I came to the conclusion that the only thing that kept me watching this show to the bitter end was the lead actress...even in this restrained role, there is something riveting about her.
Fool me once, shame on you.
....Fool me twice, shame on me.
So much hate on this show. Personally, I loved the whole season and loved the twist at the end. Looking forward to season two!
I'm not a fan of the show myself (doesn't come close to being in the same league as Breaking Bad, The Walking Dead and Hell on Wheels), but I have to say I'm very impressed with Joel Kinnaman. The fact that his Stephen Holden out-wiggas the likes of Aaron Paul's Jesse Pinkman in Breaking Bad -- and he's Swedish! -- is amazing to me. I think we're going to hear a lot more of this guy. He's the only reason why I have even the smallest interest in the show.
Yes the lead actors did great work with a weak product.
They both have charisma.
I saw Mireille Enos in a PBS historical show... of all things, playing a colonial woman... I could not take my eyes off of her. She sold it!
I'm not crazy about liking any Mormon, anywhere, any time...but I think this gal has star potential.
R1, I was going to post the same thing, I had absolutely no problem whatsoever with this show, it was well acted, I loved the rainy, moody atmosphere and the Rosie Larsen case was engrossing and creepy. I'm really looking forward to the series return. And I agree with R2 about Joel Kinnaman. He's got that wigga-swagga down real good.
[quote]Yes the lead actors did great work with a weak product.
R3 is correct. The series was elevated to something worth watching completely at the hands of these two actors.
I watched it a few months ago and liked it.
Kinnaman had a "blink and you'll miss him" role in the Fincher GIRL WITH THE DRAGON TATTOO. He played the gay member of the Millenium magazine staff, which is more of a role in the books. I suspect some of his scenes wound up on the cutting room floor.
After seeing him in KILLING, he and Brit actor Mackenzie Crook from the British THE OFFICE could play relatives.
Season 1 had me completely addicted. But now I can't remember the details about how the ending fucked us over.
I vaguely remember someone calling the star (can't remember their names) to tell her that they were unable to supply her with the security camera footage that she'd requested (was it from the toll booth on the bridge to the Indian casino maybe???) because that camera had been out of order during the time she wanted. And that meant the pics that her partner had produced which were allegedly taken from that security camera were faked.
But I don't remember who those pics made look guilty. Who got charged with the murder resulting from those faked pics?
And that partner got into a car driven by someone we didn't see, and told the driver something along the lines of their plan working. That part I really don't remember clearly.
And someone was about to assassinate the mayoral candidate (Billy Campbell) while he's speaking at some rally. Was the shooter the guy that worked in the shop of Rosie's parents? Did he end up shooting? I can't recall.
I'm assuming AMC will do a marathon before the premier like they do with Walking Dead. For sure I'll have to catch the season finale to refresh me on the stuff I'm fuzzy about.
The original series was boring and unbearable. I can't believe I watched most of it.
I always thought it was so weird that it would be sunny in one shot and five minutes later it would be dark and rainy. They would get in a car and it would be pouring and by the time they got out, it would be sunny.
Is that the way it is in Vancouver/Seattle? Hated it.
[quote]I saw Mireille Enos in a PBS historical show... of all things, playing a colonial woman... I could not take my eyes off of her. She sold it!
She had a similar look in her dual role as twin sisters in a polygamist compound on Big Love. She created a completely different persona for each sister and was spellbinding to watch. The woman has talent.
I totally agree with those who liked Season 1. They fucked the audience with the ending, but I thought it was cool having the rug pulled from under us.
I know it is "just tv" but has any detective in real life ever encountered this many convenient red herrings in one murder case?
I liked the relative realism and grittiness of Season 1 and am looking forward to the start of Season 2. Mireille Enos is great in it.
The lead is captivating to watch, and I like how she just wears jeans, sweaters, and her hair pulled back sort of messy, unlike female detectives on other shows who look like they have personal stylists and make up artists.
I like Holden, too, and didn't know he was Swedish until I read it above--that's amazing! I actually was convinced he was someone I'd seen in U.S. shows before.
R8, the ending was that Holden faked pictures of the councilman on the bridge, and thanked someone we couldn't see for the photoshopping. The fake photos and all the other evidence lead to the councilman's arrest, and the guy who worked for the Larsen family attempted to assassinate the councilman, not sure if it worked.
The guy who worked for the Larsens did a really good job, too. The scene where the dad was beating the teacher, and the worker was there but couldn't get in the fight was so disturbing...when he started punching the rocks, acting like he was in the fight.
As for that article, I had no idea people hated the ending. I was happy the way everything went (except maybe the excessive crying scenes where the mom reminisces in the dead girl's room), and the cliffhanger meant there'd be another season, so that was good, I thought.
The ending "implied" that Holden faked the pictures...I am sure this is yet another red herring.
Starts tonight. I haven't decided yet if I'll watch. I got sucked into S1, but I wasn't the biggest fan (even before the letdown of the season finale).
So many shows on Sunday now....
I'm looking forward to the 2 episode season premier tonight. As frustrated as Season 1 left me, I'm sure I'll be sticking with this show so long as the tone, acting, and story remain at the level they were. It's better to be frustrated by a quality drama than bored by the majority of uninspired TV programs that fill the schedule.
I'm glad they are showing the last 2 episodes of the first season prior to the premier because I need that refresher on where we stand - although thanks to R15 for hitting on the big points.
Loved the 2nd season opener. Off to a great start.
Loved the opener. Once again, lots of twists and turns. One thing I don't understand is how did the guy that shot the suspect not only know that the politician was going to be arrested, but when and where. I think the 2 lead actors are terrific.
I wish I had been able to brush up on last season before last night but... GURL that was exciting!
I think Mitch did it.
Love love love, if I suspend my disbelief that Linden can just keep coming back time after time to Seattle PD after she's ostensibly resigned. Cancel her flight, keep working the case. I don't think it works that way in real life.
Also, the scene with Terri(sp?) and the crystal champagne flute or whatever was excellent camp.
Holder lost his cool when Linden kept shutting him out and that bald guy he's conspiring with really shut him down and let him know how much of a pawn he is and how he's being used. The story is getting more complex now, I wonder how it will be resolved, they can't keep Rosie's murderer a secret forever - the backpack scene was creepy.
[quote]I think Mitch did it.
I've thought this since the beginning but I don't know if it's the case - her behavior has been odd since Episode 1.
22 If you have On Demand they are playingbthe entire first season.
Mireille Enos is a revelation for me! Such a good actress. Honest acting ; not a false moment all of last season or last night in the new season. Very few actresses -- you look in to their eyes and you know exactly what they are thinking as their character. I'd never seen her act before this series.
Season One is no longer On Demand
[quote]I'd never seen her act before this series.
Mireille Enos was also on Big Love playing twins, she was really good.
Glad to see Holder is not all bad. But I would have thought he was a little more street smart than to get duped by the other cops.
Holder got the wind knocked out of him and now some of his swagger is gone.
This show is so depressing, it makes The Walking dead seem like a feel good show.
So did Holder do meth tonight?
That was unclear...but I think not. The women he was shtupping in the car asked if he was holding, it would not have been that question if he was high.
Looks like the Polish mobster is exacting revenge on Larson for leaving his employ, or at least that's what is happening this week.
Another fan. Like the mood. Like the plot twists. It's not easy to sustain a procedural mystery over such an extended period. It's not entirely successful, put it puts any other cop show to shame.
What was the giant high-heeled shoe about in the backpack?
The Mitch on the road plot line is throwing me. also why did holder go back to the dealer/friend in the trailer park?
[quote]What was the giant high-heeled shoe about in the backpack?
Linden was pulling all that random stuff out of the backpack and realizing that none of it could have belonged to Rosie. She figured out that it wasn't Rosie's backpack after all, and it became clear to her what Holder had done and why in switching the backpacks.
[quote]why did holder go back to the dealer/friend in the trailer park?
I thought it was just to show him acquiring some drugs, so we'd wonder if he'd really relapse.
[quote]Linden was pulling all that random stuff out of the backpack and realizing that none of it could have belonged to Rosie. She figured out that it wasn't Rosie's backpack after all, and it became clear to her what Holder had done and why in switching the backpacks.
WAY off the mark. Linden had already found the other shoe in Rosie's room and knows that Rosie was working for an escort service that her Aunt hooked her up with. Holder switched the backpack to confirm that his boss was messing with the evidence.
[quote]One thing I don't understand is how did the guy that shot the suspect not only know that the politician was going to be arrested, but when and where.
