Does anyone know what really happened in the JonBenet Ramsey murder case? I've read some of the older books, newer ones have been written, any recommendations?
Let me know if this thread already exists.
Yes, someone knows.
There have been countless DL threads over the years, OP. You can start here:
I'm sure DL's own Mrs. Patsy Ramsey will be joining this thread momentarily...
Was it her brother Burke after all?
Mother Ramsey walked in on the father Ramsey molesting JonBenet. She was understandably pissed and threw a Mag-lite flashlight at him but accidentally hit JonBenet instead. They quickly conspired to cover it up.
R5, Is that speculation or evidence? Mrs R was a controlling, mentally ill cunt of the worst kind. What kind of "mother" makes her young child repeatedly spend hours getting her hair and makeup done, to look like an adult, appealing to child predators fantasies?
I met a guy from Boulder a few years back who told me that's the official word around town, R6. He'd told me the entire story including the reason why the parents were never arrested, but I've forgotten at this point. I wish I could recall everything, but I just remember the main gist of what he told me. It all made sense to me at the time.
It's ALL speculation, every one of the millions of words written on the Datalounge.
Nobody knows except the killer, and (likely enough) the people who helped cover up the evidence.
Oh My God, not again.
OP, this topic has been posted here at least 100 times.
Wish it made sense to me r8
R8, Thanks for your response. I am convinced that Patsy did it for whatever reason. She clearly wrote that ridiculous ransom note. Wonder if the fact that Boulder DA's Office knew that the Ramseys would spend an unlimited amount of money defending the cunt (DL, one place the use of this word is really appropriate,)and they didn't have the resources to prosecute made a difference. Plus they botched the crime scene; a defense lawyer's dream. Of course if they knew the cunt was dying of cancer (God's payback?) she would get worldwide sympathy for any stress a trial would incur.
[R2] [R10] Thanks, I knew there had to a thread here. I followed the case but it became so convoluted and apparent the truth wouldn't come out until many years later, any newly written book recommendations?
I remember reading that it could have been a crime of opportunity.
They were a prominent family, plus I'm sure the pageants attracts a seedy element, they were doing renovations on their house so workers were coming in and out, and they had recently hosted a Christmas party.
Patsy killed her daughter.
What did Ann Rule say about it?
Only if you include a recipe, R17.
PPSM, any holiday season recipe would tie in quite nicely, after all, the unfortunate incident happened after a Christmas party.
The only important thing to come out of all this is the "Famous JonBenets Throughout History" thread, which is no longer available.
I've followed the case from the beginning, and the only scenario that makes sense to me is that John was sexually molesting JonBenet, Burke made the 911 call on the 23rd to report it, John killed her accidentally by hitting her on the back of the head, then strangled her to make it look more like the work of an intruder, and Patsy wrote the ransom note.
By the way, the best collection and analysis of evidence I've found is at the link. They present the evidence, then look at various theories from many different perspectives. The site, however, doesn't reach any conclusions---it's just a compendium of all the research done.
The most informed book is; Jon Benet, Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation. By Steve Thomas and Don Davis. Steve Thomas was the chief investigator and studied the case for years. He was thwarted by the Boulder Police who protected the Ramsey's at every turn. He has no doubt, Patsy killed her daughter.
It's no coincidence that Burke got his garrote-making badge from is Cub Scout troop after his sister's demise.
Little bitch wouldn't give up here slick snatch to her pervvy daddy so he offed her. End of story.
R25, are you trying to sound stupid?
I just read it R24 and it just confirms what I've always believed: a big cover-up at the highest levels. Daddy Ramsey was and IMPORTANT man. If this was a real kidnapping case involving someone Ramsey didn't know you better believe the FBI would've taken over that case from the very beginning.
Jon Benet was killed during one of their rituals under the guise of a Christmas party. The Ramseys were Satanists as are/were their wealthy and powerful friends. Children are abused in these rituals, sexually and otherwise, and in Jon Benet's case, it went a little too far.
Her vagina was shredded and twice the size of a normal 6-year old's vagina. The first medical examiner said she was a victim of ongoing horrific sexual abuse.
Wake up! Many of the power elite are Satanists underneath their often times "Christian" or Jewish, or whatever socially acceptable religion veneers.
John Ramsey was not an important man.
Who is this satanic conspiracy theorist who keeps popping up in every thread?
I do agree, however, that he would have called Lockheed Martin security before he would have called the police.
Since someone fessed up they really don't like Rocky Horror...
I'll go ahead and admit I never really got into John Waters, not even Pink Flamingos or Female Trouble.
Especially with the $118,000 in the ransom note.
It meant someone knew his bonus.
It could've been Burke, however, he did it with full approval of Mom and Dad. It just went too far.
There aren't wandering packs of child-murdering cultists wandering around upper-income neighborhoods on Christmas Eve.
