- If sounding like you're singing through a never-ending sinus infection makes you the "queen of pop", then more power to her.
I like some of her stuff but find it sad that this is what's become the height of top 40 music.
- Yet she hasn't had a #1 album in the USA.
- Pop music has officially died.
- If the duck-voiced Rihanna can be this successful, then I agree, music has officially died.
- r1 is referring to Britney Spears. Rihanna's the one with the tan, hon.
- As a grizzled queen, I welcome her and her rooster hairdos to my iPhone and patiently wait for the celebrity rehab season featuring Chris Brown.
- downloads of singles mean nothing. The industry has changed...,nothing rihanna done has been anywhere close to as culturally influential as Janet/Madonna/Mariah in the 80s and 90s (and I don't even LIKE those women).
The internet has skewed everything. That video of Chris Crocker blinking has over 18 million views. It's Fred has over 845 MILLION views.
- And other than that dumb "Umbrella" song, I couldn't identify a single one of them.
- Rihanna is the most manufactured artist out there. Any pretty girl with a decent voice and decent performance skills who had the same packaging team would end up with the same career.
She may have beaten Madonna's and Janet's records, but she will never be the same caliber of artist as Madonna or Janet or Mariah. She is not even Britney.
Does she write any of her songs? Does she have any creative control over her music? Her image?
She is not the artist, her packaging team are the real artists. She is just a brand.
- What's the name of the single?
- now if they would only stop playing her "Happy Birthday" ad...she sucks!!
- She sings flat and the producers tack on the same stock vibrato at the end of a line.
I can't name any of her songs.
I think her whole manufactured 'relationship' with Chris Brown was to get her some cheap sympathy publicity (looks like that worked) and to quell the gay rumors about Brown (word is still out on that one).
- I love this bitch. Her twitter is hilarious and will make you love her.
- Mariah and Janet are/ were culturally relevant? Oh vey, oh vey.
- Janet was competing with Madonna, Mariah was trying to be Whitney.
- Actually, Madonna has 12 #1 Hot 100 singles. Mariah has 18. Even when Rihanna does surpass Madonna (and she will soon) she'll never have the cultural impact or longevity of the Queen of Pop. For example, Madonna has 37 Hot 100 top 10 hits, the most of any artist. Elvis has 36. Janet and Mariah have 27. Rihanna has 17.
Rihanna's benefiting from Billboard's change to their Hot 100 formula and the weight they give to digital singles sales. It's a different era and it was a lot harder for artists to earn their hits in the past.
- There's still payola, it's just not staight up cash anymore.
Read this NPR article about how a Rihanna (and other pop singers) singles becomes hits. They say it takes about 1 million per song.
"Treating the radio guys nice' is a very fuzzy cost. It can mean taking the program directors of major market stations to nice dinners. It can mean flying your artist in to do a free show at a station in order to generate more spots on a radio playlist.
Former program director Paul Porter, who co-founded the media watchdog group Industry Ears, says it's not that record labels pay outright for a song. They pay to establish relationships so that when they are pushing a record, they will come first."
- love her. bitch is the shit.
- Like others have said, she's nothing but a brand. They get the best songwriters and producers to turn out earworm hits and use her voice and image to sell them. If she is the future of pop, it won't be long until they have the technology to digitally create a pop star and then they won't even have to
- [quote]Rihanna is the most manufactured artist out there. Any pretty girl with a decent voice and decent performance skills who had the same packaging team would end up with the same career.
Exactly. And she has the nerve to refer to herself as a 'rockstar' (sic). Bitch wishes.
If pop music doesn't take a turn sometime in the foreseeable future and get back to being more organic, I really think r19 is right - we are headed for computer game-like virtual reality pop stars who exist nowhere except inside a computer. We're two-thirds there as it is.
- Stupid question, but has anyone here actually listened to her last album? It was really bloody good.
- Japan has already created a virtual pop star:
- LOL at the pretentious queens scathing about how she is manufactured and a brand. Even artists who write their own songs and play their own instruments are manufactured - presenting an ideal of themselves to the public that they want you to believe is the real them. Any musician is contrived. Why do you think Kurt Cobain shot himself? Because the image he had cultivated gave him permission to.
- That's why he shot himself?
Funny I thought it had something to do with him having a history of depression,a family history of mental illness(two of his uncles shot themselves)as well as having a dysfunctional relationship with his parents and the pressure's of fame.Oh and having a bit of a heroin problem which causes severe lows.
But what do I know?
- Oh spare me, r24. The cause of his death was narcissism - and that's a direct quote from Courtney herself, who has been VICTIMIZED by this isolating culture of being creatively autonomous.
No big surprise that she found her niche after 'selling out' in 1998's Celebrity Skin.
Fucking hipsters. How I despise them.
- R23, yes, every artist is contrived and manufactured to a degree. But look at Lady GaGa. She writes or co-writes most of her songs. Yes, she has a creative team behind her, but you have to admit that she is more than just a pawn in the whole process, unlike Rihanna.
- This shit is so insulting - calling these girls Rihanna and Britney pawns - just because they aren't cerebral and and are utilized by the unseen professionals who are actually innovating pop music.
