How many of you want to leave the city you're living in? I have been in Seattle four years and I've had enough. It's aesthetically pleasing, but the weather for most of the year is horrendous and socially it is a very messed up place. People are flaky, passive aggressive, and socially awkward. I've lived in Boston, NYC, DC, and Chicago and I never had difficulty making friends in any of those cities. I'm also surprised at how humorless people can be here, too.
Of course you are older too, which affect things.
I'm in LA and despise the people. Hope to move back to NYC where people know how to read and actually listen to non-autotuned music.
I know how you feel, OP. I came back to live in Seattle about five years ago, for family, and I'm ready to leave again.
Then there are days I want to leave the US altogether.
Ironic timing - I just have decided to leave Chicago after 25 years (plus my suburban childhood) for Seattle. Am I making a huge mistake? On paper, Seattle looks like the right fit - what am I missing?
r4 Your name sounds familiar...hmmm.
Ditto for LA. I have lived here for 10 years now.
R4 - I've been in Seattle for 22 years and love it. I know for some folks it's hard to make connections. I'd suggest giving it time and having a plan of how you might want to meet folks (join organizations, work, etc.).
I met a local boy a year after I arrived and we've been together since. Hopefully we'll be getting married soon (already in a WA domestic partnership).
Oh yeah - one thing that I've found essential is getting some sun in February. I'm headed to Puerto Vallarta next month.
[quote]I'm in LA and despise the people. Hope to move back to NYC where people know how to read and actually listen to non-autotuned music.
I almost want to live in LA, just to be able to say that myself.
Oh OP, quit being such a drama queen! you think Seattle has bad weather? I live in a city where it rains 250 days a year, and three times as much as in Seattle.. yep, three times more. Try living here for 5 years like I have, and then you have something to complain about.
It depends, R4. A lot of people who move to Seattle love it, so you might too. It has some good things going for it, but socially I find it to be a very awkward and frigid place. And the passive aggressiveness is off the charts.
R9, what city is that?
My bf and I are getting worn out by NYC. We've been thinking about Providence Rhode Island, which is close enough to NYC so we can come back frequently, has cheap housing stock, the ocean nearby and an art and theater scene. Plus we have friends there. I also really miss the feeling of visiting NYC and being completely smitten by it. From the moment we moved here that feeling was gone and only comes back a little when someone is visiting.
I'd love to leave Las vegas and move to somewhere like Sydney, or New York. Since I was little, I always wanted to move to a city with more of a community feeling. In Las Vegas, it's everyone for themselves, I've lived beside the same person for almost six years, and we barely talk. I heard that in Australia, everyone knows everyone else. It's home-like.
OP, you need to move to Bellevue and hang out with the original Eastsiders. We're nice and friendly and remember how cool Seattle and Bellevue used to be.
My feelings on the Pacific Northwest--beautiful scenery, great summers, but the sensibility is somewhat childish to me. I love that diversity is embraced, but there's still a really dark side to Seattle and there is still a very racist thread that runs through the communities that gets pushed under the rug all too often.
I agree about the passive aggressive, wan attitude about everything. Drives me nuts.
I grew up on the East Coast and I think that plays a major factor in not feeling totally welcome in these parts. There's a type of thinking that I find disingenuous and deluded. I come from people who speak their mind and don't have a problem being straightforward. And people don't cry all the time that you 'hurt their feelings', they just tell you to fuck off.
Don't go to Vancouver, BC, OP - it's everything you said about Seattle. I guess the Pacific NW is simply not fun!
R11, I'm not even from USA, I live in a city you've probably never heard of.. it's tiny compared to Seattle.
Yes, R3. I have a very East Coast way of communicating. If something pisses me off, I say it. If I have a preference for something, I say it. Most people in Seattle find that to be "rude". The idea of planning ahead to people seems foreign. Back East, it was normal to make brunch plans two weeks ahead with friends. Here, a request of that sort is "weird".
Houston. What the fuck was I thinking?
R19, I grew up in Houston and yeah it's horrible. Great food, cheap housing, but other than that, not much going for it. Don't you love how huge structures like warehouses, etc. are just abandoned. It's like Detroit, with money.
Lived in Austin for 13 years and I loved it but had to move to Dallas because of work. I don't love it but don't hate it either. It's fine.
OK - so where SHOULD we move then? Personally I need to get out of the Northeast, the winters are killing me and it's too expensive.
I think the show 'Portlandia' skewers the PNW pretty effectively.
Case in point---I transferred to a new store and a new management position in the company I work for about a year ago. Within the first three weeks of my being there, I was pulled into the office with my supervisors for a 'chat'. While they were thrilled with my commitment and performance, it seemed that many of the crew didn't find me particularly 'friendly'. Now, I said hello to people, smiled at them, was never rude to anyone, but apparently, I didn't ask them about their personal lives and try to ingratiate myself into their good graces so I was pegged as aloof and kind of a bitch. This was deemed a problem by my bosses. So I had to switch my focus from sales to, you know, making my subordinates feel comfortable around me.
I found the entire situation pretty ironic, given the social climate, but I'm still bitter about it. I don't feel like people around here are ever 'real'. They're a lot more shallow than one would initially think, too.
Bellevue/Eastsiders are the worst,are you kidding, R14? Entitled and whiny like you wouldn't believe.
Whenever there are threads like this, it never fails to surprise me how many Seattlites are DL'ers. I've never heard one gay man mention this place in RL, and when I talk about this site, I get a lot of puzzled stares.
[quote]I'd love to leave Las vegas and move to somewhere like Sydney...I heard that in Australia, everyone knows everyone else. It's home-like.
Oh my sides! Sydney is a driven, nihilistic, 'fuck you' city with a shallow beach-culture mentality. But honey, if you're coming from Las Vegas you could feel right at home!
Just ensure you have the body. Gay Sydney's tag 'No pecs, no sex' isn't a quaint joke: it's an exhaustively applied law.
That's not weird R22. There are only a couple hundred regulars here. Why would you expect to run in to the few who live in Seattle?
R9 darling: we've all heard of Bergen. And no, we're not going to stalk you.
What about San Francisco? Those I know who've lived there have all really liked it. (Though most of them have lived in and prefered NY.)
Over the past several years, I've had to spend time in Seattle for both business and pleasure. The one thing that I found most striking is how hostile and rude people were. There was definitely a lot of pent up rudeness under a veneer of "mellowness". Throw in a awful weather, a sad gay scene, and a relatively blah setting, Seattle really sucks ass.
You hit it on the head, R27. It is not a "live and let live" kind of attitude, it is aloof yet aggressive. Instead of verbalizing anything, people expect you to mind read. It's a very sour cherry on top of an already claustrophobic and gloomy sundae.
You will never be happy anywhere if you don't have family or friends. I generally hate my area but I have family, my partner and friends. It's them that make the place, not the place itself. As I close in on retirement, we must decide where we want to move to that's cheaper.
I lived in SF. It's hard to make friends if you're older, it's a young person's city, and expensive too. A lot of people there who are middle aged and older have their friends,and they don't want any more. Young people seem to be able to make friends much easier.
Great city though.
I've lived in NYC a long time, and I have a love/hate relationship with the place, so it all depends on what day it is.
Since I'm looking for a job, I'd say I'd leave NYC in a NY minute for the right job.
I've lived in LA for over 15 years. Finishing up this year and then heading out. Can't wait.
Having lived in NYC, DC, Minneapolis, and five additional university towns in the midwest, I find that whatever problems you perceive that you have, you tend to take them with you wherever you happen to move to.
It is just something to think about.
