What''s so great about Dallas?

Those people are representative of 2% of Dallas.%0D %0D If you wanted to cast a show about the real Dallas, your cast would need to be 35% Hispanic, 15% Black and 5% South Asian.

Now there is fucking Top Chef - Texas coming up.

Jojo the Dog-Faced Boy sold tickets.

I don't get it either. Why are they trying to make Texas happen? As long as it stays the backwards Republican shithole that it is, it will never "happen". This is the same state that ties people to the back of their trucks and drag them to death on the road.

Bitch, please.%0D %0D I'm no Dallas fan but not all the people are hillbillies and furthermore, that city has some of THE best looking people anywhere.

What R4 said. Shithole.

"I like my coffee like I like my men."

Dallas IS a major american city. But dear god it truly represents the worst of America...hotbed of consumerism and franchises with the most non-intellectual people I've come across in major cities. No thanks.

Don't forget Nazis like GWB and HRP live there.

[quote]This is the same state that ties people to the back of their trucks and drag them to death on the road.

That's like saying, "New York is the state that sodomizes people with toilet plungers."

Why aren't there any shows about Houston or Austin?

This is the state that convicts people of capital murder for tying a man to the back of the truck and murdering him.

What did New York do to the cops who shot Sean Bell to death on his wedding day?

Dallas is more like middle America than Houston and Austin.

R10 You don't even want to got there sweetie. ALL states have their share of crooked cops. We're talking about the quality of life overall.%0D %0D Funny that some people on here are sticking up for a state who didn't repeal it's sodomy laws until 2003.

Talking about dragging people to death behind trucks is not, "talking about the quality of life overall."

What kind of brain damage do you have, specifically?

[quote] ALL states have their share of crooked cops.

That is pretty much the point. There are people that do bad things everywhere. So to point to a specific one as condemnation is meaningless.

R10/R13/R15 You can go on and on defending Texas, but at the end of the day, it's still a backwards, homophobic shithole.

The point wasn't to defend Texas. The point was that your reasoning as to why it is so was rather stupid.

Agree with R16.

I could understand if it had been Houston, but I don't get Dallas. Houston is the fourth largest city in the country, so while I would have expected LA or Chicago first, Houston would have made sense.

Plus Houston is just nicer than Dallas. Austin is still the best Texan city, though.

[quote]You don't even want to got there sweetie. ALL states have their share of crooked cops

Yes, all states have crooked cops. All states have racist murders. How does [italic]your[/italic] state punish racist murderers? Does it let them go scot free? Or does it convict them and send them to prison?

I'm not the one who brought up the James Byrd murder. I'm the one who pointed out that his murderers were appropriately punished rather than being set free.

[quote]All states have racist murders.

Really? That's how you justify it?

What a sad place Texas is.

[quote]Really? That's how you justify it?

I haven't justified it at all. I'm telling you it's ridiculous to point out a racist murder in a state and claim that it's an indicator for the quality of life there, and then, when a racist murder in another state is brought up, claim that it means nothing about that state because all states have corrupt cops.

Well, yes, all states have corrupt cops. And all states have racist murders. I didn't rationalize ignoring racist murderers evading punishment by stating that all states have corrupt cops.

And you still haven't addressed the disparity in jury reaction to racist murder.

The only thing I like about Dallas is "The Tin Room".%0D

Departing flights

Their arts district is better than your arts district.

[quote]I haven't justified it at all.

Wow, that's some fucked up psychology you've got going on there. Here's a clue: trying to minimize something with "Oh, fiddle-dee-dee, that happens everywhere" is a form of justification.

Not really a fan.

What state do you live in R26? I want to make sure to equate the entire state with a notorious murder that happened in the state.

R26, no, it's just pointing out a problem with your argument.%0D

[quote]Wow, that's some fucked up psychology you've got going on there. Here's a clue: trying to minimize something with "Oh, fiddle-dee-dee, that happens everywhere" is a form of justification.

You mean like the person who rationalized racist murderers in NYC getting off scot free because "all states have corrupt cops?"

I was mimicking the argument of the person I was arguing against. See the pattern?

[quote]You mean like the person who rationalized racist murderers in NYC

Looks like R30 wants to talk about anything but Dallas. Wonder why that is?

Well, R31, I would suppose that's because this discussion was long ago diverted by someone bringing up the James Byrd murder. If you would like to take this thread back to a discussion of Dallas, by all means, go ahead.

And if all you were doing was smirking in writing because you can't manage to rebut me, then go fuck yourself.

Please ignore the bitter reactionary at R32. We're not all like that.

