- I haven't seen it since I was a little kid in the 70s. One moment I remember vividly was in an episode featuring an anti-gay activist who belonged to some group called Fathers Against Gay Society, to which Maude replied "Oh, the F.A.G.S.?"
I remember that line making my heart sing a little bit, knowing that someone somewhere out there was on our side. (I was just a kid, but I knew.)
- Obligatory theme song
- Mrs. Naugatuck left abruptly when she got a job in feature film starring Burt Reynolds and Dom DeLuise.
- Eldergay thread.
- I prefer the longer intro.
Sung by Wayne Brady, btw
- I found the early episodes of Maude very cold. The characters weren't likable and they all just seemed to stand around holding drinks and discussing social/political issues. (Did Carol even have a job?) But the show really seemed to hit its stride several years into the run. I remember one later season where every episode was very funny. Some of my favorites from that time period include the "Rashomon" story of Maude's broken punch bowl, Aunt Tinky's plane crash, and the one where a friend is buried wearing a brooch that Maude had loaned to her.
- This may be heresy, but I found Mrs. Naugatuck sort of annoying.
It was much more fun when Florida was around to be a sort of sly foil to Maude, and the way that Maude's extreme racial oversensitivity and determination to "liberate" Florida ended up highlighting Maude's condescenscion/ridiculousness.
With Mrs. Naugatuck, you lost all that and got somebody who, when you come down to it, was another braying loudmouth just like Maude. If anything, Mrs. Naugatuck's loud obnoxiousness makes Maude seem like more of a reasonable, sane person - whereas to me the show is at its funniest when it's satirizing Maude as an out-of-control extremist. I recognize that's a matter of individual taste, though, and that different people may feel differently about when the show was strongest.
- [R7] The first season had some great episodes but they were really trying to define the characters. Much like All In The Family. I think after those first episodes they were able to tell more character based stories.
One that sticks out for me is when Arthur suddenly gets religion, and Maude discovers it's because he is selling the church appliances. I'm not anti-faith/anti-religion, but this was VERY much like my suburban town, where the church was just another place for people who thought they had a "title" or a certain role in town to network.
- [R8] I loved Naugatuck but I get what you're saying. In the beginning Maude could be both a voice of reason AND also a parody of a certain kind of liberal.
She was actually more liberal on paper, so to speak, but as various situations came up more conservative elements of Maude came out. I thought that made her way more human and interesting.
Bea Arthur's reactions and deadpan faces were worth the price of admission alone.
- Whoops, in R9 I meant Walter, not Arthur.
- I tried watching it on AT cause I heard so much about it here. I fucking hate Maude. The character is so insufferable. How could anyone live with her? I liked the old maid. Another problem of the show is it is so fucking dated in the most tragic of eras to be dated in.
- "whereas to me the show is at its funniest when it's satirizing Maude as an out-of-control extremist"
Oh, and I should clarify that I don't just mean when when it's satirizing her politically... I'd say that the Aunt Tinky plane crash episode counts for this, too, in terms of satirizing the out-of-control bad behavior that lurks just underneath Maude's surface.
- I think this comment from the TV.com page on the Aunt Tinky episode is fairly astute:
" perfect example of the greatness of the show. displays maude as the good-hearted hypocrite that she is. she is every bit as horrible a person as archie bunker, but she has a conscience that makes her say one thing even as she is thinking another. archie gets to enjoy his rotten-ness. maude suffers for hers... until it makes a difference, then she can turn on a dime. **spoilers** in this episode she practically prays her "aunt" is dead so she can spend her insurance money on a trip to rome. with no genuine guilt to speak of. and when said aunt turns out to be alive, she sobs in sadness. but only because she can't spend the insurance money. love it!"
- Maude would vote Ron Paul if she were still around.
Ron Paul 2012
- No way, r15, Maude would be wrapped up in a quixotic quest for a primary challenger to Obama... probably going door-to-door in Tuckahoe gathering signatures for a petition to Al Gore to get into the race or something...
- Puleeeze. Maude would run for president herself!
- That's hilarious, R6.
[quote]Susan B. Anthony always out doin’ stuff, marchin’ around and holdin’ up signs.
- Had heard about the show but only very recently have I watched it. Yes, it's dated but it's funny and it's mind trip for someone who grew up with the Golden Girls to see Bea Arthur in another iconic role. A local channel shows back to back episodes of All in the Family and Maude and I enjoy them. I didn't get AitF when I was a kid in the 80's and would avoid the reruns. Now that I'm in dotage (late 30's), both AitF and Maude make a lot more sense. I get them.
- It could be a little heavy handed, but it's genius compared to most sitcoms since the early 80s. I quit watching TV for the most part then, when I went off to school. After growing up on stuff like MTM and MASH, TV since then isn't worth much of my time.
- MASH was crap, R20
- Maude was one of the smartest shows in television history. I've seen a couple of comments from people who recently caught an episode and didn't like it, but you really have to sit down and watch the show. I happen to have the entire series. I love it more than All In The Family. Bea was a pistol, and the plot lines and one-liners became infamous. It was fearless television.
- I thought only the first season was released on DVD, r22. How do you have the entire series - from diligently taping the reruns?
- I was too young to watch it at the time but I find that, like most Norman Lear shows, it works better as a social commentary and a testimony of how pop culture addressed and tried to shape the societal changes than a genuinely laugh out funny sitcom. I mean, a show like MTM or Bob Newhart Show works even today whereas humor in Maude feels very forced and constructed around heavy-handed messages which feel very much of their time.
- I'm with you [R22]. I actually think some of this is better and less dated than GG.
It's like All In The Family. Overlook some of the time-specific references and it's a really wonderful character study. But you do actually have to sit down and watch, and absorb it.
And that was the genius of Maude, that she was so flawed. She could be vindictive and mean. The episode where she and Walter aren't invited to the Harmons' dinner party is faaaabulous and has as many biting one liners as an AbFab episode.
- [R23] Antenna TV is re-running the series M-F. Antenna is on some cable systems and is also a digital channel available over the air in some cities.
