank talked Jesse out of setting the fire while holding a gun on him.
Which television show called Breaking Bad are you watching, r31?
Here's the scene where Hank comes upon Jesse repeatedly lighting a cigarette lighter in Walt's house after Jesse doused the floor with gasoline.
[quote]He also gave away his money and wants justice for Walt. He's gone from a vapid punk to a man of conscience.
A man of conscience should take responsibility for his own actions. Jesse is still a punk. He never had a compelling reason for going down the path he did. Walt did. And calling "Mr White" the devil like he deserves punishment more than Jesse himself is pure punk rationalization.
Turning Walt over to Hank is being a punk too; his plan has probably gotten Hank (and Gomez) killed. He was willing to burn down Walt's house. He had no idea whether Walt's wife or kids were there. Just because he shows a twinge of conscience now and then doesn't make him better; Walt himself shows a conscience too. He didn't want to take Jesse out, and he definitely didn't want to take Hank out, even though Hank intended to destroy him.
OK--He was going to go through with it, but wanting to burn down that house does not make Jesse evil. It was empty and Walt is rich. Jesse was seeking justice, not gain. He doesn't want Walt to "get away with it."
Fuck Walt. I hate this character more than any other now.
It IS his fault the Nazi's showed up. He always thinks he's in total control but they are the Chaos factor. They can not be controlled. He invited the devil in and expected the Devil to take orders.
I was beginning to love Hank but fuck as soon as he called Marie- I knew he was dead. God damn it.
Jesse/Hanks set up for Walt was BRILLIANT. But it was too good to be true.
What is Marie going to do now?
The thing I enjoy about this show is that each character (with the exception of the children) has both good and bad qualities about them. Each is flawed in their own way but at the same time we have witnessed the good in them as well. It's difficult not to have a love/hate opinion of each one.
[quote]Also, I can't believe that the gang would just open fire and risk killing Walt, whom they need to do a cook.
Did you forget the small fact that Walt gave the Nazis the exact coordinates of approximately $200 million IN CASH? FUCK the cook!
they don't know about the cash
Where does the Hank hate come from? I don't see it all. I feel sorry for him: Walt took advantage of him; made a complete fool of him; and got him shot and paralyzed in the process. If he's angry, he sure as hell has good reason.
Mind you, I haven't been too impressed with his detective skills, between not figuring Walt out sooner; not sharing his findings with his colleagues; and going into dangerous situations without telling anyone and without backup. That said, I sympathize with his plight and am rooting for him.
How sure is everyone that he's a dead man? I'm thinking maybe not. It's like they telegraphed his impending doom, but they didn't go ahead and off him. If they were going to do that, wouldn't that be at the end of this episode, as opposed to the beginning (or middle) of the next one? Plus, I'm not sure the writers want to follow-up "shooting him but not killing him" in Season 3 with "shoot him and kill him" in Season 5.
I'm just not convinced that it's "obvious" that he's a goner.
How would he survive?
I don't hate Hank at all. I'll be upset when/if he dies.
Personally, I don't like Hank because he represents the fat, righteous, racist white cunt no-one likes IRL, the 'cop' that needs his just desserts because he's the dictionary definition of asshole.
He's always treated Walt (hell, the entire family) as inferior compared against himself, and was never shy in implying it. I loved the earlier scenes where Walt was playing him right under his nose.
For me though, I've disliked Hank from his very first introduction at the 50th birthday because of his intense arrogance. It's because of that that he never caught on sooner.
I can see how people want to root for him to get the bad guy, fair enough. But feeling sorry for him? Fuck no! I hope he ends up like the picture of Jesse.
[quote]I'm just not convinced that it's "obvious" that he's a goner.
Maybe, but we're running out of time here, and people are simply going to have to start getting killed. Hank and his cop buddy seem like a logical place to start.
Jesse will clearly escape somehow, and one miracle escape out of there seems to be about all they'll be able to handle.
