I am too old for bb. I grew up gay during the beginnings of HIV-could never think of sex without a condom. But a great many young guys online, in the porn films, do it. Why? Is the risk worth the fuck? Or am I just old fashioned by now?Or is the message of safe sex being drowned out by the free fall of immature boredom?
I don't ever use a condom. I don't have much interest in tired reruns of hetero sex.
I REFUSE TO PUT A CONDOMS ON OR GET FUKKED BY ANYBODY WEARING ONE YOU CAN"T FILL ANYTHINGS!!!
AND NO PULLING OUT EATHER!
Then enjoy your sero-conversion and your subsequent crix belly, huge medical bills, and health problems, r1.
am against it unlesss yu've been with the personfor a long-time and been tested or you're a straight couple who want to have children.Its just too dangerous otherwise.
For what's it worth, I was a top but since I found the condoms too desensitizing, and started to have too many encounters where bottoms just don't, how should I say, keep themselves clean, I opted out of fucking. I find it overrated and I think most guys do it because they think it's the thing to do. I get off so much more on foreplay - kissing, frottage, and mutual oral.
Guys who don't use condoms are gross. It kills a hook up if I realize the other person had no intention of using one. Don't want to touch that.
Strict top here. I use condoms, unless the bottom requests I take it off, and then I comply.
I would guess that I've fucked about 75 guys in my life, and only three times have I ever come in contact with fecal matter.
I test every 3 months, always neg.
Despite what some people want to tell you, a strict top is at very low risk of infection when barebacking a bottom..even if the bottom is poz.
CUM IS GOOD FOR YOU IT'S LOADED WITH PROTEIN AND VITAMINS>
R3, my long term BF is +ve and I am not. Like R5 said, I get off so much more on foreplay - kissing, frottage, and mutual oral. Penis-in-hole is not for everyone. I can cum almost instantly if I get both our cocks in my hand and jerk us together. If I then jerk him off with a handful of my cum he gets off within seconds.
I just can't imagine why someone would want someone else's fecal matter on their penis and entering their urethra.
You might as well rub your dick on the edge of a toilet bowl.
[quote]You might as well rub your dick on the edge of a toilet bowl.
You say that like its a bad thing.
Bottom here. As long as they pull out, I have no problem with barebacking. A couple of guys have tried to not pull out and I explained that I'm not down with breeding.
R12 May as well let them stay in, because if they have the bug they have already given it to you long before that point.
r13, you're not one for logic are you?
R14 Studies have demonstrated the presence of HIV in most pre-ejaculate samples from infected men. But hey, its your life.
r15, a chance can be small or great. The problem is that you're not making distinctions.
I bet the possibility of being in a car accident or a plane crash hasn't stopped you from using them as transportation. It's all about assessing odds, but you seem programmed to believe that any chance = done deal.
There is possible and probable
All this nonsense about chances, and car accidents, and plane crashes. You CAN prevent becoming infected by becoming educated and practicing safe-ER sex. Being celibate would guarantee non- infection, but that is not a viable option for me. However, I guarantee I would not have anal sex without a condom. I would also have to think very long and hard about trusting a monogamous partner and engaging in bareback sex.
Yes, R18, the thought of wasting life-giving sperm by depositing it into a condom *is* nauseating.
[quote] Being celibate would guarantee non- infection
Avoiding anal sex guarantees non-infection
r21, not if you done be sharin them needles while you smokin they dope an guzzlin they jizz an... an... an...
Yes avoiding anal sex would be most effective in avoiding infection. My choice is to practice safe sex. I only have anal sex with one long term partner, with a condom.
Chances of getting HIV infection from unprotected anal sex: 1 in 31 to 1 in 1300
[quote]Despite what some people want to tell you, a strict top is at very low risk of infection when barebacking a bottom..even if the bottom is poz.
Makes me wonder though how all these bottoms get infected.
R26 They believe it when some guy they hardly know tells them they are a strict top.
Condoms or I don't do it.
You're still sticking your dick in someone's ass and it's primary job is to expel shit, so while I'm all for multi tasking, I still take note of my workplace surroundings.
