He's hetero and married. I'm female, in a LTR with a woman, and have never had a relationship with a man. He and I have worked together for 15 years, and we have socialized as couples with our spouses. I like his wife and have also seen her socially without him.
He and I have always gotten along very well, but we've become particularly close over the last 4-5 years or so. He recently told me that I'm his best friend, which he also is to me, and we've each said "I love you." We've also acknowledged that our respective spouses are increasingly jealous of our special (his word) relationship, to the point that he has lied to his wife three times when we've seen each other outside of work (a dinner out, watching the 2012 returns in a bar, etc.) Hell, he didn't mention to her that amusing "Gay Girls Will Marry Your Boyfriends" video I'd forwarded to him, because he feared she might take it the wrong way.
Thing is, I can't stop thinking about him. I don't know if he's physically attracted to me, but we're certainly flirtatious on occasion. I also know that he is very much in love with his wife, and I am very much in love with my partner. But still, I can't stop thinking about him.
This is not going to end well, is it?
Oh, this should be good...
What do his feet look like OP?
Do you have a mullet, OP?
"Wherever I go, he is with me, in spirit. For we have a bond stronger than friendship or love. And although we cannot be together, we will never, ever be apart."
OP bitch what do you want us to say?
Some people just invite drama to their life.
Dis your friend just get snubbed for a Best Director Oscar? Is his best male friend a scientologist who is also unknowingly in love with him and ended up getting his own hit sitcom? Do you have an irritating helium voice?
This will end in a fight...rent the movie
OP, you are a horny frivolous bitch. You just got flattered that a man paid attention to you. Are you an attention whore or you just need to whore your feelings out?
This makes OP feel like a "real" woman to be able to steal another woman's man (or feel oneself able to). Many women feel this way. It's sad.
What r 9 said. Unless of course you're an EST -in that case, I give you a 5 for producing some semi-provocative bullshit.
Be Grateful For What You Don't Have Idiot
What's missing in your relationship with your female partner besides a penis? Address that first.
Please, I've asked a million times. What, in DL parlance, is "EST?"
Not every emotion needs to be expressed. Not every desire needs to be acted upon.
I wish more lesbians/women would heed that. Boundaries people.
OP, I believe your tale and have some advice for you: have you and your girlfriend rent a man together.
You have a need for strong, male body, which is fine. Don't feel embarassed about that. But you are already cheating on her emotionally. You need to talk this out with her and explain your sudden need to touch a male. Ask her to do this with you.
p.s. don't be an immmoral lesbian by cheating with a married man. Oh, and I give this 7/10 because it flows nicely and has an authentic voice.
OP is fascinating. He should have his own reality show on TLC.
Is this the "my bulldyke girlfriend is pregnant" troll? Anyway, THIS DID NOT HAPPEN.
What r15 said. You love your partner. He loves his wife. That's the end of it. Maybe spending some time apart (outside of work) might help.
Maybe you and your partner and he and his wife could do a wife swap together?
Make sure you let him cum on your face! It's so hot!
OP I have a question: is this a black dude?
I have noticed that gay women have a special relationship with black men. There seems to be mutual respect there.
I think that when a lesbian couple hires a man out to share they go black, don't they?
You love your partner, he loves his wife- then end your relationship with the man. Period>
Be a grownup- it is not as if either of you are free or in bad relationships. Endulging your lust or emotion or whatever serves what or who to what end?
This is a situation where a mature choice can be be made.
Of course I never know if these kind of silly posts are legitimate.
[quote] we've each said "I love you."
Translation: OP was first to drop the L-bomb, and her friend responded with a non-committal "Aw..I love you too, sweetie!".
r23, GO TO OPRAH!! GO TO OPRAH!! GO TO OPRAH!!
"Indulging" before the spelling troll has at me.
How did OP and her partner start out and how did her male friend and his wife start out? If everyone started out as romantic relationships it can be startling to become part of a relationship that has built up over time where an intimate emotional and/or psychological relationship has developed.
