- I second BERKELEY SQUARE. Have watched that series twice. Anyone familiar with the crime series TRIAL AND RETRIBUTION will recognize Victoria Smurfit who plays one of the nannies. And Hermione Norris (WIRE IN THE BLOOD, MI-5) plays one of the wives.
No this series isn't as elaborate or as well shot as Downtown but it does have Jason O'Mara as the footman.
- Does anyone know if that's the last we see of Sharon Small? Can't see how that character would reappear but love the actress.
Anonymous
- Yes, I do have way too much time on my hands but I was thinking about Fellowes'"Gosford Park" last night and then began fantasizing what it would be like to have DA's Thomas the footmen servicing GP's Jeremy Northam. Hot!
- Here's the trailer for Julian Fellowes "Titanic' airing on ABC on the 100th Anniversary of the sinking in April !
Starring "Mrs. Bates"... cannot wait to see that bitch bounce off a propeller !
http%3A//www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DDW9WZQi4Vpw
- Great clip of Lady Edith !
Lady Edith: "Another slipped the hook?"
Lady Mary; "At least i'm not fishing with no bait ."
- Interview with Allen leach ( Branson YUM!) and Rob James-Collier ( Thomas... lesser yum )
Branson seems to be quite gay in real life .
http%3A//www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D27rUt1PPAYc
- R5 here, forgot to link
http%3A//www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3D27rUt1PPAYc
- So, Lady Mary only needs to say that Mr. Pamuk raped her and died in the process. Problem solved. Too easy?
- Rape was not invented yet. besides you cannot rape the willing.
Lady%20Edith
- Too easy, r8. She would never say that in a million years. Whatever else her faults are, she wouldn't directly lie about someone that way.
- Let me emend that: she would never lie about someone she respected that way, and certainly not when she's not in the heat of anger.
- Scandal! The real Cora (the countess Carnovan who lived at Highclere at the time the series is set) was the illegitimate daughter of a Rothschild.
The current Countess reports that the actual staff at the time would have been about 60 people including 14 footmen and something called "hall boys." Heaven!
http%3A//www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/downtonabbey/season2_countess.html
- Oh, the real Cora had the healing drive of Matthew's mother in the series. It was she who motivated turning the castle into a hospital. The real Robert financed the expeditions in Egypt that led to the discovery of King Tut's tomb.
- I hope in the next season, Thomas and Matthew hit if off. And Matthew's bisexuality becomes a prickly subject for Mary.
- Julian Fellows presents TITANIC! a four part mini series starring Maria Doyle Kennedy (Mrs. Bates from Downton Abbey). This April on ABC.
the trailer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fljq33727cA
- "Hello Shrimpy? It's Aunt Violet..."
Don't know why but that made me laugh my ass off!
- What is the point of yet another telling of the Titanic story? Yes, it's 100 years, but James Cameron is releasing his film in 3D.
- Whats the difference between lady Mary and the Titanic?
Only 1200 men went down on the Titanic.
Lady%20Edith
- I do so love Laura Carmichael who plays Lady Edith! She seems to have a healthy sense of humor about the character and is actually quite lovely, too. I hope in her down time from the series she gets to play some great roles in feature films.
- They definitely made Edith more dowdy in the first series. Her hair, her clothing, her makeup, and she always had what my mother called "a puss on her face."
- Lady Edith is a classic combination of Suellen O'Hara and Jan Brady.
Middle daughter syndrome in early 20th century England.
- I actually have kind of a soft spot for Lady Edith - but then I always tend to cheer for the underdogs and "other ones". I'd like to see her get a decent storyline in season 3, an opportunity to get out of her more comely sister's shadow and come into her own somehow.
- And, after all, it's not exactly as if there's any great love out there for Lady Mary.
- Lady Mary is getting a Vanity Fair cover.
http%3A//www.celebitchy.com/209539/downton_abbey_mania_is_upon_us_lady_mary_michelle_dockery_to_get_vanity_fair_cover/
- Now?
- Can anyone tell me exactly what was called the grocery list on the wall that was shown by actress who plays Daisy (my favorite character!) on the post-episode feature shown Sunday night? I'd like to see if I can procure one & need to know precisely what to call it.
- Was it the House Needs board? It was something lIke that. Lover the little flip tabs.
- Honey--Don't forget the Borax.