I was quite surprised recently when my husband the doc said that women have virtually never passed HIV to a man from BB sex. STD'S YES! But HIV, no.
That;s how he and his brethren knew Magic Johnson was full of shit from the get go.
I cannot abide a condom...rather do w/o sexual intercourse personally.
[quote] I opted out of fucking. I find it overrated and I think most guys do it because they think it's the thing to do. I get off so much more on foreplay - kissing, frottage, and mutual oral.
Nobody (except one old queen on Datalounge) gets off on frottage.
Thinking otherwise is yet another self-delusion along the lines of "I've never had any complaints!" about cock-size or sexual prowess (meaning: his partner was appalled to the point of speechlessness and fled the scene as quickly as humanly possible.)
[quote]Nobody (except one old queen on Datalounge) gets off on frottage.
You have never been on a crowded subway car...
Condoms kill all sensation. Of course I prefer to fuck without one, but I would only fuck a neg bottom that way.
Real life: condom
When it was time for my son to lose his virginity, I took him into my bed. I showed him how to suck cock and I came in his mouth, but when it was time for him to enter me, I wanted him to get used to safe sex so he wore a condom. I'm 42, my son is 16,
only if asked to use one, hate them.
F&F for R34, please
R29 - Interesting. How is the situation in Africa and parts of Asia explained?
Sex with a condom is safer sex, it isn't better sex or more pleasurable to most, but it is safer.
My dope into you, never. Your dope into me, always.
I'm 48. The thought of barebacking horrifies me. I saw what HIV can do first hand. I lost almost every friend I had in the late 1980s and early 1990s. I escaped without infection because I used condoms EVERY TIME I had sex and I was not promiscuous.
People think the AIDS situation is over. Far from it. My cousin died 2 months ago from AIDS. He tested positive in 1998. It will still kill you, just slower. Besides HIV, there is HPV (some strains lead to cancer of the tongue, throat, anus and penis), chlamydia, herpes (yuck), syphillis, gonorrhea (the antibiotic resistant strain is suposed to be a real bitch), and many other heebie jeebies.
I have NEVER had an STD. Yes, I get called a sex negative. Yes, I get called a Mary. But, I am still alive and I am STILL HEALTHY.
I will not lecture any of you about safer sex, but I will let you know that I have been sexually active since I was 13 (1978) and I have never had any type of STD (and I have had some excellent wild sex over the decades). Do what you feel is right for you, but remember, there are lots of things out there that can fuck up your life. It's your life and you are free to do with it what you please. I hope you will use your brain.
Joey in Dallas
Look for neg bottoms
R41 So, you just take their word for it? You ask, "Do you have HIV?" Answer: "No." You reply, "Cool, bend over, let's fuck!" Not smart.
When AIDS reared its ugly head in the early '80s, I stopped anal sex altogether. I was always a top and always preferred oral sex, so when the plague hit, I just gave up on buttsex. I haven't fucked an ass since 1983. I don't miss it.
Yeah, the idea of shit on my dick really grosses me out. I have never fucked an ass and I have never been fucked. I have an awesome sex life, just no filth. I'm 50 and just never was into butt sex.
I did some buttfucking back in high school, in the late '70s, but I would rather have just exchanged blow-jobs. Receiving oral takes me to places that anal never could.
Go ahead and bareback if you have no self-respect and you have enough money in the bank to pay for the hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of medication it will take to keep you alive. One of my dear friends has been HIV positive since 1991. He has been on the drug cocktail since 1996.
He would be the first to tell you that HIV/AIDS is not "just like high blood pressure or type 2 diabetes, just take a pill and voila!" He has been in and out of the hospital so many times over the last 16 or 17 years (with things like pneumonia, brain tumors, internal bleeding, sores that won't heal, diarrhea and nausea that last weeks). Not pretty.
Educate yourself about the diseases that you can catch and then make your own decision. If you don't mind being sick all the time from HIV related illnesses, then throw your life away. Remember, you only get one ride on this merry-go-round of life. You can't buy another ticket and ride again, no matter how much money or prominence you have.