And whatever societal problems you perceive as existing in the city you currently live in, those societal problems tend to exist in other cities in the U.S. such as:
heavy traffic, passive aggressive behavior, rudeness, coldness, indifference to people, lack of community feeling, people not needing any more friends and not needing new friends, closed social circles, weather problems, etc.
So, it looks as though we've all got some 'issues' with where we live in manifesting in one form or another. So let me posit this question instead. WHERE in the continental US, if you had your druthers, would you relocate to and why?
Except, R33, that the things I dislike about Seattle do not apply to other cities I have lived. In other cities, making friends was a lot easier and I didn't experience passive-aggressiveness. That is why Seattle stands out to me.
I don't agree, R33. I have lived in four different places and two were a lot better than the others. The ones that were more cosmopolitan, liberal, and had culture. The ones that didn't were hell. And I mean real culture - sophisticated and wideranging. Every dump exaggerates its population and lies that they have culture. There are not many places on this planet that are real arts/culture cities.
Yeah, I hate that passive-aggressiveness - same thing in Vancouver, B.C.
Prescient response R33, good work. As someone who is reluctantly doing this in their mid-40s, I'm well aware of the old adage 'wherever you go there you are' and how it applies in this case. I'm also reasonably certain that it is, in fact, a greater challenge to 'connect' with people at my present age than when I was 20 years younger. Though I may be setting myself up for some level of disappointment, I do think it is still possible.
I live in Boston. Most of the time I love it, but the weather is now killing me. I always need to go someplace warm for a few weeks between January and March or I can't take it.
I've never lived anywhere else. Sometimes I wonder if I'm missing out, but on vacations to other cities, I've never been tempted to leave.
I love Chicago but I set a deadline with myself where I absolutely have to be on my way to somewhere else by June of this year. And I find all of the burned-out third-tier Midwestern cities incredibly endearing but I'm not sure I could do any of them as a non-driver.
I lived in Minneapolis for the first eighteen years of my life. People who whine about the weather in Seattle, where I live now, seem like ridiculous spoiled babies.
R33 here. R40, I am a non-driver too. Have never driven my entire adult life.
(drove just for three years as a teenager)
I moved to Dallas since the mid-80s -- and I am Dallas-ed out.
I came here for school and stayed for the jobs.
Tired of working and tired of here.
I still think it is very good to move around and experience different cities -
even if 'where ever you go, there you are' and wherever you go, you take your problems with you'.
I am leaving Anchorage this year. I've been saying this for the last three years, but this winter has been brutal, following a shitty, gloomy cold summer. It has hovered around zero for just over a month now, and has warmed up only briefly to snow two feet at a time. We don't have it nearly as bad as some parts of the state, where they are having to shut down the town and have run out of shovels, but we usually have a milder winter than, say, Minneapolis.
It's easy to forgive this kind of brutal stuff when you have one of our occasional glorious summers, but we haven't had one of those since 2009. Also, I'm tired of the people. This used to be an outpost of people with big dreams and weird ideas and open minds. Now it is Jesusland, full of obese, racist assholes who don't give a shit about anything besides fishing (illegally), hunting (poaching), and getting their PFD check so they can buy out Costco every October.
I'm moving back to a decent climate, even if I have to put up with much of the same shit. At least I'll be warm and don't have to drive a 4WD everywhere.
Another one in LA here, fucking sick of the place.
R45, Minneapolis here. We've had no snow at all this winter.
Just 2 inches a couple of times.
And the temperatures have been extremely mild in 30's and 40's a great deal of the time.
And only a few times 20's. Once or twice below 20 for just a day or two.
I've lived in Vegas. Definitely "every man for himself" there. ZERO sense of community or culture. Ugliest landscape imaginable.
Then moved to San Diego which, on paper, looks like a great city. Also looks great on a postcard. But the vapid, flakey people RUIN it. I agree with R29, it doesn't matter how beautiful a city is or how great the weather might be--you'll still be unhappy if you don't have any family/friends.
You have our winter of 2009-10, r47. That one followed a summer where it was in the 70s and low 80s for two straight months with 18 hours of full sunshine a day.
I feel duped (even though I was born here.) And it doesn't help that I'm too broke to go on vacation and have to use my discretionary $$ on my medical deductible this year instead.
I've been in LA 4 years and want to leave this year.
I'm thinking about moving to Seattle, NY or SF. I'm in LA now.
I'm in Chicago and I want to get the fuck out NOW! The people here are bitchy and two-faced and the city is a shithole!
I forgot to add, I sypathize with the people who want the fuck out of L.A. I lived there for 6 months and that was enough. Haven't gone back since.
I live in Dallas.
Where do you want to go 52/53?
I moved to Seattle in the 90's from LA, moved back to LA about 5 years ago. ..I'm ready to go back, I love the Northwest. I think I'll just plan to travel a bit more in order to deal with the grey weather.
Hello Anchorage, I live in Palmer. I know what you mean about this winter. However, when I am OUTSIDE, I appreciate how uncrowded we have it here in AK. I do not think I could stand the traffic in a city in the lower 48. I could prob. live somewhere rural, but there's the catch - there are very few jobs in rural areas in the lower 48 with today's economy. There is more job opportunity here in AK, too.
There currently are jobs here, but there's not much growth.
How long have you lived in Palmer?
R55 If we're talking where I'd like to live in my wildest dreams, then it would be in London or the south of France. If we're talking realistically, then somewhere in Connecticut or Massachusetts, because I like the east coast and I could be close to New York so I could visit easily. As much as I love New York, I wouldn't live there unless I was rich, so I'll just stick to visiting.
I'm just so sick of Chicago and Illinois in general. The people are SUCH bitches here and with the exception of downtown, it's a shithole. As soon as I get enough money, I'm gone.
I'm in DC and I kind of hate it here. Everything boils down to where you went to school, what you do for a living, what kind of car you drive...and don't get me started on the gays (flighty as hell). I work for the federal government...maybe I can start putting in for jobs elsewhere, preferably overseas.
R59, isn't Oak Park nice? I think it's a part of the inner city.
R25, funny! But you're right, of course. I just assumed nobody had heard about it, because this is a pretty insignificant town after all.
Actually R38 it was a salient response, not a prescient one.
"Salient" as in "stand out"? A bit self-promoting my dear. Do you mean "pertinent"?
I've lived all around the country and there is no paradise. Theoretically, Oakland is probably as good as it gets, but it sure doesn't feel that way when you live there. Most American cities see few outsiders, so they aren't good candidates (including those little midwestern burgs). Even during boom times, only a few cities are economically robust enough to be easy to move to. Today, it is rare (and yes, that's what you were thinking about Houston and you were right).
Denver is welcoming to outsiders, relatively strong economically, and a clean gay friendly place. A bit dull of course. But not necessarily a good place to grow old. People die early there with the low oxygen saturation.
I live in LA and I used to say I can't afford to stay; I really can't afford to leave. I'd love to move home and get a job there, but I don't know what I'd do.
I'd like something that pays decently and has good benefits.
Denver's diversity level is also pretty low.
It's odd that people die young from low oxygen saturation in Denver when they live to be as old as Methuselah in the Andes.
Maybe the proximity of all kinds of uranium mines has something to do with it.
My city has an El Pollo Loco so the answer to wanting to leave is NO.
I won't defend Seattle. You know why? Because we don't care what you think of us and our weather. And that's pretty much what's wrong with this place. People who like it that way stay. Everybody else eventually leaves, most sooner rather than later.
OP, you had to get out there. You had to explore. Look, I get it. I was young once. Seattle promised you the world but you'll realize the things you were looking for, your hometown had all along. But you already knew that, didn't you?
I moved to DC for a job, but have used every excuse not to set foot in the city. I've even neglected my job.Badly.
Maybe if you would stop trolling on Craig's List and settle down you'd actually like your surroundings, OP.