A lot of them are also on YouTube.
- I was shocked to find out Rue McClanahan wasn't on it much the first season.
- I got them from tape trading via the web. I have them all on about 20 DVDs. The plot lines are dedicated to issues that are happening all over again now. It's crazy. I lent them out, saying nothing, and this was the reaction from the person who saw it as well.
I still remember in "Seinfeld" when they're all in the Hamptons. Elaine comes out in a giant hat and big outfit, and Jerry exclaims, "And then there's Maude". Always cracked me up.
Speaking of which, the Maude theme song was hilarious.
- I was shocked that they made Rue's hair gray as to match Bea's. They tried to make her look older.
- Can't find it up anywhere, but I loved the Carol Burnett parody "Broad," guest-starring Isabel Sanford as her maid, New Jersey ("The Garden State!").
I did find this, though. :)
- That's true, R29. Rue was only 36 (!) when Maude began.
- I find it very sad that none of those great socially progressive shows from the 70's would get made or be on the air in today's conservative climate.
- Does anyone watch modern network sit-coms anymore, R32? Do they even make them?
- [R32] I've been thinking that too. Instead of a Maude Findlay, we now have Kris Jenner as a fiftysomething woman, who acts like a child, dresses like a whore and wants to be her daughter's contemporary. It's fucking sad.
- Apparently some people here really don't like "30 Rock" but I absolutely love it. I hope it isn't canceled this year.
I also really liked "Better Off Ted" from a few years ago.
"Big Bang Theory" is cute but not something I'd go out of my way to watch.
But yeah, it's pretty much a desert out there.
- No one has mentioned the opportunities the show gave Maude to sing, pretty contrived though they may have been. And Bea of course sold the tunes big time.
As for current sitcoms, Community and Louie are my two favorites. It's a different world now from the Lear 70s to be sure.
And Antenna TV is nearing the end of Soap, which they've been running Sunday nights and which holds up pretty well, even if the last season is considerably weaker than the first three. Wonder if they'll start over again from the beginning.
- OP/R9, this isn't any suburban town, Tuckahoe is the NYC SUBURBS. Everything NYC is completely different than anywhere else.
Yes, I grew up there
- 30 Rock is the only sitcom I actually make a conscious effort to watch. I'll take reruns of Frasier, Roseanne, and Seinfeld over most of the sitcoms that are in production right now.
- [quote]I find it very sad that none of those great socially progressive shows from the 70's would get made or be on the air in today's conservative climate.
I find it very sad that someone as old as you doesn't know it's '70s, not 70's.
- [quote]And Antenna TV is nearing the end of Soap, which they've been running Sunday nights and which holds up pretty well, even if the last season is considerably weaker than the first three. Wonder if they'll start over again from the beginning.
When Diana Canova left "Soap" to star in "I'm a Big Girl Now" it did leave a bit of a void.
I am sure Antenna TV will re run "Soap" from the beginning once again or perhaps in time for the next season of "American Horror Story" on FX.
- Actually, [R39], 70s is considered correct. I am a writer and I use the AP Style Guide, and it is very specifically the decade in numbers, lower case s to indicate plural.
- R30 I remember that parody.
"Come Sit on Auntie Maude's lap!" Carol says to Isabel.
And Vicki as Adrienne saying "I have to go upstairs to talk to my child who no one ever sees." (the character of Phillip was always spoken of, but hardly ever shown the first year)
- [quote]And Bea of course sold the tunes big time.
First time I ever heard "Hard-hearted Hannah" was on Maude.
- One could argue that Leslie Knope on Parks & Recreation is somewhat of a successor to Maude. She'd certainly be up to knocking on doors for a political cause with Maude!
- [R43] I loved that episode. Bea sang the FUCK out of that song.
Wasn't there a 60s sitcom (Lucy, maybe?) where Carol Burnett sang the same song pre "Carol Burnett Show."
Love Carol too. She needs her own thread!
- Answered my own question.
- I agree we need A thread for Carol B....
- OK…found that number on Maude (Bea also sang it at the end of a GG episode too).
Before the number (at 7:00) there's a great exchange between Arthur and Maude about Marcus Welby and "Smut on TV":
ARTHUR: He (Marcus Welby) did a show where he treated a homosexual.
MAUDE: Really? To what?
- R41, it's '70s.
- I liked the episode where Maude is talking to a psychiatrist. It's incredibly affecting and Bea Arthur's acting is amazing.
About Carol, played by big-titted Adrienne Barbeau...what exactly did she DO, besides "date?" She was a slut, but did she have a job, a career, anything? I don't seem to remember her doing anything but jumping into bed with various types of men.
- Carol definitely worked, because there was one about her getting sexually harrassed by her boss - she was told that to get the promotion she wanted, she'd have to sleep with him, or something like that.
- Carol was given the last name Traynor, after, you guessed it, the trainer bra. She had one episode where we found out she was a salesperson and wasn't given a promotion because she was a woman. It was an interesting episode because Carol flirted with the idea that if sleeping with her boss would get her the promotion, she might as well do it.
Maude: Do you really think she won't do anything?
Walter: Of course not, she's just like you.
Maude: OH MY GOD!
- [quote]About Carol, played by big-titted Adrienne Barbeau
Yup, she was basically the T&A of the show. In the link in R45 she basically bounces her tits up and down as her contribution.
Which is a shame, since I think she could sing at the time (she was in the original Broadway company of Grease).
- R41 doesn't know how to use the AP Style Guide.
- Thank you for that link, R6, I seriously needed the laugh today!!
- I think Vivian's Party is one of my favorites.
Maude gets some SERIOUSLY bitchy lines in on this episode. LOVE. IT.
My favorite is at about 12:00.
- Part 2 of Vivian's Party.
Maude gets a few more good ones in here.
- Since we've already strayed a bit off-topic and have discussed Hard Hearted Hannah -- here's Dorothy Loudon singing the fuck out of that song on the Merv Griffin Show
- [R58] Love it!
- I was a child of the 70s and saw a few shows when it was in first run, but most of it went over my head.
