Seriously, just fuck them. I hope every single person who works for them has to watch their closest loved ones crushed beneath an overturned vehicle.
That is all.
the IRS is just there to carry out the increasingly arcane and fucked up tax code. blame your wimpy representatives in the government who can't get their shit together and get off the subsidy and tax break teats to fix it.
A friend went to work as a lawyer for the IRS and he was somewhere between positive and neutral about them at the time. It took less than a year for him to begin seething with hate for the IRS because he watched them routinely go after small fish while they ignored major tax evaders. The incident that caused him to turn against them was when they auctioned off the farm of an elderly widow.
The DEA does the same thing, going after street dealers while those for whom they work go free. I've heard ATF is notorious for the same thing. The more egregious your crimes, the less likely some federal agencies are to prosecute you.
I always hope they'll be hacked and lose all the info on who owes what, but naturally they must have serious back up on it all. I've also heard of a lot of people quitting the IRS because they couldn't stomach how heartless they are.
Time to defund for starters and then replace this rogue agency. Enough of their apologies and promises to do better. They've said that for years. They are a modern day Gestapo used by both Democrat and Republican administrations. The Fair Tax is the way to go. You get your full paycheck with no tax taken out. Everyone pays at the cash register when they buy goods or services. No loopholes. You do get a rebate for any taxes paid on essentials like food. Check out the Fair Tax website.
And tax the churches !
I hate them too, but I have to agree with R1.
The real culprit is the despicable and spineless political establishment that has produced a perverted, impenetrable tax code that would provide Kafka with the stuff of a dozen horror stories.
They provide loopholes for themselves and their donors and anyone else rich enough to afford comprehensive and very expensive tax avoidance advice, while forcing everyone else to spend days tearing out their hair trying to figure out how to calculate what they owe (and you always do seem to owe, don't you? That's because you probably don't have a team at Ernst and Young figuring out which of your assets you should be holding via a Guam-based shell company!).
And now the government is cutting enforcement resources, which means the IRS will concentrate more than ever on the low-hanging fruit of small earners and businesses.
The reason they don't go after "big fish" is that they tend to pay loads of consumption (sales, hotel, telephone, etc.) taxes, and other taes, including property, employer, etc. It's just good business to let them keep spending.
They do this even with average people. I've owed my stat4e government about $3k for years, but in that time, becuase of the nature of my work, I've paid more in consumption and other taxes to the state than most multimillionaires. Of course it'd be nice to pay them off, but it's not like I'm not paying other taxes. Rest assured, if I ever acquire property, or wealth, the state will be there, ready to take its cash back.
The woman who lostw her farm could have protected it in bankruptcy, in all likelihood.
You're lucky (or smart) to owe state and not federal taxes, r8, because state tax authorities don't have anything like the pull of the IRS machine. Your state is unlikely to have you arrested at the airport, and I imagine the civil and criminal penalties for failing to pay your state taxes in time are significantly lower than for federal taxes.
Remember, one of the absurd things federal tax laws are supposed to do is to provide a basis for jailing people like Al Capone, who can't be convicted of other serious offenses.
And in spite of the 24/7 PRISM surveillance we've all recently discovered we're under, I don't believe for a second that either the IRS or state tax authorities have the capacity to figure out who's paying what in property, employment, sales or other taxes to make up for unpaid income taxes. Please, that would actually require a lucid cost/benefit analysis. AS IF!
Let it go, op, without the IRS their would be no USA.
[quote]without the IRS their would be no USA.
R10, there most certainly was a US before the IRS and there'd be one if we dismantled it. The agency was originally created by Lincoln as a temporary (!) way to help pay for the Civil War. Then, the politicians discovered how much they liked the extra money and the ability to fuck, er, fiddle with tax codes to manipulate society.
R1 is absolutely right. I've had to deal professionally with the IRS for over 30 years, and, believe me, they don't like the current tax laws anymore than you do. The real problem is a Congress that preaches "tax simplification" and then passes laws that do exactly the opposite, being impossible to administer without adding more complexity to the system.
