How do you cut someone out of your life that you love?
Since I came out, about 3 years ago, my mother has treated me like shit. It's like she's become psychotically cruel when it comes to me. I sometimes think she must think up things that she knows will be emotionally devastating to me, writes them on note cards and keeps them by the phone for when I call her. Tonight she told me that she has wished for years that it had been me that had died of cancer instead of my brother, she'd also wished that I would get cancer, one of the long dragged out ones with excruciating pain
Last week she said I'd caused my dad's fatal heart attack when i came out, even tho it was two years between my coming out and his death, but my dad didn't die befor he (supposedly) told her that he'd always hated me.
As bad as that is, it's pretty much the usual type of ugly hateful things she says to me every time I call her.
What the he'll is wrong with me that I still call her every week? If one of my friends told me that they were treated like this I'd tell them to cut that person from their life, but I can't seem to take my own advice. Part of me keeps (foolishly) hoping that things will someday go back to the way they were before I came out and we were great friends. Other part wonders why I even try after all this time with her being so evil to me. Before I call her I know it's going to hurt, and I know almost exactly how much it'll hurt, but I do it anyways, every damn week.
I guess that no matter what she says, or how much she hurts me, I still love her, but I don't know how I still love her after years of her talking like this to me.
I don't know, maybe if she hadn't been a really good mom, and later on friend, I could punch and delete. The person she is now is 100% opposite of who was before I came out.
It's really confusing because now I wonder which 'version' of her is the true one. Was she always this psychotically mean person that she covered over with a loving and good mother act? I also don't understand how she could flip from loving me one day to hating me and wishing me dead the next.
So, how do you cut someone out of your life that you still love?
Why the hell do you still love her? She hates you, I wouldn't even try sticking it out for the inheritance, I doubt you'd get anything. She told you that she wished you'd die of a long painful bout with cancer. She hates you!
Now, what to do. I hate my whole fucking family except my mom. She's the only one I talk to. What's complicated about it? Kick her to the curb.
I'm sorry to hear your story OP. It must be devestating for you to hear those sorts of things from your Mother.
The good news is just because someone gave birth to you doesn't mean that you have to love them and take this no matter what. Your parents need to earn your love and respect. Your Mother sounds psychologically ill. Does she has a substance abuse problem?
As hard as it will be, you need to cut her from your life. Write a letter and tell her you wont tolerate this anymore. Tell her what she's done/doing. Tell her you never want to see or hear from her again for any reason. You have to be strong and cut all contact. It will get easier over time.
Perhaps one day she will reconsider and apologise and try to make it up to you but for now you can't have any contact.
I had to do this with my father and 23 years later I am utterly thrilled that I made the right decision as it has saved me 23 years of heartache.
Good luck with everything.
Oh, Gwyneth. J'adore when you role play.
Usually it pains me when people talk about cutting their parents out of their lives, but if my mother sounded like the Mary Tyler Moore character in "Ordinary People" I would back away.
Who needs that?
Don't call. Let her think about why you're not calling. If she then approaches you in a conciliatory vein, I would give her another chance.
Send her a letter informing her of your death. Then wait...
Has she always been like this? How much time between the death of your brother and father? And who is left in the family?
No she used to be nice, that's clearly stated in the OP. So what, now she's a homophobic psycho. There's no reason to take any shit from anyone who isn't paying your bills. The best advice I ever heard Oprah give is: if someone doesn't support you, cut them out of your life. A simple rule I've always lived by.
I was in no way supporting mother's behavior.
Is there someone she trusts who could get her to a doctor? I'm with r2, but if it were my mother I'd want to make sure there wasn't a medical issue.
She's toxic, in pain, and using you to blame for the pain of her losses. Write her a letter explaining how her behavior is going to cost her another member of her family, and then distance yourself. She may reach out to you or she may not, but say your peace. Do not write that letter in anger.