I got a DVD of the first season cheap, and started watching it.
It's actually funnier than I thought it would be.
Adrienne Barbeau was (is) so beautiful. I felt sorry for her character as Maude was such a controlling mother.
Conrad Bain was funnier on Maude than he was on Diff Strokes.
Is Bill Macy, who played Walter, related to William H Macy?
- [quote] I liked the episode where Maude is talking to a psychiatrist. It's incredibly affecting and Bea Arthur's acting is amazing.
She won the EMMY for that episode.
- I love Maude. I bought the DVD of the first season when it came out, but I doubt they'll release any more of the show. It really is dated, although for those of us who grew up in the 70s I think it still resonates... at least it does for me.
One thing I never got is that Carol called Maude by her first name, at least early on in the show. Even in the 70s, that would have been very weird.
- Maude wanted Carol to call her by her first name to show that she was hip with things,
- Re: the video of Carol dancing in season 2, Adrienne must have lost a good deal of weight between seasons 1 and 2.
- "This may be heresy, but I found Mrs. Naugatuck sort of annoying."
Not heresy, I found her annoying as well. She took me out of the show.
- That other link to Dorothy Loudon doing Hard Hearted Hannah no longer works, so here's a link to another version she did.
Fucking ham, but I love her.
- Dorothy Loudon is verging on Betty Hutton territory in that clip, r66.
Bea's understated version from Maude is still the best. Not that anyone should ever accuse Bea of being understated, but compared to Loudon's version, yeesh.
- The episode where Vivian attends her first funeral with Maude is still one of the funniest sitcom episodes I've ever seen.
"Oh, Maude, she looks so peacful."
"She should. She's wearing your broach."
OK, you have to see it to understand.
- I remember watching it as an early teen; and now I'm watching it and I'm the same age as Bea Arthur was on the show.
- It's funny how, in contrast to "The Golden Girls" where one of the show's biggest sources of humor was Dorothy's unattractiveness, inability to get a date, the way she repelled men, etc.... Maude seems not to have a doubt in the world that she is gorgeous and desired by the men she comes in contact with. And it's especially funny since, due to the major weight loss, Bea actually looked better and less truck driver-ish on "Golden Girls" than she did on "Maude".
- Re-watching for the first time, I had never noticed how much Bea Arthur and Bill Macy SHOUTED!!!!
- What did Bea look like in her 20s?
- Yeah, the psychiatrist episode is amazing. Twenty minute monologue. Bea deserved the Emmy.
I just caught up on these from the retro TV station and yes as R71 said, there always seemed to be shouting.
R70 I like Maude better than GG for that reason - and I thought that outside of her messy nest of a hairdo, Maude was more attractive. Anyone could have played Dorothy, but only Bea could have played Maude.
- R73 - You're right. Very few people could have pulled off Maude.
- I liked the way Florida Evans explains how she got her name. It could have been Sunkist Evans.
- There's one episode where Maude has a party for a "black radical". she does not tell the guests that it is a fund raising party. Also, she has Florida as a guest (under a different name) because all of the other guest are lily white. To top it all of, Maude's tanked on Valium and several glasses of scotch.
- If they were to reboot Maude, Candice Bergen could do it.
- There was one episode that had Maude demonstrating how to sing like Streisand that was killer.
- If they reboot Maude, it should star Sigourney Weaver.
- Did anyone else think Bill Macy was sexy?
- Vivian's first funeral is the best of all the episodes.
But goddamn, has there ever been so much yelling and screaming on a sitcom before or since? There were massive fights in every episode. Sometimes I wonder why Walter didn't shoot her.
- Sigourney is a wonderful actress and has the height, but I think Candice has the attitude more.
- The best episode was in the last season when the bedroom is all dark and you hear Maude say to Walter,
"Come to bed."
Then you see Walter flick on the light Maude says "Don't turn on the light," while Walter's face turns white and he screams, "Oh no, you have a yahoo, not a wee-ha"
- r82, Candace and Sigourney are great, but neither have the razor sharp coming timing or unique sound like Bea Arthur. She was a true, inimitable original.
- Why did Maude always wear a scarf around her neck.
[quote]Maude wanted Carol to call her by her first name to show that she was hip with things
That only worked for Bess
- [quote]What did Bea look like in her 20s?
Walter Brennan as Grandpa McCoy.
- Here's Bea in her early 20's during WWII. She was a handsome lady.
- Kathleen Turner would make a good Maude.
- Yeah, Kathleen would have.
- Here's a good one of Maude and Carol arguing. Begins with Florida singing
- Maude got an abortion. Imagine having that happen in a sitcom today without screaming and nervous collapse from the Religious Right.
(Rue McClanahan has a huge head of gray hair in this episode.)
- That's a pioneering episode, R91. I love that it's Carol pushing Maude not to have the baby ("you're too old, Mom").
- I have the DVD of season 1 and it is really really dated.
- R93 - some of it dated (the show is 40 years old), but some of the episodes aren't. The one with Maude finding out she's pregnant at 47 isn't dated. The one with Maude reuniting with a classmate who is now a VP with Avon could be tweaked to be less dated.
- There is one episode where she is inviting a black activist to a fund-raiser and she is begging the doctor for a Mill-town
- R95 - she's totally tranked at the end. This is the one where she has to have Florida as a guest (under a different name) because there are no other black people at the party.
- Maude and Walter explain to their grandson why he has to go to church and they don't.
- [quote]she was basically the T&A of the show. In the link in [R45] she basically bounces her tits up and down as her contribution. Which is a shame, since I think she could sing at the time
Sadly, she couldn't act. She just slinks in, bounces her tits, bats her eyes, and sashays out again.
- Really disagree R98 - Adrienne could hold up against Bea very well. Though she was making a transition from stage to TV acting at the time, she was quite good even in the first season.
- [quote]I was shocked that they made Rue's hair gray as to match Bea's. They tried to make her look older.
Not at all. It was actually 'frosted' hair and it was very chic in the early to mid 1970s.