James Byrd's death changed Jasper, the town near which his murder occurred. Essentially, it brought blacks and whites together, rather than turning into a perpetual hate fest of suspicion and blame. Mr. Byrd's family has been honored for their graciousness (and they truly were gracious when no one could have expected them to be), creating the James Byrd Jr. Foundation for Racial Healing which, among other things, helped get a hate crime bill passed in Texas.

James Byrd's death isn't over - we will remember it like we always associate JFK's death with Dallas or Emmett Till's death with Mississippi. We aren't proud of it, and we're working to heal from it and change things so others don't have to experience something so horrific. But the fact is, it happened. We have to own that.

The old racial attitudes like R32's that want to defensively sweep aside premeditated, horrific, racially motivated murders like James Byrd's by pointing accusatory fingers elsewhere are dying here. Not fast enough, maybe, but they are dying.

[quote]The old racial attitudes like R32's that want to defensively sweep aside premeditated,

Old racial attitudes? Can you really not follow the argument?

I pointed out that the people of Texas convicted James Byrd's killers. Then I pointed out that the people of New York acquitted Sean Bell's killers. The goal of this comparison was to show that racial killing is not tolerated here, but it seems to be tolerate in New York. I had hoped that the comparison would jar the person who originally brought up the James Byrd murder into an awareness that it's not appropriate to paint the whole state by one killing: You wouldn't want the whole state of New York slammed for Bell's murder, so you shouldn't slam the whole state of Texas for James Byrd's murder. The response was that such a comparison was not appropriate because "all states have corrupt cops." I thought it was a lame response. I mimicked it with "all states have racist murders." And instead of people spotting that the "all states have corrupt cops" response was a feeble explanation of the Sean Bell killing, I have people chasing me down this thread.

For fuck's sake, if you think it's wrong to respond "all states have racist murders," then, in parallel, shouldn't you also think it's wrong to respond "all states have corrupt cops?" That was the goal of my comment. I really don't believe it was all that abstruse. I believe the people who continue to argue this point are deliberately being obtuse because they want to be able to slam Texas without any counterargument.

P.S. I will again point out that no one has addressed the disparity in jury response between the Texas murder and the New York murder.

Love R32

[quote]WTF is so special about Dallas?%0D %0D The people are loud, vain, superficial blowhards, which is exactly what the A-List is looking for.

Dallas is indeed a unique "flavor" of America, as distinct as San Francisco or Chicago. It presents a unique contrast of nativist parochial WASP-supremacist conservatism and 21st century flamboyance, materialism and global capitalism. It's the city that simultaneously produced the John Birch Society and Neiman Marcus, and that George W. Bush and Glenn Beck chose to settle in. It is distinctly - and grotesquely - American.%0D %0D Even though Houston is larger, more cultured and more globally significant, it is a bit of a mystery why it hasn't produced the kind of image that Dallas has managed to parlay.

Let's forget about crooked cops and racism. It is true - that is everywhere.

What is not normal, is a large state wanting to secede from the country every few decades. Texans think of themselves as better than the rest of the United States. "We've created more jobs than any other State in the Nation" cries Rick Perry.

Please - Texas created more openings at Chick-Fil-A....you know, that gay-hating company?

Texas is trash, the people are trash. Go ahead and secede. We don't want you!

By vague impression:

Houston is more diverse and has marginally less class distinction.

Dallas is more stratified and has a more sheltered and over-the-top "elite."

Also, the DFW metroplex is actually bigger than the greater Houston area.

Dallas is the home of the Cowboys, America's Team. And Rick Perry plans to move the White House to Dallas, if he gets elected.

I am NOT a Texan, but the way Texas handled the James Byrd murder should really be a model for NY and the rest of the country, and reflects well on the state's efforts to become more modern and sophisticated.

Houstonian here and avoid Dallas at all costs. Loathe it. They are bourgeois materialistic consumerists and where you will see many of the stereotypical Dallas fraus with big bleached blonde hair, plastic surgery and spandex. Ugly city too. Think rednecks with money.

Dallas has been a Democratic city for years. It voted for both Kerry and Obama. The city government is controlled by Democrats and we have an openly lesbian sheriff.

That's because Dallas proper is a minority-majority city.

None of the Byrd killers have been put to death although one is scheduled to. If it had been the other way around, the execution would have happened long ago.

Having been to Dallas one of the things that struck me is that it is laid out more like suburb than city.

Sorry Dallasites -- your town blows.

There are MUCH better cities and towns in Texas than Dallas.

Live there if you must for a job, but get out soon as you can to retire and die. You do not want to have "Dallas, Texas" on your death certificate.

Once you leave, only then will you fully understand the odium Dallas arouses in non-residents.