A good example is the Earned Income Credit, an entitlement designed to benefit the lowest income individuals. Over the years, Congress has added so many qualifiers and rules - designed to avoid abuse of the system - that it's almost impossible for the average person to compute it with pen and tax forms, without using software or a tax professional. Congress recognizes that, and is talking about "simplifying" it, but ... well, you get the picture.
In all of my years dealing with the IRS, I have encountered a few assholes on a power trip (and have enjoyed taking them down, since they can't get away with the intimidation they use on taxpayers alone, since I am well aware of what they can and cannot do.) But the vast majority of IRS employees I have worked with have been reasonable, polite people, trying to do a job that society sees just one step above the guy at the animal shelter who puts down stray animals. Many get frustrated with the system and leave, resulting in a shameful turnover of staff, making everyone else's job just that more difficult. And today, with budget cuts coming from Congress (the same people who make their job uber-difficult), they are often short-staffed and poorly trained, to the point where I find myself actually feeling sorry for them, which is a new experience for me.
As far as them "picking on" lower income people, that is somewhat true only with regard to small businesses as opposed to big ones. The reason is financial: large businesses can generally afford legal advice and professional audit representation, making it more difficult and time consuming for the IRS to collect extra tax from a previous year. On the other hand, send a scary-looking IRS notice to a small business, saying they owe $XXX, and they are likely to just send in a check, because they are deathly afraid of having to deal with the IRS face to face. It's sad, because the IRS DOES make many mistakes, especially these days, and it is very possible that the assessment isn't justified. (While it is true that small businesses would be less likely to have professional tax guidance, and thus more likely to claim questionable deductions, they also are as likely to MISS legit deductions. I have had many instances when I am representing a new client in audit, and the end result is that the client gets more money back, because we found stuff they missed!) But the IRS plays the odds, and would rather hit up 100 small businesses to get $200 each, than one larger business for $20,000. It's simply easier and faster.
OK. I paid $63 for a seven-digit number called a PTIN on the 27th of December. Apparently, they expire every Dec. 31, despite when you actually get it. So, now I have to pay those assholes another $63 out of my -broke-as-fuck account for a PTIN renewal. Value? FUCK THE IRS!!!!!!!
I've never had a problem with them. They have a tough job because people like OP (sorry) take their frustrations with the entire system or even the world out on them. Taxes are the price of a civilized society. Have some gratitude that we've got paved roads and safe food, etc. taxes are lower today for most people than they've been for 60 years.
R13 Again, blame Congress, not the IRS.
[quote]But the IRS plays the odds, and would rather hit up 100 small businesses to get $200 each, than one larger business for $20,000. It's simply easier and faster.
That's an explanation, but it's definitely not a valid reason. We deserve so much better than that.
Actually, I work for the IRS and I can tell you that shit is fucked up on MY end because of identity thieves. They are fucking RAMPANT.
Over HALF of the shit I see on a daily basis is bullshit scams or identity theft. Really, you all have NO IDEA how many scams are out there. It's fucking astounding how many bogus tax returns are filed by scammers. I see a "real" return and I'm amazed.
There are fewer and fewer employees to deal with the scams and that pisses me off. I HATE seeing money wasted on fucking scammers/ID thieves. I'd much rather go after these fat cats who are gaming the system but there are so many fucking small-time scammers that we get bogged down in them. And it takes forever to prosecute them.
TaxTrollEA - I hope you don't mind, I have a question for you. I owed the IRS $2,000 last year and have been making monthly payments on time. I'm going to owe about the same amount this year. Do you think they'll allow me to add it to the monthly plan?
OP, quit acting as if you're the only one who fills out a tax form every year. You're not.
[quote]there most certainly was a US before the IRS and there'd be one if we dismantled it.
Yeah! Sure! Before the income tax, America charged TARIFFS on imported goods! Do you think for FIVE SECONDS the "job creators" would be allowing anything like that to happen!? What do you think would happen to the price of oh, say...EVERYTHING?