- Just watched the Christmas episode on dvd. loved it. had to turn on the captions to "translate" some of Lady Violet's bon mots though.
"Ou sont les neiges d'antans?"
A verse from a 16th century French poet, Villon, means "Where are the snows of yesteryear". My guess is Lady Violet was lamenting her on reckless youth with Lord Hepworth's father back in the "late 60's " LOL
"Better stand back when you light the blue touch paper"
I guess she thought the grammaphone was some sort of explosive device.
BEST LINE
"Remember your Great-Aunt Roberta...,. she loaded the guns at Lucknow "
had to google that one, refers to the Siege of Lucknow during the Indian Mutiny of 1857.
Going to be a very long wait till September when we get to see series III on PBS.
- The best Lady Violet delivery was "Promise?" after Carlisle said he was never coming back to Downton.
- R30, LOVED that one too, especially the look on Lord Granthams`face when she said it, trying not to laugh .
Cannot wait to see what kind of interactions Maggie Smith & Shirley Maclain will have next series.
Plus I just read that O`Briens nephew , Alfred, will be joining the staff as a new footman, hope he`s hot and gets some action with Thomas . If her nephew IS gay that might help explain her friendship with Thomas, plus I think O`Brien might be a bit lesbian herself.
- [quote]I think O`Brien might be a bit lesbian herself.
What gave it away? The fact that she's humorless?
- Doesn`t Lady Edith remind you of something....
https%3A//encrypted-tbn0.google.com/images%3Fq%3Dtbn%3AANd9GcRMP5WhKgO1FGhvKCLBzSYLGlt6W-Eqf6sW3aPaC6nFF_guzsE6yQ
Lady%20Mary
- Thanks for the info R29!
Anonymousi
- I heard the rumor that Petula Clark appears on season III singing the hit theme song, "DOWNTON."
- LOL R35
There IS a rumour going around the set that Harrison Ford is interested in a role, and Fellowes may be considering creating a role for him.
- If this show devolves into stupid stunt casting I'm going to be really mad.
Shirley Maclaine=good.
Harrison Ford=absolutely not.
- Another Dowager Countess gem: "Don't be defeatist, dear. It's very middle class."
fanlez
- Jason O`Mara is O`Brien`s nephew and the new footman.
He even looks like O`Brien
http%3A//www.imdb.com/name/nm0641816/
- "It's a nutcracker. For when you crack nuts." I loved the look on Violet's face.
- The new footman's gorgeous. Would love to see him as Thomas's new love interest.
- Where did it say there that he was joining the cast? He's got his own show now. Why be tenth-tier on DA?
- W&W for R32
- It's Matt Milne from "War Horse" who is playing the new footman/O'Brien's nephew.
And it's David Boreanaz, not Harrison Ford, who has started a Twitter campaign to get cast on Downton as a suitor for Lady Mary.
http%3A//www.imdb.com/media/rm17543168/nm3982608
- Where did you read that, R39? Does that mean Terra Nova was cancelled?
- R39 is wrong.
http%3A//blog.zap2it.com/frominsidethebox/2012/02/downton-abbey-matt-milne-cast-as-the-new-footman.html
- Yes, I liked that too.
- Didn't you all keep waiting for some revelation from Thomas or O'Brien that would finally allow us to understand their mysterious allegiance? I thought for sure they were brother and sister yet why would that need to be kept a secret?
- [quote]What gave it away? The fact that she's humorless?
She seemed envious of Bates's cane.
- jason seems a bit long in the tooth for a footman.
- [quote]Didn't you all keep waiting for some revelation from Thomas or O'Brien that would finally allow us to understand their mysterious allegiance?
Easy. They live and work in the same house and nobody else likes either of them.
- Well, then it's lucky he's not playing one, r50.
- [quote]Didn't you all keep waiting for some revelation from Thomas or O'Brien that would finally allow us to understand their mysterious allegiance? I thought for sure they were brother and sister yet why would that need to be kept a secret?
I agree with R51, but there is also the fact that the two of them are co-conspirators. There's no one else in the house who would go along with their schemes. They recognized the selfishness and sneakiness in each other early on.
We watched the bond develop between them when they took those smoke breaks together.
O'Brien deliberately caused Cora to have a miscarriage, and Thomas is a thief and a liar. They're birds of a feather.
