Have you ever lost respect for someone, after you found out that they were very religious?
There is this guy at work who is incredibly smart. He grasps concepts very quickly and can speak on any number of topics. I found out that he is way into the Jesus. Like every Sunday, tithing, have a blessed day, into Jesus. Now everything he does doesn't seem that great or smart or funny. I know it's my problem and I have to work through it, but I was really let down.
Pat Robertson really frightens us.
It would depend on the type of Christian they were as to whether I'd lose respect for them. I admit that I find it bizarre that otherwise intelligent people can seemingly make sense out of nonsense. It goes to show how powerful social and cultural forces are when they can outrank rationalization and logic.
You're right, it is your problem. What an ass you are.
Like he gives a fuck OP
I don't give a damn if someone wants to be religious or not; it's only when they think they have a right to judge me or others and think gays shouldn't have equal rights. Then I lose respect for them and dismiss them from my life.
I have that experience with a couple of people at work who are Mormons. I just can't bring myself to respect Mormons...
I have experienced this, I distance myself, I find it all very disturbing.
I had a Wiccan friend who was all about the "Blessed Be" shit.
He got busted for distributing meth, served time for that and for numerous other illegalities. He has major financial problems and is always trying to scam his friends which is why I cut him out of my life, and that happened before he got involved with meth.
I hadn't seen him in years, and I ran into him a while ago. I asked him just what aspect of the Goddess he was honoring when he tried to sell meth to that undercover cop.
To his credit he really didn't lose his cool, he just mumbled goodbye and walked away.
If you're going to claim to have a faith go big or go home. I'm sick of religious hypocrisy.
It depends. I have one friend who is very christian but also very nice and non-judgmental. Very welcoming to everyone and her best friend is Muslim.
I had another former co-worker who was of the creationist variety. She seemed intelligent and then one day she asked me how on earth did men and dinosaurs co-exist. I was WTF? and avoided her after that.
[quote]I had a Wiccan friend who was all about the "Blessed Be" shit.
Those Wiccan people are just as crazy as other religions. I also had a friend once who was Wiccan and you couldn't trust her a bit - conniving and always trying to get something out of you.
Yes. My therapist was all dressed up for Passover today..I thought he was smarter than that.
I get disappointed like this all the time, OP. It's not an odd feeling to want to express, despite what the religious on this thread might want to make you think.
The other night at Whole Foods, I sat across from an attractive, nerdy young couple and the dude was going on and on about shit that happened in the New Testament like it was for real. I mean, even if it was real, the way he was relating it was so utterly banal and pointless, I couldn't believe he was subjecting his Asian wife to it. She seemed to be religious as well, but had little more than "uh-huh" to periodically interject. I myself wanted to interject and say something like, "You know you don't really have to take that book so seriously, it was written thousands of years ago by ignorant, bigoted, misogynistic men in the desert who didn't actually know anything."
I also have a hard time staying connected or wanting to reconnect with certain high school friends and family members who've grown up to be religious adults. I just can't take that seriously; it really makes me doubt a person's intelligence and sensibilities.
Op a colleague of mine- an engineer - does not believe in evolution. So I know put him in the idiot category
I grew up in a very religious family...Catholics, Pentecostals, non-denominationals, etc. My sister and I could never understand the dichotomy that existed between the teachings of Jesus and the behavior of the "Christians" around us. From the pulpit they blasted liberals and President Clinton, while teaching about the relationship between King David and God. They preached the Ten Commandments, but most of them were gluttonously obese. Our pastor's wife and most of their family were on uppers consistently, but called others weak and unfaithful if they sought help. Needless to say, my sister and I are both athiests, have Master's degrees in our respective fields, and are very successful in our professions. When I come across Christians, it's hard for me to be non-judgemental...the very thing that irks me about them. Many seem to be uneducated, trained from birth with no independent thought, or damaged in some way.
I was really shocked when I found out Ken Jennings is Mormon.
You don't believe 1000 virgins await you, OP?