The IRS and Federal Reserve are far more evil than Putin.
[quote]The IRS and Federal Reserve are far more evil than Putin.
Hi, Libertarian Idiot Troll! What color is the sky today on Planet Libertarian?
Here on planet Earth, Putin referred to Eastern Ukraine today as "New Russia". To my knowledge, neither the IRS nor the Fed has ever tried to launch military actions against a sovereign country. So your comparison, as always, is six different shades of stupid.
Right up the ass.
May I have this dance, r22?
Every March 1st or so (not Feb 1st because the asswholes can't get the forms out on time anymore,) I take what my liability was last year and send the IRS that exact amount and enclose all 4 estimated forms. Then I can totally forget they exist for another 11 months. I use the Internet thingy to file, just fill in whatever and don't check anything. Fuck em if they want to dig through all the numbers which I can no longer comprehend.
It took me almost 70 years to get where I can do that.
Don Rumsfield sends in the same note with his tax returns every year:
"As in prior years, it is important for you to know that I have absolutely no idea whether our tax returns and our tax payments are accurate. I say that despite the fact that I am a college graduate and I try hard to make sure our returns are accurate.
The tax code is so complex and the forms are so complicated, that I know I cannot have any confidence that I know what is being requested, and therefore I cannot and do not know, and I suspect a great many Americans cannot know, whether or not their tax returns are accurate."
[quote]I owed the IRS $2,000 last year and have been making monthly payments on time. I'm going to owe about the same amount this year. Do you think they'll allow me to add it to the monthly plan?
When you agree to pay back taxes on an IRS Installment Agreement, what you are signing includes a condition that you remain "current" with all taxes within the length of the agreement. You violated that, if your balance due for the following year is more than the greater of $1,000 or 10% of your total tax.
Call the IRS at the number you have for your installment agreement (NOT the generic IRS number), and explain what happened. They likely will allow you to add it, with the caveat that it must NOT happen again.
The IRS has been so vastky underfunded that they go for middle income low-hanging fruit. The Republicans have made it impossible for the IRS to audit the Big Fish. Add to that the added unfunded responsibility of the ACA and you get exactly what the Republicans intended all the time, a frozen bureaucracy.
Audit the Koch fuckers.
R26 So why is he addressing this to the IRS? He worked in government for years--does he not realize that the IRS has nothing to do with how complex the tax laws have become? Wasn't he a Congressman?
They are federal employees which means they show up, count the milliseconds until retirement and nothing else if they can help it. They have power and, being small wretches, are drunk with it. They're jealous, which makes them evil and vindictive. I try my very best to make life miserable for them, but it's hard to do.
r30, you are just the middle class idiot that Reaganomics has spawned over three decades. Federal employees do a difficult job and are under unfunded mandates to accomplish almost impossible tasks.
If you hate government, and elect government haters, don't be surprised at the government you get.
I know of no government employee that would go out of their way to engage an asshole like you. Your needs would be met efficiently and they would head to the bathroom having dodged another bullet.
And them be jealous of assholes like you, hardly.
Fuck you r30 on behalf of all my friends who work for the Federal Government.
R31 is a social parasite.
r32 has a silver spoon shoved up his ass.
R31 has no earthly idea how pitiful his post sounds and never will.
The IRS does the best job it can under the circumstances. People who complain about it are usually either crooks or libertarians.
OP sounds like he's both.
r35 nailed it. OP is an ass.
Taxes are necessary. Unless you want to live in a barbaric landscape with nothing. No roads. No schools. No emergency responders. No military. No police. No museums. No libraries. No national parks. No public transportation.
OP - Move to Somalia.
No police = no more black men having their lives ruined by brownshirts for things that shouldn't even be illegal.
No schools = no more propaganda factories turning out idiots, and no more kids being bullied to suicide.
No military = no more incidents like the wars in Afghanistan or Iraq.
Government employees are enablers of imperialism.
that does it -- r38 = OP = idiot libertarian.
