18 year-old shot ***NINE*** times for just holding a knife!
There was no one around him. NO ONE.
And when he refused to drop the knife he was holding, the cops aimed and fired NINE TIMES!
Then afterwards they tasered him, because they feared for his safety.
See Video below
Nine shots you say? Could this Vanilla Ice lyric finally have come true?
"Jealous 'cause I'm out getting mine, Shay with a gauge and Vanilla with a nine."
This young man didn't need to die. The police had him "secured" by himself in a streetcar and he had a small knife. They could have talked to him, given him food and waited it out. Just tragic!
I hope the family gets a huge settlement.
R5, he was shot NINE times then tasered! Shouldn't have they used the taser first? This is just pure overkill and I'm glad it was caught on video.
I suspect the taser was done to cover the police's tracks since it just doesn't make any sense to taser someone after shooting him NINE times! Then, one officer also tried to revive him through CPR.
He had a small knife and told everyone in the streetcar to get out. Sounds like someone who didn't want to hurt others. The police had so many other options. They could have pushed the switch to close the doors of the streetcar. They could have waited it out. If you watch the video, he didn't lunge at them, he simply took a step.
Instead, the police simply went to "comply or die" mode. Now, a young man is dead! Very, very tragic!
Knives are illegal to carry in places like Britain.
[quote]They could have talked to him, given him food and waited it out.
WHAT is going on in Canada? What was this boy doing with the knife? Was he using it or just walking around holding it?
R8, you are a major douchebag!
FYI, this is not just my opinion. But, the opinion of most experts and former police officers. I don't know about where you live. But, in Canada, deadly force is only used when there is imminent danger. In this situation, there was none.
After the "mishandling" of the Toronto police of the G8 protesters, most Canadians are concerned about police brutality. Since it can very well happen to all of us.
[quote]He should have dropped the knife. Period.
What knife? You mean the knife we can clearly see in that blurry, dark video shot from 100 feet away? Oh wait...
There could be a number of reasons why he didn't. He may have been mentally impaired. He may have been deaf (for all the cops knew)and couldn't hear the command to "drop" whatever it was they claim he was holding.
An eye witness on the streetcar said he also had his penis in his hand. I assume he meant "he had his dick out".
The popo obviously botched this one and hopefully there will be a full inquiry and justice will be done. But I can't get too teary-eyed over some guy who pulls a knife on a crowded streetcar and starts yelling at people, even if he has mental health issues. I'm just way past tired of crazies running wild in the streets here in Toronto.
A few weeks ago there was an incident on the subway were a guy was being aggressive and threatening people with a knife. A man intervened to keep him away from someone more vulnerable (old lady or something, I forget) and got slashed in the neck for his trouble. Fortunately, he survived. But if the police had taken him out, I wouldn't have wasted any sympathy on him.
r13 Have you actually READ some of the saner posts here. All they're saying is that there were better ways of handling the situation. The cops went overboard, and that's a fact. The perp was alone, they could've lobbed in tear gas. And tasering AFTER shooting? C'mon now, let's be reasonable. I wonder how many high 5's went around the stationhouse?
Did you not read my opening sentence, r14?
And why would you think there were high fives?
That's a cheap shot R16.
R18, a cheap shot is firing NINE shots at a scrawny kid with a small knife then tasering him afterwards. That's a cheap shot, execution style.
23 Officers with guns, bats and tasers against one 18 year-old kid with a small knife cornered inside a streetcar. That's cowardice!
R19 - it's not a paid vacation. It is a paid suspension.
Should we string up the officer in the public square without an investigation and trial?
Or has the police department done exactly what they should have - gotten the officer off the streets pending the conclusion of the investigation. But keep him on the payroll until his guilt or innocence has been determined?
You are coming very close to doing exactly what the officers are accused of doing. Taking an extreme action without cause.
Semantics. A young man is dead.
The officer is entitled to due process. I know that and I would not have it any other way. I wish more could have been done. There were so many available options. Why take a young man's life? Why? Deadly force is the last resort.
I've seen bouncers at clubs successfully disarm drunk patrons with knives. In the UK, most officers do not even carry guns. But, they disarm people all the time.