Anchorage? Try Wasila. I spend as little time there as possible.
R33, you're a sanctimonious bastard -- and I'm guessing you that THAT wherever you go.
Some places are much worse than others. College towns are all the same. Try living in Newark and THEN tell me that you're so together it won't get you down.
I've owned houses or rented placed in St. Louis (now), London, Denver, and Des Moines ( ! ), and have spent enough time in Chicago and D.C. with jobs that I know neighborhoods, services, "vibes," good butchers and avoidable clubs.
I loved London and found it very livable, despite the tourists, because there are many places the tourists don't go. I loathed Denver (had a house there for 16 years so I gave it a shot, but pretty much stayed away except for business trips the last 6) because there was no there there - if I wanted to live in New California at least I would want an ocean.
St. Louis is okay, since I still travel and when I'm home it's fine to knock around the house and neighborhood and not feel pinched because of it. There's an oldness people miss - Soulard and Lafayette Square and CWE - and I like the brick and limestone. Arts are just fine. People, though, with old-style racial issues (thuggery versus white trash) and midwestern conventionalism and brittle youth (so dull) leave me glad for a change. But I'll probably keep the house here - couldn't afford anything so great in such an interesting area anywhere else in the country, probably.
Des Moines? Lord. Insurance executives wanting to get you drunk and they always had a wet spot in the crotch of their pants.
I don't like Chicago except for shopping and some arts. We go up for the day and come back. The people are hideous - as are most types around the Great Lakes, except in Cleveland, interestingly. (How's that for stereotyping?)
How are the people in Chicago hideous exactly???
We all hate where we live at times, face it. No place is perfect. However, I do feel really sorry for the Alaska posters.
79 posts and no wants to leave Atlanta? I guess we're all staying!
R75, I was talking about interesting, enjoyable cities full of culture. I was not talking about crummy cities such as Newark.
And I did not say that all interesting, enjoyable cities are the same.
I just said that wherever you go, your problems often go along with you - so that is something to keep in mind.
And then ar R44, I went on to say that I think it is very good to move around a lot and experience different cities, even if wherever you go, your problems often go with you.
And I strongly disagree with you that 'all university towns are the same. I've lives in five or six different university towns/ciiies which are all very different. And I've visited a couple dozen university towns - all very different.
Meant to add, it is R33 (me) at R81
Rude, loud, obnoxious, impatient, and closed-minded East Coasties will never like anywhere they're not from. The ones who move here seem to like to complain in general.
It's fun to visit NY and Boston and cop their attitude for a few days, but it is exhausting. The climate extremes seem oppressive. Can't imagine living like that.
Well, it's all relative, I absolutely hate San Francisco weather. Talk about monotonous.
I'll go one better. I hate San Francisco.
R77, the people in Chicago are hideous because they are pushy and shallow, defensive, angry, and lack wit. Now, of course that's ridiculous to say.
But the Great Lakes area's third-, fourth- and fifth-generation middle European white base, the generations of blue-collar/manufacturing lost souls, the mercantile and shallow entrepreneurial types, the large cohorts of defeated latter-day clerks, arrogant academics cannibalizing their institutions' life blood to keep their nests feathered and stinking up cultural life as an effect, and the loss of real artistic verve (outside of some music) all combine in the swelter to leave a rather tedious, unwelcoming city. Some Chicago neighborhoods are okay, but the gentrification is not an improvement in quality, and the habituated rage of the underclass feels like a dispersed headache.
Immigrants - with the same kind of dynamics everywhere in the US and in Europe (usually subdivided by family/not family oriented and educated/not educated) - offer some respite and cheer, when you're not facing their suspicions or self-protection.
R86 sounds hideous.
After living in Madison, WI for 35 years I am so-o-o weary of "progressives."
35 years in one university town/city is too long.
Unless you are professor at the Univ of Wisconsin and cannot easily move.
R88, I worked as a legislative aide in the state capitol for many years after going to school at the UW.
I'm still here out of inertia and because this is where my friends are.
Ah, R89, that is a good job.
What do you do now?
R90, I live off my retirement benefits and dabble with writing.
I've had 100,000 hits on my erotic short stories, but they're too kinky for me to link.
I lived in Madison, WI for three years. It is a great city!
[quote]I don't like Chicago except for shopping and some arts. We go up for the day and come back. The people are hideous - as are most types around the Great Lakes, except in Cleveland, interestingly. (How's that for stereotyping?)
I knew I wasn't the only one who felt this way. The people here are VILE, bitchy, and arrogant. It runs rife in Chicago.
I can't wait until I can get the fuck out.
[quote]It's fun to visit NY and Boston and cop their attitude for a few days, but it is exhausting. The climate extremes seem oppressive. Can't imagine living like that.
Ditto. Very nice places to visit, but after a week I'm ready to go. Although the weather doesn't bother me (I like having 4 seasons).
I need space and I can't imagine spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on a decent but cramped one bedroom apartment.
R86 could say that about any city, it has no ring of truth to it.
We Built This City
What about DC, R12? The people there are warm and real.
People seem to love Chicago. I've only visited.
I live in Orange County and not a day goes by that I don't wish I was somewhere else. The beach is beautiful, but it's not enough to keep me here.
[quote]I lived in Minneapolis for the first eighteen years of my life. People who whine about the weather in Seattle, where I live now, seem like ridiculous spoiled babies.
I'm from Minnesota (live in Chicago), and in terms of cold (usually) and snow (usually), maybe that's true. But, I'd say Mpls has considerably more sun than Seattle. And, for many people the "gloom" of Seattle isn't necessarily just the cold or lack of warmth, but the lack of sun. And, from a purely visual and walking around standpoint, many people like snow much better than pissing rain.
Thank you, R100. The only way in which people who complain about Seattle's weather would be "crybabies" is if Minneapolis was even MORE gloomy. No one in Seattle complains about the cold, they complain about the lack of sun. The "crybaby" statement would only be valid if someone in Houston complained about how cold it is there. Gloomy skies and winter temperatures are two different things.
I appreciate sun + winter more than always grey and often rainy PNW.
Yes, Minneapolis is quite sunny in winter.
And pretty sunny year-round.
R92, then I guess this city isn't for you.. not if you don't like constant rain for three weeks in a row, with some hail mixed in, then a couple of days with sun, then another 3-4 weeks with rain. We have a total of 250 rain days a year, it's actually a miracle if the sun does shine. It's usually grey and depressing year round, but it's especially bad in winter when it's dark like 18 hours of the day.. you also have your winter storms.. ugh :(
That said.. we've actually had some amazing weather here the last few days, blue sky, sunshine.. I'll definitely enjoy it while it lasts! It's beautiful to see the snowcapped mountains surrounding the city in sunshine :)
I live in Sacramento and I often think about moving.
Here's a reason Alaskans want to depart (but it's too cold up by the border to drive out),
That's wild, R47. I lived in Mpls in the mid-90s and the winters were pretty brutal, especially since I didn't have a car. I remember one night in April it went down to 17 below. I still enjoyed my time there and miss it, though downtown seemed to have really gone downhill during my one visit a few years ago.
I spent a winter in Seattle in the early 90s. I found the city very visually attractive, and enjoyed the weather, since I love rain and am used to the snowy Midwest. However I had the same experience as many of you regarding the people. The vibe struck me as a combination of Minnesota Nice and California flake. Just really distant. Minnesotans can be difficult to get to know, but they're like warm Italians compared to Seattlites in my experience.
I'd live in Mpls again, but never Seattle.
I live in the Detroit area, where I grew up and returned to after many years of moving around. Detroit itself is a depressing shithole, but I actually generally like the people around here, especially in the old blue collar suburbs. Waitresses still call you hon, which I actually like. Detroit is never coming back, but if you're older, have family and friends and don't give a shit about what people think anymore it can be a comfy place. Right now that's enough for me.