"You do not want to have "Dallas, Texas" on your death certificate."

I heard that!

I wasn't aware that dead people cared what their death certificates said.

I am not a Dallas fan in the least, but still have to point out a few inaccuracies here, starting with the ridiculous notion that the James Byrd murder is somehow representative of the state as a whole. Does anyone hold the entire state of California accountable because the LAPD beat up Rodney King? As has already been noted, horrific crimes and murders happen everywhere, and Texas is logically going to get more than most states because it's the second or third most populous state.

[quote]Now there is fucking Top Chef - Texas coming up.

Why is that a problem? Texas has some great restaurants. That said, my understanding is that the show primarily takes place outside of Dallas; they spent quite some time filming here in Austin, as well as San Antonio and Houston.

[quote]Funny that some people on here are sticking up for a state who didn't repeal it's sodomy laws until 2003.

Many states still have anti-sodomy laws on the books; they're not enforceable, however, due to the federal Lawrence v. Texas decision.

[quote]at the end of the day, it's still a backwards, homophobic shithole.

Not really. Dallas and Houston have two of the largest gay ghettos in the country, and both cities have openly gay leaders, most notably current Houston mayor Annise Parker. Yes, its rural areas are homophobic, but so are those throughout the country.

[quote]Dallas has been a Democratic city for years. It voted for both Kerry and Obama.

True, but the majority of the population attributed to Dallas (not counting Fort Worth) is in the suburbs and overwhelmingly Republican. Dallas proper is only majority-minority due to white flight over the past several decades, starting in the '70s. The fact that the Dallas school district is so godawful (and corruption-plagued) played a big role here as well.

[quote]Houston is more diverse and has marginally less class distinction. Dallas is more stratified and has a more sheltered and over-the-top "elite."

Both statements are *way* off-base. Houston and Dallas are more or less equally diverse, at least in their central cores. Houston, if anything, has a substantially larger elite, thanks to the fact that it's the center of the Texas oil industry. It certainly has the arts organizations and cultural treasures to show it; hell, even Fort Worth has better museums than Dallas does.

[quote]They are bourgeois materialistic consumerists and where you will see many of the stereotypical Dallas fraus with big bleached blonde hair, plastic surgery and spandex. Ugly city too.

R42, you must be willfully blind; Houston has just as many bleached 'frauen and plastic surgery disasters as Dallas. I'll grant you that it's physically a much prettier city, however.

All you Dallas haters crack me up. Those of us who have lived here all of our lives (and yes, have visited all of you in your perfect urban paradises) don't care what you think. We are perfectly content with a great cultural scene, excellent food, access to natural spaces, can-do attitude, and..for the most part...genuine and friendly people. Keep throwing bricks. We'll just use them for our next construction project.

Yet even a guidebook to Dallas says that 90% of Dallas people would prefer to live somewhere else.

[quote] Houston, if anything, has a substantially larger elite, thanks to the fact that it's the center of the Texas oil industry.

Houston also has vastly more of what once were called yuppies, scores of youngish people who work in the CBD or in the Texas Medical Center, so many that they form a substantial middle class here.

Though I've lived only in Houston and know Dallas only from visits, I think of Houston as more diverse in the sense of its immense immigrant population from absolutely everywhere. Nigerians? Hundreds of thousands. Angolans? Indonesians? Thais? Somalis? Ethiopians? South Asians of every definition? Ditto.

I can't believe y'all haven't brought up lip gloss and Prada yet!

Does Dallas resident richwhiteboy still post here? I always enjoyed reading him.

[quote]Though I've lived only in Houston and know Dallas only from visits, I think of Houston as more diverse in the sense of its immense immigrant population from absolutely everywhere. Nigerians? Hundreds of thousands. Angolans? Indonesians? Thais? Somalis? Ethiopians? South Asians of every definition?

Dallas also has huge immigrant populations from all over the place; a substantial part of the population these days is South Asian, for instance. Really, any major American (or Canadian) city these days has a large immigrant population, in addition to the obvious Mexican and Central American immigrants.

W&W for R48!

[quote]Dallas proper is only majority-minority due to white flight over the past several decades, starting in the '70s. The fact that the Dallas school district is so godawful (and corruption-plagued) played a big role here as well.

The "white flight" was caused mainly because families were priced out of the city. Families could not afford large homes in the better Dallas neighborhoods. In reality, many of these suburbanites would give anything if they could afford a home in the Park Cities or Preston Hollow and avoid the hideous commute to work everyday.

Ooooo....a guidebook. THERE's some dependable research.