Here is a list of well-known cases of people killed by the Toronto police after a confrontation. Call me skeptical. But, it will most likely result in a refresher course on mental health for the officers involved.
R21 - you may well and probably do have a point about the police. (although I don't buy the part about police officers in the UK. Unless by disarm you aren't including people with guns). The comparison to bouncers is weak. The procedures and protocols and public safety concerns for police officers and bouncers are hardly the same.
But please don't marginalize or trivialize your point by taking pot shots at the officers involved and trying to claim semantics.
Stick to the high road. There is plenty of room - and no reason for you to leave it.
Holding on to a deadly weapon after the police tell you to drop it is a direct invitation to be shot. You'll get no outrage whatsoever over this from me, OP.
At first I read this as 18 year old being forced to watch the movie NINE!I think I'd rather be shot.
R25 is going to learn how wrong he is the hard way.
Justice for Trayvon
Thats nothing compared to what goes on in the U.S.
Cop mind-controlled...kid de-popped.
R30 is the cray cray "depop" troll from other threads.
R24, I guess you haven't been to the UK then. Google "Do UK Police carry guns?".
Again, you're missing the point. My comparison to bouncers is to prove to you that you do not need deadly force to disarm someone with a knife. These police officers had batons and tasers at their disposal. Why shoot to kill? It was a "comply or die" tactic! You can hear on the tape, the officer barking "Drop the knife! If you take one more step, you're finished". No communication at all which is always critical during these confrontations. If they had just waited a few more minutes to de-escalate the situation, this kid may still be alive.
Those first 3 shots were not warning shots. Then, he paused, then 6 more shots. Then, they use a taser. This was an execution!
I've lost all respect for the Toronto Police after the police brutality and abuse of power during the G20 protest. No charges were ever filed for the injuries to civilians. Simply disgusting!
There seems to be no explanation why that type of force was necessary (everyone was off the tram so why not wait for a specialist unit?). Compare the situation to the Muslim extremists who killed the young soldier on the streets of London. They both ran towards to police with intent to kill, and police managed to disarm them at close range with several gun shots without killing them.
This could be Canada's Trayvon Martin case.
To be fair, we should wait for get cops to give their side of the story. Perhaps they had intel on a terrorist attack and were amped up.
Well, don't stand around at night with a knife in public transit. It's quite simple.
[quote] If he was black... , every other reply on this thread would be defending the cops.
No the outrage would twice what it is right now.
Remember the mentally ill guy that beheaded the other man on the Greyhound Bus?
The cops LOCKED him in the bus after everyone got out and deescalated the situation. And he was carrying a much bigger Knife.
I think they used teargas to subdue him.
The cops could have done the same on this streetcar.
Whoa, nelly--those were some fat-ass police officers shooting that kid.
Someone send the video to Nancy Grace!
We don't really have community police anymore, we are moving towards a militarized state.
For every cop with his heart in the right place who would do anything for his city (and yes, there are great cops) there's another one who is either a hired goon with little to no mental capacity for gray areas (or worse yet, is corrupt and on the take).
A guy at my gym, a lawyer who works closely with police, said he thinks these cops were probably young, inexperienced patrol cops. They aren't really trained or experienced enough to diffuse situations like this.
On Metro Morning today someone said that maybe we need to disarm Toronto beat cops since they're never involved in shootouts with bad guys anyway. They only shoot kids and innocent people.
[quote] They aren't really trained or experienced enough to diffuse situations like this.
But common sense says you don't really need to shoot someone who is not a threat. I mean, how low do we set the intelligence threshold for cops? How stupid would be too stupid, or is there any floor on that?
They certainly don't need to shoot him that many times.
I also wonder how much the young man's appearance had to do with this. He was dressed in the typical thug style of a lot of young men his age. That's just how a lot of kids dress these days but it puts people on edge, particularly cops.
I'm not saying he's to blame. But if you're unhinged, dressed like a thug, and start waving a knife around ....
What kind of a last name is Yatim?
I can answer my own question--he was Syrian.
R32 - I'm not missing your point, you're missing mine.
