I am 48 years old, I have an MBA, I was downsized in October of 2011 from a client management/sales position.
I look on-line for a job and I have received calls but to no avail. Much of my time has been spent doing huge amounts of (unpaid) eldercare management work for an Aunt with dementia in another state, transitioning her to a nursing home here in NYC and straightening out her finances and for my Mother, who is in her eighties. I go to the gym and museums as much as I can.
I reside with my Mom in Brooklyn and now have no more savings (except for my 401K, from which I am do not want to withdraw funds) but I have escalating credit card debt.
I know it sounds very shallow and this is where I will get ridicule but I was in senior management and having to work for Bed Bath and Beyond - if I am lucky to get such a job - is just so painful to me. Obviously if I have to I will.
So there must be some of you who have been in such an awful position - what did you do?
I died of starvation on the street.
Could you be consulting during this time? Start a coaching service or something on how to develop good relationships with clients or something? Even if you make no money, it would be good for the resume. Also start a blog and blog religiously...you'd be surprised that magazines and other publications will start asking you to write for them if you're good enough. Don't give up.
R1 you should have signed your post Fantine, aka Anne Hathaway.
You may need to move.
Good luck to you OP.
I just had to pack it in and prematurely retire.
It's a bitch. It's not fair. But if you're over a certain age, they don't want you. Your career is over.
I sold my house in the city at a profit and moved to a cheaper state where I could pay cash for a small house.
I thank my lucky stars every day that I was a lifelong saver….
Move where? And what should OP blog about? Eldercare? Unemployment? Student loan debt for useless graduate degrees?
Eldercare is a huge growing market. I agree with R2 start a consulting business.
Are you depressed? If you are, are you treating it?
I ask because being in your situation, you're at serious risk for depression. My Dad went into a pretty deep depression within 3 months of being laid off, and it got pretty bad. Depression becomes a cycle and it will be difficult for you to get a job if you have depression that is not treated.
I agree with the suggestion to start a website / blog about management. These little "extras" are just the sort of thing hiring managers are looking for to help someone in a stream of qualified candidates stand out from the crowd.
1) Take any minimum wage job you can get.
2) Create a profile on LinkedIn and use the connections to businesses and people you know.
3) Network, network and network some more.
4) Don't waste your time on job boards.
5) Use your state Dept. of Labor resources for job hunting seminars, resume writing instruction, networking skills, etc. In addition, it's an excellent source for job leads.
Elder care is indeed a huge and growing market -- and surely there are existing elder care companies that could use an MBA with sales management experience and the compassion to deal with the issues at hand. That's what I'd suggest -- FT work with an elder care company, plus consulting on your own.
Also, OP, life is long. I'm sorry this has been so difficult a time for you, but hang in there. You'll land on your feet.
Trader joes pays well. Seriously. I temped for several months and then got offered a job at the same place and have transitioned careers.
[quote]except for my 401K, from which I am do not want to withdraw funds
So you probably have a few hundred thousand in your 401K and we are supposed to feel sorry for you because you don't want to spend it?
I feel for you OP. I am in sales and management as well & have been through job loss. The post about you possibly getting involved into some sort of eldercare business is a good one. Massive opportunity in companies manufacturing dementia monitoring equipment, sales and marketing roles within assisted living communities etc. Your age( and you are not old!) would actually prove beneficial, as the industry appreciates life experience. Have at least 4 CVs and resumes for different industries and don't give up hope. You can do it.
Do not touch your 401k. r12 is a fool.
OP, yesterday is gone. You need to start at the bottom. Pretend the planet was hit by a worldwide catastrophe and humanity is trying to rebuild. Your forebears lived through the Depression, they toughed it out. Swallow your pride; get tough.
You're lucky you have somewhere stable to live. Edit your resume if you have to ("High School Graduate"). And take whatever job you can stomach.
Rosie the Riveter
OP, I feel for you. I'm thankful every day that I retired before this mess started. Have you considered signing up with every temp agency you can find? Surely they could find someone of your abilities some work. And those temp jobs many times can turn into full time jobs.
Thanks for the feedback and the ideas so far.
Now, I would not have said fool but R14 you are 100% correct about not touching my 401K. Believe me I see firsthand how expensive it is when one gets really, really old. The costs are horrendous, even with long term care insurance.
Therefore R12, maybe I wrote my post wrong, but I am not looking for anyone to feel sorry for me! I don't have children to feed or educate, that would be far worse.
The blog would have been a good idea - you cannot BELIEVE the stuff I have dealt with in the past 18 months. Maybe I can still move forward with it.
As far as being depressed, it is the gym that keeps it away, IMO.
R9 Gives some good advice OP.
I read that taking cold showers helps with depression. No joke, you can google it. Apparently we have 3x as many cold receptors as warm receptors in our skin. The cold water has some effect on the nervous system. You can acclimate to the cold before going for the cold plunge by gradually using less hot water when you shower or alternated between hot and cold.
OP start volunteering for a non profit maybe something connected with elder care. I found that every time I was jobless as soon as I started volunteering i got another paying job. Maybe it's putting out positive energy that gets rewarded. You old also start your own non profit too. Don't wait for someone to hire you - hire yourself.
I like the log idea too. You should chronicle the last 18 months. Even talk about how you de-stress through exercise. You'd be surprised how many people you can help.
Touch your 401K and touch it now. If you think it's going to be there in 15 to 20 years you're crazy. You think the government is going to allow trillions of dollars to just sit there much longer? Any country that has started a similar program has ended up confiscating the money and putting it into bonds and saying you'll get a little extra in a social security type program. Touch it and touch it now.
