Manners are disappearing so quickly. No one says 'thank you' or 'excuse me' or 'sir' anymore. They walk into your path and say nothing.
Hint: when someone asks you to repeat something, be nice. Maybe they didn't hear you correctly.
And "not a problem" is not an alternative to "your welcome".
All of this really depends on your geography. In cantonese, m sei (you're welcome) seems quite formal, where if you say mo man tai is a much more warm and genuine expression. Similar things in English - just depends on where you are and the context.
STFU about "no problem". That trollery has played itself out 6 billion times on Datalounge and it's clear that, at most, only 2 other eldergays agree with you. It means exactly the same thing as "you're welcome", "don't mention it" or "it was nothing". It's a perfectly acceptable acknowledgement of another persons gratitude. I've never encountered a single person in the real world (or anywhere else online) that takes offense at someone saying "no problem". This is purely the creation and obsession of a tiny handful of Dataloungers and no one else.
And what the fuck does your headline even mean??? Has dementia set in?
Interviewing media host: "Thank you for your time."
Interviewed expert: "Thank you."
What happened to: "You're welcome," or "It was a pleasure," or "I enjoyed our discussion"? A "Thank you" reply to "Thank you" doesn't make sense.
Seems like the troll is r2.
It's certainly better than the trashy, 'no problem' though, r3!
[quote]And "not a problem" is not an alternative to "your welcome".
And "your welcome" is not an alternative to "YOU'RE welcome."
I say "sure thing" when someone says thank you. I think it sounds more genuine than you're welcome.
No problemo! I will say it now to every old man I meet hoping it is you.
[quote]Seems like the troll is [R2].
How am I a troll? Because I don't agree with you?
A troll is someone who posts provocative material online, in order to get a reaction from others. Like, say, trotting out a hackneyed topic that has already been discussed ad infinitim because you know it will get a rise out of people and spark a lengthy flame war.
Is that clear now? Yes?
It's threads like this that make me seriously think about buying a taser.
[quote]And "not a problem" is not an alternative to "your welcome".
Besides being a typo or worse (as R6 pointed out), this is BULLSHIT!
A "not a problem" is perfectly fine with me. Actually, the words don't matter; the attitude does. You can be a rude shit and sneer, "you're so welcome" and a sincere person who says "no big deal"... I'd prefer the latter.
I get called sir all the time and for the first time I enjoy it at 53. I now have a full head of grey hair.
[quote]Is that clear now? Yes?
No, because you ignited *and* stoked the fire.
You're so right, OP. I grew up in the deep south and I was taught by my parents to be kind and respectful. At forty-two, I open doors for women, I pull their chairs out in restaurants and a host of other normal civil niceties that are rapidly vanishing from the American landscape. Just today I went to lunch with someone who treated our server like crap, and it embarrassed me. I actually said something to my lunch companion who had the gall to reply, "Jesus, she's just a waitress for Christ's sake." I was shocked and I will NEVER go to lunch with that person again.
[quote]I've never encountered a single person in the real world (or anywhere else online) that takes offense at someone saying "no problem". This is purely the creation and obsession of a tiny handful of Dataloungers and no one else.
I can at least tell you of one company that hires over 30,000 in the hospitality industry that disagrees with you.
In the over-1000 pages of GOLD (an actual acronym) standards for its employees, Royal Caribbean International specifically dictates that all "thank yous" will be answered with a "my pleasure" and strongly advises against "no problem" or "you're welcome".
However, since many of their employees who deal with guests directly do come from countries (especially Caribbean Islands) where the "no problem" phrase is practically a national refrain if not a way of life, they fall short of strictly enforcing the policy.
Former Cruise Director
Somebody fetch the OP her smelling salts.
My favorite is "Mmmm hmmm" in place of "You're welcome."
For example, you walk up to a receptionist in a business office and you ask for information. The receptionist gives it to you. You say, "Thank you." The receptionist says, "Mmmm hmmm."
Happens on the phone, too. It boggles my mind that some people are too lazy to form words and instead make guttural sounds to communicate.
It's probably the same type of person that resorts to profanity on message boards to convey disagreement or dissatisfaction. It's the dumbing down of America.
R1, a waiter once reprimanded me for being too formal while ordering at a dim sum restaurant.
What a fucker...too bad my Cantonese is so crap, I really wanted to tell him off.
[quote]In the over-1000 pages of GOLD (an actual acronym) standards for its employees, Royal Caribbean International specifically dictates that all "thank yous" will be answered with a "my pleasure" and strongly advises against "no problem" or "you're welcome".