And they don't kill kids, then hang around the house, find legal pads and Sharpies, and compose three-page ransom notes before leaving.
Someone in the family did it; they all know (or knew). It's not that complicated.
My money's always been on Patsy. Hell of a gal.
I think it's beyond gross that people accuse her brother Burke, a 9-year-old boy himself, of the murder with very little evidence.
This is my favourite thread every year. So shush yourselves haters!
[quote]I think it's beyond gross that people accuse her brother Burke, a 9-year-old boy himself, of the murder with very little evidence.
He's no longer 9 years old. He's 25 now.
Patsy wrote the ransom note, but it's still not clear whether she killed JonBenet or John did.
It was certainly not Burke: at 9, he wasn't old enough to have the practical knowledge required to make a garrotte out of wire and a paintbrush handle, nor was he likely strong enough to garrotte his sister with it.
R40, people were accusing him way back then, too. Sick.
Actually there is strong evidence to suggest Burke did it and the parents covered up for him.
The garrotte could've been done anytime. The autopsy and evidence was so mishandled nothing conclusive can be drawn from it, because it was so contaminated.
Burke most likely did it and Patsy and John covered for him.
Just go to the crime library and you can see quite a few example of 8 year old murderers. Mary Bell was a little girl who used to hold other little kids down and press on their windpipes till they died.
Of course being in England they just kept her in a nice school till she was 18. Then they reissued her a new name, gave her a new life and passed a law saying no one can disclose her new name.
Because in Europe murdering people is only a two or three year punishment.
"Actually there is strong evidence to suggest Burke did it"
No there isn't. Of course since there's no evidence proving him innocent, some of you feel free to run with your pet theory.
There are 3 reasons why people still believe the Ramseys killed their daughter, even though DNA evidence has proved it was someone else and the Ramseys were officially cleared:
1. the body was found in the house
2. the sum of the ransom
3. the child pageants and Patsy's behavior
There was snow on the ground, but not everywhere. There was a suitcase found underneath a basement window. The note was written on middle pages from a tablet found in the house. Several more middle pages were missing. The duct tape and rope used on Jonbenet were not found in the house. There were marks now believed to be made by a taser on the body. She was not killed by the blow to the head. She was sexually assaulted while alive and asphixiated by the garotte, the blow to the head came close to the time of death. She pulled at the garotte fighting to breathe. Her own blood was found under her fingernails. The family was exonerated by new DNA techniques that proved there was much more DNA from a non family member all over her. There were no signs of previous sexual abuse.
I subscribe to the theories put forward by John Douglas and Lou Smit. An intruder came in through the basement window while the Ramseys were out. He could have been waiting there for hours. He wrote the note during that time - it was a spur of the moment decision, probably done as a ruse to give himself more time to escape. I think he'd been stalking Jonbenet and her family. He might have even been in the house before under some pretext. Remember that the man who kidnapped Elizabeth Smart did some odd jobs at the family home. He hid in the empty room next to Jonbenet's when the family came home. Patsy told police she generally left the hall light outside Jonbenet's room on so her room wouldn't be totally dark.
He tased her and brought her down to the basement. Her room was next to the stairs. From fibers on the outside of her clothes that matched those in the suitcase, he may have tried to stuff her in it. When he couldn't get both her and himself out of the window he came in, he sexually assaulted and killed her in the basement.
This was not done by a pedo-ninja. This was a messy, disorganized crime that did leave evidence that the Boulder PD ignored because the family acted so strangely. This was the second child John Ramsey had lost, and Patsy clearly had a weird obsession with her daughter. I think they both just kind of lost it for a while. In fact, I think Patsy lost it permanently.
Pedo-ninja. I love it
The Ramseys were satanists.
R45, if your theory were true they would've found the identity of the killer via process of elimination. Who was privy to John's holiday bonus amount, etc. There couldn't have been many. Also, they never cleared Patsy as not having authored the note, did they? IIRC, it was inconclusive.
I think R12 has got it right.
My theory is that Patsy was responsible, mortally injuring her daughter during a fit of rage over something. It reminded me a lot of the Jeffrey MacDonald murders: raged-based mortal wounds, then a ridiculous cover story. Macdonald blamed homicidal hippies; the Ramseys blamed the "small foreigh faction" who wrote the ransom note.
Just saw that L&O: CI episode (with Liza!) the other day, in which one very important point was made. If the kidnappers were supposed to be calling at a certain time, why was the mother making so many phone calls and asking people to come to the house? That one phone call from the kidnappers was ALL she should have been thinking about.
I wonder if we'll have Patsy Ramsey rhymes someday, the way we had Lizzie Borden ones when I was a kid.
I don't know how many people could have known about the bonus R48, and I think that's the key to the case. I do think the family had been stalked and researched by the killer, but oddly he knew about the $118,000 and then referred to John Ramsey's "Southern good sense". The family relocated to Boulder from Atlanta, but Ramsey is from Michigan.