Just watched the most recent episode; I agree with R42, I don't get the Hank hate. Granted, he was kind of a buffoon the 1st season and he was ugly to his wife during the recovery, but during the 5th season, who didn't honestly believe he loved his crazy wife? He seems like most characters - flawed, but ultimately lovable.
Here's my theory (I read an online article where Vince Gilligan provides some insight in to the season finale so I'm not just pulling this out of my $ss):
- Gomez dies: (sad, but someone has to die in that shoot out)
- Jesse runs: you see Todd's look of dismay when Walt describes him as family; Jesse has his hand on the door handle and at the 1st opportunity he runs for it. Spends the last couple of episodes on the run.
- Walt: somehow intervenes and while he can't save Gomez, he can save Hank. After watching this episode, I think he's done and he's ready to hang up Heisenberg. Plus, he's devastated by the Jesse betrayal. While I think Skyler will die and Jr. will turn against him, I think he tries his best to protect his family
- Hank: somehow lives through the shoot out. I think he dies before the end of the series (and maybe never sees Marie again) but somehow manages to get to Andrea and Brock to try to protect them from the nazis
- Marie: I read this interview with VG where she becomes a force to be reckoned with, so when she thinks Hank is dead, she comes after Walt.
Also, somehow Saul factors in to all this, but who knows how?
Ooh, those are some great thoughts, R47.
And now both Jesse and Hank know (roughly) where Walt has buried the money. So if one of them is the last man standing, they can come back for some or all of it.
(Jesse would likely come back to give it away or set up some kind of children's fund. Hank would likely give some to Gomez' family if he ends up dead, etc)
I cannot WAIT to see how this all plays out. These next 3 weeks are like waiting for Christmas. (Corny but true!)
I agree with R14, but I think Walt and Jesse will both be cooking for the Nazis and Lydia.
Who gets the ricin in the end? Well, someone asked Vince how many people would ricin kill and he didn't really answer -- so it's probably not a group.
Whoever is at the tippy-top of the evil empire (Lydia)? Is going get the ricin and then Walt is going to kill the rest of them (Nazis) to be out, forever (or until cancer takes him).
Walt will finally convince Jesse to go find a different place to live, as Walt does the same -- he gets his family set up in a safe place with access to the money.
The phone call with Skyler asking, "When will you be home.." is no doubt after he does what he has to do to finally be out for good...but he probably won't ever make it to that safe place with his family -- and he'll die before getting there.
I don't know that the nazis would necessarily want Jesse as a cook; he's a threat to Todd (who he punched) and they don't know (nor does Todd) that' he's a comparable cook to Walt. Walt knows that, but they want the master, not his student. Plus, in their mind, Todd is the heir apparent, not Jesse so it's in their interest to eliminate Jesse. Lydia doesn't know Jesse, so I can't imagine she's going to have an opinion beyond improving the quality of the meth.
I think Jesse spends the rest of the episodes on the run as more of a loose end. I think Todd will be the one to try to take him out so we can be Walt's "son". Maybe he might even take out Walt Jr. as competition for Walt.
There's obviously a time gap between what's happening now and when Walt comes back for the ricin - he has hair when he comes back.
Quiet, mousy little Marie is probably going to play a huge part in what's to come, because whether Hank dies in the shoot out or not, she is going to be PISSED. I think he and Gomez will most likely die, but Jesse will get away. Sometimes I think he's going to be the only one left alive at the end.
And how are all the people who survive going to get out of the desert? Most of the vehicles there were not driveable at the end of the episode.
What am I going to do all week?! Seems like such a long time to wait.
I hope Hank gets his head blown off. Can't stand that arrogant prick.
I'm betting that the last scene is Walt committing suicide with the ricin. Everyone dead, the money gone, his life in ruins, and he takes the pill to end it all because there's absolutely nothing left to live for.
I also can't see him using something that slow to kill someone else in the final episode.
Hank is a bit of a douche but a good guy I think Walt loves him. Hank is good at his job and it kills him what Walt truly is. I don't think he will just be dead at the beginning of next episode Walt will do a mercykilling and Hank will ask him to protect his wife and the promise won't be kept...