Look at the amazing inspiration Britney has given all these fantastic music producers and video music directors, giving us benchmark standards like the album Blackout or the video Hold it Against Me - all inspired by the woman herself.
You can have your St Vincents and your Laura Marlings glorying in their ego ideals and aloof and sophisticated technique - or you can let go of your own ego in the sensory delirium and operatic showpieces of Rihanna and Britney - both being the personification of a fantastic and ever growing collaboration in sound, style and spectacle... or maybe if you're open minded you can enjoy BOTH.
- As far as Gaga goes, I think she should shut up and do what she does, which is simple pop music, without all the verbals and the egomaniacal rantings about the 'kingdom of her fans'. Girl does herself no favors and needs to take a leaf out of Brit and Rihanna's books on how to go about being a pop princess - expand your collaborative horizons and shut the fuck up.
- How can this be? I am younger and sexier than she is.
- Let's see if she can catch up with us.
- [quote]Rihanna is the most manufactured artist out there. Any pretty girl with a decent voice and decent performance skills who had the same packaging team would end up with the same career.
Pretty much. There was an article awhile ago that talked about how much it costs to get a #1 record and used Rihanna as an example The answer? $1 million.
The record company sets up a boot camp for song writers and producers to come up with material for Rihanna. They then go through the tracks to find the 'hit,' and then they have to spend a shit ton just to market it.
Rihanna pretty much has zero involvement.
- I feel bad for the kids today.
They have no idea what a pop star is. They didn't live through the pop star era that peaked in the 80's and went into attrition in the late 90's.
The music stars were the BIGGEST stars in the pop culture. Now, they're the D-listers, competing with "reality stars" for some brief mention at the end of an infotainment wrap-up.
My grandparents didn't just know who Madonna was, they knew her every transgression because they were covered on the Nightly News.
75 % of the population couldn't pick Rihanna out of a police line-up.
- And, yet, I still don't know what this 11th #1 single is.
Like somebody upthread mentioned, the only Rihanna song I know is "Umbrella," and that's actually because of the Lindbergh Palace remix.
- What is Shakira doing lately? I always thought she was a bit more authentic than the others. I do love early Brit though.
- I could probaby name about 3 songs of hers and none of those are recent. Since I mainly do not listen to Top 40 radio I'm not really exposed to her music. When I do listen to radio it seems like all I hear is Katy Perry.
Also, Rihanna is an awful stage performer and it's not just because she can't sing. She has no stage presence and always looks bored. I think she performed on one of the million music awards a while ago and she was awful. And the song wasn't memorable at all.
None of these songs are. It's all very disposable. That's why Perry, Britney, Rihanna have to have an album out every single year. If they take a break, people will forget them.
- "We Found Love", the latest #1
- Rihanna was hospitalized for "extreme exhaustion" this week. That's usually the first stop towards complete meltdown, a la Britney & Mariah circa 2001.
- Rihanna does Vogue better than Madonna:
- Y'all jus jealous
Rihanna, fingering my "CUNT" necklace as I speak
- Calm down, R27, I was one of the people calling her manufactured and I don't think the same thing about Britney (at least not anywhere to the same degree). You gave examples of Britney's influence, but what about Rihanna? You can't. Because she's just there to be the face of these songs.
Also, the video for Hold It Against Me sucked. That's no one's benchmark.
- Britney's a talentless whore puppet.
That is all.
- Weird she can't dance. She just stands there while guys swirl around her.
Proof that the industry is run by 13-yr. old black girls now.
- For r41:
- And if you believe that r43, then you also probably believe that bitch is actually in control of her money, and her life.
- You really disgust me, r44. Truly.
- R22, I'm not surprised at all about Japan being the first to create a virtual pop star. Look into the 'tarento' culture there. They've had this shit down to a science for a long time, now they've just taken it to the next level.
- Don't care how many bought-and-paid-for hits she has, I still find her music to be corny and flaky and her voice to be awful.
- [quote]Rihanna's benefiting from Billboard's change to their Hot 100 formula and the weight they give to digital singles sales. It's a different era and it was a lot harder for artists to earn their hits in the past.
This is true. The way the formulas (and technology) have changed the ranking of songs is significant. Consider that in the 80s:
- A song never debuted at No. 1. The highest debut was No. 20 ("Thriller" - Michael Jackson)
- The highest leap to No. 1 was from No. 6 ("Rapture" by Blondie)
- The fastest a song reached No. 1 was four weeks ("We Are the World" - USA for Africa)
And yet since the formulas changed for ranking songs in the mid-90s, 20 different songs have debuted at No. 1. Comparing chart records of today vs. twenty years ago is like comparing apples to oranges... or Rihanna to Madonna.
- Oops. The hightest leap was Can't Buy Me Love. 27-1. Kelly Clarkson broke it though...Even Paperback Writer leaped to #1 from # 15. I thInk Let it Be debut was #6. this was all before the changes which means more credibility.
But the biggest leap was a 74 place leapfrog from #81 to #7.
Harper Valley PTA!
- Oops I think Zbritney broke the biggest leap record, which means it was contrived;(
- Thanks R49. My results were for 80s only.