To me, the note is a taunt. He's boldly hiding in the family home, about to snatch Jonbenet from under their very noses. He's letting Ramsey know that he knows personal things about him, and that's why that amount was chosen.
R47, What evidence do you have that the Ramsey's were Satanists?
The most compelling bit of info to me is the statement by John R's secretary that she overheard someone in the family say that Patsy accidentally hit JonBenet in a fit of rage while trying to hit her husband, who she caught molesting the completely sexualized little girl.
Patsy clearly wrote the "ransom" note herself. What a sick, repressed, greedy, materialistic, hyper-fake religious Repugnicant, pedo beauty pageant-obsessed little family.
These people aren't very bright, but did manage to Stonewall the police and media to the bitter end. They clammed up well after realizing that their PR games had failed.
Patsy took their dirty secrets with her to her grave. She was all about presenting a good surface image.
Silly R45, the Ramseys were home the entire time of the crime. The intruder have no knowledge of Ramsey's bonus check amount. There were no taser marks and tasers certainly do not prevent someone from crying out. There was almost DNA on her, and the foreign DNA could have come from the manufacturer of the underwear, not to mention people trying to revive her, people searching the house, you name it. The fact that Patsy was okay with crime scene tape and filling the house with her friends (who then had to be added as suspects) shoots down the intruder theory. Patsy knew she was dead.
Patsy Ramsey took a rope
And gave her daughter quite a choke
When she saw what Daddy did
She knew she couldn't trust that kid.
I didn't read that she was sexually assaulted. I read the she had a yeast infection.
Dec. 23 there was a 9-1-1 call to Boulder police from the Ramsey residence.
They released surveillance footage from the police station where cops were questioning the Ramseys.
When the cops got even mildly suspicious of their stories, Patsy switched from grieving mom to brittle gun moll in about two seconds. I half expected her to say, "Yeah, what of it, copper?"
Ramsey was from Nebraska. I wonder if he is related to Hagel. They had very similar careers...up until the murder.
What in the world, R59?
Because two men happen to be from the same state, that means they may possibly be related?
You have cognitive disabilities or you are mentally disturbed or acutely stupid.
Don't ask me. I'm no longer in a position to talk about it.
On the 15th anniversary of this case I am bumping this thread.
Maybe OJ did it?
HA ha. I think that now that it's been like 15 years, the real killer will never come clean.
I mean if he confessed he would've already been in jail for 15 years right? So if he does now he'll have to start over from scratch and that's not fair to him.
r62, exactly what do you mean...''that's not fair to him''
I'm glad I read the other thread before it disappeared.
Last night, I ordered that "Foreign Faction" book that one poster kept mentioning. My local library doesn't carry that book anywhere in the county, so I bought a used hard copy off Amazon.
I also listened to an old True Crimes podcast with the author (I think...) who had A LOT of information about JB's prior abuse.
John Ramsey tried to live in Atlanta for awhile, but moved on to the relative safety of Michigan. Charlevoix, by the way, is a lovely little village-like town on the upper edge of the state. The population is around 2,000, so people must notice him there, too.
Burke did it and the scum still let's his mother take the rap for it. What an awful child.
JR ran for office. He thought the fame of his daughter's death would propel him to a national political career.
R66 No one has taken the rap for anything, have they?
Not one to stand for living in his sister's shadow, Burke will come clean on his death bed.
He's going to go out with a bang.
[quote]In the Reddit forum, Beckner said police should have separated JonBenet's parents and gotten full statements from Patsy and John Ramsey that day. The case was initially mishandled due to a "perfect storm type scenario," he wrote.
[quote]"It was the Christmas holiday and we were short staffed, we faced a situation as I said earlier that no one in the country had ever seen before or since, and there was confusion at the scene as people were arriving before we had enough personnel on the scene," he wrote online.
[quote]No one has been prosecuted in the case. Court documents released in 2013 show a grand jury recommended indictments against the Ramseys, contrary to the long-held perception that the secret panel ended their work in 1999 without deciding to charge anyone.
Obviously John Ramsey knows what happened and possibly Burk.
If only I had not snuck downstairs for that extra slice of pineapple!
Considering that everyone knows that Burke did it, yeah Burke should know.
It was very nice of Patsy to take the rap for her awful kid's murder of her good child.
The father was really hot
what ever happened to him
I got away with it...
Just like OJ
all have in common?
They all got away with it.
Hey I only killed one person, and she was a child, more like half a person.
Don't lump me in with those double killers.
OJ didn't do it. Stupid white people just thought he was the go to guy. He didn't do it.
This part of his Beckner's statement just jumped out at me:
[quote]we faced a situation ... that no one in the country had ever seen before or since.