You have to take action for your own sanity. Let the decision be hers, and your soul will be cleansed. Make it clear that in order to have a relationship with you that she needs to treat you with respect and love, and you will be there for her if she does. If not, you won't. It's just that simple.
Honestly she sounds like she could use grief counseling.
Do what 10 says, exactly that and vow to go it alone.
I'm not normally a Punch and Delete type, but in this situation, that's the best option.
Use scissors, silly.
Joan Crawford-Tina, bring me your former "uncle's" photos!
Cut her off. Even she is telling you to cut her out of your life. Very sad. Sorry.
Delete her phone number. Or block the phone number. Instead of calling her, call a friend whenever you feel the urge to call her (with the friends knowledge).
You won't feel the need to talk to her weekly once you stop doing it. It will pass.
Good luck, OP
Yes OP, when i read your problem immediately i thought what the rest thought. Write her a letter and express the way you feel about the whole situation. Be sincere and don't try not to hurt her. She hurt you emotionally and now you must give her to understand how it feels to hurt someone like this. Play the same war she plays with you, which is one of the sliest and it is called psychological war.
Say that you love her, that after all she is your mom, but she can't humiliate you like she does and she can't always thinking about her emotions over yours. That's cruel. She made her life and her marriage, now it's time for you to make your life and your mother can't drag you down with her denial and her antics. You should also say to her that if she hates you and treats you like this, then she hates a big part of herself and she can't take her of her own emotional state. She's no good, and she must understand it and she must stop fighting you with her twisted psychology.
You are a man and you have your needs to be loved and to be respected. Tell her that you can't take no more poison from your own mother, it is killing you and that you want to hold only the loving memories you had from her. If she can't cooperate, then maybe you should disconnect yourself from her for some long time and make her think (if she can think)clearly.
[quote]Let the decision be hers, and your soul will be cleansed
[quote]Tonight she told me that she has wished for years that it had been me that had died of cancer instead of my brother, she'd also wished that I would get cancer, one of the long dragged out ones with excruciating pain
This. Never. Happened.
Back under the bridge, troll.
Does she live alone? If not, she might be feeding off that person's feelings about you.
No sane person loves someone who wants them dead. OP's hate-mongering mother is not sane. OP also needs help.
OP = Alice Sebold. Trying out new material for The Almost Moon 2.
(1) Ask her to write a note to you wishing you were dead.
(2) Put it by your phone
Seriously, people are cut out of our lives without warning and through no control of our own. Take control of this one. Surround yourself with people who are positive and you will become one of them.
OP See if your phone company allows you to block her number from being called by your phone. I know years ago I had a roommate who was addicted to phone sex lines and we ended up making it so he could not call them from the phone.
OP, honey, I'm sorry. She is using you as a target for her displaced rage. You do not have to remain her target. You can set boundaries.
A very firm boundary, in fact. It's important that you do this. It's a chance for you to grow and mature and stand up for yourself.
You don't have to write a letter. You could do it in a phone call. Regardless, you don't have to go on and on with accusations, the kind of stuff that feeds into her toxic behavior.
This is not a debate.
All you have to say is, "You're my mother, but until you can stop saying hateful things to me and directing all your rage at me, I'm not going to be in touch with you. When you feel able to resume our relationship, let me know."
Then hang up. Don't answer when she calls. Don't respond to her mail, if she writes or emails. She will get angry, then she will wheedle, she will beg, she will tell you that you owe her, she will threaten.
No matter. Once you've set that limit, hold her to it.
Try using this logic: You are cutting her out of your life because you love her and because you love yourself. Your love for her cannot be used as your excuse for perpetuating hatred (which you are doing maintaining the relationship as it currently is). You have to break the pattern, at least for enough time to let yourself see things clearly. Once you have established you and your mother as separate, independent adults, then you can decide what kind of relationship you really want to have with her. If she doesn't want to have a mature relationship with you, that will be her decision.
If this is true (this is DL after all), then you are a glutton for punishment OP. Strap on a pair, man up, tell the bitch you want nothing to do with her ever again and be done with her.
