Sorry for coming off as stupid. But, what happens after the bankruptcy? Are the residents to be moved out of Detroit or something? Will Detroit be razed over and turned into farmland?
If only r11, if only.
Detroit will NEVER be president, now.
Some cities just aren't meant to sustain a growth trajectory. Is there no way to "slim down" Detroit in a responsible way. I mean, look at Bonn, Germany. Once the capital of West Germany, it now doesn't even register as a main European town. Yet I doubt it is collapsing into chaos.
Then all of their current officials should be removed from office and replaced since they obviously don't know what they're doing. Time to clean house.
It's likely that wealthy Chinese will come in and turn it into one of their ghost cities. Or, they will raze everything and like you said, turn it into farmland.
Americans don't want Detroit. It's a failed memory. But immigrants don't care about it's history and will put it to good use.
R11 That already has been happening. There's a big urban farming movement happening there because the city is made up of VAST EXPANSES of unoccupied, decaying houses and other VAST EXPANSES of flattened land.
Detroit is not going to attract any American investors. No one wants to eat lettuce "grown in Detroit."
It's also too fucking cold and sounds ugly. I've never been there, but it sounds grey, cold, ugly and desolate.
I imagine the land there is soaked in toxins and pollutants. I would not eat anything I knew was grown there.
R10, even more frightening is the fact that the DIA got Howdy because it has one of the best collections of puppets in the USA- The McPharlin Collection. You just know the auction houses are salivating at the prospects. The notion that the works or art will go to other museums is false. The art will go to the highest bidder, which is very likely a collector. The art may not even stay in the USA.
R21 there could be a fight over the art given a recent area-wide tax that was approved. The funding wasn't just City of Detroit or patron-based anymore so the non-Detroit areas that pay could have a reasonable claim in protecting it.
Why doesn't some libertarian consortium take it over and show us how it works in real life.
great idea, since we know what democrats did to the city.
It's a shame that art in a public museum will just be sold off to Russian oligarchs and oil sheikhs.
So what now? Detroit is sold off to corporations? Will anyone want to buy it?
Fuck it, I'll buy it.
Just heard on NPR they're assigning the blame going all the way back to "the turn of the century"- not this one- the OTHER one.
R22, I understand that, but at the same time it puts the shaping of the collection in the hands of the public. Unfortunately, the brand names with bragging rights will win. In other words, save the Picasso and the Rubens, sell the puppets.
Does Aretha Franklin still live there?
So where did the population move to?
Detroit was like Vegas in that it was a heterosexual defined city, and we know where that leads--to ruination.
Folks, the ugly truth is that straights ruin everything they touch. And the most homophobic places are always the shittiest--why is that?
I wonder what the next city to topple will be?
I'm not in Detroit, R30, but I think the migration patterns are similar to those here in St. Louis, another city that has lost more population (as a percentage of its total in 1950) than Detroit.
First, middle class blacks started fleeing the city for the suburbs. Whites in the surburbs went to suburbs further out when blacks started moving in (white flight).
I'm sure when urban blacks started leaving Detroit for Dearborn and other Wayne County suburbs, whites in those area moved to suburbs futher out in Macomb and Oakland counties.
R30, the suburbs. "Detroit" is now the suburbs and the city is a barren wasteland.
They're still working on us, R23.
I got out while the gettin' was good.
[quote]It's also too fucking cold and sounds ugly. I've never been there, but it sounds grey, cold, ugly and desolate.
I've been there on business. Some of the decaying architecture (which they call "ruin porn") is stunning and Ozymandias-like in scope. There are dozens of gorgeous buildings in Downtown alone.
There's a whole little district of Mies van der Rohe townhouses just outside Downtown -- it's called Lafayette Park, and it's really stunning.
What struck me the most is miles and miles of abandoned houses... and then you come across one little block that's just barely hanging in. My tour guide said the neighbors in these little pockets would mow the houses around them, trying to stave off squatters and people who would break in to steal copper or whatever. But even the abandoned houses have great bones.
Hey, don't the Japanese need to relocate their whole island because of Fukashima?
They're neat, clean, quiet, and as neighbors they get such 'glowing' reviews.
What's on its iPod?