On Carnival Cruises, they're just happy if you don't respond to "Thank you" by shitting on the floor.
Repetitive Manners Troll alert
[quote]My favorite is "Mmmm hmmm" in place of "You're welcome."
Oh God, yes. Although I love, "Uh huh," just that little bit more.
"Not a problem" sounds so "frat boy from the midwest." It is arrogant sounding.
I see nothing wrong with no problem, not a problem or hmm hmm. You're welcome sounds smug, Your welcome sounds illiterate and saying, no, thank you is just repetitive.
"no problem" has the advantage of being clear. "You're Welcome" means what exactly?
You are welcome...to all my labor...to give me a tip...to kiss my ass?
"On Carnival Cruises, they're just happy if you don't respond to "Thank you" by shitting on the floor."
That happened to me.
Is "no worries" a substitute for "you're welcome," though, R19? I only know one person who says that, and I can't remember if that's what she means by it.
Most people would hugely prefer another person responding to a "thank you!" with a "no problem!" delivered with kindness and warmth, rather than than a chilly pro forma "You're welcome."
But the OP (and his rigid ilk) are the exceptions. He is obviously not concerned that manners are "disappearing" because of the reason that manners are supposed to exist in the first place (i.e. to show kindness and warmth, and to smooth social relations, and to put people at their ease). He's clearly interested in manners instead as some sort of rigid social code to be used to exclude others and to make people feel inferior.
If those manners are disappearing, then good: let them disappear. Kindness and generosity matter infinitely more than responding according to the exactly correctly worded pat formula.
"Jesus, she's just a waitress for Christ's sake."
That "just" business says A LOT about the way he was raised ... in a VERY BAD way!
"No problem" is a permissible response, as is "sure"; "my pleasure" is perhaps better, but does seem a bit formal.
As for ordering Dim Sum, my experience as a caucasian is that they'll usually explain a dish and I'll either say "yes" or "no", or they'll explain multiple offerings and I'll point to what I want.
"You're welcome" means "You are welcome to the thing you are thanking me for." Only an idiot wouldn't understand that.
To me, "No problem" is only a problem when it's used inappropriately. If I thanks someone for doing something for me that's special or out of the ordinary and they say "no problem," I think that's a very nice, appropriate response. But if I ask a waiter for a coke, and he brings it, and then I say "thank you" just to be polite and he replies with "no problem," that's just weird.
[quote]"You're welcome" means "You are welcome to the thing you are thanking me for." Only an [bold]idiot[/bold] wouldn't understand that.
Exactly! Now you know why some people in this thread can't comprehend that fact.
This thread is repeated every few months. Old people love to talk about "young people"(everyone under sixty)and how much worse they are now than back in the old days.
I started the thread in the link, wondering about whether people get tired of "thank yous."
[quote]I started the thread in the link
I never understood why people get uptight about 'no problem' as a response. To me it's a less formal way of saying, 'my pleasure'. Only a tight ass would get wound up about it.
[quote]I never understood why people get uptight about 'no problem' as a response. To me it's a less formal way of saying, 'my pleasure'.
I've come to understand it this way R37 . I am in my late 40's and to my ear "No problem" sounds lazy. It doesn't match "Thank you" I think in part because it's unenthusiastic and there is no reciprocal "you". It just isn't as kind and leaves the transaction one sided.
It takes two sides to make a successful and pleasant transaction. If I say, "Thank you" and you say "you're welcome" or "my pleasure" or something of the like then we both get a feeling of being appreciated. In a way, something more than "No problem" feels like "and I thank you for being a pleasant customer, unlike some of the dicks I deal with".
When I get the response "no problem" it always feels one sided, like the person saying it is just sort of a monolith and it made no difference to him/her whether we interacted well. It's just boring and lackluster.
That said, I understand that it is not how y'all mean it. Still, I do appreciate an earlier poster's use of "Sure thing". Sure thing, de nada, don't mention it are all much more positive and friendlier responses.
"No problem" just sounds like you take neither pride nor pleasure in your work.
But I realize it ain't going away!
[quote]to my ear "No problem" sounds lazy. It doesn't match "Thank you"
It isn't intended to. It's the casual equivalent of "you're welcome."
For the first time ever, a few months ago I encountered an actual person -- an older woman -- who said she hated the phrase "no problem." I burst out laughing thinking of DataLounge.
If you say thank you and the guy says you're welcome you sound like a conceited ass hole.
Which you prolly are.