I found Cleveland familiar and appealing the few times I've gone there. Chicago on the other hand has always struck me as the most overrated city in America. So friggin' expensive, and for what? Grim, not very walkable neighborhoods from what I saw.
How is Pittsburgh? It looks beautiful in photographs.
[quote]Denver's diversity level is also pretty low.
Well at least it's got something going for it.
[quote]Chicago on the other hand has always struck me as the most overrated city in America. So friggin' expensive, and for what? Grim, not very walkable neighborhoods from what I saw.
Completely agree. I've never seen a city with a huge downtown yet you still pretty much have to drive everywhere in it to get around. Chicago is definitely not much of a walking city and the people are not nice at all.
I know someone who love Pittsburg. (I've never been there, though).
I lived in Pittsburgh many years ago, and I absolutely loved it. It's very friendly, quite beautiful, and there are tons of parks. Winter is endless, however.
I only left because I had the opportunity to move to Manhattan, where I've been since.
What's the minimum "diversity" quotient you'll accept for a potential city (to move to).
It seems like most of the posters here would not be happy ANYWHERE. For so many, it is not about geography. It's about psychology. When you are here you want to be there. When you are there you want to be here. No matter where you go, you take "you"with you, problems included.
Sure, there are some things about a city that do change quality of life: arts, weather, cost of living, etc. but, really, if anyone thinks that simply MOVING somewhere will make them "happy," it won't. Some people love NYC, some hate it. Some people hate Honolulu, too. There is no "paradise." But opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one. I, personally, love Chicago but I have had wonderful, magical experiences there and my first visit there twenty something years ago was like going to "Oz." So, my perspective is what it is. Others here apparently hate the city. So be it. We all have different desires and perspectives.
I could never EVER live anywhere in Alaska, personally. Or Detroit. Or San Diego. All for various reasons. And I lived in Seattle for a year. That WET WET rain and cold bone chilling "wet wind" in the winter got to me. SO grey. SO depressing. And the people were passive aggressive as shit. I also did not like the topography of the place. Dizzying, disorienting city. So many "inlets" and "peninsula" types deals. So many hills. Never could get a handle on the place. Had some excellent coffee and meals, though. Seattle is also on the edge of hell. I was raised in the midwest and all my family and many old friends are there. Seattle was TOO freaking far from all things familiar. Too expensive to fly back very often.
I now live in NYC. And am a realist about it. I am sure I will burn out at some point. But for now it is bliss.
san francisco = smug, (generally) ugly, passive-aggressive gays who don't talk to other gays unless they want to sleep with them.
[quote]It seems like most of the posters here would not be happy ANYWHERE. For so many, it is not about geography. It's about psychology. When you are here you want to be there. When you are there you want to be here. No matter where you go, you take "you"with you, problems included.
This is probably mostly true, though I disagree with the first sentence. (I'm one of the Alaskans.) I've lived all over the country and had extended time in others. There has always been something I liked somewhere. It's hard to beat Alaska summers, when you get one - on a good June day, virtually everyone who can leave work does and you can ride your bike along the coastal trail or hike in the mountains in the sunshine until almost midnight.
Later in the summer, your neighbors are knocking on your door to bring you salmon filets or crab legs, depending on where you are in the state.
But we are at the nadir of a 30 year climate cycle. We're having the shitty, glum summers and freezing winters of my early childhood and probably will continue for another 7-8 years. And Fukushima has had a profound effect. The last of the uncontaminated salmon is in my freezer right now.
After growing up here, climate makes a HUGE difference to me. I don't want my activities for half or more of the year to be determined by how much I can bear going outside in the cold or how bad the roads are (currently: icy as hell.) I'm here only because the economy is marginally less fucked than everywhere else.
In this country I do well in southern California, Hawaii, the desert southwest, and the south. I HATE the cold, don't like the endless grey of the PNW, and can put up with all manner of assholes to get away from both.
R115, you're missing the point that the economic trajectory pointing upward is never true in more than a few cities at a time so MOST PLACES people move are in a state of decline (or in boom times relative decline) and likely to make them unhappy unless they brought money with them.
Houston... We have a problem.
This fucking dreadful city.
I disagree with the "most of you wouldn't be happy anywhere sentiment". The quality of life greatly varies in different cities in the US and around the world.
R116 -- my Mom just came over with a couple of cans of wild Alaska salmon because she likes the fish burgers I make with them. Are the cans okay? Should I look for a glow?
They're fine, r120. Just don't eat them next year.
I'm bored, restless and unfulfilled in LA. I'm grateful to work but I detest my job and co-workers. I have the freedom to leave but I feel pulled in different directions. It's very frustrating. I dread going to work tomorrow.
Work sucks everywhere, now R122. Moving to a new city won't improve your co-workers -- only finding a better office will, but the chances of that are low since crappy offices/coworkers are the result of systematic changes in our culture.
"I'm bored, restless and unfulfilled in LA."
I feel the same way; I'm getting out. Can't stand it anymore.
I love San Francisco. I go to The Lion bar all the time.
Some jobs are better than others. The people and environment of my current job are toxic. I dislike the feel of the place. It beats unemployment but it sucks. Right now, I'm working on a plan to get out of LA.
R100, I like when it's gray outside. I don't like the sun and considered moving to Seattle. I even got my professional certification license in Washington. That is until we had 5-6 weeks of rain, gray overcast weather and absolutely no sun that entire time. It really got to me. I was shocked and surprised that it affected me that way
I still don't like the sun, but I won't be moving to Seattle any time soon
WTF is The Lion bar? Gay?
R2, by all means, please leave LA. This city would be much better off without the douchebag, aggro asshole NY-transplants who pollute the place with their grating presence and pretentiousness. Its funny how so many NYers prattle on and on about how much they hate LA, yet there are SO many who willingly move here? On the other hand, you rarely see or hear of native Angelenos moving to that rat-infested shithole.
r126 = Failed actor.
I'm not in the entertainment industry.
'This city would be much better off without the douchebag, aggro asshole NY-transplants who pollute the place with their grating presence and pretentiousness.'
Funny, that's how I would describe Los Angelenos. Plus mental illness and painful stupidity that has to be experienced to be believed.
Corporations have made most worlplaces, miserable places. If you work for a worker friendly company, thank your lucky stars.
I've met the strangest and most unstable people in LA. The city is full of them.
R127, I thought I didn't like the sun when I lived in a place that could get very hot in summers - then I lived in the Pacific Northwest... and had a new appreciation for the sun. The lack of sun (and the crappy people) does get one down.
Is there anyone that enjoys living in Seattle? I'm thinking about relocating to Seattle but this discussion gives me pause.
Toronto: a landscape of grey boxy buildings (especially grim with rain and little snow). Way overpriced for what it offers. Roads, side walks and many stores are in a bad condition (everything needs a good overhaul). Imports culture.
Agree, R137. You can even write: "Imports 'culture.'"
R129, The only douchebag, aggro asshole is you
I have been offered a job in Memphis. Does it have any redeeming qualities? I've only been there once, and it reminded me of Detroit, though it didn't seem quite as advanced in its decay.
I posted before - I've been in Seattle since 89 and love it. The gloom can be tough in the winter (definitely get away for some sun) and I've heard it can be tough to meet people although that hasn't been my experience. There are a lot of introverted people here which is a plus for me. I grew up in the "in your face" northeast so I was actually happy to be among the polite but reserved locals. I really like that it's a city full of smart and interesting people surrounded by some astounding scenery.
You should really check it out for yourself.
Does anyone believe Salt Lake City is gay-friendly?