- [quote]she was quite good even in the first season.
"Quite good" isn't good enough when you're surrounded by those who range from very good to great. It's like saying your PB&J sammich is quite good on Thanksgiving while everyone else is enjoying a feast.
- R101 - She wasn't nearly as bad as some are making her out to be, and she definitively improved with time.
- just watched two very funny, well written and acted eps. Barbara Rush as her college friend who's turned out pretty and very successful and the one where Maude tries to get arrested for pot. Great series, they don't make 'em like this anymore.
- the episodes called "Guilt Trip" and "Desperate Hours" are two of the funniest sitcom episodes i've ever seen in my life. Maybe a bit dated but both a hoot. They're on youtube. hihgly recommended.
- The episode where Maude gets a speeding ticket is one of the funniest in the first season.
- R105 - with the baby face cop, yes!
- Adrienne Barbeau was excruciating on Maude. Her voice was so shrill and overemphatic (or maybe I was just used to Miss Bea's gutteral roars.) Her acting was majorly annoying and I NEVER got her alleged attractiveness. I would think only folks who adore huge tits would see anything there to admire. Her face certainly wasn't at all pretty.
- The only one I ever liked on the whole show was the old lady maid. The few times I watched it I just wanted to punch loud ass Maude in the throat. Imagine living with someone like that?
- [quote] Tuckahoe is the NYC SUBURBS
There are at least two Tuckahoes in NY state.
- I haven't seen it in years, but the episode in which Maud sees the UFO was one of the wackiest and wittiest as I remember.
- Adrienne Barbeau wasn't terrible. No worse than Sally Struthers IMO. Problem was that Carol became increasingly irrelevant, especially after Rue became a regular. In the final season or two, she didn't appear regularly, and her name only appeared in the opening credits of the episodes in which she appeared.
- R111 - and ironically, she was a better TV actor by then.
- R12 nails it. "TV actor." In season one, Barbeau and the rest were still projecting to the back row of a theater and it wasn't necessary.
- Only Adrienne and Bill Macy left of the original cast with the passing of Bain.
- Best Maude clip ever.
- R115 - That's a spoof.
- Remember when Maude invited Vivian over and she showed up and wanted to do a three way with Walter?
- I remember that episode, r117. Bea looked fierce in her latex domme outfit.
- R117, that's not too far off a real episode. Maude and Walter show up unexpectedly at Vivian's house and she opens the door, flips open her raincoat and she's nude underneath. She later explains that she was wrapped in Saran Wrap because she and Arthur like to play "leftovers." Joan Rivers later stole this joke for her act.
My favorite episode is where Walter has a dream in which he kisses Arthur and he fears he's gay because of it.
- "After hearing a man's voice in the night, Maude accuses Carol of having a man spend the night. However, she soon discovers, Mrs. Naugatuck is the culprit when Walter and her discover a naked man hiding in Mrs. Naugatuck's closet. Soon Mrs. Naugatuck begins demanding privacy in what is her home too."
- I hated Mrs. Naugatuck. I didn't find her character credible in the least.
- [quote]I found the early episodes of Maude very cold. The characters weren't likable and they all just seemed to stand around holding drinks and discussing social/political issues. (Did Carol even have a job?)
In the first year Carol had a job in at least one episode. I think another episode had her on a job interview. No matter what, all her scenes came to a grinding halt as she recited the lines she had memorized. Worst actor ever.
- Any idea if/when season 2 will be released?
- Season 1 is dated and that's what makes it so much fun. It's like "Gone With The Wind" is dated. Should GWTW include cellphones and car chases?
The Presidential election in the first season is really a great episode. Arthur comes storming over because Maude pasted a McGovern bumper sticker over his Nixon sticker.
All the arguments they were making defending their candidates could match the pre-election insults at DL from last year. It was a demo of how history repeats itself.
- Is the first season that much more dated than the others? If so, why?
- What was the deal with Arthur and Vivian's house? The set used for their living room/den(?) defies description.
- I loved Maude but some of the episodes were actually quite depressing. I remember episodes where Walter tried to kill himself and another where Maude was treated for manic depression. I know Norman Lear liked getting these issues on air but sometimes it was a bit too serious. Bea was amazing though.
- [quote]Is the first season that much more dated than the others? If so, why?
All the seasons are dated. 70s cars, no Homeland Security, a white president, no internet, no cellphones, small televisions, no DVD players. Arthur's wellness center was called a medical center. It's all so 70s!
- As much as I adore Bea, I always found the characters so shrill and unlikeable. And all that screaming! I find All in the Family so much more watchable, even though they shared the same basic template, because there was a humanity to the characters and a certain amount of warmth, even amid all the conflict, both of which I never witnessed with Maude.
- The gay episode
- we loves the gays
- Maude was the only TV show I ever watched from the audience while it was being taped. There was the living room set and I couldn't believe it was just walls. Some guy came out and took questions. I noticed that the plants were fake. They looked real on TV. I raised my hand and told the guy that Maude would NEVER have plastic plants. He looked around, looked back, and said "well, apparently she does."
- R126 - yes, but R124 seemed to imply that season 1 was especially dated.
- The gay bar episode is on this week.
It's sad that Bea is more cemented as Dorothy than Maude. Maude was a revolutionary tv character.
"Maude" shits all over "The Golden Girls".
- [quote]"Maude" shits all over "The Golden Girls".
That would make for one strange fetish video.
- I'm reading Adrienne's biography. She speaks highly of both Bea and Conrad. She said she didn't feel comfortable till the second season.
- [quote]She said she didn't feel comfortable till the second season.
It's no wonder when you see her total lack of all acting skills throughout the first season.
- [quote]Maude was the only TV show I ever watched from the audience while it was being taped. There was the living room set and I couldn't believe it was just walls. Some guy came out and took questions. I noticed that the plants were fake. They looked real on TV. I raised my hand and told the guy that Maude would NEVER have plastic plants. He looked around, looked back, and said "well, apparently she does."
I'm surprised he didn't invite you up on the set to demonstrate your pencil-dialing skills on Maude's prop phone.