- Ever wondered if you had any aristocrats in your family tree ? try this free search from "Burke's Peerage" ( Gives you a very generally search result, for more you have to sign up as a paid member)
I tried my family name, one of the families I'm related to are the Carnarvons! (the ones who currently live in Highclere castle aka DA)
I'll stay in The Armada room next visit!
- Silly me forgot the link ( must be all that inbreeding)
http%3A//www.burkespeerage.com/
- Saw a UK interview with some cast, they say they'll be 2 weddings in Season 3 plus another Christmas Special, the time span will be the first 18 months of the 1920's... lots of Irish rebellion and politics with Branson & Sybil
I suspect one wedding will be Lady Mary and Matthew .... maybe the other will be poor Lady Edith ( or even better maybe Lady Violet gets swept off her feet by some cowboy from the middle west)
- Lady Edith would fare better in love if she were a lesbian.
- Any idea when season 2 will be available on Netflix? I watch the show on an I pad and can't getbitbon the PBS site due to the need for flash.
- I heard Branson will be killed in the uprising and Sybil returns to highclere.
- I thought the guy who plays Branson said he'd been signed for the full 3rd series?
- Killing off Branson would be dumb. The marriage is fertile ground for plot points.
- The Irish War lasted until the summer of 1921. Branson could do series three and still get killed.
- Sybil is pregnant. If she has a son and Matthew gets killed off, her son would be the new heir.
Hmmm....
- You just know some of your favorite characters will die in order to make room for new ones with new story lines.
Who would you like to see go?
My choices:
Bates, because Anna deserves someone sexier.
Cousin Isobel, just because.
Shirl
- [quote]Sybil is pregnant. If she has a son and Matthew gets killed off, her son would be the new heir.
I don't think so. If that were true, Matthew would never have been groomed to be the heir as the odds are very high that one of the daughters would have a son before Robert dies.
- The show is about the abbey, the lord and his wife and their three daughters.
Marrying all the daughters off so they live happily ever after ends the show.
So Branson gets killed in the Irish war and Matthew dies in a car accident. Then the two widowed daughters return to the abbey and the future of the home is again fraught with tension.
And Edith goes lesbo
- I suspect Bates will be found innocent, maybe that bitch Vera left a suicide note only to be opened when her husband is standing on the gallows.
- [quote]Sybil is pregnant. If she has a son and Matthew gets killed off, her son would be the new heir.
Girls ( and the girls of girls ) can't inherit , stupid.
Mrs.%20Patmore
- Has anyone bought the DA Soundtrack or the Christmas Album yet?
http%3A//www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DgkyNUZ3S6eg
- I hope Bates will be found innocent. I think Vera's boyfriend probably killed her or the wife of her boyfriend. She was completely evil...she had probably fucked over a lot of people.
- Sir Richard Carlisle may have had Vera killed since she fucked him over as well. He would certainly have the connections to have her taken care of.
- I think she committed suicide to frame Bates.
- If I cannot have him in life, I will have him in death!
Mrs. John (Vera) Bates
- I keep thinking O'Brien killed Vera.
- Vera died in London didn't she ? I don't think O'Brien could have made it there and back in time , not even on her broomstick.
Should have had the bitch die at Downton Abbey, then we would have a good old fashion "who-dun-it", like "Gosford Park". lots of suspects lots of motives.... you missed the boat there Lord Fellowes.
- F&F for r32!
- Vera wrote a letter to someone saying that she was afraid of Bates killing her, there is some mystery person involved who killed her, someone she knew.
It will come out next season since Bates is going to get out of prison, that has already leaked from the actors...
- Link to Chart explaining it all...
http%3A//laura.chinet.com/html/titles05.html
- Use of "The Honourable"
"The Honourable" is a title which applies to younger sons of earls and all children of viscounts and barons (and the wives of those sons). However, it is used only on envelopes, and is never spoken, even by a servant, or used in the salutation of a letter. It is not even included on calling cards. (A person is announced by servants according to the name on his calling card.) Thus it is impossible to know, merely upon introduction, that a person ranks as an Honourable.
That's why when Isobel Crawley first met Lady Violet, Dowager Countess of Grantham , she asked" Whatever shall we call each other?" To which the old bat replied "Well we can start with Mrs Crawley and Lady Grantham" then later in the series she refers to her as Cousin Isobel .
- [quote]It will come out next season since Bates is going to get out of prison, that has already leaked from the actors...