- Update with a new thread, bitches. Rihanna has 12 now, and ties Vadge for 2nd most #1 hits behind Mariah, as far as women go.
- Mariah????? Please, that cow's career is ovah! Why do you think she signed for Idol? Trying to get some relevance.
- R53 we'll see...it revived JLo's career. I think Mariah has at least 1 more hit left in her. Anyway her record is intact for a while. 18 #1 hot 100 hits...unless Rihanna gets 6 more which I suppose is possible. Still waaaaaaaay better than Vadge.
- I'm a Madonna fan but it's clear she doesn't care about her music anymore. Mariah still does. She's young enough and has enough recent hits that radio will give any new material from her a shot. If it's good she'll add to her list of number ones.
- Vadge is way past her peak. Rihanna will pass her.
- Technically, Rihanna is a beautiful girl, but can't sing for shit.
- R55 um Mariah's Triumphant comeback single didn't even chart on the Hot 100! Given her age I don't think she'll be getting a #1anytim soon. As for Madonna she has 8 #1 albums, Rihanna still has none, in fact Madonna is on trek to tie Striesand with her next album for female artists with the most #1 albums in chart history! Madonna also has more top 10 songs (38) than ANY artist in Billboard chart history and has a combined 156 #1's on the Billboard charts MORE THAN ANYBODY IN HISTORY. That's just her success in the US, her success worlwide is ridiculous and don't even make me bring up her record breaking touring numbers.
- Rihanna recently went on a tv show hosted by Andy Cohen and begged Madonna to do a duet with her, so Madonna could easily get a 13th US #1 by doing the duet thing. On the United World Charts Madonna has 21 #1 singles that's once again more #1's worldwide than anybody in music history. Mariah by comparison only has 5 #1's on the UWC further confirming that she's a local act. If Madonna does get another US #1 she'll set another record by being the oldest female artist to hit #1 in Billboard chart history, if her next album goes to #1 not only will she tie Striesand, but she'll break the record she's currently tied with with Janet for female artist with the most CONSECUTIVE #1 albums both have 5 Madonna has a good shot at getting her 6th consecutive #1 album.
- Vadge has a lot of international #1 hits because people across the world sadly like white trashy acts. It doesn't mean she's better than anyone else. It's clear her singing is awful.
Who cares about her 156 #1s? Most of those are off the dance chart. WHere it's at is the hot 100. Topping the biggest chart in USA is the best you can do. Mariah owns Vadge in that category by far and Vadge will NEVER catch Mariah.
- R 60 and Mariah will never catch Madonna for #1 albums on the Billboard charts! Or top 10 ten singles on the Billboard Hot 100 charts. Or Madonna's 27 gold, platinum or multiplatinum certified singles in the US, the most of any female. Or Madonna's album sales, cultural impact and fame. Don't even make me bring up Madonna's touring grosses which are over 1.3 BILLIOn, including the 2 top grossing tours for a female artist in history. I believe Mariah's tours haven't even grossed a combined total of 100 million. Sad. And what does race have to do with this?
- If Madonna gets 2 more #1 albums she'll have 10 #1 albums and with her 12 # 1 singles will be only the 3rd act in Billboard (and only female) chart history to have 10 or more #1 albums and singles. The other 2 are Elvis and the Beatles.
- Like it or not, Rihanna will most likely get more #1 hits. She is probably the biggest female pop/r&b singer of the late 00's/early '10's. She is smarter and more self-aware of her public image than we think and morphs with each new album release a la Madge.
I'd also argue that she will outlast Gaga, Ke$ha and Perry, her three main rivals on the chart. Gaga's 2013 release woill be pivotal to her success, since the public seems to have tired of her stunts/tweets/homages. She needs an album of pure pop that people can dance to and allegedly the new CD will be more like that.
Katy Perry needs to advance from "playful icon" stage to something more long-lasting. Again, her new CD needs to maintan the momentum of her last one in terms of hits. As for Ke$ha, her single is decent but she seems to be trying to out-Gaga with political causes (PETA) and gawdy getups (human tooth bras and glitter). She's a pretty gifted songwriter who needs to dial down the nonsense and just sing.
- Rihanna's Janet influence is clear, as is many of the other young female pop/R&B stars of today. RiRi's red hairdo from a couple of years ago was an homage to Janet's "Velvet Rope" era, and this is a quote from her:
"Janet was one of the first female pop icons that I could relate to ... She was so vibrant, she had so much energy. She still has power. I’ve seen her on stage, and she can stand there for 20 minutes and have the whole arena scream at her. You have to love Janet."
Janet--still the only artist to net 7 top 5 Hot 100 singles from a single album
- Here is the list of female artists with the most #1 singles on Billboard charts:
1. Mariah Carey-18
2. Madonna & Rihanna (tied)-12
3. Whitney Houston-11
4. Janet Jackson-10
Here are the Billboard albums list
1. Barbra Striesand-9
3. Mariah Carey, Janet Jackson & Britney Spears-6
Madonna has almost a 100% chance of tying if not surpassing Striesand for female artist with most #1 albums in Billboard history, her last FIVE studio albums have all debuted at #1, and she has 2 albums left on her Live Nation contract. Rihanna also has almost a 100% chance of eclipsing Carey for female artist with the most #1 singles in Billboard chart history, as she's rws hot right now, unfortunately she has yet to have a #1 album which is kind of odd.