- Has anyone else seen this interview Bea Arthur did talking about Maude? From about the 15 minute mark she talks about all the co-stars. High praises Bill Macy, Rue McClanahan, Conrad Bain and Hermoine Baddeley but not so much Adrienne Barbeau or Esther Rolle...
- "I tried watching it on AT cause I heard so much about it here. I fucking hate Maude. The character is so insufferable. How could anyone live with her?"
The same could be said of Archie Bunker. And George Jefferson. And Fred Sanford. They were ALL insufferable in their own ways. That's because they were the main characters in a sitcom. There HAS to be conflict and discord in a sitcom in order for it to be funny. The character's in Norman Lear's sitcoms took it to and extreme, though. And if you think the screaming on Maude was bad, you should watch "One Day At A Time." I think TV Guide said that ODAAT was the loudest show on television.
- R137 - It wasn't that Adrienne lacked skill then. It was that she wasn't being used well, and that she was very self conscious. You can also see that she slimmed down in season 2.
- It always bugged me that the exterior of Maude's house shown in the opening credits did not physically match the interior door or the set...the same was true of the Bunker's house. And the Brady's house, and the Three's Company apartment. Is it so hard to find a house exterior shot that matches the set, or just make the set match the exterior?
- In r139's clip:
"I'm Esther Rolle. I don't do windows and I don't do comedy."
- R143 Florida passes.
- Bill Macy has been interviewed on YouTube recently and says Maude ended because Bea's husband went off with a younger woman and Bea was so devastated she didnt want to keep going otherwise they could have had more seasons
- Thanks R145
- I've been watching one of those retro tv channels that show sitcoms like Maude, All In The Family, Good Times, etc. They're good for a few laughs, but aren't nearly as good as I remembered. In fact, they're frequently unbearable. The characters are so awful: stupid, arrogant, obstinate, annoying. They're not funny, they're horrible, especially Archie Bunker. I saw an episode where Archie buys his baby grandson a realistic looking toy GUN for his birthday. Mike and Gloria have bought him a doll, which Archie quickly destroys by pulling off its head. At their dismay, he suggests that they give the doll to some poor needy "fruit" or "fruity" kid. I didn't find any of that funny, in fact I thought it was absolutely revolting.
- R147 It *was* intense subject matter and it doesn't always end in hugs and high fives.
I know I was surprised when I saw Maude again how much they all yell at each other.
- [quote]It always bugged me that the exterior of Maude's house shown in the opening credits
The opening credits are a drive from Manhattan out to Maude's house in the suburbs shot on location in N.Y. But when Maude's house is finally arrived at it is definitely a house they found in L.A. that looked "east coast" - there's a palm tree sticking out around the side.
- [quote]I've been watching one of those retro tv channels that show sitcoms like Maude, All In The Family, Good Times, etc. They're good for a few laughs, but aren't nearly as good as I remembered. In fact, they're frequently unbearable. The characters are so awful: stupid, arrogant, obstinate, annoying. ...
As opposed to many of the characters on today's sitcoms?
- R150 is right.
- Carol's ex returns.
- Bump for this 3.5 minute version of the Maude theme by Sammy Davis Jr. In 1977 Sammy did an album called Sammy David Jr Sings the Great TV Themes and this Maude has mentions for Annie Oakley and Queen Elizabeth among others. Groovy!
"Go ahead Maude! Do you're thing baby!"
- Maude hasn't aged as well as GG--but it still can be fun. Bea's timing is as always amazing. And it was especially fun, if a stretch for the character, when she got to sing.
- I didn't like Rue on the show at all.
She really was born to play Blanche - she was the best actress on that show, but ive never cared for her in anything else.
But the hardest thing to swallow had to have been buying both Bea and Bill Macy as WASPs. At least for GG she got to graduate to Italian.
- Adrienne improved a lot over the run, both in her ability to play TV and in her looks.
- R155 - God will get you for that.
- Bea was amazing but damn, she could be a cold bitch. That American TV Institute interview showed it in spades.
- I think they Maude should have kept the baby.
She would actually have had something to do all day besides screaming and patronizing the help.
Later on she went into politics and it seemed very forced. The show died a merciful death.
They trivialized subjects like suicide and depression without any follow up.
Maude and Walter were arguably the least attractive couple in the history of TV.
Thanks to whoever posted the great Sammy link.
- I know the Lear shows are much louder and abrasive than we're used to now. But I'd take an episode of Maude, with its yelling, over the saccharine overdose of the Golden Girls any day.
I loved that Maude was exaggerated. She was the flip side of Archie Bunker. Lear was a liberal, but to his credit he poked as many holes in Maude Findlay as he did in Archie Bunker, and showed them both as human and imperfect.
- I LOVED Carol Burnett take-off of the show calling it BROAD
- Vivians First Funeral is my favorite episode. Season 5 Episode 1. So many funny moments. The funeral home is "Mcdonalds" and the owner is named Ronald! When Maude tries to retrieve the brooch and discovers the coffin lid closed, I lose my shit when she knocks on the lid. The background music is a Musak version of the "The Girl From Ipanema"
- Vivian's Party is hysterical at the end. Very funny.
- How times change. The Maude abortion episode kept emphasizing Maude and Walter were much too old to be parents. And it was true. Maude was what, in her forties? And looked older than that. I don't know how old Walter was supposed to be, but he looked at least in his early fifties. But today it's considered no big deal for a woman in her forties or fifties or OLDER to have a baby. I think it's gross and selfish and unnatural for anyone to want to be a parent at that age, but it's not looked upon as a bad idea these days. But it is! Maude and Walter did the right thing.
- no they didn't. They murdered their child because it was inconvenient.
- I eat piles and piles of shit.
- No problem R159 Credit goes to the guy who made it into an MP3 for Youtube. As he says himself he must be one of the few people who owns it.
R161 I never saw it but there is 1 minute of it here on Youtube. Even from the 10 seconds Carol is in the clip I can tell it would have been great.