Your mother is mentally ill. Sometimes Alzheimers can have a person to show marked changes in personality. Are there any of your mothers friends you could call to see how she's interacting with the rest of the world?
If it is a medical condition, and you have the stomach and armor of steel to see it through, good luck to you. If she refuses to see a doctor or get help, I'd cut her off without explanation.
In either case, I am sorry, OP. Mourn your mother, because the mother you once had is gone.
Ask them for money
Lighten up girlfriend!
You only have one mother and she is still alive which is one of God's blessings. I am sure there is another reason for her words to you. Are you telling the whole story? Did you come out in a way that was uncomfortable for your parents? People need to be eased into new ways of thinking and do not need people like you forcing them to adapt to something foreign. Think about how you have affected her and I'm sure you will find the real reason for her so-called hatred toward you. It's not her fault.
Wow R30. There isnt enough bandwidth to list how wrong you are.
If OP is real, or for anyone in a similar position: Read some Alice Miller, perhaps starting with The Truth Will Set You Free, or The Body Never Lies.
r31, I'm just trying to put myself in the mother's shoes. I am a mother myself and I cannot and will not believe that a mother who is loving (as OP described) will just turn on her son. The son either is not telling the whole story or is acting in a way that makes this mother uncomfortable. The problem lies with him - not her.
Oh, really, r33? So when your kid does something that makes you uncomfortable, it'll be okay for you to tell him you hope he dies a long, painful death from cancer? Lovely.
Guessing r30/r33 is one of the Salvation Army trolls ...
"Tonight she told me that she has wished for years that it had been me that had died of cancer instead of my brother, she'd also wished that I would get cancer, one of the long dragged out ones with excruciating pain."
Why are you all feeding this troll, who obviously made up this sick story for his own demented reasons? As if a man would keep calling a mother who told him she not only wishes he were dead, but that his death would be slow and excruciatingly painful.
Fuck you, OP.
I love you R29. OP, you should consider the advice of R52 in the attached thread.
Does OP's story remind anyone else of the third act of Torch Song Trilogy? Stop being a doormat and stand up to your mother. If she thinks she can continue to get away with this behavior, she'll keep it up instead of dealing with the root of why she is acting this way.
R31 I dont give a fuck if you're a mother or not. That has absolutely nothing to do with it. You sound like a horrible person and I really feel bad for your kids. Having someone like you around, a person who calls a someone a liar without any proof, a person who thinks that their child's happiness is secondary to your own feelings is really shitty. Its all about you. Just as long as you/OPs mother is happy then everything is cool and fuck what anyone else may need.
Unless you can provide proof to back up your claim that OP is either not telling the whole story or is acting in a way that makes this mother uncomfortable, you can go fuck yourself.
Next time you talk to her, ask her "Why do you think you can talk to me this way?". Sometimes that throws toxic people off and forces them into a corner. I'm sure her response will be completely unsatisfactory. After she gives her lame response, tell her it's not ok to treat you that way and until she can learn to treat her own son with common decency, you won't be in her life.
It sounds like you haven't been firm enough in setting up boundaries with her. She sounds like the type of person that needs a hard push (like very hard, firm words and complete break) before changing. Ignore her after that, let things cool for a while and maybe that'll clue her in that you mean business.
r35, last weekend I was at the grocery store and heard a mother say to her daughter, who wasn't more than 10 years old: "You suck all of the joy and happiness out of my life. I hate the weekends. I can't wait until Monday when I am free from you and all the misery you cause me." And then the little girl begged her mother to forgive her and not to be mad. The mother told her to get out of her sight, go wait outside in the car.
The point is that some people aren't fit to be parents, but their children want and need their approval and love no matter how old they are.
R39, that's very true. But OP is presumably an adult male, not a 10-year-old. I refuse to believe that any adult would keep on loving (and calling) his mother if mom said things like, "I wish you had died a slow, excruciating death."