There are many libertarians here.
It's sad that you think there is just one.
You, and your friends are parasites that deserve the scorn heaped upon you.
You do nothing but steal and obstruct. You bring zero value, but instead inhibit creative actions.
You are scum.
[quote]Taxes are necessary. Unless you want to live in a barbaric landscape with nothing. No roads. No schools. No emergency responders. No military. No police. No museums. No libraries. No national parks. No public transportation.
The free market (not the Koch funded crony capitalist bullshit) can give ALL OF THOSE THINGS more efficiently, more humanely, more beautifully, and more effectively than bureaucratic bullshit lazy government employees.
No roads? Most new roads today are created by private companies building subdivisions. You never hear complaints about them being full of potholes or with collapsing bridges.
No schools? Until the government took over, schools were far superior. Public schools spend +/-$15k a year per student, while private schools spend half of that with better results.
Volunteer, privately funded fire departments and rescue squads service most of the nation.
No military. GOOD! All they do is kill for Exxon and Boeing and Citibank. We have guns. We are well prepared to repel invasion. We need to disband the military.
No police? You mean the ones who put brown and black people in jail for nothing? A private police system could easily be instituted if the government didn't actively suppress it. In many communities, they have a private police system, and it works well.
The Smithsonian is private. There are thousands of private museums and libraries.
The US has multiple wild fires each summer due to the incompetence of the public "management" of the government parks. Private companies could do it far better.
You really have no idea how freedom works, do you? You really are that drunk and stupefied on government cheese. How sad.
[quote]The Smithsonian is private.
Further proof of your ignorance.
are you the OP, r42 et al?
I can't think of a more effective argument against home-schooling than Libertarians.
I mean, [bold]Jeeezus.[/bold] Weapon's-grade stupidity.
Could the Libertarians post to their own privately-manufactured internet, completely free of evil gummint influence, so they'll stop posting their OCD spamming bullshit?
Everyone pays taxes, OP. You are NOT being singled out the way every other douchebag claims to be.
Until the government took it over, the Smithsonian was a private museum. It was endowed by Smithson but since he died childless the governance was given to the US Government. They have made it a shell of its former glory.
Your ignorance is astonishing.
Until private entities saw the power of the internet only a few people used it.
Once people recognized the power of P2P power, the internet grew.
If it was still controlled by the government, Datalounge would not exist.
Please try not to expose your legen-wait for it- DARY ignorance.
Government cannot create- it can only steal.
Private companies create. Please try to not be such an ignorant douche.
R46, you sick fuck---
[quote]Could the Libertarians post to their own privately-manufactured internet, completely free of evil gummint influence, so they'll stop posting their OCD spamming bullshit?
A free 'Net would mean stopping the NSA from spying on us. The "darknet" exists for people who want to hide from the spies, but soon the whole internet will incorporate these "anti government spying on us 24/7 bullshit"!
It makes me sad that people like you support the murder by drone, the spying, the lying, the stealing, the destruction. You are worse than scum. You deserve to burn in hell for your support of the murder of innocent children.
And as always, R50, you completely misread what I just said. I just want you to go the fuck away. We ain't buying what you're selling.
I mean, as long as you're going to use these threads as a one-man circle jerk, you might as well do it in the privacy of your own private internet.
So why don't you go hang out with the pedos and drug dealers on the "dark web", and leave us the fuck alone. I'm sure they'd be more interested in your psychotic view of the world.
You do see you're alone, and that several libertarians have exposed your tired bullshit? Or are you too stupid to see how stupid you are?
r21, r40, r41, r42, r48, r49, r50, and to quote you at r51:
[quote]Or are you too stupid to see how stupid you are?
Girl, mirror...mirror, girl.
OP & others, aren't you using TurboTax? Yes doing taxes is horrible BUT the last couple of years I've been doing it myself with TT and it's been great. It's also really difficult too but the great thing is I'm in charge of it, I go over and over and over it at the end like 10x and it's a win win for me.