- R65 Mariah has plenty of time to pass Vadge for #1 albums too and Rihanna is 6 #1 hits behind Mariah hich is a lot. I expect her to stall at 13 or 14. It doesn't matter though as Vadge is becoming more and more irrelevant in the music world except for people who go see her tours.
- Here are some Billboard chart facts. Madonna has had more top 10 singles (38) than Cher, Striesand and Tina Turner. COMBINED. In 2008 Billboard released their list, in honor of their 50th anniversary, of the top 50 most successful artists in the Billboard Hot 100 history. The Beatles were number 1 but Madonna came in at #2 despite the fact that Carey (who placed 6th) has more #1 songs than her. The reason is because many of Madonna 's record breaking 38 top 10 hits that failed to hit #1 had amazing staying power and legs on the charts, so by the time they fell off the Hot 100 they were bigger hits than many of Mariah's #1's, which Sony would reduce to a cheap prices to get high chart positions, but as soon as they put her singles to regular price, they fell hard off the charts and didn't have the staying power of Madonna's hits. For instance 4 minutes hit #3 on the Hot 100 but do to it's staying power ended up becoming a bigger hit than Touch My Body which went to #1 but fell down quickly.
- 4 minutes was 1 of Vadge's worst singles ever. The fact that it did so well says more about the public's poor taste than Vadge's credibility at making quality songs.
- Mariah's last 2 albums failed to go to #1 Madonna's last FIVE did, what part of that don't you understand? And if Madonna's irrelevant than what the fuck is Mariah? She can't even have a successful tour if her life depended on it! Let alone the record breaking tours that Madonna has. And her Triumphant single was a huge flop and didn't even chart on the Hot 100, if Madonna released a first single from an album that failed to chart on the Hot 100 the media would be RIPPING her apart. Mariah does it and nobody seems to care, I guess she's not relevant after all.
- Actually "Everbody" peaked at #107 lolz. The difference is Vadge's fans will EAT UP anything she puts out because they lack good music taste. Mariah's fans are loyal but they don't let her get away with shit. "Triumphant" was a horrible single and it deserved to fail. On the other hand "Gimme All Your Luvin' " was just as pathetic but Vadge's dumbass fanbase bought it anyway.
Same with touring-Mariah's singing ability is not as great as it used to be and her fans want to see her for her voice, so her tours haven't done as well lately. Vadge never could sing but she has so many pieces of her performance to distract from her sucky singing that her stans still rave about it. They apparently don't mind watching softcore porn from a nearly 60 year old desperate hag.
- When I heard Triumphant I didn't realize it was Mariah's own single. I thought she was only feautred in it. Either way it was a shit song. People thought she was done before We Belong Together so I wouldn't write her off so quickly.
- r66 (aka the "Vadge" troll) is completely obsessed with trashing Madonna. Get a new pastime, nutter!
- How would you queens rank the current pecking order for pop princesses? Don't include lifetime achievements, just who is the biggest, say, from five years ago to right now?
Gaga, Rihanna, Britney, Beyonce, Keisha, Katy Perry, Madge, someone else?
- R70 than how come when Striesand tours she can command up to $500 dollars a ticket and it's a huge event and sells out everywhere, hell when Whitney toured Europe a few years back she sold out and it was very successful. The sad truth is NOBODY gives a damb about Mariah, most of her early chart success was basrd on screwi g than marrying her record label boss. If she were a true icon like Madonna, Whitney and Striesand she would only tour once every couple of years and sell out and break records everywhere but that is not the case! Her last tour was a theatre tour for godsakes!
- R73 for the last 5 years, touring wise Madonna is the biggest her last 2 tours have grossed a combined total of $750 milliin! Album sales wise Adele leads the pack, she has sold nearly 35 milkion albums worldwide in the last 5 years more than any female! Singles wise Rihanna is tops in the last 5 years, she scored !more Billboard top 10 hits than any female in the last 5 years, and has also dominated the United World Charts. Oddly enough that media darling Lady Gaga hasn't dominated anything!
- R73 I think Katy Perry is #1 now, in terms of her combo of hit singles, #1 albums and her touring. Gaga and Rihanna compete for #2 at the moment. Ke$ha is quietly showing a bit of staying power which suprised me. Shitney is irrelevant and only had a few hits a few years ago because the media made the public feel sympathy for her during her comeback. She should be largely done, and is really stinking up the joint on X-Factor. Beyonce's last album bombed too but she's hard at work for her next one. Vadge is clearly behind all of them...her album this year has been a laughing stock.
Adele usurped everyone last year but she's gone back into hibernation with the baby now and I doubt her next album will be as big.
Taylor Swift is also a force to be reckoned with.
- R76 um neither Beyonce or Madonna's last albums bombed! Bey's 4 album sold 2 million, while MDNA is at 1.7 million since March, dissapointments yeah but hardly flops, especially when you anymorer nobody buys albums anymore. A floo album would be Christina Aguilera's Bionic mess which only sold 600,000 copies worlwide! Or Mariah's last studio album which also sold about 600,000 copies worlwide, about 1 /3 of Madonna's MDNA album.
