At least Andrew and Michael are actually gay so I guess that's slightly better,I cringe at Eric's performance on Modern Family,Andrew's character is a close second.
I would vote for Sean Hayes, because he annoyed the crap out of me at the time. But in retrospect, it appears he actually helped us. Many straight people enjoyed Will & Grace, and the character of Jack, I hate to say it, was ultimately viewed favorably in time.
Besides, there are many gay people who are like Jack, he wasn't as much of a caricature as I thought. I still find his performance annoying though, and wish there could be more gay characters of greater diversity in Hollywood.
Everyone on a sitcom is a stereotype.
The young, thin, hot mom who looks like she had her first child at fifteen.
The goofy dad who means well but always gets it wrong.
The shrewish mother in law no one can stand.
The grumpy, but occasionally wise grandad.
Good-looking children who consider doing the wrong thing but usually end up doing the right thing after a talking to from one of the above.
And now we have the camp gay man.
OP as The OP.
Try Billy Crystal on Soap. While stereotypical, Sean Hayes's was not shameful, except to self-loathing gay men who think effeminacy is a capital offense.
Come and knock on my door, I've been waiting for you!
R2, I had no idea Jason Bateman played a gay character. Apparently, that show only aired 7 episodes, which explains why I never heard of it.
R10, please. Sean Hayes in Will and Grace was a gay minstrel show. A gay person being offended by this wretched stereotype is no different than an African American cringing at the depiction of a stereotypical mammy.
William Frawley on "I Love Lucy".
d) All of the above
R14 wins by a mile.
Sean Hayes (Jack) on Will & Grace
They are all pretty awful.
Sean Hayes was brilliant as Jack. Sorry, maybe there was some stereotypical behavior, but he's a great actor, and is great at physical comedy. And we are talking about comedy - the key is exaggeration. Jack was a caricature, but a harmless one that I think helped acceptance. The shameful portrayals are the ones where gays are depicted as prissy jewelry store salesmen, there for the Al Bundies to make fun of.
Eric Stonestreet by a mile. can't watch that show.
Def Sean Hayes in Will and Grace.
r10, acting [childish epithet posted by a bigoted tool] is not a capital offense. Acting like a shrieking 15 year old girl on uppers IS a capital offense.
Andrew Rannell's character knows he's over the top. Eric Stonestreet's thinks he perfect. Can't stand Eric Stonestreet's Steppin Faggot act.
"Everyone on a sitcom is a stereotype."
Not quite - there's a much broader range of hetero characters on sitcoms. Gay male characters come in only two varieties - screaming queen and dull "everyman" gay with no sex appeal.
In other words, Will and Jack, the Rannels and Bartha characters on NEW NORMAL.
Stonestreet was fairly funny the first season of MODERN FAMILY, but he's gotten more and more prissy to the point where he's intolerable.
It still surprises me that Eric isn't gay. I saw him on AHS, season one, and he played the same character as he does on MF. He just pings to high heaven...
Can we discuss Billy Crystal on Soap, please?
Shameful, really OP? Stereotypes exist so people and shows can make fun of them. People who are bothered by stereotypes have issues (usually self loathing).
Yeah the Soap writers did trot out some unsavory cliches with Jody. Confusing homosexuality and being transsexual, multiple suicide attempts (a lesbian friend successfully offed herself) and then the cherry on top, as the series ends he's turned straight in a relationship with a woman.
But just having a gay, main-cast member was groundbreaking at the time, and Jody was generally sympathetic, after all it propelled Crystal to stardom.
How about Michael Urie's character on "Ugly Betty"?
That was a really hateful character, with some glimmers of humanity once in a while. But it was all about him, he stabbed everyone in the back, even his boss he supposedly really admired.
I work in fashion myself, for many years, in the advertising end, I cannot stand to be around those types of gay men, I find them depressing. Many feel acting like that is the norm in the fashion field. It seems they study that in school! These types of gay men perpetuate that obnoxious off-putting 'bitchy queen' stereotype.
ELLE magazine's Creative Director, Joe Zee, star of "All On the Line" also fits that mold. He's very talented, knows what he's talking about but unfortunately he's another snobby fashionista stereotype.
Yes, I know 'Ugly Betty" was developed from the original tele-novella, so there were those elements of a soap opera, with those types of characters, but still.