He was arrested at a public campaign event. The killer had no idea he would be in police custody.
Mireille Enos -
She was really great in Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf? with Kathleen Turner and Bill Irwin. And of course, Big Love. Interesting actress.
No mention of Billy Campbell's feets??
OK. Remember when Linden found out about the shooting when she was at the airport, and she and her son leave the airport to stay in Seattle? She drove over to her Leuitenant's house, right? He had her son sleeping on his couch while she went off to follow the investigation.
But then she discovers something about the chain of events and the people involved in faking the photograph, and she rushes back to the house, grabs her son, and leaves in a big hurry. As if she knows her Leuitenant is dirty. How?
Holder comes to the same conclusion when he decides to switch the backpacks. His hunch is verified when the Leuitenant gives him the "results." So now they have a new superior.(Duck from Mad Men!)Is he dirty, too?
What made Linden realize her old boss was dirty? Why was she afraid her son was in danger? Also,after watching the last episode, I am wondering if the Larsen's mobsters killed Rosie. I also have a feeling that Larsen's sister-in-law knows a lot more and is implicated.
Oh, so the stuff in the backpack was Rosie's, just not the backpack itself? That passed me by.
[quote] The original series was boring and unbearable. I can't believe I watched most of it.
The original series was from Denmark. If you don't understand Danish, then it's not surprising you would be bored.
Mireille Enos is married to Ferris Bueller's friend Cameron.
I think Linden found out her boss was dirty when she went to check on the faked bridge picture. The guy in the office got a phonecall and she figured out it was her boss tipping him off about her.
The whole Larsen family is so annoying I can't find sympathy for them. Those sons are the worst.
Well I think it's getting more intriguing with the introduction of new suspects and motivations for Rosie's murder and none of the possibilities play as though they just threw something together, but they fit with the storyline of the Larsen's or specifically Stan's history and it makes sense.
blaming it on the mob is kind of weak IMHO.
the candidate's story line is going nowhere that I can see...
I feel like I'm understanding less and less as the story goes on.
Linden looked like she made a connection when she heard the name of the bio dad of the foster boy with the dragon tattoo. I didn't recognize the name. Who was he? The Polish mafia boss that the kid now works for???
Is grieving mother Mitch doing her own investigating by infiltrating some prostitution ring? Or is she really just kind of a whore?
How does a guy popular enough to be running for office not have a single friend or family member at his side in the hospital?
And is his campaign manger/aide guy gay or not? I thought he was, but then last night the councilman made a comment about him need to get laid and said he should call his old girlfriend Gwen. Either way, it sure seems like the guy has a loving relationship with the councilman.
Should we have known who the lady was that showed up at the end and asked grieving dad if he knew who she was?
And at the very end when Linden and her junkie partner found that sketch of Rosie tucked inside that book, were they searching the apartment of dragon tattoo boy?
It's frustrating that so much of the stuff we learned and the characters we got to know in the first season ultimately had nothing to do with the case and we won't see them again.
[quote]How does a guy popular enough to be running for office not have a single friend or family member at his side in the hospital?
Well look at the callous way he treated his campaign manager and his entire team by just dropping out.
[quote]Should we have known who the lady was that showed up at the end and asked grieving dad if he knew who she was?
She was the girlfriend of the man Stan killed when he was working for that Russian guy and she's also the birth mother of the kid that Linden was researching at the foster home - and apparently the kid had something against Rosie. The woman said Stan got what he deserved because of what Stan did to her boyfriend.
[quote]Linden looked like she made a connection when she heard the name of the bio dad of the foster boy with the dragon tattoo. I didn't recognize the name. Who was he? The Polish mafia boss that the kid now works for???
No, he was Piotr, the guy Stan Larsen killed at the Polish mafia boss's behest. The woman who confronted Stan at the end was his wife, whom we met earlier when Linden and Holder visted her at home. The young guy with the manga tattoo is their biological son whom the mother gave up when his father was killed by Stan.
[quote]And is his campaign manger/aide guy gay or not? I thought he was, but then last night the councilman made a comment about him need to get laid and said he should call his old girlfriend Gwen. Either way, it sure seems like the guy has a loving relationship with the councilman.
The actor pings, but the character is straight.
[quote]Should we have known who the lady was that showed up at the end and asked grieving dad if he knew who she was?
Piotr's wife. See above.
[quote]She was the girlfriend of the man Stan killed when he was working for that Russian guy and she's also the birth mother of the kid that Linden was researching at the foster home - and apparently the kid had something against Rosie. The woman said Stan got what he deserved because of what Stan did to her boyfriend.
Husband. And Polish. This is the Polish mafia.
[quote]and apparently the kid had something against Rosie.
Yeah, that Stan killed his father.
Thanks R54 and R55. Those explanations help a lot. Apparently I wasn't paying the same close attention as I usually do.
Did Mitch's sister call & hang up on that rich kid who lives on the island's parents??
Sterling finally made an appearance & I thought I saw one of the angsty emo boys from the first couple of episodes in the hallway.
The pacific northwest has become very popular on TV.
Yes, but it is such a dreary, overcast rainy place I can't see why anyone would move there.
I love dreary and overcast rainy weather.
Ya, who did Mitch's sister call?
I've never heard of a woman named Mitch, short for Michelle I guess. Meanwhile I finally found out that "Mireille" is pronounced "Mee-Ray". Cute name, good actress.
[quote]Did Mitch's sister call & hang up on that rich kid who lives on the island's parents??
She was calling Jasper's father. It was established last season that she knows him; we are to infer that he was one of her clients at Beau Soleil and that she has feelings for him, whereas to him she's just a whore he won't acknowledge publically.
In my defense, "publically" is an alternate spelling, though that's totally not what I was going for.
At other sites people swoon over Holder. He is good for comic relief sometimes but his ghetto schtick is tiring. I'm glad they have Mad Men on after this because this show is so depressing it's not the last thing I want to watch on Sunday nights before starting the work week.
Things are bad when you have to rely on Mad Men for a pick-me-up -- a female friend thinks MM is the most depressing show on TV.
Now that I think about it the shows I watch on AMC (Breaking Bad, The Killing, The Walking Dead, Mad Men) are all kind of depressing.
I watch Game of THrones on Sundays too. Lots of lust & violence and bad wigs so it's not depressing.
The kid with the tattoo reminds me of Tom Cruise.
Richmond is sure a horndog for brunettes.
Was that Terri in the hooker heels getting into the car?
So was that the first time Stan and she kissed? Or do you think they were having an affair?
how the heck long are they going to drag this show on for? The plot should have resolved last season
[quote] The kid with the tattoo reminds me of Tom Cruise.
I wonder if Tom will bring him in for a wrestling/casting session.
My god, another twist in the damned plot! This is like a damned soap opera. I get so angry at it, and yet I can't not watch!
way crazy stuff -
Sister & stan have had a previous affair it didn't seem like their first encounter.
Wondering if Rosie was the sister's illegitimate baby that stan & mitch took in...
Billy campbell is pitiful.
I watched half of this ep and then jumped to Veep (meh) and Girls (love it) to get away from yet another dead red herring and yet more doom and gloom. I will continue to watch if only to finally find out who actually killed Laura Palmer 2.0 but really where can this show go after this?
I think Rosie's real father is the guy that Stan killed. That explains why Mitch made him leave the mob after that and the bond between Alexi and Rosie--they are siblings.
I'm just now watching Season 1. I like it but to me the characters need more fleshing out but maybe they do at the end. Like whose mailbox did Holder leave money in unless I missed something? What's the deal with the sister? She's constantly at the house and doesn't seem to have any life of her own. I'm kind of tired of watching the political side of the story too. I'm on episode 7 or 8 right now. I'm getting disgusted with Mitch moping around and neglecting her family. Take some anti-depressants or something. I don't how they are going to drag this murder out for another season. I think each season should be a new case.
oh smack! a ton of crazy shit has been dumped on us and we're only 20 minutes into the episode!!
Stupid Mitch, she just met that girl and lets her spend the night in bed with her. What a surprise (NOT) she got robbed.
Really like this show especially the lead actress. It is dark and gloomy and that suits me just fine. I loved season 1 but more is thrown at us in s2 so i need to go back and watch since I haven't been focusing enough.
That woman who came back to work for Richmond must be in love with him. Get in line after Jamie.
Haven't watched last night's episode yet. Are the more shots of Billy Campbell's bare feets?
Who cares? This will be canceled. The numbers are terrible. It never should have been renewed in the first place and AMC knows it.
If it does get canceled they better wrap things up before they pull it or viewers are going to be really ticked.