There are several factors that have contributed to Detroit's demise:
- White and black flight/postwar suburbanization ... now exurbanization (building suburbs of suburbs)
- "Redlining" (racial segregation due to restrictive government housing policy)
- Freeway construction that destroyed neighbourhoods, bisected the city, and resulted in the demise of an expansive streetcar system
- The globalization of the auto industry, movement of factory jobs first to the US South, then Mexico, now Asia
- Lack of a diversified local economy
- Sprawl - Detroit's total area far exceeds that of comparable US cities - it's a city comprised of single-family detached homes
- Ground pollution and miles of abandoned industrial "brown zones" that will be difficult to redevelop/repurpose
- Corrupt and dysfunctional local government
- Lack of regional planning between the city, its suburbs, and the state
In addition to r39's excellent list I would add that Detroit really isn't the "hub" of anything; successful secondary cities are hubs of regions (Denver - the Mountain States; Chicago - the Midwest; Atlanta - the South, etc.) And it's not a gateway city like Seattle is to the Far East and Miami to Latin America. There really is very little reason for such a large city to be located in that corner of Michigan.
[quote]BEAVER have returned to Detroit. BEAVER.
Is this somehow connected to MichFest?
Let's let Ontario annex it.
I agree with what another poster said on another thread - us gays should turn it into a gay mecca. Property is cheap and it would be a shame to see all those beautiful old buildings get torn down.
No surprise, the city's run by Democrats. They've run out of money to pay for the "free" social programs.
No thanks, r42.
We took it from you in the War of 1812 but then let you take it back once we got a good look.
No to any bailout. Collect it back from the politicians that stole from the city and there are many. Seize their property, bank accounts, boats cars, personal property.
repubs know how to bust a city dry as well but the Dems have cornered the market on death by social engineering.
Actually the city is run by Republicans and always has been. They run the banks that refused to lend any money, they run the companies that fled to the suburbs then Mexico, and they run the state, who is behind this whole gambit.
As for libertarians, they've been running wild there for ten years without making any substantive improvements.
It tried to lure film productions in with huge tax breaks but nobody on crews wanted to have to LIVE there. Oz: The Great and Powerful is the last big movie to shoot there.
it's Demo land. Run by democrats, inhabited by democrats, and looted by democrats.
You know nothing about Detroit R50.
I live in the area and I can tell you it is a multifaceted issue. There's corruption but also a whole lot of policy issues designe to protect industry have come back to bite the city in the butt.
They refused to put in a solid transportation system and any attempt to do so was always blocked as a means of protecting the precious auto industry. So now they have people who rely on public transportation that don't have a reliable means of getting to work and can't afford to keep a car in the city moving out to suburbs where they can live with family and feel safer walking to work. Or people who just feel that it isn't worth it to commute and they would rather find a job closer to the subs where they live.
The next thing the brilliant city government did in response was initiate laws that said if you worked for the city government you had to live in the city. People either started finding jobs elsewhere or cheating that requirement by claiming residence where they don't actually live.
The governor is a tea party nut sack and used the recall election to put his token Bing in the mayor's office and any government official that actually tries to get anything done magically finds themselves the target of a corruption scandal. It's SOP for this place. They got rid of Jerry Oliver, they got rid of every democratic leaning federal judge, and they continue to rip up the school board to suite their own interests and financial gain.
Blacks turn cities to shit!
RIP. US is stumbling. It's jobs, period. Work on the people, give them livelihood.
But no, that would be 'big government.' Socialism! Hand outs!
Educating the resource-poor there in varied skills, even public infrastructure build-up, would be more fruitful than arms spending.
Destroying the living wage was counter-productive. So long, Detroit. Help is not on the way.
Something like half the homes in the city are running a home based business. It is already a kind of libertarian paradise.
It's OFFICIALLY the LARGEST MUNICIPAL BANKRUPTCY IN US HISTORY.
I'm sure Obama will be blamed.
Well, get ready for a Republican takeover in 2016 from the presidency to all of Congress -- Congressional takeover will happen next year.
I hadn't posted on here in ages but thanks for the reminder of why r53. This place is racist as hell.
r48, blacks ruined Detroit!!
[quote] The next thing the brilliant city government did in response was initiate laws that said if you worked for the city government you had to live in the city.
Chicago's had that law for decades.
R57 needs to wake up from that dream he's having.
it will be all Republican but what will that accomplish for the average Joe?