Call me crazy, but I LOVE Mormon guys. Every one I've ever met has been so nice, and I love me some white boys. Utah would likely be my own personal heaven (minus the religion crap). Magic underwear, mmmm....
This thread is a little too U.S. orientated. I'd appreciate hearing from some offshore sufferers. London 'orrible? Berlin simply Scheiss? Share with group.
Can someone get me the fuck out of the entire state of Illinois? I fucking hate it here! There's no jobs and the people are assholes.
Would leave if I had the money to do so
Live in a small college town in the northeast and work in another small college town ten miles away at a university. Love my job, the winters are brutal but I don't want to move right now. Don't want to go where you have to get on an interstate to go to work. Can't stand congested traffic. Like that I know my neighbors and am active in my community. There is even culture here. Used to live in NYC and I wouldn't move back to a city if you paid me. My next move will be out of the village into the woods.
[quote]Used to live in NYC and I wouldn't move back to a city if you paid me. My next move will be out of the village into the woods.
How long were you in NYC for and what did you dislike about it? Was your apartment an expensive dump?
Anyone here live in Portland? I'm curious to know if the people there are the same or diff't than the Seattle/Vancouver population.
I'd also like to hear about Ann Arbor, Savannah or Atlanta.
Yes, r 147. I moved from apartment to apartment and finally settled in a rent stabilized place in the East Village where I played roommate roulette and dealt with a crazy neighbor downstairs who harassed me constantly and a super who wouldn't fix anything. Then I moved to a studio in Brooklyn for four years which was actually a nice break but it was not much bigger than a closet and had no kitchen. I had a counter where I put my hot plate and washed dishes in the bathroom which made me ill if I gave it much thought which I didn't just to survive. The day I moved out I paid my super 75 dollars to stand on the truck so no one would steal my stuff and homeless men were trying to distract her to get to my stuff. I like my safe town with no crime and lots of space.
I loved living in Brooklyn.
I'm surprised at how shitty Toronto is.
I've only visited Toronto once but I enjoyed it.
Don't get me wrong, I like Toronto, but it's a shoddy state compared to some other major cities.
(Perhaps the city spends revenue on more important things).
*in a shoddy state...
R149 Wow, thanks for telling me that! You made me realize that unless you make six figures a year, it would be no fun to live in NYC.
I just stay in my flyover state where everything is cheap and I have space.
R134 what were the people who you met in Los Angeles like? What was wrong with them?
How passive aggressive are people in Seattle and the PNW?
So just how passive aggressive are people in Seattle and the PNW?
I lived in Boston for years and liked it. Moved to Brooklyn and love it. The winters in the Northeast are rough, but in both cities there's a higher % of intelligent/interesting people who have their shit together and are reasonably friendly.
I'd like to live in Philadelphia but the job scene is rather poor there.
I loved living in Brooklyn. I can't wait to leave LA.
R129 I totally agree with you. Everyone that's not from L.A. has to leave! Especially if you're a NY transplant. It's the non-natives that bring their BS and pretense to this town. Especially the New Yorkers. Blech!
I'm a native Los Angeleno and I'm so happy I am.
R157 R158 I'm not sure that's it. You have to do some searching to find a real Seattleite (born, schooled; married, kids; or alt.) and we are terminally boring and self-absorbed. The newer arrivals have the attitude hecause they are the last ones in the "magical" place they've discovered and need to lock the gate behind them.
Don't blame NYers for LA's crappyness.
Seattle is more humorless than Boston, OP? That's hard to imagine.
"It's the non-natives that bring their BS and pretense to this town."
Bitch, please! So not true. I've lived in LA for 20 years, and the natives are FULL of BS and pretense.
I moved back to NYC last year after several years in DC (godawful, evil, third-world place). The move hasn't gone well.
When I first moved to NYC, I was 30 and found it extremely easy to make friends and meet cool people. These people didn't necessarily become lifelong friends - they may not have stuck around long - but it felt like there were always new, interesting people to meet.
Now I'm 40, and it's been the completely opposite experience. Almost everyone I meet is cold and unfriendly. I've done all sorts of things - French classes, language and gaming meetup groups, running club, both gay and straight - and it appears that absolutely no one in this city wants new friends. My old friends have either left town or after several years we've grown apart, and it's been a very lonely experience.
I also feel like NY has become much more like the rest of America - the East Village is now a giant brofest, which wasn't the case a decade ago; the LES is worse. The West Village gay vibe has really withered - it's now either old bears or entitled yuppie women in tall heels wandering around in packs. The artists, musicians, and other creative types seem to have pretty much vanished, or perhaps they're all in Bushwick.
There used to be lots of cool coffeehouses where you could sit and read and strike up a conversation with someone - there were several such places that were all gay. They're all gone now. Any coffeehouse that does exist is filled up at all hours of the day and night with people on laptops listening to their iPods, and it can be impossible to find a place to sit.
I used to live in Toronto several years ago, but I left because it couldn't measure up to NYC. Now I go back there and I wish I had stayed. The people are so much more open, much kinder and friendlier. Oh well - such is life, I guess.
R166 then perhaps you should leave LA. Return to whence you came! We natives won't miss you. I'll help you pack.
I'm in LA now and considering moving to Seattle, NY or SF. I've already lived in NY. LA isn't for me but I'm unsure of where to go.
I have a feeling, just a feeling, no evidence, that many of the people mkaing our most interesting cities seem cold and unfriedly are the same ones moving around looking for the Perfect Place (which doesn't exist.)
Be glad you don't live in Columbus Ohio...
OMG.SUBURBAN CULTURELESS WASTELAND! and what makes it worse? the locals think the city is world class or something because they all moved from small podunk towns around the state. Seriously it's so sad.
I seriously hate it here i could go on and on and on and on and on and on...
"then perhaps you should leave LA. Return to whence you came! We natives won't miss you. I'll help you pack"
Oh, honey, I cannot wait to leave this dump of a town.
You could live in German Village, could you not, R171?
R169 Try Austin, Texas. It's a cool city. I spent a year there while I was consulting a company. It was very friendly, cool music scene, restaurants. It wasn't the conservative city like the rest of Texas. Anyway, just a suggestion. I liked it.
I live in Portland, Oregon and love it but R15 nailed it.
How is Seattle racist?
I'm glad I didn't see this thread before moving to Seattle. I've found it a friendly city and have made many new friends here. As a percentage of the population, Seattle has the second highest gay population of US cities.
The downside is the gloom from November - December. There can be a brief respite in January/early February as the weather changes from the rains of winter to the rains of spring, but really, winter is gray here.
For a city that's progressive, friendly, highly educated, and has a high percentage of gays, I can put up with the winter gloom and travel for a winter sun break in HI or Mexico.
The summer and fall here is gorgeous.
I'm thinking about moving to Seattle.
They are freaks.
Sorry, OP. Hope you can flee.
People on here sure hate the Pacific Northwest.
[quote]NY has become much more like the rest of America - the East Village is now a giant brofest, which wasn't the case a decade ago; the LES is worse.
I noticed that too -- guys who would have been disinterested tourists at best -- dragged along on the Sex and the City Tour by their sappy girlfriends and wives -- now actually live in the city, and fill it with their...selves.
Any insights about the following cities: Milwaukee, Louisville, and Philadelphia?
Milwaukee has the best-priced lakefront property in a fairly major city that you could find. Lots of wonderful Victorian architecture. Socialist history, but lots of racial tension, and lots of astonishingly ignorant Republican peasants in the area. People there like their food. A lot. Gay community very strong.
Louisville is surprisingly sophisticated architecturally and culturally, but the gay community is in a normal state of "under siege," lots of closet cases and lots of bigotry.