And if there is, in fact, any adult who would keep loving (and calling) his mother under such circumstances, that person is severely mentally ill and needs a lot more help than can be found by asking for advice on DataLounge.
"You only have one mother and she is still alive which is one of God's blessings."
I tell this to my daughters every day.
Pain or no pain, this is abusive behavior. Do what r24 said and don't back down.
I finally really understand the term "self-loathing."
It's not always the parents' fault r39.
I don't think OP is a troll. My own mother told me that she "hopes I die of AIDS" at a time when we were arguing. I don't believe she has an issue with my being gay but she just wanted to hurt me at the time.
Also, keep in mind that it's only been 3 yrs of this behavior to OP so it's not like he's spending an entire lifetime seeking his mother's approval. I am shocked he calls her so often considering her attitude but if she was truly nice before, I can see how it w/b hard to accept her new attitude and I guess it takes time to come to the realization that it won't change.
The OP is lying or leaving out details. No mother would speak like this to her son.
Please tell the truth, OP.
OP, I haven't experienced the brutality you've described, but I have experienced incredible emotinal deprivation, treated like a pariah, and frozen out of family life. It's hard to deal with. Really affects you.
All I can tell you is don't question your love for your mother and the person you remember. It is possible to love someone who doesn't love you back.
But she does sound mentally ill, OP. She sounds like someone who has serious mental health issues and possibly a chemical imbalance, some hormonal changes, a tumor, something, some physiological reason for this behavior. Don't know how old she is but she could even be suffering from Alzheimers or some other form of dementia.
At the very least, she's likely never recovered from the deaths and is projecting a lot of pain & guilt onto you. Maybe she is blaming herself as a failure as a mother because she views you as a failure as a person for being gay.
Whatever the case,absolutely limit your calls in duration, but continue to call her regularly.In fact, if you can arrange it so that you call her around the same time and day once a week or twice a month, do it.
Do not attempt to argue with her or participate in that type of discussion on her terms where you are responding or reacting to what she says. YOu control the discussion. When she starts with the hate, just say something like,"I called to ask you a question about "whatever", not to hear you rant. Talk to you later."
The fact you attempt to engage her,may be prolonging this. You'll have to be the adult. See, once she got into the habit, it got easier. To break her of the habit, you have to stop her in her tracks.
My way of coping is to try to remain accessible for those times when people behave. But also to be kind to myself. We can't be so self-protective we shut people out and become like them.
Remember, ultimately, do what you do, for yourself. Carrying around pain and anger and hatefulness is most corrosive to you, not the person it's directed it. You might want to talk to someone too, since this is affecting you in ways you aren't aware right now.
What a sad, bitter person she must be. You can't "FIX" that OP. She isn't the only person in the world who has suffered disappointment, tragedy, defeat, etc. Maybe you can help her focus on the good parts. But it sounds like she has distanced herself from acknowledging them because it would jar her latest version of reality.
She needs help. She needs medical attention, and she needs to seek mental health counseling. You aren't equipped to fix this, you need to call in the cavalry! Good luck & god bless you.
Contrary to the warm fuzzies people promote on TV, Christmas always seems to exacerbate the negativity in most families. Don't expose yourself to it.Self preservation dictates that you maintain contact, but limit it and control it.
R46 Why dont you provide the proof to back up your claim?
R45, I don't think the fact that his mother has been behaving this way for "only three years" makes a whole hell of a lot of difference.
R48, fuck you as well.
Excuse me, r48?
R50 Exactly what I said. Whats the problem? As well as being self absorbed you also cant read?
F&F r48 and r51. It's a troll. Ignore it.
We are trying to ask this OP to provide all the facts and not his one-sided account. There is no mother out there who would speak this way to their child. I should know. A moher's love is deep.
Your mom sounds like she is sufferring from depression or other mental illness. You need to tell her that what she says is hurtful to you and that either she goes to a psychiatrist to deal with her hateful issues with you, or you will simply stop calling her. Even offer to take her to the doctor. If she refuses, then stop calling her. Period.
yes R52 OP's mom would be asking for someone to prove that OP is lying about what he said. Thats some real amazing logic you're using.
