Does anyone else find Batman unlikeable and depressing?
Be it in the movie or the in the comic book. He always appeared very boring,depressing and an all-around unlikeable character. Do you think the franchise would do better if they had replace the main character. I also think Christian Bale was perfect for that character, they are both dreadfully boring.
Batman is represented in many forms. Find an animation that is voiced by Kevin Conroy playing Batman...he captures the character the best, in my opinion.
When I was a boy, the superheroes seemed happier. Nowadays, it seems everybody always has to be brooding. Boring! It's men in capes -- have some fucking fun with it!
Yes. I dislike him greatly, except the campy TV show version, and the "gay" Joel Schumaker ridiculous film, 'Batman Forever.'
He was much better when Dick Grayson took over for him a couple of years back in the comics.
Liked Keaton better. He was as depressed but there was also wit to his performance, and a sense of the manic. He *looked* nuts.
Bale just feels monotonous. And that voice...ugh.
Batman is the only comic I've ever liked. I like my man dark and damaged.
I can't stand the Christopher Nolan or Joel Schumacher versions, but the Tim Burton helmed versions I could watch over and over.
I liked him quite a bit before Crisis on Infinite Earths in the mid-80s; then the writers at DC went overboard in making him fascistic and nasty (inspired by the success of The Dark Knight Returns series by Frank Miller).
Well he's no Superman.
I'm a big fan of the Nolan trilogy. Complicated, dark, explores moral dilemmas, food for thought, but still has heart, Batman still has the heart of a hero, and goodness prevails in the end. So, depressing? Not to me, I found it touching.
I never read any original Batman comics though.
I also loved The Avengers; a big blast of funny, ass-kicking superheroes.
They're very different but each good in its own way. I found Nolan's Batman refreshing because I never knew superheroes could explore darker themes so well, especially in The Dark Knight.
And The Avengers is just the ultimate fun superhero movie.
I think it's very nice that we get such different movies. Something for everybody.
Stop picking on Daddy.
I agree that he's not all that likeable. Bruce Wayne is a rich, arrogant psycho, and none of the Batman villains have ever really caught my imagination.
Superman is really a dullard, but at least he has the truly excellent 1980s films going for him (the first two anyway), Batman has never had a truly good film made about him.
Really, the Marvel superheroes tend to be better written, even if they do tend to whine.
r12, it's obvious that you never read the comic book.
Burton was much like Nolan, but Nolan created a universe not fit for the comic book, which is why he couldn't do most of the iconic villains. Burton was highly influenced by Frank Miller. Burton's films came on the heels of Miller's take. Miller is a big ol right-wing extremist, so picking up on a change in Batman's demeanor, one side being Fascist, is actually pretty accurate.
No, Batman is my favorite comic book hero. He's low key, yes, but intense, persevering, intelligent and always gets his man. What's not to like? I'm with R8 on this.
Batman isn't even a real Superhero which is why it irritates me when people say he's their favorite superhero.
He's one damaged dude who's parent s were killed when he was a kid, with a lot of money and cool gadgets and a bat fetish. Not to mention a questionable relationship with Robin.
HE'S NOT A REAL SUPERHERO!
[quote]I'm a big fan of the Nolan trilogy. Complicated, dark, explores moral dilemmas, food for thought, but still has heart,
It is not complicated, it is very black and white.
Almost all films explore moral dilemmas.
Food for thought? How sad, you must read at a 1st grade level.
Has heart? Oh please.
People who consider comic books worthy of analysis make me sad.
19. I'd say The Dark Knight explores more moral dilemmas, darkness and philosophy with the Joker than any generic art movie.
And if you've seen those movies, yeah, you'd know it has heart. There's the whole exploration of what it means to be a hero that no other superhero movie has come close to when it comes to depth.
20. You're saying a comic book can't be intelligent or have emotional depth? Jeez, you're narrow-minded and judgmental.
The Watchmen comic book has a more clever plot and intelligent writing than most books.
[childish epithet posted by a bigoted tool] queens find Batman uninteresting. Frustrated closeted butch gays find Batman fascinating.
I couldn't stand "The Dark Knight." After two hours of that crap I was like George C. Scott in "Hardcore." TURN IT OOOOAAAUUUUUUUUUGHHHHHHHHHH!
I've enjoyed Scott Snyder's run on Batman. He had a great take on the Joker being the Jester of the King Of Gotham's, Batman's, court. He saw it as his job and the rest of the criminals of Gotham to serve their King.
I agree with the previous poster who commented on Frank Miller's influence of Batman. They've made him a dark, brooding, maverick character that is a foil to Superman.
That was in the mid-80s. They've incorporated different Robins, Batgirl, Dick Grayson as Nightwing and Batman's replacement, and each time they have killed off the characters or found a way to distance Batman from them.