So small that finding employment is likely problematic.
Both of those two cities are places people move FROM rather than to, so you'd really have to know someone. Philadelphia is a big city so it's a different animal.
I've been in New York over 4 years and love it, minus the weather and the subway commute. I live in a large, affordable apartment in Astoria, Queens with roommates, and I have lots of friends, more than I'd ever made in Pittsburgh and Philly. And I am far from rich.
I would leave it for southern California if I could, just to give it a shot. Nothing is written in stone. So far all I've gathered is that the people in L.A. are shallow, stupid, and crazy. Any other reasons to hate it?
Thanks a lot, R183!
Doesn't Milwaukee have rising crime rates?
I moved to SoCal from NY. I can't wait to leave.
R186, please explain further. What is driving you away from SoCal? Is it Los Angeles that you want to leave or another town - San Diego?
R184 LA is the best. Weather, culture, beach, mountains. Always something to do.
I have lived in many cities. Most of the major cities in the US plus London, Sydney and Barcelona. I have yet to find a city or town that didn't make me happy, each in its own way. I'd like to say I have a favorite, but honestly, I've really loved them all and would gladly return to any of them. London, Paris, Sydney, San Frnacisco and Los Angeles are fantastic, but so were Montgomery, AL, DC, Chicago, Boston and NYC. All wonderful experiences, each of which would satisfy any lifetime in my opinion. Cities don't fail, we fail individually and location is often the scapegoat. I honestly believe happy people are not location dependent.
Whatever it takes for each of us to be happy can be telling and educational if we really give a damn about anyone but ourselves.
I'm 186. I'm in Los Angeles. I dislike driving and the traffic is horrible. You have to drive everywhere. I miss seasons.
Well folks, I'm going to stand you on your head. What's the most diverse metropolitan area in the US? Wait for it.....
yup, it's Houston! An amazing place - if you learn how to handle the heat and humidity (and we have beautiful fall and spring), the low prices, great jobs (we created more than 100,000 new jobs in the past year), proximity to the ocean, great airport with connections to the world, no income tax, and an amazing potpourri of international restaurants - you could love it here. Not to mention a very open and large diverse gay community and, oh yes, an openly lesbian mayor.
Large parts of the city are hidden by a pine forest - it is flat, but if you're adventurous, love the outdoors, rodeos, parades, and various cultures - you could really enjoy it here. People are friendly and accepting in large part.
I like Houston (the boys were very friendly when I visited) but the fact that it's in Texas is a deal breaker for me.
I have lived in Denver for six years, and have grown to hate it. I hate cold and wind. The people are unfashionable hillbillies. If you don't ski, there is nothing to do all winter. I lived in Scottsdale for years, and wish I could move back, but I have a good job here in Denver.
r189, the fact that you've moved so much tells me you have not stayed long in most of the places you've lived.
I loved living in Boston for the first four years. After eight years I could't wait to leave.
I've been in Portland, OR for a little over 20 years and I still love it.
Some cities/locations are just better fits for some people.
I need a fresh start and want to relocate away from my small Northeastern city - any suggestions for Best Place To Make A Fresh Start?
Leaving London was always part of my long-term plan. I've had a lot of good times here and even now, I can say that I'm still quite happy around 50% of the time.
I have friends here and a job that I like which leaves me with enough disposable income to save money for retirement as well go on holidays to other European cities every 2 months, but the older I get, the more I crave to move somewhere more muted and less lively in the countryside or to smaller cities in Canada or Australia.
The noise and chaos is fun when you're young, and I'm way past going clubbing and getting incredibly drunk on weekday nights(or on Saturday nights and during boozy Sunday roasts at the pub, for that matter). The amazing near-superhuman powers of the British to absorb alcohol astounds me.
I loved living in London and want to go back.
I've heard that living in places with a high elevation(Denver, for instance) can be bad for your health in regards to oxygen levels, especially for older people. Has anybody else heard that?
I live in Ann Arbor. Sadly, we're being overrun by New Yorkers.
Any rudeness in Chicago has nothing on Boston's.
r195, based on the information you've provided I would say anywhere should meet your needs.
My brother has lived in Seattle for decades, and whenever he came to Chicago he would take us to whatever restaurant was cool and hip that week.
Without fail (my BF and I would sit and wait for it), within 20 minutes of being seated he would do a long, slow, pan across the room and say, "Well, this place would never make it in Seattle."
All you need to know about the Seattle mindset.
More about Columbus Ohio, please. Or Toledo(I know, I know) for that matter.
Thanks, R202. The people in Seattle sound unbearable.
Really, 202? Seattle restaurants are, by and large, middle-of-the-road at best. They do get points for always having fresh and often organic ingredients, but in terms of ambiance and originality, they score very low.
[quote]Really, 202? Seattle restaurants are, by and large, middle-of-the-road at best. They do get points for always having fresh and often organic ingredients, but in terms of ambiance and originality, they score very low.
I know! There's no accounting for it, but honestly, it went on for years, and we practically had to stab forks into our legs to keep from laughing whenever he said it.
What was funny was that he never bothered to ask us where WE thought we should eat. It was always some trendy nightmare that had been written up somewhere. In fact, he rejected any place we would suggest.
What did your brother mean by saying 'this place would never make it in Seattle'?
R207, probably that the customers were too lively, the decor too modern, and the menu too innovative.
I am tired of living in Calgary and plan on moving to London, UK this June. Quite a change. My ass is ready.
What do you dislike about Calgary? What will you do in London?
I lived in Seattle for a few years, and the restaurants were one of the few things that I liked about it. The people were pretentious assholes. Average people thought that they were hot for some reason. The rain and gloom were absolutely unbearable though. I have no idea how people deal with it.
[quote]I lived in Seattle for a few years, and the restaurants were one of the few things that I liked about it. The people were pretentious assholes. Average people thought that they were hot for some reason. The rain and gloom were absolutely unbearable though. I have no idea how people deal with it.
I wonder why Portland has such a different feel to it? I do not get that vibe here at all. I have some friends from Portland who currently live in Seattle and they have talked about the Seattle attitude too.
I live in Dallas. I love it.
I've lived in DC,LA, Atlanta, and Tampa. Dallas is my fab. I hated Tampa.
That won't last R213.
Yeah, you stay in Dallas, R213, 'cause you're off your rocker.
This city has my sphincter so tight I haven't done a number two in like five days.
[quote]I wonder why Portland has such a different feel to it? I do not get that vibe here at all. I have some friends from Portland who currently live in Seattle and they have talked about the Seattle attitude too.
They call it the "Seattle Freeze," and it's real. And under all the Gore-Tex there is a Main Line snobbishness about the born-and-breds; more than once I heard people pop off "We're FIFTH generation," which is as silly as it sounds, for many reasons. But Seattle does have decent big-city stuff: museums, restaurants, etc., and the bays and mountains are gorgeous. Once you make friends, they're nice people, but it is harder than it is in other cities.
I was transferred to Portland for a year. I know people that live there LOVE Portland, and endlessly defend it, but it just felt like a Northwest version of Berkeley to me: a city with its head up its own ass. People are very polite, and very enthusiastic about anything "Portland," but a lot of things "Portland" really aren't very good: bad museums, mediocre theater, and a lot of restaurants that are cute, but it's more important that things be "locally sourced" than they taste good, or that they're consistent. Plus Portland seemed to think it invented culinary ideas and trends that had been done in California for decades.
Most of all, Portland just felt juvenile (men on the verge of middle age dressing like teenagers, riding skateboards, comic books, everybody in a crappy band, etc.) and, ultimately, cliquish.
