Here we go again. A Washington flower shop has refused to do a Gay customers wedding bc of the owners 'relationship with Jesus'
A Washington State couple, Curt and Rob Ingersoll, were turned away from Arelene’s Flowers, their longtime florist of 9 years, after requesting to book their wedding with the flower shop. Owner Barronelle Stuzman politely declined saying “I just took his hands and I said I’m sorry I can’t do your wedding because of my relationship with Jesus Christ” and that she believed marriage should only be between one man and one woman.
Ingersoll said he respects her views, but was shocked this had never come up as an issue before since the couple frequently sent flowers to each other. He said
It came as a shock to me because I’ve had a nine year relationship with Barronelle and have never thought there was a reason that she wouldn’t..”
Stuzman denied she discriminates against gay couples, saying
We hire gay people. I have friends that are gay, that wasn’t the issue. The issue is that I just didn’t want to participate in the marriage.
Ingersoll posted his story onto his personal Facebook page a few days after the incident occurred last Friday, and said the his story spread like wildfire, mostly from supporters.
I’ve had hate mail. I’ve had people who want to burn my building, I’ve had people say they’ll never shop here again and tell all their friends. And I’ve had other people say thanks for standing up for your convictions and we’ll shop here and we’ll back you in any way we can.
Check out the comments she received on her facebook page and watch the local news report at the link also an explanation of how she broke the law in Washington:
The only way to show people what the deal is in situations like this is NOT TO SPEND YOUR MONEY WITH THEM! This shop owner doesn't care what anyone has to say about her, nor does anyone else like her. The only way to hold these pukes responsible is to spend your cash elsewhere. Filing a lawsuit is just pompous, bitching at her is wanting to hear yourself talk, picketing her establishment just makes us look foolish in front of her and those who think like she does. Intellect plays no part in this. Besides, in any situation where there's an aversion to my money I gladly take it ro where there's no problem. TAKE YOUR CASH TO A BUSINESS THAT WANTS IT! It's that simple. Business is business and when these idiots let self-righteous and unrealistic virtue get in the way of keeping the lights on they'll think twice about just threatening same-sex marriage is to "traditional" marriage. Let's think with our heads, people--TAKE YOUR CASH TO A BUSINESS THAT WANTS IT! Chik-Filet changed their tune real quick, and look what's happening to The Boy Scouts. Their fundraising revenue is down. Money talks, not big fancy words. Why would you wanna communicate with ignorant fuckers and why give $$$ to fuckers who don't want it? 'Nuff said.
[quote]Stuzman denied she discriminates against gay couples, saying We hire gay people. I have friends that are gay, that wasn’t the issue.
I get so sick of that lame "I have friends that are gay" excuse whenever someone is trying to defend their homophobic bullshit. Please! You are not friends if you don't want to see your "friends" happy.
Hopefully this guy will never shop at her shop again.
Barronelle Stuzman? that's a name?
Remind her that Jesus was a fag who hung around with twelve men who were most likely almost naked most of the time. "Why don't you fish FOR ME?" said queer Jesus to the new recruits.
She's an idiot.
Mary! Get the fuck over it...the woman is a homophobic bitch, but she isn't obligated to accommodate some entitled egomaniac.
He shouldn't respect her views.
Actually, R4, if she's in business in the state of Washington, she is obligated:
Jill Mullins, of the QLaw Foundation,a gay rights attorney organization, said Stuzman did violate the Washington Law Against Discrimination, found in RCW 49.60.030, the Freedom from discrimination – Declaration of civil rights:
(1) The right to be free from discrimination because of race, creed, color, national origin, sex, honorably discharged veteran or military status, sexual orientation, or the presence of any sensory, mental, or physical disability or the use of a trained dog guide or service animal by a person with a disability is recognized as and declared to be a civil right. This right shall include, but not be limited to:
(d) The right to engage in credit transactions without discrimination.
We need to start asking business owners "Are you a bible-believing Christian?" or "Do you believe in biblical values?" before we lay down a large chunk of money for them. Screen them out before they can disrespect us.
[quote]The only way to show people what the deal is in situations like this is NOT TO SPEND YOUR MONEY WITH THEM!... TAKE YOUR CASH TO A BUSINESS THAT WANTS IT! It's that simple.