- The "Broad" skit is great. Isabel Sanford guest-stars as "domestic engineer" New Jersey, who comes in for a job interview and lists all the chores she doesn't do. Broad slops white liberal guilt all over her, even sitting New Jersey on her knee and talking baby talk to her.
- I tried watching this too after hearing so much about
Not being from that era, I don't get All in the Family or Maude. Some good acting sometimes, esp. Bea/Jean/Carroll, but these shows don't seem funny to me, seem more forced, and too much is really outdated.
You can watch the GG not being from that era and it is funnier.
I did like both maids when I tried watching it, esp. Mrs. Naugatuck. My Grandma told me she and Bea did not click personally and that is why she was written out.
- Maude's repeats/shouts the other charachter's names incessantly while talking to them.
Anybody else notice this?
- I want to see all of the BROAD sketch!
- Who was "Isadora the first bra burner?"
- If only there was a page that you could search that and find the answer, R172.
- Did Maude invent the coffee cake hair look?
- "The guilt trip", the one where Maude's aunt Tinkie "dies" in a plane crash is one of the most hilarious 30 minutes ever to be broadcast on tv. it's on Youtube, watch it!
- I second R175. Rue is hilarious in this one.
- Not to derail the thread, but in reply to R175, this ten minute clip of All in the Family is the funniest thing ever put on TV. Lionel's Engagement.
- R164 - Maude was 47 in the first season. Walter was the same age or maybe slightly older, I think Carol was 27, which meant that she had her son when she was 18 or 19.
- Just watching this episode of Maude on Youtube. Maude is trying to get marijuana and at about 12:05 in this video it arrives and she says "Florida, there a pot fairy after all". The audience laugh then it cuts to Florida saying "Pot fairy? The kid looked normal to me...."
Am I right in thinking she's implying he didn't look gay? The way the little scene of Florida saying this sounds different and almost silent, as if it was edited in later?
- Norman Lear was as subtle as a bulldozer, and he crammed his social issues into all of his shows.
- Most sitcoms did back then. His were the most memorable.
- I loved most of his stuff. He really captured a reality that hadn't been captured before on TV.
- Agreed, R175. "Maude's Guilt Trip" is one of the top 10 best sitcom episodes of all time.
Often Maude is remembered in the context of its issue-oriented, political storylines -- Maude's abortion, the gay bar episode, Walter's alcoholism and suicide attempt, numerous race-related storylines -- but people forget that at least half of the episodes were just smart and funny storytelling, like "Maude's Guilt Trip" and "Vivian's First Funeral". And the reprehensible behavior of the four leads rivals and sometimes exceeds that of the four leads of Seinfeld, the show which is typically credited with being the first to be based around a group of unlikable people. But Maude did it first.
- I love this thread! Super-Thanks to every DL Poster!
- Is "Maude" the only sitcom in tv history in which one of the main characters tried to kill himself? i don't think such a plot has ever been used before or after. Even contemporary "edgy" cable comedies wouldn't go there, i think
- Can't think any other traditional sitcoms that did that.
- very ballsy move, can't believe the network allowed that. Maybe the were all high
- Drama shows have had it. Carrie flirted with suicide attempts on Homeland. I think another show did it.
I am not sure, but I think Sherilyn Fenn's character on Rude Awakenings considered suicide.
- R185 I seem to remember an episode of Cheers in which Frasier was going to kill himself but was played more for laughs (or not as serious as Walter's attempt in Maude at least)
The only other one I can think of is Homer in The Simpsons. Not a sitcom perhaps, but a comedy. It was a Season 1 episode. Homer lost his job and said the family would be better off without him and was going to commit suicide. I saw it again recently for the first time in years and it was quite jarring how seriously it was played. Nothing like The Simpsons of today.
I do think Maude pushed the envelope further then even All In The Family. It's telling that we can't think of many other instances 40 years later, even as you say in the edgier cable comedies.
- the fact is that in "Maude" Walter actually took the pills, it was not just a thought: they found him unconscious in his bed.
- The Maude Carol relationship was unusual and daring for the time.
- Maude's visit to a psychic was funny.
- One has to hand it to the departed Bea Arthur, on the "Golden Girls" she acted like she really liked Betty White..quite the opposite.
- Desperate Hosewives had a character blow her brains out in the first 3 minutes.
- Yes, r193, especially when she would hit her on the head with a newspaper!
- R170 - Yes.
- R194, Desperate Housewives is not a sitcom, it's a dramedy. so that suicide doesn't count
- [quote]One thing I never got is that Carol called Maude by her first name, at least early on in the show. Even in the 70s, that would have been very weird.
I called my mother by her first name starting in the late 70s. Not sure how or when it started, but my two older brothers did it first, then I followed suit.
- Did you know that in the 80s "Maude" was remade for french tv?
here's the credits, it was called "Maguy"
- Mad Men has had a couple suicides.
- holy christ, we are talking SITCOM suicides! Of course dramas and dramedy dealt with suicides!
- If I were Walter I would have committed suicide too. COULD YOU IMAGINE LIVING WITH SOMEONE LIKE MAUDE? IT WOULD BE LIKE THE LOUDEST HOUSE IN HISTORY. Jesus fucking Christ. There was not a likeable thing about her. The only funny one on the entire run of the show was the old maid. Just fucking looking at Conrad Bain is depressing.
- [quote]COULD YOU IMAGINE LIVING WITH SOMEONE LIKE MAUDE?
- [quote] COULD YOU IMAGINE LIVING WITH SOMEONE LIKE MAUDE?
An overbearing liberal cunt?
- Walter's problem
"You used my toothbrush too!"
- And Maude's facelift
- [quote]"You used my toothbrush too!"
- They had really good writers.
- I'm watching season 1 on DVD right now, and it holds up pretty well. Where's the rest of it?
- Face it though. The old lady maid was the funniest one. Why did they get rid of her? That third maid was the most unfunny maid in sitcom history.
- R209 - Don't know why they have been slow the release the other seasons.
I think they actually improved after season 1.