Everyone assumes Jesse will get away. Maybe he won't. And that phone call from Hank to Marie was so, "I MUST be getting killed in the next 5 minutes" that I wonder. Maybe Hank survives, Jesse dies.
You never know.
A little OT but:
Skylar's significant weight loss is sort of taking me out of the timeline.
And Todd looks more and more like Matt Damon.
Walt will not take the ricin. It's a painful death. He's a scientist. He knows how to commit suicide with far less fuss or muss.
Yes, R56, Skyler has lost a lot of weight, yet she still has big boobs. I wonder if the actress had work done.
I think Todd is too ugly to be Matt Damon; you can tell he has a bad complexion
The actor who now plays the nazi (formerly Herc of FNL) is starting to look like a meth addict himself
they call Todd "Meth Damon" on Reddit...
[quote]they call Todd "Meth Damon" on Reddit...
They call him that on several websites, twitter, etc.
Catch up. Datalounge.
The only way Hank can live through it is if he actually called for back up while chasing Walt's signal.
Given his ego, I don't see that happening. He had to walk Walt in by himself. He had to be the big man. Just like Walt — he wanted to control everything and now it's all shot to hell, literally.
And after such a brilliant move. He went down in glory.
If Walt just runs away because he knows he's busted— The Nazis are going to go after HIS family.
If they kidnap Walt - or for whatever reason they go missing- both Skylar and Marie will have missing husbands.
Will they team up?
God this is an intense season. Gomez and Cranston were on Talking Bad (which is so much better than Talking Dead)and it seems obvious that Gomez gets killed. I'm also thinking that if Hank gets killed that Skylar gets clarity and take the kids and runs. Or teams up with Marie to get Walt. Also can they just cross pollinate all the media awards and give Aaron Paul an Emmy, an Oscar, a Tony and a Grammy? He has been killing it.
OMG: Something just occurred to me. If Hank dies. Marie is going to flip out.
What if Marie is the one who goes apeshit on Walter's house?
If Hank gets killed they'll clearly go back to Plan B and stage it to look like corrupt DEA agents were killed in a drug deal gone wrong. Easy to do since Hank was completely off the books from start to finish on this.
Marie will flip out, but what proof does she have?
[quote]There's obviously a time gap between what's happening now and when Walt comes back for the ricin - he has hair when he comes back.
The flash-forward takes place on Walt's 52nd birthday. We know this from the way he arranged the bacon in the diner scene. The current timeline is still just after his 51st.
RJ Mitte was 16 when this show started filming; he's now a grown man in his 20s, and it's become impossible to obscure this fact. Good thing the show is ending now.
[quote] Marie will flip out, but what proof does she have?
What do you mean? Why would she need "proof" to flip out? She knows the truth. That's exactly the point. She has no recourse, no legal grievance- She will FLIP OUT and fuck up his house.
The Yellow Heisenberg makes sense - since she wants to expose him and no one would believe her— She might go apeshit. She wants the world to know that WALT IS HEISENBERG.
[quote]What do you mean? Why would she need "proof" to flip out? She knows the truth. That's exactly the point. She has no recourse, no legal grievance- She will FLIP OUT and fuck up his house.
When I said no proof, I meant nothing she can take to the DEA. I agree with you, she'll go after revenge on her own.
[quote]Marie will flip out, but what proof does she have?
Did you all forget about the video confession?
If the graffiti is in purple, It's Marie. If not, not.
[quote]If the graffiti is in purple, It's Marie. If not, not.
She has been wearing Yellow this season.
Walt's confession to Jesse as he was driving to the set up was no doubt recorded.
Of course it was recorded. It was completely artificial and out of character for Walt to list his most heinous crimes. No one would speak that way. Jesse knows what Walt has done. Walt would just need to refer to his crimes, not list them with sufficient detail to be incriminating.
Yes R274 and that recording is no doubt in the possession of Walt and/or Gomie. With one or both of them dead or seriously wounded, it is highly possible that that recording will now fall into the hands of Nazi Jack.
I think Walter is now officially his bitch.