You never know what can happen when you accept a position. I started out at one job making minimum wage and just kept showing my skills and ability to be available and the position blossomed into more pay and hours. The other job, I had minimum hours and pay also and worked diligently until they saw the benefit of increasing both my pay and hours for that one as well. I'm happy/grateful for the jobs I currently have even though I am working like a dog (60 hours a week). I know I am lucky to have them. I also find the gym a great stress reliever. Better to do the things you're doing (gym, museums) that are healthy and educational rather than spending time wallowing in depression. Best wishes - I hope things turn around for you. I'm sorry I have minimal words of advice.
What did I do? Back in the 1990s I was in the same position. I took at job at WalMart. Not management, not operation. On the floor. I took the job and worked as if it was my life. Within the year, I'd found a job in my field.
Working at WalMart paid the bills. It also (re)taught me the value of work.
Suck it up at take that job.
Let me also support the elder care angle. Financial planning for people who have Alzheimer's in their family gene pool is, unfortunately, a big market. If you could put together a class about when to get power of attorney, etc., and take it around to churches/synagogues, continuing ed. venues, senior centers, and other places where seniors and their family caregivers gather -- I bet you'd quickly become a go-to person for financial advice. Personalize you presentation by talking about your own experience.
Best wishes to you.
OP thread is a perfect example of how we should not judge people who live with their parents after age 40
I can happen to anyone, even men with MBA
I made sure I did something every day to find a job. I also kept files on everything I applied for and looked into. It made me feel like I was doing something to move forward. Good luck.
I hear Home Depot is hiring.
I took a survival job. It sucked. Took me two years to climb out of that whole and find something better. But I did. That was six years ago. I say stay focused, move ahead and believe that the survival job is just temporary.
Madge the Palmolive lady
R21's tinfoil underwear is on a bit tight today.
R27 my grandfather works at Home Depot. He is retired and he loves it. He gets to be a know it all and get paid for it.
R21 seems to imagine that 401Ks are somehow in the control of the government. But what the government DOES control is the set of consequences if one taps into retirement accounts early. One has deposited funds into such accounts without paying taxes. Those taxes are due immediately upon the withdrawal of the funds, and penalties are imposed on top of that in the event that the withdrawal is premature.
Examples of countries confiscating 401K like programs: Poland, Bulgaria, Ireland, France, Portugal, Bolivia & Argentina. We have too much debt for the government to let that much money sit around untaxed and unspent. With our debt the way it is it just isn't going to happen.
I'm not a fool or a tinhat. I know the government has very little control over them now. A decade ago would you have said that the government would take over health care? The auto industry? Billions on failed green companies? This sequestration bullshit? A fiscal cliff? I know I'm a piss ant poster on DL but go read some non loony bin financial adviser pages. The info is out there now.
It will start with thing like a required percentage of a 401K to buy government bonds. In California 3% must now be "invested" into the public pension program.
OP, check out the link here and see if there's a consulting niche you could fill.
Become an RN. Seriously. Check out your local universities for RN programs - with an MBA you can probably get a license within a year. THEN with that license in your hot little hand, not only is your income potential greater, but so are the opportunities to expand on your eldercare expertise. Becoming an RN was the smartest thing I ever did. You can do it too. It will pay for itself in no time and the job opportunities are varied and plentiful.
Nurse refused to give CPR to elderly woman who later died
Bakersfield fire dispatcher Tracey Halvorson pleaded with the woman on the other end of the line, begging her to start CPR on an elderly woman who was barely breathing.
“It’s a human being,” Halvorson said, speaking quickly. “Is there anybody that’s willing to help this lady and not let her die?”
The woman paused.
“Um, not at this time.”
On a 911 tape released by the Bakersfield Fire Department, the woman on the other end of the line told Halvorson that she was a nurse at Glenwood Gardens, a senior living facility in Bakersfield. But on Tuesday, the nurse refused to give the woman CPR, saying it was against the facility’s policy for staff to do so, according to the tape.
The elderly woman was identified by KGET-TV (Channel 17) as 87-year-old Lorraine Bayless. She died Tuesday at Mercy Hospital Southwest, KGET reported.
In the tape, a different Glenwood Gardens employee said that an elderly woman had passed out in the facility’s dining room while eating. She was barely breathing.
For several minutes, Halvorson begged the nurse to begin CPR, saying something had to be done before an ambulance arrived.
After the nurse repeatedly refused, Halvorson asked her to find a passerby or anyone who would be willing to help. Halvorson said she would talk someone through performing CPR.
“I understand if your facility is not willing to do that,” Halvorson told the nurse. “Give the phone to that passerby, that stranger…this woman’s not breathing enough.
“She’s going to die if we don’t get this started.… I don’t understand why you’re not willing to help this patient.”
The nurse could be heard talking to someone else at the facility.
“She’s yelling at me,” she said of Halvorson, “and saying we have to have one of our residents perform CPR. I’m feeling stressed, and I’m not going to do that, make that call.”
When Halvorson asked the nurse if she was going to let the woman die, the nurse said, “That’s why we called 911.”
After a few minutes, the nurse said the ambulance had arrived. The tape ended with Halvorson sighing.
The facility’s executive director, Jeffrey Toomer, sent a statement on behalf of Glenwood Gardens to KGET, the station reported.
“In the event of a health emergency at this independent living community our practice is to immediately call emergency medical personnel for assistance and to wait with the individual needing attention until such personnel arrives,” the statement said, according to KGET.
Bakersfield Fire Battalion Chief Anthony Galagaza said Halvorson followed protocol and that dispatchers give CPR instructions over the phone numerous times each year.