Cool people say no problem or no worries if you're British.
When you really think about it, saying "You're welcome" makes less sense than saying, "it's no problem" or something similar.
[quote]And "not a problem" is not an alternative to "your welcome".
This complaint is just so stupid. I don't even understand it. Why is "no problem" not acceptable? What kind of an asshole does it take to be offended by "no problem" as a response to "thank you"?
Seriously, if THIS bothers you, YOU are the problem.
Why is the thread title "I said no"?
Who said no? To whom? And why?
And what does it have to do with manners?
I'm more concerned with a different part of OP's post: no one saying "Sir" any more!
It's true, you know. They're all getting uppity, I tell you!
OP cohort, class of '51
In both Spanish and French, the response to thank you translates to something along the lines of "it's no problem".
Yes, this OP is definitely an oddball. I wonder if he starts all of the anti-"no problem" threads. It's clearly an obsession with some tiny minority of people here, since we have a new thread on this inane topic about every 3 days.
I've never heard anyone complain or take offense at someone saying "no problem" in response to "thank you". Except on Datalounge.
The only times I want anyone to call me "sir" are when I'm sexual role-playing with a submissive, or when a stranger is trying to address me in public for whatever reason. I'll admit it's better than "HEY YOU!" in that situation. Waiters and waitresses may also use it for similar reasons, but only when necessary. Eye contact and direct speech usually suffices in a typical restaurant transaction. Other service people like hotel staff, sales clerks, customer service reps and medical assistants can usually glean your name from their files or your card info and address you as Mr. Whatever.
Besides that it is an archaic, overly formal term with too many disparate interpretations (see "Madam"). Once someone has my attention they can just talk to me directly unless/until I introduce myself. I don't need anyone calling me "sir" otherwise. I'm not a drill sergeant, a member of the nobility or a slave master.
[quote]I've never heard anyone complain or take offense at someone saying "no problem" in response to "thank you".
The defensive are oblivious that they are insulting people daily.
The one I can't stand is how the phrase "what happened?" suddenly replaced "what did you say?" When did that happen??
R46 is correct. The common Spanish response to Gracias (thank you) is De Nada (it's nothing) or no hay de que (it was nothing)
The common French response to Merci (thank you) is De Rien (it's nothing)
How about no biggie as a response?
[quote]My favorite is "Mmmm hmmm" in place of "You're welcome."
I hate that one too. It's sort of patronizing.
What the fuck does "Mmmm hmmm" mean? It means nothing.
Years ago when I sold stuff on ebay, it always bugged me when people would leave feedback 'No problems with this seller'.
That's not positive feedback, it's neutral, at best.
R54 what would have preferred they write?
R40, I think I worked for that woman.
But I do think she and the OP have a point when it's taken in the context of the service industry. If I thank a friend for something and their response is 'no problem', it seems fine to me.
However, if I am picking up my latte in the drive-thru at Starbucks, hearing the barista say 'no problem' makes me bristle. It's implying that there COULD have been a problem, but the person is cool with it.
It's one thing if your friend just gave you a lift because your car died and you're profusely thanking them ("no problem! don't worry about it"). But in what world is it a problem for you to give me my fucking coffee that I paid for? It's your JOB.
Saying "it's nothing" is quite a different thing, and I personally think it's a nicer response. I also prefer, "my pleasure" when dealing with customers.
What really drives me bonkers is the loss of "Excuse me" in our vocabulary. I think it's the rudest thing in the world to just suddenly start yapping to someone who is clearly in the middle of doing something and just expect them to know you're addressing them. It's obnoxious and egotistical, as if everyone is waiting around to take care of you.
There ain't no ladies now there's only pigs and whores
And even kids'll knock you down so's they can pass
Nobody's got no class!!!
No problem with 'no problem' here too. It's the intent and sincerity that counts. Any and all such pleasantries are better than the absence of same at some shops I use. Offhandedness is always more noticeable than any courtesy.
It's really much more about the tone. Both "you're welcome" and "no problem" can be said with an enthusiastic and sincere tone, or a bitter, sarcastic one.
I care much more about the tone and intent of the words than the actual words themselves.
r56 , I had to smile at the phrase "I bristle". I have to assume that you don't realise the origin of that phrase.
And please stop spitting where people walk!
And what would that be, R60?
Oh, god, I hate spitting, R61. A floggingworthy offense, IMO.
R2 is correct.
This is such a stupid fucking thread. Eldergays who think the world should never, ever change are so tiresome.
BLow me, r64.
Sorry, R65, I draw the line at 70 years old.