I wouldn't be so sure. Downton Abbey has a tradition of not wrapping storylines up.
- How is Matthew a cousin to the Earl? Was it explained? Are they first cousins? Second?
- Matthew is the third-cousin-once-removed of Robert Crawley, Sixth Earl of Grantham. They would have shared common great-great-great grandparents on their fathers side since they both have the last name Crawley.
His late father, Reginald Crawley, was a medical doctor who had done research on infections on children. Reginald Crawley trained under Matthew's maternal grandfather, who was also a medical doctor.
Matthew and Lord Crawleys common ancestor would have been one generation further back than this, so presumably around the late 1700's ?
- Thanks R82. For that tenuous link, Matthew inherits everything?!
Can someone also explained what a removed cousin is? I've always been confused about the removed business.
- "Removed cousins" gets rather complicated .... you would share common greats - but not directly pararell in descents. for example if your great grandparents were your cousin grandparents then you are cousins "once removed"
I read somewhere that is you have a surname that originated in Great Britain ( not including slave names here in North America ) you are basically no further removed than 8 or 9 times from every other person descended from Great Britain as well.
Pretty damned amazing that a small island with a relatively small population has risen to become the dominate cultural force in the world today, and that we ( I mean people of British descent) or all fairly closely related compared to the rest of the world.
Here s alink explaining more about the whole "cousins" thing.
http%3A//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cousin
- Let's say you and I are first cousins, r83. Your child would be my first cousin, once removed. Our children would be second cousins to each other.
- R85, thank you, that's how I understood it. What gets complicated is when it gets into 4th cousins once removed, etc. When I read something like that, it's hard to see that relationship. Guess it would help to have pen and paper in hand and sketch it out.
- R84, thanks, the Wikipedia chart is really helpful.
- The British are very inbred.
- [quote]The British are very inbred.
Who are we supposed to breed with... BELGIANS??
- They're not killing off Matthew. He and Mary are two of the most popular characters on the show.
Branson will probably be the "big death" for next season.
I imagine they're grooming Shirley MacLaine in case Maggie's cancer comes back.
- [quote]"The Honourable" is a title which applies to younger sons of earls and all children of viscounts and barons (and the wives of those sons). However, it is used only on envelopes
and on credit cards.
- Bump for Matthew and Thomas and their chins.
- [quote]... the dominate cultural force ...
Is this correct? "dominate"? Shouldn't it be "dominant"?
- I don't think R78's chart is accurate. Surely, the wife of an Earl is a Countess.
Violet
- [quote]"The Honourable" is a title which applies to younger sons of earls and all children of viscounts and barons (and the wives of those sons). However, it is used only on envelopes
Similarly in the US, the courtesy title Esquire, mysteriously appropriated by lawyers, should only be used when writing to a lawyer. Any lawyer who refers to himself as Joe Lawyer, Esq. is a pompous fool.
- [quote]I don't think [R78]'s chart is accurate. Surely, the wife of an Earl is a Countess.
If she isn't, I think we've found a way to get the Levinson money out of the Grantham estate, because I was sold a bill of goods.
Cora
- Thomas should end up being his Lordships bastard son and real heir to Downton.
- Here's the bit that explains Dowager Countesses.
http%3A//laura.chinet.com/html/titles09.html
Daisy
- That does not explain it. In order to be a Dowager Countess the widow would have had to have been a Countess and your source implies neither Violet nor Cora had that title.
- But what is a dowager hump?
And which dowager was it named for?
- How kind of you all to put so much thought and effort in searching for the proper way to address me, I am most flattered.
But alas I have no plans to cross the Atlantic nor do I intend to be received in a wigwam .
Lady%20Violet%2C%20Dowager%20Countess%20of%20Grantham
- Don't worry, doll. I'll be coming to you.
Mrs.%20Martha%20Levinson
- How wonderful Mrs. Levenson, my sister Roberta has been assisting me with the preparations for your welcome to Downton.
Lady%20Violet%2C%20Locked%20%26%20Loaded.
- I agree that Robert Carlisle had Vera murdered. Vera threatened him. If Richard does come back to threaten Mary, that will be used against him.
- Carlisle murdered Vera? Did he also force her to ask Bates to buy the poison that killed her? Did he ask Vera to write a letter saying she feared Bates would kill her? These are vital clues. She killed herself to frame her husband.