Bayless' daughter told KGET that she was a nurse and was satisfied with her mother's care at Glenwood Gardens, the station reported.
[Updated, 4:30 p.m.: KGET-TV said the patient did not have a do-not-resucitate order.]
I just became a 36 waiter, OP. I have two degrees, an MBA, and ten years working my field. For two years I wasn't able to find work, lived off savings and credit cards, had to declare bankruptcy. And now I'm a waiter. I'm that old waiter everyone sort of looks at with sad eyes and a pained expression of "gee, poor old guy".
But I kind of like it.
OP, see if you can make a LOAN from your 401K. Sometimes this can be done for reasons of hardship.
You could take it all as a distribution, but I would not do that if it was over 5K. Under 5K, maybe you can make that up eventually.
I feel for you OP...I was laid off last summer and can't seem to get hired anywhere. My background is marketing/PR, which is usually one of the first departments to get hit in any layoff. I'm freelance writing at the moment and just applied to work at a call center at an insurance company, and made sure not to mention my MA in my resume or cover letter or application.
I've been so depressed, don't know what to do, well-meaning people (including my family) who don't know what in hell they're talking about giving me advice hasn't helped either. Sometimes, I just want to throw in the towel and end it all, because it seems that it's just not meant for me to have a decent job or life. Fuck everything...
[r37]: I never think that no matter what age the waiter is. Only vulgar job snobs would think that. An awesome waiter or waitress who likes his/her job is better than a shitty CEO.
Suze Orman would tell you to get real about your finances.
No more gym membership.
No more museums.
Cut expenses everywhere.
Take whatever job you can get. Work is work.
And a temporary loan from a 401K can work, because if done for hardship reasons I don't think you get dinged for the tax penalties as you would - or it's less. I did that once when I was laid off and got 5K - paid it back within the time frame.
Right there with you, OP. I'm 45 and was laid off in May of last year from a Director level position in the SF area. Student loans are in default and other debt that I was trying to pay down. I have no family (parents are dead and siblings might as well be) and my friends have pretty much been MIA since I got laid off. Fortunately, I'm still on unemployment but I have tremendous anxiety as to what I will do if I don't find a job before it runs out.
I have never experienced such a dismal job market. So much seems to be targeted towards "entry level" and I see so many ads with managerial qualifications with an "intern" title attached to it. There are so many "job creators" taking advantage of the economy, it's disgusting. I'm depressed and have even contemplated suicide as an option if I cannot find work before unemployment runs out. I will not live in my car or a shelter. My confidence is at an all-time low.
I miss my mom who died four years ago. She was always such a source of inspiration and strength, especially in difficult times.
Thanks R40. I try to be a good waiter, but it can be hard on the soul at times...
Don't cancel your gym membership. You need good health and endorphins.
OP, I thought Congress extended unemployment for another year.
My heart is with the OP and all of the above posters.
Oh well, at least we're all in this together.
Even the well-heeled have to worry that they could lose it all in one bad market--we may be at an advantage in that we know how to fend for ourselves in the real world, on a street level.
I believe it will get better.
But here's what bothers me: when I see small children in public, I now REALLY wonder how tough it may be for them. I look into their eyes and feel so much anxiety becuse I DON'T know that it won't be hard for them.
Will their parents stay employed? Will they get decent healthcare? will they have access to a middle class life?
Good grief, they are so innocent and sweet, always smiling. I hope we, yes we, the ones who are suffering now, can give them a brighter future.
OP, I was in your shoes a few years ago and I'm a few years older.
I lost my job when I took FLMA to take care of my terminally ill mother. She hung on longer than expected and I aggravated a back injury when I was cleaning out her apartment. I used up all my FLMA time and my employer refused to let me come back to work. I was not eligible for unemployment despite 2 appeals. (Basically I was told since I voluntarily took the time I wasn't entitled.)
Things got really bad, really quickly. This is how I survived:
The first thing you need to do is do a serious review of your finances and cut everything but the essentials.
If you have a spare room, find a roommate. Cutting your basic living expenses in half can make a huge difference.
You need to be doing a 3 pronged job search--one search for anything, one search for an okay job and one search for the job you really want.
If you take a crap job, try and find one with later hours so you have time in your day to interview for a real job without taking time away from earning some kind of income.
Prepare yourself for nothing but rejection from all sides. The crap jobs aren't going to want to hire you because of your past experience and age. Neither will the mediocre jobs and the jobs in your field already think you're over the hill.
Get some kind of additional education or training if you can. I was already enrolled in a tech program at the local community college. Thankfully it is cheap. I got a certification that really helped get my foot in the door where I landed. It also tells these people who assume that you are too old, that you are open to change and learning.
All it takes is one person to get you back on the right track. Mine was a woman at a retail store who told me flat out I didn't want the temp job helping a crew tear up her store in prep for a remodel. I flat out told her my situation and she hired me for the project which was hell, kept me on for Christmas and past that.
Try and not give up. I was down to $45 in my checking account when I got my current job. It's not perfect, but it pays the mortgage and things are slowly getting better.
You also need to let go of the notion about the 401k. WHen push comes to shove, getting through right is more important than the nebulous future.
Here's what a nurse told me: the burnout is over having to lift obese patients. Obese patients are the norm, not the exception. Many people leave the field due to back and shoulder injuries. Therefore, there is always a constant need for nurses and caregivers.
Fema fat farm attendant
God bless the fat people because maybe there will be a job in it for us all.
Fema fat farm guard dog
Sometimes a seemingly dead end job can workout. The same thing happened to my sister as to the OP. She had to take a job at Burger King. Night shift even.
