Why aren't there more out celebrities in hollywood?
It's the 21st century for crying out loud, what's going to happen to you when you come out of the closet. Nothing. So why don't more celebrities come out of the closet?
Because then fraus wouldn't be able to fantasize Romance-novel-style about their favorite Hollywood leading men.
BECAUSE THEY ARE A BUNCH OF FUCKING PUSSIES. HOLLYWOOD IS FULL OF HYPOCRITES. PRAISING US IN MOVIES AND TV SHOWS AND THEN HAVING THE ACTORS PRETEND TO BE STRAIGHT. ANYONE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE BALLS TO COME OUT IS A PIECE OF SHIT. ANYONE WHO LIES ABOUT WHO THEY ARE IS THE WORST EXCUSE FOR A HUMAN BEING. 85-90% OF THE MALE ACTORS IN HOLLYWOOD ARE QUEER. FACT! I AM IN A POSITION TO OUT THEM AND I AM GOING TO BEGIN VERY SOON. I AM GATHERING PROOF SO I WON'T GET SUED.
Switch to decaf R2.
And there are a lot more know than there ever were in the past OP. Things are changing in a big way, just slowly.
it's not the fraus so much as the old guys who run the studios and record companies that can't fathom that it wouldn't be a problem.
NPH was lucky he gad a long term gig when he came out. there is still the question if conservative radio will really support current gay artists.
it's one thing if you are comfortable at a lower level of fame fame but it still remains to be seen if someone starting out..out can make it big.
i don't get the stars who have made it big, have a nest egg for life but still stay closeted.
It is the teenage girls.
Those in charge of the entertainment industry think the entire world is made up of 7 billion teenage girls.
I am in a position to know who is and who isn't and I, like a previous poster, am securing lots of photographic evidence (some that I have already is quite shocking). There won't be many closet cases left in Tinseltown by the time I am through. Nine times out of ten, if Datalounge whispers that an actor is gay/bi, then they usually/always are. I'm out to prove it.
Gee, what a unique thread op!
I think it has more to do with the "steroetypes" that are associated with gay people. As accepting as people claim to be, there is still a negative connotation attatched to us. Thats why you so often hear "I love my/the gays","my gay friend", or whatever. I know it sounds absurd, but I get offended by such comments. Its no different than someone saying..."thats my BLACK friend" or I like Black people". Its all about respect, and we will never reach that level until we earn and demand that respect. In order to do that, we have to stop perpetuating the stereotypes. I actually stopped speaking to my best friend since childhood simply because I became tired of being introduced as her "gay" best friend. She didnt get it...and most people dont.
r8, after reading that, I still don't get what specifically is bugging you.
I don't know if it really has anything to do with actors being out R8, but I definitely agree with you.
[quote] Thats why you so often hear "I love my/the gays","my gay friend", or whatever.
Annoys the shit out of me. I don't solely blame the straight women who it, I also blame the walking cliches who eat that shit up and encourage that kind of behavior.
Honestly, it's because they don't want to start an avalanche. Because ALL Hollywood actors are gay, gay, gay!
Seriously, think of your high school theater groups...all gay! Hollywood is full of these people who have learned how to BUTCH IT up for the public. They have fake back-stories created to make them look like they were the all American jock, or popular with the ladies... anything but a theater homo.
And if they're caught having done a play or two in High School, the story always is to get the girl of their dreams, or because theater needed a jock type or some such bullshit.
They're fucking actors! They can portray any image they want and sell it to the public. Although, some are much better at it than others. For instance, Sean Penn, Ed Harris... they're gooooood!
But there are some, take Cliff Robertson, for example, who, although they butch it up, if you look closely enough, they're prancing through it all.
Watch this movie called "Shoot" from 1976. You'll see what I mean.
Good movie, btw.
r9, r10....my point being...being gay is percieved as being less than human...a joke...a cliche'. How can anyone...especially a celebrity...expect to be taken seriously if secretly theyre viewed as a joke or a "token".
Look at all the already out celebrities, business people, whoever...the first thing referenced isnt their accomplishments...its that theyre gay. Once you label yourself...you pigeonhole yourself. Its like being a whore...no matter what else you do in life, youll always be thought of as a whore. Being gay is not some novelty...its no different than being fat, skinny, tall, short, etc...
Until we stop allowing ourselves to be labeled we will never gain true acceptance.
What's worse, R13, if all the actors came tumbling out, Hollywood would become one big fucking joke. I mean, more than it already is.
Because the straight moviegoers need to believe the person onscreen would want them, should they ever accidentally meet.
