I find it disgusting and sad how many gay men are okay with the "occasional" barebacking.
As if the terrible and on going AIDS crisis wasn't enough to convince people to wrap it up. Even now bareback porn is becoming all the rage again.
What happened to the big push and the strict condom culture that used to exist?
Cumwhore from another thread
R2 nailed it.
Honestly, I have very little sympathy for these guys. They know the risks, and have no one to blame but themselves if they contract HIV. Just as I have very little symphathy for smokers who develop lung cancer.
Ugh, yeah it's pretty stupid, but I wonder if R4 also has 'little sympathy' for car drivers who die in a crash, fats who develop diabetes etc, mountain climbers who fall and die, soldiers who are killed in combat.
No, it's not the same, but it's not entirely different either.
[quote]fats who develop diabetes
Are you kidding? Fatties get murdered here. It's kind of creepy how into fat bashing some people are here.
An oral HIV blocker is going to be the best solution. With PrEP showing so much promise, I'm hoping it's the answer people have been waiting for.
Yeah, R7, until the next AIDS comes along and is even worse.
[quote]It's kind of creepy how into fat bashing some people are here.
A little peer pressure, in these cases, saves lives.
STOP FUCKING COMPULSIVELY! STOP EATING COMPULSIVELY!
Exactly R8. Anal sex is always going to be a sexual act that can easily transmit diseases between people. Learn to appreciate the necessity of condoms until you are in a monogamous relationship with someone you trust.
[quote]Ugh, yeah it's pretty stupid, but I wonder if [R4] also has 'little sympathy' for ...soldiers who are killed in combat. No, it's not the same, but it's not entirely different either.
Combat is an intentional risk taken to help others. Barebacking (these days) is an intentional risk for no good reason.
How is this app allowed? It's for sex. Why would Apple permit it? They've banned so many apps. Aren't they afraid someone could end up murdered?
[quote]Honestly, I have very little sympathy for these guys. They know the risks, and have no one to blame but themselves if they contract HIV.
The problem is they're out there with all the other diseases that condoms don't protect against. You got HIV, odds are good you've got more than that.
[quote]Combat is an intentional risk taken to help others.
Yes, but ultimately it fulfils a desire with a very real risk attached.
Personally, I always use condoms, even with someone I trust. Even though I know I am HIV-, if I fuck, I still use a condom.
r13, if it's your first time using the app, you may not have anything, but the other person does.
Grindr is just disgusting. I have it for a laugh. I try to see if I recognize anyone from my neighborhood. I don't live in a gay ghetto. The profiles on there are so low, all vile queens. It's really depressing.
I was talking to a friend of mine (who's amazing), and he was telling me how a few of his exes were appalled that he wanted to use condoms until they had been dating for a while. I just find it hard to fathom that there are gay men out there who think it's no big deal to bareback. Hell, I'm always disappointed by my straight friends who have sex with girls without using condoms. Talk about irresponsible...
[quote]Honestly, I have very little sympathy for these guys.
Who's asking for your sympathy?
Seriously, are there any guys in NYC who are neither disease-riddled sex addicts nor paranoid celibates? Everyone seems to fit into one of these extreme categories. I'm an average, middle of the road guy who enjoys sowing oats (safely, of course) from time to time, but who rather be in a monogamous relationship with another regular guy who believes in monogamy. Is there anyone in the city like me and, if you, where do you meet them?
No. Sadly ... you are the only person in NY that feels that way R18. Nobody else shares your opinion.
R17 - all gay men who get HIV want sympathy because "I'm human and things happen!". 99% of the time, no it doesn't just happen.
Bullshit. I'm sick of sexual irresponsibility.
But PEEEEEEEEEEOPLE! We can't be so JUDGMENTAL! We need to UNDERSTAND why me and my friends like to bareback! You need to help us avoid STIGMA! We need to be accepted, regardless of how stupidly we act, and no matter how much death has come before us, I was too busy in diapers, and I NEED UNDERSTANDING!!!!!!
A lot of men using Grindr are married. I joined a group for married men who enjoy gay sex just to see what they're all about. One of the things discussed is how to keep the Grindr app hidden from their wives. A lot of them also use CL. There are more than twelve-thousand members of the group with dozens more joining every day. That was a real eye-opener.
HIV/AIDS are a huge risk, but there are many, many, many other diseases out there too. HPV is gross, and some strains (cancer-causing) are absolutely horrifying. Penile, and especially anal, cancers are quite scary. Untreated syphillis, gonorrhea, chlamydia, etc. are also trouble for your future health. Herpes is very prevalent among gay men and it is forever. So many people have the attitude of, "Hey, it's my life, mind your own business, asshole" or "Oh, smell her. She's a paranoid delusional". I do mind my own business, but I still try to warn people of the dangers out there.
Nearly 100% of gay men who use Grindr are sluts!
If you must use Grindr, just jack off with the partners you find. Do not exchange body fluids.