Made fries, waited on a nasty public, mopped floors, scrubbed toilets, all under the direction of a pimply 20 year old. For the first two months her body ached from head to toe. But her personality and work ethic made her go in there and scrub and serve with a smile and all the enthusiasm she could muster.
A year later she was an assistant manager at a corporate owned stores. Two years later she's a manager for two corporate owned stores. She's making right around a 100K a year. Places like the fast food and Walmart like to promote from within. It's just tough for them to find bright, educated people who start as toilet scrubbers who don't treat it like a dead end job on the way to somewhere else.
Speaking of Walmart my cousin started there as a stock boy and about 5 years later is making a great pay as a store manager. He barely made it through High School and is making more than a lot of people with advanced degrees. I'm not one of those make lemonade people but I hope I could go in with the same attitude and hope for the best.
Many cops and firemen are retiring and becoming RNS. They are big and strong and will not drop patients.
I have no advice but I offer my best wishes, OP.
I'm well-paid, a CEO at a small research company, but the federal budget and changing (horribly crude and overtly back-stabbing) climate in universities are leading towards a likely collapse. My partner's and my finances are in terrible shape, since we have aimed at expansion when it looked like things were better. So your and the other people's experiences here help me think and prepare. There's no use avoiding reality, since it will hit you in the head anyway.
OP, Keep up your going to gym and look after your physical appearance. Apply to all jobs which look promising for MBA on job search web sights every day as well as getting several head hunters to be looking for you, if not already done this.
I left worst job of my life and did this. The new job was opposite, in better setting, better quality of people - educated and intelligent - I did not know it would happen, although I had faith it would work out for the best. I did go to interviews which were dead ends, however, in the end the right job finally did show up. Also, check with alumnae association of college (s) you attended to see if they have any contacts...
Have you thought about real estate, OP? You've got the sales background and the market is picking up.
Also, have you been to headhunters? A lot of them offer just in time opportunities, where experienced people are parachuted in for a short term fix. Not totally stable, but it could be an interim solution.
I'm on your side. Good luck!
Wow the fatties are ruining the backs and sholders of nurses? When will fat people realise their huge tons of flesh effect others? I have a feeling they know and still don't give a fuck.
OP you need to be doing something. The longer you are unemployed, you will have to explain to prospective employers how you are spending your time. They like to see people with energy and initiative.
I know this is demoralizing time for you and you may not realize that you're weighted down and discouraged. So yes, absolutely. Find something to volunteer for. And make sure it's something that uses your skills.
If you're a good administrator, or you can do strategic planning or write proposals to funding agencies, or coach young men or women or do something related to training and development,I mean delivering meals on wheels is great, but it won't do the trick.
Find somewhere to volunteer even if only twice a week. You live in NYC. There are a million opportunities for volunteering. There are progressive Jewish synagogues, at least three or four in Brooklyn that have all kinds of programs.
The point is you can meet prospective employers thru these organizations. Make your life interesting. Re-energize yourself. When we get into a rut, sometimes we take these mundane, energy-sapping tasks and they end up eating all our time up. Don't give in to that!
Hang out a Brooklyn Flea. Maybe you can volunteer some of your business training to some of the incubator small businesses that are popping up. There are non-profits that aid small businesses. You could be a small business "doctor" and help them succeed, or learn why they're failing.
The real issue here is that of the imperious middle-aged white collar white middle class unable to accept reality.
You could spend years sending out thousands of resumes to achieve nothing. No one wants you. You've been retired.
Break into that sacred 401K and use the money to start any sort of business. Be it a food cart or a table at flea market. Or buy into a franchise or an existing small business where you'll draw a salary and have somewhere to go to everyday.
The alternative seems to be to be a drone at a low level chain-store peeing into a cup on a command at unlivable wages, living parsimoniously until "retirement" and then dying.
WHAT do did you learn while getting an MBA?
OP, quit looking for a job, and start figuring out ways to make money. MBAs aren't dumb.
We are all mexicans now, so to speak.
Fortunately for us, they have provided examples of how to survive with little, and how to initiate small business income with no references and little education.
White-collar jobs will be outsourced if possible. Watch the George Carlin videos--he tells us the truth about America. He is a bit too cynical for me however, I appreciate his humor.
We are on a downwardly mobile slide but so-fucking what! Give love and enjoy the show.
OP, you sound like a good soul.
I have no answers being in much the same position but I wish you well.
OP, I am not trying to sound crass or mean and I'm not trying to make a joke, but I have to ask. Since you mentioned an elderly aunt with dementia you're relocating to NYC, does your mother who you are living with rent or own the place in BK?
Is your name on the title or the lease? God forbid anything should happen to your mother, and I'm sure you don't want to live off her, but you need to make sure you have a roof over your head. This will pass, and you'll be on your feet again, but you need to insure your security as much as you can.
OP, I'm in the same boat. I'm 49 today and cannot find a job in my business. I've applied for a Starbucks job and even housekeeping to no avail. I thank god I have parents willing to pay my rent and my car is paid off.
OP, you may have cut some corners - like not paying $18 a month to start threads of this nature on DL.
Thanks for the advice so far; it has been very helpful.
R60, VERY GOOD POINT - yes, my name is now on the title and I have power of attorney for my Aunt and my Mother.
We live in a 2-family home just about 3 months ago I said made my Mom face the reality that our second floor apartment which was empty for over a year would not be used by my Aunt. I rented it to a family of four - the father is Egyptian and owns a food pushcart on Madison Avenue; the son, who is in college, says with pride "My Dad own's a business on Madison Avenue". They pay the rent in cash too, lol.
I have otherwise sold a lot on Ebay, which netted me about $2,000.