Its all about the art of illusion. The perfect example...Marilyn Monroe...undoubtedly the "ultimate" sex symbol, yet reportedly, she loathed the act of sex. Its the same with gay celebrities...they sell an image...an image that has to appeal to the masses in order to become profitable. While coming out might liberate them, and they could be role models...it would also limit their earning potential and marketability. Most celebrities are not in the business to become role models...theyre in the business to become rich and famous to feed their narcissism. If you were a celebrity, would you rather have the gay community admire you, or the entire world ?
I'm wondering the same thing, op. There's gays on TV and even Frank Ocean has made a little difference in the music world (he still can't get airplay though!) But there are NO out actors in the movies. Except Jodie Foster who probably won't get big parts again.
There is a lot of money made keeping the Hollywood closet going. Publicists, Managers, Agents all prey on the fear factor for higher commissions.
Don't think actors are the only ones earning a paycheck in Hollywood.
H Y P O C R I T E S . . .
Hollywood is over run with them.
I think being closeted after a certain age (18) should be a crime.
I know, op. I hardly go to films anymore, certainly not romantic ones. They are so fucking fake. Unbelievable on multiple levels.
It's all about the studios "right to make money".
For instance, mommy won't take Jimmy to the multiplex if she knows James Bond or Superman is gay.
Or at least, that is the studios reasonning.
I wonder if people are more open-minded that they are given credit for.
Also, a lot of people state : It's the fraus! It's the teenage girls!
Well, do people really need to think that he object of their fantasy could reciprocate ?
What about the teenage boys (and their fathers) ?
It seems to me they are the first public the studios cater to nowadays.
Would they still have followed Rambo, Terminator, Harry Potter, The Avengers,etc, if the main actor was known as gay ?
Maybe. Maybe not. I sincerly don't know.
(After all the actor who incarnated Gandalf and Magneto is gay; didn't offend anyone)
Hollywood, Sports, Politics - it's all fantasy for chumps, and they know it. They are all pretending to be something they are not.
Because they're self-serving cunts and they know or are under the belief they wouldn't get to the top if they were honest.
If too much is known about a star's personal life it ruins the suspension of disbelief/the fantasy of people wanting to be with them - i.e. how can we buy a guy we know IRL is openly gay be believable as a straight romantic lead. And most are not great actors on a level with Ian McKellen where they'd always get work regardless.
In short they do it because they won't get the best (usually straight) roles and don't want to be stuck being typecast as generic best gay friend or in the gay cinema ghetto.
It will never change. But now with the internet the difference is they have nowhere to hide.
James Bond will never be a Figure Skater.
I'm just surprised that there aren't even any gays in supporting roles.
R2 you can start by naming some names here anonymously. We won't sue you.
For all of the PR to the contrary, Hollywood is owned and operated by the 1 percenters and is very Republican.
People in Hollywood get off on dirty tricks, getting paid to tell lies, ordering us to worship shattered sluts and carved up closet cases, as well as implicitly degrading their audiences with dull, crude, stolen material.
I will not pay for it anymore.
Because the openly gay community is miniscule and can't muster the power or will to change anything, so the closeted skate by with nary a care.
I'm coming around to the idea that we may never see an openly gay leading man/action star.... Does anyone think that gay films could possibly become mainstream one day? Would straight people support mainstream gay films with great story-lines? I'm sure this is also very unlikely.
Because not one of your mothers held baby you in her arms and said "Oh I hope he turns out gay." They want a Star, but not a Gay Star.
These Hollywood celebrities you bash so easily have much more to lose than you.
Because a lot of them use the frau card but in truth they are not comfortable with their own sexuality. I really believe a lot of Hollywood type people are like that. They need to grow a pair and own up to who they are. There are actors in the closet who are are over and yet they still won't come out.
R30, My Beautiful Laundrette did pretty well for itself back in the 80s, winning all kinds of awards. I don't know why the same thing couldn't happen today.
Because of people like r2
What r31 says is t r u e.
The truth is there aren't more out celebs in Hollywood because they're greedy and only care about fame and money rather than being true to themselves or trying to make a difference. If all of the gay celebs in Hollywood came out at once, all the bearding and closeting shit would be over. But since they don't have any fucking guts, this closeting shit will remain just like it's been since the beginning of Hollywood.
The best thing you can do is refuse to waste your money on celebs that you know are closeted and not contribute to their charades. Likewise, always support openly gay actors so that dumb ass Hollywood will realize that gay celebs are bankable too.
and I bravely sign this reply as Anonymous, whilst daring to attack the OP for not signing with his or her real name. Really people, could we get any lamer??
R30 , why not?
But at first, it would have to be very well made. A good film is a good film.
People are used to see gay characters now, and not as caricatures. Yes, mainly on tv. Yes, mainly as supporting charcters.
I think the next step is gay chracters in the main plot. If it's good and that the scenario has a universal appeal, then it won't get ghettoised.
So, not right now, but not very far in the future either.