- R76 Swift doesn't have global power, her success outside the US and Canada is marginal.
- I don't think it's fair to include Adele in with the pop princesses. Adele has crossed over into mainstream, big time, but she's an actual artist, not just a pop star.
- Good for her- but her music and her voice don't do a thing for me.
- R78 Taylor has had hit singles all over the globe. Sure, most haven't reached #1 but top 5 everywhere. She's quietly expanded globally.
R77 ok people bought their albums, but no one is playing their singles. That's not a good thing.
- God, again with the deluded gays on this site and their fucking queen Madonna. I know that the fact that she simply acknowledged your existence during the height of the AIDS crisis inspires your intense, undying loyalty, but give it a fucking rest and realize that 90% of the world is so far beyond caring it's not even funny.
Madonna gets dragged into EVERY SINGLE thread here about a female popstar and it's so fucking lame.
Get over her. She's certainly over you.
- [quote]Madonna gets dragged into EVERY SINGLE thread here about a female popstar and it's so fucking lame.
You said it. It is way beyond annoying.
[quote]Mariah and Janet are/ were culturally relevant? Oh vey, oh vey.
Can't speak for Mariah, but you'd have to be daft to not know that Janet's stamp is on nearly every female pop ingenue in the game today--from Britney to Rihanna and everyone else in between. Scores of them have had videos, concerts and personal styles that totally mimic what Janet's already done. Hell, even Janet's 1993 Rolling Stone cover is still being mimicked today.
- Madonna made manufactured pop artists possible. It all stared with her. She is the original manufactured princess of top 40. So thank Madonna for all the horrible shit that has come since.
Janet and MDNA had their day, and had their influences, just as they have influenced others.
Personally I find Rhianna catchy, but without talent much talent of the kind that will give her longevity. Bringing Janet or MDNA into it is boring and tired.
- [quote]It's kind of hard to argue with them since sales don't lie.
Of course they do. Slim Whitman had more #1 hits in England than the Beatles.
- Rihanna is now a bigger pop star than Vadge ever was.
- R85, Janet never gets credit for being as influential as she was, hence my above comment. Rihanna is great for what she does. Her songs are extremely catchy, and she seems to be on an upward trajectory. My mentioning how Janet helped to pave the way does not detract from that.
- You watch that terrible video of Rihanna singing in a high school beauty pageant, and you realize she never could carry a tune in a bucket. And yet she went on to become the most successful pop singer of her generation. I can't decide if it's laughable, or something to admire.
Anyway, it always surprises me to see that she has devoted gay fans.
- [quote]Anyway, it always surprises me to see that she has devoted gay fans.
How come? Every gorgeous, fabulous female singer has her share of gay fans.
- r19 What about the Ariches? They were a cartoon pop group? Even in the 1960's you didn't have to be a real person to have hit songs.
- Everything about Rihanna from her 'music' to her one dimensional image is manufactured garbage. You can accuse Madge of many things but she was/is the far more innovative and multifaceted of the two.
- R90, I don't know, I guess I've just always assumed the standards were higher. Female musicians that attract tons of gay fans tend to be great singers (Whitney, Mariah), great performers (Madonna, Janet), or a modest combo of the two (Beyonce, Gaga). And I don't consider Rihanna any of these things.
Mind you, I don't dislike Rihanna. Her music is very catchy, and I totally get why it's been so commercially successful. I just don't happen to find her all that talented or interesting.
But now that I think of it, before Rihanna I never understood why so many of my friends were obsessed with Britney. She's in the same category for me: can't sing, can't dance, no personality.
- r93, Britney used to be the best technical dancer in the game. Her gay fans only stuck around at the last album due to the audacity of how processed her vocals were - it was some futuristic shit and interesting to the ear.
She has to figure out what she's going to do though because people are not going to tolerate her non-glamourous image, amateur arm flapping that's supposed to be considered dancing and inability to sing. She has to do at least one. The last tour was a whole "Gosh ya'll, I can't believe I sold out a whole world tour without singing or dancing while looking like cow shit from Kentucky!"
If she always looked immaculate (which her huge amount of free time and $ at her disposal would allow), she'd be much better off because image counts as much as the actual music in the pop world and probably her lost talent in singing and dancing would be overlooked. However, she's either lazy or so fucked up on prescription drugs she doesn't have the wherewithal to get her act together.
- R87 that's the funniest thing I read all week? Madonna is the BIGGEST female music star that ever lived. Not just pop but all genres. She's the 4th biggest selling artist of all time as well as the highest grossing solo touring artist of all time. Rihanna is NOWHERE near her in terms of album sales, touring numbers and cultural influence. In fact Rihanna's album sales are really poor, her first six albums COMBINED sold less tgan Madonna's 1990 Greatest Hits album The Immaculate Collection. Whoever said Madonna was manufactured needs to get their head checked, Madonna is many things but manufactured isn't one of them. And the reason Madonna gets dragges into every thread is because she's the biggest, most successful and influential female artist that ever lived l, so any discussion on pop girls will include Madonna, especially if you considet everyone has mentioned Madonna as an influence. Susan Sarandon said it best the story of women in popular music can be broken down in two parts the before Madonna era and the post Madonna era.