I appreciate the stories about people re-starting art-time and hourly jobs which lead to something more significant. I think that is my best bet at this point.
By the way, I prepaid my gym membership not long before I was let go, so I have that through the end of this year thank God. You cannot believe how it helps me - both physically and emotionally. My appearance does matter now more than ever.
R62 - DL costs $18 a year, not a month!
I have been in the same position and ended up in a job I really like (teaching in a University) after a few years in my 40s working in retail.
Part of what helped was that I pay off all my credit cards twice a month and never let a balance carry over.
From what I hear from others it is what saved me. I may not have had the same income but at least I had no debt. As long as I could meet rent and utilities I was fine.
The plot thickens.
This poor waif not only has hundreds of thousands of dollars tucked away but also owns a house in NYC generating rental income.
OP while I understand relocating is not a real option in your situation for others in the same situation I would strongly look at metro areas in TX. (yes I know alot of DLers trash the state and rightfully so in alot of areas but the big three, Houston Austin and Dallas are all quite liberal thriving areas where jobs at all levels are easier to come by)
I would also look at doing something on your own rather than looking at a low hourly positions. Residential property management, eldercare (group homes are a up and coming alternative to skilled) sales and or leasing at senior living complexes or senior living finders similar to an apartment finders. Good Luck
R42, That's rough. Is it possible to get out of the Bay area? I lived there 4 years and it was difficult to get work and of course ridiculously expensive to live there. Not sure that would be possible for you to do and also still collect unemployment. I relocated to a flyover state. It didn't kill me. Most important was finding work and not being so depressed I wanted to off myself.
Jesus Christ OP shut your big maw. You left out way too many details in your original post.
OP, you've gotten a lot of good advice here. The one thing I feel compelled to add is that you absolutely have to not let yourself get into any more credit card debt, and one way or the other pay off the CC debt you have. Compounding 19% interest is the path to life-long slavery for someone in your position. Shred the fucking cards until you have a stable job. Take a 401K loan to pay them off if you have to. For now, if you can't afford something (including food) don't buy it!
Not really possible to get out of the Bay area since I don't have connections outside of CA and NY. I've put feelers out in other states but nothing has stuck. I get interviews and on a couple of occasions, I was one of the final candidates but didn't get the job. Right now it's hand to mouth...
I don't own a house. I live in a studio and have already cut out non-necessities. I have been living on a bare bones budget for almost a year which is how I can afford to live on unemployment. I have yet to pay taxes on unemployment received last year, too. That's another major stomach-turner for me that's lurking around the corner.
Unlike the OP, I don't have an MBA or a 401k Just a BFA and a shitload of credit card debt, most of which was accumulated while I was taking care of my mom. I was her caregiver for almost two years when she was dying. When I made the decision to care for her, the economy had yet to implode. Never did I expect it to take a turn for the horrible like it did....
Not sure what my place is in this new world or if it's even worth the effort to stick around. I'm tired of it all...
R42 did you get EBT? I did. Only two hundred bucks a month but it's free food.
I feel for you. You sound resourceful. Did all your friends shine you on? That's happened to me. I used to think of myself as a fool based on my previous friends, choices and actions, but I had to let that go. Why can't there be some kind of quasi-ridiculous but life-affirmng commune/farm to drop out to? There used to be.
caregivers will reap the bounty of good karma and benefaction soon enough. Don't worry. keep going, keep your head up.
Caregivers acquire a certain look-they look like Care-Givers. That is a prestigous attribute, soon to be most desired in our hurting society.
And don't think that no one notices--they do.
feel better dear
R72, haven't applied for EBT but when I was laid off, I used their online calculator to see if I qualified and was told I didn't. Not sure why given that all my income is unemployment and I had less than a thousand in the bank when I applied. Maybe it's my car (paid off) that might be considered an asset although it's not worth all that much... I took it to mean that you needed to be starving and living in a cardboard box to qualify for something like food stamps. $200 in grocery money would help me out considerably. When I got laid off, I thought I'd find work within six months. I'm sort of blown away that I'm pushing a year and haven't found a job still and that's what makes me crazy.
The only friends who seem to really care are my neighbors (awesome people and I am so grateful for my good fortune in the neighbor department) and my BFF in New Jersey...oh and my boss from about ten years ago. I stopped relying on friends to lift me up a long time ago so I'm not surprised that friends are scarce when the chips are down.
And thanks, R73. I hope you're right...
[quote] She was barely breathing. For several minutes, Halvorson begged the nurse to begin CPR
You do not start CPR if the person is still breathing and alive.
So "not as this time" was the sound response.
OP, you sound like you're in a good position but are too stressed to realize it. You didn't plan on being the CEO of a huge corporation anyway did you?
Take stock of your position and what your priorities are.
You say you want to safeguard your retirement funds so you need income to overcome any temptation to tap into it. You seem to have no housing costs except maybe to help with the utilities - I am assuming the house is paid off. You and your mom have income from the rentals so there seems to be sufficient funds to pay for other housing costs like property taxes and repairs.
You mentioned the rental income is cash. Please do not be tempted to neglect reporting all the rental income. Not worth it and your tenants have no loyalty to you.
If you are going to take a lower paying job until you can get a better offer then use it as an opportunity to work at a job or a location you've always wanted to. The beach, a fish market, a toy train store, a cigar store. Obviously there's no guarantee you'll get these jobs because there may be many applicants but for instance if you were interested in a museum or an art related job you could also start volunteering your time for other work.
Like sports? What jobs are available with your favorite teams or arenas? Can you do a lesser job for one of the sports teams in the NYC area? How about for a theater or music venue?
Always been interested in being a fireman or policeman as a kid - still interested? See what civilian jobs there are?