That is so unrealistic. Rock Hudson and Richard Chamberlin would not have had careers if they had come out young.
The same is true now. Box office is driven by ticket sales, not actors disclosing their sexuality in public forum.
Once an actor finally starts to get work which will support them in the Real World, do you think they want to be unemployed?
Every actor which has tried to come out when they were relatively young stopped getting
[quote]Every actor which has tried to come out when they were relatively young stopped getting work.
Not many have tried. Recent examples, Zachary Quinto, Johnathan Groff, Ezra Miller, and Neil Patrick Harris appear to still be getting work.
R39 = Closet case
Good grief why come out? If someone told me I'd have 90% fewer job oppertunities I'd stay closeted as well.
r40, those aren't exactly hunks or leading man material.
Because it limits the parts they're offered and it limits their box office appeal. I know gay agents who won't take out gay clients.
If you're a gay actor with leading man looks and potential, don't come out or you will be stuck with parts in David DeCoteau movies and soaps.
I don't actually think the audiences are the problem. I think the problem are the studio heads that aren't as "liberal" as they want people to think.
I am not saying society is open-minded, but I think that provided the movie/show is entertaining, even homophobes will ignore the gayness of an actor/actress or even gay character.
They do the same thing with Asians and blacks. They say black people don't sell irrespective of the success of Denzel or Will Smith. They simply don't want to fund quality projects for anyone that isn't straight and white. Hell even white women barely get roles. They mostly just play supporting roles- often times just the girlfriend.
R33, that was an independent film, and a 'foreign film', at that. For whatever reason, Europeans are allowed to be more daring and push more envelopes sexually than Americans.
[quote]If someone told me I'd have 90% fewer job oppertunities...
R2 is insane.
Why aren't there more out major sports athletes? Why aren't there more out clergy? Why aren't there more out soldiers? Why aren't there more out CEOs? Why aren't there more out politicians? The stigma associated with homosexuality is so overwhelming and widespread that is amazing anyone ever comes out.
R2, please start outing these cowardly closeted men. The more that people know about their little "secret", the more likely they may [reluctantly] come out.
not so, r41
The actors mentioned above are not leading men and mostly television stars from regular long running sitcom.
R45, I agree. I think most of Hollywood isn't as liberal as they feel they have to be. I don't think they have a problem with blacks but I do think there is an un spoken problem with homosexuality.
[quote]Does anyone think that gay films could possibly become mainstream one day? Would straight people support mainstream gay films with great story-lines? I'm sure this is also very unlikely.
I think so, yes. Not so long ago films with black leads or about black people didn't extend beyond Shack.
All of the relationship movies are dead in the water these days, plus the lack of charismatic leads.
All of this is a result of the closet.
I know I'll get flamed here, but I've never seen a gay actor, with the possible exception of Clooney, successfully play a straight romantic lead. Same with lesbians. They all look like a variation of Jodie Foster in Maverick.
If Hollywood allowed these people to come out of the closet and pick their roles, parts would open up for younger, straight actors. Gay actors could demand decent, non-stereotyped same sex relationship parts.
Instead, the industry constantly pushes people like Bradley Cooper on us as straight male leads.
The Brits are generally better actors, so at least their closet cases, like Tom Hardy, are more charismatic and believable in straight roles.
r53 Why don't you think Hollywood has a problem with black people. They only use the same 4 black actors. And most of them are not solo-leads unless they are Eddie Murphy, Denzel, Will Smith, and Martin Lawrence.
Hollywood is really a small town. It has a problem with anyone not in the clique.
This includes *any* minority.
Honestly, I think AAs are over-represented in film compared to their population. Hispanics and Asians have more reason to bitch, IMHO.
I am NOT saying there is no racism, particularly on the business side and below the line, but it's unfair to confine racism in Hollywood accusations to black people.
[quote]If Hollywood allowed these people to come out of the closet and pick their roles, parts would open up for younger, straight actors. Gay actors could demand decent, non-stereotyped same sex relationship parts.
Yes, those poor straight actors, it is so hard out there for him. Those gays just have it so much easier and take all the roles.
You're right, gays should just only ever play gay roles. Just like all actors should only play roles exactly like their personality. Hmm, looks like Hollywood will need some doctors and cops moving there that want to be actors.
r57 In my first post I did mention Asians. That said black people are only well represented on TV(11% of roles, while being 12% of the population). That is not the case with movies. And even when they are in movies that are supporting roles.
r58, don't be dickily obtuse.
That's not what I meant. I meant that it would be nice to have a gay actor have the option of playing a romantic/relationship role that wasn't totally forced on them.
Most of those roles are based on charisma and chemistry with co-stars. Having someone in the closet play them is problematic.
At least an gay actor would have the choice, because he could insist on them. If he was out he'd have nothing to lose.