Plus I'm signed up with the EFTPS (electronic fex tax payment system) and the EFT for my state. I just pay whatever I need to that way.
Before this I would go to HR Block and it would be way more stressful, plus I'd have to bring everything in.
This year in November or December I bought TT from Costco for under $100 then I started working on it in Jan or Feb up thru April 15. I put it in on April 15th.
We are a sm biz so I made sure I had no refund (I used it for ES - est tax payments for the 2014 tax year) for both the state and the feds.
We used to pay $1000+ for getting our taxes done at HR Block, so I love doing this instead even though it's really TOUGH to do.
I know enough about taxes that I could look at the Obama's taxes that were released and think, oh yeah, their taxes are not that difficult, they should have used TT, but of course they're far too busy.
What I really hated in the past was letting someone else fill out the forms online for me, that is HR Block and any tax professional. You have no control over that, but they ask you questions. I prefer to do this myself.
10-1 OP is white and male.
UM, R21, R41, R42, R48, R49, R50, R53, etc -- if there are so many libertarians on DL, why are they all you???
The one thing that saves us from libertarians is they tend to be amazingly stupid. So self-involved and self-absorbed that they don't learn things like, you know, TROLLDAR.
Go away, you libertarian freak. Go back to the Freeper boards where you belong.
to be fair, there are a handful of "regular DL posters" who are libertarian. Some not even American.
But yea, there are far fewer of them than they want to admit.
Kinda like Scientologists, who vastly inflate their estimated numbers.
R42 is profoundly retarded.
1. The USA can and has existed without the IRS.
2. Putting that point aside, just because the IRS does exist doesn't mean it can act with impunity or is above reproach.
3.Saying we should be grateful for safe food and roads, and not complain, is like saying, "Hey, we want a military, so there should be no spending controls whatsoever and everything the military does should be blindly supported..as we should be grateful it exists to keep us safe".
No, it's not.
Taxation is the foundation of modern society. We simply cannot have things - police, firemen, roads, sewers - without it.
The fact that libertarians believe that society could survive without central organization and revenue says more about their mental illness than about the fundamental needs of society.
There are a dozen libertarian posts on this thread that aren't mine.
Why does freedom scare you!
To whom or what do you owe $60,000?
If the IRS, then why?
If some other entity, then why?
[quote]The fact that libertarians believe that society could survive without central organization and revenue says more about their mental illness than about the fundamental needs of society.
It has never actually been tried, and you use that as proof that it doesn't work. You can't disprove a theory until you actually test it out.
98% of taxes (ex SS and Medicare) are paid by the top 50% of taxpayers.
If someone is bitching about taxes, they are NOT poor since the poor get more money than they earned.
The average one income household in 1970 could support a middle class life.
The destruction of our economy by the banks and big corporations in tandem with the Federal Reserve and US Government has destroyed the middle class.
The top 0.1% get richer by using the government to pass laws and regulations that benefit them, while the bottom 99.9% pays the price.
Most millionaires got that way via hard work. Most billionaires did it by "gaming the system" and using government regulations and largesse.
r69, I believe it has bee tried and we moved on when we were no longer hunter gatherers and created cities.
How interesting that the divide between rural and city has been so divisive over centuries.
But, I might say, that the rural communities do enjoy their electrification projects and the like. Easy to forget that it was welfare that brought them into the light of the 20th Century.
[quote]Then why do you remain willfully stupid?
Then show us the dozen other libertarians posting on this thread.
I have no problem with the IRS. R1 is correct.
I've been audited and the process was quite reasonable, simple, and not at all unpleasant.
Tax laws and regulations are unduly complex, but that's entirely the fault of Congress. At the same time, it's not that difficult to have some sense of what one's tax situation is and to plan accordingly. Alarmist radio and TV ads about some poor pensioner suddenly finding that they owe many tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars are disingenuous. One has to have a very considerable income of some sort to be confronted with owing with a "surprise!" six-figure tax bill. Grannies retired from a career of working part-time on the wrapping line at the lollipop factory and don't suddenly have six-figure IRS bills. People with very substantial incomes and who get very creative or very negligent with their accounting might.