- What was great about the 80s was that there were so many artists and genres of music - so many superstars that competed with each other like Prince and Michael Jackson. Now labels only support one or two artists at a time and actively suppress their competition by signing them and never releasing anything, but holding them hostage to their contracts. It's a shady ass business. Must be why oldies stations are so popular.
- Another great thing about the 80's superstars was that they had separate producers for the most part. Now all the top acts use the same producers. Their material is interchangeable.
- Also, part of Rihanna's success is her strategy. Namely, let's throw as much crap as we can at the wall, and then see what sticks. If Rihanna will be legendary for anything, it will be her productivity. She's even released a whole album a year for the past four years. When you have that much material floating around, it's not surprising you're going to have eleven hits in the muck.
And I'm not saying this as a Rihanna hater, I have genuinely enjoyed a lot of her songs mostly for the catchiness, but Diamonds is truly terrible. I can't believe Sia helped write that stinker, I normally love her.
- Wow, I am too lazy to real the whole thread, but has Lady Gaga even been mentioned once? That is what Rihanna has to look forward to.
I do love her music though. And I do understand that she is completely manufactured. That doesn't make me love her music any less. And I understand it is not Rihanna's music, but Rihanna INC. I don't think if you left her alone in a studio for even an hour she would know what to do besides put on the headphones and wait for her cue.
But Umbrella, Rude Boy, Hard, What's My Name, We Found Love, Where have you Been and Diamonds all of this whiny longing to them that makes them great pop songs.
Although this video proves any producer can do it.
- At least Rihanna is 2000% less obnoxious and exhausting than Lady Gaga. Rihanna also puts out way better music - who really gives a fuck if she wrote it or not.
- To the poster who said Vadge is not manufactured...HELLO? Everyone who is not a delusional Vadgestan knows it's the producers who deserve credit for making her a hit. I'm sure by now she knows some stuff about making music, but even in the early 90s when she had been around for about 10 years, articles were out about how the producers do most of the work and she just approves or disapproves something. She's not a creative music maker by any means. They play with the sounds and special effects to take away from her weak singing. Vadge, Shitney and Rihanna are all very manufactored pop stars. Producers made them who they are. These 3 are all weak singers and either don't write, or write crappily, or buy writing credits.
and Mariah is definitely influential too. Look at singers such as Christina Aguilera or Leona Lewis who clearly copy Mariah's style in their less talented ways.
- When totalling sales figures, you should keep in mind the likes of Whitney and Janet who, in their entire careers, released a very small quantity of music, usually spending years between albums, vs the likes of Rihanna, Gaga and (to a lesser extent) Mariah and Madge etc who always seem to have a record out, and most of it is, sadly, forgettable.
It was rather extreme in Whitney's case because in a career spanning 27 years, she released something like 6 or 7 albums. It
- Releasing albums slowly extends careers. Whitney released 6 or 7 albums, and the last few were flops.
- When Mariah has albums as critically acclaimed and influential as Like a Prayer or Ray of Light then we can talk. When Mariah has amazing and ground breaking concerts or some of the best most iconic music videos ever like Madonna than we can talk. Mariah is a vocalist and WAS an amazing one at that. Madonna is a performance artist, who also dances and plays instruments, something that Mariah doesn't. Both have their talents and both have also written or co-wrote many of their hits, they're just two completely different artists.
- Including her recent posthumous album, Whitney has released a total of 12 albums in her career, not 6 or 7. Rihanna however is already on her 7th album, she releases a new album every year. And yet still can't get a number 1 album!
- That Madonna loon owns this thread now.
Nothing to see here folks, move right on along...
I actually found Rihanna really enjoyable in that video.
Her facials were pretty great.
- Good for her
- R105 I've read that Rihanna is on track to debut at #1 this week with her album...
- I love her pretty visuals and great video screen presence. Congrats Rhi Rhi: The New Queen Of Pop!!!
You Go Girl!!
- [quote]And the reason Madonna gets dragges into every thread is because she's the biggest, most successful and influential female artist that ever lived
CLEARLY the insane ramblings of a Madonna-obsessed queen. Ever hear of Michael Jackson, sweetie?
- To the Madonna Loon at R104/R105, etc., sit the fuck down. When Madonna releases a video as captivating, influential and iconic as this, THEN we can talk...
- Janet Jackson will never be able to catch up to Rihanna at this point.
- She's been described as a singer who is a "one hit wonder, over and over again."
- Janet is a legend, R113. It's not about her catching up to anything. Rihanna was able to achieve what she's acheived because Janet helped to lay the groundwork.
- I have seen Rihanna LIVE and lemme tell you she can´t sing to save her own life. It´s all autotune and backup tracks. It´s actually painful to hear her singing live. That being said, I have to admit most of her songs are catchy and good for the dance floor. Isn´t what music is all about these days?