I don't judge and I don't advise. OP may know she loves her partner but she does not know what her friend really feels about his wife. Having said that, he may not have told her only because he likes to spend time with you as a friend but his wife is nonetheless still jealous because you are a woman and he just doesn't want to fight with her about it.
I can say that truly deep relationships can develop over time that don't start out looking for a romance or a husband/partner. They are based on mutual interests or compatablility that has developed naturally without the game of romance and all the deceit that may entail. Sometimes those are the healthiest ones and they often occur in the workplace.
OP, there ARE different ways to be in love.
Why do lesbians state their boundaries for every last thing EXCEPT those things where boundaries should be clearly stated?
I've always heard that, too, R22!
What does EST mean?????
OP is witch. Corral the villagers, and buy some torches.
R13 and R30. I'm not sure but my guess is that "EST" stands for Elaborate Scenario Troll.
Thanks to those with thoughtful responses, especially R27. Our respective relationships each started romantically, not as friends who became lovers. And part of what makes us great friends is that we are compatible in certain ways in which we are not with our S/Os. (He and I are a Scorpio and Cancer, each partnered with a Leo; we are each the more demonstrative, emotional, nurturing, and romantic partner.) Deep down, I know the only way that I get to keep my relationship with my partner and my friendship with him is indeed to maintain some emotional distance, and hopefully at some point the intrusive thoughts about him will pass.
I posted this to get the thoughts/experiences of anyone who might've been in a similar situation, knowing the bitchiness and EST accusations that would follow. I have to say, DL, you don't disappoint.
OP, I've been in the same situation as you.
If you are physically attractive, I'm sure your straight male friend feels some attraction
for you as well.
You'll have to tough it out, and it won't be easy since you cannot talk to your partner about it.
Sometimes we lesbians meet a man who seems exceptional to us, and feelings develop. I would not advise telling him how you feel. He might want to act on it, and if you do you'll be sorry. But you already know that, on some level. Keep a clear head and hold your tongue.
a lesbian whose been there
Why wouldn't a person really want a cock. It's natural to want dick. Go for it OP. It makes more sense.
For R30: Elaborate Scenario Troll
I hate r16 more then OP.
r35 and OP are NOT lesbians.
Who cares R22. It's a man and that's what's important. This is the first lesbo thread Iv'e read that makes any sense
Try to talk your partner and his wife into having an affair. If you can't get them interested in each other after about a year or so of continuous suggestions that they ought to give it a go, change tactics slightly and start suggesting a foursome.
OP, you've come to a website that is 99% bitter gay men whose attitude towards lesbians is either disinterest or outright contempt and straight female fag hags that pretty much echo those same attitudes.
There are very, very few lesbians on DL anymore. Meanwhile, you post a tale that plays perfectly right in to the favorite ridiculous paradigm of those bitter gay men/hostile straight women - that paradigm being that all lesbians must secretly crave cock - and you wonder at the response you receive.
Either you are an overly optimistic troll or an incredibly stupid, oblivious, and insensitive person. For your sake - I'm hoping for the former, since it reflects more favorably upon you.
OP didn't say she was a lesbian -- sounds more bisexual.
"OP didn't say she was a lesbian -- sounds more bisexual."
So? DL'ers second favorite paradigm is all bisexual women end up with a guy.
OP is a troll. I'd like a think a legitimate bi woman with this problem would be smart enough to seek advice somewhere other than this pit of vipers.
We need to start a thread where we post pics of what we think the average DL poster looks like.
When I come here, I picture one of two types of people. This first pic epitomizes Type #1:
As a longtime DLer (pre-9/11) I never doubted the tenor of many, if not most, of the responses I'd get. But I'll admit to being optimistic that I'd get at least a few thoughtful responses from an anonymous community that occasionally offers up some wisdom, and I did. For those, I'm grateful.
Type #2. Which is weird, because I like this guy.
Come to think of it, there's a Type #3. I don't know if I'll find a successful example, though.