Less money for infrastructure, education, etc.
If people vote simply on impulse due to democratic failings we are really sunk.
Right now--we need to discuss our options and be very thoughtful about it all.
r61, you know he is correct!
Yes, but Chicago also has reliable in-city transportation. Imagine living in a city where the republican led government has created islands of isolation by buying off residents and removing bus stops then having to decide between staying and taking a convoluted three hour bus ride to work where you have to walk about a mile from stop to stop or quitting said job and moving out of the city.
It's even worse for kids because there is no school bus system they have to rely on city transportation and every year the damn city government redoes the busing system to remove even more bus stops. Then they have the nerve to complain that parents aren't sending their kids to school. It is all ass backward.
Voice of the Night, you can have Fuseli's Night Mare as long as I get Raeburn's portrait of the Earl of Buchan. Mmmm...
So many great paintings there; it makes me sick at heart.
you make a GREAT point regarding public transportation and maintain a work force.
It BLOWS MY MIND that the wealthy never consider how people travel throughout their communities.
Case in point: Jerry Jones builds that state-of-the-art stadium in Dallas however there is no public transportation available to that site. How can so much money be poured into a project without considering basic transportation?
Removing bus stops is not just a repub thing, democrats love to isolate the "others" who do not drive or have access to cars.
Even the bay area has lousy bus service but brags about its BART system, which honestly is far too frightening to travel on for much of the city but tough luck for us, eh?
Detroit is so far gone, I think the best thing to do now would be to tear down all the abandoned, decaying buildings and just let nature re-claim the land. Turn it into a national park or a nature preserve or something.
Rome bounced back. But it took several centuries.
But was Rome, at the depth of the Dark Ages, as far gone as Detroit is now? IIRC, it was down to a few thousand people at the lowest, living among the glorious ruins.
Detroit may be the largest bankruptcy filing under Chapter 9 ...to date...but there are more to come. Yes, there has been colossal mismanagement, and corruption and bad investments, etc. But that is only a small part of the story of this massive FAIL.
Detroit is tied to the auto industry. But if you don't think NAFTA, Wall Street, predatory lending, the financial crisis and the mess George Bush gave us affected Detroit's financial viability you are living in dreamland.
We stabilized the financial services and the banks, we stabilized the auto industry, but we have done nothing at all to really "fix" the fragile financial condition of state governments, cities, counties and public school systems all over the country that are teetering on the brink, or who have already filed for bankruptcy.
Before you get smug and point fingers at Detroit, please recognize that, in spite of the so-called recovery, the unwillingness of this Congress to invest in a comprehensive jobs program, or to rebuild crumbling infrastructure, or to strengthen our manufacturing base, or to increase the minimum wage, is putting all of us in jeopardy.
Detroit should be taken over by the county. All these corrupt politicians and thieves should be thrown to the wolves. They need a city manager who understands how to run a city, and let the Mayor be a figure head.
My home town and a shit hole. I left when I was 18 over 40 years ago. I could see no future there. I live in No. California. My idiot family are all still there and miserable. They could leave. I don't know why they stay. I refuse to return for any reason. Detroit haunts me in my nightmares. I did go back to see my Mom while she was alive but now that she is gone, nothing will make me go back. Ever!
[quote]Imagine living in a city where the republican led government
EPIC FAIL. Are you a product of the Detroit Public School system? Detroit's had five straight decades of Democratic mayors.
[quote]I live in No. California.
Hopefully not in Vallejo or Stockton (also bankrupt.)
Detroit has had Democratic mayors since 1961.
That's pre-Bush, pre-everything.
Detroit is a democratic- socially engineered nightmare.
Personally, I see no difference between Dems and Repubs.
Not these days. All are corrupt.
Watch the stock markets tomorrow.
[quote]Personally, I see no difference between Dems and Repubs.
How so? Break it down for us.
I PUT A CURSE ON Y'ALLL! AHAHAHAHAHAHA! AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
r74 wrote this:
[quote]It's also too fucking cold and sounds ugly. I've never been there, but it sounds grey, cold, ugly and desolate.
Troll-dar them, and look through the previous three pages. It's a Freeptard.