Walter didn't look like anyone's bitch in the flashforward (buying the M60 & at the dinner). He looked in full-Heisenberg mode.
I sure hope so R76. I couldn't stand watching the big blowhard douchebag Hank making a big production out of humiliating Walter as he arrested him - I was hoping Walt would whip around and bust him in his tiny nutsack.
r64 - Well, it's been heavily foreshadowed that Marie breaks a little bad herself. I don't think she's the one who destroys the White house though unless she really loses her mind. She still loves the kids.
r74 - Yes, that was a weak point.
Why does Walter have hair in the flash-forward scenes? Doesn't he have incurable cancer?
I think most of the major characters -- Hank, Gomey, Jesse, Skyler, Walt Jr., and of course Walt -- will die. I'm hoping that Marie will take Walt out, and that she'll end up with baby Holly. This has been a very grim series and I think that's about as close to a "happy" ending as we might get. Though we may not even be left with anything as hopeful as that.
I think the only person who is going to die out of the main characters (meaning Walt's family plus Jesse) is Walt.
I'm pretty sure Walt dies at the end.
R78, if there's a sudden introduction of Purple Meth into the market, we'll know that Marie has really broken bad.
I lost sympathy for Jesse now that he is a snitch. I am rooting for Walt. I want that smug asshat Hank and his klept holier than thou wife Marie to go DOWN.
I broke bad long before any of them.
How do Hank and Marie afford that house?
Even the actress who plays Marie is annoying, I think her new show will flop as she has no appeal
I really don't get all the love for Aaron Paul this season.
He's done nothing except stare off in the distance with a pained expression on his face, and if we wanted that we could watch anything Kristen Stewart is in.
I wanted to slap Jesse when he said about Walt "he can't keep getting away with iiiit!"
What a whiner.
Nobody forced Jesse to kill Gale B. - he had enough money (and really no family ties at all) to just go away and disappear.
He could have let Walt do it.
Jesse was a small-time cook, dealer and user. He really had nothing going for him.
Except those dreamy blue eyes!
All characters on this show have shades of black and white.
On a scale from 1-10 how would you rate them? 1 being the most innocent and 10 being the most evil.
I was going to start on 1 with Walt Jr. - He hasn't been touched and put Walt Sr. at 10 but each have someone on the other side of their end. At -1 would be the baby Holly. and and 10+ would be Todd and the Nazis.
Jesse is on the darker side but he still tries to do what is right in some circumstances. I'd out him on the plus side, around 6 or 7.
His Counterpart might be Hank who is on the lighter side but does some dumb shit when he's caught up in his pride- ex: beating up Jesse, fudging evidence to get a the truth and now completely going on his own and bringing Gomez into it with him. It' smore about his own pride and vision now than 'justice' or 'law'. Still he's on the lighter side of things.
I'd give Hank a 3
Skylar started out as a 2 then worked her way down the scale- she's almost by Walt's side now, 8.
Marie- 2. All she did was shop lift and that went away but I suspect she's about to "flip" to the dark side after / IF Hank dies.
Through Badger and Petey in there around 5 they're addicts and dealers but they're not killers and not into converting the sober just to score.
[quote]10+ would be Todd and the Nazis.
Todd is unfailingly polite and never calls Walt anything except "Mr. White," so he gets points for that in my book. He is also neat and clean, and that's a plus.
Good etiquette and grooming is worth a great deal, even when you're talking about murderous psychopaths. I would say Todd is no higher than an 8.
Todd fits right in with the Nazis.
Polite, efficient, and completely willing to murder any number of people at the drop of a hat for no other reason than to "follow orders".
Clean or not, Todd is definitely a 10. He doesn't even have a good reason for being in this. Needs money like Walt? No. Blackmailed into it like Jesse? No. He's in it purely b/c he's a psychopath.
I give the Nazis like an 8 too. In my book, they get points for questioning the reasoning behind Jesse's hit. They get 2 pts b/c it seemed to me that they felt that Walt's reasoning wasn't really good enough to kill someone. Granted, they were still going to do it but there it is.