I don't think The Pitch will do that well either.
Um...how did the campaign bitch go from watching Billy Campbell in his televised interview in DC to lunch with her father in Seattle and then decide to work for Campbell again all in one day? Did I miss something? The Mitch subplot is excruciatingly bad. The only brief moment of light in the show was when Mirielle gets her son's quiz results and finally smiles and acts like a human for once. Of course this was followed within seconds by the ominous picture on the fridge and the mad dash to Holder's house. Oy. I will watch this to the end but goddam it requires patience, good hearing, an appreciation of rain and clouds and a major suspension of disbelief.
They need to wrap the story up and go to a new one or something.
WTF is with all the rain? I know it rains in Seattle but christ! Is it winter in the show?
I love all the rainy weather and gloom in this show, it's one of my favorite aspects of it. I also loved that view of the water and mountains in Rosie's room when Linden looked out her window.
Why was Terri kissing Stan last week but this week we learn that she was having a relationship with that gahy haired guy? Mitch and that runaway girl are boring. Mitch needs to just go home.
I loved when that rich kid asked Holder if he realized he was white.
So Linden is supposed to have had some kind of emotional breakdown on the job in the past? They keep hinting arond that and I'm not sure if I'm reading it right.
Ever been to Vancouver, B.C.? It's substituting for Seattle and it looks like that three-fourths of the year. Rain, clouds, dampness.
I've been loyal to this series from beginning but now I'm getting pissed. All of a sudden, new characters this season that could be guilty of the murder. It's a cheat. Unfair. I also was hoping Mitch, the mother, would just disappear. Irritated by her all last season and I couldn't care less about her storyline this season. Still, I'll stick with it cause I love Enos and Kinneman.
Who are the new characters? Every single character is someone we've already "met"last season. Maybe it was only in passing, but we met them.
Well, Alexi and his mother are new. But I can't think of anyone else who's important. The young girl at the motel with Mitch isn't a major character not even a supporting one. HEr arc will probably not last more than two or three episodes.
I loathed Mitch. I've only seen Season 1 but I just wanted her whiny, mopey ass gone.
I can't believe that if the police had arrested the leading candidate for mayor of a major city and as a result he was shot and then almost immediately cleared suddenly, the local, national, and international media would be all over the case and that state and federal investigators wouldn't be called in. No way single police captain cover effectively cover it up and impede the investigation and no way just two unheralded detectives would be the only ones on the case.
Maybe in Denmark.
The socialite wife interviewed by the detectives at the party --she's new and , I suspect, we could be seeing more of her. (She's the one who said she and hubby had an "open marriage" and wasn't concerned about his affairs. I liked her little performance,btw). The hubby --did or did he not have sex with Rosie?? I got confused. (I don't remember being introduced to him last season. )
That's Jasper's mother.
Jasper has the nastiest teenage boy face ever! Wanna slap the shit out of him? I did love his white quip to the partner.
I'm mesmerized by Eric Ladin's voice (the guy who plays Jamie).
Holder almost had some man on man action.
Linden's kid is only 13? He is annoying.
what is this fuckery tonight? Last week's episode was MUCH better..
I'm starting to think Linden and Holder will get together. And I NEVER thought that would happen.
Worst episode ever.
why is Linden living is crappy motels-shes making a detectives salary. Obvioulsy shes not going to Sonoma so get an apt.
also-wasnt Holder supposed to be her replacement? why would they keep her on staff?
Did the original Danish series have an equivalent plot point to a Native reserve/casino?
Also, the local Vancouver actors they hire stand out so obviously with their accents.
How the fuck did Billy Campbells's character get to Pappy Larsen's house to come clean about his bitch minion's attempt to get an endorsement? It seems that he would have a logistical dilemma getting from the hospital to anywhere as he wasn't being released from the hospital until the next day. Maddening show. Linden has completely crossed the line between dedicated and delusional as well as dangerous (Holder's getting the shit beaten out of him because of Linden's obsessions). Bring back Breaking Bad stat!!
holder was not on the previews for next week... someone on another board says he gets wacked.
Well his character is killed in the original Danish one by the murderer....
Detective Sarah Lund
And why doesn't Holder have a car? It sure seems like one might come in handy in Seattle.
I can't see where this series can go if it's renewed for a third season. The locale and the central character are so unrelentingly bleak that it just repels rather than attracts.
Are we going to get a solution in this Rosie Larsen case this season? I am ready for a new case.
It's only DAY 20 in the case. One tends to forget that. You keep thinking that weeks go by but then each episode reminds you what day it is. Unfortunately, it also makes it harder to believe all this could take place in just a number of days -- Campbell's recovery from being shot and paralyzed and out in public again, as one example; people moping for what seems like weeks when it's really only a few days since the murder.
By the way I liked the second series of the Danish one better than it's first. I did love the first series but I think i found the murder investigation of the second really intense. Great murder plot and Lund is far more interesting and compelling a character than Linden. I recommend it highly....
I was thinking the same thing, r110--not much time has really passed since the murder, which makes an awful lot of it unbelievable. Mitch leaves her family after pain we feel we've been watching for months, but has only actually covered a couple of weeks, making her less than even remotely sympathetic (you have two other children, hon). Linden and child seem to be living like vagrants forever, but actually only for a couple of weeks, which probably wouldn't have brought things to a crisis point so quickly.
Every time I see "Day 20" or whatever, it pulls me out of the story.
As for Holder, Linden says in the preview for next week that her boss sat in his office while "one of your officers was dying," so I'm thinking he might be available for other work.
I fail to understand why people are still watching this excruciatingly torturous and boring show. It's not going to make it to a third season. It shouldn't have made it past the first.
Well go somewhere ELSE and ponder that burning question, R113. I'm sure there's yet ANOTHER thread you can go to enlighten people that the show they're discussing is OVAH!
I totally agree with R113. There is no reason for them to drag this out. Nothing happens. This story should have been one season. And even then they would have been dragging it out longer than it should have been.
I have no idea why so many people are watching this show when over the years so many good shows get really low viewers and have been canceled. Southland is an excellent show. It kicks this shows ass, yet not many people watched it when it was on a major network
Why are they still spending so much time on the Richmond campaign if he is innocent? Did Jamie do it?
If Holder is killed, I'm outta there.
What evidence of Holder's did they just bag?
Richmond is going home already? Not too realistic.
Mayor is involved with the tribe... that's who set up Rosie's murder?
Yahoo picked Linden as this years worst Mom. She even beat out Regina from Once Upon a Time.
Viewership is down. People are tired of this case.
They need to wrap the Rosie case up, it's gone on too long and I'm a fan and am willing to put up with twists and turns, but they are just digging themselves deeper with no way out. I didn't think Holder would be killed, it would be way too soon and they are going to solve it together. I am glad that Linden's son is out of the picture, all he did was mope and be bitter and that doesn't add to the story, it's just annoying.
I like the show this season more than I expected, but the stuff with Stan and his family is just not that interesting anymore.
Also, there's no way Holder would have been out of the hospital that quickly given the beating he got, plus exposure.
Mireille Enos's acting this season is terrific, as is Joel Kinnamon's.
It's changed from a murder investigation to a mediation on grief. Boring!
Sunday was one more episode where nothing happened. I don't care who killed rosie. I don't care about the Indians either.
Linden had one human moment (and great acting) in the airport with her son and then went back into her Aspergers bubble. They can't possibly intend to continue this after this season.
txs for sending me this link~
Hooked on The Killing but SSN2 is slowing up
You're welks. You seemed like you wanted a discussion. :)
I hate hate hate fucking Mitch. I wish she'd go away.
It looks like we're finally going to get somewhere and I'd LOVE to swear off this show forever. Unfortunately, unless they cancel it (which I guess is probable) I'll watch again because I really like Holder and Linden.
Mean mean Indians keep beating people up.
I don't really mind Mitch - but I'm getting tired of the political angle - or they need to change that up soon. I still love this show - I got hooked immediately into Season 1 and watched all of the episodes within a week or something. Love Linden and Holder and I'll watch for as long as it's on.
Wow...my mantra while watching this show has become "this is stupid." The whole protracted Mitch subplot and her attendant family issues just are a drag and have nothing to do with who actually killed Rosie. The theft of the GPS from the cop's car by Linden then leading them to a town 30 miles away and then Holder remembering suddenly that there was a storage unit that led to the finding of the key was so lame. And then back to the island of fun and evil injuns and more increduality. There was a modicum of suspense at the end but the previews for next week show Linden in a holding tank so there's that. I agree with everyone who likes Holder and Linden. I just wish they were in a better plotted and written show.