Don't dismiss someone because he/she is a person of faith. Find out what he/she believes first. OP, what kind of Christian is he? I'm an Episcopalian; we are not in the same category as Southern Baptists for example. Sometimes I tell people to have a blessed day. If someone is atheist I don't use that phrase though. I respect different beliefs.
Yes OP, I have--a few times. It made me sad.
But you no doubt believe some ridiculous things, R17. It's just hard to respect that.
You might not enrage a person, because you do seem from that one paragraph like a polite person at the very least. But being a member of the Christian faith, you have to accept that non-believers are going to, at the very least, doubt your critical thinking skills.
Yes, this girl at my work.
I thought we were cool, we would hang out at lunch and breaks, we always had a laugh and everything seemed cool until one day I swore, and if you could see the horror on this chick's face and the sudden gasp of terror. All I said was "fuck off" after she made a crude joke as we usually did with each other.
This girl got so upset and said "I don't curse" "cursing is against the teachings of the church, it's disrespectful to God ..etc etc"
I was flabbergasted. Things definitely changed between us after that.
Am from a fundamentalist (stricter than Baptist) background... eventually I found my way out. As opposed to many people's experiences, my "church people" were a loving gang... sweet to the core & hardly intellectually-challenged. The reason I believe that I stayed so long had a great deal to do w/my own lack of self-esteem... our reliance was in the Bible and in God rather than trusting our own instincts and reason (in fact, one verse says... "the heart is desperately wicked"). Hence, the crap that comes out of their mouths is not necessarily from their own hearts (barring the bigots & homophobes who use any excuse... even religion), but rather from an archaic book which mankind should have outgrown by now. Why not be sparing in your judgment? .;. I felt comfortable in leaving fundamentalism behind due in a small part to the discovery that kindness was not exclusive to Christianity.
R11, Passover, like most Jewish Holidays, is celebrated symbolically as the triumph of a powerless few over the cruel, dominant majority out to destroy them in part by breaking their spirit. The whole purpose is not to have an elaborate dinner but to discuss why it's themes are relevant today. Whether or not it actually happened as written is less important.
I looked someone from high school up on facebook and it was like an episode of Big Love or something. He has eight kids (like one every nine months) and he home schools and does bible study etc.
You're right OP. It suggests they don't reason.
I moved to an area not realizing it was full of neo-cons. I was at a friend's house and friend-of-friend starts ranting about alcohol, somehow relating drinking alcohol to eating roadkill. I listened in stunned silence. You can't reason with insanity. It was really odd and I made sure to never be around that family again.
I too lose interest in people (and become quite disappointed) when learning of either their religious or Republican fervor. I make a point to not discuss religion or politics with neighbors out of fear they will disappoint me and I will not like them anymore. I prefer to be blissfully ignorant of their views.
R20 I hate freaks like that, who have no problem telling/listening to crude jokes or being suggestive, yet have a heart attack if they hear a cuss word.
[bold]Have you ever lost respect for someone, after you found out that they were very religious?[/bold]
It isn't a matter of losing respect. It's a matter of losing contact. Leave the person to his religion; but get the heaven-or-hell away from the person.
I've known two people in my life who were very Christian and about ten million times smarter than I am. I have an itchy feeling at the back of my head telling me that the first sentence in this post is grammatically wonky but either of them would have known immediately how to make it right. Both were immigrants I knew in my teens: one a Nigerian girl who was the valedictorian of my high school graduating class, the other an incredibly gay Polish guy who went to CalTech.
Yes, I have. This is a sad thing to happen.
I have also had several friendships with people who where Christians (perhaps in name only) who believed in evolution, equality, and science. Before the topic came up, I believed these people to be atheists. I did not loose respect in this case. Had the topic not come up directly, I would have never known.
I have a great many Jewish friends having grown up among a Jewish population. r22's got it right. It's a culture more than a belief and it's mostly harmless as practiced by the average adherent. If someone says they are Jewish, I'm usually inclined to have either a positive reaction or none at all (or a "duh, your surname is Milstein"). Happy Pesach.
yea...I would never date a religious person. If a guy tells me he goes to church, I go the other direction. I can never respect him.