My investigator is leaving the area (I am distraught) because she got a good job with the fed govt (Just Dept) as an investigator for the civil rights division. So they ARE hiring - sequestration be damned.
You just need to figure out what you need financially to live and become the cool guy who left his high powered, high paying job to relax and have fun with a fun job for a while. There's a certain cachet to that if you work it right. it's believable to me that a 48 year old might want to wind down and not be desperate at all - especially since you have property (or will be inheriting it) and a nice nest egg.
And you do NOT need a gym to stay in shape. Buy some damn free weights and a dvd.
Good luck. You sound like you'll be fine. Be happy - don't worry.
R42, hang in there. I'm in the same boat but living with family (well, I'm related to them but they aren't really "family") in a spare room. I have a BA, lost my job almost 5 years ago, ran out of unemployment and am now doing cater waitering. My college loans are screeching for payment and other bills as well. I also contemplated suicide.
I'm hating just about every aspect of my life but am determined to not let these, hopefully temporary, circumstances beat me. Others have been through worse. Many are now going through worse around the world. Just keep looking for a job in your field and something will come up. Change is the only constant. And these dark days have to be changing soon.
Shave your head of hair and sell it.
OP, you do what every person who can't get a job does. You go back to school and get a teaching certificate and teach.
It's not good out there and there is no end in sight. I wish our president would worry more about putting people back to work than being a movie star.
Don't let people think you're a dinosaur. Shave decades off your CV. Remove any dates attached to schooling and any positions prior to 1990. 1995 is even better. You have no choice but to fudge and massage and focus on it detailing with ACHIEVEMENTS rather than dates. Don't allow anyone to exclude you by assuming looking at your CV you're a Baby Boomer. If you are, unless you're a super high achiever, you are effectively dead to the market. The recruiters themselves are just out of diapers these days so they don't like dealing with fossils.
The day before the interview get the grey dyed out & get a hipster suit. In a surreal paradigm where 23 year olds pitch themselves as seasoned social media senior executives, under no circumnstances can you appear old.
I have a car. I went and got food stamps. I told them I had no income, told them about the car, and told them I feared eviction. I got the EBT card quickly. I spent a full day there going through the process, but it was efficient. Go vegan and monitor what you eat. It can last a month (barely) I need the food to get a new job...
r42- You sound lovely, please don't give up. Think about all the good things that your Mother wanted for & how much she loved you. I know good things lie ahead for you. Send out a ton of resumes and do temp work until you find isomething permanent. If you have to take a lower paying job in the meantime, do. It does not have to go on your resume. Sending good thoughts for you. I have been there...
OP, I started betting on sports. I hit it big and it is now my career.
Take the retail job, whatever you can get and be glad, work hard and you'll eventually own the place if you're smart. "client management/sales positions" are not real jobs. They're just fluff we can lay off if they come around and bother us.
Of course, the question arises that if this situation really throws you so much and causes so much emotional disturbance, were you ever really suited for senior management?
Management is a tough field, so maybe working at Bed Bath and Beyond is a better fit.
I have money in the bank but I think I should get welfare because I don't want to pay tax on it.
Dude, that is why it's in the bank. It's your own stupidity for tying up your money. Pay the tax and use the money.
Since you haven't worked in two years, the chances of you getting a job that paid what you used to make is zero, so you have a lower tax bracket anyway. As for fines? That's life.
What are you gonna do when you have a real problem. Fuckin' loser.
A friend of mine had to rop out of grad school about three years ago because of the economy. He went to bartender school and he is now making nice money, having a ball and living in Aruba.
[quote] Become an RN. Seriously
Don't. The market is saturated with new grads and they're not going to hire a 50 year old new grad when they can get a 22 year old. Not happening.
[quote] Take the retail job, whatever you can get and be glad, work hard and you'll eventually own the place if you're smart. "
Yeah, right. OP is going to own Bed Bath and Beyond.
Anna Wintour (Editor of Vogue) worked at a porn magazine when times were tough for her.
I'm a video editor R90 and a couple years ago, I couldn't get a job editing pron trailers in the valley! I think I came off too clean cut. My lack of tattoos and scabies may have been an issue.
OP, I might get on Meetup and try to join athletic or cooking groups, something not necessarily job-related - a club that wealthy, connected, lonely people might attend. Join one, and act rich, like you work for fun. See what happens, since the tried and true approaches... aren't.
Take an entry level job in a field you've loved as a hobby. When going for these jobs omit any higher education. It may threaten the person responsible for hiring you. It will give them a heads up that you're planning on running things as an educated, efficient person down the road if you like the fit, possibly replacing them. Work it with gusto and consider it payment to becoming an insider.
Do NOT withdraw from your 401k. These funds are probably exempt from creditors. Take a look at the exemptionsminmyour state for bankruptcy purposes. You may be able to walk away debt free from credit cards and stuff. see a bk attorney, and then another one. I am always very nice to the people I meet at bed and bath etc. it's not hard tomfigureoutnthat many of these people are highly educated and working their due to down sizing.
Bartenders meet guys, get great tips and have fun. They party every night and if they're great listeners, they could write novels from all they see and hear on the job. Never a dull moment.$60K at minimum.
If the government thinks it's going to take over my 401k without raing taxes on the rich to 40%, they've got another thing coming.
What do people who keep saving not to take money out of your 401k think people who have exhausted their all their savings and have no income should do?
"Shave decades off your CV."
If you're a top, your services are in great demand. In the gay world, tops are about 1-in-20. Charge $20 to let them blow you. $50 for a fuck. All tax free.
Look at NYC civil service exams. Some agencies also hire via resume.