Holder leaving the casino "sayonara Pocahontas"
The previews for next week with Linden in a cell spoiled the suspense. I was so scared Holder was going to get beat up again when he was in the casino. I think a lot of his white boy ghetto crap is schtick as he knows how to play it up like when he was getting loud in the casino to distract attention away from Linden.
I was just coming to post about how much I loved Holden's gangsta ghetto act in the casino - I don't know if it's an "act" since he pretty much always behaves that way. Stan and his sons are going through hell together but when Mitch called out of the blue (what nerve) he told her they were doing fine. I think he should've told her the truth to make her suffer the way she's making them suffer without her. The scene where Linden was in the elevator and the doors finally opened up to a pitch dark floor was creepy. I hope they will resolve Rosie's murder this season - it's become too convoluted.
Gwen's dad was secretly pimping her out to his political buddies?
Yeah, Gwen's blackmailing scheme didn't work out as well as she'd hoped. I hope that guy was lying about her dad.
I like that I can switch over and watch Veep after I watch this. Totally cleanses my palate.
Well, they certainly want you to think the Mayor (incumbent) is the murderer. Seems they heavy-handedly planted that idea this episode. Unless---Gwen somehow isn't going to turn out to be quite what we thought she was--a woman in love with a politician who she felt she had to report had lied about where he was the night of murder.
I agree r137, Stan let Mitch off too easy.
David (Rosie's father) looked better on this show than he did on Desperate Housewives.
Wow it wouldn't exactly be a Sophie's choice to decide between Rosie's bio dad or Stan.
Stan looks like he would be a heavy mouth breather and sweating all over you if you had sex with him.
why does my mind have to go there....
I don't care anymore about who killed Rosie Larson!
[quote]David (Rosie's father) looked better on this show than he did on Desperate Housewives.
I was trying to figure out where I'd seen him before. He did look better. Must be the stubble.
Enos isn't a practicing Mormon. You can feel better about supporting her.
I used to love Linden. Really hard to care about her anymore.
You are right R141, but it is the hallmark of this show to mislead us on who the culprit is. Although I still find enough good in the show to keep watching, I no longer let myself form opinions about who they are telling us the killer is.
It's Rosie's teacher. No, it's Jasper. No, it's somebody from the Muslim Brotherhood (or whatever that was Season 1). No, it's Billy Campbell. No, it's Jasper's dad. No, it's the Polish Mafia. No, it's somebody from the Indian nation. No, it's...
It's so much misdirection that it's maddening.
Is this a 13-episode season? If so, then there must only be about 3 shows left. I remember reading last summer that based on feedback from fans about how frustrating it was to not resolve the story at the end of the season, they intended to wrap up the Rosie murder and start a new mystery midway through Season 2. Either they aren't sticking to that, or they are going for more than 13 eps.
I don't think Stan let Mitch off easy. He dismissed her. "Gotta go. We're fine." That was like slamming the door. She calls all excited about talking to this guy, oblivious about her family and then remembers to ask "How are my boys." What bullshit. I like how he handled her. Rather then yelling at her, he was just dismissive. Emotinally exhausted. Cold. To me that was real.
I think Rosie was killed for seeing something at the casino, possibly involving the Mayor and the Indian Boss Lady, and her henchmen and the guy who works for the Mayor disposed of her,making it look like his opponent did it.
They're clearly stretching the mystery out for another full season while the ratings drop. You'd think that someone at AMC would have stepped in between seasons and made them speed things up. I guess after "Rubicon" anything seemed exciting.
I dig the friendship or subtle sexual tension between Linden and Holder. Reminds me of Mulder and Scully. In some way, I relate to Linden's fuckedup-ness. TV likes to do this with all female investigator roles.
I liked the last episode. Emotional and tense at the end. Couldn't believe Linden went up in that elevator. Freaked me the fuck out that she was on the 10th floor in the dark! I think as long as you don't analyze this show too hard (suspend disbelief) it's good. I realized we didn't see Mitch's sister this episode.
So Lindens fiance is her psychiatrist? Creepy. So this episode was a total bore except that Holder got to be center stage and was great
Three eps left. Lets go.
how did she go from being hit on the head in the casino to be kept in a lock down psych wing?
Apparently the indians sent her. They said she was trying to jump. That hit on the head must have been a doozy.
But we get to find out she had been there before. Not surprising really. Enos did great, butthe therapist sucked completely.
What's going on with Gwen saying to that guy at the end "good work with the Richmond photo"?
This episode was annoying because Linden in the psych ward was a waste of time and took too long, nothing came of it. I did like Holder's investigating scenes though.
I think she said, "Good job with the Richmond video", meaning it wasn't a viral video from a voter. I thought we got a lot of Linden's backstory, which is majorly fucked up. Her finance is her psychologist?! Is that even legal? I love Holden and how he fought for her, not as a romantic interest, but as a friend and partner.
If there is a third season, I think the new mystery will be about the murdered prostitute--the one in which Linden doesn't believe the husband is guilty
God, I thought that was the best episode in 2 seasons.
The back-story of why Linden does what she does, getting enough info the get the police chief on their side, Holder getting Linden out...all great stuff.
I've been frustrated with the show before, but this was good.
Great episode last night.
Psychiatrist. Not psychologist. Its not illegal, but it is unethical on his part. He could lose his license to ptactice which might be the reason that they wete moving.
Interesting that he never got close to cracking Linden's barriers to understanding her first breakdown. This therapist almost did, love how Linden tried to parry with her, alternating jabs and good behavior.
Linden was a piece of shit bringing Holder back to the casino where he almost died. That really infuriated me.
Shes not his mother. He chose to go. He chose to distract. It showed his character and his determination to help.
I agree with R166, Holder does what he wants and probably enjoyed going back to the casino to throw it in their faces.
I loved her scenes with the shrink. I especially loved that last scene where they tell her Linden's being released and she says, "Just a minute..." and then Linden walks.
As if Linden would want to say one more word to her!
As they closed the episode last night the announcer said they would reveal Rosie's killer. There are three more to go as with Mad Men.
this show had promise but quickly became tedious and often boring except for the two leads all the acting is pretty dreadful
what we need before they cancel it is some naked or at least shirtless Holder
[quote] this show had promise but quickly became tedious and often boring except for the two leads all the acting is pretty dreadful
I'd have to disagree with this. Brent Sexton (the actor playing Stan Larsen) is doing a great job. Michelle Forbes was also really good during Season 1 but not given much to do in the current season.
The actors save this show.
I disagree with R169. I've been surprised that the cast is as good as it is.
I've only watched season 1 via Netflix. I was getting irritated at Mitch until her sister got in her face about not being the perfect mother to those horrible boys and Mitch said it had only been a week.
So far the sister has taken no responsibility for getting her niece into the escort service, which almost certainly led to her death. She keeps saying Mitch was too strict with Rosie. I wasn't aware that when your sister is too strict with her teen daughter, it's an aunt's responsibility to step in and get her niece started hooking.
I'm looking forward to season 2.
The niece was not an escort...she just looked at the website once. She was a maid at the casino.
She was a maid at the casino? Why was she heavily made up and wearing those hooker shoes?
Why did she have her father's ATM card? I never heard anything more about that.
Jamie, Gwen, the sister in law, the mayor, all awful vancouver actors
[quote]I wasn't aware that when your sister is too strict with her teen daughter, it's an aunt's responsibility to step in and get her niece started hooking.
Then you haven't been watching.
Thank the stars for that, Maury Springer. I don't enjoy watching those misfits, not to mention the guests on their shows.
Maybe she was in hookerwear because she was undercover to investigate.
LOL R175 has an issue with actors from Vancouver.
Jamie reminds me of Herbie the Elf.
R178, they said she liked dressing up...not a hooker
Am I remembering this wrong?.
I started the confusion about her being a hooker, R181. I've only watched through the first season, so I don't know what happened since then.
I hope Stan's crazy son doesn't kill their new bulldog.
[quote]They're clearly stretching the mystery out for another full season while the ratings drop. You'd think that someone at AMC would have stepped in between seasons and made them speed things up.
They're running the show at the pace of the original Danish show, "Forbrydelsen." That show has 20 one-hour (and commercial-free) episodes a season; "The Killing" has 13 episodes each season with 42 minutes minus commercials, which is why the Rosie Larsen case has consumed two seasons.
Jamie and Terri aren't Vancouver actors; they're moderately well-known American TV actors. Eric Ladin is from Houston.
The kids are clearly local Vancouver talent, though.