- R111 I said FEMALE pop star. R112 Like a Virgin Material Girl Papa Don't Preach Open Your Heart Like a Prayer Express Yourself Oh Father Vogue Justify My Love Bad Girl Rain Take a Bow Bedtime Story Human Nature Frozen Ray of Light Music Don't Tell Me Die Another Day American Life Hung Up
- R115 Rihanna called Madonna the "Queen of Music' and in the interview with Andy Cohen and she also said she would love to duet with her and it would be a dream come true.
- Ri Ri has turned into such a skank. It's really sad.
- R119 = Solange Knowles
- Rihanna is the annointed flavor of the Month. She is a lucky bitch and might as well enjoy the ride while she can.
- R121 she's been doing really well for the past 5 years lol...not just a month...She's the modern, much more attractive Madonna. Neither has much talent but they found great producers so all is good for them.
- Why can't the Madonna fans ever just move on? Pop music is a young person's game and that bitch is FAR from young.
Actually, she's gone way past menopuse as well.
- R118, look at R64 for what Rihanna has said about Janet, and at how she copped Janet's style from 1997.
- R123 ageism anyone?
- R122 don't know about Rihanna, but Madonna also writes and produces herself and is known for changing it up and working in collaboration with different producers for each album.
- Rhianna might have 11 number ones, none will be remembered. The music today is disposable.
- R126, don't bring that up. People here never believe it. They think she's bought all her writing credits including the ones on her first album that she made when she didn't have money.
- Rihanna is a less talented, watered down Aaliyah.
When her hair is long and to the side and she's wearing sunglasses (which seems to be her current look) she even looks like her.
- Rihanna's career is like a shark that needs to keep moving or it dies. If she doesn't keep putting out a new song every couple months and upping the ante with her sexuality the public will quickly forget about her, and she knows it.
- Every single female pop singer in the last 30 years has been compared to Madonna, and is said to be the "New" Madonna. I've grown up with Madonna and I have watched her entire career from the beginning. There will never be another Madonna. Regardless of their talent, how many singles they sell, what they look like, Madonna is a living legend. Rihanna may be a big deal for the last few years and that's all good. Madonna has been on the charts for 30 years. How do you really compare to that? I know some of the younger guys here don't quite get it, but at my age (40) Madonnas music was the soundtrack to my life, as a gay guy coming out and coming to terms with being gay. She was rebellious, we loved her. Every song, every album, was for us! Younger guys, you don't get it because you were not there. Her career is amazing. I hope this generation has a Madonna figure to dance to, as you sneak off to the gay club, picking up some new gay friends along the way, finding you way in the gay world. For me, there will never be a replacement.
- Rihanna won't replace anything, except maybe suicide.
- Rihanna does nothing for the gays. Sometimes I wonder if she's homophobic. That's another big difference between her and Madonna, and other female pop stars like Cher, Gaga and, hell, even Katy Perry. Rihanna's silence about her gay fans is very telling.
- Her singles are great, but she has yet to put out a critically acclaimed album. You cannot compare Madonna's body of work, and cultural influence on Rihanna's gazillion digital downloads.
- R134 exactly and her album sales are EXTREMELY low considering her singles success. I know nobody buys albums anymore, but you would at least think Rihanna can muster up ONE 5 million + seller worldwide. Madonna has 17 of them! Also her touring numbers, while good should be a lot better considering her singles success, she has yet to have a tour gross over $100 million. Madonna has 4 of them and that's WITHOUT adding inflation for her 80s and 90s tours.
- Mariah is the only "pop star" who can sit down and compose a song with hit potential from start to finish by herself. If Mariah wants to keep up her glamorous lifestyle, she needs to seriously consider doing more songwriting for others because her voice is almost gone and no one will see her on tour. Her lifestyle is VERY expensive and she can only sell so much crap on QVC.
- Guys this is an OLD thread...Rihanna has 12 #1 singles now, which ties her with Vadge. Time for a new thread.
- Katy Perry and Rihanna pile up tons of number 1 singles but can't really move albums.
Taylor Swift, Gaga and Adele sell many many more albums but don't have as many hit singles.
- [quote]Every single female pop singer in the last 30 years has been compared to Madonna...
Bull and Shit. And most of the time when a female pop singer is compared to Madonna(Britney in particular), they don't have much in common with her at all, save for the fact that they're a white female.
- R139 Britney and Gaga have been compared to Madonna constantly. Rihanna has gone around saying she wants to be the "black Madonna", Nicki Minaj has called heraelf "the Madonna of rap", Pink has called Madonna one of her biggest influences, and Katy Perry said in an interview with Vogue this year that Madonna "is everything to her" and she would love to work with her. Christina, JLO, Fergie, Kesha and most recently Carly Rae Jepsen have all cited Madonna as an influence and inspiration. If Madonna wanted to she have her people call up anyone of these girls and get a duet going. Hell Gaga dedicated her debut album to Madonna (which people tend to forget), and in Gagas first press release in 2008 she says she wants to revolutionalize pop music like Madonna did.
- What am I, chopped liver?
- [quote]Britney and Gaga have been compared to Madonna constantly
Yes, because of meida. The media constantly compares Britney to Madonna, which is completely bogus because she's more like Janet Jackson than Madonna. It's because she's white that they automatically make the comparison, but everything from Britney's routines to her stage shows to her videos is Janet Jackson 2.0. Her co-stars even used to call her "Little Janet" when she was on The Mickey Mouse Club.