- Better to say she killed herself and framed her husband. One last bit of posthumous evil.
- I wonder if now that Matthew & Mary are back on and engaged, what will interfere this time around?
My guess is that Cora's mother is coming over from America with a lawyer in tow, whose discovered a way of breaking the entail . I cannot see why Mrs. Levenson would sit idly by while her daughters fortune is passed on the a third cousin once removed. So if Matthew is no longer the heir, and Mary gets to keep the money would the still stick together?
- Isn't Lady Mary almost 30 at this point? How long can they put off a marriage? Both Lady Mary and poor Edith would be considered over the hill old maids at their age.
- That would be an interesting plot point, R10. One clarification: Matthew would still be the heir to the title and the estate.
Mary would have her money with him or without him, and given that she loves him and the marriage saves the estate and answers her family's prayers, why wouldn't she marry him?
I hope they don't extend their courtship any further.
- Vera did not strike me as the type of personality that would become suicidal. What would have made her commit suicide ? A broken heart over Bates .... hardly.
She already had sent him to prison, b een separated for several years, and I certainly saw no love in her for Bates in the least. She got all of Bates money, plus whatever Carlisle gave her to remain quiet. Anyone that greedy would certainly want to stick around and enjoy her new found wealth wouldn't they?She was very angry that Bates was going to be happy and free of her at last, and very very few people ever commit suicide out of anger, especially someone as conniving and vicious as Vera.
My guess is she was murdered by someone in Carlisles' employ, then it was made to look like a suicide. No one even thought it was murder at first, seemed like it was a period of months or maybe longer before the police showed up to arrest Bates.
Anyways we have months of waiting , so plenty of time to play "Miss Marple"
- The engagement will be interrupted when Mary finds Matthew in bed with Thomas.
- I never thought Lady Mary was in love with boring Matthew at all. When he first showed up, she was blasé about him. Now suddenly he lights her fire? No way.
- [quote]My guess is that Cora's mother is coming over from America with a lawyer in tow, whose discovered a way of breaking the entail .
It should be who has or who's, rather than whose.
Questions about Cora's maiden name, Levinson:
Why aren't Cora's children Jewish?
Is it believable British aristocracy would have married their son to a Jewish girl, even for her vast fortune?
And how vast can her fortune be, given that her father was a milliner, not a steel magnate?
Is it believable at all Cora's family would have agreed to her renouncing her religion in order to marry into British aristocracy?
Is this just another example of one of Julian Fellowes' premises being illogical and historically ridiculous?
And no, I'm not being anti-Semitic. I'm asking about historical attitudes, prejudices and practices, not suggesting they were in any way admirable or should be acceptable today.
- [quote]Carlisle murdered Vera? Did he also force her to ask Bates to buy the poison that killed her? Did he ask Vera to write a letter saying she feared Bates would kill her?
More to the point, for her last meal, did she dine on Red Herring?
- R111 that would be more interesting.
- [quote] What would have made her commit suicide ? A broken heart over Bates .... hardly.
Hardly indeed. Her motive for killing herself isn't really relevant. The writers could cook one up--terminal illness, exposure as a criminal, lost all her money gambling or simply being a miserable human being.
We know she took pleasure in denying Bates his happiness.
Your theory requires that the fact that Vera asked Bates to buy the poison that killed her and that she wrote a letter saying her would kill her are merely unfortunate coincidences. I find that unlikely.
Would you like another cup of tea?
- Nothing thing about Vera's death ( not to beat a dead horse-faced bitch...)
If she WAS staging her suicide to make it look like Bates murdered her, she did a very bad job of it. Why not leave a half-scrawled note saying "John poisoned me....." or stagger out into the public once she'd taken the poison and screaming that her husband was killing her ?
Instead we see Vera lying facedown on the floor, looking very disheveled , surely if she was staging her suicide she would have positioned herself with a little more poise and dignity for when the body was discovered. She's also surrounded by broken teacups and such indicating that she just did not gulp the poison, she took the time to make tea, set a nice table, then topple over dead in a most undignified position.
i think she was murdered... it seems the only way Bates can be freed if someone else is either caught or confesses to her murder.
- [quote]Your theory requires that the fact that Vera asked Bates to buy the poison that killed her and that she wrote a letter saying her would kill her are merely unfortunate coincidences. I find that unlikely.
Not unfortunate coincidences. Garden variety plot contrivances in order to cloud the waters, and keep us guessing.