I live in Ann Arbor, but born and raised in Detroit. It breaks my heart that the city has to file for bankruptcy, but for those of us who do care for the city, realize that this is what is needed to help it recover. I think Detroit will make significant strides in the coming decade to remove itself from this embarrassing situation.
However, I'm concerned with the type of people who have been "managing" the city... they are ignorant, greedy, and selfish. Detroit needs a new kind of mayor, be it a female, a non-black, or a republican, SOMEONE very different with a new attitude and a serious commitment to make Detroit a strong city once again.
Finally, they better not touch a goddamn piece of art at the Detroit Institute of Arts. That museum is primarily the ONLY world renowned cultural place that brings visitors to Detroit. I know that other museums are kind of salivating right now at the prospect of buying works of art from the DIA, but now more than ever, the DIA needs to remain completely intact to help keep the spirit of the city alive.
r72 you obviously don't live here and have no idea what I am talking about so you are the one who has failed republicans at the state level are constantly initiating state policies that rip at the city of Detroit. The mayor's office has been nothing but a dummy position for years. Try passing reading comprehension before you critique posts made by other people.
I have a very recent Detroit story.
A couple weeks ago I moved from Portland to take a job in IT in Detroit. I didn't want to go, but it was an area I would like experience in, and I figured I could stand anything for a year or so. The job was to start Jul 1st.
I moved into one of the converted warehouses near the bridge to Canada and on the riverfront.
When I called the leasing office before moving, they sent me beautiful pics. They said it was geared toward "young professionals and artists". The place is only three years old. I could get a month to month lease if it didn't work out. But still, it cost 2100 to move in. I could never have afforded such a huge loft in PDX, so I thought what the heck.
I lasted exactly three days.
My next door neighbors were gang-bangers who blasted rap, pounded on the walls, and screamed and yelled at the same time. There would be at lease 20 of them in there coming and going. I guess they sleep during the day.
I complained multiple times to the management. I recorded audio.
I did not sleep for three nights.
In desperation I called the police dispatch to see if they could enforce a noise ordinance (which you can do in PDX and Indy). The dispatcher was an A-A woman. She could hear the noise and offered her condolences and talked to me for about 20 mins. She said that all I could do is what she did, and move out of Detroit.
There were other problems: the floors were freshly varnished the day before I was to take residence and I had to spend 2 nights in a hotel on my dime. Still the varnish smell was sickening.
There was no loft ladder, no clicker for the garage (I had to go on a waiting list for both). There was no refrigerator or stove, and I had to beg to get them installed. There was garbage everywhere, broken windows, giant holes in the property, and a posting above the mailboxes about toxins from an oil refinery explosion in the back of the property.
There was a smell of garbage that was permeating my furniture and skin, and I think it was from the neighbors. (When I was moving in I was told the unit across the hall with a view of the river would be unavailable for a month b/c it was "unhygienic".) There was no lighting in my end of the hall, so even during the day it was dark.
I was told the unit had ATT internet. Instead I had to get Dish network installed with a 2 year contract, which I cancelled on move out, costing me another 700.
I had to rent a truck and pay for movers, another 400 or so.
I am getting a "maybe" from the management about my 1300 deposit back, forget about the first month rent.
Supposedly the developer is putting up these lofts to attract IT workers for Quicken etc. (I was with a very small firm.) But by law they have to accept Section 8. They get 30 days move out notice if they violate the rules. I could not last 30 days. I felt they were targeting me to move out.
I could go on, but I'll just post the pics below.
Not to mention the air actually stinks. It stinks! I guess they pile up the garbage and it sits somewhere before incineration. And a weird stinky steam comes out of all the sewer covers.
I turned down the job after one day. My nearest relative is 4 hours away and a commute wasn't doable.
If the people of Detroit tear things down as soon as others try to build something up, Detroit as a city is doomed.
I am getting my white ass back to Portland ASAP.
I did that R77.
R74, et al., is also trolling @ the "Michael Moore Files For Divorce" thread with this post (among others):
[quote]he talks too much for a fattie.
What a [italic]fascinating[/italic] comment!
it's all Bush's fault and these poor thugs are victims!
Detroit has failed as a social engineering experiment and it's time to move on.
When you allow legions of grown men to not accept normal, regular responsibility you bankruptcy.
and any black person who defends that is self-loathing and has no pride.