Wasn't this very same scenario, but with three men, presented less than a week ago?
Weak, OP. 0.5/10.
Now, would a bisexual woman use the term "tenor" AND stay on this site of so long, AND have the type of problem described in OP, AND ask this website for advice? I'm leery.
r48, yes; an academic lesbian.
Don't mind the nasty posts R45. They are obviously from cunty lesbians. Nasty and hypocritical. That's just the way they are.
Now go out and get that dick. NOBODY should be without it.
R49, An academic lesbian wouldn't use patriarchal terminology.
Go R51! Sniff out that bullshit!
SOMEONE is about to have their annual invite to Michfest revoked.
I feel for the OP: there's a chance that the two of them are meant for each other but what about their partners?
You're curious to know what cock feels like (*whispers* it's amazing!) and you're stuck in a LTR with another woman; feelings are only going to get hurt but you should take a step back and think about things alone. If it means taking a break from your partner for a bit, then do it.
Where's the aforementioned patriarchal terminology?
OP said nothing about dick. She appears to have fallen in love with a person, not an appendage.
They are both bored in their relationships/lives
I imagine that the married man is charmed by the idea of seducing a lesbian. Once such seduction takes place, it is likely he will scurry back to the wife, his lurid dreams of conquest satisfied. He will then distance himself from his "lesbian" friend.
How OP will react to that remains to be seen. OP, how would you react to being used by a man? Or are you the user?
Enjoyer of dramatic scenarios
[quote]This is not going to end well, is it?
You're in love with a man who lies to his wife.
Proof that feelings are unreliable.
OP, I've been in similar situations. What presents as love in the moments you're enjoying each other or feeling your heart flutter, is not something that translates into a healthy, lasting relationship. It's excitement amidst some of the doldrums of LTRs.
Generally, the harm caused is irrevocable and the brief fun (it might or might not be! you've never been with a man; you might be turned off when it gets down to it) won't at all be worth it. If your two relationships are bad, end them or fix them. Don't break their hearts and give them trust issues just because you excite each other, or feel simpatico.
You will forever be the lesbian his prowess turned out, and a source of pride for the rest of his life. You, however, will go away feeling small, dirty and regretful. There's a small possibility you two would get together, but the most likely by far is you would just be some excitement on the side, that will blow up spectacularly later (Scorpio and Leo assures that). He's the Scorpio, right? Some Scorps have amazing seductive powers that just ooze from their pores and leave people jelly and smitten. Has happened to me many times, but with enough space and circumspection, I eventually come to my senses and wonder what the hell was wrong with me.
Don't look to him as the panacea for everything missing in your relationship. Work on your relationship and yourself all the harder.
Now, were you both single? I'd say go for it, despite the likelihood of you getting used and hurt.
But for now, take stock of your life. Honestly, and without including the heart pangs in your analysis. What do you want? What are you willing to utterly gamble and lose in order to (maybe) get that? Be rational rather than emotional, this one time (because of all the possible consequences).
Thanks, R60; wise words, and very helpful. (Yes, he's the Scorpio; his wife and my partner are the Leos. I'm the Cancer, which makes suspending emotion in this scenario particularly challenging.)
And R55 has it exactly right.
OP has fallen for the excitement of falling for someone new, which happens in LTR's of all kinds for all kinds of reasons. The fact that it's a man isn't so important a factor (except it might be that the reason OP and Illicit Man Fruit have gotten too close for comfort is that they were assuming the hetero/homo barrier would keep them safe from such feelings)
OP should just pull back and see if the feelings die down with time. And she should ask herself if this flare up speaks to any major dissatisfaction in her relationship or it's just a temporary hormonal flush. OP should seek to get sexual with her partner ASAP if they have stopped being sexual.
If OP takes these steps and is still pining for Illicit Man Fruit after 9-12 months, then maybe she is really in love with him and she'll have to take it from there But she has to allow herself the emotional distance to find this out.