Hank was a douche in the beginning of the show - yes. But, he's not doing everything in his power to get Walt because of pride. Remember Walt's tape implicating him put him in a tough spot and he said he won't tell the DEA until he has Walt in cuffs. He wants to go to his bosses with the problem and the solution at the same time to possibly save his job - period. He had to tell Gomie b/c Gomie was pressuring him asking questions about why he's got men tailing people.
Jesse killed Gale to save Walt, the man so many of you cherish. So I'm not so sure you can throw him on the evil scale for that. He has had opportunities to get out of the business and got back in for terrible reasons, so he may fall into a 5 or 6 for that.
[quote]He could have let Walt do it.
Walt was being held at gunpoint, about to be killed. Jessie killed Gayle to save Mr. White's life.
Hey, what about me? I'm as innocent as they come!
yep, you're right r94 - i forgot about that - so many details in this show!
the devils in the details!
Hey, R87, don't forget The Angry Knitted Brow expression.
It's been officially announced that BETTER CALL SAUL the BREAKING BAD prequel, has been picked up by AMC.
I hope Saul, Bill Burr and Huell don't die in these next few weeks.
[quote] Gomez and Cranston were on Talking Bad (which is so much better than Talking Dead)
Well, on Talking Bad they've actually got something to talk about instead of, "Um, so were you sad when your saw that your character was finally going to be eaten by zombies?"
[quote]Why does Walter have hair in the flash-forward scenes? Doesn't he have incurable cancer?
Pay closer attention, dear. He's still terminally ill in the flashforwards. Moreover, he's *visibly* ill, and judging by his hair, he stopped doing chemo long ago. As has been the case throughout the show, however, Walt has a considerable amount of luck -- at least in the context of avoiding death -- and in this case it's apparently extended to outliving physician forecasts of his life expectancy.
[quote]He had to tell Gomie b/c Gomie was pressuring him asking questions about why he's got men tailing people.
If this season has had a serious flaw, it is not spending more time on that scene. Hank telling Gomie could have been a very intense 5 or 10 minutes.
I hope before the series is over they explain how Walt became a school teacher. We know why he left Grey Matter - because of his falling out with Gretchen and Elliott - but at the beginning of Season 4 (?), there's a flashback to Walt & Skyler looking at the house in which they currently reside. Skyler is pregnant with Walt Jr. and Walt still has some job at Sandia that seems to have a bright future (because he indicates that they will want a bigger house soon). Does anyone else remember that?
They never really explained why he became a teacher, which was obviously a big step down for him. I wonder it it had something to do with Jr. being born with cerebral palsy.
[quote]at the beginning of Season 4 (?), there's a flashback to Walt & Skyler looking at the house in which they currently reside. Skyler is pregnant with Walt Jr. and Walt still has some job at Sandia that seems to have a bright future (because he indicates that they will want a bigger house soon). Does anyone else remember that?
Vaguely, yeah. It was surprising, cuz this show isn't too big on the flashbacks iirc.
[quote]They never really explained why he became a teacher, which was obviously a big step down for him. I wonder it it had something to do with Jr. being born with cerebral palsy.
I can see that being the reason: wanting a steady paycheck, regular hours, and maybe getting dibs on the best teaching assistance for his son.
Junior was so star struck by Saul, and I thought it was cute that Saul played along with it.
I think it was because Jr was born with cerebral palsy. Walt needed a steady job with a dependable income and medical benefits.
The whole idea of Walt Breaking Bad because of medical costs was kind of over-the-top. He had medical benefits which covered cancer treatment, but I've seen reviewers of the show in the UK and Australia saying that Walt did this because the US does not have universal health care. The only thing that wasn't covered by his insurance was the experimental surgery, which would certainly not have been covered by the National Health in the UK and probably wouldn't be covered in Australia or Canada either.
And $750,000 probably wouldn't cover college costs for Jr and Holly. By the time Holly goes to college, it will probably cost $200,000 a year at the rate we're going.