One of the great entertainment quotes was Glenn Frey, quoting Bob Dylan about all the agents, producers, etc: "They fooled me into thinking I had something to protect."
I realize that as a rule, you guys want a straight woman's opinion about as much as you want a case of the clap. but in this specific thread I'm going to give you the distaff reasoning.
Young straight women(under 45)have an implanted bio-chip
which forces them to want to fantasize about romantic leading men. And no, they aren't stupid enough to think they can make it happen IRL, but the next time they fuck their bf or husband, you can bet your bottom dollar it is Brad Pitt(in the 90's),Clooney(because women refuse to entertain the truth of his sexuality)or one of the Hemsworth boys they are fucking. That's the estrogen at work.
I don't think anyone has a problem with Tammy or Huge Jackman in an action flick where desirability is not a factor in the film. As a matter of fact, I predict that now that the word is out, Bradley Cooper's career shapers will attempt to mirror that of Cruise's in the last 15 years.
I completely GET your disdain for the closet, but if a male chooses to pursue a Hollywood career as a leading man, he is knowingly accepting a life in the closet for the duration of said career.
More "seasoned" women such as myself are not as likely to object to an openly gay man playing the love interest, because we are no longer pumping out the estrogen of our youth.
But we no longer matter to casting directors.
R12 that movie came up as a recommendation on my youtube account, now I'm more intrigued.
I love Robertson, fantastic in Charly. I never thought of him being gay but now that you mention it.. he looks like Anthony Perkins as well.
R63, I don't think your that in touch with the tastes if young straight women. They made Taylor Lautner of all gaydar breaking actors a pinup. And Hugh Jackman does have heartthrob status. Clooney, I think is more of an older women (and men) heartthrob and don't know any young people into him.
Being pinned as "that gay actor" probably wouldn't help their job prospects.
Like Matt Bomer for example. People say he lost the Superman role because he was gay. I don't think this is because they were worried that women would find him any less desirable, but the whole media circus surrounding "the gay superman" would take away from the movie itself and turn attending the movie into some sort of litmus test for your support of gay marriage or something.
Nowadays girls, especially teens and maybe right up to fraus are more open -minded when it comes to sexuality. They still fancy guys they know are gay, you better believe it. Then there's that "oh he's good looking he must be gay" meme.
Maybe someone like Luke MacFarlane could test it out. Cavill if he came out would work on looks alone, even if there was no charisma/talent.
I wish there were.
I'm female, straight, and I prefer the men to be gay. Why? No women to honestly and truly be jealous of
Weird way to look at it, but it works for me.
Thank goodness Jimmy Fallon is gay. I'm already jealous of his 'wife'--but I would be devastatingly jealous is he was actually straight. Same with Matty Bomer and Adam Lambert.
I prefer to fantasize with them with other men.
I'm quite sure I'm in the minority with this viewpoint, but most straight men bore me to tears.
Maybe that is all there is. As much as you all would love for Ben Affleck and Matt Damon to be gay, the simple truth is they are not.
Actually, r68's view of preferring to see two men together isn't uncommon. Slash fiction and yaoi are extremely popular among some groups of young women.
Also, once a guy is considered gay, the public looks for all sorts of evidence that he is not quite "manly." His mannerisms, speech, music tastes would then be under intense scrutiny for signs of ef feminancy and non-masculinity. An openly gay actor would have to be exceedingly masculine to be a leading man.
I think speculation sells more than people being sure a certain celebrity is gay.
The most recent example is this Harry Styles guy: people all over internet are all assuming he´s gay and in a relattionship with another band member or with some dj or with whatever guy he is seeing partying and it keeps them interested and searching info on itthrough sites magazines or newspapers. the same with other celebrities like Taylor Lautner or Andrw Garfield. maybe if they come out it´ll lose its mistery aura and they will move to their next guessing
[quote]The most recent example is this Harry Styles guy: people all over internet are all assuming he´s gay and in a relattionship with another band member or with some dj or with whatever guy he is seeing partying and it keeps them interested and searching info on itthrough sites magazines or newspapers.
Harry Styles is fabulous. He manages to drop gay innuendo into all sorts of things he does and doesn't care. His latest Twitter post was a picture of a Scrabble board, which among many words, spelled out 'queer'.
You've gotta love him. Glad he dropped the act with that awful Taylor Swift stunt but sadly no hot young celeb is above bearding for image reasons.
There are hardly any gay men left in gay porn, everyone wants to be bi or straight. So I guess you can imagine Hollywood would be 100 times worse.
[quote]Because they're self-serving cunts and they know or are under the belief they wouldn't get to the top if they were honest.
That's it. They are the ones who want men and women to be drawn to their personal image. In fact they work hard at it.