What initially drew Rosie to get a job with or even be involved with anyone/anything at that casino? I've been watching the show but can't remember.
Okay, so the latest twist leads back to . . . Richmond and his two henchmen. So why was the incumbent so jumpy. Are he and whoever in cahoots? And Mitch is home. How heartwarming.
I wonder if they will solve it next week or if they will drag it out until next season?
R186, she was trying to raise money to run away.
I thought it was a good episode on all fronts, with all the storylines. I hope that evil casino owner gets hers, I loved Linden mocking her with the key card. If I had to say which one of Richmond's henchmen could've gotten Rosie, I'd say it was the dude because he's been overly determined to keep the campaign going no matter what and maybe he had to stop Rosie from stopping it, but then again, it may not be Richmond's henchmen at all. I'm ready for anything. I knew it wasn't Stan that would get Yannick, I knew exactly who it would be, the person he hurt the most.
I think the killer is going to turn out to be either Kristin Lehman or Eric Liden. I don't know why and I really don't care but that's what I think. Has this been renewed for next season? Will we get another murder case that take 24 episodes (two seasons) to solve?
The show is on the bubble leaning toward cancellation. It would be a surprise if it was brought back since any chatter about it mostly concerns how boring it is and how badly the producer handled solving any mysteries.
I think it's one of the better things I've seen on TV in recent years.
Then again, I've never been able to sit through an entire episode of Big Bang Theory.
My experience of it was probably improved by having watched it on Netflix streaming, and not having a week-long break in between. Granted it was somewhat flawed, but it wasn't a piece of shit beginning to end like most television series.
The announcer said the killer will be revealed in the last episode of the season. I hope they wrap things up well because I don't think the series will be coming back. I enjoyed the show although it could be slow moving. I will miss Linden and Holder.
Part of the reason I like the show is that it is so slow moving and touches all of the bases.
The fact that at the end we like the two leads as much as we do is because they were so well fleshed out and well acted.
Good show. I'll miss it.
That Indian chief lady is mean.
r196 - she is a hardcore bitch. First she smirks and says to Linden that she thought she got her badge taken away. Then she slams the security woman's fingers in the door. I want to see her go down. And I do give the show credit for being politically incorrect by having the Indians be bad guys.
I loved when Holder slapped her in the face with the warrant and then pushed her aside.
Linden did not even trust the FBI with that card.
I don't think any chain of evidence will hold up...so the end game she's playing right now better work.
It's the rain. The weather in the series is almost a character. It really has become oppressive. I hate to watch it because it is relentless, tedious, always the same. Makes everything seem to drag. I hate the gloomy weather.
I love the gloomy weather, it's a plus for me, I love rain and it makes the show better, IMO.
Can't shake the feeling Jamie is the killer and have thought so from the beginning of this second season. Doesn't make sense why he would kill Rosie but the two things that kept me wondering about him are : 1) He has gotten so much screen time (and especially this season) when there are other story lines that could have used more development so you start thinking he is going to be more at the center of the plot than you would have thought last season. 2) His devotion to the Billy Campbell character----it's almost weird how loyal he is to him. Secretly in love with him? Secretly not loyal to him and really working for someone else to make it look suspicious that Campbell disappeared the same night Rosie was killed, etc. Can't wait to find out now who is the killer!
I think the rain enhances the mood of the show; and it isn't always raining. At the beginning when Linden was going to move to Sonoma with that whiny guy, the rain seemed to provide an extra incentive for leaving.
My favorite show of the past couple of years. Really looking forward to the finale, and very much hoping it will be renewed for a third season.
I am a fan of Mad Men as well, but am far more absorbed in the story line of The Killing.
R202, I said something similar upthread - whenever Richmond has said he was backing out of the campaign, Jaime always gets extremely angry with him and says how hard he's worked and how much he's sacrificed for Richmond and the campaign. Makes you wonder what exactly did he do - did Rosie see something that Jaime thought would hurt Richmond and he killed her?
I think the current mayor's henchmen, including some Indian goons from the casino killed Rosie for seeing something, or finding something out that she shouldn't have seen.
I think they thought she knew more than she did. After she was killed, they decided to implicate Richmond by using his campaign car. They clearly framed him.
Jamie is typical of a certain type of personality usually found in top aides of politicans. These people are borderline obssessive/compulsives and they identify so strongly with their principal, it's almost like a love affair. In some cases it is.
I called Jamie early, not for any "good" reason, but because I couldn't figure out any other reason for having the character. Why would the writers opt for a politician to have two political aides? From the story we've seen so far through 20+ episodes, it would be completely possible to combine the Gwen and Jamie characters into a single role without impacting continuity or plot.
It kills me that-- despite thinking he is the killer for awhile-- I can't come up with a reason I am happy with. I sure as hell hope that the writers have.
R206 - Let's hope it's something other than the Mayor/Casino Indians. That's been so obvious for so many episodes that it would be a real letdown if it's nothing more than that. They are going to have to come up with something totally shocking and unexpected at this point!
R207 - If it turns out to be Jamie, I think it will still somehow connect to Gwen and her powerful political father, at least indirectly. I'm not so sure that Gwen can completely be eliminated as the one who did it.
I realized I didn't make it clear why I thought Gwen can't be eliminated as a suspect ------She was with Richmond the night of the murder and felt compelled to reveal he disappeared during that night (we now know he was at bridge contemplating suicide). That means Gwen was free the night of the murder to do it while Richmond was gone. No one has thought to investigate whether she went out after Richmond left.
I'll be kind of disappointed if it's Jamie since I have thought it was him since the first season.
Maybe Mitch was involved? They brought her back home for the finale.
[quote] Maybe Mitch was involved? They brought her back home for the finale.
If any member of the family is involved, I'd be inclined to think that it's the aunt and the john/lover who broke it off with her some time ago. That whole subplot with the escort service has been on the backburner for some time now.
I really hate that Mitch is back--I wish she'd just disappeared permanently, and let her poor husband and her other two horrendously neglected children get on with their lives. Her endless moping and self-pity has been a real pill for two seasons now.
Though honestly, I'm not even invested in the outcome at this point. I'd like to see who they pin it on, but I mostly just want it to be over. This bullshit where there's a new or revived suspect every fucking episode only to be ruled out almost immediately the following week is really awful and lazy. It doesn't seem organic or well-plotted, just desperate and flailing, as though Veena Sud was irreparably harmed by some early exposure to cheap radio serials. Get another job, lady--you're not suited to this one.
I am thinking maybe the sister-in-law was involved. She was just trying to keep Rosie from spilling the dirt and it went too far.
[quote]I really hate that Mitch is back--I wish she'd just disappeared permanently, and let her poor husband and her other two horrendously neglected children get on with their lives.
I don't think it's unrealistic for her to go into deep mourning after the brutal murder of her daughter. I thought Mitch's parents should have taken the boys to stay with them so Mitch didn't have to deal with their constant whining and neediness. The same day they found out their daughter was murdered, those nasty boys were in their faces constantly demanding attention. It was definitely a case of the wrong kid getting killed off.
is Jamie too old to be the kid in the closet w/the dead hooker Mom (the Picasso bit..?)
r215, wow that would be an interesting twist. But I think Jamie is too old, he seems to be about the same age as Linden.
Who put that picture on Linden's fridge?
r215 again - -maybe Mich pulled a Patsy Ramsey & killed Rosie by accident? & her sister helped her get rid of the body..she may have asked her big shot boyfriend to help...?
216 - for some reason I think Reggie the social services person Linden & her son lived with on the boat has something to do with it....
2 pt finale starts tonight ... I'm excited
r210 again here, well I guess I called the killer from the beginning...
I don't know. I think there's another twist coming, but it does look like it's him.
That's what bugs me. I thought it was Jamie the first time I laid eyes on him, so if it is him, I'll feel disappointed.
Oh great, the evil Indian chief is a lesbian.
LOL r222, I thought the same thing
If the show is not renewed soon, I'm afraid Holder will be killed in the last episode.
I still think Richmond may be good for the murder. Remeber, Gwen told Linden/Holder that he was wet up to his knees when he returned to the bed and breakfast. Pretty shallow water for a suice attempt.
I'm thinking the show is already filmed so Holder's fate is decided.
Once again I must bitch about Mitch. SELFISH BITCH continues to be a selfish bitch. Not move? Stay in that dark, oppressive place? I was so glad Stan put her ass in its place.
And throwing a side eye at her sister? SHE WAS OUT FUCKING STRANGE! She needs to go. I love that the one kid doesn't want anything to do with her. Very realistic reactions from the whole family.