[quote]The whole idea of Walt Breaking Bad because of medical costs was kind of over-the-top.
I think it was clear from the beginning that medical costs weren't the real reason he wanted the money.
He didn't want the money solely for his medical costs, it was for his family to have enough money to live on once he died.
Junior will need money to go to college. Plus, once he turns 18, there won't be as much government support for him, so his expenses will probably increase.
And Holly wasn't even born at the time, so that would be 18+ years of Skylar raising her without Walt's income.
It was never just about Walt's medical expenses.
It was a combination of providing for his family when he was gone PLUS the missed opportunity of having left Gray Matter before it hit big.
Remember, Gray wasn't just a little company, it was worth in the BILLIONS.
Imagine, helping to start Apple and being bought out for $5000 (which was a decent amount of money at the time). Walt felt a profound sense of loss (money, prestige, etc.) for the whole Gray Matter debacle. We don't really know why Walt left Gray Matter (personal reason with Gretchen?) but his ideas are what helped it succeed.
I wonder if the show will bring some closure to why he left GM. Gretchen is a smug bitch - maybe she gets the ricin.
[quote]We don't really know why Walt left Gray Matter (personal reason with Gretchen?) but his ideas are what helped it succeed.
It was implied that he was in love with Gretchen and she chose the other guy. THAT is why he left the company and was hasty about it. The show made it clear there was no ill feelings from the other half of the team it was all Walt's bullshit.
Not being the Alpha dog in any situation doesn't sit well with him. He'd rather walk away and cause a mess than not be in total control.
And perhaps that's why teaching appealed to him in some matters. At the front of the class he is the authority figure who controls the narrative, hands out assignments and brings about judgement on others. It's a control thing.
Again - it all comes down to EGO for Walt. Control and Power.
If i remember correctly, Walt walked out on Gretchen at some family function of hers (she was a rich girl and it was implied he didn't feel like he fit in). I think by the time Gray Matter happened their relationship was over.
Hank is going to be on Talking Bad next week. Another reason to think he's dead meat?
R113: the show isn't real.
So if Jr. hadn't been born with CP, then Walt wouldn't have had to take a teaching job. If Walt had a better job, he'd have better insurance (and never would have met Jessie). So technically speaking, this whole mess is Jr.'s fault? I hope that spastic fucker burns in hell.
Loved Saul's parting comment to Walt Junior: "Don't drink and drive, but if you do, Call Saul!"
Ever the huckster!
R111, I agree until the end. Control and power is due to his Heisenberg alter-ego. Walt, the person, was a wimp. A push over. That's why Hank never caught on sooner.
My impression is that high school was the easy route he regretted, but did it for his family.
R120 Bryan Cranston has said his interpretation of why Walt became a teacher was, it was a job that made him impervious to criticism and judgment, and after his failure to take any risks and succeed in life, his egotism and narcissism needed the protection. Because teaching is an honored job, and low risk.
I think you added that last part, R121. No narcissist would become a teacher. A masochist, maybe.
Walt was beat down. A good man that saw every colleague better him, though many weren't nearly as talented or capable. That would gnaw at anyone that had healthy pride. And it's why Walt was so sympathetic at the beginning.
Personally, I find Pinkman insufferable at this point. And he appears to be speaking for Gilligan. A big round of "ugh" on that.
And Hank? Talk about ego.
Yeah, I don't like what they've done with Jesse. So self-righteous it's nauseating. I might find him tolerable if he & Walt end up joining forces again.
Yeah, a narcissist would hate to have a profession where people give you their undivided attention and compliment you as a hero. They'd hate summers off too.
[quote]No narcissist would become a teacher.
Narcissism takes different forms. When we meet him in the pilot, Walt has constructed an image of himself that is impervious to criticism. Throughout the series, he constructs the image of Heisenberg and revels in donning his hat and being called his name. "I am the one who knocks" was a reaction to narcissistic injury and a pretty direct expression of his constructed identity. These are all expressions of narcissism.
[quote]a profession where people give you their undivided attention and compliment you as a hero.