[quote]And it's not a gateway city like Seattle is to the Far East and Miami to Latin America. There really is very little reason for such a large city to be located in that corner of Michigan.
You couldn't be more wrong.
Detroit is situated on a major international shipping waterway between Great Lakes connecting to the Atlantic. It has plenty of water and good agricultural land amid a large regional population. The name means "the strait" in french. It's decimation is purely due to politics.
Now Las Vegas, Phoenix...those are cities that should not be. When water and oil become scarce they will dry up and blow away.
why am I wrong?
A man who has been over 300 pounds for most of his life is not mentally stable. He is undisciplined and out of control.
It's like listening to a junkie prattle on and on about his opinions.
FF R74/R82 - FREEPER TROLL!
Can you go just star a blog or something r84? No one here wants to read your hateful rambling.
If I were 300 plus pounds for most of my manhood then I would
a) admit to a problem
b) fix the fucking problem
c) not get on camera yammering about issues
Detroit and Michigan will be fine in the long run. Access to fresh water is going to be a huge issue in the future, and Michigan is literally surrounded by it.
As long as Robocop's around, Detroit will be just fine!
speaking of films that need a sequel...
R80, I definitely feel for you and I'm sorry your brief experience in Detroit sucked to an almighty high. it pains me to say that most dwellings that "have" to offer Section 8 can be ruined by that lot as most of those people simply have a rent mentality and do not respect property at a discount.
Like I said in my previous thread, I live in Ann Arbor, about 40 miles East of Detroit, and I only go to Detroit, just off of 8 Mile Rd, to see my sister. I drive downtown to take the tunnel to Canada. and I also visit the DIA. Other than that, my time in Detroit is very limited.
Travel safe back to Portland.
The border crossings in SE Michigan, including the bridge in Detroit, are the busiest commercial trade land border crosspoints in the country (and Canada is our biggest trading partner).
That's correct R91! Detroit will survive this. And with a new Int'l Bridge being built a couple miles South from the Ambassador bridge, a lot more international commerce will flow more freely through Detroit/Windsor, Ont.
If I must say, a major bonus in living in SE Michigan, IS the ease and access to another country, Canada.
Now all we need is someone like Bloomberg to pour money into that valuable river front area and one day, Detroit can be called, New Detroit.
r60, NYC has a residency requirement of living in the five boroughs or on Long Island and a few counties north of the city. Government employees can commute 50 miles from the suburbs, but aren't permitted to live in Jersey City, a ten-minute PATH train ride across the Hudson to the Garden State.
[quote]There's a whole little district of Mies van der Rohe townhouses just outside Downtown -- it's called Lafayette Park, and it's really stunning.
Mies van der Rohe = Battery Humans. Who the fuck wants to preserve concrete hell? He, Gropius and Le Corbusier can fuck right off for the urban blight they have inflicted under the guise of modern architecture.
Now it is time to call Colbyco, Denver-Carrington won't help, trust me, and ask some help. I am loving caring woman, who loves to help my city, if the price is right.
Just saw some pics of empty abandoned buildings in Denver. Looks so sad.
[quote]empty abandoned buildings
As opposed to the fully occupied abandoned buildings?
Detroit is experiencing the same fucked up weather as Chicago. It's going to have the same weather as Louisiana in a few years.
I still think Datalounge should get me a job in St. Paul/Minneapolis in accounting/operations.
About me me me: love Microsoft Excel, short walks on a beach, gardens, trashy reupholstery, and fur-back gays.
I do this with all the love I possess for my data loungers.
Here are my best Detroit homes for sale. Warning: It's Trulia and the site is very slow:
Detroit made a huge mistake eons ago by relying on the auto industry to keep itself alive.
Cleveland Ohio government and businesses were smart enough to find something other than steel (medicine, for example) before the steel mills left, and Cleveland has become again a very vibrant city. The National Senior Games (an event with more athletes than the last Olympics) are here this week and the Gay Games are here next year. Detroit thought that cars would be their only need and they rae paying dearly for it.
BTW, living by one of the Great Lakes is a huge plus and as many other states whine they don't have enough fresh water, Great Lakes states and cities will be the envy of people in the future.
This one meets four criteria: relatively low crime, fireplace, brick exterior, and NOT a short sale:
I remember so many great underground parties there late 80's/early90's, house and techno. But it was always dangerous and it has been for the last 30 years. They didn't call Murder City for nothing.