The character is very well written. But I hate her so much, I may not ever be able to like Michelle Forbes again.
I also don't know if I want to go through another 24 episode mystery that is all "look! Over here! NO! look over here! NO!" yada yada yada. Even for the fun of watching the dynamic duo interact and survive the storm.
They'd be fools to kill Holder. He and Linden (and Stan who presumably will not be in the next mystery) are the best things in the story.
What character was in the delapidated house when Richmond showed up at the end of the show ? Whoever it was knew Jaime.
I could hardly see his face.
Did they reveal who killed Laura Palmer yet?
Laura Palmer's dad killed her.
Jaime killed Rosie.
I think that was his grandfather?
Have decided it can't be Gwen. She split from Richmond and went off to DC to work for a while.. was that end of last season or start of this season -- anyone remember? A murderer wouldn't return to the city of the crime once they had a legit reason to leave the city. Not when they know two relentless detectives have never stopped working on the case.
That was Jamie's grandpops
Sunday's The Killing episode was directed by Keith Gordon, the guy who was in Christine, Dressed to Kill, etc.
How were we supposed to recognize jamie's grandfather? Had we seen him before?
Holder and Linden find out that Jamie's alibi is his grandpops and they discuss following up on it, but we have not seen him until this past episode.
r34 but we've heard about Jamie's grandpa MANY times. He sure looked white trashy vs. inspirational.
I would have watched both seasons for no other reason than to hear Holder tell Linden he was her "sensei in the blood sport of life."
In Richmond's speech at the beginning of the episode, which I really wasn't paying close attention to because I didn't know it would matter later, he mentioned some man who had undergone some hardship that had inspired Richmond.
When Richmond went to the Jamie's grandfather's place, the latter said something about "another speech about me."
Ah! Nice catch R237.
I didn't pay close enough attention to that speech either. Regretted it later when that mystery man said that line you quoted about 'another speech about him.'
I just want the killer unmaske. Then I can never watch this piece of shit show again.
So many good actors, such garbage writing and directing. Every week I roll my eyes so severely at all the hackneyed dead-ends and wrong turns introduced for no discernable reason that it's a wonder I'm able to see at all.
Veena Sud and her crap-ass team should all be banished from working in the entertainment field again. Miserable stinking hacks.
What R239 said. Yes to that.
I wonder if it was Richmond, after feeling sorry for him that he was paralyzed and his hearfelt speech about his suicide attempt it would be ironic if he was the killer. I wish they would have explained more about the escort service, they kind of dropped that Richmond was the creepy Orpheus.
What makes me suspicous it may be Richmond is because so much time has been spent on his character.
I also suspected Terry, but it would take a real cold blooded person to be able to take care of Rosie's family after killing her.
I'm still holding out hope that the killer is someone completely unexpected or very low on the suspect list.
Is it possible that Richmond and (allegedly not gay although I still think so) Jamie are related?
I wonder because of the brief exchange we got at the end of the last episode when Richmond came to the house of what appeared to be Jamie's grandfather. They obviously have some old relationship, especially if the councilman is mentioning the guy in his speeches. So they could be family, right? Maybe estranged?
If that were the case, then my idea that Jamie is so devoted to Billy Campbell has to be adjusted.
Anyway, I'm just wondering. I'm sure in the two seasons this story has been dragging on there may have been things revealed to refute my idea, and I've forgotten them.
I thought Richmond only mentioned Jamie's grandfather in a speech because while in his first days in the hospital - Jamie was telling him a story about his gramps overcoming adversity.
[quote]I wish they would have explained more about the escort service, they kind of dropped that Richmond was the creepy Orpheus.
I wonder about this in every episode. Did they just forget about it?
I am going with Terry, that would be a more shocking reveal than Jamie.
I'm going with Gwen's political , powerful dad. We've seen little of him but in his few scenes he gives a "villain" vibe. Gwen either was forced in to covering for him --revealing Richmond left her bed the night of the murder, knowing that would make him a suspect--or she at some point had to leave for D.C. because she knows about her dad and he, the dad ,did pull strings to get her to D.C. job as i remember it.
Interesting, r247. I think the actor playing her dad was also Charles Whidmore on Lost who was a baddie on there too.
We shall see if our theories are correct on Sunday!
I'm staying off the internets as the time gets closer to The Killing. I fear spoilers. I want my Rosie killer reveal to be pure.
Linden and Holder don't seem like characters that have been done to death in these cop/partner shows, they seem like originals (the only other recent team that seems unique to me were Mary and Marshall on In Plain Sight). I love L&H and hope someone can write up a good case for them the next season.
We should have taken a DL poll on who we each think is the killer. Except that for 2 season we've been given nothing but red herrings, so I wouldn't have any confidence in my pick.
I wonder if there is going to be an investigation into who killed Janisch (or whatever that Polish mafia guy's name is). Is that kid just going to get away with it?
The thing that bothers me about both Jamie and Gwen being the actualy killer is that Richmond's campaign car was used. If either or both were responsible why would they use a Richmond campaign car to dispose of Rosie? That would automatically lead the cops back to them. Too close IMO.
I think Gwen's hands are dirty but inadvertently. I think Jamie was a double dealer, schmoozing with people like Ames, but not a murderer.
I hate to say it but all roads lead to the Evil Lesbian Indian and her henchmen doing the actual deed. Probably Ames was involved too. Rosie was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
The way she was killed makes me feel the Casino indians did it. She was alive when they put her in the trunk. The car was stolen almost as an afterthought, to implicate Richmond so he'd lose to the Mayor. Again, this points to Jackson and her gang of "security" thugs. They'd think this was a great idea.
Gwen's father and the rest are all corrupt and could be implicated, but not directly responsible. I think what the show's creators have done, is show this atmosphere of high stakes deal making and corruption, and this is the environment where a young girl gets whacked.
I was the one who posted above I have thought it was Jamie since the beginning. Kind of disappointed I was right.
SPOILER above but then again you probably shouldn't be reading this thread right now if you haven't watched the finale yet.
What a waste of time. Stupid show.
Reveal killer at 915. Why bother watching more.
WAIT A MINUTE - oh snap! THey flipped it, keep watching, I posted too soon. The real killer is not Jamie.
**Good twist!!** Very satisfying and well-acted.
Yhe killer makes sense, I won't spoiler it yet like I accidentally did above but I am satisfied with the reveal.
I was hoping that person was the killer all along. Much more interesting.
It's the sister!
But I pretty much knew it was that guy in the beginning and I thought a family member was involved...just wasn't sure it was her. Anyway, it was a good story.
Someone refresh my memory - Rosie was at the hotel because she was getting ready to run away from home and was working there to make some money first? Is that right?
And she was hiding in that room when Jamie found her because.....
This damn show has dragged on for two seasons - I couldn't commit all the facts to memory. Shit, I'm watching GOT, Mad Men, etc. I can only retain so much....
There were so many stories about Rosie - then there allegations that she was an escort/prostitute. Is that what she was doing at the hotel? And why was she in THAT room?
Fantastic series, satisfying ending. Great show. Loved it.
Who hung the picture on Linden's refrigerator?
At the end did Linden quit her job?
Will she get her son back?
Is Stan Larson going to jail?
Richmond takes over the position of mayor the day after the election?
How can Ames get away scot free?
More loose ends than LOST
[quote]Who hung the picture on Linden's refrigerator?
They briefly alluded to the casino's head of security/tribal chief's ladyfriend having done it but didn't explain anything.
[quote]How can Ames get away scot free?
When Richmond was closing the door on Gwen at the end, you could hear Ames in the background saying he was working on "a deal", presumably with prosecutors.
[quote]At the end did Linden quit her job?
That's what I took away from Holder's "Keep in touch." That scene was stupid but true to form for this series: Seattle PD would have no jurisdiction anywhere near Sea-Tac, which does not lie within Seattle city limits (though it is within... dun dun dun... "County.")
Being mayor of Seattle is important enough to motivate someone to kill a girl? Wow. I didn't realize Seattle was so cut throat.
R267, you know the killer wasn't the mayor, right? It was her aunt Terry.
Richmond is going ahead with Jamie's deal and shutting Gwen out. Both surprising.
R267--As far as Jamie was concerned, mayor of Seattle was just the first stop. He probably envisioned the White House.
Would you watch a 3rd season?
There's no way there will be a third season.
i would love a third season, but it seems highly unlikely.
i was hoping they would wrap up the rosie case and introduce a new mystery / murder, but that didn't happen. sounds like amc ordered them to wrap it up without any cliffhanger.