What profession is this? Man, I'd like a job like that.
[quote]I often wondered why Vince [Gilligan] chose the profession of teacher for him to go into and I’ve contemplated that for a while and it finally hit me as far as what I wanted to use it for. It’s an unimpeachable position. No one will criticize someone going into the teaching profession. They’re above it. If he decided I’m going to be a truck driver, people would obviously say, “What the hell are you doing? You’re a world class chemist!” But as a teacher, I can hide in teaching because I can say I want to influence the next generation of students, and people are going, “Yes, yeah, I get that” and they can support it but okay. So he kind of hid out in that, but the depression built and by the time he’s 50 he’s now fully cast and balled up. It’s not until this diagnosis that it just blew everything open for him.
Walt had health insurance through his teaching job but it wasn't a very good plan (or at least it wasn't an amazing plan) because it wouldn't cover the treatment with that doctor (the amazing oncologist); he wasn't in the network.
Personally, I think we'll find he left Gray Matter over a ridiculous, perceived slight. He took something badly because that's the way he is. Walt's own worst enemy is Walt. He wanted to be Fring but Fring could tamp down on his ego long enough to work with the cartel and then stomp it. I don't think Walt's ego would ever had let him do that long term. Of course, Gus had his own emotional problem with his need for revenge on Tio. Never let it get personal!
P.S. As a fellow teacher, I agree!
Most people want status. Those that don't are often losers.
The Walt we see at the show's beginning is a wounded man. Most people would be very upset if they were in his position -- losing a billion dollar business over a breakup, then eking by on a teacher's salary in a country that is losing any sense of a middle class. I wouldn't deny that ego is involved -- of course it is -- but to an obviously abnormal extent?
As the show progresses Walt's ego balloons with his success. And that is what the show is truly about -- change.
Isn't there evidence that Walt would have continued working under Gus, but that Jesse's plot -- and Walt's need to protect Jesse -- destroyed that partnership? So much of what happened -- so much of the bad, for Walt -- can be traced to Jesse's need for revenge and Walt's loyalty to Jesse.
[quote] Walt had health insurance through his teaching job but it wasn't a very good plan (or at least it wasn't an amazing plan) because it wouldn't cover the treatment with that doctor (the amazing oncologist); he wasn't in the network
They wanted experimental surgery and Walt's insurance wouldn't cover it. Nobody's insurance would have covered it. (It wouldn't have been covered in countries with universal health care, either)
Oncology is pretty uncreative. It's formulaic unless you are at a center like Memorial Sloane Kettering where, frankly, they do some pretty shitty research trials that have killed people because it was forbiden to deviate from the research trial protocols. I know two young women who died prematurely because of this. People don't fully understand that experimental cancer research can shorten your life more often than you think.
I've known a lot of oncologists. My best friend married one. I wouldn't say any of them were "amazing." Oncologists are not surgeons, btw. They're people who follow established protocols unless they work in research.
Research oncologists are going to make their research trial sound terrific to the patients. Take it with a grain if salt. They have a vested interest in making you want to be in their trial. Their trials are paid for by grants and they need subjects, aka patients
What experimental surgery did they want? The out-of-network doctor recommended an aggressive chemo/radiation plan. That shrunk the tumor and they were able to do the lobectomy.
As to whether or not the doctor was actually amazing, I don't know. He was presented as such on the show by Marie and Skylar.
Walt leaving Gray Matter = Larry David in 'Clear History'
There really aren't any fantastic oncologists for Stage IIIA lung cancer since the prognosis has remained unchanged for years and the response to treatment depends upon things like patient age, gender and general health.
The fantastic oncologist is a plot contrivance. It's the first time we see Walt losing drug money. We didn't know that as time goes on we are going to see more and more plot contrivances that will cause Walt to spend his ill-gotten gains.
Hank's being shot was a plot contrivance to cause Walt to spend more drug loot. Marie's hysteria once again causes a family to go overboard with medical care. Well, this had to happen, otherwise Walt wouldn't have been able to make that incriminating DVD that shocked and horrified the audience a few weeks ago.(Never mind that Hank was in no position to demand Walt pay Hank's rehab bills -- as awalt claimed -- when Hank was unable to get out of bed).