The future for Detroit is pretty bleak. The next major domino to fall may well be Chicago, I'm deeply sorry to say.
R97 Good you got the point.
Detroit is such a vast city, despite its current underpopulated character. Link is to a map showing how Detroit can easily envelop the area of Boston, San Francisco, and Manhattan.
Of course, this only makes the problem worse. Those three cities have a combined population in excess of 3 million people; Detroit now has maybe 680,000, and was never larger than 2.1 million.
It's sad watching Detroit die. I grew up in the rust belt and I've seen how a city can whither away and die when industry pulls out.
It's not a Detroit problem, it's an American problem.
R107 lovely, good? Am I looking same pics?
Make that fat ex crook mayor Kwame pay back the millions he stole. Carpet bombing should take care of the 80,000 abandoned structures and then make all of the welfare recipients clean up the mess.
please get up we love you detroit
[bold] Detroit bankruptcy filing unconstitutional, must be withdrawn [/bold]
LANSING — An Ingham County judge says Thursday's historic Detroit bankruptcy filing violates the Michigan Constitution and state law and must be withdrawn.
(More at link)
I think the solution to Detroit is to break it up into six cities. Each one individually would be stronger than the whole.
And the central city would reap a whirlwind of investment.
F&F for r111 & 113. This is the attitude that brought Detroit to ruin.
I hope no one is stupid enough to think that the Michigan constitution and Michigan law can trump federal bankruptcy statutes.
Of course it can R120. The state creates cities and governs them.
Blacks destroy cities!!
Detroit's long-time motto:
"Speramus meliora; resurget cineribus."
(Motto of Detroit: "We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes.")
I have friends who live in a very nice suburb, outside of Detroit. Gay couple, quite well off. Have their home values gone way down ? Can't imagine all is rosy in the lovely, outlying areas if the city has no real 'there' there. Know nothing about the city , area. Anyone (realtor, homeowner) know ?
JAY Z, buy it for me honey, pretty please
[quote]"We hope for better things; it will arise from the ashes.")
Wouldn't that be more appropriate for Phoenix?
Detroit has not collapsed, as long as MELINDA BROWN DUNCAN lives there! Baby!
Michigan's state motto is unbelievably stupid: if you seek a pleasant peninsula, look around you. In Latin.
Turn the land into cotton fields... Just a thought..
When Philadelphia had serious money problems, the state stepped in and had to approve the city's budget each year. Why doesn't Michigan step in and take control?
The state did - the Governor is the one who approved the bankruptcy filing. The city leadership was just ho-humming along totally in denial.
You have to understand the dynamics involved. The City of Detroit is almost 80% black. Any attempted interventions are taken as racially motivated efforts to end Detroit's (i.e. black) homerule.
There have been members of Detroit's city council who have publicly stated they don't care if they wipe every bit of white culture out of the city.
Detroit has had a strong black separatist movement for some time. The Nation of Islam was also founded here.
If what R131 says is true, Detroit will soon be known as The American Congo
[quote]They refused to put in a solid transportation system and any attempt to do so was always blocked as a means of protecting the precious auto industry.
The fucking auto industry has ruined pretty much everything in this country. Nobody wanted to think of the future so they just kept caving into them.
Now we have shitty rail systems (anyone outside of the East Coast ever take a train anywhere?)and nearly nonexistent public transportation between and in major cities. All because of Detroit and the auto industry.
R133 if the rail systems weren't shitty to start with they would still be popular - like they are in Europe. Even Canada's Via Rail is light years nicer than Amtrak.
The City of Detroit, on the other hand, can't even competently run a bus system and that has nothing to do with the automakers.
The rail system was shit-canned by Detroit because they wanted Americans to buy cars and NOT use rail.
So they used their $$ to pressure the politicians to limit passenger rail - and this is what we have.
Fuck them. If they'd spent their money improving the rail system instead of convincing everyone to use cars, we'd be a lot better off today as a country. And probably would not be in Iraq.
I was born in the 60s and I can't remember a time since childhood that Detroit was ever considered anything but a center of the worst imaginable urban decay and frightening violence. So it's amazing to me that it has been able to survive as long as it has. Similarly, when I was a kid Cleveland has a bad rep as a rusted, toxic wasteland, but unlike Detroit, Cleveland has been able to turn it around. It seems like Detroit's safety issue and its permanently corrupt government has been the big difference.