[quote]If you say thank you and the guy says you're welcome you sound like a conceited ass hole.
"Asshole" is one word, not two.
[quote]Which you prolly are.
"Probably" is not spelled "prolly".
[quote]Cool people say no problem or no worries if you're British.
Being "cool" isn't the same as having good manners.
[quote]In both Spanish and French, the response to thank you translates to something along the lines of "it's no problem".
Not really. The word “problem” – the source of all this dissent - is not a part of the phrases you are most likely referencing:
“De nada” (Spanish for “it’s nothing”) , “No hay de que” (Spanish for ”there’s no reason to thank me”) , “de rien” (French for “de nada”) or “il n'y a pas de quoi” (French for “no hay de que”) do not make the recipient feel like whatever he/she has expressed appreciation for could be – under other circumstances – considered a burden. “No problem” screams that. Maybe such controversial expression should be changed to “never a problem!”
Um, hog hair, R60?
I remember when this came into vogue in the late 70's.... it was the working class young people who started saying "No problem" instead of the more standard "You're welcome". The same type of people portrayed in the movie Saturday Night Fever, who put a bit of a premium on being tough and cool rather than smooth and refined. Here is the issue that grates on some people. The phrase "No problem" has the implied unsaid statement behind it "If it was a problem, I would let you know" or "I am not offended you asked me to do that". There is an unsaid implied assertiveness to it, that lets you know what they are doing to help you is conditional, not part of their station or job, and if you ask wrong or give them any side eye, they will go all Guido on your ass.
I never understood the idea of women being first or pulling chairs out for them, etc. etc. etc. In this day and age whoever is closest to the door goes in first and holds it for the next person. Women are as capable as men at pulling out a chair, for Christ's sake, it's not like 1850s South Carolina or something. As far as "sir" and "ma'am" are concerned, I suppose one might have to use it to get someone's attention, but to me any title smacks of some kind of phony deference and is folly. The way is toward equality and that means men can go in first, keep their hats/caps on (if they have them) inside a building and women can manage to pull out a chair for themselves. Quakers have always eschewed titles like sir or ma'am and even Mr. or Mrs. in the name of equality and I think they are right. All you need is a modicum of consideration for the next person no matter if they are male or female. The person upthread who said "She's only a waitress" ought to have their ass kicked hard.
I don't think I could ever date someone who had a problem with "No problem". I can't bring myself to get it up for anyone that uptight and prissy.
I see the "Lipstick and Prada Queens from Dallas" have returned to Datalounge.
"No problem" is clearly superior to "you're welcome", as the latter can sound sarcastic or condescending, whereas the former is relatively risk-free.
Feminism goes against the notion that men should open doors for women. It's demeaning to women and puts them in a place of helplessness and dependency. It's a relic of the Antebellum South and something I hope erodes significantly in my lifetime.
The worst are these wannabe "Southern Belles" who absolutely insist that men put out all of misogyny's greatest hits, complete with asking their father for their hand in marriage before they propose as if you're some piece of chattel to be bartered from father to husband.
I thought of this thread today. I had a person come to my house today to do some minor repairs. When he was done and all the transactions were completed I said 'thank you' and he said 'you're very welcome.'
After he left I noticed that he had a very unusual last name. On a whim I looked him up on the internet and the first thing that popped up was his mugshot for disorderly conduct.
Apparently not everyone who says you're welcome are all that POLITE.
oh for the love of people, 'No Problem' is trashy, and you know it.
'No Problem' is flip and rude.
'You're Welcome" is not condescending, it's proper.
Learn to respect other people and use proper language.
I'll take the drunken disorderly with manners over an ingrate. Thank you very much.
r74, I totally agree--if feminism gets rid of all this timeworn bullshit about women as well as men then I say long may it live. I am 58 years old and I still resent coming into a school building at age 10 with my hat on to have the big, fat, John Birch Society, fucked up principal snatch my hat off and hand it to me roughly as if I were committing a mortal sin. If etiquette doesn't promote equality and consideration we need to get rid of it. The south can be cordoned off as some sort of danger zone if letting them secede can't be done.
[quote]'No Problem' is flip and rude.
No, it isn't. If you twist it in order to interpret it that way, well, it's all on you. It's YOUR problem.
You're an idiot. And that's as polite as I can be about how ignorant and stupid you come off with this bullshit nonsense of yours.
Amen, R72. Amen. You nailed it.
It's "lip gloss and Prada queens from Dallas" not "lip stick."