One minute Ted is a concerned boss who is cooking the books because he is trying to keep his business afloat and keep his employees in their jobs. But when presented with the means to solve his problem with Walt's drug money, he
suddenly behaves in a way that makes everything even worse. Plot contrivance.
None of these scenarios is relevant to real life. But they are needed for entertainment value.
r134 - I think you presume a lot. The audience wasn't necessarily "horrified" by Walt's phony confession tape. I thought it was a great strategic move to try to shut Hank down in a nonviolent manner.
And as for Ted's misuse of the drug money not being "relevant;" I disagree. Sure, it made the situation more entertaining, but it wasn't unrealistic. If you've ever seen someone desperately needy come into some money that they didn't earn, it's not unusual for it to be squandered. Generally, the reason they were desperate to begin with is because they can't handle money.
[quote]And as for Ted's misuse of the drug money not being "relevant;" I disagree. Sure, it made the situation more entertaining, but it wasn't unrealistic. If you've ever seen someone desperately needy come into some money that they didn't earn, it's not unusual for it to be squandered. Generally, the reason they were desperate to begin with is because they can't handle money.
I live in a slum area of my city and am friends with many low-income people, including welfare recipients. Most of them waste money on the stupidest shit, instead of important things.
Hell, a weirdo friend of mine collects Hot Wheels cars. He doesn't have any important or valuable ones, just any old package that he finds at a store or flea market for under $2. And he doesn't have any kids or nephews to give them to, either. He just hangs on to them.
He literally has over 300 of these useless fucking things, just sitting around collecting dust.
He doesn't have, like, a fucking phone in his home, or a computer, or cable tv or internet. But he's got 300+ Hot Wheels!
Plus, he spends about $30-50 per week playing the damn lottery, cuz he's definitely gonna win any day now and will be a millionaire.
Uh oh, spoiler alert! See link!
No, not really. There's nothing spoilery in it at all, promise. In fact, it's a funny pic.
R134, i don't mean to throw shade, but you use the term "plot contrivance" when you really mean "plot."
Everything that happens in a darkened theater, or on a silver screen, or on a television, is more heightened, coincidental, and less likely, than what happens to us in real life. That does not mean it is somehow inauthentic. That just means it storytelling. And to dismiss basically the entire core of storytelling as "plot contrivance" is to be a little too cool for the room.
Unless you think Juliet not waking up in time from her death-like stupor was also a "plot contrivance."
If you think all the things you list are beyond the realm of reality, or break with our understanding of the characters as laid out in the show and its plot, then I disagree.
If you think they are unlikely, well, so is the rest of everything you ever watch. We humans are delighted by the unlikely.
[quote]i don't mean to throw shade, but you use the term "plot contrivance" when you really mean "plot."
I think you can tack the word "contrivance" on when the plot turns become convenient and fly in the face of established character traits. Everything needs to happen within the boundaries of reality established by the show. This varies wildly, story by story, series by series, movie by movie, etc. What is acceptable as realistic plotting in the FRIENDS universe is not going to be acceptable in the VEEP universe, let alone THE SOPRANOS. All we ask is that they stay consistent within the strictures of their logic.
I don't think Hank being shot was a plot contrivance, as such. Not at all. But almost everything that has happened in the last two episodes can be seen as contrived. Partly because it's all happening so quickly.
Next episode description is ...
Everyone copes with radically changed circumstances...
Goodbye Hank ....
Walt will be captured by the nazis
We will think Jesse is dead . At the last minute he will pop up to kill Walt. Fighting to survive until the bitter end Walt will tell Jesse he's his real father. Not caring Jesse shots him anyway' A smiling Walt dies. Jesse walks into the sunset only to be killed by Hank's wife. The end...
Anyone from Hollywood out there?
"Oh my God. I'm back. I'm home. All the time, it was... We finally really did it ... You Maniacs! You blew it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!"
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