I worked briefly for US immigration and Houston is indeed one of the most ethnically diverse metro areas in the country. DFW immigrants were mostly Mexican/Latin American.

Really R51? As someone that lived in Texas for years even the Dallas supporters were mainly due to loyalty. Anyone objective can see the problems with Dallas and they are many.

Call us "haters" all you want, I enjoyed Texas, thought Austin and Houston were legit places to live...but dear god not Dallas. My friends that got jobs there are all actively trying to move away cause they hate the consumerist, materialistic and anti-intellectual culture.

R5=Prada lip-gloss queen from Dallas.

Don't mess with Dallas!

Don't die there!

It'd be just so embarrassing for your family.

Houston still has glory holes. Dallas, not.

Nuff said?!

Is Fort Worth a viable option?

R60, pray tell what intellectual meccas did your so-called friends move to, dear?

Still trying to get over the stain of the assasination.

Still trying to live down the stench of "Dallas' Most Eligible".

See link for why "Top Chef" deigned to film in that shithole of a city.

There's payola allegations. Houston blows San Antonio away in restaurant quality. Montrose has some of the best restaurants in the state. Too bad they won't be featured.

They swallow.

There's only one thing great about Dallas: Miles Austin's butt.

[quote]Is Fort Worth a viable option?

Fort Worth is wonderful!

Taking X at The Starck Club in 1985 was about as good as it gets in Dallas.

Is the message really that Dallas is "great", rather than simply that it's peculiar and laugh-worthy.

Tea party has roots in the Dallas of 1963

By Bill Minutaglio, Published: November 21

The president is a socialist. He is neutering the United States on the world stage. He is spending us into bankruptcy. He is hellbent on expanding national health care, which will surely lead to government death panels.

He is advancing big-government agendas everywhere from Main Street to Wall Street. And do we really know the truth about his personal history and religion?

Perhaps the man in the Oval Office should be impeached — even tried for treason.

If today’s extremist rhetoric sounds familiar, that’s because it is eerily, poignantly similar to the vitriol aimed squarely at John F. Kennedy during his presidency.

And just like today, Texans were leading what some of them saw as a moral crusade.

To find the very roots of the tea party of 2013, just go back to downtown Dallas in 1963, back to the months and weeks leading to the Kennedy assassination. It was where and when a deeply angry political polarization, driven by a band of zealots, burst wide open in America.

It was fueled then, as now, by billionaires opposed to federal oversight, rabid media, Bible-thumping preachers and extremist lawmakers who had moved far from their political peers. In 1963, that strident minority hijacked the civic dialogue and brewed the boiling, toxic environment waiting for Kennedy the day he died.

As he planned his trip to Dallas in November 1963, President Kennedy knew that hundreds of thousands across Texas adored him — or at least, respected the office he held. But he also knew that there was an increasingly hysterical fringe.

As Kennedy approached Dallas, he turned to his wife, Jacqueline. “We’re heading into nut country today,” he said.

Dallas Morning News publisher Ted Dealey had a loathing that became particularly deeply personal. At a social luncheon for Texas news executives in the State Dining Room of the White House, Dealey berated Kennedy to his face: “We need a man on horseback to lead this nation — and many people in Texas and the Southwest think that you are riding Caroline’s tricycle.”

Back in Dallas, Dealey ordered his reporters to investigate whether Kennedy had been married to another woman and whether the Kennedy dynasty had somehow erased evidence of that marriage.

Not far away in downtown Dallas, oil billionaire H.L. Hunt was pouring millions into a ceaseless anti-Kennedy radio campaign; it was the dawn of extremist radio in the nation. Hunt’s program, “Life Line,” reached 10 million listeners a day with its scorching attacks against “the mistaken,” the term Hunt’s announcers used to describe the president’s supporters.

When Kennedy proposed Medicare to provide health care for the elderly, Hunt’s shows warned that government death panels would follow: “a package which would literally make the president of the United States a medical czar with potential life-or-death power over every man, woman and child in the country.”

Hunt’s pastor in Dallas was the thundering W.A. Criswell, head of the largest Baptist congregation in the country. Criswell was deeply suspicious of the president’s Catholic religion, and he assailed Kennedy’s candidacy as a possible plot that would undermine America’s true Christian values.

Dallas was represented in Congress by an eloquent, Ivy League-educated ideologue regarded by some as the most extreme politician in Washington. Bruce Alger had cast the lone “no” vote against a federal program to provide free surplus milk to needy children. Even among his conservative peers, Alger was considered on the outer edge.

There was also Maj. Gen. A. Walker, the commander who had been hailed as a hero for breaking the grip of segregation in Arkansas’ capital; he led the bayonet-carrying troops who escorted African-American students to the doors of a Little Rock high school and kept order in the streets afterwards.