OP, if you're being sincere in your post (it's hard to tell trolls from genuine people sometimes), I'd strongly encourage you to look into therapy, and possibly a codependents' support group. The bottom line is that you need to change your attitude and your behavior, and stop enabling your mom and causing yourself to get hurt. You are contributing to this situation every bit as much as she is by calling her every week and taking the abuse.
[Guessing [R30]/[R33] is one of the Salvation Army trolls ...]
Ha! Somebody has bumped one of the SA threads, and now I see I was correct at r34.
Ignore Psycho Mom at r44, etc.; it's just the same old gay-hating Salvation Army defender, here to stir up more homophobic shit.
Awwwww Poor Baby R53 Being asked to back up your claims is the same as being a troll? Did I hurt your little baby feelings? Well maybe I should say I'm sorry. But instead I will say Fuck You. You made a claim now its up to you to back it up. If you cant, then get the fuck out of here you old bitter dried up cunt.
How do you cut someone out of your life that you love?
I slap their faces VICIOUSLY!!!
r55, I think perhaps r52's point is that the "I'm a mother" troll in this thread is a CUNT just like OP's mom (and you, apparently).
R57 I saw that too. Same person who thinks gay people should just be quite because it hurts the sensibilities of the oldsters. And when they get called on it the first they do is demand everyone F&F them. The sense of self entitlement this cunt exhibits is amazing. If they really do have kids (which I doubt) I would guess they never speak to her because she is so damn miserable.
As someone who's been estranged from a toxic birth mother and non-existent birth father for the last 9 years, for very similar reasons, here's my advice, in order of importance:
1. Stop calling her.
2. Get some therapy.
You don't need to sum everything up in a nice little, blame the victim letter. You'd just be offering yourself up for more abuse. Also, there's no statute of limitations on this - believe me, you could use some time away to figure out how you really feel. Someone on here said, "Don't write that letter in anger," well, that maybe but there's nothing wrong with being angry about the way she's treated you.
You need to go to therapy for yourself because, believe me, this kind of conditioned abuse (that only a parent can accomplish) is affecting all the other relationships in your life - you'll start to figure that out when you stop talking to your birth mother. You'll note there are a few other people you've struck up relationships with who are just waiting in the wings to take over her role. Start housekeeping now, OP.
Stop calling your mother. Do not return her calls, do not even feel obligated to listen to her messages, if she leaves any, or open any mail from her. Get on with your life and look for relationships that you already have or that are available to you that are actually going to be productive and long-lasting.
I repeat, do not call her. You don't owe her anything after the way she's treated you. She's wished you dead. C'mon. Wake up. You don't need that in your life.
Also, as an addendum, don't convince the loss of a mother figure or a father figure with the person who is actually your birth mother. You will miss not having those parental figures but missing that and missing that actually person is two different things.
And I guess what I meant to say at R63, was don't confuse the ABSENCE of these figures for actually missing your birth mother. She isn't capable of loving you the way she should; a mother's love is meant to be unconditional. This is for her to resolve, not you. You need to resolve it for yourself and move on.
r18 can see this is troll bait...why can't you?
OK, how much money does your mother have and is she likely to leave any to you? If you answered none and no then I would drop her like a hot rock--cut her off entirely and don't look back, it's the only way; she is trying to do the same with you so give her a taste of her own medicine. If she does have money and may leave some to you, I would keep up a very minimal line of communication, it's up to you whether or not she's lying if she says you're still in the will or if you want her money. Freedom usually trumps money I think.
I did it for 15 years. Walked away from my family.
The biggest mistake I made was letting them back in to my life. I only did it for the inheritance but my 90-year-old passive aggressive mother won’t die.
The good die young, r68.
Thanks for the advice and suggestions.