- [quote]If I were Walter I would have committed suicide too. COULD YOU IMAGINE LIVING WITH SOMEONE LIKE MAUDE? IT WOULD BE LIKE THE LOUDEST HOUSE IN HISTORY.
But remember, Bea Arthur also had the largest dick in history, so it would be worth it.
- [quote]I think they actually improved after season 1.
Many older shows are at a disadvantage on DVD for this reason. Without the benefit of reruns, many people buy the first season of a show find it doesn't hold up to their overinflated memories that were usually formed by later episodes. By that time, the cast is usually more comfortable working together and the writers have a better hold on the characters.
- Indeed. Seeing first season episodes on DVD it struck me how stagey the earliest ones were, and how much the production values, writing, blocking, and timing feel like British sitcoms of that era. Watching episodes for seasons 2 & 3 on Antenna TV for the first time, it's easy to see that the chemistry began to gel in a few episodes of the first season, but the show quickly hit its stride by season 2 with some very funny and compelling entries. Pity Florida had to split so early because Esther Rolle and Bea Arthur together made the show. Expanding Rue's character sure helped, too. LOVED the 2 part "face lift" story.
- Are they releasing season 2 on DVD?
- Does anyone know why they got rid of the old maid? The funniest thing on this sitcom? Doesn't make sense. Did they just want to bring in a colored girl? Was Bea jealous of the laughs she was getting?
- Aunt Tinkie.
- Maude was a big hit till Season 5, then the ratings tanked and Lear blamed the old lady. He fired her. Lear did not like immigrants.
- [quote]Are they releasing season 2 on DVD?
The complete series will be released on DVD March 17. If you buy it directly from Shout! you can get it a month earlier than that.
- I remember on one of Bea's biographies or intimate portraits that she called Maude and Vivian "the Lucy and Ethel Mertz of the 70s." She could be a little full of herself sometimes.
- The old maid Hermoine was in a movie with Roddy McDowell called Bullwhip Griffin..playing a maid. My nephew got the movie for Christmas because his 4th grade class is studying the book the movie is based on. Roddy was a hottie in his prime.
One of my favorite Maude episodes was the one about Aunt Tinkie 'Gucci Pucci Gucci'. I also loved the one where Viv and Maude appear on a game show 'I'm going to beat the devil!' Or maude throwing a party for a Black Panther and her only black invitee cancels 'Maude you have to have a backup black'.
The darker episodes were like one act plays. One set solely in the bedroom as Maude contemplates a hysterectomy sticks in my mind.
- [quote]One of my favorite Maude episodes was the one about Aunt Tinkie 'Gucci Pucci Gucci'.
This one is called "Maude's Guilt Trip" and I think it's the best episode of the entire series.
Another real standout is "Vivian's First Funeral".
- The original Phillip left the show because Adrienne Barbeau kept exposing herself to him and his mother didn't like that.
- Conrad Bain has a twin brother who's name is Boner.
- Whose idea was it to cast Conrad Bain in , well, in anything?
- Mrs Naugatuck hated the other famous Hermione.
- For any of your girls who like to read, Adrienne wrote two pretty good vampire novels a few years ago.
Bea and Hermione are old theatrical troopers--amazingly talented. But Maude does look really dated, there is too much yelling, and way too much politics.
I met Bea when she toured with her stories and singing act with the pianist. What a warm, modest, charming woman--truly an American treasure.
Yes, I thought there was something middle aged daddy sexy about Walter.
Never liked Vivian's husband, who always seemed very gay/fey.
- Adrienne's autobiography is also pretty good.
- Walter...sexy daddy...Bill Macy had a surprisingly good body for a man in his fifties, Definitely a younger looking body than his face would lead viewers to believe, and at a time when most men didn't work out.
He also appeared in "Oh, Calcutta!", so he must have always looked somewhat naturally fit.
- [R223] are you making that up? Or are you confusing the story with that of Brett Butler?
- Didn't Bill Macy ruin his career by getting supremely drunk at an awards show (for Norman Lear!) and spewing forth an obscenity-laden rant/joke?
About what I do not know, but I remember Macy apologizing with a "do you know what contrition is?" speech.
Too late, Bill
- Bill Macy mooned the audience.
- I wonder if his ass was as fit at the rest of him...
- Lear did not like Mrs Naugatuck and wrote her out. I remember Hermione being terribly upset as Bea was supposedly her best friend, and Bea told her, "too bad, go do something else."
He probably misremembered it. HEY I'TS A LEGITIMATE REASON
- The second Phillip was horrible. How about the time when the fake Phil had a date with the fake Edina from "The Odd Couple"? But she only liked him because Phillip was impotent and some Duke University student had date raped her prior.
- LOL—wish someone would post the whole sketch, though:
- Why? From the little I saw it wasn't funny. And why does Vicki laugh at lines that aren't funny?
- They went through Phillips like Mad Men goes through Bobbys.
- Fun blooper: Watching the one where Viv and Arthur have a party and Maude loans Mrs. Naugatuck to serve. As the group fight over whether or not to send her, Mrs Naugatuck climbs the staircase and her big strappy platform shoes change color from red to black and back again, as footage from two separate performances of the scene are intercut.
- Big mistake when Maude tells Arthur she loves him and Walter just smiles stupidly.
- I have only maybe ever seen 15 episodes of Maude in my life, and I swear I have never once seen an episode with Esther Rolle! Was she heavily featured?
- [quote] Many older shows are at a disadvantage on DVD for this reason. Without the benefit of reruns, many people buy the first season of a show find it doesn't hold up to their overinflated memories that were usually formed by later episodes. By that time, the cast is usually more comfortable working together and the writers have a better hold on the characters.
MTM is another example.
- You're nuts the first season of Mary Tyler Moore was classic. It went downhill each season after.
With fat sarcastic Rhoda, and naive Mary and the dictatorial Lou Grant and the wimp Murray and the one note Ted.
This was classic.
What do you have later:
Rhoda gets thin and is no longer funny
Murray stand up for himself, no longer funny
Lou Grant is afraid of Sue Ann and Phyllis, Not funny
Ted gets "feelings" and a soft spoken Georgette, who never added anything to the show.