It's funny. Two of my best friends are straight guys. They buttfuck their wives/girlfriends all the time. I am gay and have only assfucked one guy (many, many years ago).
We live in a very selfish time. I hope it's a phase.
Sure, bareback can be more pleasurable. But your casual choice today can kill someone else tomorrow. The car accident analogy, besides being statistically wrong, is also completely irrelevant, because getting in a car accident does not increase your chances of getting someone else into one later.
It's not all about you and what feels good to you. We should act with some responsibility for one another.
I hooked up with a guy and then saw HIV meds on the counter in his bathroom. I told him that wasn't cool and he said "You didn't ask." Total selfish, irresponsible behavior. He might have been "right" -- but he was still being selfish and unkind.
That should count.
r49 is full of shit.
R50 No, I don't think he is. I had a very similar situation that occurred in the 1990s. Luckily I was a top and used a rubber, but I found meds in his bathroom. I went into a panic, went to get tested and went into a period of celibacy for 7 years. I think he's telling the truth.
r51 Then you're both idiots.
R52 Why are they idiots?
If the guy is foolish enough not to ask, and you know or suspect you're HIV+, you have a moral duty to raise the issue. End of.
[quote]You might as well rub your dick on the edge of a toilet bowl.
In some cases it might be cleaner and tighter.
The last time I bare fucked an ass was when I was 18. That was 34 years ago. I got my third urinary tract infection and started using condoms any time I plugged an ass. Thank God for those UTI's or I would probably have died from AIDS. I consider those painful infections to have been lifesavers. I'll never fuck an ass without a condom again. And no, I do not get fucked. I hate receptive anal.
r54 When you pulled that unicorn out of your ass did a rainbow shoot out?
r50 I think you're the kind of asshole r49 is talking about
And r57 should die. Alone.
I always top and i always use a condom. I got a uti once when i was in the military i was a virgin at the time.
The army doctor would NOT believe i was virgin after a lot of insistince he finally backed off it and basically offered to remedy the situation in a not so subtle way.
I laughed it off at the time and to this day i regret not taking him up on it,he was gorgeous. This was the year before they repealed Dadt and i was too.insecure and confused.
If we did have sex we would have used condoms though. Doctors orders!
i have started barebacking with my BF whom i trust completely and after we both got tested. i've started having symptoms that i'm thinking might be a uti. just general discomfort in the head of my dick with more when i urinate. is there a way to get rid of it without going to the doctor? what about ways to help prevent, sans using a condom of course?
I do not ride my motorcycle without a helmet.
I do not drive my car without fastening my seatbelt.
I do not stand up on rollercoasters.
I do not roll around naked in poison ivy.
I do not french kiss live rattlesnakes.
I do not fuck without a condom.
Rules I live by
Totally against it in my personal life, but I love jacking off to bareback porn.
Oh, r58 , go fuck yourself. Troll responses to a troll thread. How many times?
As long as the guy pulls out, I'm good.
HIV is found in precum, R64.
God I love precum.
Unless you know your sex partner very well, you should assume anyone you have sex with could have HIV, and act accordingly.
R49, if you went home with a guy without knowing or asking his status, you only have yourself to blame.
I simply don't understand the number of people here willing to put their health on the line for a 15 second orgasm. It reflects a willingness to sacrifice long term well being for a short term fix, kind of like a heroin or coke rush.
You hags can scream "sex negative" all you want, but picking up random strangers and fucking bareback is some mighty high stakes gambling, way too high for my taste.
Trusting your partner is risky. I was with my Ex for 23 years. I would never have thought of him cheating. Well, he did. Several times in the last two years of our relationship. Luckily, I never gave up on using condoms EVERY time. A mutual friend told me that my Ex is now HIV postive. His new boyfriend abandoned him after the diagnosis.
[quote]I simply don't understand the number of people here willing to put their health on the line for a 15 second orgasm.
15 seconds? Damn. Now that just might be worth the risk.
The amount of ignorance, misinformation, and outright stupidity on this thread is staggering. Unless you're in an honest, monogamous relationship where you know your partner's neg you're playing Russian roulette every time you engage in unprotected anal.