Thanks for the suggestion that I write to her. I really like that idea. By writing to her I'd be able to say absolutely everything that I want to say without her interrupting me for her latest round of head fuckery. I also think it would help me to list the mean lies and hurtful things that she's said to me and tell her I'm not going to let myself be hurt by her anymore. I don't think I could tell her that I never want to see or hear from her ever again no matter the reason. I've gotten a lot of second chances so I almost always try to give people a second chance. If she ever gets back to normal I think I might want her to be a small part of my life if/once I could trust her again. I would tell her in the letter that I won't be calling her again because of what she's said/done over the past 3 years. I know this will sound pretty paranoid but I wouldn't tell her that if she got her life together and treated me decently I would be happy to have a relationship with her because I don't think I trust that she wouldn't fake being normal to get me to talk with her and telling her about my life just use it against me.
R2, I would say there's a pretty good chance that she's got some kind of a substance abuse problem right now. In the past, going back to when we were really young kids, there were times when she would drink a lot more than her usual couple of glasses of wine. She'd go thru almost a whole bottle of vodka every night for several weeks and then go back to her two glasses of wine for a couple of months. My sister sees her with some regularity and she's said that my mom is still drinking like that.
When my brother had cancer her doctor gave her some type of anti-anxiety medication and sleeping pills and she kept running out of them before she could refill them so she found another doctor who would prescribe the same meds but didn't know about the first doctor prescribing too.
When my dad died earlier this year her doctor put her on, what seems to me a high dose of, Xanax (2 mg and she could take them as often as she felt she needed to, up to 6 times a day) and busperone (sp?). I don't know if she's still taking the medication. My sister told me around Thanksgiving that my mom was still taking Xanax and again had two different doctors giving her prescriptions.
I think she may have/has now some mental illness issues as well. Aside from all the crazy crap she says, almost every time she and my dad, or my sister and i when we were adults, would get into an argument/fight somewhere in the fight she'd yell one or two things. The first was that we and her doctors might think she was crazy but she knew better and knew she wasn't crazy. The other thing she would say was that the reason she was crazy was because of either my dad or us kids or both and she needed some kind of medication to make us act normal. If she was seeing a psychologist or psychiatrist she wasn't taking any medication (as a teenager I knew everything in my parent's medicine cabinet) and I don't remember her being away from home for any long periods so I don't think she was ever hospitalized.
I really apreciate the advice. It made me realize that she can't hurt me unless I let her (by calling her every week) and I think I'm ready to make sure she can't hurt me again. Im also going to start some kind of therapy. It's pretty messed up to love someone who is wishing me dead.
OP's original post seems as believable as any possible EST, the only thing that's making me suspicious it might an EST is that he hasn't come back and said anything yet, even though the thread has been very active.
Oh sorry, he's back. You didn't sign OP!
She's definitely mentally ill and possibly incompetent. You should call her friends or neighbors to see if she is functioning. She definitely is not listening to herself in the things she says to you. Ask her if she remembers blaming you for your dad's death? She'll probably deny she ever did.
Cutting her out is a safer option, but I think you should go that extra mile and have someone you trust check on her to make sure she hasn't had a mental breakdown and is living in filth and poverty.
Too convoluted to be real.
[quote] I also think it would help me to list the mean lies and hurtful things that she's said to me and tell her I'm not going to let myself be hurt by her anymore.
I'm not sure that's really the best idea. If she's as crazy as you say she is, she won't hear it anyway, and it gives her more fuel for abuse. It's basically telling her that you want to continue this dialogue, which in her mind, will tell her that she will be able to continue abuse at a later date. It also gives her lots of time to rationalize her abuse, and make it your fault. I think if you do send a letter, it's best to keep it simple, and short. Something along the lines of 'I no longer wish to keep in contact with you for personal reasons, if you call me I will not answer, if you send me mail I will not open it' and leave it at that.
If you really want to get healthy (because there's no way that her abuse hasn't had a negative impact on other relationships in your life and other behaviors), you're going to need therapy and a support group.