Why are gay men who work in fashion always depicted as over-the-top bitchy, backstabbers, evil, know-it-all and total ass-kissers to their equally nasty fashionista bosses?
I would like to punch Eric Stonestreet in his fat mug for the repulsive stereotype he plays - I can take camp and silliness, but the fact that he is a bad actor means he doesn't know how to connect elements of cliche to a recognizable human being.
And this fat fuck gets two Emmys because he's a straight man playing a mincing hippo?
He makes Sofia's performance look like a model of circumspection and detached authenticity.
Kim Cattrall as Sam Jones on Sex & the City.
Mario Cantone as himself.
R28, what I don't understand is why people are so willing to brush off the (to my mind) far more egregious offensiveness of a character like Jody, but will foam at the mouth like rabid wolves at the mere mention of Sean Hayes's name.
I am sick of the stereotypical swishing gay clown. It is the equivalent of minstrel show characters like Stepin Fetchit and Sleep 'n Eat.
I know a lot of gay men who act like Sean Hayes' character 'Jack'. It may have involved indulging some stereotypes, but they weren't all inaccurate.
Mary! All of you!
And we joke that lesbians have no senses of humor. Yes, they are stereotypes and the majority of people who watch television know that they are stereotypes.
Maybe if they had a gay character who was offended by everything then all of you would be happy.
There were a few reasons why I never liked Will & Grace, but Jack was never one of them.
R8, you forgot the "horny grandma"
If the DL gay male stereotype were portrayed in an sitcom, he would be a fat, bald, 55 y/o, hissing, bitchy, cheeto munching, basement dwelling, caftan wearing queen.
Jack Tripper on Three's Company.
I mean, talk about shameful.
R38, I think OP could play him.
The Neutered Tony Randall in "The Odd Couple" is only eclipsed by the neutered Tony Randall in "Love, Sydney".
Bea Arthur in The Golden Girls. Couldn't they have at least hired a man to play the bitchy old caftan wearing elder gay?
I mean I do have to give her props for the deep masculine voice and butch demeanor but could't she have worn jeans or a speedo at least once?
"People who are bothered by stereotypes have issues (usually self loathing)."
Tell that to all of the African-Americans who have rightly criticized the Black Maid and Sufflin' Lazy Black Man stereotypes that were in the movies for so long.
"Yes, they are stereotypes and the majority of people who watch television know that they are stereotypes."
Oh, you're giving TV watchers waaaay too much credit.
"there's a much broader range of hetero characters on sitcoms. Gay male characters come in only two varieties - screaming queen and dull "everyman" gay with no sex appeal."
BINGO! It's amazing how clueless some peopler are here.
Eric Stonestreet - a little annoying but if if it were coming from a more attractive guy, I'd be more tolerant of it. If the show was centered on Mitch and Cam, I wouldn't be watching
Michael Urie - Attractive (to me), but has the "I am much better than any of you" vibe in his character, and that becomes annoying quickly. I find it hard to sit through that show because every line is followed by a laugh track and it distracts from whatever storyline they are going for.
Andrew Rannells - I know many guys like this and I generally do not get along with that type.
Sean Hayes - He nailed the Jack character. Is "jack" someone I could be friends with? No. But his job was to entertain and that he did.
Remember…..Acting is Attracting !!
Brad Bell as "Cheeks" in Husbands.
It's yet another gay minstrel show.
[quote]what I don't understand is why people are so willing to brush off the (to my mind) far more egregious offensiveness of a character like Jody, but will foam at the mouth like rabid wolves at the mere mention of Sean Hayes's name.
Because Jody was on a show called SOAP, a soap opera parody where everyone was fucked up.
And SOAP was in the late 1970s and included such other realistic storylines as babies possessed by the devil, flying saucers, illegal aliens, and time travel.
I don't know. I always find that the gays that complaint the most about stereotypes of tv are usually insecure themselves. In real life, I wouldn't be able to stand a Jack from W&G type, but on tv his type don't bother me since they are pretty common in big cities/gay ghettoes.
r43, people aren't clueless but you can't expect for Rome to be built in a day. Even those stereotypes should be considered progress when considering how far we've come already.