- [quote]Is this just another example of one of Julian Fellowes' premises being illogical and historically ridiculous?
The actual person Cora is based on (Countess Carnovan during this era) was (at least) half Jewish. She was an illegitimate daughter of a Rothschild.
The name Levinson is not necessarily Jewish and Martha is not a Jewish name. I don't believe the topic of Cora's being Jewish has ever been mentioned which is unlikely if she were. Perhaps her parents are not Jewish at all or her mother is not Jewish and she was not raised a Jew.
- [quote]Not unfortunate coincidences. Garden variety plot contrivances in order to cloud the waters, and keep us guessing.
But this is not a mystery story. We don't really care who killed Vera. We only care whether or not Bates did it. There really are no other logical suspects. Either Bates killed her or she killed herself. Carlisle has no motive and he is far more useful continuing as a powerful press magnate than he is as a prisoner never to be seen again.
- When did the Upper Class English stop using servants? I know it must still go on, but not in the way it was in Downton Abbey's era.
- [quote]Questions about Cora's maiden name, Levinson:
Why aren't Cora's children Jewish?
I thought about that too... but we are not even sure if "Levinson' is Jewish are we ? I have also seen it spelled "Levenson" in several; articles.
Martha Levinson is the widow of Isadore Levinson of Cincinnati, Ohio ( did they have Jews in Ohio the 1800's?) He made is fortune in dry goods and that's about we're told.
Martha has houses in New York & Newport, indicating that she is well established in American High Society , not that that precludes her from being Jewish, many members of society were in the US, Benjamin Guggenheim, Isadore & Ida Strauss ( all who died on titanic btw)
Martha may be herself a gentile and married Isadore ( assuming he was even Jewish) wouldn't her child, Cora therefore be gentile . ( i'm not Jewish, but i believe that the faith comes through your motherside is that correct?
- The question of who killed Vera is currently a mystery element in the show, R120, and so red herrings should be expected. They used it as a season cliff-hanger. And they were very deliberate in setting up Carlisle as a potential suspect to the audience (but not to the other characters) with his private threats to Vera should she cross him.
However it turns out, we haven't seen all the clues yet. Whatever deus ex machina is used to eventually free Bates, you can bet they have shown all their cards yet.
- Thomas could have killed Vera because he hates Bates. But since he can't scheme correctly, he would have been caught right away.
- [quote]When did the Upper Class English stop using servants? I know it must still go on, but not in the way it was in Downton Abbey's era.
IIRC most of the Great Country Houses went into decline during the 1930's and the Great Depression. Fellowes movie "Gosford Park" was set in the late 30's I think (?), and it portrays a house party in a great manoir house. At the end of the film the newly widowed Countess says something to the effect the she's not if she'll keep the house open.... leaving the impression that that way of live was just about over, once staff became too expensive as did hosting 20 guests at a time .
There are still many great houses like Highclere, which make money by being open ( at least partially) to the public as museums, while iothers are run as hotels .
The first great country house to be demolish by its owner was Trentham Hall in 1912 ( mostly due to the fact the river is was on became so polluted that no one could bear the smell) . After WW1 and the introduction of personal income tax and inheritance taxes in the UK, many more houses were demolished or abandoned because there owners could no ,longer afford them. That did not mean the streets were full of homeless Dukes, most peers have multiple homes, usually a home in London, a country estate, a hunting estate and since you do not need the castle to keep your title many great houses were lost forever
In 1955 one great house was being demolished every 5 days to date over 2000 of these great houses are gone forever.
It wasn't until the late 70's that people began to realize these houses are historically important , and that's why many are now listed with "The National trust" which offers various degrees of protection.
Here's a link that lists all the lost houses, many with pictures.... such a shame when you realize they are lost forever, but that way of life is gone forever as well, even the Queen lives much differently than her father and grandfather.
http%3A//www.lostheritage.org.uk/
- Vera was also a ladies maid to the Marquess of Flichers (sp?) wife , which is where she first learned the story about Lady Mary & Poor Mr Pemuk from another maid who knew O'Brien.
Who are the Marquess & Marchioness of Flincher you ask?
Well if you remember when Lady Violet was on the telephone trying to find someone who would help bring William home ? She asked the Operator "Well how many Marqueeses of Flincher are there?" then once connected she said " Hello Shrimpy, it's Aunt Violet.... yes yes ..,. and how's Susan?"