"no problem" is not acceptable in a professional
office environment. I coach my employees, as
directed by corporate, to use "my pleasure"
when a client says "thank you".
Only eldergays care about this shit.
I usually say, Hakuna Mattata.
"You're welcome." is strictly an Americanism.
In France it's "De rien." which means "It was nothing."
In Australia it's "No worries."
In England people used to say "Not at all." or "It was my pleasure." Nowadays we say "No probs." or "Thanks. Bye!" or "No worries." (blame Neighbours), and in some horrifying cases "You're welcome."
As long as there is some call and response in words, the content of it is unimportant. Really, OP, if you get hung up on stuff like this, you might want to examine your arsehole for sweeping implements.
Damn, but some of you are determined to fight to the death for your right to say "not a problem" without impunity.
The phrase "not a problem" is attractive to people who resent having to be of service and so they slyly insert an implicit sense of having done you a favor just by handing you the coffee they are paid to hand you.
"Not a problem" IS a problem if you are performing a task for which you are paid. "no problem" is just as strange.
As pointed out by r56, "not a problem" is perfectly on target if you are doing someone a favor, but not if you are an employee talking to a customer or your boss.
Mr.Carson with the support of Mrs. Hughes, Mrs. Patmore and His Lordship
Why care so much what someone else says? Let them say what they want. Try not to read so much into it. Life is short, move on.
I hear "Non c'e problema" in Italian and "pas de probleme" in French all the time.
Really, people. This is not new. It is not just in English, it is not just American. And it is decidedly not a problem.
R86, just curious: how old are you?
[quote]Feminism goes against the notion that men should open doors for women.. It's a relic of the Antebellum South and something I hope erodes significantly in my lifetime.
Uh, men opening doors for women is derived from medieval chivalric codes. And I still think it's polite.
Any woman who objects can simply say, "Thank you, I can get it myself." And if she can't do that, or slowly stews and simmers about the situation and thinks it's some sign of her inequality, then she is so stupid she doesn't deserve the advances that the work of smart feminists has brought her.
Most women (I do it reflexively, it's how I was raised) are agape with awe and gratitude that I will hold a door, especially an elevator door and let them in/out first.
And there are many types of feminism.I have female friends who certainly believe, like I do, in equal rights, equal pay, equal opportunities for women, but also appreciate help with their coat or having a door opened for them. Their heads don't explode because the ideas are somehow wildly contradictory.
You can't really argue that life is short and "who cares" what anyone said and then get upset when people react to what you say.
If it doesn't matter, follow your own philosophy and don't react. Then you are consistent with your philosophy "life is too short etc"
For those who are genuinely wondering why "not a problem" is a potentially off putting choice of phrase IN THE CONTEXT of CUSTOMER SERVICE consider the following:
What triggers the annoyance, is the strange and ungracious implication that the action inspiring the thanks was even potentially burdensome. That's it. That is the entire issue right there.
"Not a problem" isn't a problem in plenty of other circumstances but it has strange implications when you are performing a task for which you are paid.
r88, in my experience Italians tend to use "prego".
Last week a client from Paris responded very strongly to a NYC barista who said "not a problem" with "of COURSE it is not a problem, why would you think it would have been a problem" Certainly an over the top response but the point is she isn't accustomed to hearing "pas de probleme" or "De rien" which translates "its nothing" in customer service situations.
It is all about context and life is too short to not consider context.
In the context of customer service, you realize the ma'am means bitch and sir means asshole, right?
I can give you your coffee with a smile on my face and utter the special phrases that your prissy highness feels the need to hear in order to feel that little extra holier than thou over those of us relegated to serve you, but IN CONTEXT 'oh, you're welcome, SIR' will have an entirely different meaning to those of us behind the counter (or just in the know).
Bonus points if you guess the special something we put in that coffee just for you, SIR!
Get off your damn high horse.
Better yet, eat shit and die!
r93 is clearly one of the staunch advocates of the "who cares" and "live and let live" philosophy of communication.
I imagine r93 is unable to self soothe sufficiently to grok that he has proven the point that the way people communicate is designed to have a specific emotional response.
No need to thank me, it wasn't a problem.
#86 nails it. "Noooot a problem" is passive-aggressive, as if the customer's very existence was dangerously close to inconveniencing the Server at any moment- but all is forgiven!