Didn't Jody also think he was an elderly Jewish man at the end of the run?
Based on these comments on here, the most shameful portrayal of a gay man has yet to happen. Picture a show filled with the bitchy, bitter people that sometimes populate datalounge. Imagine the portrayal of the kind of guy who puts no fems, no blacks, no Asians on their gawkr profile. Imagine America falling in love with that guy and that show being popular--I don't see it happening.
All these shows that you're putting down in some ways have led to America actually seeing gay people as just like everyone else and contributed to the turn around in the poll numbers supporting gay rights and equality. Plus some of them were/are funny.
Nothing wrong with encouraging variety in portrayal of gay people on TV, but I don't see the need to put down all these shows to do so.
[quote]Picture a show filled with the bitchy, bitter people that sometimes populate datalounge.
I don't have to picture it, I can already see it Monday nights at 8:30 on CBS and Tuesday nights at 9:30 on NBC.
Sean Hayes in W&G was a fucking gay Stepin Fetchit and annoying to boot.
Sean Hayes should have his liver pecked out by vultures!
[quote]Picture a show filled with the bitchy, bitter people that sometimes populate datalounge.
If it includes Cheryl I might picture it but I certainly don't want to smell it.
I do think Jack on W&G and Cam on Modern Family are kinda gay minstrel show characters.
I don't think you can but Rannell's character on the New Normal in that box. He is much more a three dimensional character and feels like a real person.
Y'know, having known each and every one of the above-mentioned "types" in my long and semi-illustrious time on the planet, I have to agree with [R10]. The self-loathing thing is a real problem.
Hilarious first paragraph r50, you nailed it. Perhaps there have been too many stereotypical gay men in sitcoms, and more diversity would be good, but I don't object to fem characters in general. I'm not what you'd call "flamboyant," but I identify with that type of guy a lot more than I do straight men. I figure if a flaming queen isn't accepted, then I'm not really accepted either. They're the canaries in the mine for the rest of us.
All gay men are not screaming queens. It's disappointing that almost every gay man portrayed on television is.
What's even more disappointing is that a gay character who is a screaming queen will be played by a gay actor, but his hot butch boyfriend will be played by a straight actor (Rannells/Bartha, Urie/Routh, Quinto/Sears).
OP and others,
You just aren't that interesting for television. Face it.
Who was the actor in the old Ellen sitcom who first appeared as a telemarketer? Had red hair and would pop up and say "I got a hundred dollars!" He was kind of fey and stereotypical but not offensive. The guy was really funny.
Found him, it was Patrick Bristow. I fthought he was hilarious in Ellen but some people found him offensively stereotypical.
I loved that guy R62, and his boyfriend.
Patrick Bristow, of course best known for his legendary performance in Showgirls.
I think a gay man portraying a gay character on tv should be discounted. Eric Stonestreet is excellent in his role as Cam...
Sean Hayes was BRILLIANT (all caps) as Jack McFarland. Impeccable comic timing and the blessing of wonderful writers. His over the top stereotype was MEANT to be just that. And it was. And so was Karen Walker. SHE was as over the top hilarious as "Just Jack." Anyone who chaps at Sean's portrayal, which was purposefully crafted that way, should look inward. Those characters go down in sitcom history as some of the funniest in the history of television.
Will and Grace was groundbreaking. It was the FIRST show (or sitcom) ever to have gays as out, loud and proud. Not apologizing for who they were. There was no freakin' Stepinfetchit thing going on. There were plenty of OTHER gay characters shown along the way (Michael Douglas, Bobby Canavale, Patrick Duffy, for example) who were "traditionally masculine." Jack was "Just Jack." And a very real personality type that actually exists in the world. So, how is that a Stepinfetchit? Will Truman was a stereotype,too . The uptight, prissy and anal retentive yuppie gay man. The show introduced much of America to gay life by way of humor. It opened some doors. And it has very well crafted humor. Every gay person could relate to the jokes, the humor and the attitudes. Everyone knew (or WAS) a Jack or Will. They occasionally showed some humanity in the characters (plenty of moments where the characters expressed love and affection in between all the barbs), but it wasn't meant to be about multi-dimensional people. Sitcoms are not about that.