I never expected a cliff-hanger. I think they would have tied up the case even if there will be a third season.
There have always been snippets of Rosie throughout the show since the beginning, but it was still kind of surreal to see her at the beginning interacting with her family when she was living and the film she made that they showed near the end was very poignant.
So Terry didn't know it was Rosie in the trunk (so disturbing to hear Rosie screaming as the car went into the water, but even if it wasn't Rosie, you have to be some kind of monster to just make a decision to do something like that - I don't see how Mitch could forgive her although it looked like she would. When Linden confronted Terry and said they got the killer, Terry looked like she was surprised and relieved for a second.
I loved the whole series and hope it will return mainly because of Linden and Holder and the moody/rainy Seattle atmosphere.
I'm not sure I buy that Terry would have just buried the truth and gone on with her life after the murder. Surely the guilt of finding out that the girl she killed was her own niece would have broken her, especially since the murder was a spontaneous thing. And the last place she would want to be would be with Rosie's family. Granted she has to be pretty cold to have done the murder in the first place.
I agree with you R275. Terri should have been the one to go on a walkabout and distance herself from the family rather than Mitch. Instead Terri gets deeper into their lives than ever before after she kills her niece? Doesn't make sense.
And why her sudden confession of everything?
But before that, how did (allegedly not gay) Jamie get a probably bloodied body of Rosie out of the construction area of the 10th floor and out to the car with nobody noticing? We'd already seen that you had to go through the casino to get access to that elevator. AND wouldn't his leaving with her unconscious body have also been on that security camera footage from the elevator???
Maybe he threw her off the 10 floor balcony and went downstairs to move the car over to wherever she landed. Ugh.
I'm not comfortable with how Jamie would have let Richmond go down for the murder like was seemed to be happening at the end of Season 1. Doesn't make sense when it seems like he could have come up with some scheme to implicate the escort Terri once he know the shit was coming down on his candidate.
Other things bothered me about the conclusion too, but those are just the couple that are foremost on my mind right now.
I imagine the Casino security people took her down from the 10th floor. We saw Jamies alone in the elevator on the surveillance tape. The kidnapping was a conspiracy and everyone involved should have been arrested for felony murder with kidnapping as the predicate crime. The idea that two of the conspirators would show up for a meeting at the mayor's office as if nothing had happened is implausible. Especially when the mayor had already been accused of the crime and his key aide was a major part of it. Richmond could not bury it. The story of how and why Terry was at the lake and who was with her could not be hidden.
How did they know Terry was guilty her confession?
Meant before she confessed. They acted like they knew when they walked in the room.
They suddenly suspected her because of the reports that the getaway vehicle (wrongly assumed to have been a taxi) that Michael Ames used to flee Rosie's murder scene had a busted tail light.
Lo and behold, they spotted Terri's car in the Larsens' garage and whaddya know---a busted tail light! They knew that Terri had been Ames' lover, and did the math.
There have been better mysteries written.
Wasn't Rosie up there looking (or filming) the city from the balcony? Part of her goodbye?
So was Rosie doing escort work or not?
I read that the ratings for the finale actually went down. If true, the show is toast. They were certainly hoping for solid tune-up for the wrap-up.
Linden quit. It's not going to keep going with just Holder. Actually I didn't feel there was enough Linden and Holder in this one. They felt like tertiary characters.
OK - I got that Terry ended up killing Rosie and I believed her when she said she didn't know it was Rosie in the car trunk. That's fine. That's tragedy on a level of classic Greek tragedy and I appreciate the writers going for that. I can accept that once Terry realized who she killed that she would somehow feel she could pay penance for it by not running away and coming to be with Rosie's brothers --after all, that would be awkward to just disappear and wouldn't Mitch wonder what that was all about if Terry wasn't there to "support" the family.
What I don't get is the motivation for Terry even getting out of the car at the lake and turning on the car so it rolls in to the lake. Even if she heard Ames yelling at Jamie that he wasn't leaving his wife for Terry and she had to face that at that moment ----what did she think killing an innocent girl in a car trunk would do for her?? Win over her lover Ames??? He would somehow stay loyal to her if she solved their problem --what would she even know about what was at stake for Ames and Jamie? No, that was poor planning on the writers. They needed to give us more character revelations about Terry during season for us to understand how that could happen.
I loved the series though. I hope it returns. I also wonder if Enos wants out. That ending could release her if she does and maybe it's just Kinnamon next season??
I thought the twist of Terry being the killer was a great choice and took me by surprise. It was a twist worthy of Henry Slesar from the old Edge of Night show.
[quote]What I don't get is the motivation for Terry even getting out of the car at the lake and turning on the car so it rolls in to the lake. Even if she heard Ames yelling at Jamie that he wasn't leaving his wife for Terry and she had to face that at that moment ----what did she think killing an innocent girl in a car trunk would do for her??
Remember, her immediate family had ties to the Polish mob. Stan was a killer, and Mitch encouraged Stan to kill Bennett Ahmed. None of them have clean hands, and none of them think about murder the way "normal" people do. They're grieving because one of their own died, but they're all tainted by a life of crime to some extent.
whether it gets renewed or not, it was one of the greatest tv crime procedurals ever. i looked forward to every episode, and the show had a logical, tragic resolution. hoping very much for a season 3, even though that doesn't seem to be in the cards.
I didn't feel like Linden left for good. Didn't her boss take her shield? I thought they fired her. So if she wasn't formally re-instated, she had the right to walk away from that call. She needed a break.
She has to take some time to re-connect and repair things with her son. If there is a season three, she'll be back, maybe not in every single episode, but she'll be back. Altho, she is getting film roles too now.
Do we know for sure that Terry actually heard what Ames was saying to Jamie about not leaving his wife? Or did it just look like to her that they were arguing?
She obviously knew there was a body in the trunk. Was she just impatient about them arguing or was her action of putting the car in drive and sending it into the water an act of rage against Ames and Jamie?
I just am not clear on her motive. Was it anger, despair, impatience? Did Ames tell Terry that Jamie found a girl in the casino who video-taped them and "heard everything, now he wants to get rid of her."
Until I saw Terry do it, every time I considered Jamie a suspect, I always decided he couldn't be because who ever did it used Richmond's campaign car. Jamie and Terry were equally guilty. Terry just took care of it for him.
R292, because the shot was POV from Terry sitting in the car listening to the argument and cutting to see her facial expressions at what they were saying, I'd assume that she could hear everything they said since we could hear it.
But I could see her action as being motivated by impatience too like you suggest. She could have been pissed off that they were wasting time arguing about what to do because neither guy had the balls to do what needed to be done, so she sped things up by doing it herself so that she could go home.
But because of the way we saw her face getting sadder during the argument and then her slow/calm walkover to the car, I'm confident we are supposed to believe she was motivated to do it out of a desperate hope that Ames would see her differently for handling a serious problem of his.
Except that wasn't Linden. She put work ahead of everything. Holder saying "Keep in touch" makes me think she was quitting. Now if they come back with season three, it could begin with them trying to get her to come back. But, child protection should still be trying to find her and her son so I'd think she'd be moving.
[quote]I didn't feel like Linden left for good. Didn't her boss take her shield? I thought they fired her.
In the scene scene when Holder and Linden were sitting in their office in the dark, Holder gave her her badge back, saying their boss said she could have it back.
The ratings are a bad, bad sign for those that might be hoping for the show to continue.
How often is it that the season finale of a bubble program has fewer viewers than the penultimate show, but the show gets picked up?
[quote] it was one of the greatest tv crime procedurals ever
Except, of course, that it involved the worst police work ever seen on television. Every episode they set their sights on some new suspect, went after them without the slightest idea what the hell they were doing so couldn't possibly get anything that would stick in court, and ruined the person's life only to later discover that they were wrong again.
The only thing this show did worse than crime procedure was motherhood. Mitch and Linden were some of the worst television mothers since "Sybil."
This was one shitstorm of a show.
I think it would be a shame to renew it. Why couldn't this show be as simple as two seasons solving one crime? Why does it have to go on? I thought it was completely satisfactory with no loose ends. We could take a hint from the BBC on how to produce shows.
The original series had another case after its first "Rosie Larsen" (named Nanna Larsen in the Danish version) murder was solved. They could adapt that second Danish season into a third/fourth season for AMC.
R299, you reminded me of something that I've been meaning to ask.
For anyone that is familiar with the Danish version, did the killer end up being a family member like Aunt Terry? Or did they vastly differ the story for AMC?
I know that others on here have said that the Holder-equivalent character dies, but I think that's the only spoiler that I can remember reading - and that one didn't even make it into this version.