I remember when retail workers moved out of the customers' way on the floor, instead of the now-standard practice of plowing over them if they're in the path of the workers.
r91, I don't care from where any of the bullshit chivalry derives, it's irrelevant in today's world. So do you base being "polite" on doing it for 1/2 the population based merely on whether they have a cunt or a dick? It seems odd if you are a gay male. It shouldn't hinge on how women react to something you think you "need" to do--that is your problem entirely. Don't use me as your reference point for validation of something that's some leftover fossil of the slave south or something. If others do things and think differently from you, it's not necessarily wrong, just different and probably more enlightened.
I agree that R86 analysis is spot on, however another aspect to this lack of grace in manners has to the do with the abandonment of the strict social hierarchy that existed between masters and servants at the turn of the 20th century (Edwardian era England). The phrase No problem implies a certain amount of social equality between the parties when uttered by the staff, as if I am doing something for you as social equals even when I am not your equal. In reality nothing has really changed in the master/servant relationship. The servant/employee is still the servant and should be expected to respond with the expected dignity and deference of 'my pleasure your lordship." The absence of the social mores to support and reinforce that deference shown to the master is what allows the 'no problem style' of service to persist. The working class is no longer limited to a life 'in service' to the lord. Although the degree of social mobility that really exists today in our society is somewhat exaggerated to perpetuate the false paradigm of the American Dream. The no problems exist to perpetuate that myth. No problem is a subtle means of empowering the servant without really empowering the servant, similar to the exulted title of executive assistant when in reality they are still just the lowly secretary.
The "No problem" retort is even demanded by lunatics like the Abercrombie & Fitch CEO Jefferies in his flight contract with his flight crew when responding to a request from him or his guests. The fallacy of this type of respect for servants is all the more apparent with someone like Jefferies who treat their employees as nothing more than disposable prostitutes. I am sure he thinks that he is being nice to them by asking them to reply with that token sign of equality. The pat phrases and pleasantries are just a cover (a burying of one's head in the sand so to speak) to hide the desired strict hierarchy the master/employers really want, but they can't demand because society has moved on from the Edwardian era. Only someone like Mitt Romney who is so entitled and so disconnected from reality would make no effort to hide his contempt for his underlings. He would expect people to show him deference and respect and if they didn't, they would be summarily fired.
R86 is a stuck up full-of-shit moron.
Seriously. To get worked up when someone says "no problem" is just beyond the pale. It's far more rude in itself than anyone saying "no problem". So in addition to being full of shit, you're a goddamned hypocrite.
I think r56 has it about right.
"It's nothing"(in whatever language) is more like "don't mention it," --a polite and friendly alternative to "you're welcome." I also like "Happy to help" in some contexts.
But in a service or professional exchange, "no problem" can seem one-sided (taking the thanks without putting the thanker at ease, if that makes sense). It can seem like saying "I did what you asked and it doesn't bother me as much it could have." Or worse, "Yes, I solved your problem."
But these distinctions obviously don't mean much to most people.
You know who you are. It's a tough habit to break. Stick your finger in your cheek when you feel a 'no problem' coming on and replace it with, 'you're welcome'. You'll be amazed at how much more respect you will receive.
[quote]Or worse, "Yes, I solved your problem."
How is that worse?
And why the fuck are you spending so much time over-thinking and over-analyzing this to death, putting words in the mouths of others, and then condemning them for what you misinterpret, and what they never actually said or meant?
How delusional or mentally ill ARE you?
r101 the one getting worked up here is clearly you. There wasn't anything in r86 post that suggested he/she was worked up.
R86 at least had a point and a sense of humor about it.
All these posters screeching "eat shit and die" etc. come across as arrogant and humorless and compeltely reactionary.
The "hypocrite" is you getting all worked up over the way someone talks while your whole point is that it shouldn't matter.
No, R104, I'm not getting worked up over the way anyone talks (again, you're projecting your hypocrisy on to me).
I'm getting worked up at the idiotic judgment, the condescension, the looking down your nose at others, FOR NO GOOD REASON. It's ridiculous, it's stupid, it's a waste of time, and we've done this stupid argument to death here, and the anti-"No Problem" people have lost every time.
Time to give it up. Language changes. Deal with it.
my apologies r101, my post was meant to be directed to r99's heel twisting hysterics.
R106, you're still projecting.
The people getting worked up are the ones ranting against "no problem" for no good reason.
The rest of us are just getting frustrated with your continued idiocy.
If you want to get bent out of shape over a perceived (yet non-existent) slight, because someone says 'no problem' instead of the more cumbersome 'you're welcome'... that's all on you. It's your problem.
[quote]they slyly insert an implicit sense of having done you a favor
You are paranoid.