The auto industry was saved by Obama. He's to blame them right?
Happy 312th Birthday Detroit!
I think R131 is on to something. Coleman Young was mayor of the city for 20 years from 1974 to 1994. The news media reported constantly that various governmental crime agencies were investigating him. Young said back at the time he was first elected that his goal was to have Detroit be the first black owned and black run city in the country. He was totally into black power.
It took 131 posts to get to Coleman Young?
Young scared the shit out of white people - on purpose - and he was responsible for the city/suburb and city/state antagonism which defined Detroit for the past half-century.
131 is right. The city council is beyond racist and don't bother hiding it.
Unreal. The Detroit City Council is focusing on the Treyvon Martin case and trying to ensure that Zimmerman is tried in a civil case.
Good lord, the Detroit City Council actually has members who come to work dressed in traditional African costume.
Yes. That's true R143. There are lots of people all over town looking like that from what I've seen on TV.
[quote]Cleveland has a bad rep as a rusted, toxic wasteland, but unlike Detroit, Cleveland has been able to turn it around. It seems like Detroit's safety issue and its permanently corrupt government has been the big difference.
Well, actually, there's another BIG difference between Cleveland and Detroit which made Cleveland able to turn itself around.
Since Detroit is dying- slowly, but inexorably- and will soon be forced to sell the DIAs artwork due to bankruptcy, why not make it an experiment?
Many sections are war zones comparable to Baghdad or Islamabad. Many homes are vacant and in need of repair. Parts of downtown have amazing buildings that are falling apart from disrepair. The police and hospitals won't even respond to 911 calls in parts of the city. The government has stopped work on the downtown jail and seeks bids from private investors. Basically the city is FUCKED! The current system will just make it worse.
So, why not make it an independent city state, with no state/federal taxes or regulations or laws, a totally independent entity, governed only by the US Constitution?
They could (if they wished) eliminate all tariffs, make anything they wished "legal tender", decriminalize drugs/gambling/ prostitution, eliminate most taxes and shrink the government to less than 1% of the "GDP" of the city.
If they failed, then "libertarianism" would be discredited.
The reason they won't- because it would prove that a free-market, libertarian system is superior to the socialist/fascist system that we have in the USA.
"Oh my God. I'm back. I'm home. All the time, it was... We finally really did it ... You Maniacs! You blew it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!"
We are switching to the new platform for The DataLounge this weekend. All of our mobile users have been using it for over a week and all first time users have been using it for about a month - which adds up to well over one million users. So we're ready to end this phase of the testing and move everybody to the new site. (more)
And yes, we've changed the look and some of how it operates.
Yes, we know you just *hate* it in well in advance.
Yes, we know we suck.
Yes, we are the biggest suckers that ever sucked.
But it was time for a change and with the huge shift to mobile it was long overdue. We've taken this opportunity not only to update the look but also make major changes under the hood (or "bonnet" if you're either British or pretentious or both). And we have to prepare for 2016 - a presidential election year where we can normally expect to see a 60% jump in traffic (yes, we've seen 5 presidential elections so far…Christ we're old).
The site has a bunch - nay, plethora - of new features which will make the site more usable: better search, the ability to ignore posters and threads, see link previews, to pick up a thread where you left off, spam and malware filtering and more.
If you want you can go explore and see for yourself, Click here.
And while running the tests we've noticed two interesting reactions to the new system - people are spending more time on the site and more people that come stay around longer and look at more stuff. Both good things. Yay!
Possibly we've not slain all the dragons and there will be issues that come up during the switchover. There's a help button in the lower right hand corner of the page which you can use to send us bug reports.
Please include as much information about the hardware (PC, Mac, Tablet, Phone etc), operating system (Windows, Mac OS, Android, iOS etc) and browser (Chrome, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer etc) that you are using as possible to help us replicate and fix the problem.
Please note that complaints about colors, fonts, icons and the like are not "bugs" - they are design choices that we've made and we expect one or two cases of world-class bitching. But they won't actually cause headaches, scurvy, heart attacks, Restless Leg Syndrome, Morgellon's Disease or the vapors (but have your smelling salts at hand just in case).
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