What a brilliant idea. I've taken your suggestion to heart. I ran to the nearest florist and bought a beautiful pink rose. I've got the receipt in my wallet and booked a flight to Seattle. When I arrive there tomorrow, I'll head for her shop and show her the receipt so she knows I won't spend my money with her. That will teach her a lesson, just as you suggest r1.
OTOH, if I want to save some money and let her know that she's a hate-mongering bigot, I could e-mail or post on FB but R-1 wouldn't approve of doing something that practical.
Can't wait for Wal Mart to have different sections and check outs. Gays and lesbians aisle 7 - 9, blacks on aisle 1 - 5, straight married breeders, aisle 10 - 14 and fatties only on 17.
This is shameful and these folks shouldn't be able to get away with this. Put them out of business.. NOW.
Please note she is in Richland, Washington, on the arid, eastern side of the Cascades and 200 miles from civilization. It is as conservative there as the Seattle area is liberal and the very definition of flyover country. We outvote those guys every election. They're just pissed because cows,sagebrush and barrels of nuclear waste can't vote.
relationship with jesus! hahahahahaha
Did Jesus use a condom when he had a personal relationship with her? If not, should we be on the lookout for a big bright star in the sky?
Quit taking My Name and that of my Son in vain. Also, as far as you're being in a relationship with Us, we've never heard of you.
God, If Barronelle is right then Jesus was an asshole. Thanks God for sending that jerk down here.
I am surprised -- considering the state of the U.S. economy -- that anyone would turn down paying customers
R4...shut the fuck up, asshole. You're worse than she is, seriously.
The saddest/ weirdest thing about her kneejerk decision is the men had been using her shop for years, sending each other lovey-dovey notes (that she had to type up on the cards), etc. They thought she'd be cool about it. And I don't blame them.
R17 This is why I like for people to know I'm gay before I get too friendly with them, because there's nothing worse than thinking someone is your "friend" only to find out later on down the road that they're a homophobic asshole.
As usual the glaring inconsistencies and blatant contradictions of the bible are ignored and the warped bible interpretation always seems to exactly align with the christians' personal beliefs - the bible says nothing about gay marriage, Jesus said nothing about gay marriage. I usually just say well I'm awfully sorry your imaginary friends don't like me, my imaginary friends like you and move on.
This can only happen to gays because gays are the only minority in the US that has no federal protections. In fact, the US sanctions this discrimination and participates in it...DOMA basically mandates discrimination against gays by making it illegal to recognize same-sex unions. You can thank Bill Clinton for this mess.
...and thus gay wedding businesses are springing up.
Newsflash: she isn't particpating in the marriage. She is selling a product to a consumer. STOO-PID business decision.
Jesus needs to come back and explain his message to his followers. Fast. Real fast.
I like the button that says "Jesus, protect me from your followers"
Doing fine with Isis and Bastet, thank you very much.
What the hell is up with this Jesus argument?? Jesus would be the first to one to hang out with gays, he loved everyone especially those outcast by society. Jesus Christ!
Another phony-baloney "Christian". Boycott the hell out of her
[quote]Boycott the hell out of her
It doesn't make a lot of sense for people in New York, Miami, and Los Angeles to boycott her, does it? It makes NO IMPACT on her whatsoever.
E-mail and Facebook are the ways to let the hate-mongering bitch know her ways bear no relation to the teachings of Jesus.
Is gay marriage legal in WA state? If not, is this really much different from a florist shop owner saying he/she didn't want to do flowers for:
2, 1st cousins (which is legal, but frowned upon by, say, Catholics)
2, 15-year-olds, even with written permission of their parents, because florist owner doesn't "believe" in underage marriage?
A released convict marrying - anyone?
My point - and I'm sure no one will see it - is that even though it's small-minded and reeks of prejudice, I would think that a business owner has some right to refuse to do business with EVERYONE, much like the signs one sees in bars or restaurants: "we reserve the right not to serve...", blah-blah.
The posters who say we should take our business elsewhere, have the right idea; even bgetter, the posters who say: ask a store, first.
Ya gotta watch too much regulation/laws for every fucking thing. You would hate to have a 300-lb 22 year old white trash roommate and be in some jurisdiction that said you couldn't kick him out after a certain amount of time/rent control. I have heard of such things.