(cont.)

Within four years, Walker had been relieved of his command by Kennedy’s defense secretary, Robert S. McNamara, after he was accused of trying to brainwash his troops with ultra-right-wing propaganda. The defrocked Walker moved to Dallas and was welcomed by the mayor in a grand public ceremony.

Walker promoted anti-federal agendas as well as what were once quaintly called “Southern traditions.” He made national headlines by instigating bloody riots against James Meredith’s brave attempts to integrate the University of Mississippi.

Many historians now agree that the blind absolutism of these powerful men of Dallas in the early 1960s has been discredited.

But here we are in 2013 and the echo is painfully clear:

The ad hominem attacks against a “socialist president.” The howling broadcasters. The mega-rich men from Texas funding the political action campaigns. There is even another charismatic, Ivy-educated ideologue: Sen. Ted Cruz would have been quite comfortable in Dallas 1963.

In the days leading to Kennedy’s fateful hour in Dallas, the city experienced one dark moment after another. Swastikas were plastered on the high-end emporium Neiman Marcus. A bomb threat was made during a visit by the Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. A cross was burned on the lawn of a Holocaust survivor. U.N. Ambassador Adlai E. Stevenson II, in town for a speech, fled for his life after being surrounded by a spitting mob.

It all occurred in a place where a few powerful people had marched far from the political center and erected a firewall against reasoned debate.

Fifty years after Kennedy’s death, it is as if nothing has changed. As the nation continues to sift for meaning in his tragedy, this is the most aching lesson of all.

Bill Minutaglio is a University of Texas journalism professor and the author of “First Son: George W. Bush and the Bush Family Dynasty.” He and Steven L. Davis are the authors of “Dallas 1963” (2013, Twelve Books), from which this article is adapted.

OP, Dallas cannot be full of hillbillies. There are no fucking HILLS there. North Texas is as flat as a pancake. No hills anywhere. The last time I was there I saw thousands upon thousands of African Americans, maybe 40 Whites and 30 Mexicans. There are far more Blacks there than Whites. Richland Hills, Arlington and Fort Worth have far more Whites. Dallas seems predominantly Black to my observations.

From "New York Syndrome" by Daniel Goleman.

"Dr. Hillman sees the pull of the city in terms of a larger psychological dimension. 'Dallas, where I lived for awhile, is for people in the fast lane, people concerned with consuming,' Dr. Hillman says. 'It pulls to it those who are already Dallas types. Whether they be in Illinois or Pennsylvania, they are meant for Dallas. Likewise, New York draws the cosmopolite, the person who wants to be challenged the most, who needs to most varied and rich stimulation."

Voices from the early 80s...

Contrary to the "City of Hate" image that clings to Dallas, the photo of well-wishers greeting the President tell another story. The haters were not the majority in Dallas that day.

You couldn't get that many Dallasites downtown today if you promised to give away $100 bills.

Dallas voted 'Best International Skyline'

I live in Dallas. On White Rock Lake, actually, in a gigantic house.

This town is THE shittiest place I have ever lived. If I didn't have money, I would flee so fast.

First, it's a cultural sinkhole.

Second, it's simply gross. Dirty, unkept, and the people are just not pleasing.

Third, the traffic is total shit. You will sit on the freeway if you literally want to go anywhere.

Fourth, the crime? Holy shit.

Fifth, the whole Baptist Gun Culture. You think you've seen it before, you think you're ready to deal with sociopathic office cunts, but you are not. Not in any way.

Sixth, the Dallas Gays. What a bunch of empty headed no experience having idiots. I can't even go out anymore because I literally feel like I'm getting dumber talking to "A gays" who are anything but.

Run. Do not come to this city. I haven't even mentioned the political corruption, the cops, the air quality, or lately, the earthquakes. Fuck. This. Place.

Before you jump on me for that "unkept," I meant "unkempt," but yeah, the upkeep just ain't here.

Where did you live before that was so much better?

R85 - hardly pertinent.

I'm just curious what large city isn't dirty with bad traffic and political corruption.

Dallas: A shithole that has aspirations to be an outhouse.

OP = Gary Ewing

Why wasn't I included?

Obviously Dallas is the only city in the world where the newspaper is so bad people actually read USA Today.

Dr. Hillman thought that cities were a kind of fraternity rush.

I can't even imagine what he would have made of me.

Everything's bigger there.

horrifying hellhole

There was a Dallas ep of House Hunters and the dreadful wife met all the stereotypes here. Insisted on a "grand entrance" (lawyer foyer) mcmansion.