P!nk performed on Janet Jacksons's MTV Icon special, and has talked about Janet being an influence on her. Gaga called Janet a legend (it's on Youtube), and the opening of her "Alejandro" video was likened to Janet's "Rhythm Nation". Nicki Minaj's "Your Love" video was visually likened to Janet's "Call on Me" video. Christina presented at Janet's ICON special, and has talked over the years about her Janet admiration, even utilizing Janet's choreographer Tina Landon for several of her own videos. Jennifer Lopez not only used to dance for Janet, but she also went on record saying that Janet's "Pleasure Principle" video is what made her want to get into show business. Her style of performance is clearly Janet-influenced.
TLC, Aaliyah, Beyonce, Toni Braxton, Kelly Rowland, Usher, Chris Brown, Ciara, Mya--all of these women (and men) have cited Janet as a major influence, and have had videos that are basically carbon copies of Janet videos.
As for Rihanna, well, it's been said earlier in the thread what her thoughts are on Janet.
Madonna is not the only female pop star who came to prominence in the '80s that has influenced artists of later generations.
- She absolutely cannot sing. I've seen clips where she tries without the aid of autotune and she's awful.
That said, she's great at the business of being a pop star. She makes danceable, fun music that apparently a LOT of people like,and has high energy shows. And, I doubt she's stupid enough to actually sing at concerts. She's also good at the business of being a celeb and fahionista (even if she looks ridiculous a lot of the time, she always offers something to talk about).
She completely caught me off guard. I remember early in her career her first singles and hearing about her. I didn't pay much attention at all and woke up one day and she was this HUGE star.
Not a fan, but her career kind of amazes me.
- R143...because she's manufactured and auto-tuned, like most of the music stars of today.
- Adele and Gaga have shown that when artists who actually can sing are promoted they can sell millions and millions of albums. Yet the industry keeps propping up people like Rihanna and Kesha.
- Christina's Not Myself Toninght was an homage to Madonna's excellent Express Yourself video, bot Alejandro and Bad Romance have Madonna Vogue influences throughout to the point where the media was calling it plagarism. Rihanna has also stated her S&M video is a tribute to Madonna's Human Nature vid. But you're right about Britney's performance style being more similar to Janet with the robotic dancing and all, that was before her breakdown and now she can't even do that.
Rihanna is very close to surpassing Madonna now. Her new single Stay is at #3 on the Billboard Hot 100. It went from #58 to #3 in just one week.It will be #1 in no time. Her Grammy performance gave the song a sales bump. I swear her team are marketing geniuses. Jay-Z and Roc Nation know what they are doing. Her producers, label, & management are the ones with the real talents. Ri is just their muse.
- R147 I can't stand RiHOanna, but that bitch Vadgedonna deserves to be knocked off her pedestal. After she surpasses Vadgedonna, I hope she surpasses Whoriah's record.
- The MDNA references in Alejandro were clearly tongue in cheek, and mocking the somewhat offensive stereotyping of Italian American women in pop.
- Just think about who's buying the music these days and you'll realize why crap sells.
- There's no fair comparison, really. The structure of the music industry has changed significantly, and how they calculate the top hits has changed as well.
- In line with what r151 posted, back before digital you actually had to get off your ass and go to a store to buy a single or an album, and you also had to plan that time around school, work etc. It took a bit of effort. Today you just point and click to get your music. That's going to change how many copies are sold, significantly.
- R152, This is true however it's much harder to sell a record these days. Why buy something that you can download for free online?
Rihanna's success is impressive by today's standards. She is the biggest selling digital artist of all time.
- Shhhhh r153, you're spoiling the narrative! What is this hogwash about free downloading making it much harder to sell music than it was for Madonna all those pre-Napster years? Madonna will still reign supreme even after Rihanna breaks all her records. I want it to be so and therefore will believe it to be so!
- OH! R147, stop being so witty and clever! You shame us all!
- Can someone start a new thread? Rihanna has now achieved her 13th #1 single. Unfortunately, it's her second with Emmy.
She has now passed Vadge.
Mariah of course is still far in the lead for #1 singles.
Also, both Beyonce threads have been closed.
Both Rihanna and Beyonce making big moves this week!
- Madonna who? Rihanna knocked that bitch off the #1 singles ladder.
- r156, what about us, bitch?
The Beatles (both living and dead)
- R158 we're talking about women.
The overrated Beatles won't be passed any time soon.
- What? Do women only count for you boys? except in your beds of course! hahahahahahaha!
- Vadge becoming more and more irrelevant with time. Finally. I'm sure others will pass her too.
The bigger news is not about Vadge though. It's that Rihanna has now TIED Michael Jackson with 13 #1 singles. That means she is tied for third place, behind only the Beatles (20) and Mariah (18).
Who would have thought.
- good for her, but who can name them? they're not important or era defining songs.
- Rihanna's last few solo singles haven't done so hot though. I wonder if this is her last #1, or she'll have another revival with the next album
- Rihanna > Vadge