They know that their fake image is their ace in the hole to beat out the other guy for the part. But the other guy might be a lot better than they are. And like you said there aren't that many Willem Defoes, Gary Oldmans out there.
Do any A-listers have any fucking guts to come out?
[R65] The young girls with damp panties and Taylor Lautner posters are generally clueless as to the sexual orientation of boys who are beautiful. Do you actually think that if TL was to come out tomorrow as gay, those posters would remain on the walls?
We are in complete disagreement re: Jackman. I don't know a woman who believes for a hot second that he is straight. And he surely is not a favorite of the teen/tween set who do not as yet have gaydar.
I will agree that Clooney is now the object of attraction to an older demo. I specified Brad Pitt in the 90's, and I should have done so with GC as well. He certainly WAS a heartthrob in the ER days.
I did not mean to offend with my logic. I was just trying to 'splain why the most desired female demo will not continue to worship a gay matinee idol. YES! She may still respect and support him....but the fantasy factor is ovah.
The problem with gay actors coming out is not teen girls or even women period. It's the male audience.
Studios are afraid that men who identify as straight will be afraid to appear gay if they want to see a movie with an openly gay actor.
Women are much more aware of the possibility of the hot actor being gay than you think.
The problem is really the studios and not so much the audience. I bet if Matt Bomer had been cast as Superman it would have been a hit.
Once male sports figures start coming out of the closet, this will have a big impact, more so than Hollywood leading men. People already suspect Hollywood is gay anyway.
Teen hearthrobs don't need to come out at 16 anyway. But once you hit your late twenties, it is fine.
Did somebody put a gun to your hole to come out [R2]?
Clearly you will never see Justin Timberlake come out. If they go that far, they're totally in Narnia.
It is really sad when a celeb waits till their career is over till they come out. One example is Matt Dallas, pretty but could never act at all. Despite being obviously gay he went on Howard Stern and pretended to have slept with dozens of girls at high school. Would love to know what that was all about, Perez Hilton was involved with outing in those days. Stern mocked his fake deep voice.
America is still extremely homophobic and that is still the biggest market. Europe does not really buy that much American entertainment.
They want to get as many people "into" them as possible. They want men to relate to them as action figures and they want women's lust to keep themselves top of the list of bankable actors.
Since crushes on people you don't know well even in real life is short lived, the celebrity piles it on to make himself as desirable to as many people as possible. Even if he has to lie.
Otherwise after a couple of films, people would just move on to the next actor and they might be just as talented. But that's not what they want, it won't make them rich enough.
Don't forget the emerging foreign market sales in the equation.
Middle America is important, but most real revenue these days is in ancillary sales (DVDs, toys, merch, etc.) and foreign market.
Countries like China and Russia (particularly their totalitarian governments), are not gay-friendly.
It's one thing to edit out a minor gay character, but a major plot point or out gay actor becomes a political issue that interferes with business.
The World is still a very homophobic place. Movie studios don't just depend on domestic box office anymore, but international as well.
There are MANY countries in this World that are much more anti-gay, than the United States. Mexico, many countries in South America, Japan, China, India, and many parts of Africa are very anti-gay and not progressive. If a leading man in a film is openly gay, than producers worry about losing money in the end.
Women are more okay with men being gay, than other men. I think most women find the idea of a guy being gay to be hot. Matt Bomer, Neal Patrick Harris, Zachary Quinto, Ricky Martin, and Anderson Cooper still have female admirers after comint out of the closet.
[quote]Women are more okay with men being gay, than other men
Yes but they're less likely to maintain crushes on gay men- real life isn't like sites where gay men congregate where women will swear their undying love to gay actors. So the star just becomes another wolf in the pack. That's not the way to get rich.
They want the attention from women. It's narcissism, not homophobia.
I know for a fact that a young Hollywood actor is gay. Yet he has orchestrated a big PR push to become a heart-throb. Why? He's only done small, indie size movies, or had supporting roles in bigger mainstream movies. Yet he wants to be prostituted to the paps 24/7. Why? Because he wants the attention.
[quote]Stern mocked his fake deep voice.
Stern doesn't need to be mocking anyone considering he's so stupid that he actually believes Simon Cowell and Leo D. are straight.
Gay actors are still good but not masculine, scientists find
New US research asked 'Can a gay man play it straight?' and looked at perceptions of an actor's performance and masculinity
15 May 2013 | By Rakshita Patel People think gay actors are less masculine – but they are still just as good at acting, scientists have proved.
The US research asked 'Can a gay man play it straight?' and looked at perceptions of an actor’s masculinity and performance.
College students were given biographical information on a male actor, including sexual orientation, and shown a video of the actor’s performance.
They were then asked to rate the actor’s performance and the likelihood of casting the actor in their own productions.