The reason Holder didn't die in the American version is that the producers knew they had a good thing. If they killed him off there would have been no way the ratings would have held. After all, this isn't Game of Thrones.
Thanks, R298. I agree.
The best series are often the ones with relatively few episodes that play out a stand-alone story -- as though it's the first and last chance. If they are renewed for a second season, they do the same.
Make something good enough that, if someone were to watch only some part of it, the quality would be evident. That does away with the need for cheesy cliffhangers and pandering.
I would be fine with this being the ending of the show. They told a good story, the acting was good, the loose ends have been tied up and there's no reason to keep it on until it becomes a parody of its former self (see Dexter, for example). At least AMC gave The Killing a shot at the second season; I'm still pissed off at them for canceling Rubicon.
Amen R303. I'm with you about Rubicon. We must be the only two fans - haha. I still have the entire series on my DVR and I'm not going to delete it. But they really left us hanging at the end - more than any other show I can think of.
One note about Holder. I like him and the actor was very good, but I wish he didn't mumble so much. There were several times I had to go back and re-watch a scene (once or twice even using closed captioning) because I couldn't make out what he was saying.
[quote]For anyone that is familiar with the Danish version, did the killer end up being a family member like Aunt Terry? Or did they vastly differ the story for AMC?
It was the "Belko" character in the Danish version.
[quote] I'm still pissed off at them for canceling Rubicon.
I liked Rubicon too, but the loose ends of that show were pretty much tied up once Will found out who was behind everything.
Can someone explain Richmond's welcome to the Evil Lesbian Chief and her henchman at the end? Why does he want to work with them? They were arrested for obstruction of justice, but now that the sister has confessed they will be on the hook for more and presumably re-arrested. Does Richmond know about the sister's confession? Was he a bad guy all along?
I quite liked season 2 but don't feel any need for the show to go on.
There was the scene in the chambers between Richmond and Mayor Adams where Adams says to him,"You don't change the office, the office changes you." That's the point of the scene at the end. Now that Richmond is mayor, he's swallowing his principles and making deals just like Adams did.
Yup and his Gwen is out in the cold watching someone she believed in enough to manipulate situations for, become just like her dad.
Oops. Not "his Gwen." Typo.
[quote]It was the "Belko" character in the Danish version.
What was the motivation? Did the whole development conspiracy exist?
I think because they ticked people off by not solving the mystery in one season that viewership went down and they will not get renewed for a third season. From what I read the actor who plays Holder is getting some other good parts now.
They'd have to do some really good writing to come up with a compelling case that might bring back their initial audience and spark interest in new viewers, but since most people are so disappointed with the show (I didn't have too many issues with it and enjoyed it for the most part) I'm not sure if they can do it.
Too bad they did not show the original version like they did in England. It would be nice to have the actual BBC instead BBC America.
No comments about the finale?! Is there another thread? Without saying much, as a big fan of the show something about the finale let me down. It went too fast. Or else I took too long to watch it from the previous episode. Anyone else?
R315, check the last 2 or 3 pages of this thread for the discussion about the finale.
I thought maybe, just maybe, there would be hope for this show coming back if there were some Emmy nominations. But it looks like it was shut out when the noms were announced this morning.
I wonder how long before we get the official word that it's been cancelled.
[quote]How often is it that the season finale of a bubble program has fewer viewers than the penultimate show, but the show gets picked up?
To be fair, the murderer was revealed in the penultimate show, so the finale was really kind of an epilogue.
That said, the reason this show failed is because of the network's and producers' failure to adequately set expectations. They should have NEVER led people on in terms of the expectation that the Rosie Larsen murder would be resolved by the end of season one. On top of that, they further misled people *after* the first season by claiming that the Rosie murder would be solved early on in season two and the focus would move to another case, which was total bullshit.
The problem was simple: the original Danish version was something like 20 episodes without commercials; AMC shows only have 13 per season, each about 40 minutes long minus commercials. The complete length of the combined two seasons is pretty close to the original, so in that context it was faithful. However, that's irrelevant: there is NO fucking way they should have hewed to the original so closely. The show should've been restructured for the American market to allow for one mystery per season. Instead, the second season was a long, hot boring mess, with increasingly ridiculous and pointless plots involving the Larsens. While I see that that was necessary in order to set up the sister as being the unintended killer, the producers could have EASILY cut at least 50% of the stuff aired, from both this season and last, to make a faster paced story. Why on earth did we need all those red herrings in season one and the extended Indian reservation plot in season two?
Anyway, I'm done with the show, even on the off chance it's renewed.
[quote]To be fair, the murderer was revealed in the penultimate show, so the finale was really kind of an epilogue.
The revelation of "the killer" in the penultimate episode was a red herring. The actual killer was revealed at the end of the last episode. Did you not catch that?
[quote]The revelation of "the killer" in the penultimate episode was a red herring. The actual killer was revealed at the end of the last episode. Did you not catch that?
Sorry - brain fart. What I should have said is that people apparently *mistakenly* thought the murderer had been revealed. There's not much else to explain the drop in ratings for the finale, at least versus week-before numbers (unless for some reason that episode had an unusually high percentage of timeshifted viewers who recorded it and watched later).
Holy Crap Bump!
All these months after we've come to terms (well, some of us have) with the show being shelved, there is actually a chance that it will start up again.
Both of the lead actors would still be on the show if this happens.
So long as the show isn't a Netflix exclusive (if they show episodes on AMC also), I'm excited for the possibility of it coming back.
Like many fans I grumbled and complained about all of the misleads the show repeatedly dished out (the Season 1 finale being the Grand Poobah of misdirection). But for me it was definitely worthy of the complaints because it was a solid drama and better than most current programming.
The only TV I watch live is on Sunday nights and I love all the AMC shows (avoiding the Monday morning blues). Would be interesting if this came back but I won't watch it online.
More good news for fans of the show.
It looks like this is a sure thing now. The producers and writers are back at work on the new season and AMC will likely premier it in May 2013.
They have announced a few new cast members - most notably Peter Sarsgaard.
They have released the following as a description of the new storyline...
[quote]A year after closing the Rosie Larsen case, Sarah Linden is no longer a detective. But when her ex-partner Stephen Holder’s search for a runaway girl leads him to discover a gruesome string of murders that connects to a previous murder investigation by Linden, she is drawn back into the life she thought she’d left behind.
Peter Sarsgaard is the only thing that could make this show worse.
Did she ever leave Seattle? Is the guy in Sonoma still waiting for her?
If they were going to bring the show back, they should at least replace the show runner so that there's a chance that it could get better.
More casting has been announced. The only of the new names I'm familiar with is Aaron Douglas who played 'Chief' Galen Tyrol on Battlestar Galactica.
Also they have a shooting start date of Feb. 25th (according to the attached), but with no date yet announced for when AMC will broadcast Season 3.
Thanks R329. Seems like The Killing producers were big fans of Battlestar Galactica since Douglas is the 3rd BG alum on The Killing. Mitch/Admiral Caine and Linden's bf/Cylon Leoben being the other two.
The Killing was a fantastic series. Personally, I LOVED the twist at the end of season one, and was shocked at the negative reaction from some fans and critics.
It had a few silly plot holes, but the acting was first rate, and few shows have ever successfully created and maintained a particular mood. Season 2 was even better than season 1, and the finale was devastating.
Loved it. Delighted that it's coming back.
Only 2 months to wait. AMC announced the premier date for Season 3 is June 2nd.
EW reviewed the Season 3 kickoff.
Starts this weekend! Because most summer programming is not interesting to me, I was mildly excited earlier this week to see that my DVR had the season premiere scheduled.
Netflix just renewed it for six more episodes.....after it was cancelled a few months ago....
Good, I need Holder back on my screen. Can they film it in summer so we can see him without 50 layers of clothing for once?
Six episodes? They should do 13 episodes! Damn. Oh well. I guess I shouldn't complain too much, I really want to know how they're going to wrap up the show after that shocking season finale. Maybe they will shoot it like a BBC mini series -- that's what I hope.
The good news is we get to see the incomparable Joel Kinaman again giving the greatest urban-white-boi-with-swag performance one last time. He's truly the saving grace for a rather pedestrian series.
It was so DULL last season, zzzzzzz.
I disagree. I thought last season was the best...
I haven't watched Season 3 yet.
Did they have it end with such a twisting cliff-hanger (like Season 1) that they need these final 6 episodes to give some conclusion to whatever story they were telling in Season 3?
The murder mystery was solved at the end of S3 but there was a cliffhanger involving Linden.