I know police in the UK don't as a rule carry guns. My point was you claimed that without guns the UK police were successful at disarming people. I said I don't believe that - unless you are excluding people with guns from those they disarm. For the record I did as you suggest. Guess what, police in the UK radio for more officers with guns when faced with a criminal with a gun.
I can't believe you are still trying to stick to your bouncer comparison. Your logical flaw is in your attempt to compare a single incident with your perceived generalization. Some bouncers may be able to disarm some people in some circumstances who have knifes. That doesn't mean any bouncer or any police officer in any circumstance can disarm anyone holding a knife. It's foolish reasoning.
My point is and continues to be there is plenty of evidence to support your theory of police misconduct. Why go out on a limb with foolish comparisons and cheap shots about paid vacations? What on earth do you think either accomplishes?
In Floriduh, deputies shot a black man who was sitting in his own car in his own yard. Someone might want to start a thread about this.
R50, I never said that the UK police are disarming people with guns. I said, knives! Similar to this case. You're the one who brought that up which has nothing to do with this case.
Yes, I'm making a generalization. There is no reason to "shoot to kill" a young man with a knife when there is no imminent danger.
There are so many questions about this case that are very disturbing.
Why shoot 9 times? Why taser him afterwards? Why did it take 20 minutes for the ambulance to arrive? Why did the officers open fire without securing the general vicinity (you can see people on bikes and in the streets)? Why were there no attempts to de-escalate the situation? In the video, you can hear the officer say “If you take one step in this direction with that foot …[inaudible] die,”. Why? Why? Why?
You can stay high and mighty about your attitude on the Toronto Police. That's your prerogative. I choose to judge them! Since based on experience, a young man is dead and these officers will most likely not be charged. This is not the first time the Toronto Police have "inappropriately" killed mentally ill or agitated people. But, this time, there is video. Imagine what they would have claimed if there was none. In another video, you can already see the officers kicking the bullet shells and compromising the crime scene. They probably didn't realize they were being filmed. Sickening!!!
R53 - Actually if you go back and read your posts you will see you made the point that you have seen bouncers disarm patrons with knifes. You didn't make that distinction when you talked about UK police. Which is why I said I didn't believe you unless you were not including disarming people who had guns.
I'm not the one being high and mighty. As a matter of fact you are the one admitting to judging the Toronto Police. That would be an example of being "high and mighty".
My point was and continues to be - why are you introducing foolish elements like bouncers you have seen disarm someone with a knife? Why take a cheap shot at what is clearly the right thing to do with regards to the officer being put on paid suspension?
You keep making your case with just the facts - why not stop there?
This is how they treat Blacks 24 7
R54, please shut up.
This is the new mental health system. A four pronged approach -- beating, jailing, tasing, shooting. Either of the four are randomly applied by police.
R54, you heard R56!
Canada swung to the Right. Not surprising.
R56 - No.
But hey thanks for the confirmation that I'm right.
Er no, R59, there is mass outrage over this.
The kid was clearly trying for suicide by cop but it's inexcusable that they fired on him when he posed no immediate threat to anyone.
R58 - who said there isn't mass outrage - justified for that matter?
But not that you have explained what happened - I'm sure there is no need for an investigation.
R39, it wasn't that long ago. Go ahead and search. The Boston Bomber threads were full of people creaming their jeans, while Trayvon/Zimmerman threads were massively trolled by racists.
R56 is the sort of scum that makes this country the shit hole it is. I'll say it again -this is how blacks are treated 24 7 you don't like it you can go to hell with the rest of the fakers.
How big was his dick?
Pity it was a twink and not a fat bear. Bears and their "sub-culture" that glorify both inelegant behavior and fat are a blot on society.
Was he white?
Don't tell me you weren't thinking it
good one less mother fucker using up our resources.
good one less idiot collecting welfare.
He's cute. Suddenly, I care.
Yes, I'm shallow.
The cop has been charged with second degree murder.
r61 I don't know if the kid was trying for suicide by cop, but the second half of your statement is indeed true. THAT is what has to be reconciled, vis a vis, the actions of that police officer. And now there's evidence of contamination/alteration of the crime scene? The hole just keeps gettin' wider and deeper.