Therefore we now know that the Marquess of Flincher is married to Lady Violet's niece ( her sister Roberta's daughter ) Susan.
Vera Bates was Susan's (Lady Flincher) maid , and was working for her when she learned the scandal from another maid who knew O'Brien .
Not sure what it all means, but John Bates was not Vera's only link to Downton, nor was he the only one with a motive or drudge to bear against Vera.
- Interesting, R126. I hadn't caught that connection. Frankly, I hope they contrive a more creative solution than the obvious choices of a Vera suicide or a Carlilse murder.
It would be refreshing for them to resolve a plot point in some other way than having it come screaming at you waving a flag from a mile off.
- SPOILER!
Downton Abbey Series III Opening Scene Script Leaked.
Scene I John Bates is lying in bed, morning light streaming through a window, the sound of running water is in the background. Bates slowly awakens and climbs out of bed, walks to a closed door behind which is the sound of running water.
John Bates opens the door to a steamy filled bathroom, slowly the steams clears and till a female figure can be seen in the shower standing back to the camera. The figure turns slowly looking over her soapy wet shoulder, revealing it to be Vera Bates
Vera : Well Good Morning
John Bates faints and falls to the floor
cue music
Nobody%20saw%20that%20one%20coming%20did%20they%3F
- I wondered about that too R124.
- As the figure of Vera approaches Bates, Bates immediately drops dead of a heart attack. Then we see the disguise come off. Vera is really Thomas in drag!
- It is obvious to me that Martha Levenson is not Jewish but was married to a Jew.
They really wouldn't have cast supreme shiksa Shirley MacLaine in the role if the character is Jewish, in spite of the fact that Shirley was (woefully) miscast as Jewess Gittel Mosca in the film version of Two for the Seesaw 50 years ago.
And yes, in the Jewish religion, the mother's religion determines the children's religion.
- [quote]even the Queen lives much differently than her father and grandfather.
Yes. She pees sitting down.
- You know, it's possible they will introduce a new character in series 3, someone we will be led to like, and that person will turn out to be Vera's killer. They're not going to carry the Bates thing all season, but maybe for three or four episodes.
Maybe it's Shirley! Maybe she killed Vera!
- [quote]The engagement will be interrupted when Mary finds Matthew in bed with Thomas.
... after he's finished being fucked by Branson, home on holiday.
- Bump for "Art."
- O'Brien has the hots for Lady Cora.
- Lavinia and Matthew should have married. Lavinia gets pregnant, but dies in childbirth. Season 3, Matthew and Mary get married, but Matthew is so devoted to his child with Lavinia, who is the spitting image of her dead mother, that Mary becomes jealous. Since we know she has adventurous streak, it doesn't surprise us that Mary looks for sex on the side, to spite her husband.
- MacLaine on the set of DA:
http%3A//www.zimbio.com/pictures/pnYmWzzoS2U/Shirley+MacLaine+Set+Downton+Abbey
- Hmmm. . .
In those pictures, the car is driving AWAY from DA.
Setting up a re-take, perhaps, or filming her exit?
- Oh for fuck sake, R124. The show has already gotten ridiculous. What a dumb storyline you've proposed.
- R137, look up "cliche" in the dictionary. You'll find your proposed plot line as the definition.
- R141, no, I'd say the predictable storyline would be what just aired.
Mary and Matthew ending up together was hackneyed, not to mention stupid. Are we supposed to be happy that the woman whose focused on titles and money beat out the wallflower who came back to Matthew knowing he wouldn't be a "proper" husband?
- who's*
- [quote][R137], look up "cliche" in the dictionary. You'll find your proposed plot line as the definition.
Well, yes, but this is a soap opera. It if full of cliches as it is. Besides, I want Mary's bitchiness back in season 3!
137
- The pic of Mrs. Levinson in the car, shows Maclaine & a young woman and a man driving... looks like Martha' brought along her own maid & chauffeur ( and since the car looks like a left hand drive , I'd say that she may have even had her own American car shipped over as well!) Makes sense she bring some of her staff along, back in those days using someone else's maid would be like using someone elses' toothbrush !
Looks like 2 new staff members 9 they are defiantly in costume) and the chauffeur looks to be middle aged so many he'll spark some romance with Mrs. Hughes , or Mrs Patmore... or maybe even O'Brien!