People going out of their way in seeking to be offended, will be able to find some offense somewhere, real or imagined (mostly imagined). These sorts of people are very sad, sad people.
Why in the hell would any sane person look to be offended because someone didn't thank them in exactly the way they prefer to be thanked? Seriously? What a weird sense of entitlement.
r105 calm down, the assumption that you are making is what is upsetting you, not what was actually said.
All your accusations are based on what you assume r86's point of view was.
If you like saying "not a problem" as a part of your customer service, go right ahead.
Nobody really cares what you think of them, if you resent them or assume they are assholes simply becasuse you took a job YOU feel is beneath you, that is your problem and your projection.
Think whatever you want about the people you serve, some of them probably ARE assholes but unless they abuse you, it really isn't any of your business as a customer service person what kind of character they have. Just be professional, know your job and leave it at that.
they just don't need your judgement about your own job or them in the form of some passive agressive response to you doing your job.
Just don't be alarmed if you get looks or no tips or if someone has a reaction to what you decide to do.
And the supreme act of condecension is sumarily deciding that a topic has been discussed sufficiently and by royal decree you declare it a done topic.
[quote]calm down, the assumption that you are making is what is upsetting you, not what was actually said.
Perfect advice for those whining about "No Problem" like the OP... not for me. Again... projection.
[quote]If you like saying "not a problem" as a part of your customer service, go right ahead.
It has nothing to do with what [italic]I[/italic] like. And I'm not in customer service. Again, you seem to be projecting something onto me that simply isn't true.
You must enjoy being wrong a lot, because you sure do flaunt it publicly here.
I'm an old-fashioned older Southerner, raised to have good manners.
But attitude is the important thing, not the words.
I know that if someone says "No problem" to me with a genuine smile, that he has treated me with respect and shown real kindness. Using specific words is not necessary. Even in France they have given up on such unnecessary "guidelines" of etiquette.
I do believe that showing good manners is essential, but one mustn't be so smug as to tell others how to express good manners.
OP and his ilk can fuck off with this "Not a problem" bashing. Face it, Mary!:
When someone says "Not a problem," they're not being passive aggressive or rude. It's simply a regional saying for, "You're welcome." And another thing, you uncultured twat, if you go to Europe (especially Germany), it's not uncommon for locals to say, "It is no problem" when they assist you.
I'm so tired of the bitter old queens on DL who miss the days of men wearing hats, ladies wearing dresses, and blacks using separate facilities. In other words, get with the times and quit trying to idealize days that have long passed.
R113= Voice of reason.
[quote]I'm an old-fashioned older Southerner, raised to have good manners.
People who brag about their Southern manners often use the words "please," "thank you," and "n*gger" like they're going out of style. Let's not pretend people from the South know shit about treating others with genuine respect.
Too bad they didn't teach you to read in the north, R116.
[quote]Let's not pretend people from the South know shit about treating others with genuine respect.
That's pretty much it - treating others with respect.
I'd rather hear "no problem" from a pleasant waitstaff than "it was my pleasure" from an embittered, condescending one.
Since coffee shops seem to be a popular place for some posters to stroke out over this, get over yourselves. Someone's handing you a cup of coffee, not serving you a caviar at Le Bernardin. Get some perspective.
R113 seems like a gentleman who knows what he's talking about.
But I will note that the most polite people I've met are Southerners. And the most cutthroat people who'll stab you in the back and screw you were also Southerners.
Just knowing the correct phrases (according to the Miss Manners police on here) to say does not make one a better person. One day OP will learn this the hard way as some young hustler screws him out of all of his possessions while smiling and saying You're Welcome.
Whatever happened to fair dealing
And pure ethics
And nice manners?
Defend the use of “no problem” all you want. It is simply an inappropriate and incorrect response to a “Thank you”. “No problem” is an appropriate response to “I’m sorry to cause you a problem”. Let me dumb this down for some of the readers…”Thank you” is a gift…”Your welcome” is showing acceptance and appreciateion..”No problem”.. is saying “I reject your gift”.
The thing that mystifies me is how some of you insist that "You're Welcome" is more cumbersome or burdensome to say than "No Problem". In what way more cumbersome? And how were some of you raised to have grown up thinking that "You're Welcome" is hoity-toity or condescending?
"No problem" is all soft consonants and I can't hear it over my rustling crinolines!
"I hear 'Non c'e problema' in Italian and 'pas de probleme' in French all the time."