The study found knowing an actor is gay has no significant effect on ratings of his acting performance.
This challenges dominant thinking in many articles that an out gay actor cannot convincingly play straight because audiences who know their sexuality find them less believable.
'These new findings indicate that knowledge of an actor’s sexual orientation doesn’t necessarily cause their performance to be perceived in light of stereotypes about gays,' said Professor Merritt who led the research.
But the study also found that audiences who know an actor is gay give him a lower rating for masculinity.
Equity, the actors' union, published a survey last year looking at whether it was safe to be open about your sexuality in the entertainment industry.
It found almost half of LGBT actors had not come out to their agents. While 81% were out in their professional lives, and 94% were honest about their sexuality to their fellow performers, only 57% were open about their sexuality to their agents.
They kept it a secret from their agents because they feared coming out would harm their career prospects of being cast in certain roles, especially romantic leads, and would restrict the jobs open to them.
The new survey, finding actor's masculinity is brought into question when people know they are gay, may bear these fears out.
But many actors do make a success of 'gay' and 'straight' roles like US TV star Neil Patrick Harris who plays a womanizer in How I Met Your Mother despite being openly gay.
The researchers believe the reduced masculinity ratings are important to fully understand how being openly out influences how an actor is perceived and are planning to further explore these issues in future research, Merritt told Gay Star News.
The new research was led by Paul Merritt, a Psychology Professor at Clemson University in South Carolina, and published in the journal Psychology of Popular Culture.
Unlike incorrect reports in other media, Merritt's research only looked at responses to gay men, not lesbians.
[quote]I know for a fact that a young Hollywood actor is gay. Yet he has orchestrated a big PR push to become a heart-throb. Why? He's only done small, indie size movies, or had supporting roles in bigger mainstream movies. Yet he wants to be prostituted to the paps 24/7. Why? Because he wants the attention.
It's more than just the attention. It's his bank account. He wants a bigger bank account, thus he's not going to take a chance on getting turned down for a role just because he sucks dick.
As the study confirmed, people perceive openly gay men to be significantly less masculine than other men. Leading men tend to be perceived as masculine and manly. They are supposed to be Alpha Males, so any taint of femininity will affect their marketability.
They want to appeal to the biggest audience. While there is a huge percentage of gays in the entertainment industry they are not the ones buying the tickets.
[quote]There are MANY countries in this World that are much more anti-gay, than the United States. Mexico, many countries in South America, Japan, China, India, and many parts of Africa are very anti-gay and not progressive. If a leading man in a film is openly gay, than producers worry about losing money in the end.
Yet Mexico has gay marriage, and the much more "gay friendly" United States do not. Go figure..
Neil Patrick Harris and Matt Bomer landed their current roles before they came out. The question is what kind of work will they be able to get once their current shows end? Neither is going to have any kind of real movie career, but what about television? Is Harris going to end up playing the gay dad roles like Sean Hayes? Could Bomer land another straight leading man role in another network drama or is it going to be supporting roles, gay roles, comedies, etc. Ryan Murphy would probably happily cast him in any of his shows and while that's better than not working at all, how could that be?
Oops. Meant to say "while that's better than not working at all, how satisfying could that be?"
We call them names when they stay in the closet. But then when they come out proudly, we start conversations on whether they still can or cannot get work.
Some of these celebs didn't really have to come out and would have easily chosen to stay closeted but they didn't. So the least we can do is wish them the best and pray that others follow their lead to force hollywood to recognise us and give us that respect
Bomer and NPH may not be A-list, but they are getting work that many straight actors would kill for. Take Bomer for example, he's a lead on a well liked tv series, and has had some good roles in big films like MagicMike, voicing superman in the animated series, a good role in the upcoming Russel Crowe/Colin Farrel movie, hopefully 50shades of grey etc
Zachary Quinto is also flying the flag in the Star Trek movie, so please let's stop with the grumbling and instead wish these young guys the best. We are not yet there but at least we're still moving.
I think that it's about what fantasies work and what fantasies don't work.
For me (and probably for many other people) having someone who is openly heterosexual play the part of someone who is openly gay or lesbian does not work. Other people, of course, might find the openly heterosexual person playing a gay or lesbian role to meet their fantasies about an otherwise unavailable person.
Similarly, having someone who is openly gay or lesbian play the part of someone who is openly heterosexual does not work for me.
It's also a bit of egg and chicken - with few out A grade actors, there are few key roles created for gays and lesbians, so there is a lack of incentive for gays and lesbians to come out.
There's a similar issue with music. A few years ago, a macho heterosexual male singer put out an album of duets with female singers. One of the duets was a love song with an openly lesbian singer - and it just did not work.
R97 Unless you're a teenager or a 12 yr old girl who still fantasizes about falling in love with the characters on the screen, then you should be able to understand what acting is all about.