So, R26, you're ok with someone refusing to do business with Jews, for instance? If you think that's different, then where do you draw the line? It has to be precise, this line. So, where do you draw the line?
They couldn't find a gay florist?
You can't throw a rock without hitting one.
I'm quite flustered by the people on this thread who are boggled by the idea of not being able to not support this woman by not giving her their business. It's obvious that if you don't live in Seattle you won't specifically be giving her your patronage. However...you can be as vigilant with boycotting business owners like her in YOUR communities. No one is suggesting that you leave your town so you can flaunt your decision not to do business with a florist in Seattle in her face. People like her are everywhere, trust me. You don't need to wait hear about headlines of a bigot on the opposite coast the become concerned about discrimination in your own community. Worry about spreading news like this about your local businesses around your own communities. Bitching about this woman on Facebook is pointless. There's someone like her in your own backyard.
Her relationship with Jesus?
Necrophilia's more moral than homo-sex?
R27, I see your point. But to assume that people are not discriminated against in very clever and covert fashions in establishments of business every day all over the world is narrow-minded. This florist is different because she actually articulated her blatant discrimination for her reasons that are justifiable to her. I'm a hairdresser and I loathe working on children. If I get a call to book an appt for a kid, then whoopsie, I'm "booked". I can recall a situation where my partner and myself, who are obviously a couple just by the way we interact with each other, were seated in a restaurant way out of sight of the other patrons. I could have caused a stink, but at the end of the day would have just embarrassed myself cuz I had no proof. Instead, we took our cash elsewhere and spread the word to our friends and family, and relate the story whenever the restaurant's name comes up in a conversation
[quote]I'm quite flustered by the people on this thread who are boggled by the idea of not being able to not support this woman by not giving her their business.
Please stop your mindless flustered blather. If we want to slam this hate-monger with e-mail from all across the nation, who the Hell do you think you are to order everyone to stop?
My town has one florist and they do gay events. I'm not driving for miles and miles to find some place to boycott just because you're flustered. Duh!
Now make yourself useful and go picket the Supreme Court or something. They may enjoy seeing some flustered queen prancing across the front lawn.
Her relationship with Jesus?
So necrophilia's more moral than homo-sex?
The nation went through all these same arguments in the 1960s with the black civil rights movement. If someone has the right to refuse to serve gay people, they have the right to refuse blacks or Jews or whites or women or whatever.
Get over it. Do your job. Stop hiding your prejudice behind imaginary gods. "Open to the public" means "open to the public."
[quote]Newsflash: she isn't particpating in the marriage. She is selling a product to a consumer. STOO-PID business decision.
She has a flower shop in a small town of 50,000 in the middle of the most conservative part of the state. The gays in WA state tend to be west of the Cascades (which is nowhere near the toxic nuclear waste scablands of Richland). In a good year, she might get asked to provide flowers for one gay wedding.
She probably gets asked to do lots of weddings for conservative fundie types though, especially with the Jesus relationship stuff. This is a signal to conservatives that they can "take a stand against gay marriage" by using her flower shop for their "Jesus approved" weddings.
Her business will be fine. It was a good short term decision for her - and from the looks of her picture she's pretty close to her nursing home years, so it doesn't have to pay off for long. Her business will probably increase for awhile, then she'll cash out and the shop will close.
Sorry, but religion is implicated when services are asked to be provided for same-sex marriages. That is not the case with race. Almost no religions assert that interracial marriages or black peoples' weddings are immoral or sinful, and such marriages or not prohibited by the Bible. Most religions and the Bible forbid same-sex unions of any type. You should not be able to force anyone to participate or aid something that contravenes their deeply held religious values. Further, in the 29 states that do not have any gay rights laws, one of the most potent arguments against such laws is that they will violate religious liberty. SOme of you are making a very good case for not extending such laws any further.
[quote]If someone has the right to refuse to serve gay people, they have the right to refuse blacks or Jews or whites or women or whatever.
Are you really that stupid R36? Have you never heard of the Civil Rights Act of 1964? It made it illegal for anyone to discriminate against any of those groups you mentioned EXCEPT gays. If you refuse service to black people the feds will sue the hell out of you. Same with Jews or women. Or even whites since race is a protected class. However, gays are not protected and in fact when Bill Clinton signed DOMA he made it okay to discriminate against gay marriage since he mandated that the feds do it.