Also check out employment opportunities at USPS in about 10 days. It's not a permanent position or well paying, but it's better than $0. ;)
I know a fairly unambitious guy who managed to get a job at a coffee shop within weeks of applying. OP, you need to set the bar lower...and also consider moving away from New York City.
Curriculum Vitae, R99. AKA, resume.
I agree with those who suggested temping. I left a lucrative job in NYC in '03 without having another one. But I had gone to several temp agencies to put myself "in their database." I was without a job for about 7 days before I got a 2 day assignment. Less than a week later, I had a temp job that became permanent. I worked there for 2 years before finding a better job in my field.
Now I realize my situation was different but I posted it to say that, a temp job is not the worst thing in the world. They can become permanent, as others have pointed out.
Also, a job with little to no stress may be just what you need, OP as you're taking care of others. I wouldn't mind a job where I could get a good night's sleep without worrying about some aspect of my job.
Take the Job at BB&B, if Offered
Have you ever thought of selling your ass if you are a cute guy?
Here we go op. Some good advice.
First of all, rather than waiting for someone to rescue you with that great job offer---rescue yourself. That means looking at what you know, what you can do, then go do it.
You are 48 with an MBA and work experience and client management skills. You've also learned something about elder benefits and planning. Consider consulting in this area. People need advice and good advice about this stuff is hard to find. Go online, look up info on financial planning and benefits planning for seniors. Have a notepad with you. Make a list of all the things you don't know and will have to learn if you consult in this area. Go learn it and then start networking with the people who could give you referrals. See what professional designations are out there for financial planners and fp for seniors. You may want to get trained.
Insurance Sales-Sr. Benefits.
Nursing home insurance, medical insurance, gap insurance. A lot of so-called financial planners are just insurance salesmen selling annuities etc. Nothing wrong with that, but become an expert on planning. Some things you need to know about the insurance biz.
1. Ins. Agencies get money to train new agents. They make a profit off of this, it's an iportant source of revenue. As a result they will take on any jerk, pay them a training allowance, get them to sell policies to everyone they know then watch them crash and burn. The training is bad and they never give these people good leads. THe agencies WANT these guys to fail so they don't have to share good leads with them, and the policies they do sell become "orphan accounts." The agency makes money off of these accounts, enough to cover their operating overhead. You have an MBA. If you go with an agency to sell senior benefits, you want to make sure they really want you. Tell them you want the best they have to offer in training, and support. BETTER than they are planning to give to the guy with the jr. college degree who got laid off from the delivery truck. You want their best and you will give them the best, and make them money.
Leeds. Of course you want to generate your own through referrals, but don't let these agencies kid you. They spend a ton on advertising and generate some primo leads. You want your share. They problem is that those leads will go to the top guys, the insiders. The leads they will give your are crap. You want a shot at the best they have to offer. If an agency won;t give it to you, tell them you'd rather go with another agency.
I think providing some sort of paid service to seniors is the way to go for you. The learning curve is reasonable, plus your age is an advantage. 48 is perfect. No one wants to take this sort of financial advice from a kid. A little gray at the temples inspires trust.
What about getting trained as a masso-therapist specializing in seniors? You could work for yourself. Does health insurance cover this stuff? Medicare? If it does, you could make out like a bandit. Market yourself to doctors. They can make the referral and you can charge the ins. cos. or medicare.
Get fit. Looks count. I realized that I was limiting myself and my career opportunities by putting on too much weight. 75 pounds to be exact. Hey it happens. I took charge, changed my eating habits, hit the treadmill everyday and I do some light weight training for conditioning. Took off 26 pounds sine early January. I'll have all 75 off by the end of summer or mid fall, Meanwhile I feel great and my self-confidence has soared, and that's no small thing.
Best of luck and don't forget...don't wait for someone to save you, save yourself. Fight back. You can do it.
Thanks. R103, now that explains why I get unsolicited emails from insurance companies.
R105 Thank you R105, I'm R103. I see other people on this thread have made similar suggestions regarding areas of elder care where you might find a career, including selling medical devices, products and such. They look good, I would reread them if you haven't already. R104, you aid annuties suck. They suck if they aren't the right product for you. If an annuity doesn't fit your particular needs, they do indeed suck, for someone else, an annuity could be ideal. If the OP pursues this, he will want to be come a sales PROFESSIONAL and that means mastering the skills of CONSULTATIVE selling, matching people up with the right product. He does need to be wary of companies who will want their agents to push a particular product regardless of the needs of the client. They all do this sometimes and he'll have to deal with it. I appreciate you comment however.
An MBA is a joke, everyone got one in the 90s. I was a manager in a hotel and I had a desk clerk and a reservationist and a bellman who had MBAs.
And that is when the economy was good. Everyone gets an MBA, that's a sign that the guy finished with a bachelors and had no idea what to do, so his parents paid for him to go to grad school.
I read somewhere that an MBA is no big advantage unless its from one of the big, Ivy League type schools. Like my law degree, MBAs have become ubiquitous.
You're delusional, R107. I have an MBA from Stanford. I received it in 2000, and I walked into a job making *85k annually. I worked 80 hours a week back then (and work close to it now), but that's what I made. And I landed that job, the same job I have now, mind you, without even trying. Shit, I didn't even know enough to wear a belt to the interview. I thought my suit coat would cover up its absence.
OP, you've been given spectacular advice on this thread. I actually warms me to see people take the time to do this. This site can be so full of hurtful bitchery that I don't frequent the way I used to. In any event, I truly think you may have to consider moving. Are at least applying for jobs in Chicago, LA, Philly, etc.?