R98 - Yes, acting is about people taking on roles. But some things get in the way of that being successful. For me, having someone pretend to be a different sexual orientation doesn't work.
[quote] we start conversations on whether they still can or cannot get work.
R96 It's a legitimate part of the discussion as to why aren't there more actors out in Hollywood. The question is why does that make YOU uncomfortable.
I fully support Neil Patrick Harris, Matt Bomer, and Zachary Quinto and I applaud them for coming out, but it's foolish and naive to pretend that there are no consequences for gay actors who come out.
You're willfully ignoring the fact that Bomer landed his TV show before he came out in 2012. Ditto with his roles on Magic Mike and Superman Unbound. What's not clear is the future of his acting career now that he is out. Post coming-out he's landed a very small role in Winter's Tale. He'll be on screen for what? Five minutes? Other than that he's done a PSA for Ryan Murphy's The New Normal. At this point his only pending role is that of a gay man who dies of AIDS in a production to be directed by Ryan Murphy. I think Bomer will be able to find work post-White Collar, but the question is what kind of roles will he be offered?
Zachary Quinto was cast in Star Trek before he came out. Would he still be cast today? We can't say, but what other movie roles has he been offered since he came out in late 2011? Not counting small films produced by himself or his friends, the only thing I see listed in IMDB is something called The Invitation which was announced a year ago, but seems to be stuck in pre-production.
Hollywood has progressed beyond the point where being openly gay makes you completely unemployable. The question is would openly gay actors have the same opportunities available to them as straight actors, or are there roles that are not going to be offered them because of their sexual orientation? It's all ready tough enough to be an actor in Hollywood. There are lots of talented unemployed actors competing for a relatively small number of good roles. So if you're a gay actor, how does the possibility that you may not even have any chance at many roles because of your sexual orientation factor into your decision to come out in Hollywood?
R96 You may be in a position where you can ignore the realities of working in Hollywood, but how many gay actors in Hollywood have that option? It can't be an easy decision for a gay actor in Hollywood to come out, but when they do, pretending that there are no costs to them does them a serious disservice.
Its willfully ignorant to deny the role that fantasy plays in ticket sales for mainstream films. If it werent for fantasy, Leads wouldnt have to look like they all do. Glamorised stories of their private lives wouldnt sell magazines. Their weddings and announcements of engagement wouldnt be making mainstream news.
We live vicariously through them. We want to be them. We want to fuck them. Their sexuality does matter to that extent.
NPH scored the Barney character before he was out. Once he was out his other big starring role was in a campy kids film not really a proper Leading Mans role.
Quinto plays Spock. The queerness works on that. Besides the Leading Man vibe is covered by Pine and others in that film.
I seriously doubt an out gay man could ever a carry a Summer blockbuster type of film by himself. Comedies yes. Kids flicks sure. Character driven indies of course. But mindless testosterone filled, leading lady kissing films, the kind that make money, fuhgettaboutit.
Well that is the prevailing theory why Tom Cruise and others remain firmly locked behind that closet door.
Then we have Rupert Everett's famous interview about how he "regretted" coming out as it ruined his Hollywood career. Now we can debate whether the man had the potential for a leading man career at all, but there you are.
People like Hugh Jackman won't come out because they perpetuated their straight image with catering to housewife type of woman who love to believe that they get a hot guy like Jackman even though they are ordinary women. He would never have been a top ALister as an out gay actor.
Don't blame Neil Patrick Harris, he is responsible for bringing gays respectability and out into the mainstream.
We would not have gay marriage without him.
Their days of staying comfortably in the closet are over though, pretty soon lots of them will have to live with degrees of outness. Like chace Crawford, Easy to foresee a rise in quiet outings of that sort.
It's funny how NPH succeeded in being out and making homosexuality respectable while no one else before him could do so.
Might have something to do with his camera ready family, everyone likes a family man.
Tig Notaro is out and she just gets shit from you guys.
r101, r105, r107, and r108 have me convinced that this is a new training protocol for publicists' assistants. Here's a name of a celeb, go to DL and promote/defend. Learn the importance of deleting cookies.
NPH is a white/Euro WASPY blonde/blue "boy next door" sort. In short just the sort of "normal" all American boy (now man) that many can relate and understand.
Not lispy or fey like Truman Capote. Nor a muscled out Folsom fair sort either. Just your average non-threatening white gay guy who now has a husband and two equally white blonde/blue children. It's like Darrin and Samantha Stephens from Bridgeport Conn.
There is no scandal and the guy as just as someone said, a family man who happens to be gay. How much more "normal" can you get and what better face for equality?