[quote]It isn't a matter of losing respect. It's a matter of losing contact.
That's the way to do it. I don't want to be around people who wear their religion on their shoulder for all to admire.
Yes. Anyone I meet who is Christian and open about it is someone I will lose respect for. Or those "spiritual types" who go on and on about the Universe knowing what you need, etc.
The only religion I respect is Buddhism. And even then, I'm wary.
I lose respect for people who purport to be open minded but find it perfectly acceptable to look down on people of faith.
That is the definition of hypocrisy.
I wouldn't say I "lose respect", but I have to admit that I start finding them lacking in credibility when it comes to anything really substantial. And I usually tend to drift away from them as much as possible.
the phrase "at my work" brings to mind golden arches.
So, basically... You all are looking down on these religious types for being judgemental, exactly like you are . Interesting.
You're jumping to conclusions, R36. I personally want to distance myself from them because I can't take people who believe in fairy tales seriously.
I went to Georgetown in the early 1980s (Reagan era) and lived with a group of four other guys. We were unusual in that all of us were not only Democrats, but all of our parents were still on their first marriages.
One of my former housemates is a Catholic priest. That is not that unusual ... seven friends in my class became RC priests or nuns. But this one joined a priory that still performs daily Latin masses and refuses to acknowledge Vatican II policies.
The shock is not that he is religious --- that he became 19th century in his beliefs/outlooks was more the surprise.
No but I don't adjust my behaviour to please them.
R35 is golden arches?
R33, I never claim to be open-minded. I'm judgmental and do not suffer fools gladly.
To me, religious fundamentalists (of any kind) are deeply and fundamentally stupid, regardless of any cleverness they exhibit in other areas.
Just remember, not all people of faith are fucked up fundamentalists but all fucked up fundamentalists are people of faith.
Everyone is judgmental in some way. Judging someone for their belief in a magical sky fairy is something I'm open about. If I was running around saying I believed in Santa, you would have me committed.
You guys hate God and mock Christ here daily. It's really pretty sad. If you want to distance yourselves from Christians, keep doing and saying the things you're doing and saying against God. You'll get you're wish. Granted for eternity. Unrepentant Godless heathens, some of you. The Christians "at your work" don't want you coughing all over them, anyway.
You speak nothing but the truth!
No R43. It's hard to "hate" something if you don't think it exists. I have many friends who are christian, not fundamentalist, but they walk the walk and aren't nasty and condemning everyone to hell for eternity as you are or willfully ignorant of science as many are.
I'd say you are the most hateful one on this thread and the most likely to be destined for that place you fear.
No, R45, there's nothing hateful about telling the truth. You're just offended. Funny how you weren't offended until someone spoke up and defended Christianity. I don't fear hell. I fear The Lord. Ask your Christian friends to explain the difference to you..if you dare. And before you Godless heathens say anything else to further expose your total ignorance on the subject, when I say "fear," I mean, revere/respect. Please stop mocking God. Live how you want to live, but I'm begging those of you who constantly do it, please just stop.
I like people who question things. Who look up in the night sky and wonder. Who THINK.
Because no one knows what happens when we die, if anything. Who cares- you're dead. So why bother trying to fantasize this whole scenario of pearly gates and angels? Or twenty virgins waiting for you? Stupid.
Of course not, however in fairness, most very religious people let you know where they are almost immediately. It is rare to know someone for a while and not realize that.
Recently saw the Jeremy Lin documentary, Linsanity, at a film festival. He's the Asian American NBA star formerly with NY, now with Houston. Disappointed that a high profile Asian American, and Harvard grad, is doing it all for God in an Evangelical way, not even modest about it.
Our minister at church this past Palm Sunday made a great analogy in his sermon comparing some of the ways Jesus approached social problems with the way gay rights advocates are trying to change views. I love this about my church. Many, many religious people are really trying to follow the examples of social justice, kindness, and concern for fellow man that Jesus taught. I look forward to going every Sunday and find comfort in reminders once a week to think outside of my own skin and try to see a bigger picture.