I liked Batman as a character with a high moral code and unparalleled abilities as a human. I always enjoyed seeing his character as similar to Captain America, but he had his utility belt instead of a shield, and Batman was a brilliant detective as opposed to Captain America's unquestioning patriotism.
r23 here - wasn't being bigoted. Just telling it in straight-forward terms.
R26= childish moron.
He's a cartoon people. A cartoon.
Clooney's Batman wasn't depressed.
I'd argue that Clooney's Batman had a much lighter story, and previously mentioned it was an attempt at doing so with Robin and Batgirl also involved in the story.
Batman would no longer be in existence without its gallery of rogues.
Ramblin' time about the possible 2016 film reboot!
A reboot depends on if "The Justice League" film happens, which depends on the success of "Man of Steel". If "Man of Steel" is a success, "Justice League" will come BEFORE a Batman reboot. If "Man of Steel" isn't a success, they go right to the reboot of Batman.
Back in the late 90s, I followed the development of a new Batman reboot religiously. They did exactly what I wanted them to do: do a darker take on the character. Back then "Batman: Year One" was what was being prepped. It later leaked who the studio was considering for the lead role. It was all "Dawson's Creek" young types, and Christian Bale. Obviously, I wanted Bale. Here's the funny thing -- I followed Bale in the 90s as well. His career was in the toilet. I believe his small fan base was dubbed Baleheads. His getting the title role for Nolan's film turned his career around. He went from child actor, to adult film start (non-porn). It's sad that people haven't picked up on that. They think his career was all "American Psycho" pre-Batman Begins. "American Psycho" became a cult classic after the fact. It didn't revive his career at the time.
As for the future of the Batman franchise, I want them to lighten it up again. I got what I wanted: the darker take, now I've had enough. People act as if Nolan is the definitive take on the character, and his films stay true to the comic book. Not true at all. He couldn't do the majority of the iconic characters because they didn't fit into his realistic tone. It didn't stay true to the book. If Nolan has truly retired from the franchise, I'll respect him. "The Dark Knight Rises" screamed THE END. I know Warner Bros wants him to stay on for the next round as consultant. They did this with Burton back in the day too.
Armie Hammer is being groomed for the next Batman.
BTW, I don't take Bale as Batman. I still take him as Christian Bale playing Christian Bale, playing Bruce Wayne. That voice he put on was the worst!
Oh, and about "Justice League"... they're trying to work out the Batman/Superman thing. Bale won't be coming back. Then they wonder about Joseph Gordon-Levitt. Cavill would definitely be Superman, as if the JL movie even happens, it would have to be due to the success of "Man of Steel" which would thus then be getting a sequel. As far as I understand, JL keeps getting scrapped, then back on the table, even as of now.
JL goes back pre-Batman Begins, even pre-Batman: Year One.
I really wish Anne Hathaway didn't play Catwoman, err, Selina Kyle. Just wanted to throw that out there.
Like after the previous four Bat films, with Nolan's first film, they did a new villain. I doubt we'll see Joker, Catwoman, Two-Face, etc, at least not in the first reboot film. Methinks Penguin or Riddler could be first up. They seem to be willing to go for villains the public isn't well-versed with. That's cool.
Heath Ledger + Brittany Murphy = Joker and Harley Quinn. They died one year apart. What a lost opportunity.
No, Batman rules along with Spiderman, Superman, and Wolverine
[quote]People who consider comic books worthy of analysis make me sad.
It actually takes a lively, erudite and creative mind to write interestingly about comic books and their wider role in the culture. There are some comic-book scholars who are also schooled in history, sociology, psychology, anthropology and other fields. The playwright Joan Schenkar, in her biography of Patricia Highsmith, also wrote an interesting section about the "Golden Age of American Comics", in which she touches on the Jewish roots of many of the creators, their need to create superheroes after being traumatized by WWII, antisemitism, etc. There's a lot to be analyzed if you look for it.
It's the dystopia that disturbs me the most about Batman. He's not a hero who vanquishes the threat to a peaceful society. Instead, he's an exterminator who simply keeps the tide of filth at bay for an undeserving populace.
So it works for/frightens me when we have such a dysfunctional government, high unemployment, and little hope. The 80s and the 00s/10s are appropriate.
Kevin Conroy is the only actor (even though he's a voice actor) who understood Batman/Bruce Wayne.
You mean Ben Affleck? Yes, entirely.
I never got into the Dark Knight stuff , but I loved the 1992 "Batman Returns" with Danny Devito, Christopher Walken and Michelle Pfeiffer. That was very black comedy and allegedly had to censored to get a PG13 rating at the time instead of an R. If I recall correctly, it was the scene where people were set on fire that went on for a couple minutes and was kind of intense.