Where's the logic in saddling yourself with an incurable disease that requires taking a regimen of harsh, costly drugs for the rest of your life for a few minutes of condomless sex because it's "better"? Not to mention rendering yourself a sexual leper to guys who aren't pos once you do have HIV.
Here's one in support of frottage.
The most intense orgasms I've ever had have been during a frottage session - truly like full-body orgasms. amazing stuff!
I totally agree r72! I really wish more guys were into it. Can anyone recommend a good date site for frottage lovers?
I think it's really hard to have an orgasm from frottage alone. Usually if I manage to find someone who's into it, he cums before I do. Is it easier to lie one atop the other, or do it standing up?
I'll just say this about bareback sex: I hear the risk for HIV is very low if you're a strict top (1 in 1300? I like those odds!). But yeah, the UTIs are a pain in the penis head. They do go away on their own. Or you can drink a really bitter bottle of 100% cranberry juice.
Whatever is most taboo becomes fetishised. If you look at pre-Aids, no condom porn, the ass full of cum or 50 load weekends are not happening much.
Oral, fucking, backshot or on the face. There was and always will be piss, fisting, gangbangs and leather vids. But in mainstream porn, they fucked till it was gonna blow and then blew it out. I heard that was how most guys got the most off in life too.
Since cum is now the missile of death, being flooded full has been glorified in porn. Ass-dripping deposits. Not gonna lie, some of the porn turns me on.
But I fuck more than I watch porn. I am both old enough and young enough to know better. We all have fantasies, but some of them have little to do with actual sexual pleasure.
Don't be a cum dump guys. It's disgusting and degrading.
It's also true that younger means more wildly risky in general. I was for sure, long after I knew better. You have to work at getting to know what makes you tick and examine what is acceptable. And be honest with others.
If you are consumed with guilt and worry after unsafe sex then there is your answer.
If not, it's your body, your life.
To those of you who think HIV infection is no longer an occurrence or problem or ongoing epidemioc, from an article this week in the WASHINGTON POST:
"20,000 Americans living with HIV still die every year, an annual toll that exceeds the rate of U.S. combat deaths in Vietnam."
"Men who have sex with men (MSM) have accounted for a rising proportion of new infections over the past two decades, and now account for almost two-thirds of new infections."
"An estimated 208,000 Americans carry the HIV virus but don’t know it. These men and women form an epicenter of all new HIV infections. The majority of infected young gay men don’t know their status. Rates of undetected infection are especially high among African American and Latino gay and bisexual youth."
But are they bottoms or tops? That is an important distinction.
YOU GUYS, ESPECIALLY YOU YOUNG GUYS, NEED TO START TALKING TO EACH OTHER MORE ABOUT WHAT TURNS YOU ON SEXUALLY, AND TO HAVE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT WHAT YOU THINK OF AS "AIDS PREVENTION."
Does "prevention" mean you go to the Emergency Room the day after letting a guy come inside your ass without a condom, and get yourself PEP: post-exposure prophylactics? (Roosevelt-St. Luke's Hospital in NYC can provide it. Not all hospitals do.)
From the AIDS.gov website:
"PEP involves taking anti-HIV drugs as soon as possible after you may have been exposed to HIV to try to reduce the chance of becoming HIV positive. . . To be effective, PEP must begin within 72 hours of exposure, before the virus has time to rapidly replicate in your body. PEP consists of 2-3 antiretroviral medications and should be taken for 28 days. . . PEP is not 100% effective; it does not guarantee that someone exposed to HIV will not become infected with HIV."
OR: does "prevention" mean you take PrEP: Pre-exposure prophylactics? From the CDC website: "PrEP is a new HIV prevention method in which people who do not have HIV take a daily pill to reduce their risk of becoming infected. When used consistently, PrEP has been shown to be effective in men who have sex with men (MSM) and heterosexually-active men and women. . . Based on studies to date, in July 2012 the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved the combination medication tenofovir disoproxil fumarate plus emtricitabine (TDF/FTC) for use as PrEP among sexually active adults at risk for HIV infection."