I don't judge people for believing in a god(s) or God(s) of any persuasion. They'll irritate me if it's all they talk about or bring it into conversation awkwardly.
Your god doesn't exist R46.
Calling the lot of us godless heathens is meaningless.
DL is a guilty pleasure of mine. There are lots of childish, mean spirited threads mixed in with the witty, thought provoking ones. I've nearly pissed in my pants, some are that funny. I am also a Christian. I belong to a very welcoming church - science and LGBT friendly.
Now out of respect, I wouldn't even dream of quoting scripture to my non-believing friends- or HERE of all places. But this being a Holy Week I thought I'd share this reading that our pastor used in his sermon Sunday:
"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." 1 Cor 1:18
Im not an ignorant flake. My intentions are not to be preachy. But when those have this revelation of what the cross represents, you can never look at things in the same way again.
As my fabulous 'heathen' Auntie used to say "F*CK YOUR G*D"! I loved her so. She had more ethics than any right wing christian kook.
#49, when you think about it, Asians would make awesome Christians- and that's not a compliment. They'd love all those rules and honor thy father shit.
But they'd probably have to stop drowning those baby girls.
A lot of Chinese who have immigrated to North America are Christian, R55.
South Koreans, too.
Always. Religion is bizarre and on its face, highly suspect.
R43 = Westboro Baptist Church member.
Go rub your clit on Phred Phelps.
At the end of the day, it's still an invisible sky-friend, and it's retarded to believe in it. There's been no reason for humans to believe this infantile crap for hundreds of years because we have real, verifiable explanations for the nature of the universe and we don't need to rely on stories about talking snakes, mud-and-rib people, virgin births, zombie sons, and people flying into the clouds.
It's infantile, and anyone who professes belief in it justifiably loses the respect of intelligent people (even if the smart people don't say so to your face, even if they don't acknowledge it to themselves, they lose respect imho).
Keepin it real: You can have your invisible sky-friend or you can roll with the smart people. You can't have both.
R53, doesn't it bother you - even slightly - that your religion is so convenient? People question the logic of belief - we've got an answer for that. The fact that Christianity has an answer for everything, and that the answer is always so fantastic for those who believe - love, salvation, eternal happiness - that it raises my hackles instantly. If it's too good to be true - and let's face it, eternal salvation is pretty fucking good - then it's probably bullshit.
I'm an avowed and outspoken atheist. I can't have any other position, and I cannot stand that the majority of religious people (and the churches themselves) seek to meddle in secular affairs. But one of my closest friends is a pretty committed Christian, and I think the reason that we get along is that she never, ever brings it up, and vice versa.
I have also done quite a bit of work with people who adhere to indigenous spiritual beliefs (which are more rigid in many ways that Christian belief since they operate without hypocrisy). I think their beliefs are completely nonsensical but I don't say anything because their beliefs are entirely their own, with no attempts at influencing others.
Islam and Christianity seek to influence and dominate public policy so much that I can't tolerate them as institutions. But I'll respect individual beliefs if they aren't preachy or hypocritical.
Having said all of that, the most painful experience I've dealt with in the workplace was a woman who made basically every decision based on astrology. It's not just organized religion that's irritating.
You don't know anything about his beliefs other than the fact he believes in something, and you immediately distance yourself from in, most likely because you lump him together with other religious people. One aspect of who he is, that's now the only thing you see.
Congratulations of your bigotry.
Yes, OP, I understand exactly what you mean.
I too have been really disappointed to learn that a few people I know and respect were, like, uber religious with the Christianity.
I'm sorry and I mean no offense, but it makes people, to me anyway, seem much less intelligent.
R61 I was a cynically ,world-weary atheist one year ago. I suffer from addiction and my son who is jailed on drug charges, suffers from addiction. I am in a 12 step program. Until recently, I couldn't give 2 shits what the hell anyone else believes in. DL is pretty much the last place I ever thought I'd be sharing, but, if anyone cares to know...we will all suffer in some way, just like Christ did on the Cross.
I actually changed my family practice doctor when I found out he went to a local Southern Baptist Church.
Learning something like that changes everything you thought you knew about someone.