He looks a little old and straight for Thomas.
There is another thread about the new photos, thanks for posting it here too, ( just transfered me comments from there as well, just in case they sound repetitive )
- Is Season 3 for sure about the early part of the 1920s?
I think that makes the most sense, but in looking for spoilers I came across an article where the EP ridiculously suggested that season 3 may start off at the end of the great depression right before world war II starts.
***
The third season, Neame said, may open in the years just before the next great conflict, World War II, possibly at the tail end of the Great Depression.
Will Downton Abbey be shelled in the Nazi Blitz? Will Matthew be going back to war? Or will the Crawley family suffer the hardship of the Depression as the German threat grows in the background?
Neame isn't revealing anything so far, including how much time will pass between the season two finale and the season three premiere. The second season began in 1916, only two years after the first season ended, but dropped viewers in the middle of the Battle of the Somme.
Regardless of whether next season's central focus will be on the Great Depression or on World War II, however, Downton Abbey is sure to go through as radical a change as it did in season two, leaving no character unchanged... or unscarred.
http%3A//www.ibtimes.com/articles/301540/20120220/downton-abbey-season-3-spoilers-things-know.htm
- Agree r142.
It would be as if Gone With the Wind ended with Scarlett happy that Melanie was finally out of the way and she and Ashley could be together rather than realizing she actually loved Rhett all along.
Matthew should have at least taken an episode to get over the shock that Mary wasn't a virgin and had kept a murder from him. He should have been at least a little bit hurt that before the war she was willing to marry him while keeping those things a secret from him rather than just take 5 minutes to decide he was over that.
- I read that Series III covers the first 18 months of the 1920's , meaning it should end around the summer of 1921. I don't think they'll stretch out DA to reach WW2, British tv series are notoriously short lived, even the most highly rated ones. ( with of course the never endoing soap operas like Corination Street and Eastenders)
- Is Maggie Smith leaving? NOOOOOOOOOOOO!
- The 1920s is an incredibly fascinating decade because it literally transitions from Old World to New in so many aspects. And the frocks!!!
Can't imagine they'd skip over that in one season or even two.
And if we're at the end of the 1930s, they would obviously need to do a major aging job on most of the characters, not to mention killing off some of the older ones.
- Was it DL that put the idea in my head that Elizabeth McGovern is channeling Carol Channing?
Every time I see the reruns now I can hear Carol Channing every time McGovern opens her mouth...
Thanks a lot, DL! :)
- Season 3 castshot
http%3A//i1.cdnds.net/12/30/618x682/downton_abbey_02.JPG
- You'd think they could have spent more than $10 and get a real photoshop artist to work on that image. Look at all of those fucking clone marks on the grass! So sloppy.
- Season 3 is amazing! Got the advance DVD and WoW.
No%20spoilers%20for%20the%20yanks.%20
- [quote] least taken an episode to get over the shock that Mary wasn't a virgin and had kept a murder from him
What murder?
- the hot turk
- I want Branson in me, quite deeply.
- But R157, you'd have to listen to him bitch about Ireland the whole time.
- Is Berkeley Square available streaming anywhere? Netflix or Amazon?
- According to the website, Cora is the daughter of Isidore Levinson of Cincinnati. That and the fact the show is based on the real Lady C. who was the illegitimate daughter of a Rothschild makes it clear that Cora is Jewish. It is just as likely that the G's would have their heir married to a Jewish heiress than that the C's would - as they did - have their heir married to the illegitimate daughter of a Jew. As to the Levinson's wealth, I would guess, as a dry goods family theirs is similar to the great dept. store fortunes.
I don't think the real Cora's mother was Jewish. Rothschild men traditionally married Jewish women (Rothschild women didn't nec. marry Jewish men, the family's interest was in keeping the Rothschild's children Jewish which only required their mothers to be Jewish), but Almina - the "real Cora" was illegitimate.
Presumably, Cora would have converted to Anglicanism. The girls being not only disentailed (perhaps not the right word) and of partly Jewish background certainly goes a great deal to their difficulty finding mates among the gentry.
But what is odd is that no one in the family ever mentions Cora's family having been Jewish.
- It's also strange that Martha has a place in Newport. Of course, there have been Jews in Newport since colonial days, including wealthy Sephardic Jews. But it's hard to see Martha embraced by Edith Wharton's Newort.