Go for it, OP. Women always end up craving the cock, lesbian or otherwise.
that's a crock, r63
[quote](Yes, he's the Scorpio; his wife and my partner are the Leos. I'm the Cancer, which makes suspending emotion in this scenario particularly challenging.)
Yes, OP-- you are the cancer. Leave him the hell alone and get on with your own damn life.
How's his dick?
And if it weren't for assholes, R63, all men would eventually crave the pussy. Though an asshole is not actually a substitute for pussy, its anatomical location is close enough such that gays can pretend.
Right on cue, R65.
Give it a fucking break, OP. You've received 0 "thoughtful posts" out of 66, about a couple of dozen posts callling you out, a couple of dozen posts making fun of lesbians (your real objective) and a handful of posts from posters who are tendering trite and predictable "don't do it, OP" advice out of sheer boredom.
Stop while you're ahead. Like I said, even if you were legitimate, you're either a thoughtless asshole for feeding right into a tired old DL stereotype or profoundly naive.
It would be like a black guy going on to a KKK message board and "seeking thoughtful advice" because he's happily married to a fine black woman but is lusting after a white woman.
All lesbians secretly want to fuck men, right?
Yeah -- this never happened.
I am a lesbian. When younger and in the rock and roll scene I had friendships with straight men that were very confiding and sometimes felt romantic and delightful. Straight men worry less than women, like themselves more, and it is exciting to reach the part of them that is charming and fun-loving.
With one exception, did not take it too far and everything was more or less hunky-dory. The one exception ended with bad feelings and misunderstanding -- and we were both single.
Be really careful about this situation. Just be a safety valve from domesticity, but don't take it further is my advice.
[quote] Yeah -- this never happened.
Tell it, sister.
And someone, this person has fooled enough DLers to get 71 responses. Well played, but this story has more holes than a gang bang at Leonardo DiCaprio's house.
I believe OP is legit.
I also believe she should NOT move forward with this.
[quote]And part of what makes us great friends is that we are compatible in certain ways in which we are not with our S/Os. (He and I are a Scorpio and Cancer, each partnered with a Leo
WHAT DOES THIS EVEN MEAN??
I wish Americans would be less hung up about sex.
If Op was French, this post would be about the great sex you were having on the side with some guy you are in love with.
Affairs are fun.
Good point. Anyone who believes in astrology is a moron.
R75 you are an idiot. Pseudo-cool and lame.
OP, me too. I'm going through the same thing. Very much in love with my partner (f) of 24 years, and have also been in love with a man for the past 7. I have never acted on my feelings with this man, and he is too honorable to do so as well.
Sometimes in life, there are no easy answers, and there IS no solution.
Pour all of that affection into your relationship with your partner, and get a hobby.
I've knitted at least 100 scarves in the past 7 years.
R74 voiced exactly what I was thinking, but am too diplomatic to post.
[quote] I have never acted on my feelings with this man, and he is too honorable to do so as well.
Suddenly we're in Gone With the Wind.
Ladies, men are never honorable. They can only be persuaded to seem honorable by the prospect of an impoverishing divorce settlement.
R80 - this one's honorable. He's a priest. And YES, one of the good ones.
[quote]Ladies, men are never honorable. They can only be persuaded to seem honorable by the prospect of an impoverishing divorce settlement.
Notice how, once again, nobody's claiming loss of queers and babies over a bigoted, sweeping generalization like the one above. If this had been said about women, the mysoginy trolls would have been exploding.
I guess men are one thing: thicker-skinned.
There are no good priests. One day, when I have time, I will tell you all about the priests, pastors, and other religious trash I have known--from years of working with them. They definitely are not all sexual predators, but the younger crop* are all damaged in some way--closeted, self-hating gays (and the protestants usually have a bearding wife and children); guys who enjoy having power over other people (for some reason, speaking "from the pulpit" is some kind of aphrodisiac), but have no talent that would earn them power in the real world; ex-drug addicts with a Jesus fixation; current drug and alcohol addicts. MANY "faith leaders" embezzle funds from every church they are "called" to. (Sniffing this sort of this out was my job.)