OR: does "prevention" mean to you that you talk to your sex partner about condoms, about what you want to do sexually and what you're willing to do? Does it mean always using condoms?
What does it mean to you to take precautions against being infected with HIV?
Please, please, please, please, please, please, please give this some thought.
I'm not judging your sex life or desires or actions. Do whatever you like! Sex is a good thing. Just: I ask you to give thought to how you are going to keep yourself negative, IF you're negative. And how you are going to make sure your partner stays negative, if he is negative and your are positive. AND: if you are positive, how you are going to protect your OWN health in the long run, what kind of medical attention you're getting, what kind of support system you have.
Please think about this, you dudes.
Your lives matters.
This thread is horrifying. It doesn't matter if you're gay, straight, or bi; please don't have unprotected sex with hookups.
I can't judge anyone who ditches the condoms in a monogamous relationship (I have myself), but there's no excuse for barebacking with someone you just picked up, no matter what they say (or don't say) about their status. Even if you're not scared of HIV, there are still a load of STDs or diseases you can catch.
It's great for getting itchy anal warts, go ahead baby!
I mean "your lives matter," sorry for that extra "s" above.
r79, telling people not to do things isn't a way to get them to stop doing it. I know you mean well. But this strategy simply has not worked, over time. People need to know what the risks are, and they need to make decisions about the risks they are willing to take. It is really unlikely that over a period of 20 years someone will practice safe sex EVERY TIME. It just doesn't happen. The useful thing is not to shame or scold people, but to get them talking about what they do, and what they like to do, and tell them what's available in the way of prevention. People who are ashamed of their sexual behavior are not likely to engage you in conversation about it. People need to tell each other what they do, and to educate themselves and each other about prevention - not just what works next Saturday night, but what's going to work for the next 30 years.
So somebody gets real on this thread, instead of handing out a lot of quick-fix "sexy" gossip, and none of you can respond? HIV ain't no joke, motherfuckers.
You guys weren't being serious, were you? You just wanted to get the second-hand thrill of judging people you don't know.
The odds change considerably if the "strict top" has herpes, r74. And 80-90% of people with herpes do not know it.
The increased sensation is largely perception, and there are studies that indicate it. If it were true, why wouldn't men yelp in the vast increase in pleasur rather than keep pounding away when the condom slips off?
I disagree that telling people not to do things won't change behaviour. They may resent it, but on some level, the message sinks in. Whatever the means the message must be delivered.
When you bareback you don't care about yourself and your partner's or partners' health. Call me a hopeless romantic but sex for me (even casual hook ups) are not just about horny sexual attraction but admiration and respect for yourself and your partner you seek (or take the risk of experiencing) some level of intimacy.
A lot of people are terrified of themselves (and those sexual urges they have), the future, their surroundings (including family and work colleagues), enviroment, society, etc. and on a subconscious level look for a way out. And barebacking (with lots and lots of drugs and alcohol) is that lottery game that one day gives them the ticket out of the hellhole they call their miserable lives. For them HIV is not just death, but the well deserved punishment for their wicked ways and the proof that daddy or other authority figures from the past were right that they are a piece of shit and always will be a piece of shit until they die AIDS related deaths.
When you love and approve of yourself you don't feel the need to die or experience that kind of risks that come with barebacking.
r86, if it worked to tell people "no," then new infections of HIV would be dropping, instead of holding steady.
People who have studied methods of prevention have statistics and studies showing that it simply does not work to say, "No."
Nancy Reagan was wrong.
And to talk about AIDS prevention doesn't mean that you have to stay HIV negative for the next 5 months, or 5 years. It means the next 5 decades, if you're 20 and plan to live to be at least 70.
That is a LONG TIME.
Shaming might work in the short term (MIGHT, but: it doesn't.) But people need to negotiate their relationship to AIDS prevention for a lifetime. Kids think to themselves, "Oh, by the time I get infected, there'll be a cure." Kids have thought that for 30 years. And many of them are getting infected. And there still is no cure. And the "drug cocktails" work, most of the time and for people who get access to them. But they also don't always work, and people can't always get access to them. And in any case there are people on those drug cocktails who stop taking them, for a variety of reasons, and end up doing young, in any case.