What I find so funny about the online reactions to this study is that whenever there's a new study released about 90% of gay black men being HIV positive or some such shit using the same kind of junk science as this study (I.e. a very limited number of people used, metropolitan area, etc) it is automatically taken as fact and believed, but people are so quick to try to deny this one.
The authors of this study are clever because it isn't broken down into age or ethnic groups. They're just studying people who use hookup apps, which are a very large cross section of the community.
Whenever the gay majority is reminded that they too have the same issues as those they spend so much time looking down on, the immediate reaction is always to shoot the messenger. Same with anyone who tries to say that, yes, HIV is a complicated and dangerous disease. Or that perhaps gay men maybe have a bit too much sex.
Like I said, funny.
And also, those who don't know their history are doomed to repeat it. This is like 1982 all over again and I can't help but feeling some new supervirus is right around the corner.
Well, more than half people I've hooked up with (from the bar, online, wherever) would bareback if I didn't bring up condoms, so, this isn't really just a Grindr thing.
Please don't bareback with strangers!!!!
R27 is exactly right. A great many people operate under the notion of "don't ask don't tell" and assume --that is if the question receives any thought at all-- that his partner must have the same status.
Positive men assume their partner doesn't care (and evidently he doesn't), and negative men either assume the other guy is negative, too, or simply would rather have sex than compare notes or use condoms.
Mother, may I bareback with danger?
And also, those who don't know their history are doomed to repeat it. This is like 1982 all over again and I can't help but feeling some new supervirus is right around the corner."
I sense this too
[quote]This is like 1982 all over again and I can't help but feeling some new supervirus is right around the corner.
I wringing my hands in concern even as I type!
[quote]Even now bareback porn is becoming all the rage again.
Was this posting lost in cyberspace for 10 years?
[quote] This is like 1982 all over again and I can't help but feeling some new supervirus is right around the corner."
If the history of major deathly pandemics is any guide, a sexually transmitted one is highly unlikely, (Mary.)
R35, Eventually the aids meds will lose effectiveness. The virus is constantly changing
People who are promiscuous are generally self-hating. A lot of gay men are damaged souls who seek out validation from other men through sex. They jump from sex partner to sex partner in search of this elusive validation. If only they could learn to find that validation from within and not hate themselves quite so much, they wouldn't need to have so many sexual partners. I've lived long enough in the gay world to know that there is pathology involved in promiscuity and that it's not simply a function of guys just being guys. There's more to it.
r37- nails it
Trust me, they'll regret the bareback sex later.
Rock Hudson, Freddie Mercury & Anthony Perkins
Promiscuity is gross, no matter what your orientation. A lifetime of misery for a few minutes of pleasure.
Such a lie R40. And these "polls" are done by self-interested people most of the time.
Besides the obvious physical health reasons for not being promiscuous, there are mental health reasons as well. People who have multiple sex partners become numb to sex, and it becomes just another bodily function, which leads to depression. Hyersexuality itself is a tell-tale symptom of depression.
new infections flat, which means, since every year there are more infected people and a larger population, means the incidence of infection is declining. Some of you are so easily manipulated by the homophobes that come on here spewing fear. Yest 50,000 is too many. Yes, it justifies a big effort in education and Grindr should be a place for that. No, it is not the fault of promiscuity.
I don't know why I'm posting this, because you guys are going to yell at me. I practice safer sex maybe 98% of the time. The only times that I'm not as careful as I should be is when the guy is really hot or is very well hung.
R44 -- I have ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT you are telling the truth!
"a few of his exes were appalled that he wanted to use condoms until they had been dating for a while."
This is what passes for safe sex?
Until they've been dating "for a while?"
[quote]"... People who have multiple sex partners become numb to sex, and it becomes just another bodily function, which leads to depression. Hyersexuality itself is a tell-tale symptom of depression." -- R42
Did R42 cut and paste this diagnosis from a fundamentalist church's website, or Paul Cameron's website, or did she make this up all by herself?
So, R44 it's pretty sad that only 2 out of 100 guys you hook up with are hot and hung. You must be quite the fugly troll. Plus, you're a whore, darlin' if your hook ups can be counted in the 100's.
[quote]Who's asking for your sympathy?
Anyone who wants public funding for their HIV meds (which is most HIV+ people).
Anyone who needs medicaid to help with the inevitable side effects of being HIV+ over the long term.
Anyone who needs disability when they're unable to work due to those side effects.
Does "hyersexuality" involve drugs or a prostitute? I cant tell from the spelling.
R43, the part of that report that was worrisome to clinicians was the 22% increase in newly diagnosed infections in the 13-24 year old cohort over the course of only two years (2008-2010).
Around 25% of that population was presenting with full-blown AIDS, meaning that they had been HIV+ for years, probably, and had been acting as disease vectors among their peers in that time. Remember, these are the under-24's. Rising new infection rates in this cohort is very troubling.