Chicago Philly or LA????? Why would you suggest locations with high cost of living to someone looking for a job and with little funds. Try Atlanta Dallas or Houston. All three are boom cities and have lower costs to live. Tx also does not have an income tax or any taxes on food purchases
In Texas scorpions come into your house at night and walk around on your carpet.
It's full of roaches as well. BIG ones.
And chiggers, whatever they are.
R109 I have an undergrad business degree and in 2000 was pulling in just over $100K and working at most 50 hours a week.
Oh and I graduated university debt-free.
OP, I don't have any advice, but I'm sure you are not alone in this situation (this country doesn't like to think about such things, let alone talk about them) but I hope things turn around!
Business degrees are a dime a dozen. That is the sad, sad truth.
OP, Come'on a year of muesuems, and your mother hasn't slapped you?!
You've been quite fortunate not to be faced with such a reality sooner. I hope you realize having a career evaporate in smoke is equally painful blow to every person regardless of education, title, position or seniority. Clearly you're accustomed to operating at a higher rank and feel menial work is beneath you at your age. If so remember, not everyone else thinks the same, our path in life has different meaning for each person, be respectful.
Go to whichever University campus is sponsering recruiters and show up with your résumé. If they ask why you're there tell them for continuing education and personal growth because you believe it's good to "never stop learning". Tweak up the finale of your "senior mgmt gig" by telling the truth - you loved what you did for so many years, that door closed, but you still have more to contribute and invest again professionally, you're willing to do whatever it takes to get started, and when is the soonest interview date.
Make the most of all the years ahead by keeping an open mind my friend and please don't show up on here again until you're hired.
R110, OP needs to be applying nationwide and that includes cities with high costs of living. He needs to take the first job offered if it's in his field.
There are high end temp agencies that pay a decent hourly wage - based on a $400k to 60k salary (maybe more) with increases negotiated by the temp agency for long term placements. They also provide health insurance after time. My friend does this in DC and one of her temp positions landed a very well paying job with one of the biggest PR firms - she was making $90k when I knew her. After 5 years she left that position and went right back to the temp agency and they again placed her in several well paying placements - not at an equivalent $90K but at $50 or 60k - with excellent international firms & organizations. Each of those placements offered her a permanent job but she wasn't all that interested in their field. Since she was able to manage on the lesser income (at times she supplemented it with second job projects through friends and contacts for extra $$) she used the time to explore what she really wanted to do and it was to return to her international background and experience in nonprofits. She also worked on and got certified as English as a 2nd language teacher.
Isn't OP an accountant. I would think an accountant would be very valuable to those pricier temp agencies. Big companies are always doing audits, etc.
Here's the wave of the future OP:
Bring your Aunt and Mom along.
OP, can you give us an update? I'm R103, I'd really like to know how you are doing.
Me too. I'm a fellow job hunter going on 2 months.. and it's such hell! I'd love to know how to find those high paying temp agencies. I'm seeing in the range of 10 to 12 dollars an hour.
[quote] I go to the gym and museums as much as I can.
You might try acquiring a JOB with all your free time! Just TAKE ONE!
For those of you interested in temp positions, check directly with the companies/organizations that interest you. Universities, for example, hire temp workers directly (i.e. not from agencies) and they pay well because they avoid the agency fee. My cousin temped with HUD for awhile. They paid her $27.50/hour to do data entry. It was boring but she socked away $$ for three months (about $7K after minimal living expenses).
Good luck to everyone on the job market.
Thanks, R123. Wow, I'd take a data entry job that paid that in a hot minute. That's a great salary.
Anyone else out there job hunting? What sucks the most, is the time it takes between applying, interviewing, follow ups... it takes weeks and weeks.
R109 80 hours a week? It's lot. Ok, I am European, so I work much less per week for less salary, but living here doesn't cost as much. 80 hours! Do you have vacations (more than two to three weeks in a year)? I am NOT trying to be nasty, I just don't understand, how people in US are able to work so much. Do you want to or do you have to? Please explain.
All you trying to get a job I've read some really good advises. Use them and all the best on your job hunting. My advice is, take any job and then keep looking for better one(s). Then at least you have some income and your future employee(s) will see you're active, not afraid of any job and able to get a job.
OP, it's been 7 months since you posted. How are you? What are you doing? I'd very much like to get an update. (I'm the guy who posted a some long winded advice about senior services.) I hope you are doing well.
Wow. I remember this thread. I contributed to it...
I wanted to add to anyone who is struggling what worked for me. I applied for well over 600 jobs in the course of a year. I interviewed for many, some multiple times. On too many occasions, I got myself all worked up over an opportunity only to crash when it didn't work out. It was a really hard time for me and I contemplated suicide a number of times.
About two months before my UI ran out, I joined a local FREE career networking group for people over 40 who had a college education and at least ten years experience. I did a mandatory career bootcamp which covered everything from PARS, power statements, elevator speeches, networking, interviewing and the "hidden job market". After graduating from the bootcamp, I was allowed to go to the group meetings. My first meeting I met someone who helped me get a job in a startup. The pay isn't great but it's better than UI. I work from home and I have 5,000 shares available in stock options. Getting this job was easy...no lengthy interview process, no salary history or reference check. I met someone through that person in my group and boom, I was offered the job. So far, so good.
I am not a networker but I really think it's important in this job market that is so competitive to get out of the comfort zone and force yourself to network.
Good luck to you all.
[quote]And chiggers, whatever they are.
In polite company we say "chigroes"
Look into MTurk for extra cash (it adds up if you're dedicated). Go to reddit.com/r/hitsworthturkingfor to find surveys, etc. that are worth the time. Don't do the transcribing jobs.