FYI, there is a strong connection between hate groups & the IRS. For example, typically it's racist Teanderthals who rail against the IRS.
Maybe racism causes paranoia.
I have been trying to survive by doing odd jobs
as a Handyman. I made a little bit of money by being paid "under the table".
I was honest enough to make estimated tax payments. Well The Fucked up IRS waited for months to finally tell me I should have filed a form 1040 SE, as "you may have earned Self Employed income".
Well according to the Form I did not earn enough to have mattered, I owed nothing. My expected Refund was still what I had originally
I sent the form and a cover letter in. Still no Refund! What a fucked up bunch of assholes.
Hell must be full of former IRS employees. I wish they could go a cold night without Fuel for their furnace, as I have done twice this cold, snowy Winter!
My Refund would be $446 if I got it. I don't see how a multi trillion Dollar Agency is so
interested in saving the Govt. such a small sum of money compared to millions rich people get in Tax breaks.
Mr. Satan, please torment all deceased IRS sinners for all eternity. They are making life Hell for little guys like me. I want them to suffer, suffer, suffer!
[quote]But, I might say, that the rural communities do enjoy their electrification projects and the like. Easy to forget that it was welfare that brought them into the light of the 20th Century.
Exactly! Even President Harry Truman's own mother didn't have electricity until the Rural Electrification Bill! Think about the sorry state most of America's farmers would be in without the pure Socialism of the annual Farm Bill, and price support (price fixing) for the products they grow. Oh, and without Monsanto products, and the Farm Bill, we would be squabbling over a hugely diminished yearly crop output, with massively higher prices for EVERYTHING, so let's not lose sight of that.
Scroll at bottom of screen on WPIX-11 New York today said - IRS Employees Who Owe Taxes Getting Bonuses.
[quote] I have been trying to survive by doing odd jobs as a Handyman....I was honest enough to make estimated tax payments. Well The Fucked up IRS waited for months to finally tell me I should have filed a form 1040 SE, as "you may have earned Self Employed income".
Golly, you're right. How DARE the IRS simply spend millions of taxpayer dollars developing, updating and printing income tax forms and instructions, and actually expect people who EARN INCOME will have sense enough to check them out to determine the filing requirement.
You don't have to look far. Page 9 of the 1040 instructions makes it clear that, if you have income from self-employment (defined as income you earn that is NOT from an employer who withholds taxes on it) of more than $400, you are required to file a return.
They should have (somehow) KNOWN you were earning money under the table, and specifically notified you of the filing requirement ... not assume you'd take the initiative to find that out on your own.
[quote]I sent the form and a cover letter in. Still no Refund!
For how long? Again, if you look at the instructions, it tells you to wait 28 days, then call 1-800-829-4477 to inquire about a refund.
By the way, don't include "cover letters" with returns. That likely delayed the processing of your return by a couple of days. Not necessary, and a waste of your time and the IRS'.
I wouldn't be too surprised, if your income was reallty that low, that your return was delayed because they believe you could have qualified for the earned income credit. It can take several extra weeks to gear up to inform you of that.
Call the IRS and find out. Or, as you likely prefer, continue to bitch here like an imbecile.
[quoteIRS Employees Who Owe Taxes Getting Bonuses.
Doesn't surprise me, as the IRS has been totally inept in handling its employees for the past decade or more. No communication, and massive failure to follow existing systems.
Actually, IRS rules require that their employees be held to a much HIGHER standard than the general population, with regard to compliance with all tax laws. One unintentional failure to pay in enough tax during the year - even if the balance was paid by April 15th - can cause an IRS employee to be disciplined or possibly suspended. When they apply for an IRS job, it's routine for their returns for the past several years to get audited.
Absolutely no excuse, if the news item is true.
R80, your abysmal failure to grasp the rules of capitalization of the English language makes me feel pretty certain that your failure to file your taxes correctly was your own fault.