*The older crop was very different.
How's his dick?
Fuck him posthaste.
You don't want to leave lezzieland for a guy who has a clit-sized cock. Then you'll start craving the (expert lesbian) tongue.
You also seem to have commitment issues commensurate to any dude's.
His commitment issues + your commitment issues = a relationship that ain't gonna last.
Never a good idea to cheat with someone or break up a couple: If he does it with you, he'll do it to you.
That said, if he has a great cock, get down on it.
This thread proves that DL "men" have no understanding of love that transcends dick play.
Have another piece of nutloaf, R86.
Many lesbians admit to missing "the thrust."
R41 there are plenty of lesbians here.
Asshole at 87, OPs never been with a man; how could she miss what she's never had?
But what do his feets look like, OP? Any pics of them you can share?
Hi OP. I'm a lesbian, too. I've never wanted to cheat on my partner with a man, but I've felt drawn to other women and I've felt other women drawn to me.
If you want to keep your relationship, and being non-monogamous is not an option, the best thing to do in either case is to distance yourself. When you find yourself indulging in intrusive thoughts, make yourself stop and think about something else.
It will fade in time and you can go back to being normal friends.
Yep R91, I am a hetero female. And am also drawn to men - just need to discipline your thoughts as hard as it is.
R83 - I worked with priests at a diocese for 15 years. You have a valid point about the newbies. This guy is 61 and has none of that baggage, or I wouldn't be attracted to him in the first place.
R94, don't be shallow. The man is gorgeous in that Sean Connery kind of way.
Can someone recap? I don't have the energy to wade through the drama...
Old guy, thread dead.
My mom said the EXACT same things about a minister with whom she was in love. They were both in their early 60s, too. She had total blinders on because of that chemical love component. They ended up not even dating, then he remarried another woman, but they guy was clearly not "baggage free", even though she couldn't find one problem with him.
Also, word to the wise: NEVER decide that your partner, male or female, regardless of you relationship's orientation, is "too honorable" to do anything. That's what trust is about. A risk. And everyone comes with risk (ourselves included, obviously).
Are you physically attracted to him? I think if he were attracted to you, you'd know it.
We've left Gone with the Wind and now are in the Thornbirds.
I still don't get what is so hard to believe about this story. OP did not self-identify as a lesbian; she only said she's never been with a man. She also didn't claim to be craving this guy's cock; it's just that, despite her feelings for her partner, she's found herself thinking about her best friend--who happens to be male.
No canes, vegans, bread pudding, or u-hauls involved, which rules out obvious trolling. OP is legit.
tl EST; dr
OP -- Men are pretty straightforward when they are interested in someone. Has he made a pass at you?
No? Didn't think so.
He's not romantically in love with you. But, he may like the fact that you are and is stringing you along.
Do yourself a big favor and distance yourself from him for a while. See his reaction. Stop wallowing in your own feelings. Look at his actions, reactions, etc. Do not pay attention to what he says, look at what he does.
I'll make a prediction - if you distance yourself from him for one month - he will follow suit.
[quote]OP -- Men are pretty straightforward when they are interested in someone. Has he made a pass at you?
ITA 100%. If he wanted OP, she'd know it because he would have been very clear about it already. Doesn't matter how "in love" he is with his wife. When men get the itch, they scratch it 99.99% of the time. Men find it very easy to be in love with one person and in lust with another.
OP, men are only as faithful as their lack of opportunities require them to be.
What a sorry view of men, R103 and R104. I don't buy it. While some men will cheat if given the opportunity, plenty of gay and straight men are perfectly capable of remaining faithful to their partners.
103 & 104 forget that the thread was started by the woman.
You're not in love. It's just a silly phase you're going through. You're not in love.
Rs 103 and 104 are correct.
I know from first hand experience.
OP is your weight around 300 pounds? Just a guess
Now the interesting question, OP: are you a member of his congregation?