I was glad to leave, but as everyone who moves to Portland learns, the city wants you to leave and isn't shy about letting you know. The "Welcome to Portland, Now Go Home" attitude isn't a myth. The thing about blaming everything bad on Californians? That's not a myth, either.
[quote]I know people that live there LOVE Portland, and endlessly defend it, but it just felt like a Northwest version of Berkeley to me: a city with its head up its own ass. People are very polite, and very enthusiastic about anything "Portland," but a lot of things "Portland" really aren't very good: bad museums, mediocre theater, and a lot of restaurants that are cute, but it's more important that things be "locally sourced" than they taste good, or that they're consistent
I don't really feel the need to defend Portland, but I really do love living here. What you described seems pretty acurate.
Hipsters are just a symptom of a much bigger problem.
Sorry, I still do not get it. When you brother says 'this restaurant would never make it in Seattle', what is he saying the restaurants are like in Seattle?
I bet the brother is making a snide comment about the place being too trendy and not as slavish about locally sourced food. The other alternative is that he'd like more restaurants like that in Seattle but I doubt it.
In response to some of the other comments I've been in Seattle for over 20 years and love living here. There is a foodie subculture that I find obnoxious but I don't tend to go to the restaurants that cater to it. There are also some folks who can be pretty insufferable but they're pretty easily avoided. I haven't experienced the Seattle freeze so I'm likely part of the problem - I'm pretty introverted and it takes me a while to get close to people. I do really well here. The folks I know from the older families would be the last ones to mention it - the old money here is really quiet about it.
The comments about Portland are pretty accurate as they apply to a fairly small hipster/yuppie subculture. Most folks who've been there for a while are pretty low key about it (and remember Tonya Harding's from there). There's a nice smaller city outside of the Pearl District and some of the hipster dominated areas.
I've lived in Seattle for 22 years an except for my job, which I loved and could not do anywhere else, I loathed living here. I missed the social life I had in Boston and New York.
Then last year, in part our of desperation part out of boredom, I did something I always wanted to do. I learned to row, found a world class coach and began rowing competitively. In the process I found the most open welcoming community of smart people I had encountered anywhere.
I still miss the swapping of dinner invitations with friends and the comradely over meals I had in New York and Boston, That said, I am truly enjoying the new friendships I have made in my rowing club and the larger Seattle rowing community. It's been a life changer on many levels.
[quote]The comments about Portland are pretty accurate as they apply to a fairly small hipster/yuppie subculture. Most folks who've been there for a while are pretty low key about it (and remember Tonya Harding's from there). There's a nice smaller city outside of the Pearl District and some of the hipster dominated areas.
I agree, but it's the yuppie crowd that runs both City Hall and the civic conversation, and they cater to the idea of some imagined "creative class" that draws hipsters like flies to shit.
One thing about Portland: they also hate anyone whom they don't see as cosmopolitan as themselves. The suburbs are grist for endless ridicule: Beaverton, Hillsboro, Vancouver, etc. The people 20 miles from the civic center never seemed that different to me, but the geographic snobbery there is so ubiquitous it's unquestioned. When I was there, the town of Hillsboro (where all the Hispanics lived) was routinely referred to as "Hillsburrito," which they didn't see as derogatory.
It did mean you could drive 20 minutes from downtown and find remarkably affordable housing - but good luck getting anyone from Portland to come out there.
Why is it so expensive to move? My car is too small to pull the sized trailer I'd need and it'd be 2k not counting supplies and movers and motels and a storage unit and shipping my car just to get from LA to Austin in a rental truck. How much do full service movers usually charge to move the equivalent of a studio or small 1 bedroom?
Way less than 2K, R224, if you're in the same city.
r225, I'm trying to get out of LA and go to Austin.
R224, I priced a mover for a 1-bedroom apartment (not a studio, a full bedroom set, reading nook and living room) about 2 years ago from Jacksonville to Boston, and I was getting a quote of about $1600 then with insurance. Pretty sure the distance is less for you. That was with them packing everything, too. Shop around. It may be a matter of convenience. It's a lot less hassle to have other people drive it for you. Having said that, there are a lot of horror stories about hiring movers, so make sure you read the fine print on insurance if you have a lot of expensive electronics and things like that. Good luck! Austin is an awesome city; you're going to love it.
r227, do you remember which company you used?
I don't have a full set of anything, but I have some strange heavy stuff including many, many boxes of books, a large chunk of alabaster I'm carving, a heavy rolling table with a lazy susan on top, boxes and boxes of art supplies and tools, bookcases, desks, a bed/box/platform, etc.
I'm in bad health so there's not even a question of my being able to pack or un/load pretty much anything beyond bags of clothes by myself. Even driving out there in my car is going to be testing my limits, but I'll fucking die if I have to stay here any longer. Even if I drove a truck out myself I'd have to hire movers on both ends and then there'd still be the matter of the car.
Do you think I can get away with just putting my stuff into a storage unit in Austin and finding a temporary place for a week or two with my cat while looking for more permanent digs? I'm hoping to be out of here by May 1st and have thought about flying out to scout places (the Austin craigslist is awful), but I'd have to rent a car and most of my friends there are party animals so I doubt I'd get much done if I stayed with any of them.
I was up all last night doing move related math and sent a few requests to full service companies, but am not expecting to hear anything back until Monday.
BTW, the distance is about 1400 miles with stops, etc.
Having the moving company do all the packing of your all your belongings adds a big expense on to the whole move.
It's much cheaper if you're able to do all of your own packing.
R13 - that sounds lovely about Australians and everyone knowing everyone but it isn't true. Maybe if you lived in a little country town. However our big cities are just the same as yours. I barely speak to my neighbours and that's fine with all of us.
I've lived in Sydney for half my life and the other half in Melbourne where I live now. I'm 42.
Melbourne is the friendlier of the two cities. Both cities have their positive and negative points.
This thread is weird because I was thinking a lot about moving back to Sydney today. It's my home town and I moved to Melbourne for work and have stayed ever since. Now I'm not sure why I'm here sometimes.
I'm sorry but I don't remember the name of the company. Speaking as someone who's moved cross-country a few times, my best advice would be to see this as an opportunity for a truly fresh start and declutter as much as you can. Take only the things you really love, can't replace and can't imagine living without. It's just stuff! It's not worth stress or your health or extra expense if you don't love it. You can get new stuff in your new city. I do think think the storage/temporary sublet could be a solution for you, but not if you're looking to save money. Convenient, yes, but cheap, no.
I don't own any thing that isn't essential except for two sofas and a computer desk which I plan on hiring someone to move to the curb for me. The things I do have which are not irreplaceable would cost much more money to replace than move presuming a full service mover is somewhere reasonably in the ballpark of a do it yourself Penske truck plus gas. Many of my items are rare or handmade. And even for things like the desks I would have to hire someone to deliver replacements for me plus buy all new stuff.
Again, I will not even be able to pack the books myself so it's either going to have to be a full service mover or hiring movers on each end. I know that the moving companies charge way more than normal storage fees so I would have the stuff delivered and unloaded to a regular storage unit. And then have to hire another set of movers to get the stuff out of there and into my new place once I find it. But this still sounds cheaper to me than flying out and back, renting a car, renting a motel for a week and just hoping I find what I'm looking for in that time and then proceeding with having everything packed/delivered to the new address and driving out on my own with the cat.
I, also, need to be able to use my landlord for a reference and if I were to give notice, fly out, not find what I need in that time, I'd still have to proceed with the other plan.
In terms of logistics, how am I supposed to clean the place after the movers take everything away and still get on the road at a decent hour? My bed will be gone and the sofas gone and my body is a mess so sleeping on the floor overnight doesn't sound great, but is that the way people usually do this?
[quote]Sorry, I still do not get it. When you brother says 'this restaurant would never make it in Seattle', what is he saying the restaurants are like in Seattle?