"For me (and probably for many other people) having someone who is openly heterosexual play the part of someone who is openly gay or lesbian does not work"
Why? Actors are frequently different from the roles they play...you realize that, right? I just don't understand why anyone would care
Btw, thanks for posting that study, r88. I was surprised at how many actors are not out to their agents.
This story isn't new, and sadly until being gay is totally accepted without judgment it will not go away.
In interviews Kaye Ballard says her friend Paul Lynde was often upset that "Hollywood" wouldn't consider him for different roles. But the suits knew PL was gay (and he knew they knew) so the idea he couldn't handle meatier roles was baked into the cake.
As we discussed in another thread Rock Hudson's sexuality was not exactly a state secret. But yet well into the 1960's or so he was still cast in leading men roles on screen. When those dried up there was still television but sadly came his HIV/AIDs diagnosis and that took things on a different path.
Tom Cruise, John Travolta and a handful of other "leading men" whose sexuality is rumored if not taken as fact to be gay still do very well. Guess long as things remain unofficial persons can live with the status quo.
Since we're on NPH today, was there anyone who didn't know he was gay before the guy came out? Yet he was still being cast and getting work. People will say "oh well *that* is theatre, things are different...
I understand that in the past only the entertainment industry was somewhat civil to gay men. What I cannot understand that in the year 2014, gay men obsess about who is gay in Hollywood. C'mon people ...
I would like to see more out gay men and lesbians on Wall Street and in Silicon Valley; in the halls of the House of Representatives and the Senate; in the locker rooms of the MLB, the NFL, the NBA and the NHL, etc.
I would much rather see a gay or lesbian Supreme Court Justice or governor of the Federal Reserve Board than another gay/lesbian Oscar winner
I, too put it down to the financial aspect of Hollywood. You would never get distribution in many countries around the world if you had openly gay men and women as the lead. I would say up to two thirds of a film's revenue is generated in countries where homosexuality is still and moral and legal crime. So in that way staying closeted or "ambiguous" is no different from being willing to relocate for work; if I don't move to Cleveland, much as a hate it, I don't have work.
TBH I find very selfish and unreasonable for the community to not understand and accept this. Why all the shit being thrown at them. And do you really think a Geffen or Diller et al got that wealthy and successful by prancing around opening gay promoting only openly gay musicians and actors. Of course they didn't! Both of them(there are examples)made a show of relationships with women. And I have no doubt they would all be happy to fund support openly projects if they could be assured that the return would be similar to that of a hetero project.
What's all this rubbish then about how the story is so much more important than the stars these days?
r116, I think most of us realize that gay actors are under a lot of pressure but some of them go to obnoxious lengths to deny what is obvious (like getting into beard marriages, making anti-gay comments, etc.) and those people deserve nothing but contempt
Mainstream acceptance of gays is a pretty recent phenomenon. You can't expect older closeted celebrities to suddenly rush and tell the world that they've been gay all these years. Then, when choosing between up-and-coming actors, why would a studio choose a gay actor - who will automatically turn-off a segment of the population - when they could just choose the straight actor and not have to worry? It's the same reason why minority films don't get the same funding. It's not as if the majority of actors are irreplaceable talents, so it makes sense to go with the safer bet.
When you consider how often backstabbing, vicious, dog eat dog and otherwise competitive Hollywood/the entertainment industry is, perhaps it is best to play one's cards close to vest.
Hollywood in particular can be very fickle. One week you are on top and the next you cannot get anyone to pick up the telephone.
it's really no ones damn business if a person is gay unless they choose to make it public. I know it's very hard for some of you girls to understand that they don't owe you shit. your life must be empty and you must be pretty shallow for you to constantly obsess about why an actor won't reveal his sexuality.
Oh I don't know about that.
No one is obsessing and my life certainly is not boring or whatever, but there is a case to be made for those in certain positions in society to be "out".
Unlike say race which is usually evident on sight, the more gays remain "invisible" the less pressure there is for change in attitudes.
If it were not for the scores if not hundreds of out gays and lesbians pushing for SSM equality how far do you think that movement would have gone?
Young gays in particular just as with other minority youth and children need to see positive role models. This way they know they too can become CEO of Apple or host the Oscars just as they are.
okay, here's an idea. Let's pass a law making it mandatory for every gay and lesbian actor to come out of the closet and identify themselves by wearing a pink triangle on their clothing at all times. You know, like they were forced to during the Holocaust.
Most of us schmucks aren't going to host the Oscars or be the CEO of Apple. Most of us live lives of quiet desparation
I think there is a lot more acceptance in mainstream America than these celebs realize, especially if someone is a fan of their work. My 85 year old Repub mother, after her initial shock at finding out about her beloved Matt Bomer, still likes him as much as she did before.
Baby steps, but better than nothing, right? I think the fallout of coming out might be a lot less traumatic than people realize