(R103) If he's lied to his wife three times already about meeting OP, then he probably does want to sleep with OP on some level. If he didn't want to do so, he wouldn't be acting or feeling guilty. And why would his wife be getting jealous all of a sudden, if she isn't detecting some sort of sexual tension between the husband and OP?
Your "He's Just Not That Into You" logic doesn't apply here. The man in this situation has serious consequences to face if he acts on it. The fact that he's already practicing sneaking around says that he's already taking steps to take that risk. And so is OP.
I sense some ugly divorces ahead.
I laugh whenever i read the title of this thread. Oh, come on! That's so....
I don't think OP is an EST troll.
You have to think, OP, whether you want to lose your relationship over this. If you don't, then take a break from the friendship with this guy. There is no other way.
OP is an unattractive straight woman who turned lesbian because she couldn' get a man. Now that somehow, someway, she CAN get a man, she is going to make another woman (her "long-time partner") pay for it.
Fuck these dyke bitches. I have seen this creepy behavior amongst butch lesbians for a long time. OP is not in love, OP finally has a man who actually pays attention to her.
Bet she uses drugs or is a heavy boozer as well. I also bet that this married man is a heavy boozer or druggie, he had to be, lying to his devoted wife and willing to break up his marriage over a bulldyke.
Look what heavy boozer Arnold Schwartzenegger did--he knocked up his fugly housekeeper. Drunks end up in disasterous relationships much to the amusement of everyone else, and I'm sure OP will entertain us all with the resultant stories of her partner leaving her, the husband being arrested, and OP's unsuccessful stint in rehab.
OP, either be a straight-up lesbian and treat your woman right or leave the gay community.
R113, i don't think that OP is as sensitive as you wonder if she is (sorry if i'm wrong).
If she was, she wouldn't reply selectively to the posters who are lenient towards her. I think that many of us, spoke honestly about her dilemma. She just seem not ready to accept disapproval for her dubious infatuation with that man. She is cold. At least her love for her female lover grew suddenly cold. If she was in her right mind, she wouldn't ask for advice in the Datalounge but she would talk this out with her fucking lover.
I know that i sound harsh, but excuse me, i got pissed off. Women should be more caring and tender and give the right example to men.
For Chrissakes, (R114), she's known this guy for 15 years! Something developed between them, probably because they are unsatisfied with their sex lives in their respective marriages. This happens all the time in every kind of relationship. It could happen to you.
I don't think OP should necessarily act on this but why are you being so nasty about the fact that she's fallen for a man? Stop with the lesbian fascism.
I think it's safe to assume that no one has ever fallen in love with R114.
[quote]lying to his devoted wife
Do you know her?
I'm hopelessly devoted to you ou ou!
So, R115, to which "non-lenient" posts do you think called for serious response? Your "honest" post calling me a horny frivolous bitch flattered by the attention of some guy? The ones suggesting that my partner and I rent a man together? Or the ones asking me if I have a mullet or wanting to know about his feets?
If you've never had a mutual emotional connection with someone outside your existing relationship, and never had to wrestle with the prospect of losing one, the other, or possibly both, consider yourself fortunate.
I've already acknowledeged upthread the need to maintain some emotional distance from my friend if I'm going to keep my relationship, as many have suggested. And that is what I intend to do.
What R74 said.
I hope this is an EST. How vile OP sounds if not.
R118, Whether the wife is insufferable or not, the guy still lies about where he is and what he's doing. These are things that I deem worthy of side-eyeing, if you're going to essentially call the person "flawless".
I'm still waiting to hear what OP said that was supposedly patriarchal.
Have been in love with someone for a really long time. He promised to be there when I got my divorce. He said he would help me with anything I needed. As soon as I was single, he was gone! Gone Baby Gone! If I could ever find a decent guy that treated me great, I would be so happy!
You owe it to yourself to have sex with him.
It's already over with you and your girfriend. You are in love with someone else.