He meant that whatever restaurant we were in was not up to Seattle standards and would never manage to earn the patronage of Seattle's dining elite.
He seldom elaborated, but the comment usually came very early in the meal, often before the food arrived.
Seattle smells like fish.
I might get a job offer in Stamford, CT. What does DL have to say about the Stamford area?
What is interesting is that one never knows what locations they end up thriving in. A friend of mine who very happily lived in NYC 17 years moved to Phoenix and loved it. He made a great group of friends, met his now-partner, has a solid job, makes good money, and loves the weather. I also know people who have lived in Phoenix and called it "a shit hole", but not surprisingly they were people who felt pretty isolated and think Oregon weather is heaven on earth.
This is why asking other people for their opinion on a city isn't always helpful. I know there were cities that were a terrible fit for me fit other people's personalities and needs like a glove.
I deeply respect all of what you have all said on here. I am a straight woman but happened upon this awesome site. I am very liberal and my best friend is a gay man.
I have tried to join groups here but even in those groups, I have had problems getting to know people and I am very outgoing and compassionate and caring. I am a writer too, but am currently unemployed as a writer.
I am very outgoing, but as someone said above, I just tell the truth from my heart and I am very direct. There are too many experiences I have had that I have not written over the past six years I have been here, but I have to say that I find the people here to be among the most heartless, uncaring and cold people I have ever met, oh yeah, and passive aggressive whiny babies.
I am a very caring person, but grew up Italian and very direct. I am from DC. However, this is a trait that is common where I am from. It is pretty much even moreso in New York and Boston, which are cities I love more than DC.
Some days it really wears on me, like today when I was in a bookstore and a woman asked me how I was and I told her that I was treated badly by a guy in the café who started yelling at me passive aggressively when I told him they needed paper towels in the bathroom. When I went back and asked him if they had decaf drip coffee, the same paper towel guy, he said that he had never heard of decaf drip. When I told him that I did not like his service, he asked me if I had a problem, and I said it was the customer service, and that it was bad, and he physical threatened by standing over me. As a 40 year old woman, I felt threatened.
I went to the manager of the store, and a woman asked me what was wrong and I said that people in Seattle are passive aggressive. I did not say ALL people, but there was a blonde woman behind the counter who freaked out and said that they are not passive aggressive and kept butting into my conversation. Then I kept asking her if she had something she wanted to say to me and she said no, but that I need to stop talking to the woman about Seattle. But yet she was allowed o keep talking. I then talked to the Store Manager who apologized for his staff being that way b/c he said he was from the East Coast.
I am tired of these crazy Seattleites who like to justify their passive aggressive coldness by making ANYONE who is direct seem like a jerk. I am just an honest, direct person. They need to deal with it. If I was not married to a man who loves Seattle, I think I would be out of here.
Love living in LA. It's truly a 21st century cutting edge city. So much more on top of the arts than NYC.
[quote]I've lived in Boston, NYC, DC, and Chicago and I never had difficulty making friends in any of those cities.
It may not be the same if you moved to those cities today, for the first time. There has been a huge change in the last decade where people now interact with friends online instead of face to face. You don't meet as many new people since there is less meeting up with friends away from a laptop.
People here are rude and pretentious. It is almost like they lack something and need to make up for it by being an asshole.
I will never understand people who generalize the entire population of a large city.
[quote]What about San Francisco? Those I know who've lived there have all really liked it. (Though most of them have lived in and prefered NY.)
This is me. I moved out from NYC and loved SF, a magical city, but I couldn't get over how worn out everyone looked. I expected hot looking California boys, but a lot of 'em were "prairie girls" from the flyover states. NYC was fun from 18-23, LA was fun from 23-30, SF from 30-40, and now back in NYC again, but living in the 'burbs. The only reason I "prefer" NYC for entertainment and restaurants.
Grew up in the Chicago area and HATED Chicago - loved some things about it, like the housing, food - but the people are fat and unfriendly. Would NEVER go back there. I also have a love/hate thing with New York, but on balance, I don't feel I can leave. If the time comes, I will do so happily, looking forward to new and better times and places.
I do not agree with the notion that, 'wherever you go, there you are,' as if to say your hometown is always going to have the same problems, because you create your own problems, or whatever New Age-y shit that's a product of.
I've lived in a number of places, and DEFINITELY people are friendlier in some places than others. If you need that, then you will obviously be happier in friendly places; if you don't and need to fight, then you're likely to enjoy New York or Los Angeles because these are, as the MM film was titled, "Asphalt Jungles" where only the most beautiful, smart, and talented people excel.
OP, I'm in Seattle and if you let me know when you're going I'll split the car to the airport with you. The place can be incredibly frustrating.
I spent 8 years living in Berlin and loved the city, but not Germany or the Germans themselves. Came back to the States after being laid off and moved to Phoenix because my brother's family is here. Talk about culture shock.
I detest this city. I hate the sun, the relentless heat (it's fine for a month or two, but half the freaking year?), the car culture, the demographics (high % of midwestern fraus, the elderly, Mormons, 1st gen. Mexican immigrants, douchebros, and a whole lot of white trash), the endless ugly repeating suburbs full of stucco boxes and strip malls.
Yes, I knew what I was getting myself into, and never planned for it to be anything but temporary. I've been searching for my next - hopefully final - place to call home and I'm fairly set on Portland. I'm pushing 40, done partying, don't care about hipsters. But I'll take hipsters over low-IQ trash any day. I've also considered Eugene...I'm kind of tired of bigger cities, but I'm not sure if I can adjust to a smaller one. Are the Portland suburbs really so bad? Can you live in, say, Beaverton and still be car-free? I love gray skies, just need plenty of vitamin D (I avoid the sun so much here in Phoenix I need to take it anyway).
"Oh my God. I'm back. I'm home. All the time, it was... We finally really did it ... You Maniacs! You blew it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!"
We are switching to the new platform for The DataLounge this weekend. All of our mobile users have been using it for over a week and all first time users have been using it for about a month - which adds up to well over one million users. So we're ready to end this phase of the testing and move everybody to the new site. (more)
And yes, we've changed the look and some of how it operates.
Yes, we know you just *hate* it in well in advance.
Yes, we know we suck.
Yes, we are the biggest suckers that ever sucked.
But it was time for a change and with the huge shift to mobile it was long overdue. We've taken this opportunity not only to update the look but also make major changes under the hood (or "bonnet" if you're either British or pretentious or both). And we have to prepare for 2016 - a presidential election year where we can normally expect to see a 60% jump in traffic (yes, we've seen 5 presidential elections so far…Christ we're old).
The site has a bunch - nay, plethora - of new features which will make the site more usable: better search, the ability to ignore posters and threads, see link previews, to pick up a thread where you left off, spam and malware filtering and more.
If you want you can go explore and see for yourself, Click here.
And while running the tests we've noticed two interesting reactions to the new system - people are spending more time on the site and more people that come stay around longer and look at more stuff. Both good things. Yay!
Possibly we've not slain all the dragons and there will be issues that come up during the switchover. There's a help button in the lower right hand corner of the page which you can use to send us bug reports.
Please include as much information about the hardware (PC, Mac, Tablet, Phone etc), operating system (Windows, Mac OS, Android, iOS etc) and browser (Chrome, Safari, Opera, Internet Explorer etc) that you are using as possible to help us replicate and fix the problem.
Please note that complaints about colors, fonts, icons and the like are not "bugs" - they are design choices that we've made and we expect one or two cases of world-class bitching. But they won't actually cause headaches, scurvy, heart attacks, Restless Leg Syndrome, Morgellon's Disease or the vapors (but have your smelling salts at hand just in case).
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