Yes, but I'm pretty sure when you hear "pas de probleme" in French, it's someone's response to being thanked for doing a special favor for someone else. I very much doubt you would hear, for example, a waiter or a store clerk say "pas de probleme" in response to a customer thanking them for doing their job.
That said, I agree that people who say "no problem" in these situations certainly don't intend to be offensive in any way. I doubt it even occurs to them that this is not the best phrase to use in these circumstances, and I'm sure they say it just because that's what they've learned to say.
R116, My mother would have never allowed me to use the "n" word while I was growing up in the South. It is true that there were assholes in the South who did use that word, but I never would have associated with racists.
And by the way, growing up in Atlanta in the 60s, hearing the "n" word was a fairly rare ocurrence. I never heard it very often until I went to college in Illinois and Wisconsin. And Chicago was the most segregated city in America then, as MLK Jr. himself stated.
Did the freak OP ever explain why he titled this thread "I said no"?
Bingo, R113. Thank you.
What action a person takes is more important than their words.
For instance say you're out on the road and your car battery dies. You call for road service but you have to wait for at least an hour. A man stops by and offers to help jump start your car. Afterwards you tell him "thank you" and he responds "Not a problem"
Then you have another situation where you've ordered a cup of coffee from your local barista. He sizes you up and determines you're one of those prissy, get off my lawn elder gays who's a sucker for people who're polite. He wants his tip so he says "You're Welcome"
Now which one of those two people provided a more valuable service and which one of those two people were most sincere? If your answer is the barista then that just proves you're a non discerning person prone to making shallow judgment and that you're an easy mark for any con man.
So says r113 and yet it was Chicago not Atlanta that gave us our first black president. Atlanta area voted against him.
Distribution of racist tweets following 2012 US election.
Here's the rub, the buffoons say "no problem" responding to a "thank you" from somebody THEY should have said "thank you" to.....
Why is this thread titled as if it's going to be about getting raped???
[quote]I remember when this came into vogue in the late 70's.... it was the working class young people who started saying "No problem" instead of the more standard "You're welcome". The same type of people portrayed in the movie Saturday Night Fever, who put a bit of a premium on being tough and cool rather than smooth and refined.
I read shit like this here more and more. Is EVERYONE here an eldergay?
This thread should have been shut down right after R2's comments. He pretty much summed it up. Manners -- HISSSSSSSSSSSS!
R130, you just don't get it, do you? If some stranger is nice enough to go out of his way to jump start your car, and if you then thank the person and s/he replies "no problem," that's a wonderful response, because s/he is saying, "It was no problem for me to go out of my way and help you. You're welcome to the help."
But if you thank a barista for filling your order and he replies "No problem," that's in inappropriate response, because OF COURSE it's no problem for him to do his job. You were only thanking him to be polite, not because he did anything extraordinary for you.
Now, if you had asked something special of the barista -- if you had asked him to make the coffee in a very special, unusual way that's not on the menu, or maybe if you returned your first cup of coffee because it didn't taste right to you and you asked for another -- THEN I would say "No problem" would be a very nice, appropriate response on his part.
Get it now?
"Why is this thread titled as if it's going to be about getting raped???"
This is how rude people reply when you say, "Did you want lemon with your tea?". Instead of just saying, "No, thank you" or "Oh, sorry- no", they snap, "I said no"- like they're disciplining an ornery dog.
Thanks, r97. You sound like a real gem, well versed in etiquette--not to mention history! You obviously know how to get to along with others, and I'm sure you're just a special joy to be around.
A rare photo of r97, shortly after pontificating on the finer points of etiquette and chivalric codes.
R138 - it depends on how the barista delivers the "no problem", as to whether the tone includes a "my pleasure" or not.
If you order a coffee item on the menu and the barista makes it and hands it to you, and you say "Thank you," then "No problem" is an inappropriate phrase to use -- no matter how pleasant the tone -- because the barista is only doing his her job, so OF COURSE it's not problem.
There are lots of more appropriate ways the barista could respond, such as "You're welcome," "Sure thing," "Enjoy," or even "Have a great day."
So what I'm getting from this is it's OK for everyone to say "no problem" except baristas. This seems unfair and discriminatory.
I don't know about your job, R143, but there are plenty of things that most people do in the ordinary course of their employment that could still very much constitute a problem.
Before you prattle on about it not being the customer's concern, the notion that the customer is always right also went out of fashion quite a few years ago. Perhaps you've been in a coma? If so, congrats on your recovery and best wishes as you try to adapt to life in the current era.
Very well said, R130.
Nothing turns me off worse than an Edith Wharton queen.