- Nope, sorry. MTM peaked with season 4 but never jumped the shark. And your assessments of each character are off base.
And now, back to our regularly scheduled program thread...Lady Godiva was a Freedom Rider (woo hoo hoooo...)
- Too much of the first season of MTM were bland stories about Mary's romantic life.
- Nope, nothing in Season One of MTM was ever outdone by any of the other seasons.
Once Rhoda got thin, she was no longer funny.
The assesments were 100% in line. Those who disagree obviously think Ted adopting Oliver from the Brady Bunch is a "ooooh" moment and probably like squeeled every Friday at the Olsen Twins.
Lou was not funny afraid, Ted was only funny as an arrogant jerk, Rhoda was only funny when she was fat.
Phyllis never was funny but simply a bitch. That is why her show failed. You can't make a bitch funny unless you totally change the character, like they did with Vicki Lawrence's Mama. On Mama's Family, Mama was not a total bitch. In the sketches she was.
- Ohhhhh Mr. Grant.
MTM does not really hold up so well. The spinoff Lou Grant is actually better.
- Adrienne certainly got better as the series went along.
- I always hated that woman. Such a loud, obnoxious, controlling neurotic. After Lucille Ball's show "Here's Lucy" FINALLY ended in 1974, CBS put "Maude" on in Lucy's time slot she had for 20 years, ruining Monday night. I remember it well. It was so fucked up. I won't watch the reruns of it or "All in the Family" as they're both so dated and old now. They just don't hold up at all.
- I did and partly liked it. But I like All In The Family, Soap and Golden Girls more.
R250 I disagree, All In The Family is excellent and still relevant.
- The first season of MTM was its BUMPIEST.
It got better year after year after that.
Only a brain dead fucktard would think otherwise.
- R242 - She's in the early seasons.
- My old boss Maude ended up living in Florida's high density housing, like me.
- R252 tell us what you really think. Don't be shy.
- My favorite episode of Maude is one called "Vivian's First Funeral" and it involves lots of weeping over coffins and lost brooches etc.
"Oh, Maude, she looks so peaceful."
"She should be. She's wearing your brooch."
Two classic MTMs come later in the series: the Veal Prince Orloff and Chuckles Bites the Dust. Sue Ann's appearances help the later seasons come alive because her combination of acidity and fake sweetness is great.
The first appearance of Maude on All in the Family is one of their classic episodes.
- I remember the rumor at the time of the shows early years, circulating amongst the '70s housefraus, was : Maude always wears long scarves wrapped around her neck because Bea Arthur is really a post-op transsexual who constantly has to hide her male Adam's apple from the camera.
And those stupid women believed it. They even would write to the Q&A departments of various newspapers and entertainment rags demanding to know the truth.
See? There were idiots even before the advent of the internet.
- R256 posted exactly what I would have said. Thank you.
- R256 I always loved how Carroll O'Connor would pronounce Maude: "Mawwwwde."
If you heard it you know what I mean.
That said, I was never really a fan of the show. Too ham fisted and Norman Lear-ish for me and the only show I felt could get away with that on a regular basis was AITF (and that was largely due to the appeal and brilliance of O'Connor).
But the theme song does rule.
- Nearly every Norman Lear show had a kickass theme song. Even "Those Were the Days" is a great little song, though nothing like the openers for Maude, The Jeffersons, Good Times, and One Day at a Time.
Even when all the screaming made me want to tune out, the songs kept me coming back every week.
- R260 and Diffrent Strokes and The Facts of Life - which I actually never knew were Lear til I came on here.
I actually never really cared for the Good Times theme - or the show for that matter.
The Jeffersons will always be the best theme song ever. Sometimes I would just tune in forthe theme song and switch channels.
- I loved the theme for Good Times as much as the others. It's soulful and scorching. And it has woefully mistranslated lyrics, thanks to current owners Sony, who couldn't give a shit less.
As a kid, I even loved the show, until they allowed J.J. to take over, and they lost John Amos.
- R262 yes Lear produced both DS and FOL through his production company Embassy and came up with the concept of both shows and was a very "hands on" producer during the early years of DS and Facts
Al Burton, who worked on AITF, GT, ODAAT, DS, and Facts said that Lear made more money off of Facts ($30 million pocketed for himself) than any of his other shows except for AITF, as Facts always did really well in syndication
Maude not so much
- I got the complete series on DVD today!
- How much R264?
- 100 bucks at Amazon.
- Watching some Maude on the new DVDs that were released. The performances are all excellent, but some of the episodes are actually more depressing than anything I've ever seen in a sitcom. Was surprised to read on IMDB Bill Macy never even got a single Emmy nomination. He was deserving of an Emmy win for some of those episodes dealing with his alcoholism and the two hander episodes with Bea Arthur.
Bea as Maude was flawless. The character could grate at times but talk about range and timing. Best female performance in a comedy in the 70s for me, although Mary Tyler Moore and Jean Stapleton scooped up the Emmys.
- All Maude did was yell. There wasn't a single nuanced thing about the character. She was predictable from start to finish.
- Bill Macy (Walter) is 93 today!
- Overall, a very good show but geesh those outfits Bea Arthur wore on the show are almost frightening!
A few episodes I remember:
Vivian gets a face lift and Maude contemplates about getting one.
A friend of Arthur's who may have been a doctor is operated on by Arthur and dies (Michael Keaton plays I think a reporter??)
A friend of Maude's who is an author and gay(Robert Mandan of Soap) does not get along with Walter but Maude says something at the end of the show referring to him being gay which was not nice (which made Maude not always so liberal about her views)
Her daughter Carol is going out with a guy who is 21 and she is 31
Her grandson wants some alone time with a girl from school (I think they are 14 years old and Maude goes nuts-very funny!)
And happy birthday to Bill Macy!
- The one bit I remember was when they were deciding where to eat out...Maude says "What do you say we go get some chink?"
- Happy birthday Bill!
- Florida Dubonnet