AIDS prevention needs to be a discussion we gay men have with each other A LOT.
Shaming shuts down that conversation.
"doing young" = "dying young," oops
To the frottage fans here: Do you frottage, say, the arm of the sofa, or is another person involved?
I always think the "I lost ALL my friends in the 80's" is a little dramatic.
That means the only friends you had were basically just sexually active gay males, IV drug users or transfusion patients. That's it. No other friends. No nice married Frau at work, no straight widowed male neighbor, no non-sexually active gay friends, no celibate clergymen, no fag-hag, etc. You had NONE of those and every single one of your friends that didnt fit those categories died. EVERY one of them died.
I don't buy it from anyone. I know there were massive losses, but there are better things to exaggerate about.
R91, there were a lot of gay men in their 20s in the 70s whose lives were organized around their gay friends. Sure, they knew straight people. But the people they thought of as friends were other gay men. The closet was much more powerful 30 and 40 years ago, and it made a gay-ghetto life necessary to a lot of gay men. There were plenty of people whose 10 closest friends died. That doesn't mean they only knew other gay men.
I feel bad for my friend. Somewhere over the last few months he picked up something that appears in the form of a horrible, burning rash on his buttocks. (I thought it was herpes but the doctor he saw at the clinic said it's some kind of fungus.) My friend says he's always safe with guys he hooks up with but does admit he used to bareback with his BFs years ago (his last relationship was almost two years ago). The problem is that he doesn't have health insurance, so he goes to the clinic and gets a cream from one of the doctors on staff there. Thankfully, the cream helps and makes the rash go away but the fix is always only temporary; after a while it comes back and he has to go back to get more cream.
Since my friend doesn't make much money, he does have quite a bit of money in his savings account, so I've been trying to convince him to take enough out and go see my doctor to hopefully (a) find out what the heck it really is and (b) hopefully get some kind of permanent solution/cure, but so far he's refused, saying it's "too expensive w/o insurance," yet took $2,000 out this past winter to buy a coat from Burberry's (because he's all about high fashion) and $1,400 for a new bike (just a couple weeks ago). His priorities aside, however, he is still my friend, so I'm hoping one day he will change his mind.
I'm against it
r61, could you put that in Seusian rhyme?
I do not ride my bike sans topper
I don't drive with no belt on my whopper
On coasters, I do not arise
Rolling in poison ivy is not wise
Rattlsnakes are not for a snog
I don't go wrapperless when snogging in a bog
Reading these threads on barebacking/HIV always depresses me. So many judgmental posters! So much disinformation! So little compassion for our fellow gays, let alone fellow men.
I'm the one who has repeatedly posted that the condom argument has failed our "community" for lack of a better word. I know this first hand. I always used condoms for anal sex, and I still acquired HIV. but shaming doesn't work; just saying "no" doesn't work; and certainly, pretending that you can fuck anything that moves so long as you wear a rubber doesn't work.
The problem that gay men face is that, even today, being gay is still hidden, and riddled with issues of shame, low self-worth, ridicule, and worse. It's getting better, for sure, but we won't be rid of this problem until gays are fully, equally accepted into our culture, and given the power of the religious right, that's not happening anytime soon. It's very encouraging to read the stories of parents realizing their child is gay and it just not making any difference, but the reality is that doesn't happen that often. I don't know if it ever will; we still have issues with interracial marriage, interfaith marriage, on and on, so I just can't see a future where sexual orientation is viewed and treated like any other minor difference between humans (when was the last time you heard a mother tell her son he couldn't marry a girl with blue eyes or brown hair?).
This leaves us with the stigma of homosexuality, or since most straights can't get past the act, homosex. Specifically, butt sex. Even though straight men love to fuck their wife/girlfriend/whatever up the butt, the thought to most of them about two men doing it is repulsive. And that attitude comes out at high volume between gay men on threads like this. Just look at the number of posts on this thread saying "I don't do anal" or "you might as well rub your dick on a toilet." Yeah, that's sex-positive (having been repeatedly flamed as sex negative myself).