Was it a perfect show? No. There were some dull storylines. Deb Messing got pregnant and fat and had problems taking the baby weight off. Grace and Leo were dullsville. The Will and Grace have a baby line was awful. Too many stunt guest stars. But, by and large, it was classic TV comedy.
Posters who "hated Jack"....well, that says something about you. And your inability to laugh at yourself. Or to put the show and that character in perspective. Sean Hayes deserved every one of his Emmys.
Well said R67.
Sean Hayes did a great job as Jack. Walk into most any gay bar and there will be Jack McFarlands all over the place.
[quote]It was the FIRST show (or sitcom) ever to have gays as out, loud and proud.
God, you're dumb.
r59 has a great point
John Goodman on Normal Ohio
[quote]Too many stunt guest stars.
But some of them were great. Michele Lee and Chita Rivera as lesbians were wonderful. And one of the funniest moments in sitcom history when Jack, dining with Will in a restaurant, turns around and says to the Broadway star at the next table, "Shut UP, Patti LuPone!"
Out of all the gay websites I go to or post on, DL is the only one with this crazy intense dislike of queeny guys. I've never quite understood the reason for that. What is the problem with being queen? Isn't the whole deal to just be who you are?
Brothers was the first sitcom to portray a gay man who was out,proud and had dignity. Too bad it's been overshadowed by the likes of Will and Grace.
Jack was the best charater. Will was like a failed charcter out of SATC.
Josh Radnor on How I Met Your Mother
R67 is one of the most overreaching twats ever to attempt a meaningful post here.
First paragraph: 9 errors in English grammar, spelling and punctuation usage, and one serious error in logic.
Second paragraph: 7 errors in grammar, spelling and punctuation, three serious errors in logic/rhetoric, and four historical and cultural inaccuracies. The use of "Stepinfetchit" twice, in itself, qualifies the poster as an ignoramus.
Third paragraph: 7 errors, a cliche, the by-now familiar lapses in taste accumulating like shit in an outhouse, and a large error in logic.
Fourth paragraph: The capstone, with unfounded conclusions, ad hominem argument, and an error in English usage.
If you are capable of focusing your malformed brain long enough to focus on this sentence long enough to finish it, R67, please seek remedial education, appropriate therapy (It might help.), and a life plan that does not include attempts at communication. Perhaps a street show where you play a dead mime would meet your particular strengths.
Now go away.
Funny how it's essentially been an even three-way race ever since the poll was posted.
Brothers was on Showtime, not a network program. Paul Regina (RIP) did a wonderful job as the gay brother, too. Robert Walden played one of his brothers. Walden is currently on Happily Divorced as Fran Drescher's father.
Ellen had ONE gay character, namely Ellen, and the show ran for awhile before she even came out. The coming out episode was controversial, as was every episode thereafter. Ellen was cancelled, ultimately for being "too gay." So, those two shows, while groundbreaking, were not quite in the same category as Will and Grace.
Oh, and poster r78 is insane.
Too gay? No! Unfunny. Yes!
The coming out episode on Ellen gave a quick temporary boost in the ratings but it was already on its way out before she came out.
R67 = Sean Hayes
CBS has cancelled Partners so now you have one less show character to be self loathing about. Keep it up and soon you'll have no gay characters on TV.
Partners sucked royal ass and you know it. It's not self loathing to recognize a poorly written, poorly directed show. Michael Urie's character was not funny at all. He was annoying. The characters were not fleshed out. They were not relatable. That show needed to be cancelled.
Oh, and R67/R80/R81/R85 remains a completely illiterate control-freak. See R78 for evidence. Note the cunt cannot face her lack of capacity and so just keeps nattering on and on and on.
Pollute another thread for a while so this on can air out.
[quote]CBS has cancelled Partners so now you have one less show character to be self loathing about. Keep it up and soon you'll have no gay characters on TV.
Yes, our job is to support unthinkingly any piece of steaming crap the networks serve up to us, just as long as the main characters are called gay. Thank you for clearing up our duties and responsibilities for us.
I don't think Eric Stonestreet's character is all that bad. Of course he's stereotypical, but at least they depict him in a fun-loving and caring light.
Mitchell on the other hand is represented as the bitchy arrogant queen.
What's funny is that if Stonestreet were the least bit attractive no one here would ever accept that he's straight.