I know that many men who are HIV positive try to convey the thought that, "It's not so bad, guys. Just pop a pill in the morning and it's under control. Just like diabetes". I'm sorry, but I have been HIV positive since 1997. The drug cocktail is no fucking picnic. I am grateful for it, but there are countless side-effects. I saw the thread about 'accidental doodys' and that's exactly what you can expect. Out of nowhere, you will shit your fucking pants. It won't disciminate either. You may shit your pants at home or maybe on the fucking subway in front of 2000 people. Sometimes, the pills cause the opposite effect, extreme constipation. Nothing will relieve it, unless it's another blast of chronic diarrhea. There are many other side effects guys. It can be quite awful.
You DON'T want it, kids
r52, God bless you
Thank you for your presence, r52.
Like this is news?!
Until I came to DL, I didn't realize that every gay man who was alive at the beginning of the 80s was dead by the end of the 80s.
Exactly, r49, and another dirty little secret about HIV infections is that some of these people are not only getting free meds, but a DISABILITY CHECK for being poz. An acquaintance of mine gets a check every month for being positive. And who's paying for that?
If people didn't take calculated risks in life, everything would grind to a halt. No matter what you do, you're never go to live forever.
They paid into disability, r58, and deserve every penny they get out of it.
I'm sure you aren't paying for anything, anyway. Asshat.
Fuck you, r58.
From what I've been hearing lately a lot of 20-35 yo gay guys seriously don't care if they live past 50...so the party is on.
R59, So, you're basically saying, "We're all gonna die someday, so why not open up our holes wide and take every last load while we can still enjoy it?" I'm not trying to lecture you or shit on your parade, but I do care about others and hate to see people throwing their lives away, including you. If you choose to throw away your life, then I feel for you. Do what you think is best for you. You only live once. There is only one you. There will only ever be one you. Do you really want to live the last 15-25 years of your life in poverty because you are paying every last cent you have on a drug-cocktail to survive? Do you really want to live with the horrendous side-effects that those drugs can cause? If you think being a 'Proud Poz Pig' is gonna be a walk in the park, you've got another think coming. Live your life as you choose, but I still hope you will wake up before it's too late. I may sound like a 'MARY!', but I'm a Mary who cares, God damn it.
Wake the fuck up
r58 is correct!
It doesn't matter if you use Grindr, Manhunt, go to a bathhouse or meet another man for sex at a church. If you aren't safe, then you take your chances at getting AIDS and/or other diseases. I've been to a bathhouse a few times many years ago and was always safe.
R63 - Well smell you. Mind your own business. You sound old and bitter.
[quote]So, you're basically saying, "We're all gonna die someday, so why not open up our holes wide and take every last load while we can still enjoy it?"
Not every load, just the ones from good looking guys. Whether you are dropping your pants in the club's restroom or in the parking lot you need to maintain your standards and your dignity.
Have a little compassion, R66. He sounds like a good, nice person. We need a little more of that in the world. Thank you, R63. You sound like a wonderful person and I wish you the best, always.
This is r58, I said it and I'm not taking it back.
I genuinely have a lot of love in my heart for all gay people, no matter how fucked up we can be, but turning poz people into the sacred cows of our community and giving those who refuse to own their shit a pass isn't helping any of us out.
Instead of speaking earnestly about having safe sex and being risk averse we have poz "role models" like the Jack guy from project runway, who seems to be more concerned with beating us all over the head with how hot and fit he still is than having using his platform to have an honest conversation about how the disease affects his life.
And, according to this study, what we're doing right now in terms of safe sex messaging is NOT WORKING. What is working is the carefully constructed messages of the pharmaceutical companies that have been slowly sinking in over the last 10-15 years: "a pill a day", "happy and healthy", photos of hot, healthy guys hang gliding and such.
This messaging is a big reason why bareback porn is so big right now, why people aren't using condoms, etc. I'm 30. My generation didn't live through the AIDS crisis and most gays my age lack the intellectual curiosity to explore those things.
It's sad. And the pathology behind this sexual behavior is even sadder. As was noted upthread, people who are content and confident with themselves don't tend to be super promiscuous, regardless of how "hot" they are.
[quote] One of the things discussed is how to keep the Grindr app hidden from their wives.
How do you do this?
I"ve never understood why bareback porn is frowned upon but actually preferred and encouraged in straight porn. Why the double standard?
Look. There's nothing you can do about this Marys. Lecturing people who already know the inherent risks and say "its my life, so mind your fucking business" is futile. It's the way of the market as seen with the rise in bareback porn, they take their business elsewhere they don't want to see condoms and are , apparently, many enough to make bb very lucrative.
This is horrifying. And not only is this personally irresponsible, it keeps an epidemic alive. I always take precautions whenever I have sex, and I thought other people did too. So not only are they throwing their own lives away, they're putting me (and others like me) at a higher risk of infection if, god forbid, anything happens...whether it's an unknown cut in my mouth or a broken condom.
Hear, hear, R70. You are very wise and mature for a young guy. Love what you said about the messaging we get from drug companies.